[NSRCA-discussion] Lipo fire

Matt Kebabjian mattkebabjian at gmail.com
Mon Jun 13 13:00:30 AKDT 2016 

How about Pyrex pans?  So many sizes and shapes to choose from at the wallyworld, or target. They can be stacked like bricks so one or three bats per pan?? With a dremmel one can grind an opening for the cable. 


Matt Kebabjian


> On Jun 13, 2016, at 3:18 PM, Ronald Van Putte via NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
> 
> I have used the flower pot idea for many years.  I purchased a big flower pot and a base that fit, not the bottom of the pot, but the top.  I put the base of the pot on a nonflammable surface, string the battery leads through the “bottom” of the pot and place it on the base, so the only open area is the small hole the leads go through.  I haven’t had a test of the system, but I’m confident it will contain any lipo fire.
> 
> Ron Van Putte
> 
>> On Jun 13, 2016, at 2:07 PM, Anthony Abdullah via NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Ceramic, like the flower pot idea or something similar, seems to be the way to go to contain the heat.
>> 
>> If anyone is interested,
>> My sister is a potter and owns an art studio, she can make virtually anything any size or shape out of clay and fire it in house in one of 4 kilns at a thousand something degrees. if anyone has a good design they like I am sure she would be glad to put something together, for a fee of course, (guaranteed to be less than the price of a van or 4 bedroom colonial in the suburbs) that would contain the heat and make Lipo storage safer.
>> 
>> She made me a 3x3 storage chest with a top and even decorated it. It's heavy and cumbersome but will contain any heat a lipo can put out. I don't move it, I just store my batteries in it. We talked about a smaller portable one with a handle but I never commissioned it because I charge   (when/if I fly) out in the open and don't need anything else to carry. 
>> 
>> Like Mark said, Lipos everywhere in multiple states of charge and discharge. I hate that the only think keeping me from waking up to the smell of burning garage is dumb luck.
>> --------------------------------------------
>> On Mon, 6/13/16, Mike Murphy via NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Lipo fire
>> To: "Mark Atwood" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>, "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>, "Shulman Jason" <justanotherflyr at gmail.com>
>> Date: Monday, June 13, 2016, 2:37 PM
>> 
>> _filtered
>> #yiv8199251789 {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4
>> 3 2 4;}Mark,
>> 
>> I treat my batteries the same as you,for the same reasons.
>> And I also am a bit nervous. 
>> Mike Murphy
>> 
>> 
>> On June 13, 2016, at 2:09
>> PM, "Atwood, Mark via NSRCA-discussion"
>> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> So playing a little devil’s
>> advocate here.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I hear a lot of talk about “not storing them inside” or
>> “discharging any charged packs that don’t get used”
>> and a lot of other prudent sounding advice, HOWEVER… None
>> of it seems practical or even remotely in line with
>> ANYBODY’s habits that I’m aware of.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I fly a few times a week.  My
>> batteries are charged, virtually ALL the time.  Right now I
>> have 9 10s5000 flight packs fully charged sitting on the
>> garage floor in hopes that I’ll get out of work in time to
>> put up a few flights tonight.  If I do…
>> I’ll come home and charge them so they’re ready on the
>> chance I get to fly tomorrow.    
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 50% of the time,.. the charged
>> packs are sitting in my van all day…so that I can go
>> straight to the field from the office.   During contests,
>> the packs also sit in the van over night, charged and ready
>> to go the next day.  
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Yes, I discharge in the fall when
>> the weather starts to turn.  Yes, I never charge unattended
>> (or at least modestly attended).  But I have a litany of
>> small batteries, Rx packs and foamy packs that are in
>> disarray in various flight boxes and various
>> states of charge.  Bad habit?  Probably.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> My point is that keeping these
>> out of the house, or in a state of discharge isn’t
>> logistically realistic for the active flyer.  Maybe
>> that’s a stupid statement.   But I’d really like to
>> discuss practical approaches to staying safer.    And old
>> packs??  Probably the most dangerous?  I have MANY.  I
>> destroy  the truly old, but there’s a grey area where
>> they’re not too old to discard, but they’re in the
>> “I’ll only use them if I have to” stage of life.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I sort of like the idea of a
>> Cinder block “cage” I could erect on the concrete floor
>> of my basement.  It wouldn’t help the smoke, but might
>> contain the actual fire should a pack decide to ignite just
>> sitting around.     I’ve seen these packs “scoot”
>> across a paved surface when they go off, so isolation is
>> only good if they’re physically contained.  
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Treating them like gasoline or
>> black powder isn’t really analogous since neither is
>> particularly volatile if left alone.   A Jim stated… it
>> would be good to understand better what caused Roberts pack
>> to decide to become a road flare.    
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> My somewhat nervous $0.02
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -Mark 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> MARK ATWOOD
>> 
>> 
>> o.  (440)
>> 229-2502 
>> c.  (216)
>> 316-2489 
>> e.  atwoodm at paragon-inc.com
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Paragon Consulting,
>> Inc. 
>> 5900
>> Landerbrook Drive, Suite
>> 205, Cleveland Ohio, 44124 
>> www.paragon-inc.com
>> 
>> 
>> Powering The Digital
>> Experience
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Jun 13, 2016, at 1:47 PM, Jas
>> via NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Having seen the intense flames these batteries can produce,
>> I'm not sure how the ammo boxes I've seen guys
>> around here can withstand it if all the batteries went up
>> one after another.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> One thing I've always thought about is flower pots.
>> They're fire treated so I can only assume that the flame
>> wouldn't bother the pot any. Maybe?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Jas iP
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Jun 13, 2016, at 1:29 PM, David Harmon via
>> NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Man….that’s a close call
>> Robert. 
>> 
>> Glad to hear that your wife
>> handled this situation so well. 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I use a 50 cal metal ammo box
>> too….I used a 5/8” Greenlee chassis punch to make a hole
>> on the back panel for a pressure relief. 
>> 
>> 
>> Hopefully the hole is large
>> enough to relieve the pressure but still contain most of the
>> flame. 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Also….if I have any fully
>> charged batteries after flying I discharge them to 50%
>> (storage charge)…especially if I know they will not be
>> used for awhile. 
>> 
>> I use a 17 ohm 100W Dale power
>> resistor, a short lead with the correct connector on it to
>> discharge a 10S battery (connected to the main discharge
>> battery lead) 
>> 
>> This gives a 2.5A constant
>> discharge rate which makes 100W of heat. 
>> 
>> The resistor can handle that
>> much heat but I put a small fan on it anyway. 
>> 
>> I discharge them down to about
>> 40% then put on the charger to bring back up to the storage
>> charge. 
>> 
>> This also balances the cells
>> and makes the situation a bit more safe…..at least if one
>> of them blows the energy is about half. 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> David Harmon 
>> 
>> Sperry, OK 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: NSRCA-discussion
>> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On
>> Behalf Of Robert
>> Green via NSRCA-discussion
>> 
>> Sent: Monday,
>> June 13, 2016 10:15 AM
>> 
>> To: 'General
>> pattern discussion' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> 
>> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion]
>> Lipo fire 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Hey guys wanted to let you know
>> about an incident I had over the weekend that caused some
>> high concern.  I flew four flights yesterday, then returned
>> home.  I thought I would
>> go back out later and fly three more, so I charged three
>> more batteries.  The three batteries on was planning on
>> using, were flown the previous day, and were not overly
>> discharged.  I took my kids to the movies as my wife did
>> not want to go, and that turned
>> out to be the best thing for the family.  One of my 2014
>> packs decided that it no longer wanted to live and decided
>> to catch fire all by itself.  I have always thought that
>> the best time for these to catch fire, would be during the
>> charge cycle.  This incident
>> happened almost an hour after charging the pack.  Keep in
>> mind that after I charged the pack, there were immediately
>> put into my flight box for storage until I got back from the
>> movies.  After I took them off the charger, the batteries
>> did not see warm in
>> any way, cool to the touch.  I have had these batteries
>> for two and as far as I can remember - they where not
>> damaged in any way.  Due to my wifes' heroic action,
>> the house did not catch on fire like my toolbox did.  She
>> brought them out to the drive way water
>> on them to kill the flames.  I have been pretty cavalier
>> with packs, leaving them out once they are charged and not
>> putting them in something safe for storage....those days are
>> done.  If this can happen to a battery sitting with a
>> stored charge, I will not
>> longer leave my house or family unprotected.  
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I bought a safe yesterday, but
>> apparently that may not be the best thing for them either as
>> the battery give off a gas and they need to breathe.  In
>> other words if you left
>> them in a safe you may be creating a bomb scenario.  What
>> I did was - several years ago, I bought a metal ammo case. 
>> I removed 3/4 of the rubber around the case allowing for the
>> exchange of air to occur. 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> If any one has any other creative
>> ideas on how they store there lipos, please contribute to
>> this thread as I think it is important as a community that
>> we spread the message
>> that this technology which has been proven to be safe for
>> the most part also can be dangerous. 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> thanks, 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Robert 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
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