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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Truthfully.. competition will never be for
the masses.. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>One thing that would certainly help
pattern is for people to believe they can be competitive without having to
spend $5000 on an airplane. They most certainly can do it.. but the PERCEPTION
needs to be there for it to take hold.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>-Doug<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces@lists.nsrca.org] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>vicenterc@comcast.net<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Saturday, February 25, 2006
8:28 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> NSRCA Mailing List; NSRCA
Mailing List<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Was Mini Brio, Now Pattern Longitevity</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>It is rewarding to read positive messages. This is one of
them. Today, I got the K-Factor and Rusty Dose message was also
positive. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Vicente Bortone<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;
margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>-------------- Original message -------------- <br>
From: "Mike Hester" <kerlock@comcast.net> <br>
<br>
> Real quickly, I don't think pattern is dying, I think it is evolving, <br>
> changing, shifting areas of activeness. While it's numbers are dwindling
in <br>
> some places, the numbers are on the increase in others. <br>
> <br>
> one thing I think would be a mistake would be to change the airframe rules
<br>
> in pattern. they are stabilized, and I don't think changing them would
have <br>
> any positive long lasting effect. if anything, it could worsen the <br>
> situation. Stability fosters enginuety, and some people are rising to the <br>
> challenge of both leading edge technology, and old school methods. When
you <br>
> learn how to seamlessly blend both, you create more options. <br>
> <br>
> Think about how wide open our airframe and power rules real! ly are: power
is <br>
> virtually unlimited, airframe is an empty 2 meter box with a maximum
weight <br>
> of 5 k or 11 lbs, and the noise requirement...but if they can get a 40% <br>
> within the noise requirements, then that's no longer an issue. <br>
> <br>
> What we have to do, all of us, is foster a fun but competetive atmosphere.
<br>
> We need to reach out to people on a grass roots level and get them <br>
> motivated. We need to slay the perception that you must have a $3000 <br>
> airframe and $2-3000 worth of electric power or you're wasting your time.
I <br>
> hate that crap. And we need to ALL make sure that we don't even <br>
> subconsciously give the edge to a guy with the latest greatest electric
set <br>
> up, because by doing so think what message we'll be sending to the guy
that <br>
> really can't afford that kind of investment right now, today. in the
future <br>
> who knows. <br>
> <br>
> if you haven't heard, ZDZ is coming! out with a new 40cc f3A engine this <br>
> summer. this thing will turn as large of a prop as the electrics. The
weight <br>
> increase over glow isn't even half as bad as electric. This alone could do
<br>
> great things for us in crossing certain invisible barriers. <br>
> <br>
> Then again, maybe not =) <br>
> <br>
> Sorry to ramble, must be the paint fumes..... <br>
> <br>
> -Mike <br>
> <br>
> ----- Original Message ----- <br>
> From: "Ryan Smith" <br>
<SMARAGDZ@BELLSOUTH.NET>> To: <br>
<NSRCA-DISCUSSION@LISTS.NSRCA.ORG>> Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2006 12:51
PM <br>
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Was Mini Brio, Now Pattern Longitevity <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> I honestly don't think that you have to spend out the butt to have a <br>
> competitive setup. The keeping up with the Joneses syndrome is the
prevalent <br>
> factor that makes everyone think that pattern is so ungodly expensive.
There <br>
> are plenty of options out there for people to create a cost-effective, <br>
> competitive two meter! rig. But alas, people out there think they HAVE to <br>
> have the biggest best and fastest everything, when in reality, there is no
<br>
> way in hell most newer fliers out there can discern between a slightly <br>
> inferior and cheaper product and a top of the line product (a big example <br>
> here would be digital servos as opposed to analog servos). There are <br>
> certainly MANY viable options out there for a cheap two meter setup that <br>
> will be competitive in the long run. The best example I can see of this is
<br>
> Mark Hunt, down in the <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Houston</st1:place></st1:City>
area. His airplane, the Insight, is all wood <br>
> and foam, and can be built with maybe $150 worth of wood (I'm throwing a <br>
> generous estimate out there), not to mention the plans are like $25. He is
<br>
> actually running an OS 1.60 on a standard muffler and is still making the <br>
> noise restrictions. Mark exemplifies what people just starting out in <br>
> pattern need to look in! to, not only because it's cheap, but the
airplanes <br>
> are simple to maintain and I would venture to say bulletproof. I bought a <br>
> set from him a while back and haven't had the chance to build one, but I <br>
> really would like to. I would like to do what he's doing and and outfit it
<br>
> with analog servos and make it otherwise plain jane and see just how it <br>
> stacks up to the rest of the field out there. There are also several other
<br>
> wood airplanes out there that are a little more extravagant, such as the <br>
> Black Magic v2 by Mike Hester and the Quest and Shindin by Bryan Herbert <br>
> that are being drawn in CAD and being kitted. Look at the airplanes that
the <br>
> Japanese team members fly- they're all wood. And look at where they place.
<br>
> Most if not all are always in the top ten, and young Tetsuo Onda even
placed <br>
> second this year. That's a heck of a feat for anyone, mu <br>
> ch less an eighteen year old who is flying against people who have been <br>
> modeling twice as ! long as he's been living. <br>
> <br>
> Another point, the theory of everyone flying the same thing has <br>
> never worked, not in fullscale and not in models. The One Design class
never <br>
> caught on in full scale, however there are many examples of that airplane <br>
> flying. In IMAC, there are worries about everyone using consistent <br>
> batteries, motors, servos, and such, and if you have to be dictated that <br>
> much on what you can and cannot fly, it takes the fun out. Also, in IMAC,
it <br>
> is commonplace to see high end airplanes in Basic and Sportsman just
because <br>
> people want to get that advantage that they really get through burning
fuel. <br>
> I know everyone hates to hear that, but it is the truth. Once you start to
<br>
> see improvements in your own flying after having flown a lot, then you see
<br>
> what everyone preaches about when they say fly a bunch. I really don't
think <br>
> that pattern dying is really dir! ectly related to cost, but if you want
to <br>
> make it such let's break down Jay's idea. How cost effective is it to make
<br>
> someone buy something that they can't use in upper classes and would have
to <br>
> buy a new setup every year. Shouldn't we be showing people that they can
go <br>
> and get a nice setup that they can actually use and enjoy? Not to mention <br>
> the fact that you can reuse the equipment should you decide (or your
thumbs <br>
> decide) to get a new airframe. I think the cost factor is implemented by <br>
> people who don't really have the desire to succeed and have to use that as
a <br>
> scapegoat to cover what they see as their failures. <br>
> <br>
> I honestly think pattern needs an overhaul. It's not the cost <br>
> that really drives people away, it's the ideology surrounding it that
does. <br>
> People see pattern as being boring and too easy, and generally not
exciting. <br>
> However, with the advent 3D flight, and people becoming attracted to model
<br>
> airplanes because of ! it, they really want to hone their skills. I have
seen <br>
> a lot of subtle hints dropped by some past pattern flyers who write for <br>
> magazines telling people to look into pattern if they really want to
become <br>
> better at 3D. I also think that we need more promotion. Model Aviation has
<br>
> cut down the pattern column in the magazine to every other month, yet
there <br>
> are other facets in there that get full coverage that really don't need
it. <br>
> If we want pattern to survive, we really need to get publicized where it <br>
> counts- where we're going to be attracting people. Advertising in the K <br>
> Factor does nothing for the growth of pattern because we're all already <br>
> interested enough in it to subscribe. But there are people out there who <br>
> don't know and maybe would like to. I can't tell you how many times on RCU
<br>
> I've seen someone post in the Pattern Forum "What is Pattern
Flying?". Most <br>
> are usual! ly creative in what they think it is, but nevertheless, the
same <br>
& gt; group sets them straight. I think we should get on the AMA to get us
more <br>
> coverage and other magazines as well, such as Model Airplane News, 3D
Flyer, <br>
> etc. I believe THAT is what will help us, not making people buy some
little <br>
> electric that they won't be competitive with. <br>
> <br>
> Thanks for taking the time to read this guys, please feel free <br>
> to respond. <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> Regards, <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> Ryan Smith <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> _______________________________________________ <br>
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list <br>
> NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org <br>
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion <br>
> <br>
> _______________________________________________ <br>
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list <br>
> NSRCA-discussion@lists.nsrca.org <br>
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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