<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=windows-1252">
<STYLE>P {
PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; PADDING-TOP: 0px
}
BODY {
FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma
}
</STYLE>
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.6000.16481" name=GENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=3>Hi Joe,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=3>When I first saw the current schedule, I told one
of the Committee members the humpty was going to be a problem and it would work
better if it pushed back into the box instead of pulled to the outside of the
box. The half cuban currently proposed uses more area by a fair margin than the
humpty in the current schedule. I would argue that an 8 point uses as much area
as the current rolling maneuver that precedes the humpty and we're all rushing
to get the humpty in with varying degrees of success. I think the 8 point as it
stands will be more rushed than what we're experiencing now. I hope when this
schedule was being tested, it was on a field with the box marked and that the 8
point was actually centered. I think the 8 point will fit if you start it
quickly after the maneuver that precedes it, but then it won't be centered
unless the 1/2 cuban on the other end is driven out of the box.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=3>As far as the original schedule, I don't remember
it either and I apparently voted it in as a Contest Board Member! Age I guess,
but I just voted with the survey results except for one safety issue that I've
since forgotten. I must say that I've never seen a Masters schedule with 3 snaps
in it, much less 4.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=3>When I was on the NSRCA Rules Committee awhile
back, we ran into the same problems you've discussed. We also had to rely on
warm climate members to test fly our creation. It's a real handicap in that it
greatly reduces feedback from those involved. One of our members was an Advanced
pilot that had just pointed out and I greatly valued his opinion as someone who
would have to jump into the learning curve of what we were building.
Unfortunately, he was also a cold-weather guy and we had to rely on what he
THOUGHT he could transition into rather than having him actually try it. The one
thing I took out of the experience is that everyone flies better on paper in the
winter than they do in real life, myself included. Enjoyed flying with you at
the Nats as always. I haven't flown since as my flying site was taken away while
we were in Muncie...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=3>Verne</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=jlachow@hotmail.com href="mailto:jlachow@hotmail.com">Joe
Lachowski</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA Mailing List</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, July 26, 2007 9:16
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Proposed
Masters Sequence for 2009/2010</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>Verne, a bunch of us flew it. We had no problem with it.
Frankly, the humpty that we goofed up on in the current schedule before the
Figure-M gives me more heartburn<g>. I wish we could change that now.
But we did in the proposed schedule.<BR> <BR>I want to point out to many
of you that when we put together these sequences we were tight on time.
As a member of the committee, I didn't remember seeing this sequence until the
survey was published. Also, the sequences were not properly grouped in the
survey. If we had selected option B for 2009 we would be flying two schedules
back to back that were similar. They weren't grouped properly so
there was definitely a bias on what was selected. Another thing that
was difficult to do in the process was that we were working on this in
February. Not all of us were afforded the opportunity to go fly them because
of where we lived. We had to rely on the few who were in warmer climates to
make sure they worked right. On a final note many of us in the committee for
Masters also had the impression that we would have to revisit the 2009/2010
sequence again to make sure things were in perspective no matter what the
vote. Guess what, we did.<BR> <BR>I will suggest one thing to the NSRCA
board. Consider establishing the sequence committees for 2011/2012 and get
things designed by next November. That way there is plenty of time after that
to give them a long hard look before they are voted on by the membership for
the next cycle. The committees could ramp up in late August. It is
apparent that people in the other classes besides Masters are looking for a
change by then. I will also suggest that we stick to the outlines that Troy
and the committee developed. It is an excellent place to start
from.<BR> <BR>On a last note, if the NSRCA Board had not decided to open
up this issue, some of us in the committee would have definitely
submitted our own proposal loaded with supporting evidence and facts to
support our submission. We felt strongly enough that it had to be
addressed. As RVP has stated in the past, it is our right as an AMA member to
submit proposals.<g><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
<HR id=EC_stopSpelling>
From: verne@twmi.rr.com<BR>To: nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>Date:
Thu, 26 Jul 2007 20:37:57 -0400<BR>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Proposed
Masters Sequence for 2009/2010<BR><BR>
<META content="Microsoft SafeHTML" name=Generator>
<STYLE>
</STYLE>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Rex,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>The half cuban needs to be fairly large to accommodate
the 2/2 pt roll on the 45 degree downline at the end of it. Make it too
small and you'll either be right on the deck for the start of the next
maneuver or worse. It's going to take about 1/4 of the box to do it right.
If you want to center the 8 point roll right before it, that means you need
to fly 1/4 of the way into the box before you start the 8 point roll. It's
just a bad combination of maneuvers that won't work well together in the
confines of the box. I'm sure that's why FAI vertically tall and low box use
maneuvers on each end of the 8 point roll in the P07 schedule. I like the
schedule too, I just want to give the 8 point the room it
needs.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Verne</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=trexlesh@msn.com href="mailto:trexlesh@msn.com">Rex LESHER</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA Mailing List</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, July 26, 2007 7:14
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Proposed Masters Sequence for 2009/2010</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>Derek</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I like the Proposed sequence the best... I probably won't
be flying it, but I will be judging it. I personally don't
think having </DIV>
<DIV>the half cuban after the 8 point is that big of deal. It just
forces the pilot to be in the proper position to execute that string of
</DIV>
<DIV>three manuevers. As we all know, Positioning is
everything... The down humpty and the inverted 4 point roll is a
nice variation of revisited manuevers. Personally, I think the
proposed sequence flows a little better than the "A" sequence.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Rex</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>From:</B> <A
title=mailto:derekkoopowitz@gmail.com
href="mailto:derekkoopowitz@gmail.com">Derek Koopowitz</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">'NSRCA Mailing List'</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, July 25, 2007 8:26
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [NSRCA-discussion]
Proposed Masters Sequence for 2009/2010</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Over the past couple of months we
(the NSRCA board) have received a number of comments about the Masters
sequence that was selected in 2005. We heard that the sequence had
too many snaps, turnaround maneuvers did not allow positioning of the
plane (in or out) after the 5th maneuver, and that the difficulty level
from Advanced to Masters was further increased. There was also an
error in the schedule in that one would come out of the Double Immelman
(#10) inverted and head into the Humpty Bump (pull-push-pull) and head
into the ground based on the description. The Masters schedule was
published in the July 2005 issue of the K-Factor (Option A on page 25) -
in order to correct the error, maneuver #9 was modifed to a 1/2 Square
Loop with 1/2 Roll Down instead of the 1/2 Square Loop with 2/2 Pt Roll
Down.</FONT><BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>The board felt that the original
Masters sequence committee should revisit the schedule to look it over
and perhaps make modifications. The original committee was Troy
Newman (chair), Ed Alt, Dave Lockhart, Joe Lachoswki, Arch Stafford and
Bob Pastorello. Bob dropped out since he no longer flies
pattern. Troy and the team started working on it but Troy couldn't
devote 100% of his time to it due to the Nats approaching and his
commitment to trying to make the US team. Dave, Ed, Joe and Arch
worked the sequence but decided that it would take too much modification
to correct. Instead they came up with a revised schedule that the
board felt was a worthy replacement. The board would like to
submit this schedule to the Contest Board to be considered as a
replacement for the original schedule.</FONT><BR><FONT face=Arial
size=2>What do we need from everyone? We'd like to get your
opinion on the sequence that was selected in 2005 and the new schedule
that was created by the sequence committee to address the issues that
were raised by a number of pilots.</FONT><BR><FONT face=Arial
size=2>Here is the sequence that was selected:</FONT> <BR>
<P align=center> <U><B> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>2009 Masters 404 Option
A
<BR>
</FONT></B></U><B> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>KF <BR></FONT></B><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>1 Takeoff
Sequence
1 <BR>2
Stall Turn, 1-1/4 Roll Up, 1-1/4 Positive Snap
down
5 <BR>3
Top-Hat with 1/4 Rolls, Exit
INV
2 <BR>4
Cuban 8 with Full Rolls, Exit INV
4 <BR>5
Humpty Bump, with options (1/2's or 1/4's up and Down to Exit
Upright)
2 <BR>6
Avalanche, 1-1/2 snap roll, Exit INV
4 <BR>7
1/2 Square Loop on Corner (1/2 Diamond Loop)
2 <BR>8
Eight-Sided Outside Loop from top
4 <BR>9
1/2 Square Loop, 1/2pt Roll
down
2 <BR>10
Double Immelman, Full Rolls
4 <BR>11
Humpty Bump (pull-push-pull), Full Roll up, 1/2 Roll
down
3 <BR>12
8pt Roll
4 <BR>13
Stall Turn, Full Roll up
2 <BR>14
Two Loops with 1/2 Rolls on top
4 <BR>15
1/2 Reverse Cuban 8 with 2/4pt Roll up
2 <BR>16
Two 2/2pt Rolls Reversed
4 <BR>17
Immelman Turn
2 <BR>18
45 degree down, 1-1/2 Positive Snap, Exit INV
3 <BR>19
1/2 Cuban 8, Exit INV
2 <BR>20
Triangle Loop with Snap Roll on top, Exit INV
4 <BR>21
1/2 Square Loop
1 <BR>22
Two 2-turn spins, Reversed
4 <BR>23
Landing
1 <BR>
Total 66 <BR></FONT></P><FONT
face=Arial size=2>Here is the new sequence that was created by the
sequence committee:</FONT>
<BR> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>Proposed 2009-2010 Masters Sequence</FONT>
<BR>
<BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>No.</FONT>
<FONT face=Arial
color=#000000
size=2>Kf</FONT> <BR>
<BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>1</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Takeoff</FONT>
<FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>(U)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000
size=2>1</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>2</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Half Clover , with 2/4 pt roll up, 1/2
roll down</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>(U)</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>4</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>3</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Humpty bump, 2/4 pt. roll
up</FONT> <FONT face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>(T)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>2</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>4</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Eight point
roll</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>(D)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000
size=2>4</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>5</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>1/2 Cuban 8, 2/2 pt.
Roll</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>(T)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000
size=2>2</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>6</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Avalanche with 1-1/2 snap, INV entry
(from bottom)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>(U)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000
size=2>4</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>7</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Half square loop on corner w/ 1/2
rolls</FONT> <FONT face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>(T)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>2</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>8</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Eight sided loop from top, INV
entry</FONT> <FONT face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>(D)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>4</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>9</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Reverse Humpty Bump w/Options from
top(1/2 or 1/4 rolls up and down)</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>(T)</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>3</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>10</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>45 degree down with 1-1/2 snap
roll</FONT> <FONT face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>(U)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>3</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>11</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Stall turn, half rolls, INV
entry</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>(T)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000
size=2>2</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>12</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Four point roll, INV
entry</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>(D)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000
size=2>4</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>13</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Humpty Bump(push,pull,pull), 2/4 pt.
Roll Up, 1/2 Roll Down, INV entry</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>(T)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000
size=2>3</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>14</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Figure-M , with 3/4
Rolls</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>(U)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000
size=2>5</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>15</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Top Hat w/ 1/4
Rolls</FONT> <FONT face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>(T)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>2</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>16</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Two 2/2 pt. rolls
reversed</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>(D)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000
size=2>4</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>17</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Immelmann Turn</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>(T)</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>2</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>18</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Hour Glass( MID entry, top first) 2/4 pt
roll down</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>(U)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000
size=2>5</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>19</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Figure 9 from middle (INV entry, top
first)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>(T)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>1</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>20</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Double Immelmann with Full
Rolls</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>(D)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000
size=2>3</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>21</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Half Square Loop with 2/2 pt. roll
up</FONT> <FONT face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>(T)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial color=#000000
size=2>2</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>22</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>2-1/2 Turn Spin, INV entry, upright
exit</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>(U)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000
size=2>3</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>23</FONT> <FONT
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Landing</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>(U)</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000
size=2>1</FONT> <BR>
<BR>
<FONT face=Arial
color=#000000 size=2>TOTAL</FONT> <FONT face=Arial
color=#000000
size=2>66</FONT> <BR><BR><FONT
face="Times New Roman">Hopefully the above is legible… please let me
know your thoughts.</FONT>
<BR>_______________________________________________<BR>NSRCA-discussion
mailing
list<BR>NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<HR>
<P><BR>_______________________________________________<BR>NSRCA-discussion
mailing
list<BR>NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</P></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<HR>
Don't get caught with egg on your face. <A
href="http://club.live.com/chicktionary.aspx?icid=chick_wlmailtextlink"
target=_new>Play Chicktionary! </A>
<P>
<HR>
<P></P>_______________________________________________<BR>NSRCA-discussion
mailing
list<BR>NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>