<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
<html>
<head>
<meta content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1" http-equiv="Content-Type">
</head>
<body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
Del,<br>
Make a proposal to add to the list. The list I put out there is not
closed.<br>
I can only think that we should always be inclusive at the field and
the contests. Make the guy who comes out to one contest a year feel a
part of the group. Take the time to watch him fly and push some
suggestions at him on how to improve. <br>
John<br>
<br>
Del K. Rykert wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid002a01c7e5bc$b11a4650$6501a8c0@DELSPENTIUM4"
type="cite">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; ">
<meta content="MSHTML 6.00.6000.16525" name="GENERATOR">
<style>@font-face {
font-family: Cambria Math;
}
@font-face {
font-family: Calibri;
}
@font-face {
font-family: Consolas;
}
@page Section1 {size: 8.5in 11.0in; margin: 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in; }
P.MsoNormal {
FONT-SIZE: 11pt; MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: "Calibri","sans-serif"
}
LI.MsoNormal {
FONT-SIZE: 11pt; MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: "Calibri","sans-serif"
}
DIV.MsoNormal {
FONT-SIZE: 11pt; MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: "Calibri","sans-serif"
}
A:link {
COLOR: blue; TEXT-DECORATION: underline; mso-style-priority: 99
}
SPAN.MsoHyperlink {
COLOR: blue; TEXT-DECORATION: underline; mso-style-priority: 99
}
A:visited {
COLOR: purple; TEXT-DECORATION: underline; mso-style-priority: 99
}
SPAN.MsoHyperlinkFollowed {
COLOR: purple; TEXT-DECORATION: underline; mso-style-priority: 99
}
P.MsoPlainText {
FONT-SIZE: 10.5pt; MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: Consolas; mso-style-priority: 99; mso-style-link: "Plain Text Char"
}
LI.MsoPlainText {
FONT-SIZE: 10.5pt; MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: Consolas; mso-style-priority: 99; mso-style-link: "Plain Text Char"
}
DIV.MsoPlainText {
FONT-SIZE: 10.5pt; MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: Consolas; mso-style-priority: 99; mso-style-link: "Plain Text Char"
}
SPAN.PlainTextChar {
FONT-FAMILY: Consolas; mso-style-priority: 99; mso-style-link: "Plain Text"; mso-style-name: "Plain Text Char"
}
.MsoChpDefault {
mso-style-type: export-only
}
DIV.Section1 {
page: Section1
}
</style>
<!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]-->
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"><font color="#0000ff">These are all
great but, I see nothing changing to stop driving away the casual
competitor. If the organization and sport wants to truly grow that area
is long overdue. We need their numbers and help at fielding contests.</font>
</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"> </font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"> <em><font color="#800000">Del</font></em></font><em><font
color="#800000"> </font></em></div>
<blockquote
style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(0, 0, 0); padding-right: 0px; padding-left: 5px; margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px;">
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;">-----
Original Message ----- </div>
<div
style="background: rgb(228, 228, 228) none repeat scroll 0%; -moz-background-clip: initial; -moz-background-origin: initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: initial; font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>From:</b>
<a title="rob@koolsoft.com" href="mailto:rob@koolsoft.com">Robert
L. Beaubien</a> </div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>To:</b>
<a title="nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA Mailing List</a> </div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>Sent:</b>
Thursday, August 23, 2007 8:42 AM</div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>Subject:</b>
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] [Fwd: Proposal]</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div class="Section1">
<p class="MsoPlainText">Richard / John, See my comments inline.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org">mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</a>] On Behalf Of richard
wallace<br>
Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2007 7:28 PM<br>
To: NSRCA Mailing List<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] [Fwd: Proposal]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="color: black;"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Gotta say though, I'm just not a fan
of a national database for<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> recording Pattern results. I don't
really understand what problem this<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> is intended to fix.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="color: black;"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span style="color: black;">If I read
what John proposed correctly, this is to give additional value and
incentive to being a NSRCA member. Being able to participate in a
nationwide ranking system is appealing to me.<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Of course, I'm in the apparent
minority that believes that our current<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> self-policing system of advancement
points is fine, ESPECIALLY now<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> that points only count for four years.
...<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="color: black;"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span style="color: black;">I agree with
you. I think peer pressure to keep people from Sandbagging is the best
medicine and forced promotions is not needed. <o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> 2. I don't know that I'd be really
interested in seeing my 'national<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> ranking' -- I've found out enough at
the Nats the past several<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> years... and 37/44 in Masters tells me
enough about where I stand... !<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span style="color: black;">I know I
would be interested in my "national" rank as I try to progress through
the classes.<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> and one more thing - do we have any
volunteers for setting up and<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> adminstering this national system?
That's not a trivial question or<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> issue, especially in a world where (at
least some) NSRCA officers are<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> in their positions not because they
sought the job in order to be in<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> charge of stuff, but because there was
a necessary job to be done, and<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> no one else was willing to step up to
do it... I do the Champs<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> standings for my District and mostly
enjoy it, but it IS a manual<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> process. Understand about hooks to
automated scoring systems like<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> PACSS, but it'll still take initial
work and sustainment and then<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> fixes to keep it going at the national
level... and there are still<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> places around the country that still
do contest scoring manually...<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b>I would be interested in volunteering my
services towards this endeavor. What would be needed would be a
standardized scoring program used by all CD's that has upload
capabilities to a server, and a website to present the information to
the members. As a software developer, it is a project I would like to
participate in if it were to see the light of day. I would also be
willing to donate the bandwidth and servers necessary to make this
happen.<o:p></o:p></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="color: black;"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Agree about helping Sportsman and
maybe Intermediates be mentored at<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> contests- we usually don't have a
formal system for that, and more<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> would certainly be better.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b>This already happens to a great extent
in D7. When I showed up at a pattern contest, Troy Newman took it upon
himself to mentor me and I feel very lucky to have his experience to
guide me. A formal rule/suggestion/whatever towards this end is
certainly not a bad thing.<o:p></o:p></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="color: black;"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">Also am in violent agreement about the need
to grow Pattern at the<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">grass-roots level one new guy at a time -
and most of us need to plow<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">that field more thoroughly too.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">Good stuff - keep it coming!<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">- Robert Beaubien<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">- AMA #618061<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">- NSRCA #4121<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">-<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="color: black;"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="color: black;"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> ----- Original Message -----<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> From: John Gayer<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> To: NSRCA Mailing List<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2007 7:12
PM<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] [Fwd:
Proposal]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> I'd like to present three proposals
that might appeal to a few if not the<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> many....<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Modified from the original proposal .
Apparently not many saw it. The first<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> one has been added<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Comments?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> John<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> NSRCA 632<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Revive the practice of assigning
mentors to Sportsman and Intermediate<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> flyers<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> At contests, assign an experienced
competitor to mentor, call and advise the<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Sportsman/ Intermediate flyers. This
is nothing new, but should be a part of<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> every contest. We should try to
provide a connection that will last past the<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> contest.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> As I see it, there are four issues
that drasticaly affect the ability of<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> these flyers to compete effectively:
aircraft trimming, execessive throws,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> wings level and centering(also known
as flying the airplane, not letting the<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> airplane fly you).<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> These flyers have shown the initiative
to come out and compete. We owe them<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> (and ourselves) all the help we can
throw at them.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Create a National Database for Pattern<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> The database must contain the raw
scores of all flights for all competitors<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> by class. The only thing normalized
scores are good for is finding the right<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> finish order for each class at a
contest. Raw scores are much better for<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> comparing results even at a contest.
For example I finish round one with a<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> 930 and round two with a 985, both to
competitor A. Now did I fly a lot<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> better in round two(I thought I did)
or did competitor A flop a stall turn<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> in the figure M in round 2.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Anyway once you have the raw scores by
competitor and class, you can do the<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> following:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Create a National Ranking for each
class based on average points per<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> maneuver. Once this is in place and on
line, we will have a reason for<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> pattern competitors to join NSRCA. you
can't tell me that there wouldn't be<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> a lot of interest in seeing who is hot
around the country and how you stack<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> up against the competition. I know,
the judging isn't always equal but<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> that's always been true and we have to
live with it.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> The data available on each competitor
would include contests entered,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> placing, advance points earned. The
districts could extract whatever data is<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> required to ascertain the district
champions. We could archive previous<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> years as well.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Other ways to specify advancement in
class become available, percentage of<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> average FAI score, even eventually
moving the 10 top-rated pilots up a<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> class. Possibilities are endless when
you have the data.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Since the database would only be open
to NSRCA members, if you want to track<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> your National standing, joining NSRCA
would be a must. If you want to see<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> what the guy nobody heard of that just
rolled in from out of district has<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> accomplished, look him up. We've been
looking for reasons to join NSRCA, I<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> feel this is one that could be big and
would be worth some investment in<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> time and money. I would be willing to
help with such a project although I<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> don't feel like I could take it on by
myself.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Redirect the focus to our
international team competition through<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> modification of the advancement system<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Modify the advancement process to be
consistent through all classes from<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Sportsman through to F3A. See section
two for possible advancement criteria<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Advancement can be forced by the
advancement criteria(see section 2) or<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> voluntary.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> The first year in a new and higher
class is an option year. At the end of<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> the option year you can downselect one
class for any reason. This has the<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> advantage of being able to try out the
higher class for a year without<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> committing your entire pattern career.
If you discover that the next class<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> is beyond your means( time, money or
talent) then you option down the<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> following year. If you absolutely
refuse to fly your new class, then perhaps<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> you could use the time and money to
reintroduce your self to your wife,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> girlfriend, etc. If you need a goal
for the year, focus on making your<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> rudder commands instinctive, learn to
fly a helicopter, learn to fly rolling<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> circles. You would probably come back
a better pattern flyer than when you<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> left.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>
_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> NSRCA-discussion mailing list<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion________________________________">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion________________________________</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">NSRCA-discussion<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> mailing<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> list<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>
_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> NSRCA-discussion mailing list<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">NSRCA-discussion mailing list<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p> </p>
<hr> _______________________________________________<br>
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a><br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a></blockquote>
<pre wrap="">
<hr size="4" width="90%">
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</a></pre>
</blockquote>
</body>
</html>