[NSRCA-discussion] Hacker C50-14XL comp/Castle 80HV Ice 2 combo "backfiring"

Fri Aug 24 04:21:53 AKDT 2012

I redid my soldering connections and did a test run in the driveway.  We will find out tonight in St. Clairesville if the problem is solved in the air....

Mike C

From: verne at twmi.rr.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2012 11:12:16 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker C50-14XL comp/Castle 80HV Ice 2 combo "backfiring"

It’s better to hold the tip of the iron at the top rim of the cup opposite the hole. As it heats up, it’ll start pulling solder through the hole and that’s where I add solder until it won’t take any more.

Verne

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Michael Cohen
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 8:53 AM
To: NSRCA
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker C50-14XL comp/Castle 80HV Ice 2 combo "backfiring"

Well, I have turned off the logger, but tomorrow night, when I get back from San Diego, the ESC will get some new bullet connectors, just to be sure.  With a contest coming up in St. Clairsville, I wouldn't what to have to break out "old reliable"..... the YS powered Integral!

I do use a technique like Verne stated in another post.  About the only thing I have had trouble with is, on the 4mm bullets, once the pre-tinned wire gets pushed down in the connector with melted solder, there isn't any room left for adding more.  I do hold the iron right at the small hole in the bullet, just to be sure all solder draws there while it is still hot.  We will see what happens Thursday when I do a run up.

Regards,

Mike C 

From: DaveL322 at comcast.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2012 07:28:30 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker C50-14XL comp/Castle 80HV Ice 2 combo "backfiring"

When the data logging buffer on a CC ICE ESC is full, it is not uncommon to have a small “knocking” sound with outrunners and large direct drive inrunners (ie, Pletty Advance).  This is well documented on some of the forums.  The sound is generally described as a light tapping, knocking, rattle, etc…..and generally does not occur across the full throttle range.   I’ve never heard it described as loud or violent.  The solution is to turn off the data logging when it is not specifically needed.

I have never encountered the knocking on a geared inrunner; full buffer or not.

Regards,

Dave Lockhart
Team Castle Creations

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dave Harmon
Sent: Monday, August 20, 2012 11:53 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker C50-14XL comp/Castle 80HV Ice 2 combo "backfiring"

I was out flying this afternoon till dark and Ken Kaut showed up.
I asked him about my knocking sound and he said right away that the logging is the cause of the knock.
It sounds exactly like thumping the fuse with your finger.
Ken said that when the buffer is full…..it doan make no mo noise……or just shut off the logging.
At least it ain’t ready to catch fire or come aloose or anythin….

And for that I’m grateful…I don’t need any more problems.

Dave Harmon
NSRCA 586
K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
Sperry, Ok.

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Abdullah
Sent: Monday, August 20, 2012 6:47 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker C50-14XL comp/Castle 80HV Ice 2 combo "backfiring"

I had the exact same sound with mine, horrible sound like throwing a gear at full throttle. I was actually surprised when there wasn't any damage. Mark loaned me an ESC and I went home to start testing. Plugged his in and it worked perfectly. Mine had gotten to the point of doing it almost every time I throttled up. I went to take his ESC out and the bullet from the motor came right off with it. Hmmmm this migh have had something to do with it! I resoldered all of the bullets and have not had the problem since.

I suck at soldering so I wasn't terribly surprised. I did notice before it got worse that the motor would hesitate a little bit, make a little gringing noise, or turn backward about a 32nd of a turn when I first hit the idle switch on my transmitter to start the prop spinning. A couple years ago at the Columbus, OH pattern contest my Neu motor wouldn't start at all without making a horrible grinding noise. Sent it back to me and they changed some things but the problem remained. I finally changed out the ESC and needed to change the motor bullets to the right type and mysteriously the problem went away. Scott Pavlock is still running that motor and ESC with zero issues!

From: Michael Cohen <precisionaero at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Mon, August 20, 2012 4:36:47 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker C50-14XL comp/Castle 80HV Ice 2 combo "backfiring"

Well, I needed an excuse to swap out the current connectors on the ESC for some deeper ones....  I just need to wait until I am back in town.

Mike C

CC: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
From: vogel.peter at gmail.com
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2012 20:15:32 -0700
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker C50-14XL comp/Castle 80HV Ice 2 combo "backfiring"

One of the common causes of that is a bad solder joint between the ESC and the motor where some arcing is happening in the joint, frequently not seen on the ground unless it's gotten really bad because you don't have the G variations on the mechanical connection of the bad joint. 

Peter+

Sent from my iPhone4S

On Aug 19, 2012, at 7:52 PM, "Verne Koester" <verne at twmi.rr.com> wrote:

I was there when it happened and it definitely wasn’t a normal sound. I thought something had broken inside the fuse. Mike landed immediately and we checked everything and all seemed okay including a run-up on the ground so he went up again and the sound happened again but later in the flight (the first time it happened immediately after he broke ground). I’m very familiar with the plane since it used to be mine. I had the same motor but a different controller. Another pilot there said it sounded like an “electric backfire”. I’ve never heard one before, but it sounded pretty scary.

Verne Koester

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dave Harmon
Sent: Sunday, August 19, 2012 5:54 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker C50-14XL comp/Castle 80HV Ice 2 combo "backfiring"

Hi Mike….
I have noticed a sound like a ‘knock’ on the side of the fuselage on 3 different airplanes, Plett 30-10 and Advance and three ESC…a CC 80HV ICE and 2 CC 80HV ICE V2.
I’ve looked at logs and don’t recognize any problems.
I have always wondered what the sound was…at first I thought it might have caused by the cables to the rudder and elevator slapping the side if the fuse but they are fastened down tightly.
Then…I thought it might be caused by the wheels rattling….
It seems to happen most of the time on an up line.
It doesn’t seem to be a problem…yet…but I would like to know what is causing it.

Dave Harmon
NSRCA 586
K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
Sperry, Ok.

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Michael Cohen
Sent: Sunday, August 19, 2012 3:48 PM
To: NSRCA
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker C50-14XL comp/Castle 80HV Ice 2 combo "backfiring"

I had a strange problem today with a Hacker C50-14XL comp/Castle 80HV Ice 2 combo.  Sounded like the motor/ESC was backfiring, so I stopped flying.  I had 56 flights before today, and this is the first time I noticed the backfiring.  I was at a contest last weekend, so if it had occurred there, I think people, including me, would have noticed.
Well, upon taking it home and hooking it up to the computer, I did find that all my settings were still where they were supposed to be, so there was no unexplained change there.  I downloaded the data logger, but I really didn’t check it too closely.  I then went online to look for backfiring problems and the only thing I found was a sample rate of 10hz (mine was at 1hz) could cause a backfire.  I also noted a comment that if you run out of data logging space, that could cause a “ticking”.  I did not have a ticking, but I decided to clear all stored logging information and set the sampling rate to "disabled".  I ran the motor/ESC for about a minute on the ground with no evidence of a backfire.  Could the data logging/storage space been it?  Has anyone else had a similar experience?  FYI, here is my program:

Brake Strength: 30% 
Brake Delay: No delay 
Brake Ramp: Medium 
Cutoff Voltage: 3.2
Current Limiting: Normal 
Cutoff Type: Soft Cutoff 
Motor Start Power: low (39)
Motor Timing: Custom (3) 
PWM Rate: 8khz 

Regards,
Mike Cohen

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