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<DIV>Although this is one way around a problem from the manufacturer's point of view, it's not really a solution for our application. What I have asked in the past and Earl, Dave and Dean and a couple others have asked also is, and I paraphrase, how do you take advantage of the normal flying envelope to cool the motor, (engine), battery, (pipe)? Then plausible solutions have been developed or described on this forum. </DIV>
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<DIV>It makes little sense to have all that breeze available and then rely on a silly tiny fan to draw air into the motor. That's just another way to not only rob precious power, it will also cost more money up front for the "improvement". That's not value....it's plain dumb. We need to let these manufacturers know that we are smarter than that, by not buying it. </DIV>
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<DIV>MattK</DIV> <BR>-----Original Message-----<BR>From: Rex LESHER <trexlesh@msn.com><BR>To: NSRCA Mailing List <nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org><BR>Sent: Tue, 28 Mar 2006 21:33:18 -0800<BR>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Reducing the odds...<BR><BR>
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<DIV>Guys, some of our grief with cooling outrunner motors is being remedied by the manufacturer. They are beginning to install fans in the motor to pull air through them.... I believe Plettenburg is now doing this on their Extra 30-10.</DIV>
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<DIV>Rex Lesher</DIV>
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<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>From:</B> <A title=mailto:jeffghughes@comcast.net href="javascript:parent.ComposeTo('jeffghughes@comcast.net');">jeffghughes@comcast.net</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org href="javascript:parent.ComposeTo('nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org');">NSRCA Mailing List</A> ; <A title=mailto:nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org href="javascript:parent.ComposeTo('nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org');">nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, March 28, 2006 6:00 PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Reducing the odds...</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Matt,</DIV>
<DIV>Your missing my point. I have never doubted that a "properly" designed duct can increase cooling. I just doubt that most modelers have "properly" designed duct work in their planes. The ducts we make increase cooling over not having any duct work, but I've built and flown a lot of planes with engines and motors un-cowled that didn't overheat either! My initial statement was around uncowled outrunner motors. Why not have them up front and exposed? Save a lot of grief and might just look good (or not, it just might look industrial). We as pattern folks always seem to do the harder right, instead of the easier right.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Jeff</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">-------------- Original message -------------- <BR>From: rcmaster199@aol.com <BR>
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<DIV>Jeff, how do you increase air velocity around the motor with no increase in model airspeed? </DIV>
<DIV>Here's where our old friend Bernoulli comes in, stage left. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>And BTW, the properly designed ENTRY into and EXIT from the ducting really increases the ducting efficiency. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Cheers,</DIV>
<DIV>Matt</DIV> <BR>-----Original Message-----<BR>From: jeffghughes@comcast.net<BR>To: NSRCA Mailing List <nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org>; NSRCA Mailing List <nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org><BR>Sent: Tue, 28 Mar 2006 22:10:39 +0000<BR>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Reducing the odds...<BR><BR>
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<DIV>While I agree good ducting can be better than hanging out there, I seriously doubt if most modelers do any better than hanging it out. Plus I think an outrunner all polished up woul look pretty cool with the fuse faired into it. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">-------------- Original message -------------- <BR>From: "Dean Pappas" <d.pappas@kodeos.com> <BR>
<DIV><SPAN class=504561818-28032006><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Good ducting is better than hanging in the breeze, and a whole lot prettier.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman">Dean Pappas</FONT> <BR><FONT face="Times New Roman">Sr. Design Engineer</FONT> <BR><FONT face="Times New Roman">Kodeos Communications</FONT> <BR><FONT face="Times New Roman">111 Corporate Blvd.</FONT> <BR><FONT face="Times New Roman">South Plainfield, N.J. 07080</FONT> <BR><FONT face="Times New Roman">(908) 222-7817 phone</FONT> <BR><FONT face="Times New Roman">(908) 222-2392 fax</FONT> <BR><FONT face="Times New Roman">d.pappas@kodeos.com</FONT> </DIV>
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<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org]<B>On Behalf Of </B>jeffghughes@comcast.net<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, March 28, 2006 12:49 PM<BR><B>To:</B> NSRCA Mailing List; NSRCA Mailing List<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Reducing the odds...<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>I was thinking about this the other day. Why don't we change the fuse design to stick the motor out in the breeze? Kind of like a WWI rotary or a foamy. Seems like we're trying hard to keep the planes identical in design between electrics and fuel for no apparent reasons</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Also now that huge props and braking are available, will fuselages slim down some?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">-------------- Original message -------------- <BR>From: "Dean Pappas" <d.pappas@kodeos.com> <BR><BR>> Hi Earl, <BR>> This sounds a whole lot loke the similar duct I have placed around my AXI <BR>> outrunner. <BR>> It is astounding how much a difference a real cooling duct makes. <BR>> Fans inside the motor are a band-aid. The top-down solution is good airflow <BR>> management. <BR>> <BR>> The picture is of the ductwork in the Funtana I am doing for FM. <BR>> The subject is modifying the plane for high-performance electric. (high heat and <BR>> RF generation) <BR>> The airbox in the front of the cowl encloses the front of the motor, <BR>> and feeds the internals and the 1/8" gap in the duct with high pressure air. <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> later, <BR>> Dean <BR>> <BR>> Dean Pappas <BR>> </BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></! ??="ht!=" ml="!"></DIV>
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<TD class=FieldLabel noWrap>From:</TD>
<TD class=FieldValue>Dean Pappas <d.pappas@kodeos.com></TD></TR>
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<TD class=FieldLabel>To:</TD>
<TD class=FieldValue>NSRCA Mailing List <nsrca-discussion@lists.nsrca.org></TD></TR>
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<TD class=FieldLabel>Subject:</TD>
<TD class=FieldValue>Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Reducing the odds...</TD></TR>
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<TD class=FieldLabel>Date:</TD>
<TD class=FieldValue>Tue, 28 Mar 2006 18:19:00 +0000</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></DIV>
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