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<p class=MsoNormal><span class=EmailStyle19><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Rollers! I
stopped flying IMAC years ago because of those things. I remember a friends’ comment
during a practice session, “I don’t have enough airplanes to learn how to do
that”. <o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span class=EmailStyle19><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Jim Hiller<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span class=EmailStyle19><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'><![if !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'>-----Original
Message-----<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b>
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org]<b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>ronlock@comcast.net<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Monday, August 13, 2007 5:55
AM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> NSRCA Mailing List; NSRCA
Mailing List<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Stiring up theMasters 2009Sequencediscussionagain...</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><![if !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Agree, and in
particular on points:</span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Current level
of difficulty - (is about right the step between Advanced and
Masters doesn't need to be larger)</span></font><font color=black><span
style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Rollers-
(are very likely too much of a pilot challenge, and are not suitable at
many fields.)</span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Make
Maneuvers Judgeable- (Part of that should be avoiding excessive
numbers of snaps)</span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Later, Ron
Lockhart</span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:
windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 2.25pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
auto;margin-left:41.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 2.25pt;
padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>--------------
Original message -------------- <br>
From: Joe Lachowski <jlachow@hotmail.com> <br>
Making Masters as difficult as you say will lose pilots altogether. There are a
number of pilots already that struggle with the existing sequences. This
years Nats is a fine example. Typically it takes a 960's average to get into
the finals. This year I believe it was around 937. <br>
<br>
We have clear cut definitions of what Masters should be. It is basically
everything that is in FAI except a handful of certain maneuver types and that
handful is very small. They only include rolling circles, maneuvers with
integrated rolls, and certain handful of snap roll maneuvers. FAI is very
airframe dependent in design. Masters should not be that. There is a reason why
the Masters class is large and successful. Why would we want to change
something that is working well, as it is. We change the sequences every couple
of years. Some will be more difficult, others will seem easier. Level of
difficulty will fluctuate up and down a little bit. There is nothing wrong with
th! at.<br>
<br>
I for one will drop out should certain types of maneuvers creap into
Masters. I don't have the time to work on rolling maneuvers. I personally think
rolling circles should be outlawed. They take up airspace and are terrible to
judge. Ah, speaking of judging. Making maneuvers judgable is a criteria for
designing an AMA sequence<g>. You can't expect a high level of
judging skill at the local level as you might at a Nats.<br>
<br>
Hopefully forever stuggling in Masters,<br>
<br>
Joe Lachowski</span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 2.25pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:
auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:77.0pt;text-align:center;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:
0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:77.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid #1010FF 2.25pt;
padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>From:
mjfrederick@cox.net<br>
To: nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<br>
Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2007 23:43:33 -0500<br>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Stiring up the Masters
2009Sequencediscussionagain...</span></font><font color=black><span
style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:77.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid #1010FF 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>I can definitely see the quandary you are pointing out here,
Lance. I've known many pilots who never had the desire to move from
Masters to FAI competition. It had nothing to do with their skills, they just
didn't want to fly FAI. Not sure the deciding factor for them, they just never
moved "up" (or as I see it, moved on). I can definitely respect their
decision.</span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:
windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:77.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid #1010FF 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font
size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
color:black'> </span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:77.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid #1010FF 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>In my opinion Masters should at least seek to keep up with the
difficulty levels of the FAI Prelim sequence. That way we can have that
"Elite" class that is ours alone. I look at it like the difference
between soccer and football. The winner of the super bowl is probably the
best football team in the world, yet you can't really say they are because no
other countries play the sport (yeah, yeah, CFL and NFL Europe... they're all
rejects from the NFL, that has nothing to do with my point). On the other hand,
we have professional soccer teams here in the US, but nobody really cares about
them until the World Cup comes around. Even then, though, we don't just send
the best team, we hold try-outs to see who is the best of the best on the
teams, and make one Uber-Team to go out there and try to "bring home the
gold."</span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:
windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:77.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid #1010FF 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font
size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
color:black'> </span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:77.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid #1010FF 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>I only fly Intermediate right now (I really hate that name, by the
way... never should have dropped the Novice class... I'd much rather be called
"Sportsman") but as I move up, I'd hate to "de-value" the
Masters class by making it just a stepping stone to FAI. I'll probably never be
good enough to compete on the international stage, and as a result would never
have the desire to move up to FAI. You can't "point out" of Masters,
so why not make it as difficult as you want? Heck, make it harder than FAI P
and F... That way we could have a National Champion who we could say is better
than whoever the FAI decides is the "world champion." I'm all about
giving our classes more value than the FAI classes... not less.</span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:77.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid #1010FF 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font
size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
color:black'> </span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:77.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid #1010FF 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>Matt</span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:77.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid #1010FF 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font
size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
color:black'> </span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:77.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid #1010FF 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font
size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
color:black'>----- Original Message ----- </span></font><font color=black><span
style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt;
background:#E4E4E4'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:82.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>
<div style='font-color:black'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <a
href="mailto:patterndude@tx.rr.com" title="patterndude@tx.rr.com">Lance Van
Nostrand</a> </span></font></div>
<font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Arial;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:82.0pt;background:white;mso-shading:
transparent;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;
mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;font-weight:bold'>To:</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> <a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
title="nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA Mailing List</a> </span></font><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:82.0pt;background:white;mso-shading:
transparent;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;
mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> Sunday, August 12, 2007 11:37 AM</span></font><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:82.0pt;background:white;mso-shading:
transparent;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;
mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Stiring up the Masters
2009Sequencediscussionagain...</span></font><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:82.0pt;background:white;mso-shading:
transparent;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;
mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><![if !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]></span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:82.0pt;background:white;mso-shading:
transparent;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;
mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>I'm interested in what
people think about this question. This strikes at the heart of that
topic: what's the difference between Masters and FAI. I believe the many
differences should be summed up as "choices". For one example,
"do I choose to learn 2 sequences or do I only have time for
1?". Therefore, on the difficuulty question, I think Masters and FAI
P should track the same target difficulty. Jumping from Masters to FAI
forces the pilot to accept a lot of new issues that AMA doesn't deal with.
But the top AMA class should allow flying the same difficulty without the rest
of the baggage. </span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:82.0pt;background:white;mso-shading:
transparent;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;
mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:82.0pt;background:white;mso-shading:
transparent;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;
mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>On the other hand, if
Masters is not a stepping stone class to FAI then why have it at all? Is
the baggage really that great? In practice, pilots usually hone their
skills in Masters until they have achieved some success before going to FAI,
but that simply has created a division based on skill but not difficulty.
this is a tough question too, but since most contests I see have more in
Masters than FAI (or at least equal numbers) I think our country supports the
need for 2 classes even when the difficulty is the same (as it is now).</span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:82.0pt;background:white;mso-shading:
transparent;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;
mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:82.0pt;background:white;mso-shading:
transparent;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;
mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>However, designing
sequences that actually feel equivalent in difficulty is very difficult.
Just counting Kfactors is not enough. Equivalent KF's can be found in
manuvers that have only straight lines and radiuses and in rolling
manuvers. Rarely can that target be hit, so sometimes two sequences
intended to be similar in difficulty will fly a bit different. One or the
other may feel more difficult but over the years with multiple sequence cycles
one should be able to say they are essentially equivalent. Our AMA
sequences build skills so that when we get to Masters we have enough
fundamentals to fly any sequence in the KFactor range prescribed. Remember,
most countries don't have an AMA equivalent. If you want to fly pattern,
you start learning FAI P patterns. It is fortunate we have our system so
that people of all abilities can find enjoyment and those that have super skills
can follow a road that e! nds at the level of their choosing.</span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:82.0pt;background:white;mso-shading:
transparent;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;
mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:82.0pt;background:white;mso-shading:
transparent;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;
mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Right now, Masters and
FAI P07 are about the same. Once we say Masters is a step below FAI P my
guess is that most Masters pilots will feel ripped off.</span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:82.0pt;background:white;mso-shading:
transparent;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;
mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Since AMA exists in this
country for us alone we should do what the majority desires, however the
opinion of the currently active Masters and FAI competitors is of
particular interest. Therefore it might be nice to identify your active
class participation in any response you might care to make.</span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:82.0pt;background:white;mso-shading:
transparent;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;
mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:82.0pt;background:white;mso-shading:
transparent;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;
mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>--Lance</span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:87.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>----- Original Message ----- </span></font><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:87.0pt;background:#E4E4E4;border:none;
mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>
<div style='font-color:black'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <a
href="mailto:drykert2@rochester.rr.com" title="drykert2@rochester.rr.com">Del
K. Rykert</a> </span></font></div>
<font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Arial;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:87.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>To:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <a
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
title="nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA Mailing List</a> </span></font><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:87.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> Sunday,
August 12, 2007 10:04 AM</span></font><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:87.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></font></b><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Stiring up the Masters 2009
Sequencediscussionagain...</span></font><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:87.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3
color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><![if !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]></span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:87.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>Is the intent/purpose to still have some progress from
Masters to FAI or to have Master at a similar complex level with the intent of some
staying in Masters as the top out Schedule? For some advanced is the
highest they will get. </span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:87.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3
color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:87.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> Del</span></font><font color=black><span
style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>----- Original Message ----- </span></font><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;background:#E4E4E4;border:none;
mso-border-left-alt:solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>
<div style='font-color:black'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <a
href="mailto:tkeithblack@gmail.com" title="tkeithblack@gmail.com">Keith Black</a>
</span></font></div>
<font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Arial;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>To:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <a
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
title="nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA Mailing List</a> </span></font><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>
Saturday, August 11, 2007 5:18 PM</span></font><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></font></b><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> [NSRCA-discussion] Stiring up the Masters 2009 Sequence
discussionagain...</span></font><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3
color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><![if !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]></span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>A while back Derek asked the membership if they wanted to stick
with the 2009 Masters sequence that was proposed in 2005 or change to a newly
designed sequence that addresses concerns some people had regarding the
sequence. Apparently some pilots feel there are too many snaps or some such
complaints, I'm not really sure.</span></font><font color=black><span
style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3
color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>At the time I was not able to go fly the sequences and thus I had
no response, however, I now have flown the sequences and have some comments.</span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3
color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>My first observation is that six of the eleven centered maneuvers
are the same so much of the content of the patterns are identical. My second
observation is that each sequence has maneuvers I think would be more
"fun" or "challenging" than the other. If I had to put
numbers to it I'd say there are three maneuvers in the 2005 proposed
sequence that I'd miss if we went with the newly proposed schedule and six
maneuvers in the new schedule that I'd miss if we went with the original 2005
proposed schedule. </span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3
color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>I'd also say that IMHO both of these schedules are easier than the
2007 schedule and my initial impression was that the inverted entries have been
reduced. I short, it seems that the schedules have been watered down from what
we currently have. </span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3
color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>I will have no complaints flying either schedule, but if I were to
choose between the two I'd select the newly proposed schedule; not to placate
those that object to the 2005 proposed schedule because I feel there's nothing
wrong with it; but because I think the newly proposed schedule is more
interesting.</span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3
color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=2
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>Also, I'd like to comment that I feel that the Advanced schedule
for 2007 was too watered down and does not prepare pilots for the 2007
Masters schedule. I hope when designing the schedules we aren't trying to make
Masters easier so the jump from Advanced is not as big. If the jump is too big
then we should increase the level of the Advance pattern.</span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:92.0pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:
solid black 2.25pt;padding:0in;mso-padding-alt:0in 0in 0in 5.0pt'><font size=3
color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><font
color=black><span style='color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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