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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Vicente is right on the mark guys. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The first up-line is on the center line so the
radius has to start before center and it should follow that the first loop
should be the inside, otherwise the maneuver will cause a reverse in the
sequence direction and that shouldn't take place 'til after the 1/2 square with
2 of 2 up. To me, seems pretty straight forward. </FONT></DIV>
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style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=vicenterc@comcast.net
href="mailto:vicenterc@comcast.net">vicenterc@comcast.net</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org
href="mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org">NSRCA Mailing List</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, November 12, 2006 9:43
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters
Square 8</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>I agree with Don. The square 8 is a center maneuver, therefore the
center, entry and exit of the maneuver, must be in front of the judges so
the maneuver is balanced around the center. This means that the entry
point of the straight line is 15 m before the center. Likewise the exit
point is 15 meters in the other side of the entry point after the center in
order to keep the figure balanced around the center. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I am sure that we are going to have concern in other manuevers.
However, center manuevers are balanced around the center of the box so it is
easy applying this rule to come to the right conclusion in regard the entry
and exit points.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Vicente "Vince" Bortone</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">--------------
Original message -------------- <BR>From: <jivey61@bellsouth.net>
<BR><BR>> All <BR>> If the maneuver starts at center,then we fly 2 of
the same segments of the <BR>> outside portion of the "8". The inverted
horizontal portion just before the <BR>> first vertical and the last
inverted horizontal portion just before the <BR>> first vertical. Note
below taken from NSRCA judging page....maneuver <BR>> properties:..begin
and end with a straight line....... To me this says the <BR>> maneuver
starts at the entry line which is before the first vertical and <BR>>
ends after the exit line just after the first vertical point. The maneuver
<BR>> is still centered equally on either side of center. <BR>>
<BR>> Jim Ivey <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> General Judging
Guidelines <BR>> <BR>> Page maintained by Don Ramsey. Please email me
wit! h any p roblems, comments <BR>> or suggestions. <BR>> <BR>>
"All centered maneuvers should have these properties unless otherwise
<BR>> defined in the maneuver description or in that maneuver's
downgrades. Learn <BR>> these and you have an excellent start toward
becoming a better judge. <BR>> Maneuver properties:" <BR>> <BR>> -
Begin and end with a straight line - Rolls centered on lines <BR>> -
Middle of the maneuver centered <BR>> on the judges - Roll rates the same
<BR>> - Lines of equal length - Loops round <BR>> - Radiuses equal -
Done within 175 meters <BR>> - Begin and end at the same altitude
<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>>
----- Original Message ----- <BR>> From: "Stuart Chale"
<SCHALE@OPTONLINE.NET><BR>> To: "'NSRCA Mailing List'"
<NSRCA-DISCUSSION@LISTS.NSRCA.ORG><BR>> Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2006
8:21 AM <BR>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters Square 8 <BR>>
<BR>> <B! R>> > " As for scoring, I'm not entirely sure it matters.
<BR>> > Don" <BR>> > <BR>> > What Don said is probably
true. Agreed there is a long inverted flight <BR>> > before the first
push to vertical in the horizontal eight and after the <BR>> > humpty
bump. If someone is weaving, or changing altitude during this <BR>> >
portion, the judge is going to downgrade one of the two maneuvers. I
<BR>> would <BR>> > think if there was a reasonable straight and
level after the humpty then <BR>> the <BR>> > rest is judged on the
horizontal eight. Do we really have segments of <BR>> > flight that
should not be judged or added to a downgrade for anything but <BR>> >
straight and level? <BR>> > <BR>> > Stuart Chale <BR>> >
<BR>> > -----Original Message----- <BR>> > From:
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org <BR>> >
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Don Ram! sey
<BR>> > (CoxNet) <BR>> > Sent: Saturday, November 11, 2006 8:40
PM <BR>> > To: NSRCA Mailing List <BR>> > Subject: Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Masters Square 8 <BR>> > <BR>> > Lance,
<BR>> > <BR>> > I believe it starts at center. Straight line
before center and start at <BR>> > center. The reason I say that is
rule 14.1 which says "Each time the <BR>> model <BR>> > passes
before the judges, a maneuver is executed, except after takeoff and <BR>>
> landing." Of course, some maneuvers start before center as the slow
roll, <BR>> > etc. As for scoring, I'm not entirely sure it matters.
<BR>> > <BR>> > Don <BR>> > <BR>> > ----- Original
Message ----- <BR>> > From: <JIVEY61@BELLSOUTH.NET><BR>> > To:
"NSRCA Mailing List" <NSRCA-DISCUSSION@LISTS.NSRCA.ORG><BR>> > Sent:
Saturday, November 11, 2006 7:16 PM <BR>> > Subject: Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Masters Square 8 <BR>> &! gt; <BR>> >
<BR>> > > Lance <BR>> > > You will have to have a entry
line before the push to vertical past <BR>> > > center.This is
where I think it starts... at the start of the entry <BR>> line. <BR>>
> > <BR>> > > Jim Ivey <BR>> > > ----- Original
Message ----- <BR>> > > From: "Lance Van Nostrand"
<PATTERNDUDE@COMCAST.NET><BR>> > > To: "NSRCA Mailing List"
<NSRCA-DISCUSSION@LISTS.NSRCA.ORG><BR>> > > Sent: Saturday,
November 11, 2006 7:51 PM <BR>> > > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Masters Square 8 <BR>> > > <BR>> > > <BR>> >
>> OK,so where does the maneuver begin and end? At center, the radius
<BR>> after <BR>> > >> center, at the first corner
initiation? <BR>> > >> <BR>> > >> --Lance <BR>>
> >> <BR>> > >> ----- Original Message ----- <BR>>
> >> From: <JIVEY61@BELLSOUTH.NET><BR>! > &g t; >> To:
"NSRCA Mailing List" <NSRCA-DISCUSSION@LISTS.NSRCA.ORG><BR>> >
>> Sent: Saturday, November 11, 2006 4:06 PM <BR>> > >>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters Square 8 <BR>> > >>
<BR>> > >> <BR>> > >> > Jason <BR>> >
>> > The way we are flying the 8 is enter inverted and 1st loop
(outside) <BR>> to <BR>> > >> > the <BR>> > >>
> right of center and next (inside) loop to the left of center.The
<BR>> first <BR>> > >> > loop <BR>> > >> >
is outside loop and 1st vertical segment starts past center.Of course
<BR>> > > swap <BR>> > >> > left and right for
opposite flying direction. <BR>> > >> > <BR>> >
>> > <BR>> > >> > Jim Ivey <BR>> > >>
> <BR>> > >> > ----- Original Message ----- <BR>> >
>> > From: "JShulman" ! <JSHULM AN@CFL.RR.COM><BR>> >
>> > To: "NSRCA" <NSRCA-DISCUSSION@LISTS.NSRCA.ORG><BR>> >
>> > Sent: Saturday, November 11, 2006 4:08 PM <BR>> >
>> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters Square 8 <BR>> >
>> > <BR>> > >> > <BR>> > >> >> Hi
All, <BR>> > >> >> <BR>> > >> >> Does
the Square horizontal 8 start at center or just past center? <BR>> >
>> >> <BR>> > >> >> Regards, <BR>> >
>> >> Jason <BR>> > >> >> www.jasonshulman.com
<BR>> > >> >> www.shulmanaviation.com <BR>> >
>> >> www.composite-arf.com <BR>> > >> >> --
<BR>> > >> >> No virus found in this outgoing message.
<BR>> > >> >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. <BR>> >
>> >> Version: 7.1.409 / Virus Database: 268.14.2/528 - Release!
Date: <BR>> > >> >> 11/10/2006 <BR>> > >>
>> <BR>> > >> >> <BR>> > >> >>
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