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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Just to clarify, I do realize our
descriptions are referenced to a plane parallel to the flightline. Thus the
maneuvers are distorted from the judges’ perspective AND also from the
pilots’ perspective.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Richard<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Richard Lewis<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Tuesday, April 10, 2007 8:35
AM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> '<st1:PersonName w:st="on">NSRCA
Mailing List</st1:PersonName>'<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
APPARENT GEOMETRY (PARALLAXED VIEW)</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I downloaded a judging training manual for
CL stunt flying and the rulebook descriptions. These guys have an extreme
case of the distortion to the judges’ viewpoint due to the hemispherical
flight envelope. Their geometry is described and flown from the pilot’s
perspective. Loops look like circles to the pilot and ellipses to the
judges. In the training manual I found, each maneuver is drawn with the
accurate rulebook geometry from the pilot’s perspective overlaid with an
expected distorted figure from the judges’ point of view.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>IMO...this is a judge training issue.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Richard<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Del K. Rykert<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Tuesday, April 10, 2007 7:38
AM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">NSRCA
Mailing List</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
APPARENT GEOMETRY (PARALLAXED VIEW)</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>What I did to help train my pilots and
judging eye was to walk to end of flight box, staying on judging side of flight
line at contest, and watched 4 or 5 skilled pilots flying their center
maneuvers. It produced the same visual effect on their center
maneuvers as standing at center of box and looking at end
maneuvers. (Realize this only applies to the center maneuvers for eyeball
training) the assumption is the center maneuvers are flown normally more
accurately than end box maneuvers. The added bonus was I could see if the
pilots where doing correct true verticals and horizontals at my end of the
maneuvering box. The surprising flaw I noticed was some would not fly
their bottom horizontals flat. Some would also not pull a true vertical.
Occasionally I would see a pilot off as much as 20º from true vertical.
They would often have a slight climb in them as they approached the end of the
box. I found going out and experiencing was my best teacher. Class rooms
talks are great but they can't reproduce all of the geometry that an
experienced judge gains from sitting the flight line year after year.
When contests had more man power to run a contest it was discussed about
having turnaround judges at one time.</span></font><font size=2 color=black
face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> </span></font><font
size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;
color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:State
w:st="on">Del</st1:State></st1:place></span></font><font size=2 color=black
face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;
margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>----- Original Message ----- <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='font-color:black'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:#E4E4E4'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <a
href="mailto:ed_alt@hotmail.com" title="ed_alt@hotmail.com">Ed Alt</a> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;font-weight:bold'>To:</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> <a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
title="nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA Mailing List</a> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> Tuesday, April 10, 2007 7:04 AM<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] APPARENT GEOMETRY (PARALLAXED VIEW)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>And all the lines will
bend and not appear straight, Hey, I do that already!<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>Ed<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;
margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>----- Original Message ----- <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='font-color:black'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:#E4E4E4'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <a
href="mailto:fhhuber@clearwire.net" title="mailto:fhhuber@clearwire.net">Fred
Huber</a> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;font-weight:bold'>To:</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> <a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
title="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA Mailing List</a> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> Monday, April 09, 2007 10:59 PM<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] APPARENT GEOMETRY (PARALLAXED VIEW)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>The responsibility of
the pilot s to PERFORM the corret geometry despite the parallax view.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>The responsibility of
the judge is to learn how the parallax will make the correctly flown maneuver look.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>About the only way I
can think of to show the effects of parallax on a correctly flown turnaround
maneuver would be to film it from as close to perpendicular to the flight path
as possible, and at the judges' location at the same time. then play the tapes
sumultaneously at a judging seminar.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>At the appx 45 to 55
deg observation angle of the judges station, a 45 deg up/down line (half cuban)
would appear steeper than what is actually being performed. If it looks
like a 45 from the judge's station (holding up a 9th gradeer's geometry class
triangle), its too shallow. The appearance of 60 deg (same method) would
be closer to actually being the 45 deg line.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>Note that if the pilot
doesn't make use of the full box, the parallax will be reduced... and that's
not downgradeable.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>Verticals should still
look vertical.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;
margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>----- Original Message ----- <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='font-color:black'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:#E4E4E4'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <a
href="mailto:rcmaster199@aol.com" title="mailto:rcmaster199@aol.com">rcmaster199@aol.com</a>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;font-weight:bold'>To:</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> <a href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org"
title="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</a>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> Monday, April 09, 2007 10:11 PM<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> [NSRCA-discussion] APPARENT GEOMETRY (PARALLAXED VIEW)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>A question has been
posted from an IMAC gentleman (who is trying to write better IMAC
rules) as to how Pattern people fly and judge skewed appearance of
maneuvers at box ends or in center when tall maneuvers (Hourglass, Vert Sq 8,
Rolling Ess, etc) are involved. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>Some of us have
searched the book and found no wording written that describes what the pilots'
responsibilities and the judges' responsibilities are in the performance of the
skewed apparent geometry. There is a statement in the Judges Training tape in
regard to end maneuvers.... that these will appear different even when
accurately flown. The oness is essentially on the judges to know how the True
Geometry should appear when flown at an angle to the eye, and must not
downgrade for Apparent or Parallaxed appearance difference.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>Spoke with Don about
this earlier today and we decided to present the question to the group and get
some conversation going. We should be explicit in the book regarding how such
Apparent Geometry should be treated....ie- what is the pilot's responsibility
and what is the judge's. Description improvements could be written over the
next couple rule cycles.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>The pilot's
responsibility may appear easy.... they simply need to fly precise geometry per
the book. True enough, BUT.....consider what is actually flown, especially by
the top guys, and what scores well. These are not necessarily as precise as one
might think. The better pilots tend to fly purposely flawed maneuvers that
give the impression of precision. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>MattK<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-top:7.5pt'><font size=2 color=black
face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>AOL
now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at <a
href="http://www.aol.com?ncid=AOLAOF00020000000437" target="_blank"
title="http://www.aol.com/?ncid=AOLAOF00020000000437"><b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>AOL.com</span></b></a>.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>_______________________________________________<br>
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<br>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>No virus found in this
incoming message.<br>
Checked by AVG Free Edition.<br>
Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.26/752 - Release Date: 4/8/2007 8:34
PM<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>_______________________________________________<br>
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<br>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</blockquote>
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color=black face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;
color:black'>
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</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>_______________________________________________<br>
NSRCA-discussion mailing list<br>
NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org<br>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</blockquote>
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