[NSRCA-discussion] FAA Registration begins December 21

John Ford jsf106 at gmail.com
Tue Dec 15 11:31:09 AKST 2015 

Dave, 
Probably will become commonplace for clubs to do that sort of thing, I imagine, even though it clearly oversteps their bounds. 
If I was a club president, I wouldn't want to touch this with a ten foot pole. Imagine that a club president starts playing "FAA registry police" for the membership, and a plane registered to a club member cause injury to someone offsite, or a club member hits a Cessna at 1000ft over the club field. What happens then?
Someone could argue that even though the statutory liability lies with the individual, the established practice of "registry control" by the club implies acceptance of a similar liability by the club. By doing this, the club is demonstrating that they are willing to accept responsibility for the compliant behavior of the individual AND of the aircraft. 

Why even go there if you don't have to?

John





On Dec 15, 2015, at 11:42 AM, David Harmon <k6xyz at sbcglobal.net> wrote:

> I agree John……but in the case of the club I belong to…..the BOD will make it theirs and the club business to ensure that all members are registered with the FAA and verified by the club.
>  
> David Harmon
> Sperry, OK
>  
> From: NSRCA-discussion [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of John Ford via NSRCA-discussion
> Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2015 6:37 AM
> To: Comcast <mark.grabowski at comcast.net>; General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAA Registration begins December 21
>  
> On my plane, the number will be accessible without tools, per the rule, but unless asked by an FAA official, I'm not offering to show where it is to anyone. 
> I need to have my registration with me, and I will, but no one gets to see it. As the rule says, this is between me and the FAA. 
>  
> Not up to the clubs or the AMA to police individuals on behalf of the FAA, so identity theft should not be a problem. 
>  
> John
>  
>  
> On Dec 15, 2015, at 7:12 AM, Comcast via NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Been thinking the very same thing. Someone steals a user number, does something stupid and then there's a knock at my door. Without a great alibi what are you gonna do???
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Dec 15, 2015, at 5:23 AM, Ed Alt via NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
> 
> Speaking of use cases, perhaps I missed it in the flurry of emails yesterday, but has anyone thought about the identity theft risk that the FAA is creating?  By registering the pilot and not having unique identification numbers for each model that are assigned to an owner, it sets up the scenario for anyone else to use your number on their model and cause virtually unlimited problems for you, anywhere, anytime.  To help reduce this risk, at the very least, the numbers would have to be provided by the FAA with some sort of marking, holography, whatever to at least raise the difficulty of identity theft from zero to something above zero.  You can apparently use a felt marker to scribble your own numbers as it stands now. 
>  
> Better yet, from an identity theft perspective at least, there should be unique numbers for each model provided to the owner.  This, of course would drive costs way up and incur delays.  
>  
> We should put the central planners in charge of every aspect of our lives now, should we not?  They've really shown their true colors on this one.  Incompetent boobs, every last one of them.
> 
> Date: Mon, 14 Dec 2015 15:53:22 -0800
> To: acornacchione at hotmail.com; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAA Registration begins December 21
> From: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> Honestly, I think thats one of the use-cases the FAA didn't think through real well...
>  
> My belief is that this whole thing is about creating a sense of accountability for the "rogue" users (I'm not willing to give them the term pilot because they don't deserve it) who do stupid shit like flying around a wildfire and preventing Calfire airborne response for 20+ minutes, etc.  It's about dealing with the anti-AMA guys who fly 120+mph EDFs weighing 6+ lbs over an active soccer game at a local park, it's about dealing with the dipshits who fly their drone on the takeoff/approach path of an active full scale airport in hopes of "cool footage".  The AMA field flyers are the least of the FAA's worries and we're blowing it out of proportion.  Yes, it's a stupid regulation, but let's comply where we can and show ourselves to be the responsible modelers the AMA says we are.
>  
> For the foreign guys, first of all, sorry for the needless red tape (though I think a similar thing is coming for the BMFA guys in the UK and it would not surprise me to see a more sensible version of this from the Canadian guys).  But if I were CD'ing a contest and some guys came down from the Great White North, I'd happily hook them up with some temporary form of my own registration # to put in their planes for the purposes of flying at the contest because I know them to be responsible pilots.
>  
> Peter+
>  
>  
> On Mon, Dec 14, 2015 at 3:46 PM, Anthony Cornacchione via NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
> Legit question with an unknown answer:  how will this impact international (IMAC Worlds in Muncie 2018) NATS with international competitors (NATS News this year had a nice write up) and our local contests which have had the occasional Canadian wander south?
> 
> On Dec 14, 2015, at 6:33 PM, Dana Beaton via NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
> 
> Boaters register their pleasure craft, fishermen & hunters buy licenses, some folks even register their firearms! So what? Are we going to give up our hobby just because of a tiny pice of red tape? Nope! Just keep flying. The bad actors who misuse their aircraft will run afoul local authorities sure enough, that's their problem, not ours.  We need to continue to set the good example though our good flying.  Good flying will carry the day.
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On Dec 14, 2015, at 6:25 PM, Dave Burton via NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
> 
> So, just shut up and drink the Kool-Aid?
> 
>  
> 
> From: NSRCA-discussion [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Derek Koopowitz via NSRCA-discussion
> Sent: Monday, December 14, 2015 6:15 PM
> To: Atwood, Mark; General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAA Registration begins December 21
> 
>  
> 
> Yep.... yep... yep.
> 
>  
> 
> On Mon, Dec 14, 2015 at 2:32 PM, Atwood, Mark via NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
> 
> Hasn’t that private information ship already sailed?  We all register cars and think nothing of it.  Heck, we even took classes, got educated, and were tested for a license before we could own or operate a car and we have to renew that every four years and prove we’re still physically capable (minimal proof admittedly).  Personally not sure a gun should be much different but don’t want to start that discussion (especially since I’m generally pro gun…just not pro redneck hill jack survivalist conspiracy theorist) but not registering to fly airplanes?  Really?    We trade more info internationally downloading a Facebook app.    Also, we’re already registered… just with the AMA, not the USA.  And yes, the AMA is trying to make that our ONLY registration, but that’s just a proposal at this point.  
> 
>  
> 
> Guys… we already do ALL of this.  Our AMA # is on the plane, we follow safety rules, blah blah blah.  This is a very minor inconvenience and if the AMA proposal to use our AMA# for our registration number it won’t even be that.  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> On Dec 14, 2015, at 5:15 PM, Dave Burton via NSRCA-discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> wrote:
> 
>  
> 
> Now is the time for massive civil disobedience!
> 
> I don't think I'd register my planes any more than I'd register my guns.
> 
> Too bad AMA has no clout like the NRA.
> 
> Dave
> 
>  
> 
> From: NSRCA-discussion [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Robert L. Beaubien via NSRCA-discussion
> Sent: Monday, December 14, 2015 1:23 PM
> To: Scott McHarg; General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAA Registration begins December 21
> 
>  
> 
> Morons at work….
> 
>  
> 
> -           Robert Beaubien
> 
> -           DronePlastics.com
> 
>  
> 
> “Dear Algebra, Please stop asking us to find your X.  She's never coming back and don't ask Y.”
> 
>  
> 
> From: NSRCA-discussion [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Scott McHarg via NSRCA-discussion
> Sent: Monday, December 14, 2015 11:05 AM
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FAA Registration begins December 21
> 
>  
> 
> Well, here it is boys and girls.  It's official and starts next Monday.  The link is for the FAQ's of what's happening. 
> 
>  
> 
>  You only have to register once and you don't have to individually register all of your models.
> 
> You must be able to provide proof of registration and have it on you when flying.
> 
> You must have your Registration # (not going to be a N number) in your airplane where it is legible and accessible without the use of tools (aka under your canopy).  
> 
> If you sell a model, you should update your records. (I don't completely understand this if we aren't registering all of our models individually but, OK)
> 
> Registration is $5 but you'll get that back if you register in the first 30 days, I believe.
> 
>  
> 
> Have a look at the link and prepare to be upset.....
> 
>  
> 
> http://www.faa.gov/uas/registration/faqs/
> 
>  
> 
> Scott A. McHarg
> 
> VSCL / CANVASS U.A.S. Research Pilot
> 
> Texas A&M University
> 
> PPL - ASEL
> 
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