<HTML><BODY style="word-wrap: break-word; -khtml-nbsp-mode: space; -khtml-line-break: after-white-space; ">My comments regarding not all Intermediate class pilots being qualified to judge Advanced is from experience. A lot of Intermediate class pilots just moved up from Sportsman and barely know how to fly their own sequences, much less judge a class above them. They don't have the basic knowledge of how to judge correctly. I've had Intermediate pilots ask to be assigned to any other job than being a judge of Advanced pilots because they didn't feel qualified. <DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV>Further, like all programs, our judging certification program often leaves a lot to be desired. Despite the efforts of a lot of people like Don Ramsey, how many pilots just got certified by sitting in a group with a lot of other guys who all took the "test" together? I've seen it happen far too often. Judge certification classes run by Don Ramsey at the Nats take several hours. I've watched some local classes take less than an hour and most of that was taking the test. For experienced judges, just taking the test is probably enough, because they have familiarized themselves with changes to the rules and only need to take the test. However, I believe that pilots who are inexperienced judges are being shortchanged at the local level.</DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV>Ron Van Putte</DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV><BR><DIV><DIV>On Jun 14, 2007, at 8:12 AM, John Ferrell wrote:</DIV><BR class="Apple-interchange-newline"><BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"> <DIV><FONT face="Arial" size="2">I find the lack of confidence in the Judging Certification Program to be an insult to those who put forth so much effort into it.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Arial" size="2"></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Arial" size="2">There are still a lot of Masters/FAI pilots who choose to not waste their time knowing the AMA rule book. And there are many pilots who are new to the Pattern Discipline that have read and continue to read the Rule book like the Bible!</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Arial" size="2"></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Arial" size="2">The class one flies is not a good indicator of their judging qualities.</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Arial" size="2">John Ferrell W8CCW<BR>"Life is easier if you learn to plow <BR> around the stumps"<BR><A href="http://DixieNC.US">http://DixieNC.US</A><BR></FONT></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title="vanputte@cox.net" href="mailto:vanputte@cox.net">Ron Van Putte</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title="nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA Mailing List</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, June 13, 2007 7:44 PM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Nats registration</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV>It is true that SOME Intermediate pilots are qualified to judge Advanced and are used if they are. The event director's job is to discover who is qualified. That's why we pay him the big $. <VBG> <DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV> <DIV>Ron Van Putte</DIV> <DIV><BR> <DIV> <DIV>On Jun 13, 2007, at 5:51 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:</DIV><BR class="Apple-interchange-newline"> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Provided that the Intermediate pilots aren't qualified to judge Advanced, right? And since there are 20 Intermediate pilots they can help out with judging Advanced as well - since everyone has to be certified.<BR><BR> <DIV><SPAN class="gmail_quote">On 6/13/07, <B class="gmail_sendername">Ron Van Putte</B> <<A href="mailto:vanputte@cox.net">vanputte@cox.net</A>> wrote:</SPAN> <BLOCKQUOTE class="gmail_quote" style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid"> <DIV style="WORD-WRAP: break-word">As a former Nats event director, I must point out that the Master class pilots are used to judge the Advanced AND F3A pilots, thus the problem with the number of Master class pilots. If you use three judges on both Advanced lines, that's six judges each session. Then, if there are four F3A lines, that's another twelve judges. So, the first two sessions of Advanced and F3A requires 36 Master class judges. Oh oh! we run out of Master class judges on the third day if we only have 40 Master class pilots and nobody volunteers to judge extra sessions. That's why Dave Guerin's hair is turning gray/falling out. <DIV><BR> </DIV> <DIV>Ron Van Putte</DIV> <DIV><SPAN class="e" id="q_113274214dff1c2a_1"> <DIV><BR> <DIV> <DIV>On Jun 13, 2007, at 5:26 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:</DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"> <DIV>And for one year there will actually be enough judges to judge Masters - we've always struggled with not having enough F3A pilots to fill the Masters judging pool.</DIV> <DIV><BR><BR> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class="gmail_quote">On 6/13/07, <B class="gmail_sendername">Jim Woodward</B> <<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:Jim.Woodward@armorholdings.com" target="_blank">Jim.Woodward@armorholdings.com </A>> wrote:</SPAN> <BLOCKQUOTE class="gmail_quote" style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid"> <DIV lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"> <DIV><P><FONT face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Wow – Awesome! The Masters pilots will get a taste of judging a highly attended FAI class! </SPAN></FONT><FONT face="Wingdings" color="navy" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Wingdings">J</SPAN></FONT><FONT face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> </SPAN></FONT><FONT face="Wingdings" color="navy" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Wingdings">J</SPAN></FONT><FONT face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> </SPAN></FONT><FONT face="Wingdings" color="navy" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Wingdings">J</SPAN></FONT><FONT face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> </SPAN></FONT></P> <DIV><FONT face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"></SPAN></FONT><BR> </DIV><P><FONT face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Jim W.</SPAN></FONT></P> <DIV><FONT face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"></SPAN></FONT><BR> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"></SPAN></FONT><BR> </DIV> <DIV> <DIV style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align="center"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> <HR align="center" width="100%" size="2"> </SPAN></FONT></DIV><P><B><FONT face="Tahoma" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT face="Tahoma" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"> <A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org</A> [mailto:<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org </A>] <B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of </SPAN></B>Derek Koopowitz<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Wednesday, June 13, 2007 12:41 PM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> NSRCA Mailing List; <A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:dist7@nsrca.org" target="_blank">dist7@nsrca.org</A><BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> [NSRCA-discussion] Nats registration </SPAN></FONT></P></DIV> <DIV><SPAN> <DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT><BR> </DIV> <DIV><P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">It looks like we have 115 total registered pilots for the Nats this year (from the AMA website)...</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV> <DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT><BR> </DIV></DIV> <DIV><P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Intermediate - 20</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV> <DIV><P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Advanced - 16</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV> <DIV><P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Masters - 40</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV> <DIV><P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">FAI - 39</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV> <DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT><BR> </DIV></DIV> <DIV><P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Those are excellent #'s and I'm hoping that there will still be some late entries that will raise those numbers even more.</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV> <DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT><BR> </DIV></DIV> <DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT><BR> </DIV></DIV></SPAN></DIV></DIV></DIV><BR>_______________________________________________<BR>NSRCA-discussion mailing list<BR><A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</A><BR><A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion" target="_blank">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion </A><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR> <DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">_______________________________________________</DIV> <DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">NSRCA-discussion mailing list</DIV> <DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org" target="_blank">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</A></DIV> <DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion" target="_blank">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</A> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR> </DIV></SPAN></DIV></DIV><BR>_______________________________________________<BR>NSRCA-discussion mailing list<BR><A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</A><BR><A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion" target="_blank">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion </A><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR> <DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">_______________________________________________</DIV> <DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">NSRCA-discussion mailing list</DIV> <DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><A href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</A></DIV> <DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><A href="http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion">http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</A></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR></DIV><DIV> <BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><HR><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV>_______________________________________________<BR>NSRCA-discussion mailing list<BR><A href="mailto:NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</A><BR>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</BLOCKQUOTE><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; 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