[NSRCA-discussion] Arming plug and Failsafe +

[Peter Vogel]

There are several ESCs on the market today with spark suppression
circuitry.  From what I can see is that they've implemented an automatic
shunt.  There's a slow trickle charge path until the caps are fully charged
at which point a latch flips and full current flow is enabled.

Peter+

On Mon, May 18, 2015 at 10:46 AM, Ronald Van Putte via NSRCA-discussion <
nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:

> The O.S. 1100 ESC must use a special system, because there is no spark
> when the arming plug is installed.
>
> Anybody know what the system is?
>
> Ron
>
> On May 18, 2015, at 12:42 PM, Ed Alt via NSRCA-discussion <
> nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
>
> True, but it does get spread around to multiple battery connectors, not
> confined to the same pair of plugs.  But I agree, it's a good idea to use
> the bleed resistor.
>
>
>
> On May 18, 2015, at 1:36 PM, Peter Vogel <vogel.peter at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Arcing damage is gonna happen to connectors regardless of arming plug or
> not.  With an arming plug you can prevent arcing damage by using a small
> push switch that enables current to flow through a 1W resistor to slowly
> charge the ESC caps before plugging in the deans jumper.  Without an arming
> plug, unless your ESC has a spark suppression circuit, you are going to
> degrade the male deans connector on your ESC, which is much harder to
> change than the Deans shorting plug.
>
> Peter+
>
> On Mon, May 18, 2015 at 10:09 AM, Ed Alt via NSRCA-discussion <
> nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
>
>> Yep.  Trying to fix Human nature is not an easy thing.  Education to the
>> dangers may do more than yet another rule that can be overlooked. Peer
>> pressure helps as well.
>>
>> The first thing I do is remove the canopy and take all the connections
>> apart.  One time the canopy latch broke.  I wished I had an arming plug
>> that day, but I immediately ripped the canopy off to get it disconnected.
>>
>> In general though, I don't like another connector in the mix.  I've had a
>> HD Deans plug go intermittent due to some arcing damage.  It had only about
>> 10 flights, and luckily when the motor cropped out it was still in the
>> takeoff roll.  I want fewer connectors, not more.
>>
>>
>>
>> On May 18, 2015, at 12:58 PM, Keith Hoard via NSRCA-discussion <
>> nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
>>
>>  So what happens when you don't have the Arming Plug Police on scene?
>>
>> I submit that the same guy that leaves his batteries connected in his
>> plane in the pits won't remove the arming plug either.
>>
>>
>> -Keith Hoard
>> -Sent from my Windows Phone
>>  ------------------------------
>> From: Peter Vogel via NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> Sent: ‎5/‎18/‎2015 11:48
>> To: Vicente Bortone <vincebrc at gmail.com>; General pattern discussion
>> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Arming plug and Failsafe +
>>
>>  I'm a bit of a history buff.  All this discussion is reminiscent of the
>> heated discussions that occurred in the newspapers of the day when, first
>> Britain, and later the United States, imposed rules on how one drives a car
>> on the motorways of the day.  People complained bitterly at being "confined
>> to the side" of roads (left or right) and being "constrained to a speed
>> little more than walking speed" (which, was, in fact, the constraint in the
>> early 1800's when cars were steam powered).  When signage, and, later,
>> traffic lights appeared in the early 20th century, the uproar was quite
>> similar.  Everyone had an argument why "their" driving process was
>> absolutely accident proof and if everyone just followed their brilliant
>> safety system there would be no need for such ridiculous and outrageous
>> "regulation" and "government intrusion" into their preferred activities.
>>
>>  The proposed rule makes no requirement for an arming plug, but it does
>> require:
>>
>>   "the electric power circuit(s) must not be physically connected,
>> before the starting time is begun or the aircraft is preparing to be taken
>> out to the runway for the flight and must be physically disconnected
>> immediately after removal of the aircraft from the landing area."
>>
>>  Personally, given the hassle of canopy removal and replacement,
>> particularly just prior to flight, I will use an arming plug as I have
>> since I got into this sport.  Even my first electric helicopter (which is
>> how I got back into RC after a 15 year hiatus) had an arming plug, even
>> with the added safety of a throttle hold switch on the TX.  It was cheap
>> and easy insurance to be certain I never had a situation where I'd
>> unexpectedly encounter a 290mph blade tip speed...
>>
>> I've been at a *lot* of contests where people from the anti-arming plug
>> camp have lost their canopies in flight.  Hmm.  Maybe the task loading of
>> preparing the fly a round, telling your caller where you want the plane
>> positioned on the runway, AND removing your canopy to plug your batteries
>> in and then replacing the canopy is too much?  Or maybe relying on a caller
>> to know exactly how your canopy needs to be secured is expecting too much
>> of them?  I trust anyone on the flight line to take my plane out and plug
>> in the deans arming plug securely and remove it before they roll my plane
>> into the pits...
>>
>> Peter+
>>
>> On Mon, May 18, 2015 at 8:13 AM, Vicente Bortone via NSRCA-discussion <
>> nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
>>
>>  Jason,
>>
>> The most important part of your experience is that you were able to see
>> that the arming plug was still in place. At least you have chance to ask if
>> plane was armed and question the pilot. I got a real experience that I
>> would like to share. We were only three pilots at the field. One of them
>> put his plane in the pits. The other pilot and me were next to him. Few
>> minutes later the owner went to get something and walk away from the plane.
>> After he left, his plane took off in flying over the pits and flew away
>> crashing in the middle of the runway. We were lucky that nobody was hit and
>> were were only three pilots. I was a real wake up experience since we never
>> were aware that the plane was armed.  We never found what was the real
>> cause of the problem since the plane was destroyed. For sure the owner left
>> the plane armed and didn't have the arming plug. The radio was off as far
>> as I know but never really have a chance to confirm this.  After the scare,
>> I had a chance to talk and recomend to add an arming plug.  The plane
>> owner went ahead and added arming plugs to all his planes and he was glad
>> to know that there is a way to potentially avoid this type of incident
>> again.  It is clear that the arming plug won't fix anything if pilots
>> leaves the arming plug in place but give the oportunity to fellow pilots to
>> warm him of a potential problem.  I just read John Ford's e-mail.  He makes
>> the point more clearly than me but I think this is one real life
>> example that confirms what he just said.
>>
>>  Thanks,
>>
>>  Vicente "Vince" Bortone
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>  On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 7:36 PM wayg2013 via NSRCA-discussion <
>> nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
>>
>>  Hmmm arming plug.... My 1911 'll plug about anything... Now thats what
>> I call being armed...hee hee
>>
>>
>>  Sent via the Samsung GALAXY S® 5, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone
>>
>>
>> -------- Original message --------
>> From: Larry Diamond via NSRCA-discussion <
>> nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> Date:05/17/2015 5:31 PM (GMT-06:00)
>> To: Jas <justanotherflyr at gmail.com>, General pattern discussion <
>> nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Arming plug and Failsafe +
>>
>> Looks like the arming plug debate has surpassed the snap debate.... Gotta
>> love progress.
>>
>>
>>
>>  Sent via the Samsung GALAXY S®4, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone
>>
>>
>> -------- Original message --------
>> From: Jas via NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> Date: 05/17/2015 3:19 PM (GMT-06:00)
>> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Arming plug and Failsafe +
>>
>> Random thoughts about all this.
>>
>> I've watched a pilot forget to turn off his plane (and subsequently not
>> having pulled his arming plug) and idle up while near the pits (he happened
>> to have a hold of it still). It surprised him when it did it. It was during
>> practice here and we normally taxi up the taxi way to the no taxi line, so
>> its not a 'normal' contest type situation. Point: arming plug did nothing
>> in this case.
>>
>> I personally feel that fail safe and an external on-off Rx switch is
>> 'safer' (when fail safe is set correctly) and should be mandatory. If the
>> fail safe is set correct then even if the Tx is turned off the motor won't
>> turn on. If there is an external Rx switch and it gets turned off then (in
>> theory and so far in all my years flying E) the motor doesn't run after
>> it's off. I've always asked Dave (or whoever gets my plane) to turn off the
>> Rx BEFORE picking my plane up from the runway. Haven't had one start back
>> up when done this way. But once back to me, I pull the canopy and disarm it
>> before it goes anywhere else.
>>
>> For the way that I do things, I don't see an advantage of a safety plug
>> on my personal planes. I've been flying electric pattern since '03, so my
>> habits (Rx power off once landed) are just normal for me. I can certainly
>> see where some would benefit from an external plug (screws holding on
>> canopy, battery connection not easy to get to and newcomers to electric),
>> but I think there is just a different issue...
>>
>> Maybe as pilots we just need to be more self-aware and responsible?
>>
>> Sent from my iP
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>>
>>
>>  --
>>  Director, Fixed Wing Flight Training
>> Santa Clara County Model Aircraft Skypark
>> Associate Vice President, Academy of Model Aeronautics District X
>>
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>
>
>
> --
> Director, Fixed Wing Flight Training
> Santa Clara County Model Aircraft Skypark
> Associate Vice President, Academy of Model Aeronautics District X
>
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-- 
Director, Fixed Wing Flight Training
Santa Clara County Model Aircraft Skypark
Associate Vice President, Academy of Model Aeronautics District X
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