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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Tony,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I don't agree that the view of the pilot and judge
are the same. I have a habit, taught to me by senior judges in d6 long
ago, that I do when judging. Before sitting down I stand in the pilot
station and look at the poles( best) or a landmark on the box lines. then
I sit and look again. I think it is amazing how even a 10 ft judge setback
can change the perception of the box line. I know a lot of pilots that
like to stretch the box and scrape the edges on turnarounds so its important to
recognize even small parallax issues.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>BTW Matt, there were 2 judging seminars in D6. One
in Temple and one in Albuquerque. So many choices, it can be hard to
choose.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>--Lance</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=mjfrederick@cox.net href="mailto:mjfrederick@cox.net">Matthew
Frederick</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA Mailing List</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, May 15, 2007 12:45
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Judges'
Positioning, Zero Lines,and Box Definition</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Thank you, Tony. My point exactly. I'm glad
someone else realized that I was not asking for help on how to avoid breaking
the box, but just trying to bring up a potential problem with box size judging
based on simple geometry. Even though seminars are making judging more
uniform, there are still people like me who just flat-out can't make a 10-hour
drive to a contest just so they can attend a seminar. The website is helpful;
but open, ongoing discussion on these topics will keep them fresh in our
minds.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Matt</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=tony@radiosouthrc.com href="mailto:tony@radiosouthrc.com">Tony
Stillman</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">'NSRCA Mailing List'</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, May 14, 2007 8:44
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Judges'
Positioning, Zero Lines,and Box Definition</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV class=Section1>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Matt:<BR>This is
something I have spoken about several times. The poles are there for
the JUDGES. The lines are for the PILOTS. If the poles cannot be
place on their proper location, THEY SHOULD NOT BE USED! This if
because of the very thing that you are talking about. If the poles are
at the 150 meter out location, the difference between the view of the pilot
and the judges, even if they are 25 feet behind the pilot, are virtually the
same. The closer you bring in the poles, but more of an error you will
create. <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoAutoSig><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=navy size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy">Tony Stillman,
President<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoAutoSig><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=navy size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy">Radio
South<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoAutoSig><st1:Street w:st="on"><st1:address w:st="on"><FONT
face="Times New Roman" color=navy size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy">3702 N. Pace
Blvd</SPAN></FONT></st1:address></st1:Street><FONT color=navy><SPAN
style="COLOR: navy"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoAutoSig><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on"><FONT
face="Times New Roman" color=navy size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy">Pensacola</SPAN></FONT></st1:City><FONT
color=navy><SPAN style="COLOR: navy">, <st1:State w:st="on">FL</st1:State>
<st1:PostalCode
w:st="on">32505</st1:PostalCode></SPAN></FONT></st1:place><FONT
color=navy><SPAN style="COLOR: navy"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoAutoSig><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=navy size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy">1-800-962-7802<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><FONT face="Courier New" color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy">www.radiosouthrc.com<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><FONT
face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<HR tabIndex=-1 align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] <B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of </SPAN></B>Matthew
Frederick<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Saturday,
May 12, 2007 1:29 PM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B>
nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> [NSRCA-discussion] Judges'
Positioning, Zero Lines,and Box
Definition</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">OK, this forum has been too
quiet lately, so let's get some controversy going! This comment/question is
mainly directed to Don Ramsey, but I would appreciate everyone's opinion.
The good thing is, Don was at the contest where what I'm about to describe
happened. What I'm talking about here is the positioning of judges behind
the pilot. Under most circumstances the judges are positioned maybe 3-5 feet
behind the pilot with each judge's seat placed on (or very close
to) one of the 60-degree lines. Now, at a contest I attended last week
the judges apparently decided it was too hot out there on the actual flight
line, and they moved their chairs about 15-20 feet behind the pilot in the
shade of the shed at this particular field. My question is, should this be
something that is allowed since the judges' chairs define the zero line of
the flight line (and moving it back this far puts spectators in danger), and
also because it gives the judges an even more skewed view of the 60-degree
lines than they already have? I bring this up partly because of what Don
wrote in this month's K-Factor, but also because I was gigged for busting
the box by these "displaced" (in Louisiana we call them refugees)
judges when in fact, I knew I was close to the edge, but since I was
actually standing on the line, I knew I didn't bust it. As a pilot I should
not have to adjust the size of the box that I'm permitted to fly in just so
the judges can be more comfortable (granted, comfort in the heat and
humidity of <st1:State w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">Louisiana</st1:place></st1:State> is relative). I didn't bring it
up at the contest because by the time it bit me, it was too late to
complain. In the future, however, I think there need to be rules regarding
the positioning of judges if there aren't already, and if there are rules,
let's bring them to light and enforce them, and you can bet I'll refuse to
fly before judges that are that far behind me. Then again, I also think the
close edge of the runway should be the zero line on maneuvers, not the
judges' chairs. I did a little (ok, a lot) of math to figure out how much
box a pilot would be missing out on with the judges postitioned 15
feet behind him. Using approximated numbers from the contest in question I
calculated that if the poles are 40 feet out from the pilot, and the judges
are 15 feet behind the pilot, the box size at 150 meters (which is
259.81m) based on the judges' point of view is reduced by 232.61 feet
(70.9 m), or 25.2%! This would have been even greater if the poles were
closer in or the judges were further
back.</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Matt</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV></DIV>
<P>
<HR>
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mailing
list<BR>NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<BR>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion</BLOCKQUOTE>
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