From KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com  Tue Sep  1 02:12:54 2009
From: KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com (Ken Thompson)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 10:12:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating
References: <459021957.1246341251768662558.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net><4A9C7BB7.6050404@optonline.net><F5FE12DFBC254C5DBE586DFA7DE8C552@EarlPC>
	<4A9C8C23.504@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <005501ca2aed$9a47e860$0200a8c0@kencopepere>

Stuart,

The regular motor is about 1/2" shorter than the comp.

Ken
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Stuart Chale 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 9:51 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating


  The pencil line is straight, and it is a kevlar wound magnet.  I will call Hacker tomorrow and I am sure they will say send it in.  The input wire could be an issue.  I always noticed that if the wires were bent wrong it would cause friction to keep the motor from easily spinning.
  I guess I will just have to fly the Pinnacle for a while, or switch that motor to my Beryll.  Does the reg Hacker swap for the comp model or are spacings different?

  Earl Haury wrote: 
    Stuart

    As this is a change from the norm, it's apparent that something has changed with the motor. Higher temp is usually associated with higher load (more watts) which doesn't appear to be the case. A clue might be in the missing fan disc, I doubt that the change in fan efficiency is at fault due to the rapid temp rise. But, you might check the windings for damage from debris, as clearances are close between the rotor and the windings. You mention that the rotor doesn't have separated magnets. I assume that this rotor has the Kevlar thread outer winding. There's usually a pencil line drawn on the covering for the length of the rotor - ensure that the line is straight. If some magnet discs "slip" they may not develop a gap, but the pencil line will be discontinuous. (Although usually slipped disc symptoms are higher amps as well as temp.)

    Another possibility is a partially broken motor input wire, the high resistance in one "phase" will imbalance the load on the windings and quickly generate more heat. (I've found it worthwhile to tie the motor wires together to minimize flexing.)

    Good luck

    Ear
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: Stuart Chale 
      To: General pattern discussion 
      Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 8:41 PM
      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating


      It has been in the same plane for 2 years.  Never noticed it getting this hot before.  I know the last time I checked (in hotter weather) it was not this hot.
      Stuart

      Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote: 
        Stuart,



        How long you have been running the motor?  Did you measure the temperature?  It will be good idea to duct air to the back of the motor.  If you don't have any ducting I suggest that you install some.  Air from the duct should blow as close as possible to the motor.  Probably you already did all this but I am not sure.  Also need to make sure that has enough exhaust opening to allow the hot air to exhaust the fuselage.  I am sure that you will get more suggestions.



        Good luck,

        Vicente "Vince" Bortone

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Stuart Chale" <schale at optonline.net>
        To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
        Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 7:13:08 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
        Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating

        I have a hacker 14XL Comp model that started overheating this weekend. 
        I was hoping it just needed some grease.  Pulled it apart tonight and 
        grease was still present (black as usual.  Regreasing time was near.)  
        Cleaned it up and pulled the front housing off.  First thing I noticed 
        was that the bottom portion of the fan (the phenolic disk) was missing.  
        Some dust in the motor so I think it just got chewed up spit out or part 
        of it ground to dust.  Pulled the rotor and the magnet looks fine.  I 
        had a standard model where the magnet split part way down and was 
        pulling higher amps.  Bearings fit the shaft freely, no play but slid on 
        easily and seemed smooth.  Put it back together regreased.  Ran it up 
        with a 21 x 13W APC pulled 67 amps 2300 watts at WOT but after a minute 
        or so of 3 15 to 20 second full throttle bursts the motor was hot 
        again.  Too hot to hold your hand around it.

        Any ideas?
        Thanks,
        Stuart

        _______________________________________________
        NSRCA-discussion mailing list
        NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
        http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


------------------------------------------------------------------------
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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  

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From getterflash at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  1 03:06:53 2009
From: getterflash at yahoo.com (Bob Kane)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 11:06:53 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 AMA Nats pictures?
In-Reply-To: <C0713E133D594584AB219D51C5932A85@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
References: <814i7o$44drqh@dmzms99802.na.baesystems.com><280614.35045.qm@web80708.mail.mud.yahoo.com><6539.76174.qm@web32704.mail.mud.yahoo.com><542386.25618.qm@web80708.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<406054.37723.qm@web32703.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<C0713E133D594584AB219D51C5932A85@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
Message-ID: <339371.73738.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I just checked contact information Terry sent with the DVD, the email Pete sent out is the correct one.

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com




________________________________
From: Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 3:47:14 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 AMA Nats pictures?

 
I have this:
 
amad2terry at stny.rr.com
----- Original Message ----- 
>From: Bob 
>  Kane 
>To: General pattern discussion 
>Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 3:29 
>  PM
>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 AMA 
>  Nats pictures?
>
>
>The 
>  last email address I saw for Terry amad2terry at juno.com, but it goes back 
>  almost 4 years.
>
> Bob Kane
>getterflash at yahoo.com 
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________
 From: Mark Hunt <flyintexan at att.net>
>To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 3:01:58 
>  PM
>Subject: Re: 
>  [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 AMA Nats pictures?
>
>
>How do we get in touch with him.....Terry, can you hear me now?..
> 
>-mark
>
>
>
>
________________________________
 From: Bob Kane 
>  <getterflash at yahoo.com>
>To: General pattern discussion 
>  <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 12:36:58 
>  PM
>Subject: Re: 
>  [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 AMA Nats pictures?
>
>
>He 
>  has them for sale, I bought a DVD from him.  I think he was asking 
>  $20.
>
> Bob Kane
>getterflash at yahoo.com 
> 
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________
 From: Mark Hunt 
>  <flyintexan at att.net>
>To: General pattern discussion 
>  <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 1:23:51 
>  PM
>Subject: Re: 
>  [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 AMA Nats pictures?
>
>
>What ever happened to Terry Terrinoire's (sp?) Nats CD that he was going 
>  to distribute?  He took hundreds of pictures.....
> 
>-mark
>
>
>
>
________________________________
 From: "Woodward, Jim (US SSA)" 
>  <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
>To: General pattern discussion 
>  <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 10:11:06 
>  AM
>Subject: Re: 
>  [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 AMA Nats pictures?
>
> > 
>Hi 
>  Guys,
> 
>Is 
>  there a link to some photo collections from the 2009 US Nats?
>Thanks,
>Jim
>From:>  nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
>  [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Richard 
>  Strickland
>Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 11:08 AM
>To: >  NSRCA DISCUSSION
>Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FW: St Louis contest 
>  thanks
> 
>
>Kansas City 
>  Radio Control with RC Barmstormers completed their 54th in 
>  June...
>RS
> 
>
________________________________
 
>Date: Mon, 31 Aug 
>  2009 07:35:17 -0700
>From: jpavlick at idseng.com
>To: 
>  nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] St Louis 
>  contest thanks
>That's really cool but I'm pretty sure the 
>         AGS (AeroGuidance Society) in District 1 has the record for 
>        longest running Pattern contest in the country. I think it's been going 
>        for 53 or 54 years now. :)
> 
>John Pavlick
>
>--- On Mon, 8/31/09, Vicente 
>        "Vince" Bortone <vicenterc at comcast.net> >wrote:
>
>>From: Vicente 
>>          "Vince" Bortone <vicenterc at comcast.net>
>>Subject: Re: 
>>          [NSRCA-discussion] St Louis contest thanks
>>To: "General pattern 
>>          discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>Date: Monday, 
>>          August 31, 2009, 10:14 AM
>>I second 
>>          Mike.  I was glad to see an increase of pilots in the lower 
>>          classes.  I just want to add that Phantom Flyers RC Club has 
>>          been doing the pattern contest for 52 years.  I think 
>>          this could be a record.   
>>
>>Vicente "Vince" 
>>          Bortone
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "mike mueller" 
>>          <mups1953 at yahoo.com>
>>To: 
>>          nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 
>>          8:38:29 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
>>Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 
>>          St Louis contest thanks
>>
>> Thanks to Bill Ahrens, Ed White 
>>          and the Phantom Flyers RC club for having us this weekend.
>> We 
>>          had 24 flyers and I think it's safe to say it was a 
>>          blast.
>> The weather was cold for St Louis and most of us had 
>>          jackets and long pants on all day yesterday. Usually we are sweltering 
>>          in the heat at this contest. 
>> We had 12 flyers in Masters and 
>>          this posed a challenge but we got thru all the rounds albiet we had to 
>>          fly till darkness shut us down on Saturday.
>> I'm encouraged by 
>>          the decent attendances that we have seen at the contests this year. I 
>>          really expected the poor economy would have hit us hard but there 
>>          doesn't seem to be much of an effect. Mike Mueller 
>>          D5VP
>>
>>
>>     
>>           
>>_______________________________________________
>>NSRCA-discussion 
>>          mailing list
>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>-----Inline 
>>          Attachment Follows-----
>>_______________________________________________
>>NSRCA-discussion 
>>          mailing list
>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
> 
>
________________________________
 
>Hotmail? is up to 
>  70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. Try it now.
>
________________________________
 
>With Windows 
>  Live, you can organize, edit, and share your photos. Click 
>  here.
>start: 
>  0000-00-00 end: 0000-00-00 
>
________________________________
 > _______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion 
>  mailing 
>  list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From flyintexan at att.net  Tue Sep  1 03:17:21 2009
From: flyintexan at att.net (Mark Hunt)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 11:17:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 AMA Nats pictures?
References: <814i7o$44drqh@dmzms99802.na.baesystems.com><280614.35045.qm@web80708.mail.mud.yahoo.com><6539.76174.qm@web32704.mail.mud.yahoo.com><542386.25618.qm@web80708.mail.mud.yahoo.com><406054.37723.qm@web32703.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<C0713E133D594584AB219D51C5932A85@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
Message-ID: <3FF046765BC84634A43C975A2B00A2FA@MARK>

Thanks guys.  I got in touch with him.

-Mark
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Pete Cosky 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 14:47
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 AMA Nats pictures?


  I have this:

  amad2terry at stny.rr.com
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Bob Kane 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 3:29 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 AMA Nats pictures?


    The last email address I saw for Terry amad2terry at juno.com, but it goes back almost 4 years.


    Bob Kane
    getterflash at yahoo.com 





----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    From: Mark Hunt <flyintexan at att.net>
    To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
    Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 3:01:58 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 AMA Nats pictures?


    How do we get in touch with him.....Terry, can you hear me now?..

    -mark




----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    From: Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>
    To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
    Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 12:36:58 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 AMA Nats pictures?


    He has them for sale, I bought a DVD from him.  I think he was asking $20.


    Bob Kane
    getterflash at yahoo.com 





----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    From: Mark Hunt <flyintexan at att.net>
    To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
    Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 1:23:51 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 AMA Nats pictures?


    What ever happened to Terry Terrinoire's (sp?) Nats CD that he was going to distribute?  He took hundreds of pictures.....

    -mark




----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    From: "Woodward, Jim (US SSA)" <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
    To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
    Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 10:11:06 AM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 AMA Nats pictures?


    Hi Guys,



    Is there a link to some photo collections from the 2009 US Nats?

    Thanks,

    Jim

    From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Richard Strickland
    Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 11:08 AM
    To: NSRCA DISCUSSION
    Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FW: St Louis contest thanks




    Kansas City Radio Control with RC Barmstormers completed their 54th in June...
    RS
     


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2009 07:35:17 -0700
    From: jpavlick at idseng.com
    To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] St Louis contest thanks

          That's really cool but I'm pretty sure the  AGS (AeroGuidance Society) in District 1 has the record for longest running Pattern contest in the country. I think it's been going for 53 or 54 years now. :)



          John Pavlick

          --- On Mon, 8/31/09, Vicente "Vince" Bortone <vicenterc at comcast.net> wrote:


            From: Vicente "Vince" Bortone <vicenterc at comcast.net>
            Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] St Louis contest thanks
            To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
            Date: Monday, August 31, 2009, 10:14 AM

            I second Mike.  I was glad to see an increase of pilots in the lower classes.  I just want to add that Phantom Flyers RC Club has been doing the pattern contest for 52 years.  I think this could be a record.   

            Vicente "Vince" Bortone

            ----- Original Message -----
            From: "mike mueller" <mups1953 at yahoo.com>
            To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
            Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 8:38:29 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
            Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] St Louis contest thanks

             Thanks to Bill Ahrens, Ed White and the Phantom Flyers RC club for having us this weekend.
             We had 24 flyers and I think it's safe to say it was a blast.
             The weather was cold for St Louis and most of us had jackets and long pants on all day yesterday. Usually we are sweltering in the heat at this contest. 
             We had 12 flyers in Masters and this posed a challenge but we got thru all the rounds albiet we had to fly till darkness shut us down on Saturday.
             I'm encouraged by the decent attendances that we have seen at the contests this year. I really expected the poor economy would have hit us hard but there doesn't seem to be much of an effect. Mike Mueller D5VP


                  
            _______________________________________________
            NSRCA-discussion mailing list
            NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
            http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


            -----Inline Attachment Follows-----

            _______________________________________________
            NSRCA-discussion mailing list
            NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
            http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
         




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From rcmaster199 at aol.com  Tue Sep  1 06:48:24 2009
From: rcmaster199 at aol.com (rcmaster199 at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 14:48:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bolly muffler or pipe?
In-Reply-To: <3FF046765BC84634A43C975A2B00A2FA@MARK>
References: <3FF046765BC84634A43C975A2B00A2FA@MARK>
Message-ID: <8CBF92A5A51B3E7-924-AF3@webmail-d086.sysops.aol.com>

I am looking at a Bolly??MF565N.... Don't know if it's a muffler or pipe. Anyone shed any light on this beastie?


?


MattK

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From DaveL322 at comcast.net  Tue Sep  1 07:04:00 2009
From: DaveL322 at comcast.net (Dave)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 15:04:00 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bolly muffler or pipe?
In-Reply-To: <8CBF92A5A51B3E7-924-AF3@webmail-d086.sysops.aol.com>
References: <3FF046765BC84634A43C975A2B00A2FA@MARK>
	<8CBF92A5A51B3E7-924-AF3@webmail-d086.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <2FB476953E8540FCA164B66AE16CD2B9@davedesktop>

I think all MF designation was for muffler...565 should be the length in mm,
and N designates narrow.  I had one of the larger Bolly mufflers (605) and
it was the least tuned exhaust system I ever found - no boost or scavenging
noticeable at any RPM.

 

Regards,

 

Dave

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
rcmaster199 at aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 10:48 AM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bolly muffler or pipe?

 

I am looking at a Bolly  MF565N.... Don't know if it's a muffler or pipe.
Anyone shed any light on this beastie?

 

MattK

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From schale at optonline.net  Tue Sep  1 08:01:56 2009
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 16:01:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating
In-Reply-To: <BAY128-W1004198D2513A004F076E2A0F10@phx.gbl>
References: <459021957.1246341251768662558.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<4A9C7BB7.6050404@optonline.net>
	<F5FE12DFBC254C5DBE586DFA7DE8C552@EarlPC>
	<4A9C8C23.504@optonline.net>
	<BAY128-W1004198D2513A004F076E2A0F10@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <4A9D4563.5040103@optonline.net>

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From rcmaster199 at aol.com  Tue Sep  1 08:09:41 2009
From: rcmaster199 at aol.com (rcmaster199 at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 16:09:41 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bolly muffler or pipe?
In-Reply-To: <2FB476953E8540FCA164B66AE16CD2B9@davedesktop>
References: <2FB476953E8540FCA164B66AE16CD2B9@davedesktop>
Message-ID: <8CBF935B1AA474D-1240-45E6@webmail-m018.sysops.aol.com>

Thank you David. That's the info I needed


?


Matt










-----Original Message-----

From: Dave &lt;DaveL322 at comcast.net&gt;

To: 'General pattern discussion' &lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;

Sent: Tue, Sep 1, 2009 11:00 am

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Bolly muffler or pipe?












I think all MF designation was for muffler?..565 should be the length in mm, and N designates narrow. ?I had one of the larger Bolly mufflers (605) and it was the least tuned exhaust system I ever found ? no boost or scavenging noticeable at any RPM.


?


Regards,


?


Dave


?









From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com

Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 10:48 AM

To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bolly muffler or pipe?



?




I am looking at a Bolly??MF565N.... Don't know if it's a muffler or pipe. Anyone shed any light on this beastie?





?





MattK





_______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion  

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From pamrich47 at hotmail.com  Tue Sep  1 08:54:30 2009
From: pamrich47 at hotmail.com (Richard Strickland)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 16:54:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating
In-Reply-To: <4A9D4563.5040103@optonline.net>
References: <459021957.1246341251768662558.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<4A9C7BB7.6050404@optonline.net>
	<F5FE12DFBC254C5DBE586DFA7DE8C552@EarlPC>
	<4A9C8C23.504@optonline.net>
	<BAY128-W1004198D2513A004F076E2A0F10@phx.gbl> 
	<4A9D4563.5040103@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <BAY128-W85BA70069C26CA50643E6A0F10@phx.gbl>


I have two Comps that I bought used--sent them off to Hacker to be checked as one had a gear problem and the other ran 'hot'.  Got them back and one still ran hot.  I disassembled and the interior lining had a small wrinkle in it that impeded air flow--I sanded and re-sealed it--and need to test it.  Hacker suggested it had gotten very hot along the way to cause the wrinkle and probably lost some magnetism.  Even after three or four flights in relatively close succession, the other motor only got into the high 120s--this one got to almost 160.  I'll try it, but I think a new rotor is in it's future..,.BTW, they say if it got high enough to de-mag, then the bearings ought to be replaced also...

 

Now for the cause of over-heating:  The configuration of these motors is a little weird--you would think they would do a front to back air flow as you would normally have positive pressure toward the front of the motor--but the fan integrated into the gearbox pulls air through the motor from the back where you would hope there would be negative pressure.  So it would probably help to duct air to the rear.  But it doesn't seem to matter if the motor is OK as it stays reasonably cool with fairly 'normal' ducting.  So I suppose flying with weaker batteries, lots of partial throttle under load, immediate successive flights, too much prop, wide open all the time, etc. could contribute to longevity/heating/ demagging issues.  I didn't used to pay that much attention to motor temps as my original C50XL14s seemed to run fairly cool--but then I went out for some quick flights for practice--hot, humid and flights in close succession and killed 'em both within a week--I was out of business....

RS
 


Date: Tue, 1 Sep 2009 12:01:39 -0400
From: schale at optonline.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating

I called Hacker first person thought it was the phenolic disk from the fan being missing.  Next guy who was to take the order was less enthusiastic.  He thought it could have been a de magnetized issue.  Oh well off to Hacker it goes :)
I haven't flown the Pinnacle in over a year, guess it is time to get re-aquainted.
Thanks for the help.
Stuart

Richard Strickland wrote: 


There's a pretty good chance the rotor has de-magnetized, draws more amps to compensate and heats it up.  Rotor is about $180.00.  Make sure the interior paper isn't rubbing the rotor and there is some clearance--as there ain't much to start with...
RS
 


Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2009 22:51:15 -0400
From: schale at optonline.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating

The pencil line is straight, and it is a kevlar wound magnet.  I will call Hacker tomorrow and I am sure they will say send it in.  The input wire could be an issue.  I always noticed that if the wires were bent wrong it would cause friction to keep the motor from easily spinning.
I guess I will just have to fly the Pinnacle for a while, or switch that motor to my Beryll.  Does the reg Hacker swap for the comp model or are spacings different?

Earl Haury wrote: 

Stuart
 
As this is a change from the norm, it's apparent that something has changed with the motor. Higher temp is usually associated with higher load (more watts) which doesn't appear to be the case. A clue might be in the missing fan disc, I doubt that the change in fan efficiency is at fault due to the rapid temp rise. But, you might check the windings for damage from debris, as clearances are close between the rotor and the windings. You mention that the rotor doesn't have separated magnets. I assume that this rotor has the Kevlar thread outer winding. There's usually a pencil line drawn on the covering for the length of the rotor - ensure that the line is straight. If some magnet discs "slip" they may not develop a gap, but the pencil line will be discontinuous. (Although usually slipped disc symptoms are higher amps as well as temp.)
 
Another possibility is a partially broken motor input wire, the high resistance in one "phase" will imbalance the load on the windings and quickly generate more heat. (I've found it worthwhile to tie the motor wires together to minimize flexing.)
 
Good luck
 
Ear

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Stuart Chale 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 8:41 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating

It has been in the same plane for 2 years.  Never noticed it getting this hot before.  I know the last time I checked (in hotter weather) it was not this hot.
Stuart

Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote: 



Stuart,
 
How long you have been running the motor?  Did you measure the temperature?  It will be good idea to duct air to the back of the motor.  If you don't have any ducting I suggest that you install some.  Air from the duct should blow as close as possible to the motor.  Probably you already did all this but I am not sure.  Also need to make sure that has enough exhaust opening to allow the hot air to exhaust the fuselage.  I am sure that you will get more suggestions.
 
Good luck,

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Stuart Chale" <schale at optonline.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 7:13:08 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating

I have a hacker 14XL Comp model that started overheating this weekend. 
I was hoping it just needed some grease.  Pulled it apart tonight and 
grease was still present (black as usual.  Regreasing time was near.)  
Cleaned it up and pulled the front housing off.  First thing I noticed 
was that the bottom portion of the fan (the phenolic disk) was missing.  
Some dust in the motor so I think it just got chewed up spit out or part 
of it ground to dust.  Pulled the rotor and the magnet looks fine.  I 
had a standard model where the magnet split part way down and was 
pulling higher amps.  Bearings fit the shaft freely, no play but slid on 
easily and seemed smooth.  Put it back together regreased.  Ran it up 
with a 21 x 13W APC pulled 67 amps 2300 watts at WOT but after a minute 
or so of 3 15 to 20 second full throttle bursts the motor was hot 
again.  Too hot to hold your hand around it.

Any ideas?
Thanks,
Stuart

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From geobet4 at verizon.net  Tue Sep  1 09:29:05 2009
From: geobet4 at verizon.net (GEORGE KENNIE)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 17:29:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
References: <c3a.59191fff.37c2a3b9@aol.com><19FE2691F6B2485A9E1C7A7F7BE45A7B@telapoint.local>
	<A287DD65BA2D465397844F8B98154AB3@george15cf36d8>
	<DB99F5B1888C439F8CA292B5953626E1@glazecstp32xp>
Message-ID: <B16486E4772647E69FFE592DE1B86312@george15cf36d8>

Thanks Bill,

I would sure love to do that.

I sure would love to fill out a score sheet on that Christophe guy!  I can't believe that anybody can be THAT good !

I wonder what if Ramsey feels he's that much superior to all other humanoids or is there a Continental bias in effect?

Georgie



  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Bill Glaze 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:53 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


  Georgie:
  Sure did miss you at the Nats'.  I guess we'll have to wait for you to go to the Muncie Worlds' in 2011!<G>
  Bill
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: GEORGE KENNIE 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:16 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


    After observing the site and the conditions under which all these world class competitors participated, I can't help but
    conclude that when all these guys get to Muncie in 2011 that they're all gonna think that they died and went to heaven.





      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: Glen Watson 
      To: 'General pattern discussion' 
      Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:26 AM
      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


      Here ya go Buddy.. http://www.fpam.pt/WCF3A09/Classifications/scores.php

       

       

       


--------------------------------------------------------------------------

      From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of BUDDYonRC at aol.com
      Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 8:53 AM
      To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder

       

      Is there a site where we can get WC results?

      Buddy

       


--------------------------------------------------------------------------



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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Tue Sep  1 09:36:14 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 17:36:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
In-Reply-To: <B16486E4772647E69FFE592DE1B86312@george15cf36d8>
References: <c3a.59191fff.37c2a3b9@aol.com><19FE2691F6B2485A9E1C7A7F7BE45A7B@telapoint.local><A287DD65BA2D465397844F8B98154AB3@george15cf36d8><DB99F5B1888C439F8CA292B5953626E1@glazecstp32xp>
	<B16486E4772647E69FFE592DE1B86312@george15cf36d8>
Message-ID: <AB46FEEDE64D4956BA5898C07263D9BB@UncleJasPC>

Before this gets too far out of control guys, the Winner was the winner of the contest. I didn't watch everyone's flights, but I did watch most of CPLR's and I believe they got it right in the end. But again... I didn't watch everyone's flights.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: GEORGE KENNIE 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 1:28 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


  Thanks Bill,

  I would sure love to do that.

  I sure would love to fill out a score sheet on that Christophe guy!  I can't believe that anybody can be THAT good !

  I wonder what if Ramsey feels he's that much superior to all other humanoids or is there a Continental bias in effect?

  Georgie



    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Bill Glaze 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:53 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


    Georgie:
    Sure did miss you at the Nats'.  I guess we'll have to wait for you to go to the Muncie Worlds' in 2011!<G>
    Bill
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: GEORGE KENNIE 
      To: General pattern discussion 
      Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:16 PM
      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


      After observing the site and the conditions under which all these world class competitors participated, I can't help but
      conclude that when all these guys get to Muncie in 2011 that they're all gonna think that they died and went to heaven.





        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: Glen Watson 
        To: 'General pattern discussion' 
        Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:26 AM
        Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


        Here ya go Buddy.. http://www.fpam.pt/WCF3A09/Classifications/scores.php

         

         

         


------------------------------------------------------------------------

        From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of BUDDYonRC at aol.com
        Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 8:53 AM
        To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
        Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder

         

        Is there a site where we can get WC results?

        Buddy

         


------------------------------------------------------------------------



------------------------------------------------------------------------


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        NSRCA-discussion mailing list
        NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
        http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Tue Sep  1 10:04:14 2009
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 18:04:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
In-Reply-To: <AB46FEEDE64D4956BA5898C07263D9BB@UncleJasPC>
References: <c3a.59191fff.37c2a3b9@aol.com><19FE2691F6B2485A9E1C7A7F7BE45A7B@telapoint.local><A287DD65BA2D465397844F8B98154AB3@george15cf36d8><DB99F5B1888C439F8CA292B5953626E1@glazecstp32xp>
	<B16486E4772647E69FFE592DE1B86312@george15cf36d8>
	<AB46FEEDE64D4956BA5898C07263D9BB@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <272003.73842.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

George,
Quote "I can't believe that anybody can be THAT?good !" I asked a couple people at the contest last weekend that exact question. Considering the company he was in is he really that much better than everyone else? I am not suggesting that there was any bias, but it just feels a little funny that?none of the 99 or so other world class fliers could beat him in even one round? I hope he flies in?the 2011 worlds as I am very much looking forward to what perfect pattern flights look like. 

Anthony


________________________________
From: J Shu <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 1:36:07 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


Before this gets too far out of control guys, the Winner was the winner of the contest. I didn't watch everyone's flights, but I did watch most of CPLR's and I?believe they got it right in the end. But again... I didn't watch everyone's flights.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

----- Original Message ----- 
>From: GEORGE KENNIE 
>To: General pattern discussion 
>Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 1:28 PM
>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>
>
>Thanks Bill,
>?
>I would sure love to do that.
>?
>I sure would love to fill out a score sheet on that Christophe guy!? I can't believe that anybody can be THAT?good !
>?
>I?wonder what if Ramsey feels he's that much superior to all other humanoids or is there a Continental bias in effect?
>?
>Georgie
>?
>?
>?
>----- Original Message ----- 
>>From: Bill Glaze 
>>To: General pattern discussion 
>>Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:53 PM
>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>>
>>
>>Georgie:
>>Sure did miss you at the Nats'.? I guess we'll have to wait for you to go to the Muncie Worlds' in 2011!<G>
>>Bill
>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>From: GEORGE KENNIE 
>>>To: General pattern discussion 
>>>Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:16 PM
>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>>>
>>>
>>>After observing the site and the conditions under which all these world class competitors participated, I can't help but
>>>conclude that when all these guys get to Muncie in?2011 that they're all gonna think that they died and went to heaven.
>>>?
>>>?
>>>?
>>>?
>>>?
>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>From: Glen Watson 
>>>>To: 'General pattern discussion' 
>>>>Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:26 AM
>>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Here ya go Buddy?. http://www.fpam.pt/WCF3A09/Classifications/scores.php
>>>>?
>>>>?
>>>>?
>>>>
________________________________

>>>>From:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of BUDDYonRC at aol.com
>>>>Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 8:53 AM
>>>>To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder
>>>>?
>>>>Is there a site where we can get WC results?
>>>>Buddy
>>>>?
>>>>
________________________________

________________________________
_______________________________________________
>>>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
________________________________
_______________________________________________
>>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
________________________________
_______________________________________________
>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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_______________________________________________
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From jpavlick at idseng.com  Tue Sep  1 10:06:07 2009
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 18:06:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating
In-Reply-To: <BAY128-W85BA70069C26CA50643E6A0F10@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <20936.35349.qm@web80506.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Wait a minute.?I thought electric power sytems were "plug?& play" and nearly "maintenance free". You mean they're NOT???? LOL
?
John Pavlick

--- On Tue, 9/1/09, Richard Strickland <pamrich47 at hotmail.com> wrote:


From: Richard Strickland <pamrich47 at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 1, 2009, 12:54 PM




#yiv148686092 .hmmessage P
{
margin:0px;padding:0px;}
#yiv148686092 {
font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana;}

I have two Comps that I bought used--sent them off to Hacker to be checked as one had a gear problem and the other ran 'hot'.? Got them back and one still ran hot.? I disassembled and the interior lining had a small wrinkle in it that impeded air flow--I sanded?and re-sealed it--and need to test it.? Hacker suggested it had gotten very hot along the way to cause the wrinkle and probably lost some magnetism.? Even after three or four flights in relatively close succession, the other motor only got into the high?120s--this one got to almost 160.? I'll try it, but I think a new rotor is in it's future..,.BTW, they say if it got high enough to de-mag, then the bearings ought to be replaced also...
?
Now for the cause of over-heating:? The configuration of these motors is a little weird--you would think they would do a front to back air flow as you would normally have positive pressure toward the front of the motor--but the fan integrated into the gearbox pulls air through the motor from the back where you would hope there would be negative pressure.? So it would probably help to duct air to the rear.? But it doesn't seem to matter if the motor is OK as it stays reasonably cool with fairly 'normal' ducting.? So I suppose flying with weaker batteries, lots of partial throttle under load, immediate successive flights, too much prop, wide open all the time,?etc. could contribute to longevity/heating/ demagging issues.? I didn't used to pay that much attention to motor temps as my original C50XL14s seemed to run fairly cool--but then I went out for some quick flights for practice--hot, humid and flights in close succession and killed 'em both
 within a week--I was out of business....
RS
?


Date: Tue, 1 Sep 2009 12:01:39 -0400
From: schale at optonline.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating

I called Hacker first person thought it was the phenolic disk from the fan being missing.? Next guy who was to take the order was less enthusiastic.? He thought it could have been a de magnetized issue.? Oh well off to Hacker it goes :)
I haven't flown the Pinnacle in over a year, guess it is time to get re-aquainted.
Thanks for the help.
Stuart

Richard Strickland wrote: 


#yiv148686092 .ExternalClass .EC_hmmessage P
{padding:0px;}
#yiv148686092 .ExternalClass body.EC_hmmessage
{font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana;}

There's a pretty good chance?the rotor has de-magnetized, draws more amps to compensate?and heats it up.? Rotor is about $180.00.? Make sure the interior paper isn't rubbing the rotor and there is some clearance--as there ain't much to start with...
RS
?


Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2009 22:51:15 -0400
From: schale at optonline.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating

The pencil line is straight, and it is a kevlar wound magnet.? I will call Hacker tomorrow and I am sure they will say send it in.? The input wire could be an issue.? I always noticed that if the wires were bent wrong it would cause friction to keep the motor from easily spinning.
I guess I will just have to fly the Pinnacle for a while, or switch that motor to my Beryll.? Does the reg Hacker swap for the comp model or are spacings different?

Earl Haury wrote: 

Stuart
?
As this is a change from the norm, it's apparent that something has changed with the motor.?Higher temp is usually associated with higher load (more watts) which doesn't appear to be the case. A clue might be in the missing fan disc, I doubt that the change in fan efficiency is at fault due to the rapid temp rise. But, you might check the windings for damage from debris, as clearances are close between the rotor and the windings. You?mention that the rotor doesn't have separated magnets. I assume that this?rotor has the Kevlar thread outer winding. There's usually a pencil?line drawn?on the covering for the length of the rotor -?ensure that the line is?straight. If some?magnet discs?"slip" they may not develop a gap, but the?pencil line will be discontinuous.?(Although usually slipped disc symptoms are higher amps as well as temp.)
?
Another possibility is a partially broken motor input wire, the high resistance in one "phase" will imbalance the load on the windings and quickly generate more heat. (I've found it worthwhile to tie the motor wires together to?minimize flexing.)
?
Good luck
?
Ear

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Stuart Chale 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 8:41 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating

It has been in the same plane for 2 years.? Never noticed it getting this hot before.? I know the last time I checked (in hotter weather) it was not this hot.
Stuart

Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote: 


#yiv148686092 .ExternalClass P
{}


Stuart,
?
How long you have been running the motor?? Did you measure the temperature?? It will be good idea to duct air to the back of the motor.? If you don't have any ducting I suggest that you install some.? Air from the duct should blow as close as possible to the motor.? Probably you already did all this but I am not sure.? Also need to make sure that has enough exhaust opening to allow the hot air to exhaust the fuselage.? I am sure that you will get more suggestions.
?
Good luck,

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Stuart Chale" <schale at optonline.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 7:13:08 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Hacker Comp overheating

I have a hacker 14XL Comp model that started overheating this weekend. 
I was hoping it just needed some grease. ?Pulled it apart tonight and 
grease was still present (black as usual. ?Regreasing time was near.) ?
Cleaned it up and pulled the front housing off. ?First thing I noticed 
was that the bottom portion of the fan (the phenolic disk) was missing. ?
Some dust in the motor so I think it just got chewed up spit out or part 
of it ground to dust. ?Pulled the rotor and the magnet looks fine. ?I 
had a standard model where the magnet split part way down and was 
pulling higher amps. ?Bearings fit the shaft freely, no play but slid on 
easily and seemed smooth. ?Put it back together regreased. ?Ran it up 
with a 21 x 13W APC pulled 67 amps 2300 watts at WOT but after a minute 
or so of 3 15 to 20 second full throttle bursts the motor was hot 
again. ?Too hot to hold your hand around it.

Any ideas?
Thanks,
Stuart

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From seefo at san.rr.com  Tue Sep  1 10:35:32 2009
From: seefo at san.rr.com (seefo at san.rr.com)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 18:35:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
In-Reply-To: <272003.73842.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20090901183529.JNXIK.336402.root@cdptpa-web01-z02>



Having seen Christophe fly on several occasions, I can say without a doubt, YES.. he is that good. Same can be said for any of the top 10 at the WC though. Any of them can put in a burner of a flight and score that well. CPLR just seems to be able to put it together when it counts.

Also very impressed with Benoit's flying.. At the TOC I thought Benoit was a better freestyle pilot than CPLR, and I'm glad to see he's getting recognition at the world level too. It has to be hard to be the 'other' PLR brother.

One thing I didn't care for from watching videos was the style of flying. The very slow rolling through all the maneuvers seemed to take away segment definition for me and blended it all together into continuous motion of sorts. Nothing wrong with it.. I'm just not a fan.

Doug


---- Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net> wrote: 
> George,
Quote "I can't believe that anybody can be THAT?good !" I asked a couple people at the contest last weekend that exact question. Considering the company he was in is he really that much better than everyone else? I am not suggesting that there was any bias, but it just feels a little funny that?none of the 99 or so other world class fliers could beat him in even one round? I hope he flies in?the 2011 worlds as I am very much looking forward to what perfect pattern flights look like. 

Anthony


________________________________
From: J Shu <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 1:36:07 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


Before this gets too far out of control guys, the Winner was the winner of the contest. I didn't watch everyone's flights, but I did watch most of CPLR's and I?believe they got it right in the end. But again... I didn't watch everyone's flights.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

----- Original Message ----- 
>From: GEORGE KENNIE 
>To: General pattern discussion 
>Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 1:28 PM
>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>
>
>Thanks Bill,
>?
>I would sure love to do that.
>?
>I sure would love to fill out a score sheet on that Christophe guy!? I can't believe that anybody can be THAT?good !
>?
>I?wonder what if Ramsey feels he's that much superior to all other humanoids or is there a Continental bias in effect?
>?
>Georgie
>?
>?
>?
>----- Original Message ----- 
>>From: Bill Glaze 
>>To: General pattern discussion 
>>Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:53 PM
>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>>
>>
>>Georgie:
>>Sure did miss you at the Nats'.? I guess we'll have to wait for you to go to the Muncie Worlds' in 2011!<G>
>>Bill
>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>From: GEORGE KENNIE 
>>>To: General pattern discussion 
>>>Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:16 PM
>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>>>
>>>
>>>After observing the site and the conditions under which all these world class competitors participated, I can't help but
>>>conclude that when all these guys get to Muncie in?2011 that they're all gonna think that they died and went to heaven.
>>>?
>>>?
>>>?
>>>?
>>>?
>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>From: Glen Watson 
>>>>To: 'General pattern discussion' 
>>>>Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:26 AM
>>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Here ya go Buddy?. http://www.fpam.pt/WCF3A09/Classifications/scores.php
>>>>?
>>>>?
>>>>?
>>>>
________________________________

>>>>From:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of BUDDYonRC at aol.com
>>>>Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 8:53 AM
>>>>To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder
>>>>?
>>>>Is there a site where we can get WC results?
>>>>Buddy
>>>>?
>>>>
________________________________

________________________________
_______________________________________________
>>>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
________________________________
_______________________________________________
>>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
________________________________
_______________________________________________
>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
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>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
________________________________
_______________________________________________
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>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From schale at optonline.net  Tue Sep  1 10:46:04 2009
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 18:46:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
In-Reply-To: <20090901183529.JNXIK.336402.root@cdptpa-web01-z02>
References: <20090901183529.JNXIK.336402.root@cdptpa-web01-z02>
Message-ID: <4A9D6BDD.4040605@optonline.net>

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From rcmaster199 at aol.com  Tue Sep  1 13:18:19 2009
From: rcmaster199 at aol.com (rcmaster199 at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 21:18:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
In-Reply-To: <AB46FEEDE64D4956BA5898C07263D9BB@UncleJasPC>
References: <AB46FEEDE64D4956BA5898C07263D9BB@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <8CBF960CA45F04C-4090-9319@webmail-m087.sysops.aol.com>

Good for you Jason. Tell these geezers to butt out. LOL....Just kidding fellas!!! 


?


BTW, I am sure all four of you guys flew great. 


?


MattK










-----Original Message-----

From: J Shu &lt;jshulman at cfl.rr.com&gt;

To: General pattern discussion &lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;

Sent: Tue, Sep 1, 2009 1:36 pm

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -&gt; scores










Before this gets too far out of control guys, the Winner was the winner of the contest. I didn't watch everyone's flights, but I did watch most of CPLR's and I?believe they got it right in the end. But again... I didn't watch everyone's flights.




Regards,

Jason

www.shulmanaviation.com

www.composite-arf.com





----- Original Message ----- 


From: GEORGE KENNIE 


To: General pattern discussion 


Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 1:28 PM


Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -&gt; scores







Thanks Bill,


?


I would sure love to do that.


?


I sure would love to fill out a score sheet on that Christophe guy!? I can't believe that anybody can be THAT?good !


?


I?wonder what if Ramsey feels he's that much superior to all other humanoids or is there a Continental bias20in effect?


?


Georgie


?


?


?



----- Original Message ----- 


From: Bill Glaze 


To: General pattern discussion 


Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:53 PM


Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -&gt; scores







Georgie:


Sure did miss you at the Nats'.? I guess we'll have to wait for you to go to the Muncie Worlds' in 2011!&lt;G&gt;


Bill



----- Original Message ----- 


From: GEORGE KENNIE 


To: General pattern discussion 


Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:16 PM


Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -&gt; scores







After observing the site and the conditions under which all these world class competitors participated, I can't help but


conclude that when all these guys get to Muncie in?2011 that they're all gonna think that they died and went to heaven.


?


?


?


?


?



----- Original Message ----- 


From: Glen Watson 


To: 'General pattern discussion' 


Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:26 AM


Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -&gt; scores









Here ya go Buddy?. http://www.fpam.pt/WCF3A09/Classifications/scores.php


?


?

0A
?









From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of BUDDYonRC at aol.com

Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 8:53 AM

To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder



?




Is there a site where we can get WC results?





Buddy





?














_______________________________________________

NSRCA-discussion mailing list

NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion






_______________________________________________

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From geobet4 at verizon.net  Tue Sep  1 13:20:07 2009
From: geobet4 at verizon.net (GEORGE KENNIE)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 21:20:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
References: <c3a.59191fff.37c2a3b9@aol.com><19FE2691F6B2485A9E1C7A7F7BE45A7B@telapoint.local><A287DD65BA2D465397844F8B98154AB3@george15cf36d8><DB99F5B1888C439F8CA292B5953626E1@glazecstp32xp>
	<B16486E4772647E69FFE592DE1B86312@george15cf36d8>
	<AB46FEEDE64D4956BA5898C07263D9BB@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <2A97F781E4EE462B96BE442B7B5EAB9A@george15cf36d8>

Jay,

I'm sure you're absolutely correct, but I'd still like to see it for myself. 

I consider your assessment a very selfless observation and expected nothing less considering the source.

G.



  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: J Shu 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 1:36 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


  Before this gets too far out of control guys, the Winner was the winner of the contest. I didn't watch everyone's flights, but I did watch most of CPLR's and I believe they got it right in the end. But again... I didn't watch everyone's flights.

  Regards,
  Jason
  www.shulmanaviation.com
  www.composite-arf.com

    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: GEORGE KENNIE 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 1:28 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


    Thanks Bill,

    I would sure love to do that.

    I sure would love to fill out a score sheet on that Christophe guy!  I can't believe that anybody can be THAT good !

    I wonder what if Ramsey feels he's that much superior to all other humanoids or is there a Continental bias in effect?

    Georgie



      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: Bill Glaze 
      To: General pattern discussion 
      Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:53 PM
      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


      Georgie:
      Sure did miss you at the Nats'.  I guess we'll have to wait for you to go to the Muncie Worlds' in 2011!<G>
      Bill
        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: GEORGE KENNIE 
        To: General pattern discussion 
        Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:16 PM
        Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


        After observing the site and the conditions under which all these world class competitors participated, I can't help but
        conclude that when all these guys get to Muncie in 2011 that they're all gonna think that they died and went to heaven.





          ----- Original Message ----- 
          From: Glen Watson 
          To: 'General pattern discussion' 
          Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:26 AM
          Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


          Here ya go Buddy.. http://www.fpam.pt/WCF3A09/Classifications/scores.php

           

           

           


----------------------------------------------------------------------

          From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of BUDDYonRC at aol.com
          Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 8:53 AM
          To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
          Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder

           

          Is there a site where we can get WC results?

          Buddy

           


----------------------------------------------------------------------



----------------------------------------------------------------------


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          NSRCA-discussion mailing list
          NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
          http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From geobet4 at verizon.net  Tue Sep  1 13:21:21 2009
From: geobet4 at verizon.net (GEORGE KENNIE)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 21:21:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
References: <c3a.59191fff.37c2a3b9@aol.com><19FE2691F6B2485A9E1C7A7F7BE45A7B@telapoint.local><A287DD65BA2D465397844F8B98154AB3@george15cf36d8><DB99F5B1888C439F8CA292B5953626E1@glazecstp32xp>
	<B16486E4772647E69FFE592DE1B86312@george15cf36d8>
	<AB46FEEDE64D4956BA5898C07263D9BB@UncleJasPC>
	<272003.73842.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <C57AC28359B24813A451135817743753@george15cf36d8>

Me too Anthony !



  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Anthony Abdullah 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 2:04 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


  George,
  Quote "I can't believe that anybody can be THAT good !" I asked a couple people at the contest last weekend that exact question. Considering the company he was in is he really that much better than everyone else? I am not suggesting that there was any bias, but it just feels a little funny that none of the 99 or so other world class fliers could beat him in even one round? I hope he flies in the 2011 worlds as I am very much looking forward to what perfect pattern flights look like. 

  Anthony


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: J Shu <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
  To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 1:36:07 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


  Before this gets too far out of control guys, the Winner was the winner of the contest. I didn't watch everyone's flights, but I did watch most of CPLR's and I believe they got it right in the end. But again... I didn't watch everyone's flights.

  Regards,
  Jason
  www.shulmanaviation.com
  www.composite-arf.com

    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: GEORGE KENNIE 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 1:28 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


    Thanks Bill,

    I would sure love to do that.

    I sure would love to fill out a score sheet on that Christophe guy!  I can't believe that anybody can be THAT good !

    I wonder what if Ramsey feels he's that much superior to all other humanoids or is there a Continental bias in effect?

    Georgie



      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: Bill Glaze 
      To: General pattern discussion 
      Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:53 PM
      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


      Georgie:
      Sure did miss you at the Nats'.  I guess we'll have to wait for you to go to the Muncie Worlds' in 2011!<G>
      Bill
        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: GEORGE KENNIE 
        To: General pattern discussion 
        Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:16 PM
        Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


        After observing the site and the conditions under which all these world class competitors participated, I can't help but
        conclude that when all these guys get to Muncie in 2011 that they're all gonna think that they died and went to heaven.





          ----- Original Message ----- 
          From: Glen Watson 
          To: 'General pattern discussion' 
          Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:26 AM
          Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


          Here ya go Buddy?. http://www.fpam.pt/WCF3A09/Classifications/scores.php








----------------------------------------------------------------------

          From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of BUDDYonRC at aol.com
          Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 8:53 AM
          To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
          Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder



          Is there a site where we can get WC results?

          Buddy




----------------------------------------------------------------------



----------------------------------------------------------------------


          _______________________________________________
          NSRCA-discussion mailing list
          NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
          http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


------------------------------------------------------------------------


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--------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From rcmaster199 at aol.com  Tue Sep  1 13:26:43 2009
From: rcmaster199 at aol.com (rcmaster199 at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 21:26:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
In-Reply-To: <C57AC28359B24813A451135817743753@george15cf36d8>
References: <C57AC28359B24813A451135817743753@george15cf36d8>
Message-ID: <8CBF961FAA32009-4090-94D4@webmail-m087.sysops.aol.com>

Not perfect by a long shot.....Nobody is


?


Just very, very good. I've witnessed his flying a few times and was impressed and I think I am a fairly tough judge to impress


?


MattK


?


?


----- Original Message ----- 





From: Anthony Abdullah 


To: General pattern discussion 


Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 2:04 PM


Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -&gt; scores









George,


Quote "I can't believe that anybody can be THAT?good !" I asked a couple people at the contest last weekend that exact question. Considering the company he was in is he really that much better than everyone else? I am not suggesting that there was any bias, but it just feels a little funny that?none of the 99 or so other world class fliers could beat him in even one round? I hope he flies in?the 2011 worlds as I am very much looking forward to what perfect pattern flights look like. 




Anthony





From: J Shu &lt;jshulman at cfl.rr.com&gt;

To: General pattern discussion &lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;

Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 1:36:07 PM

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -&gt; scores







Before this gets too far out of control guys, the Winner was the winner of the contest. I didn't watch everyone's flights, but I=2
0did watch most of CPLR's and I?believe they got it right in the end. But again... I didn't watch everyone's flights.




Regards,

Jason

www.shulmanaviation.com

www.composite-arf.com





----- Original Message ----- 


From: GEORGE KENNIE 


To: General pattern discussion 


Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 1:28 PM


Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -&gt; scores







Thanks Bill,


?


I would sure love to do that.


?


I sure would love to fill out a score sheet on that Christophe guy!? I can't believe that anybody can be THAT?good !


?


I?wonder what if Ramsey feels he's that much superior to all other humanoids or is there a Continental bias in effect?


?


Georgie


?


?


?



----- Original Message ----- 


From: Bill Glaze 


To: General pattern discussion 


Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:53 PM


Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -&gt; scores







Georgie:


Sure did miss you at the Nats'.? I guess we'll have to wait for you to go to the Muncie Worlds' in 2011!&lt;G&gt;


Bill



----- Original Message ----- 


From: GEORGE KENNIE 


To: General pattern discussion 



Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:16 PM


Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -&gt; scores







After observing the site and the conditions under which all these world class competitors participated, I can't help but


conclude that when all these guys get to Muncie in?2011 that they're all gonna think that they died and went to heaven.


?


?


?


?


?



----- Original Message ----- 


From: Glen Watson 


To: 'General pattern discussion' 


Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:26 AM


Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -&gt; scores









Here ya go Buddy?. http://www.fpam.pt/WCF3A09/Classifications/scores.php


?


?


?









From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of BUDDYonRC at aol.com

Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 8:53 AM

To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder



?




Is there a site where we can get WC results?





Buddy





?














_______________________________________________

NSRCA-discussion mailing list

NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussio
n






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_______________________________________________

NSRCA-discussion mailing list

NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion









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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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From geobet4 at verizon.net  Tue Sep  1 13:28:00 2009
From: geobet4 at verizon.net (GEORGE KENNIE)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 21:28:00 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
References: <20090901183529.JNXIK.336402.root@cdptpa-web01-z02>
Message-ID: <CE827AC9C3544BAAB8A97AC4E2DA112E@george15cf36d8>

I agree on the roll rate. I kinda always felt that the ultra slow rolling 
was a cheat of sorts enabling the pilot to accomplish hesitation stops dead 
on.

Seems to nullify the "crisp start and stop" requirement.

No fan here either.

G.




----- Original Message ----- 
From: <seefo at san.rr.com>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 2:35 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


>
>
> Having seen Christophe fly on several occasions, I can say without a 
> doubt, YES.. he is that good. Same can be said for any of the top 10 at 
> the WC though. Any of them can put in a burner of a flight and score that 
> well. CPLR just seems to be able to put it together when it counts.
>
> Also very impressed with Benoit's flying.. At the TOC I thought Benoit was 
> a better freestyle pilot than CPLR, and I'm glad to see he's getting 
> recognition at the world level too. It has to be hard to be the 'other' 
> PLR brother.
>
> One thing I didn't care for from watching videos was the style of flying. 
> The very slow rolling through all the maneuvers seemed to take away 
> segment definition for me and blended it all together into continuous 
> motion of sorts. Nothing wrong with it.. I'm just not a fan.
>
> Doug
>
>
> ---- Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>> George,
> Quote "I can't believe that anybody can be THAT good !" I asked a couple 
> people at the contest last weekend that exact question. Considering the 
> company he was in is he really that much better than everyone else? I am 
> not suggesting that there was any bias, but it just feels a little funny 
> that none of the 99 or so other world class fliers could beat him in even 
> one round? I hope he flies in the 2011 worlds as I am very much looking 
> forward to what perfect pattern flights look like.
>
> Anthony
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: J Shu <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 1:36:07 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>
>
> Before this gets too far out of control guys, the Winner was the winner of 
> the contest. I didn't watch everyone's flights, but I did watch most of 
> CPLR's and I believe they got it right in the end. But again... I didn't 
> watch everyone's flights.
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>From: GEORGE KENNIE
>>To: General pattern discussion
>>Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 1:28 PM
>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>>
>>
>>Thanks Bill,
>>
>>I would sure love to do that.
>>
>>I sure would love to fill out a score sheet on that Christophe guy! I 
>>can't believe that anybody can be THAT good !
>>
>>I wonder what if Ramsey feels he's that much superior to all other 
>>humanoids or is there a Continental bias in effect?
>>
>>Georgie
>>
>>
>>
>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>From: Bill Glaze
>>>To: General pattern discussion
>>>Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:53 PM
>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>>>
>>>
>>>Georgie:
>>>Sure did miss you at the Nats'. I guess we'll have to wait for you to go 
>>>to the Muncie Worlds' in 2011!<G>
>>>Bill
>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>From: GEORGE KENNIE
>>>>To: General pattern discussion
>>>>Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:16 PM
>>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>After observing the site and the conditions under which all these world 
>>>>class competitors participated, I can't help but
>>>>conclude that when all these guys get to Muncie in 2011 that they're all 
>>>>gonna think that they died and went to heaven.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>From: Glen Watson
>>>>>To: 'General pattern discussion'
>>>>>Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:26 AM
>>>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Here ya go Buddy?. 
>>>>>http://www.fpam.pt/WCF3A09/Classifications/scores.php
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
> ________________________________
>
>>>>>From:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
>>>>>[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of 
>>>>>BUDDYonRC at aol.com
>>>>>Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 8:53 AM
>>>>>To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder
>>>>>
>>>>>Is there a site where we can get WC results?
>>>>>Buddy
>>>>>
>>>>>
> ________________________________
>
> ________________________________
> _______________________________________________
>>>>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> ________________________________
> _______________________________________________
>>>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> ________________________________
> _______________________________________________
>>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> ________________________________
> _______________________________________________
>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


From billglaze at bellsouth.net  Tue Sep  1 13:33:20 2009
From: billglaze at bellsouth.net (Bill Glaze)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 21:33:20 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
References: <c3a.59191fff.37c2a3b9@aol.com><19FE2691F6B2485A9E1C7A7F7BE45A7B@telapoint.local><A287DD65BA2D465397844F8B98154AB3@george15cf36d8><DB99F5B1888C439F8CA292B5953626E1@glazecstp32xp>
	<B16486E4772647E69FFE592DE1B86312@george15cf36d8>
Message-ID: <0D8477E251584665968495EC49B254A6@glazecstp32xp>

Can't be that good--sounds just like me when I was looking at QQ's scores, from another flight.  Then I had occasion to judge him at the Don Lowe's Masters.  Afterwards, looking at my score sheet, I was truly embarrassed at how high the scores were.  I had a hard time believing them--and I was the one who judged him!  Couldn't believe it myself.  Believe me, he's good.  (Although I realize that's not who/what you were questioning.)
Bill
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: GEORGE KENNIE 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 1:28 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


  Thanks Bill,

  I would sure love to do that.

  I sure would love to fill out a score sheet on that Christophe guy!  I can't believe that anybody can be THAT good !

  I wonder what if Ramsey feels he's that much superior to all other humanoids or is there a Continental bias in effect?

  Georgie



    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Bill Glaze 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:53 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


    Georgie:
    Sure did miss you at the Nats'.  I guess we'll have to wait for you to go to the Muncie Worlds' in 2011!<G>
    Bill
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: GEORGE KENNIE 
      To: General pattern discussion 
      Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:16 PM
      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


      After observing the site and the conditions under which all these world class competitors participated, I can't help but
      conclude that when all these guys get to Muncie in 2011 that they're all gonna think that they died and went to heaven.





        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: Glen Watson 
        To: 'General pattern discussion' 
        Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:26 AM
        Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


        Here ya go Buddy.. http://www.fpam.pt/WCF3A09/Classifications/scores.php

         

         

         


------------------------------------------------------------------------

        From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of BUDDYonRC at aol.com
        Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 8:53 AM
        To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
        Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder

         

        Is there a site where we can get WC results?

        Buddy

         


------------------------------------------------------------------------



------------------------------------------------------------------------


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        NSRCA-discussion mailing list
        NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
        http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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From billglaze at bellsouth.net  Tue Sep  1 13:36:55 2009
From: billglaze at bellsouth.net (Bill Glaze)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 21:36:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . ..
	.
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1B29C7DD4A3B47559AC99619651079FA@glazecstp32xp>

Making my motel reservations tomorrow a.m.  Billl Glaze
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Derek Koopowitz 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .. .


  Tentative schedule is as follows:

    a.. Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day 
    b.. Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day 
    c.. Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1 
    d.. Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2 
    e.. Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3 
    f.. Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4 
    g.. Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary 
    h.. Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals 
    i.. Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet 
    j.. Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants

  On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:

     . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?

     Bob Kane
    getterflash at yahoo.com




    _______________________________________________
    NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion





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From brian_w_young at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  1 14:49:51 2009
From: brian_w_young at yahoo.com (brian young)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 22:49:51 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
In-Reply-To: <0D8477E251584665968495EC49B254A6@glazecstp32xp>
References: <c3a.59191fff.37c2a3b9@aol.com><19FE2691F6B2485A9E1C7A7F7BE45A7B@telapoint.local><A287DD65BA2D465397844F8B98154AB3@george15cf36d8><DB99F5B1888C439F8CA292B5953626E1@glazecstp32xp>
	<B16486E4772647E69FFE592DE1B86312@george15cf36d8>
	<0D8477E251584665968495EC49B254A6@glazecstp32xp>
Message-ID: <37083.92389.qm@web112103.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>






________________________________
From: Bill Glaze <billglaze at bellsouth.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 4:33:19 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


Can't be that good--sounds just like me when I was looking at QQ's scores, from another flight.? Then I had occasion to judge him at the Don Lowe's Masters.? Afterwards, looking at my score sheet, I was truly embarrassed at how high the scores were.? I had a hard time believing them--and I was the one who judged him!? Couldn't believe it myself.? Believe me, he's good.? (Although I realize that's not who/what you were questioning.)
Bill
----- Original Message ----- 
>From: GEORGE KENNIE 
>To: General pattern discussion 
>Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 1:28 PM
>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>
>
>Thanks Bill,
>?
>I would sure love to do that.
>?
>I sure would love to fill out a score sheet on that Christophe guy!? I can't believe that anybody can be THAT?good !
>?
>I?wonder what if Ramsey feels he's that much superior to all other humanoids or is there a Continental bias in effect?
>?
>Georgie
>?
>?
>?
>----- Original Message ----- 
>>From: Bill Glaze 
>>To: General pattern discussion 
>>Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:53 PM
>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>>
>>
>>Georgie:
>>Sure did miss you at the Nats'.? I guess we'll have to wait for you to go to the Muncie Worlds' in 2011!<G>
>>Bill
>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>From: GEORGE KENNIE 
>>>To: General pattern discussion 
>>>Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:16 PM
>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>>>
>>>
>>>After observing the site and the conditions under which all these world class competitors participated, I can't help but
>>>conclude that when all these guys get to Muncie in?2011 that they're all gonna think that they died and went to heaven.
>>>?
>>>?
>>>?
>>>?
>>>?
>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>From: Glen Watson 
>>>>To: 'General pattern discussion' 
>>>>Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:26 AM
>>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Here ya go Buddy?. http://www.fpam.pt/WCF3A09/Classifications/scores.php
>>>>?
>>>>?
>>>>?
>>>>
________________________________

>>>>From:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of BUDDYonRC at aol.com
>>>>Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 8:53 AM
>>>>To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder
>>>>?
>>>>Is there a site where we can get WC results?
>>>>Buddy
>>>>?
>>>>
________________________________

________________________________
_______________________________________________
>>>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
________________________________
_______________________________________________
>>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
________________________________
_______________________________________________
>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
________________________________
_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From billglaze at bellsouth.net  Tue Sep  1 15:51:06 2009
From: billglaze at bellsouth.net (Bill Glaze)
Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 23:51:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
References: <c3a.59191fff.37c2a3b9@aol.com><19FE2691F6B2485A9E1C7A7F7BE45A7B@telapoint.local><A287DD65BA2D465397844F8B98154AB3@george15cf36d8><DB99F5B1888C439F8CA292B5953626E1@glazecstp32xp><B16486E4772647E69FFE592DE1B86312@george15cf36d8><0D8477E251584665968495EC49B254A6@glazecstp32xp>
	<37083.92389.qm@web112103.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3CE5C467A1144703B4C8106DC853C8DE@glazecstp32xp>

Georgie:
Gonna be interesting to hear Don's take on the whole scene.  Bill
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: brian young 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:49 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores







------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: Bill Glaze <billglaze at bellsouth.net>
  To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 4:33:19 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


  Can't be that good--sounds just like me when I was looking at QQ's scores, from another flight.  Then I had occasion to judge him at the Don Lowe's Masters.  Afterwards, looking at my score sheet, I was truly embarrassed at how high the scores were.  I had a hard time believing them--and I was the one who judged him!  Couldn't believe it myself.  Believe me, he's good.  (Although I realize that's not who/what you were questioning.)
  Bill
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: GEORGE KENNIE 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 1:28 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


    Thanks Bill,

    I would sure love to do that.

    I sure would love to fill out a score sheet on that Christophe guy!  I can't believe that anybody can be THAT good !

    I wonder what if Ramsey feels he's that much superior to all other humanoids or is there a Continental bias in effect?

    Georgie



      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: Bill Glaze 
      To: General pattern discussion 
      Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:53 PM
      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


      Georgie:
      Sure did miss you at the Nats'.  I guess we'll have to wait for you to go to the Muncie Worlds' in 2011!<G>
      Bill
        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: GEORGE KENNIE 
        To: General pattern discussion 
        Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:16 PM
        Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


        After observing the site and the conditions under which all these world class competitors participated, I can't help but
        conclude that when all these guys get to Muncie in 2011 that they're all gonna think that they died and went to heaven.





          ----- Original Message ----- 
          From: Glen Watson 
          To: 'General pattern discussion' 
          Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:26 AM
          Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


          Here ya go Buddy?. http://www.fpam.pt/WCF3A09/Classifications/scores.php








----------------------------------------------------------------------

          From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of BUDDYonRC at aol.com
          Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 8:53 AM
          To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
          Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder



          Is there a site where we can get WC results?

          Buddy




----------------------------------------------------------------------



----------------------------------------------------------------------


          _______________________________________________
          NSRCA-discussion mailing list
          NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
          http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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From getterflash at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  1 17:26:46 2009
From: getterflash at yahoo.com (Bob Kane)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 01:26:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com




________________________________
From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .


Tentative schedule is as follows:
 
	* Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day 
	* Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day 
	* Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1 
	* Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2 
	* Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3 
	* Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4 
	* Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary 
	* Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals 
	* Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet 
	* Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
 
On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:

 . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>
> Bob Kane
>getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>



      
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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Tue Sep  1 18:03:36 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 02:03:36 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>

That is correct. come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and then
stay and compete in the pattern Nats. the idea is that we can hopefully
entice some of the world's competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.

 

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

 

I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?

 

Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com

 

 

  _____  

From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

Tentative schedule is as follows:

 

*	Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day 
*	Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day 
*	Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1 
*	Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2 
*	Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3 
*	Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4 
*	Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary 
*	Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals 
*	Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet 
*	Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants

 

On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:

 . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com




_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

 

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From rickrosinski at hotmail.com  Tue Sep  1 18:30:43 2009
From: rickrosinski at hotmail.com (Rick Rosinski)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 02:30:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR PCM Receivers for sale
In-Reply-To: <000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com> 
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
Message-ID: <BAY108-W23EB4338E22397776B1BE7C4F00@phx.gbl>


I have two JR R770S receivers for sale.  $60 each shipped to your door.  If interested please contact me of list.

Rick

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From brian_w_young at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  1 18:43:29 2009
From: brian_w_young at yahoo.com (brian young)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 02:43:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
Message-ID: <523595.64653.qm@web112109.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

That sounds like fun, I need to negotiate more vacation ;)




________________________________
From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 9:03:26 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .


That is correct? come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and then stay and compete in the pattern Nats? the idea is that we can hopefully entice some of the world?s competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.
?
?
From:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .
?
I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
?
Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com
?
?

________________________________

From:Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .
Tentative schedule is as follows:
?
	* Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day 
	* Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day 
	* Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1 
	* Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2 
	* Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3 
	* Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4 
	* Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary 
	* Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals 
	* Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet 
	* Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
?
On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:
?. . . . . . ? do we know the dates yet?

?Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com




_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From vanputte at cox.net  Tue Sep  1 18:49:04 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 02:49:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
Message-ID: <CF364DBC-2013-4785-9D0D-3988BF4E03B2@cox.net>

I've been thinking about this and I wonder if it wouldn't be better  
to have the Nats before the F3A World Championships.  That way, the  
foreign competitors would be able to fly in the Nats and "feel out  
the water" at the site.  Besides, if I was a competitor in the F3A  
WC, I wouldn't feel much like competing in our Nats after competing  
in the F3A WC.

Ron VP

On Sep 1, 2009, at 9:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> That is correct? come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds  
> and then stay and compete in the pattern Nats? the idea is that we  
> can hopefully entice some of the world?s competitors to fly in our  
> Nationals as well.
>
>
>
>
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
> Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
>
>
> I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
>
>
>
> Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
> Tentative schedule is as follows:
>
>
>
> Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
> Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
> Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
> Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
> Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
> Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
> Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
> Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
> Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
> Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>  
> wrote:
>
>  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>
>  Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From brian_w_young at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  1 18:58:57 2009
From: brian_w_young at yahoo.com (brian young)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 02:58:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] NEU F3A - Looking For
In-Reply-To: <CF364DBC-2013-4785-9D0D-3988BF4E03B2@cox.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
	<CF364DBC-2013-4785-9D0D-3988BF4E03B2@cox.net>
Message-ID: <963170.86283.qm@web112101.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

Does anyone have a NEU F3A they would turn loose of? Mine is off being fixed and doesn't look like it will return? soon.
?
Thanks
Brian


      
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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Tue Sep  1 19:22:14 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 03:22:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie .
	.	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <CF364DBC-2013-4785-9D0D-3988BF4E03B2@cox.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
	<CF364DBC-2013-4785-9D0D-3988BF4E03B2@cox.net>
Message-ID: <001801ca2b7c$900e8450$b02b8cf0$@com>

The problem is that what happens if the World's competitor has a mishap
(crash/midair) during the Nats and they only bring one plane?

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 7:49 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

I've been thinking about this and I wonder if it wouldn't be better  
to have the Nats before the F3A World Championships.  That way, the  
foreign competitors would be able to fly in the Nats and "feel out  
the water" at the site.  Besides, if I was a competitor in the F3A  
WC, I wouldn't feel much like competing in our Nats after competing  
in the F3A WC.

Ron VP

On Sep 1, 2009, at 9:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> That is correct. come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds  
> and then stay and compete in the pattern Nats. the idea is that we  
> can hopefully entice some of the world's competitors to fly in our  
> Nationals as well.
>
>
>
>
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
> Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
>
>
> I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
>
>
>
> Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
> Tentative schedule is as follows:
>
>
>
> Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
> Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
> Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
> Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
> Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
> Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
> Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
> Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
> Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
> Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>  
> wrote:
>
>  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>
>  Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From burtona at atmc.net  Tue Sep  1 19:30:07 2009
From: burtona at atmc.net (Dave Burton)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 03:30:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie
	.	.	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <001801ca2b7c$900e8450$b02b8cf0$@com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>	<CF364DBC-2013-4785-9D0D-3988BF4E03B2@cox.net>
	<001801ca2b7c$900e8450$b02b8cf0$@com>
Message-ID: <010a01ca2b7d$b1ad4730$1507d590$@net>


Same thing that happens if he crashes in the WC practice flights.

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Derek
Koopowitz
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 11:22 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

The problem is that what happens if the World's competitor has a mishap
(crash/midair) during the Nats and they only bring one plane?

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 7:49 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

I've been thinking about this and I wonder if it wouldn't be better  
to have the Nats before the F3A World Championships.  That way, the  
foreign competitors would be able to fly in the Nats and "feel out  
the water" at the site.  Besides, if I was a competitor in the F3A  
WC, I wouldn't feel much like competing in our Nats after competing  
in the F3A WC.

Ron VP

On Sep 1, 2009, at 9:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> That is correct. come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds  
> and then stay and compete in the pattern Nats. the idea is that we  
> can hopefully entice some of the world's competitors to fly in our  
> Nationals as well.
>
>
>
>
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
> Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
>
>
> I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
>
>
>
> Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
> Tentative schedule is as follows:
>
>
>
> Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
> Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
> Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
> Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
> Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
> Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
> Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
> Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
> Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
> Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>  
> wrote:
>
>  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>
>  Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



From Snaproll4 at aol.com  Tue Sep  1 19:34:35 2009
From: Snaproll4 at aol.com (Snaproll4 at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 03:34:35 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
Message-ID: <c14.6b003f66.37cf41bc@aol.com>

Would they want to risk their planes?  My experience last weekend is a  
good example.
 
Steve Miller
 
 
In a message dated 9/1/2009 10:49:21 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
vanputte at cox.net writes:

I've  been thinking about this and I wonder if it wouldn't be better  
to  have the Nats before the F3A World Championships.  That way, the   
foreign competitors would be able to fly in the Nats and "feel out   
the water" at the site.  Besides, if I was a competitor in the  F3A  
WC, I wouldn't feel much like competing in our Nats after  competing  
in the F3A WC.

Ron VP

On Sep 1, 2009, at  9:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> That is correct? come and see the  semis and finals of the Worlds  
> and then stay and compete in the  pattern Nats? the idea is that we  
> can hopefully entice some of  the world?s competitors to fly in our  
> Nationals as  well.
>
>
>
>
>
> From:  nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
>  discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
> Sent:  Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
> To: General pattern  discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds  at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
>
>
> I also  heard the pattern NATS will be held after the  Worlds?
>
>
>
> Bob Kane
>  getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
> From:  Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> To: General pattern  discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Monday,  August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of  the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
> Tentative  schedule is as follows:
>
>
>
> Monday July 25th 2011  Processing and Official Practice Day
> Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening  Ceremony and Official Practice Day
> Wednesday July 27th 2011  Preliminaries Day 1
> Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day  2
> Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
> Saturday July 30th  2011 Preliminaries Day 4
> Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for  preliminaries if necessary
> Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
>  Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
>  Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>
>
> On  Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>   
> wrote:
>
>  . . . . . .   do we know the  dates yet?
>
>  Bob Kane
>  getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>  _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion  mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
>  _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion  mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion  mailing  list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From burtona at atmc.net  Tue Sep  1 19:42:24 2009
From: burtona at atmc.net (Dave Burton)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 03:42:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <c14.6b003f66.37cf41bc@aol.com>
References: <c14.6b003f66.37cf41bc@aol.com>
Message-ID: <011101ca2b7f$6974e570$3c5eb050$@net>

I can?t think about it that way but maybe some do. Every time you take off you put the plane at risk.

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Snaproll4 at aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 11:34 PM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .

 

Would they want to risk their planes?  My experience last weekend is a good example.

 

Steve Miller

 

In a message dated 9/1/2009 10:49:21 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, vanputte at cox.net writes:

I've been thinking about this and I wonder if it wouldn't be better  
to have the Nats before the F3A World Championships.  That way, the  
foreign competitors would be able to fly in the Nats and "feel out  
the water" at the site.  Besides, if I was a competitor in the F3A  
WC, I wouldn't feel much like competing in our Nats after competing  
in the F3A WC.

Ron VP

On Sep 1, 2009, at 9:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> That is correct? come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds  
> and then stay and compete in the pattern Nats? the idea is that we  
> can hopefully entice some of the world?s competitors to fly in our  
> Nationals as well.
>
>
>
>
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
> Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
>
>
> I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
>
>
>
> Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
> Tentative schedule is as follows:
>
>
>
> Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
> Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
> Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
> Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
> Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
> Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
> Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
> Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
> Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
> Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>  
> wrote:
>
>  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>
>  Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From jivey61 at bellsouth.net  Tue Sep  1 20:17:46 2009
From: jivey61 at bellsouth.net (jivey)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 04:17:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores
In-Reply-To: <4A9D6BDD.4040605@optonline.net>
References: <20090901183529.JNXIK.336402.root@cdptpa-web01-z02>
	<4A9D6BDD.4040605@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <A2F8448FB477498491D27804EC611E11@JimPC>

WOULD YOU PLEASE TAKE JIVEY61 at bellsouth.net off your mailing list, thank you so much
vicki Ivey
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Stuart Chale 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 2:45 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


  Where did you find the videos?
  Stuart

  seefo at san.rr.com wrote: 
Having seen Christophe fly on several occasions, I can say without a doubt, YES.. he is that good. Same can be said for any of the top 10 at the WC though. Any of them can put in a burner of a flight and score that well. CPLR just seems to be able to put it together when it counts.

Also very impressed with Benoit's flying.. At the TOC I thought Benoit was a better freestyle pilot than CPLR, and I'm glad to see he's getting recognition at the world level too. It has to be hard to be the 'other' PLR brother.

One thing I didn't care for from watching videos was the style of flying. The very slow rolling through all the maneuvers seemed to take away segment definition for me and blended it all together into continuous motion of sorts. Nothing wrong with it.. I'm just not a fan.

Doug


---- Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net> wrote: 
  George,
    Quote "I can't believe that anybody can be THAT good !" I asked a couple people at the contest last weekend that exact question. Considering the company he was in is he really that much better than everyone else? I am not suggesting that there was any bias, but it just feels a little funny that none of the 99 or so other world class fliers could beat him in even one round? I hope he flies in the 2011 worlds as I am very much looking forward to what perfect pattern flights look like. 

Anthony


________________________________
From: J Shu <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 1:36:07 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


Before this gets too far out of control guys, the Winner was the winner of the contest. I didn't watch everyone's flights, but I did watch most of CPLR's and I believe they got it right in the end. But again... I didn't watch everyone's flights.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

----- Original Message ----- 
  From: GEORGE KENNIE 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 1:28 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


Thanks Bill,
 
I would sure love to do that.
 
I sure would love to fill out a score sheet on that Christophe guy!  I can't believe that anybody can be THAT good !
 
I wonder what if Ramsey feels he's that much superior to all other humanoids or is there a Continental bias in effect?
 
Georgie
 
 
 
----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Bill Glaze 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:53 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


Georgie:
Sure did miss you at the Nats'.  I guess we'll have to wait for you to go to the Muncie Worlds' in 2011!<G>
Bill
----- Original Message ----- 
      From: GEORGE KENNIE 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 2:16 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


After observing the site and the conditions under which all these world class competitors participated, I can't help but
conclude that when all these guys get to Muncie in 2011 that they're all gonna think that they died and went to heaven.
 
 
 
 
 
----- Original Message ----- 
        From: Glen Watson 
To: 'General pattern discussion' 
Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:26 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder -> scores


Here ya go Buddy?. http://www.fpam.pt/WCF3A09/Classifications/scores.php
 
 
 

          ________________________________

  From:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of BUDDYonRC at aol.com
Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 8:53 AM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FAT Rudder
 
Is there a site where we can get WC results?
Buddy
 

          ________________________________

________________________________
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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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_______________________________________________
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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
        ________________________________
_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
      ________________________________
_______________________________________________
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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Tue Sep  1 20:41:44 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 04:41:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at
	Muncie	.	.	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <010a01ca2b7d$b1ad4730$1507d590$@net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>	<CF364DBC-2013-4785-9D0D-3988BF4E03B2@cox.net>	<001801ca2b7c$900e8450$b02b8cf0$@com>
	<010a01ca2b7d$b1ad4730$1507d590$@net>
Message-ID: <001c01ca2b87$ab39ed40$01adc7c0$@com>

Big difference to the competitor...

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dave Burton
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 8:30 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .


Same thing that happens if he crashes in the WC practice flights.

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Derek
Koopowitz
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 11:22 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

The problem is that what happens if the World's competitor has a mishap
(crash/midair) during the Nats and they only bring one plane?

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 7:49 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

I've been thinking about this and I wonder if it wouldn't be better  
to have the Nats before the F3A World Championships.  That way, the  
foreign competitors would be able to fly in the Nats and "feel out  
the water" at the site.  Besides, if I was a competitor in the F3A  
WC, I wouldn't feel much like competing in our Nats after competing  
in the F3A WC.

Ron VP

On Sep 1, 2009, at 9:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> That is correct. come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds  
> and then stay and compete in the pattern Nats. the idea is that we  
> can hopefully entice some of the world's competitors to fly in our  
> Nationals as well.
>
>
>
>
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
> Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
>
>
> I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
>
>
>
> Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
> Tentative schedule is as follows:
>
>
>
> Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
> Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
> Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
> Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
> Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
> Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
> Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
> Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
> Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
> Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>  
> wrote:
>
>  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>
>  Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
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From burtona at atmc.net  Tue Sep  1 22:08:50 2009
From: burtona at atmc.net (Dave Burton)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 06:08:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds
	at	Muncie	.	.	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <001c01ca2b87$ab39ed40$01adc7c0$@com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>	<CF364DBC-2013-4785-9D0D-3988BF4E03B2@cox.net>	<001801ca2b7c$900e8450$b02b8cf0$@com>	<010a01ca2b7d$b1ad4730$1507d590$@net>
	<001c01ca2b87$ab39ed40$01adc7c0$@com>
Message-ID: <012201ca2b93$de8dc3e0$9ba94ba0$@net>

How so? He's still without a plane before the WC.

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Derek
Koopowitz
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 12:42 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

Big difference to the competitor...

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dave Burton
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 8:30 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .


Same thing that happens if he crashes in the WC practice flights.

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Derek
Koopowitz
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 11:22 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

The problem is that what happens if the World's competitor has a mishap
(crash/midair) during the Nats and they only bring one plane?

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 7:49 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

I've been thinking about this and I wonder if it wouldn't be better  
to have the Nats before the F3A World Championships.  That way, the  
foreign competitors would be able to fly in the Nats and "feel out  
the water" at the site.  Besides, if I was a competitor in the F3A  
WC, I wouldn't feel much like competing in our Nats after competing  
in the F3A WC.

Ron VP

On Sep 1, 2009, at 9:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> That is correct. come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds  
> and then stay and compete in the pattern Nats. the idea is that we  
> can hopefully entice some of the world's competitors to fly in our  
> Nationals as well.
>
>
>
>
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
> Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
>
>
> I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
>
>
>
> Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
> Tentative schedule is as follows:
>
>
>
> Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
> Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
> Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
> Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
> Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
> Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
> Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
> Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
> Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
> Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>  
> wrote:
>
>  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>
>  Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Wed Sep  2 05:57:39 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 13:57:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . ..	.
	.
In-Reply-To: <CF364DBC-2013-4785-9D0D-3988BF4E03B2@cox.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com><902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com><000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
	<CF364DBC-2013-4785-9D0D-3988BF4E03B2@cox.net>
Message-ID: <6400E8F68E824127AEE77585D23B6D0A@UncleJasPC>

And if you're competing at the Worlds... 'we' wouldn't be flying in the Nats before. Don't want to burnout before the Worlds. We 
actually had this discussion a few days at the practice site. Whichever comes first, the Worlds will be the first contest for the 
competitors.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ron Van Putte" <vanputte at cox.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 10:48 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .. . .


I've been thinking about this and I wonder if it wouldn't be better
to have the Nats before the F3A World Championships.  That way, the
foreign competitors would be able to fly in the Nats and "feel out
the water" at the site.  Besides, if I was a competitor in the F3A
WC, I wouldn't feel much like competing in our Nats after competing
in the F3A WC.

Ron VP

On Sep 1, 2009, at 9:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> That is correct? come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds  and then stay and compete in the pattern Nats? the idea is that 
> we  can hopefully entice some of the world?s competitors to fly in our  Nationals as well.
>
>
>
>
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
> Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  Muncie . . . . .
>
>
>
> I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
>
>
>
> Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  Muncie . . . . .
>
> Tentative schedule is as follows:
>
>
>
> Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
> Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
> Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
> Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
> Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
> Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
> Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
> Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
> Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
> Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>  wrote:
>
>  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>
>  Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Wed Sep  2 06:21:40 2009
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 14:21:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .. .
	.
In-Reply-To: <6400E8F68E824127AEE77585D23B6D0A@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <595337.13511.qm@web51001.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

 My opinion is that the Nats are the Nats and the Worlds are the Worlds. One should not effect the other. 
 If the Worlds are flown first then so be it. If some of those fliers choose to stay and participate in our Nats it would be nice but the Nats can not depend on that happening.
 For me personally I can't afford 2 weeks vacation for the hobby. So I would have to make a choice of which event to attend. I like doing a lot better than watching so I'm pretty sure which way I'm leaning.
 Would it be so terrible to not have a Nats in 2011???
 I know it's a sacrifice but the logistics of having both could really tax our resources.
 Mike

--- On Wed, 9/2/09, J Shu <jshulman at cfl.rr.com> wrote:

> From: J Shu <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .. . .
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Wednesday, September 2, 2009, 8:57 AM
> And if you're competing at the
> Worlds... 'we' wouldn't be flying in the Nats before. Don't
> want to burnout before the Worlds. We 
> actually had this discussion a few days at the practice
> site. Whichever comes first, the Worlds will be the first
> contest for the 
> competitors.
> 
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Ron Van Putte" <vanputte at cox.net>
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 10:48 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds
> at Muncie . .. . .
> 
> 
> I've been thinking about this and I wonder if it wouldn't
> be better
> to have the Nats before the F3A World Championships.?
> That way, the
> foreign competitors would be able to fly in the Nats and
> "feel out
> the water" at the site.? Besides, if I was a
> competitor in the F3A
> WC, I wouldn't feel much like competing in our Nats after
> competing
> in the F3A WC.
> 
> Ron VP
> 
> On Sep 1, 2009, at 9:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
> 
> > That is correct? come and see the semis and finals
> of the Worlds? and then stay and compete in the pattern
> Nats? the idea is that 
> > we? can hopefully entice some of the world?s
> competitors to fly in our? Nationals as well.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca- discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]
> On Behalf Of Bob Kane
> > Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
> > To: General pattern discussion
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011
> Worlds at? Muncie . . . . .
> >
> >
> >
> > I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the
> Worlds?
> >
> >
> >
> > Bob Kane
> > getterflash at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> > To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011
> Worlds at? Muncie . . . . .
> >
> > Tentative schedule is as follows:
> >
> >
> >
> > Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice
> Day
> > Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official
> Practice Day
> > Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
> > Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
> > Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
> > Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
> > Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if
> necessary
> > Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
> > Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony
> and Banquet
> > Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>?
> wrote:
> >
> >? . . . . . .???do we know the
> dates yet?
> >
> >? Bob Kane
> > getterflash at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 


      

From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Wed Sep  2 06:24:40 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 14:24:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
Message-ID: <C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>

I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after the  
World Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the Nats. I  
think it would be better to schedule the Worlds in September.

Tony


On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> That is correct? come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and  
> then stay and compete in the pattern Nats? the idea is that we can  
> hopefully entice some of the world?s competitors to fly in our  
> Nationals as well.
>
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
> ] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
> Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
> I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
>
> Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
> From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
> Tentative schedule is as follows:
>
> Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
> Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
> Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
> Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
> Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
> Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
> Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
> Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
> Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
> Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>
> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>  
> wrote:
>  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>
>  Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Wed Sep  2 06:38:57 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 14:38:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie .
	.	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B766B@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

I have to say I concur.  I would love to attend both, and likely will try to help at the worlds in some capacity, but back to back would make that impossible.  Even for those who can make the vacation time, many can't do two weeks in a row, and like Mike, I would opt to compete rather than watch.

Not to mention that the availability of practice sites would be even more limited if both events were side by side.  Tony's suggestion of Sept seems to make the most sense, though I have NO clue what the AMA calendar looks like, but I would like to think that the opportunity to host the WC would allow for some calendar clearing.

Derek/Andrew/Jason - how far away do teams travel to have access to a practice facility?  I'm curious what sort of "radius" clubs need to be in to be a viable option for making their site available to incoming teams.

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Frackowiak
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 10:25 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .

I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after the World Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the Nats. I think it would be better to schedule the Worlds in September.

Tony


On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:


That is correct... come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and then stay and compete in the pattern Nats... the idea is that we can hopefully entice some of the world's competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . ..

I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?

Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com<mailto:getterflash at yahoo.com>


________________________________
From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com<mailto:derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>>
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . ..
Tentative schedule is as follows:


 *   Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
 *   Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
 *   Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
 *   Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
 *   Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
 *   Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
 *   Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
 *   Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
 *   Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
 *   Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants

On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com<mailto:getterflash at yahoo.com>> wrote:
 . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com<mailto:getterflash at yahoo.com>




_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


No virus found in this incoming message.
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From humptybump at sbcglobal.net  Wed Sep  2 07:12:58 2009
From: humptybump at sbcglobal.net (Richard Lewis)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 15:12:58 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B766B@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>
	<99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B766B@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <695442.35695.qm@web80504.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Mark,

http://www.fpam.pt/WCF3A09/Informations/trainingFieldsWCF3A09.pdf

This link is a PDF on the Pombal WC site listing official training locations available to the competitors.? They appear to range from 4.7km to well over 100Km from the flying site.

Richard




________________________________
From: "Atwood, Mark" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 2, 2009 9:31:11 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .


I have to say I concur.? I would love to attend both, and likely will try to help at the worlds in some capacity, but back to back would make that impossible.? Even for those who can make the vacation time, many can?t do two weeks in a row, and like Mike, I would opt to compete rather than watch.? 
?
Not to mention that the availability of practice sites would be even more limited if both events were side by side.? Tony?s suggestion of Sept seems to make the most sense, though I have NO clue what the AMA calendar looks like, but I would like to think that the opportunity to host the WC would allow for some calendar clearing.
?
Derek/Andrew/Jason ? how far away do teams travel to have access to a practice facility?? I?m curious what sort of ?radius? clubs need to be in to be a viable option for making their site available to incoming teams.
?
From:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Frackowiak
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 10:25 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .
?
I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after the World Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the Nats. I think it would be better to schedule the Worlds in September.
?
Tony
?
?
On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:


That is correct? come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and then stay and compete in the pattern Nats? the idea is that we can hopefully entice some of the world?s competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.
?
?
From:?nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org?[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]?On Behalf Of?Bob Kane
Sent:?Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
To:?General pattern discussion
Subject:?Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . ..
?
I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
?
Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com
?
?

________________________________

From:?Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
To:?General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent:?Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
Subject:?Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . ..
Tentative schedule is as follows:
?
	* Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
	* Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
	* Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
	* Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
	* Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
	* Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
	* Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
	* Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
	* Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
	* Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
?
On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:
?. . . . . . ? do we know the dates yet?

?Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com




_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
?
?
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
?
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.72/2337 - Release Date: 09/02/09 05:50:00
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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Wed Sep  2 07:20:41 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 15:20:41 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>

This would mean double travel expense for many people that would potentially
work at the event and compete at the Nats.  Coming early to watch the semis
and finals means arriving 3 days before the Nats... most Nats competitors
arrive 1 to 2 days before the Nats anyway and practice at local sites so
they'd be around to watch the most important flying part of the WC's anyway.

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net
> wrote:

> I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after the World
> Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the Nats. I think it
> would be better to schedule the Worlds in September.
> Tony
>
>
>  On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
>    That is correct? come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and
> then stay and compete in the pattern Nats? the idea is that we can hopefully
> entice some of the world?s competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.
>
>
>  *From:* nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [
> mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
> ] *On Behalf Of *Bob Kane
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
> *To:* General pattern discussion
> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie .
> . . . ..
>
>  I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
>
> Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>  ------------------------------
>  *From:* Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> *To:* General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> *Sent:* Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie .
> . . . ..
>  Tentative schedule is as follows:
>
>
>    - Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
>    - Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
>    - Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
>    - Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
>    - Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
>    - Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
>    - Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
>    - Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
>    - Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
>    - Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>
>
>  On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:
>  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>
>  Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Wed Sep  2 07:25:07 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 15:25:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B766B@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>
	<99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B766B@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <3454543c0909020825g627fcabdv52d0305e82a38331@mail.gmail.com>

There were some practice sites that were about 50 miles away from the main
contest site.  Bear in mind that in Portugal a lot of competitors did not
stay at the hotel that was very close to the worlds site but chose to stay
at hotels in a town that was about 25 minutes drive away (on a freeway).
The US team, along with France, China, Hong Kong, UK, Russia and the Ukraine
chose to practice at an air base about 35 miles away from our hotel.  Some
sites were within about 15 minutes drive as well.


On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:31 AM, Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>wrote:

>  I have to say I concur.  I would love to attend both, and likely will try
> to help at the worlds in some capacity, but back to back would make that
> impossible.  Even for those who can make the vacation time, many can?t do
> two weeks in a row, and like Mike, I would opt to compete rather than
> watch.
>
>
>
> Not to mention that the availability of practice sites would be even more
> limited if both events were side by side.  Tony?s suggestion of Sept seems
> to make the most sense, though I have NO clue what the AMA calendar looks
> like, but I would like to think that the opportunity to host the WC would
> allow for some calendar clearing.
>
>
>
> Derek/Andrew/Jason ? how far away do teams travel to have access to a
> practice facility?  I?m curious what sort of ?radius? clubs need to be in to
> be a viable option for making their site available to incoming teams.
>
>
>
> *From:* nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] *On Behalf Of *Anthony
> Frackowiak
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 02, 2009 10:25 AM
>
> *To:* General pattern discussion
> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie .
> . . . .
>
>
>
> I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after the World
> Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the Nats. I think it
> would be better to schedule the Worlds in September.
>
>
>
> Tony
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
>
>
>   That is correct? come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and
> then stay and compete in the pattern Nats? the idea is that we can hopefully
> entice some of the world?s competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [
> mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
> ] *On Behalf Of *Bob Kane
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
> *To:* General pattern discussion
> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie .
> . . . ..
>
>
>
> I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
>
>
>
> Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>  ------------------------------
>
> *From:* Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> *To:* General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> *Sent:* Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie .
> . . . ..
>
> Tentative schedule is as follows:
>
>
>
>    - Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
>    - Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
>    - Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
>    - Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
>    - Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
>    - Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
>    - Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
>    - Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
>    - Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
>    - Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>
>  Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
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> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.72/2337 - Release Date: 09/02/09
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From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Wed Sep  2 07:33:34 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 15:33:34 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CCA5F4D3-0625-4805-A59B-DAC81FB2C94F@sbcglobal.net>

If I'm going to the Nats to compete I won't be watching the flying at  
the WC, I'll be trying to get some practice flying in. And with the  
WC's going on there may not be any practice fields to fly at!

I really think that everyone is going to have to make a choice. Very  
few will try to do both. Moving the WC's to September would at least  
give a bit of recovery time for those that want to try to attend both.  
A Nats after the WC's will in my opinion be very lightly attended.

Tony


On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:20 AM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> This would mean double travel expense for many people that would  
> potentially work at the event and compete at the Nats.  Coming early  
> to watch the semis and finals means arriving 3 days before the  
> Nats... most Nats competitors arrive 1 to 2 days before the Nats  
> anyway and practice at local sites so they'd be around to watch the  
> most important flying part of the WC's anyway.
>
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net 
> > wrote:
> I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after  
> the World Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the  
> Nats. I think it would be better to schedule the Worlds in September.
>
> Tony
>
>
> On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
>> That is correct? come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds  
>> and then stay and compete in the pattern Nats? the idea is that we  
>> can hopefully entice some of the world?s competitors to fly in our  
>> Nationals as well.
>>
>>
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
>> ] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
>> Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
>> To: General pattern discussion
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
>> Muncie . . . . ..
>>
>> I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
>>
>> Bob Kane
>> getterflash at yahoo.com
>>
>>
>> From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
>> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
>> Muncie . . . . ..
>> Tentative schedule is as follows:
>>
>> Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
>> Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
>> Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
>> Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
>> Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
>> Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
>> Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
>> Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
>> Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
>> Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>  
>> wrote:
>>  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>>
>>  Bob Kane
>> getterflash at yahoo.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Wed Sep  2 08:19:35 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 16:19:35 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie ..	.	.
	.
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B766B@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com><3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com><902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com><000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com><C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>
	<99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B766B@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <0F493700A7E64D408BDBEB88329E20EB@UncleJasPC>

Mark, this year we drove for about an hour (120kmh+) to practice. We did find the field that was only 2.2 miles from the hotel for once the contest started. In Argentina we opted to stay an hour from the site (mistake, but lesson learned) but only 5 min from the practice site. In France we were lucky enough to have the field that was an hour and a half away to practice at (but McD's was only 10 min from there lol). We won't have any issues in Muncie though.

I believe the thinking for the Worlds then Nats was most would only want to see the semi's and finals anyway, so putting the Nats afterwards made more sense since most show-up a few days earlier anyway. And by the semi's, only 30 pilots will be out practicing so the fields won't be that bad. And after that, no one practices.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Atwood, Mark 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 10:31 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie .. . . .


  I have to say I concur.  I would love to attend both, and likely will try to help at the worlds in some capacity, but back to back would make that impossible.  Even for those who can make the vacation time, many can't do two weeks in a row, and like Mike, I would opt to compete rather than watch.  

   

  Not to mention that the availability of practice sites would be even more limited if both events were side by side.  Tony's suggestion of Sept seems to make the most sense, though I have NO clue what the AMA calendar looks like, but I would like to think that the opportunity to host the WC would allow for some calendar clearing.

   

  Derek/Andrew/Jason - how far away do teams travel to have access to a practice facility?  I'm curious what sort of "radius" clubs need to be in to be a viable option for making their site available to incoming teams.

   

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Frackowiak
  Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 10:25 AM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .

   

  I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after the World Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the Nats. I think it would be better to schedule the Worlds in September.

   

  Tony

   

   

  On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:





  That is correct. come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and then stay and compete in the pattern Nats. the idea is that we can hopefully entice some of the world's competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.

   

   

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
  Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . ..

   

  I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?

   

  Bob Kane
  getterflash at yahoo.com

   

   


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
  To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . ..

  Tentative schedule is as follows:

   

    a.. Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day 
    b.. Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day 
    c.. Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1 
    d.. Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2 
    e.. Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3 
    f.. Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4 
    g.. Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary 
    h.. Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals 
    i.. Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet 
    j.. Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants 
   

  On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:

   . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?

   Bob Kane
  getterflash at yahoo.com




  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

   

   

  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

   

  No virus found in this incoming message.
  Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
  Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.72/2337 - Release Date: 09/02/09 05:50:00



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
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From JAStebbins at worldnet.att.net  Wed Sep  2 09:04:07 2009
From: JAStebbins at worldnet.att.net (Jerry Stebbins)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 17:04:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] contact
Message-ID: <023201ca2bef$27674d60$6001a8c0@jerryscomputer>

Does anyone out there have either a phone number , or e-mail address for Al Eygabroad from Bloomington In.?
Thanks
Jerry
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From seefo at san.rr.com  Wed Sep  2 09:29:04 2009
From: seefo at san.rr.com (seefo at san.rr.com)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 17:29:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
 . .
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090902172902.VDKG4.484990.root@cdptpa-web18-z01>

We bid on, and won the right to host the WC in 2011. EVERYTHING ELSE must take a back seat to that event. The WC must be the priority and concessions or compromises to the WC due to the Nats simply cannot happen. If people can't fly in the Nats AND work the WC, then they shouldn't fly in the Nats.

IMO they should be completely separate, unrelated calendar events. If you try to shoehorn them into one long stretch, something will lose out. Either Nats competitors won't be able to practice, or worse, WC competitors won't because of people practicing for the Nats.

Do the WC right, so that people will leave with a great memory of Muncie, the AMA, the NSRCA, and their time spent here in the USA.

-Doug
 



---- Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com> wrote: 
> This would mean double travel expense for many people that would potentially
> work at the event and compete at the Nats.  Coming early to watch the semis
> and finals means arriving 3 days before the Nats... most Nats competitors
> arrive 1 to 2 days before the Nats anyway and practice at local sites so
> they'd be around to watch the most important flying part of the WC's anyway.
> 
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net
> > wrote:
> 
> > I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after the World
> > Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the Nats. I think it
> > would be better to schedule the Worlds in September.
> > Tony
> >
> >
> >  On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
> >
> >    That is correct? come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and
> > then stay and compete in the pattern Nats? the idea is that we can hopefully
> > entice some of the world?s competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.
> >
> >
> >  *From:* nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [
> > mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
> > ] *On Behalf Of *Bob Kane
> > *Sent:* Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
> > *To:* General pattern discussion
> > *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie .
> > . . . ..
> >
> >  I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
> >
> > Bob Kane
> > getterflash at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >  ------------------------------
> >  *From:* Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> > *To:* General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > *Sent:* Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
> > *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie .
> > . . . ..
> >  Tentative schedule is as follows:
> >
> >
> >    - Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
> >    - Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
> >    - Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
> >    - Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
> >    - Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
> >    - Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
> >    - Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
> >    - Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
> >    - Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
> >    - Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
> >
> >
> >  On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:
> >  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
> >
> >  Bob Kane
> > getterflash at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >


From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Wed Sep  2 12:05:05 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 20:05:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>

What is the proposed schedule for the 2011 Nats?

Tony

On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:20 AM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> This would mean double travel expense for many people that would  
> potentially work at the event and compete at the Nats.  Coming early  
> to watch the semis and finals means arriving 3 days before the  
> Nats... most Nats competitors arrive 1 to 2 days before the Nats  
> anyway and practice at local sites so they'd be around to watch the  
> most important flying part of the WC's anyway.
>
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net 
> > wrote:
> I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after  
> the World Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the  
> Nats. I think it would be better to schedule the Worlds in September.
>
> Tony
>
>
> On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
>> That is correct? come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds  
>> and then stay and compete in the pattern Nats? the idea is that we  
>> can hopefully entice some of the world?s competitors to fly in our  
>> Nationals as well.
>>
>>
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
>> ] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
>> Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
>> To: General pattern discussion
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
>> Muncie . . . . ..
>>
>> I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
>>
>> Bob Kane
>> getterflash at yahoo.com
>>
>>
>> From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
>> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
>> Muncie . . . . ..
>> Tentative schedule is as follows:
>>
>> Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
>> Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
>> Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
>> Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
>> Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
>> Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
>> Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
>> Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
>> Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
>> Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>  
>> wrote:
>>  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>>
>>  Bob Kane
>> getterflash at yahoo.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Wed Sep  2 12:31:15 2009
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 20:31:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <20090902172902.VDKG4.484990.root@cdptpa-web18-z01>
Message-ID: <1FE94A5D5BE445FBA624F795515FB226@jaysdesktop>

This may be the year to move the Pattern NATS out of Muncie, and at a later
date?

Jay Marshall

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
seefo at san.rr.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 1:29 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

We bid on, and won the right to host the WC in 2011. EVERYTHING ELSE must
take a back seat to that event. The WC must be the priority and concessions
or compromises to the WC due to the Nats simply cannot happen. If people
can't fly in the Nats AND work the WC, then they shouldn't fly in the Nats.

IMO they should be completely separate, unrelated calendar events. If you
try to shoehorn them into one long stretch, something will lose out. Either
Nats competitors won't be able to practice, or worse, WC competitors won't
because of people practicing for the Nats.

Do the WC right, so that people will leave with a great memory of Muncie,
the AMA, the NSRCA, and their time spent here in the USA.

-Doug
 



---- Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com> wrote: 
> This would mean double travel expense for many people that would
potentially
> work at the event and compete at the Nats.  Coming early to watch the
semis
> and finals means arriving 3 days before the Nats... most Nats competitors
> arrive 1 to 2 days before the Nats anyway and practice at local sites so
> they'd be around to watch the most important flying part of the WC's
anyway.
> 
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Anthony Frackowiak
<frackowiak at sbcglobal.net
> > wrote:
> 
> > I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after the
World
> > Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the Nats. I think it
> > would be better to schedule the Worlds in September.
> > Tony
> >
> >
> >  On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
> >
> >    That is correct. come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and
> > then stay and compete in the pattern Nats. the idea is that we can
hopefully
> > entice some of the world's competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.
> >
> >
> >  *From:* nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [
> >
mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<nsrca-discussion-bounces at lis
ts.nsrca.org>
> > ] *On Behalf Of *Bob Kane
> > *Sent:* Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
> > *To:* General pattern discussion
> > *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie
.
> > . . . ..
> >
> >  I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
> >
> > Bob Kane
> > getterflash at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >  ------------------------------
> >  *From:* Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> > *To:* General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > *Sent:* Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
> > *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie
.
> > . . . ..
> >  Tentative schedule is as follows:
> >
> >
> >    - Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
> >    - Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
> >    - Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
> >    - Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
> >    - Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
> >    - Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
> >    - Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
> >    - Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
> >    - Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
> >    - Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
> >
> >
> >  On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>
wrote:
> >  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
> >
> >  Bob Kane
> > getterflash at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From vicenterc at comcast.net  Wed Sep  2 12:33:58 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 20:33:58 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
 . .
In-Reply-To: <288873082.2064751251923611758.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <692836794.2065051251923638238.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

I like the idea of doing the Nats after the WC.? It will be the only way for me to see the WC and participate in the Nats .? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Anthony Frackowiak " < frackowiak @ sbcglobal .net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Wednesday, September 2, 2009 3:05:02 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . . 

What is the proposed schedule for the 2011 Nats ? 


Tony 



On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:20 AM, Derek Koopowitz wrote: 


This would mean double travel expense for many people that would potentially work at the event and compete at the Nats .? Coming early to watch the semis and finals means arriving 3 days before the Nats ... most Nats competitors arrive 1 to 2 days before the Nats anyway and practice at local sites so they'd be around to watch the most important flying part of the WC's anyway. 


On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Anthony Frackowiak < frackowiak @ sbcglobal .net > wrote: 



I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after the World Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the Nats . I think it would be better to schedule the Worlds in September. 


Tony 






On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote: 








That is correct? come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and then stay and compete in the pattern Nats ? the idea is that we can hopefully entice some of the world?s competitors to fly in our Nationals as well. 




From: ? nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org ? [ mailto: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org ] ? On Behalf Of ? Bob Kane 
Sent: ? Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM 
To: ? General pattern discussion 
Subject: ? Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .. 


I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds? 


Bob Kane 
getterflash at yahoo.com 







From: ? Derek Koopowitz < derekkoopowitz at gmail.com > 
To: ? General pattern discussion < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org > 
Sent: ? Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM 
Subject: ? Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .. 

Tentative schedule is as follows: 



    ? Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day 
    ? Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day 
    ? Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1 
    ? Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2 
    ? Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3 
    ? Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4 
    ? Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary 
    ? Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals 
    ? Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet 
    ? Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants 




On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane < getterflash at yahoo.com > wrote: 
?. . . . . . ? do we know the dates yet? 

?Bob Kane 
getterflash at yahoo.com 




_______________________________________________ 
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NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 

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http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 

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http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 

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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Wed Sep  2 12:43:20 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 20:43:20 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>
	<1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>

We won't know the schedule for the Nats until Oct. next year - that is when
the 2011 planning meeting will be held.

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 1:05 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net
> wrote:

> What is the proposed schedule for the 2011 Nats?
> Tony
>
>  On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:20 AM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
> This would mean double travel expense for many people that would
> potentially work at the event and compete at the Nats.  Coming early to
> watch the semis and finals means arriving 3 days before the Nats... most
> Nats competitors arrive 1 to 2 days before the Nats anyway and practice at
> local sites so they'd be around to watch the most important flying part of
> the WC's anyway.
>
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Anthony Frackowiak <
> frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>> I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after the
>> World Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the Nats. I think
>> it would be better to schedule the Worlds in September.
>> Tony
>>
>>
>>  On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>>
>>    That is correct? come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and
>> then stay and compete in the pattern Nats? the idea is that we can hopefully
>> entice some of the world?s competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.
>>
>>
>>  *From:* nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [
>> mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
>> ] *On Behalf Of *Bob Kane
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
>> *To:* General pattern discussion
>> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie .
>> . . . ..
>>
>>  I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
>>
>> Bob Kane
>> getterflash at yahoo.com
>>
>>
>>  ------------------------------
>>  *From:* Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
>> *To:* General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> *Sent:* Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
>> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie .
>> . . . ..
>>  Tentative schedule is as follows:
>>
>>
>>    - Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
>>    - Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
>>    - Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
>>    - Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
>>    - Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
>>    - Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
>>    - Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
>>    - Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
>>    - Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
>>    - Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>>
>>
>>  On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>
>> wrote:
>>  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>>
>>  Bob Kane
>> getterflash at yahoo.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Wed Sep  2 12:47:53 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 20:47:53 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <1FE94A5D5BE445FBA624F795515FB226@jaysdesktop>
References: <20090902172902.VDKG4.484990.root@cdptpa-web18-z01>
	<1FE94A5D5BE445FBA624F795515FB226@jaysdesktop>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B76B0@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

I think we need to be careful changing the Nat's dates.  It's been in mid July for the 20 years that I've been flying Pattern.  Moving it has some significant impact.   Those that regularly attend plan most of their summer around it.  Contests all over the country plan around it.  

I partially agree with Doug that we need to put some emphasis on the WC, but not to the complete detriment of the rest of the pattern community.  Keeping our schedule and our Nats allows all the other competitors to have a "normal" year with the added bonus of being able to attend the WC if their time and budget allows.  If we completely disrupt everything, you may find that you not only have a horrible turn out at the Nats, but some resentment towards helping out at the WC too, and that I would certainly hate to see.

Having them back to back almost forces people to pick one or the other.

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Jay Marshall
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 4:31 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .

This may be the year to move the Pattern NATS out of Muncie, and at a later
date?

Jay Marshall

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
seefo at san.rr.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 1:29 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

We bid on, and won the right to host the WC in 2011. EVERYTHING ELSE must
take a back seat to that event. The WC must be the priority and concessions
or compromises to the WC due to the Nats simply cannot happen. If people
can't fly in the Nats AND work the WC, then they shouldn't fly in the Nats.

IMO they should be completely separate, unrelated calendar events. If you
try to shoehorn them into one long stretch, something will lose out. Either
Nats competitors won't be able to practice, or worse, WC competitors won't
because of people practicing for the Nats.

Do the WC right, so that people will leave with a great memory of Muncie,
the AMA, the NSRCA, and their time spent here in the USA.

-Doug
 



---- Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com> wrote: 
> This would mean double travel expense for many people that would
potentially
> work at the event and compete at the Nats.  Coming early to watch the
semis
> and finals means arriving 3 days before the Nats... most Nats competitors
> arrive 1 to 2 days before the Nats anyway and practice at local sites so
> they'd be around to watch the most important flying part of the WC's
anyway.
> 
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Anthony Frackowiak
<frackowiak at sbcglobal.net
> > wrote:
> 
> > I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after the
World
> > Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the Nats. I think it
> > would be better to schedule the Worlds in September.
> > Tony
> >
> >
> >  On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
> >
> >    That is correct. come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and
> > then stay and compete in the pattern Nats. the idea is that we can
hopefully
> > entice some of the world's competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.
> >
> >
> >  *From:* nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [
> >
mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<nsrca-discussion-bounces at lis
ts.nsrca.org>
> > ] *On Behalf Of *Bob Kane
> > *Sent:* Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
> > *To:* General pattern discussion
> > *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie
.
> > . . . ..
> >
> >  I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
> >
> > Bob Kane
> > getterflash at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >  ------------------------------
> >  *From:* Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> > *To:* General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > *Sent:* Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
> > *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie
.
> > . . . ..
> >  Tentative schedule is as follows:
> >
> >
> >    - Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
> >    - Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
> >    - Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
> >    - Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
> >    - Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
> >    - Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
> >    - Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
> >    - Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
> >    - Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
> >    - Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
> >
> >
> >  On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>
wrote:
> >  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
> >
> >  Bob Kane
> > getterflash at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Wed Sep  2 12:57:13 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 20:57:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B76B0@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <307429323.2076261251925032903.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

This is interesting.? Here my opinion.??I think we will have more pilots attending the Nats because they want to go and see the WC and "kill to birds with one shot".? If the events are going to be in separate dates in the same year I will need to attend only one.? That probably will be the WC?for obvious reasons.??I will plan to arrive to Muncie for the semi-finals and stay there until we finish the Nats .? That sounds a very good plan to me.? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mark Atwood" < atwoodm @paragon-inc.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Wednesday, September 2, 2009 3:40:05 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [ NSRCA -discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .????????. . 

I think we need to be careful changing the Nat's dates. ?It's been in mid July for the 20 years that I've been flying Pattern. ?Moving it has some significant impact. ? Those that regularly attend plan most of their summer around it. ?Contests all over the country plan around it. ? 

I partially agree with Doug that we need to put some emphasis on the WC, but not to the complete detriment of the rest of the pattern community. ?Keeping our schedule and our Nats allows all the other competitors to have a "normal" year with the added bonus of being able to attend the WC if their time and budget allows. ?If we completely disrupt everything, you may find that you not only have a horrible turn out at the Nats , but some resentment towards helping out at the WC too, and that I would certainly hate to see. 

Having them back to back almost forces people to pick one or the other. 

-----Original Message----- 
From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org [ mailto : nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of Jay Marshall 
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 4:31 PM 
To: 'General pattern discussion' 
Subject: Re: [ NSRCA -discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . . 

This may be the year to move the Pattern NATS out of Muncie , and at a later 
date? 

Jay Marshall 

-----Original Message----- 
From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org 
[ mailto : nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of 
seefo @ san . rr .com 
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 1:29 PM 
To: General pattern discussion 
Subject: Re: [ NSRCA -discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . 
. . 

We bid on, and won the right to host the WC in 2011. EVERYTHING ELSE must 
take a back seat to that event. The WC must be the priority and concessions 
or compromises to the WC due to the Nats simply cannot happen. If people 
can't fly in the Nats AND work the WC, then they shouldn't fly in the Nats . 

IMO they should be completely separate, unrelated calendar events. If you 
try to shoehorn them into one long stretch, something will lose out. Either 
Nats competitors won't be able to practice, or worse, WC competitors won't 
because of people practicing for the Nats . 

Do the WC right, so that people will leave with a great memory of Muncie , 
the AMA, the NSRCA , and their time spent here in the USA. 

-Doug 
? 



---- Derek Koopowitz < derekkoopowitz @ gmail .com> wrote: 
> This would mean double travel expense for many people that would 
potentially 
> work at the event and compete at the Nats . ?Coming early to watch the 
semis 
> and finals means arriving 3 days before the Nats ... most Nats competitors 
> arrive 1 to 2 days before the Nats anyway and practice at local sites so 
> they'd be around to watch the most important flying part of the WC's 
anyway. 
> 
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Anthony Frackowiak 
< frackowiak @ sbcglobal .net 
> > wrote: 
> 
> > I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after the 
World 
> > Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the Nats . I think it 
> > would be better to schedule the Worlds in September. 
> > Tony 
> > 
> > 
> > ?On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote: 
> > 
> > ? ?That is correct. come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and 
> > then stay and compete in the pattern Nats . the idea is that we can 
hopefully 
> > entice some of the world's competitors to fly in our Nationals as well. 
> > 
> > 
> > ?*From:* nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org [ 
> > 
mailto : nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org< nsrca -discussion-bounces@ lis 
ts. nsrca .org> 
> > ] *On Behalf Of *Bob Kane 
> > *Sent:* Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM 
> > *To:* General pattern discussion 
> > *Subject:* Re: [ NSRCA -discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie 
. 
> > . . . .. 
> > 
> > ?I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds? 
> > 
> > Bob Kane 
> > getterflash @yahoo.com 
> > 
> > 
> > ?------------------------------ 
> > ?*From:* Derek Koopowitz < derekkoopowitz @ gmail .com> 
> > *To:* General pattern discussion < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
> > *Sent:* Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM 
> > *Subject:* Re: [ NSRCA -discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie 
. 
> > . . . .. 
> > ?Tentative schedule is as follows: 
> > 
> > 
> > ? ?- Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day 
> > ? ?- Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day 
> > ? ?- Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1 
> > ? ?- Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2 
> > ? ?- Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3 
> > ? ?- Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4 
> > ? ?- Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary 
> > ? ?- Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals 
> > ? ?- Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet 
> > ? ?- Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants 
> > 
> > 
> > ?On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane < getterflash @yahoo.com> 
wrote: 
> > ?. . . . . . ? do we know the dates yet? 
> > 
> > ?Bob Kane 
> > getterflash @yahoo.com 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________ 
> > NSRCA -discussion mailing list 
> > NSRCA -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
> > http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________ 
> > NSRCA -discussion mailing list 
> > NSRCA -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
> > http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________ 
> > NSRCA -discussion mailing list 
> > NSRCA -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
> > http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
> > 

_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA -discussion mailing list 
NSRCA -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 

_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA -discussion mailing list 
NSRCA -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 

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From wemodels at cox.net  Wed Sep  2 12:59:08 2009
From: wemodels at cox.net (Bill's Email)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 20:59:08 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
 .	. .
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>	<1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A9EDC9A.8090709@cox.net>

Derek Koopowitz wrote:
> We won't know the schedule for the Nats until Oct. next year - that is 
> when the 2011 planning meeting will be held.


And the AMA generally wants all of the NATS conducted within a given 
time window so making a change may not be a simple matter. Forgetting 
about the pilots for a second, my question is about who will actually do 
the work for the NATS and then the WC. Seems like it will be ne very 
overworked group or it will take 2 separate groups of people, and then 
the question is "who". Both tasks require very knowledgeable and 
experienced people, especially for the WC.

It is going to take a lot of effort on the part of a lot of people to 
pull them both off.





From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Wed Sep  2 13:18:05 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 21:18:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>
	<1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>

But I would hope that there has been some discussion about when to  
hold the 2011 Nats? Or has it not been considered? If it has been  
discussed, what are the planned dates for the Nats?

Tony


On Sep 2, 2009, at 1:43 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> We won't know the schedule for the Nats until Oct. next year - that  
> is when the 2011 planning meeting will be held.
>
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 1:05 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net 
> > wrote:
> What is the proposed schedule for the 2011 Nats?
>
> Tony
>
> On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:20 AM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
>> This would mean double travel expense for many people that would  
>> potentially work at the event and compete at the Nats.  Coming  
>> early to watch the semis and finals means arriving 3 days before  
>> the Nats... most Nats competitors arrive 1 to 2 days before the  
>> Nats anyway and practice at local sites so they'd be around to  
>> watch the most important flying part of the WC's anyway.
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net 
>> > wrote:
>> I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after  
>> the World Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the  
>> Nats. I think it would be better to schedule the Worlds in September.
>>
>> Tony
>>
>>
>> On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>>
>>> That is correct? come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds  
>>> and then stay and compete in the pattern Nats? the idea is that we  
>>> can hopefully entice some of the world?s competitors to fly in our  
>>> Nationals as well.
>>>
>>>
>>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
>>> ] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
>>> Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
>>> To: General pattern discussion
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
>>> Muncie . . . . ..
>>>
>>> I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
>>>
>>> Bob Kane
>>> getterflash at yahoo.com
>>>
>>>
>>> From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
>>> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>> Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
>>> Muncie . . . . ..
>>> Tentative schedule is as follows:
>>>
>>> Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
>>> Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
>>> Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
>>> Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
>>> Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
>>> Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
>>> Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
>>> Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
>>> Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
>>> Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>>>
>>> On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>  
>>> wrote:
>>>  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>>>
>>>  Bob Kane
>>> getterflash at yahoo.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Wed Sep  2 13:46:39 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 21:46:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>
	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>
	<1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>
	<4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>

Nothing firm has been decided at this point - all I know is that it will be
held after the world champs.  The wc dates are not firm either in that my
preference would be to start the prelims on Sunday July 31st and end on Sat.
August 6th with the pattern Nats starting on Monday August 8th and finishing
on Friday August 12th - these are the dates that I will be going to the AMA
with in hopes that we can use them.

We tentatively published dates for the worlds to the CIAM as starting on
July 27th (prelims) and finishing on August 2nd - this was based on dates
that I was given by the AMA - it doesn't make sense to start/end in the
middle of a week.

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:18 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net
> wrote:

> But I would hope that there has been some discussion about when to hold the
> 2011 Nats? Or has it not been considered? If it has been discussed, what are
> the planned dates for the Nats?
> Tony
>
>
>  On Sep 2, 2009, at 1:43 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
>  We won't know the schedule for the Nats until Oct. next year - that is
> when the 2011 planning meeting will be held.
>
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 1:05 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <
> frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>> What is the proposed schedule for the 2011 Nats?
>> Tony
>>
>>  On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:20 AM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>>
>> This would mean double travel expense for many people that would
>> potentially work at the event and compete at the Nats.  Coming early to
>> watch the semis and finals means arriving 3 days before the Nats... most
>> Nats competitors arrive 1 to 2 days before the Nats anyway and practice at
>> local sites so they'd be around to watch the most important flying part of
>> the WC's anyway.
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Anthony Frackowiak <
>> frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>
>>> I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after the
>>> World Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the Nats. I think
>>> it would be better to schedule the Worlds in September.
>>> Tony
>>>
>>>
>>>  On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>>>
>>>    That is correct? come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and
>>> then stay and compete in the pattern Nats? the idea is that we can hopefully
>>> entice some of the world?s competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.
>>>
>>>
>>>  *From:* nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [
>>> mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
>>> ] *On Behalf Of *Bob Kane
>>> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
>>> *To:* General pattern discussion
>>> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie
>>> . . . . ..
>>>
>>>  I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?
>>>
>>> Bob Kane
>>> getterflash at yahoo.com
>>>
>>>
>>>  ------------------------------
>>>  *From:* Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
>>> *To:* General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>> *Sent:* Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
>>> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie
>>> . . . . ..
>>>  Tentative schedule is as follows:
>>>
>>>
>>>    - Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
>>>    - Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
>>>    - Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
>>>    - Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
>>>    - Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
>>>    - Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
>>>    - Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
>>>    - Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
>>>    - Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
>>>    - Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants
>>>
>>>
>>>  On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>  . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?
>>>
>>>  Bob Kane
>>> getterflash at yahoo.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From johnfuqua at embarqmail.com  Wed Sep  2 13:51:51 2009
From: johnfuqua at embarqmail.com (John Fuqua)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 21:51:51 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . ..
	.
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com><3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com><902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com><000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com><C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net><3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com><1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net><3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com><4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <096501ca2c17$70c83780$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>

Hate to point out that schools start up in August these days, some earlier
some later.  In Florida its mid August.  If you push the Nats to that time
frame or later you WILL impact participation.   

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Derek
Koopowitz
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 4:47 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . ..
.

Nothing firm has been decided at this point - all I know is that it will be
held after the world champs.  The wc dates are not firm either in that my
preference would be to start the prelims on Sunday July 31st and end on Sat.
August 6th with the pattern Nats starting on Monday August 8th and finishing
on Friday August 12th - these are the dates that I will be going to the AMA
with in hopes that we can use them.
 
We tentatively published dates for the worlds to the CIAM as starting on
July 27th (prelims) and finishing on August 2nd - this was based on dates
that I was given by the AMA - it doesn't make sense to start/end in the
middle of a week.


On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:18 PM, Anthony Frackowiak
<frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:


	But I would hope that there has been some discussion about when to
hold the 2011 Nats? Or has it not been considered? If it has been discussed,
what are the planned dates for the Nats? 

	Tony

	 
	
	On Sep 2, 2009, at 1:43 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:


		We won't know the schedule for the Nats until Oct. next year
- that is when the 2011 planning meeting will be held.
		
		
		On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 1:05 PM, Anthony Frackowiak
<frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
		

			What is the proposed schedule for the 2011 Nats? 

			Tony

			On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:20 AM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:


				This would mean double travel expense for
many people that would potentially work at the event and compete at the
Nats.  Coming early to watch the semis and finals means arriving 3 days
before the Nats... most Nats competitors arrive 1 to 2 days before the Nats
anyway and practice at local sites so they'd be around to watch the most
important flying part of the WC's anyway.
				
				
				On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Anthony
Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
				

					I sincerely hope that this idea is
changed. Moving the Nats after the World Championships will greatly reduce
the attendance at the Nats. I think it would be better to schedule the
Worlds in September. 

					Tony


					On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek
Koopowitz wrote:


						
						That is correct. come and
see the semis and finals of the Worlds and then stay and compete in the
pattern Nats. the idea is that we can hopefully entice some of the world's
competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.
						 
						 
						From:
nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
						Sent: Tuesday, September 01,
2009 6:27 PM
						To: General pattern
discussion
						Subject: Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . ..
						 
						I also heard the pattern
NATS will be held after the Worlds?
						 
						Bob Kane
						getterflash at yahoo.com
						 
						 
						
________________________________

						From: Derek Koopowitz
<derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
						To: General pattern
discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
						Sent: Monday, August 31,
2009 4:07:33 PM
						Subject: Re:
[NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . ..
						Tentative schedule is as
follows:
						 

						*	Monday July 25th
2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
						*	Tuesday July 26th
2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
						*	Wednesday July 27th
2011 Preliminaries Day 1
						*	Thursday July 28th
2011 Preliminaries Day 2
						*	Friday July 29th
2011 Preliminaries Day 3
						*	Saturday July 30th
2011 Preliminaries Day 4
						*	Sunday July 31st
2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
						*	Monday August 1st
2011 Semi-Finals
						*	Tuesday August 2nd
2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
						*	Wednesday August 3rd
2011 Departure of Contestants

						 
						On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at
12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:
						 . . . . . .   do we know
the dates yet?
						
						 Bob Kane
						getterflash at yahoo.com 





	
_______________________________________________
						NSRCA-discussion mailing
list
	
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
	
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
						 
						 
	
_______________________________________________
						NSRCA-discussion mailing
list
	
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
	
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



	
_______________________________________________
					NSRCA-discussion mailing list
					NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
	
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
					


	
_______________________________________________
				NSRCA-discussion mailing list
				NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
	
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



			_______________________________________________
			NSRCA-discussion mailing list
			NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
	
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
			


		_______________________________________________
		NSRCA-discussion mailing list
		NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
		http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



	_______________________________________________
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	http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
	




From astafford at swtexas.net  Wed Sep  2 14:14:01 2009
From: astafford at swtexas.net (Archie Stafford)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 22:14:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>	<1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>	<4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net>

I'm guessing the IRCHA guys will fight those dates as well as that is time
they normally have their fly in, and due to the size it has grown to, I
doubt they will be willing to give it up.

 

Arch

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Derek
Koopowitz
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 5:47 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

 

Nothing firm has been decided at this point - all I know is that it will be
held after the world champs.  The wc dates are not firm either in that my
preference would be to start the prelims on Sunday July 31st and end on Sat.
August 6th with the pattern Nats starting on Monday August 8th and finishing
on Friday August 12th - these are the dates that I will be going to the AMA
with in hopes that we can use them.

 

We tentatively published dates for the worlds to the CIAM as starting on
July 27th (prelims) and finishing on August 2nd - this was based on dates
that I was given by the AMA - it doesn't make sense to start/end in the
middle of a week.

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:18 PM, Anthony Frackowiak
<frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:

But I would hope that there has been some discussion about when to hold the
2011 Nats? Or has it not been considered? If it has been discussed, what are
the planned dates for the Nats? 

 

Tony

 

 

On Sep 2, 2009, at 1:43 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

 

We won't know the schedule for the Nats until Oct. next year - that is when
the 2011 planning meeting will be held.

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 1:05 PM, Anthony Frackowiak
<frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:

What is the proposed schedule for the 2011 Nats? 

 

Tony

 

On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:20 AM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:





This would mean double travel expense for many people that would potentially
work at the event and compete at the Nats.  Coming early to watch the semis
and finals means arriving 3 days before the Nats... most Nats competitors
arrive 1 to 2 days before the Nats anyway and practice at local sites so
they'd be around to watch the most important flying part of the WC's anyway.

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Anthony Frackowiak
<frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:

I sincerely hope that this idea is changed. Moving the Nats after the World
Championships will greatly reduce the attendance at the Nats. I think it
would be better to schedule the Worlds in September. 

 

Tony

 

 

On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

 

That is correct. come and see the semis and finals of the Worlds and then
stay and compete in the pattern Nats. the idea is that we can hopefully
entice some of the world's competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.

 

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 6:27 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. ..

 

I also heard the pattern NATS will be held after the Worlds?

 

Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com

 

 


  _____  


From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:07:33 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. ..

Tentative schedule is as follows:

 

*	Monday July 25th 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
*	Tuesday July 26th 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
*	Wednesday July 27th 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
*	Thursday July 28th 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
*	Friday July 29th 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
*	Saturday July 30th 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
*	Sunday July 31st 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
*	Monday August 1st 2011 Semi-Finals
*	Tuesday August 2nd 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
*	Wednesday August 3rd 2011 Departure of Contestants

 

On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:

 . . . . . .   do we know the dates yet?

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com 






_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

 

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

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From wemodels at cox.net  Wed Sep  2 14:28:35 2009
From: wemodels at cox.net (Bill's Email)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 22:28:35 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
 .	. .
In-Reply-To: <00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com>	<902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>	<1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>	<4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>
	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net>
Message-ID: <4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>

Archie Stafford wrote:
>
> I'm guessing the IRCHA guys will fight those dates as well as that is 
> time they normally have their fly in, and due to the size it has grown 
> to, I doubt they will be willing to give it up.
>
>  
>
> Arch
>
>  
>


I heard they only got like 900 or so paid pilots this past year. Is that 
a lot??





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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Wed Sep  2 14:44:24 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 22:44:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>
	<1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>
	<4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>
	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net> <4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>
Message-ID: <3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>

So the IRCHA guys had their fly-in directly after the f3c world champs... I
think it worked for them.

Perhaps IRCHA can be persuaded to move their event out 1 week to accommodate
us?
On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 3:28 PM, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net> wrote:

>  Archie Stafford wrote:
>
>  I?m guessing the IRCHA guys will fight those dates as well as that is
> time they normally have their fly in, and due to the size it has grown to, I
> doubt they will be willing to give it up.
>
>
>
> Arch
>
>
>
>
>
> I heard they only got like 900 or so paid pilots this past year. Is that a
> lot??
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From astafford at swtexas.net  Wed Sep  2 14:51:21 2009
From: astafford at swtexas.net (Archie Stafford)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 22:51:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>	<1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>	<4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net>
	<4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>
	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <010f01ca2c1f$ddfd6520$99f82f60$@net>

IRCHA is a totally different animal though.  Kind of like having Joe Nall
after the pattern worlds.  I'd say most people really didn't care about the
F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D stuff.   

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Derek
Koopowitz
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 6:36 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

 

So the IRCHA guys had their fly-in directly after the f3c world champs... I
think it worked for them.

 

Perhaps IRCHA can be persuaded to move their event out 1 week to accommodate
us?

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 3:28 PM, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net> wrote:

Archie Stafford wrote: 

I'm guessing the IRCHA guys will fight those dates as well as that is time
they normally have their fly in, and due to the size it has grown to, I
doubt they will be willing to give it up.

 

Arch

 

 

I heard they only got like 900 or so paid pilots this past year. Is that a
lot??







_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

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From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Wed Sep  2 14:52:29 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 22:52:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>
	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>
	<1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>
	<4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>
	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net> <4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>
	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <58F61158-B975-4CF1-96CA-A45F33A77D39@sbcglobal.net>

Not the same thing. The IRCHA meet is not a competition, practice  
fields are not at a premium. I still say the WC's should be held in  
September.

Tony

On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:36 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> So the IRCHA guys had their fly-in directly after the f3c world  
> champs... I think it worked for them.
>
> Perhaps IRCHA can be persuaded to move their event out 1 week to  
> accommodate us?
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 3:28 PM, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net> wrote:
> Archie Stafford wrote:
>>
>> I?m guessing the IRCHA guys will fight those dates as well as that  
>> is time they normally have their fly in, and due to the size it has  
>> grown to, I doubt they will be willing to give it up.
>>
>>
>> Arch
>>
>>
>
>
> I heard they only got like 900 or so paid pilots this past year. Is  
> that a lot??
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Wed Sep  2 14:53:40 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 22:53:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . ..
	.
In-Reply-To: <096501ca2c17$70c83780$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com><3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com><902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com><000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com><C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net><3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com><1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net><3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com><4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>
	<096501ca2c17$70c83780$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
Message-ID: <EC922C11-8509-4E8C-AC07-372D19F5EB98@sbcglobal.net>

One of the main reasons I feel that the WC's should be in September.  
Holding the Nats after the WC's will cause a very large reduction in  
attendance.

Tony


On Sep 2, 2009, at 2:50 PM, John Fuqua wrote:

> Hate to point out that schools start up in August these days, some  
> earlier
> some later.  In Florida its mid August.  If you push the Nats to  
> that time
> frame or later you WILL impact participation.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Derek
> Koopowitz
> Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 4:47 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . ..
> .
>
> Nothing firm has been decided at this point - all I know is that it  
> will be
> held after the world champs.  The wc dates are not firm either in  
> that my
> preference would be to start the prelims on Sunday July 31st and end  
> on Sat.
> August 6th with the pattern Nats starting on Monday August 8th and  
> finishing
> on Friday August 12th - these are the dates that I will be going to  
> the AMA
> with in hopes that we can use them.
>
> We tentatively published dates for the worlds to the CIAM as  
> starting on
> July 27th (prelims) and finishing on August 2nd - this was based on  
> dates
> that I was given by the AMA - it doesn't make sense to start/end in  
> the
> middle of a week.
>
>
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:18 PM, Anthony Frackowiak
> <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>
> 	But I would hope that there has been some discussion about when to
> hold the 2011 Nats? Or has it not been considered? If it has been  
> discussed,
> what are the planned dates for the Nats?
>
> 	Tony
>
> 	
> 	
> 	On Sep 2, 2009, at 1:43 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
>
> 		We won't know the schedule for the Nats until Oct. next year
> - that is when the 2011 planning meeting will be held.
> 		
> 		
> 		On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 1:05 PM, Anthony Frackowiak
> <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> 		
>
> 			What is the proposed schedule for the 2011 Nats?
>
> 			Tony
>
> 			On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:20 AM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
>
> 				This would mean double travel expense for
> many people that would potentially work at the event and compete at  
> the
> Nats.  Coming early to watch the semis and finals means arriving 3  
> days
> before the Nats... most Nats competitors arrive 1 to 2 days before  
> the Nats
> anyway and practice at local sites so they'd be around to watch the  
> most
> important flying part of the WC's anyway.
> 				
> 				
> 				On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Anthony
> Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> 				
>
> 					I sincerely hope that this idea is
> changed. Moving the Nats after the World Championships will greatly  
> reduce
> the attendance at the Nats. I think it would be better to schedule the
> Worlds in September.
>
> 					Tony
>
>
> 					On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek
> Koopowitz wrote:
>
>
> 						
> 						That is correct. come and
> see the semis and finals of the Worlds and then stay and compete in  
> the
> pattern Nats. the idea is that we can hopefully entice some of the  
> world's
> competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.
> 						
> 						
> 						From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob  
> Kane
> 						Sent: Tuesday, September 01,
> 2009 6:27 PM
> 						To: General pattern
> discussion
> 						Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . ..
> 						
> 						I also heard the pattern
> NATS will be held after the Worlds?
> 						
> 						Bob Kane
> 						getterflash at yahoo.com
> 						
> 						
> 						
> ________________________________
>
> 						From: Derek Koopowitz
> <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> 						To: General pattern
> discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> 						Sent: Monday, August 31,
> 2009 4:07:33 PM
> 						Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . ..
> 						Tentative schedule is as
> follows:
> 						
>
> 						*	Monday July 25th
> 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
> 						*	Tuesday July 26th
> 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
> 						*	Wednesday July 27th
> 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
> 						*	Thursday July 28th
> 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
> 						*	Friday July 29th
> 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
> 						*	Saturday July 30th
> 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
> 						*	Sunday July 31st
> 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
> 						*	Monday August 1st
> 2011 Semi-Finals
> 						*	Tuesday August 2nd
> 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
> 						*	Wednesday August 3rd
> 2011 Departure of Contestants
>
> 						
> 						On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at
> 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 						 . . . . . .   do we know
> the dates yet?
> 						
> 						 Bob Kane
> 						getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
> 	
> _______________________________________________
> 						NSRCA-discussion mailing
> list
> 	
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 	
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 						
> 						
> 	
> _______________________________________________
> 						NSRCA-discussion mailing
> list
> 	
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 	
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
> 	
> _______________________________________________
> 					NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 					NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 	
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 					
>
>
> 	
> _______________________________________________
> 				NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 				NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 	
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
> 			_______________________________________________
> 			NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 			NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 	
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 			
>
>
> 		_______________________________________________
> 		NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 		NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 		http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
> 	_______________________________________________
> 	NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 	NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 	http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 	
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Wed Sep  2 14:54:47 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 22:54:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <010f01ca2c1f$ddfd6520$99f82f60$@net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>	<1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>	<4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net>
	<4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>
	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
	<010f01ca2c1f$ddfd6520$99f82f60$@net>
Message-ID: <402F958A-515B-4402-A926-B7E4515D085F@sbcglobal.net>

Archie is absolutely correct.

Tony

On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford wrote:

> IRCHA is a totally different animal though.  Kind of like having Joe  
> Nall after the pattern worlds.  I?d say most people really didn?t  
> care about the F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D stuff.
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
> ] On Behalf Of Derek Koopowitz
> Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 6:36 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
> So the IRCHA guys had their fly-in directly after the f3c world  
> champs... I think it worked for them.
>
> Perhaps IRCHA can be persuaded to move their event out 1 week to  
> accommodate us?
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 3:28 PM, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net> wrote:
> Archie Stafford wrote:
> I?m guessing the IRCHA guys will fight those dates as well as that  
> is time they normally have their fly in, and due to the size it has  
> grown to, I doubt they will be willing to give it up.
>
>
>
> Arch
>
>
>
>
> I heard they only got like 900 or so paid pilots this past year. Is  
> that a lot??
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From wemodels at cox.net  Wed Sep  2 15:00:55 2009
From: wemodels at cox.net (Bill's Email)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 23:00:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
 .	. .
In-Reply-To: <402F958A-515B-4402-A926-B7E4515D085F@sbcglobal.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>	<1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>	<4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net>	<4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>	<010f01ca2c1f$ddfd6520$99f82f60$@net>
	<402F958A-515B-4402-A926-B7E4515D085F@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <4A9EF925.9060609@cox.net>

Anthony Frackowiak wrote:
> Archie is absolutely correct. 
>
> Tony
>
> On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford wrote:
>
>> IRCHA is a totally different animal though.  Kind of like having Joe 
>> Nall after the pattern worlds.  I?d say most people really didn?t 
>> care about the F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D stuff.   


And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to an event is 
going to give them some clout when it comes to a schedule relative to 
the pattern NATS. The WC are a different thing, but IRCHA is not likely 
to budge for the pattern NATS if it came to that.


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From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Wed Sep  2 15:07:40 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 23:07:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <4A9EF925.9060609@cox.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>	<1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>	<4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net>	<4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>	<010f01ca2c1f$ddfd6520$99f82f60$@net>
	<402F958A-515B-4402-A926-B7E4515D085F@sbcglobal.net>
	<4A9EF925.9060609@cox.net>
Message-ID: <A6727037-B363-4ED4-B71C-E2337FC3D8CC@sbcglobal.net>

I absolutely agree. IRCHA will not move their dates unless forced to  
by the AMA. And I doubt the AMA will do so.

I find it hard to believe that this has not been worked out yet.

Tony

On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:00 PM, Bill's Email wrote:

> Anthony Frackowiak wrote:
>>
>> Archie is absolutely correct.
>>
>> Tony
>>
>> On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford wrote:
>>
>>> IRCHA is a totally different animal though.  Kind of like having  
>>> Joe Nall after the pattern worlds.  I?d say most people really  
>>> didn?t care about the F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D stuff.
>
>
> And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to an event  
> is going to give them some clout when it comes to a schedule  
> relative to the pattern NATS. The WC are a different thing, but  
> IRCHA is not likely to budge for the pattern NATS if it came to that.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Wed Sep  2 15:15:46 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 23:15:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <A6727037-B363-4ED4-B71C-E2337FC3D8CC@sbcglobal.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>
	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net> <4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>
	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
	<010f01ca2c1f$ddfd6520$99f82f60$@net>
	<402F958A-515B-4402-A926-B7E4515D085F@sbcglobal.net>
	<4A9EF925.9060609@cox.net>
	<A6727037-B363-4ED4-B71C-E2337FC3D8CC@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <3454543c0909021615g1c0f5af5wfa4d9581a1abfe07@mail.gmail.com>

Actually it had been all worked out until "everyone" started chiming in as
to their preference for when the wc should be held and the Nats should be
held... can't please all the people.

LOL

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:07 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net
> wrote:

> I absolutely agree. IRCHA will not move their dates unless forced to by the
> AMA. And I doubt the AMA will do so.
> I find it hard to believe that this has not been worked out yet.
>
> Tony
>
>   On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:00 PM, Bill's Email wrote:
>
>   Anthony Frackowiak wrote:
>
> Archie is absolutely correct.
> Tony
>
>  On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford wrote:
>
>   IRCHA is a totally different animal though.  Kind of like having Joe
> Nall after the pattern worlds.  I?d say most people really didn?t care about
> the F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D stuff.
>
>
>
> And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to an event is going
> to give them some clout when it comes to a schedule relative to the pattern
> NATS. The WC are a different thing, but IRCHA is not likely to budge for the
> pattern NATS if it came to that.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From wemodels at cox.net  Wed Sep  2 15:22:04 2009
From: wemodels at cox.net (Bill's Email)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 23:22:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
 .	. .
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909021615g1c0f5af5wfa4d9581a1abfe07@mail.gmail.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net>
	<4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>	<010f01ca2c1f$ddfd6520$99f82f60$@net>	<402F958A-515B-4402-A926-B7E4515D085F@sbcglobal.net>	<4A9EF925.9060609@cox.net>	<A6727037-B363-4ED4-B71C-E2337FC3D8CC@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021615g1c0f5af5wfa4d9581a1abfe07@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A9EFE1A.3020001@cox.net>

Derek Koopowitz wrote:
> Actually it had been all worked out until "everyone" started chiming 
> in as to their preference for when the wc should be held and the Nats 
> should be held... can't please all the people.
>  
> LOL

And as I have come to realize the goal is to make everyone equally 
unhappy!!! That is the true art of compromise.




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From trexlesh at msn.com  Wed Sep  2 15:23:46 2009
From: trexlesh at msn.com (Rex)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 23:23:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
	..	.
In-Reply-To: <EC922C11-8509-4E8C-AC07-372D19F5EB98@sbcglobal.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com><3454543c0908311307p3df3cacx835230397dd9d1bc@mail.gmail.com><902919.28557.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com><000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com><C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net><3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com><1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net><3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com><4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>
	<096501ca2c17$70c83780$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5> 
	<EC922C11-8509-4E8C-AC07-372D19F5EB98@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <BAY119-W5173B62EE029A18FBD8EEDCCF00@phx.gbl>


It's strange...  I've been following this thread and am a little confused on the reasoning for the idea

that the Nats attendance would be "down".  Everyone I've talked to about the possibility that the 

worlds and Nats would be held back to back, loved the idea and wants to attend.  These are people

that don't usually attend the Nats.  They want to catch the semis and finals, then fly in the Nats, 

with hopes that some of the worlds pilots would stay and fly our Nats!

 

Rex
 
> From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Wed, 2 Sep 2009 15:53:37 -0700
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .. .
> 
> One of the main reasons I feel that the WC's should be in September. 
> Holding the Nats after the WC's will cause a very large reduction in 
> attendance.
> 
> Tony
> 
> 
> On Sep 2, 2009, at 2:50 PM, John Fuqua wrote:
> 
> > Hate to point out that schools start up in August these days, some 
> > earlier
> > some later. In Florida its mid August. If you push the Nats to 
> > that time
> > frame or later you WILL impact participation.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Derek
> > Koopowitz
> > Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 4:47 PM
> > To: General pattern discussion
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at 
> > Muncie . . ..
> > .
> >
> > Nothing firm has been decided at this point - all I know is that it 
> > will be
> > held after the world champs. The wc dates are not firm either in 
> > that my
> > preference would be to start the prelims on Sunday July 31st and end 
> > on Sat.
> > August 6th with the pattern Nats starting on Monday August 8th and 
> > finishing
> > on Friday August 12th - these are the dates that I will be going to 
> > the AMA
> > with in hopes that we can use them.
> >
> > We tentatively published dates for the worlds to the CIAM as 
> > starting on
> > July 27th (prelims) and finishing on August 2nd - this was based on 
> > dates
> > that I was given by the AMA - it doesn't make sense to start/end in 
> > the
> > middle of a week.
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:18 PM, Anthony Frackowiak
> > <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> >
> >
> > But I would hope that there has been some discussion about when to
> > hold the 2011 Nats? Or has it not been considered? If it has been 
> > discussed,
> > what are the planned dates for the Nats?
> >
> > Tony
> >
> > 
> > 
> > On Sep 2, 2009, at 1:43 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
> >
> >
> > We won't know the schedule for the Nats until Oct. next year
> > - that is when the 2011 planning meeting will be held.
> > 
> > 
> > On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 1:05 PM, Anthony Frackowiak
> > <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> > 
> >
> > What is the proposed schedule for the 2011 Nats?
> >
> > Tony
> >
> > On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:20 AM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
> >
> >
> > This would mean double travel expense for
> > many people that would potentially work at the event and compete at 
> > the
> > Nats. Coming early to watch the semis and finals means arriving 3 
> > days
> > before the Nats... most Nats competitors arrive 1 to 2 days before 
> > the Nats
> > anyway and practice at local sites so they'd be around to watch the 
> > most
> > important flying part of the WC's anyway.
> > 
> > 
> > On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Anthony
> > Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> > 
> >
> > I sincerely hope that this idea is
> > changed. Moving the Nats after the World Championships will greatly 
> > reduce
> > the attendance at the Nats. I think it would be better to schedule the
> > Worlds in September.
> >
> > Tony
> >
> >
> > On Sep 1, 2009, at 7:03 PM, Derek
> > Koopowitz wrote:
> >
> >
> > 
> > That is correct. come and
> > see the semis and finals of the Worlds and then stay and compete in 
> > the
> > pattern Nats. the idea is that we can hopefully entice some of the 
> > world's
> > competitors to fly in our Nationals as well.
> > 
> > 
> > From:
> > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob 
> > Kane
> > Sent: Tuesday, September 01,
> > 2009 6:27 PM
> > To: General pattern
> > discussion
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . ..
> > 
> > I also heard the pattern
> > NATS will be held after the Worlds?
> > 
> > Bob Kane
> > getterflash at yahoo.com
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ________________________________
> >
> > From: Derek Koopowitz
> > <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> > To: General pattern
> > discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > Sent: Monday, August 31,
> > 2009 4:07:33 PM
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . ..
> > Tentative schedule is as
> > follows:
> > 
> >
> > * Monday July 25th
> > 2011 Processing and Official Practice Day
> > * Tuesday July 26th
> > 2011 Opening Ceremony and Official Practice Day
> > * Wednesday July 27th
> > 2011 Preliminaries Day 1
> > * Thursday July 28th
> > 2011 Preliminaries Day 2
> > * Friday July 29th
> > 2011 Preliminaries Day 3
> > * Saturday July 30th
> > 2011 Preliminaries Day 4
> > * Sunday July 31st
> > 2011 Reserved for preliminaries if necessary
> > * Monday August 1st
> > 2011 Semi-Finals
> > * Tuesday August 2nd
> > 2011 Finals and Closing Ceremony and Banquet
> > * Wednesday August 3rd
> > 2011 Departure of Contestants
> >
> > 
> > On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at
> > 12:21 PM, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:
> > . . . . . . do we know
> > the dates yet?
> > 
> > Bob Kane
> > getterflash at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing
> > list
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing
> > list
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >
> >
> >
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> >
> >
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Wed Sep  2 15:25:01 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 23:25:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909021615g1c0f5af5wfa4d9581a1abfe07@mail.gmail.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>
	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net> <4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>
	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
	<010f01ca2c1f$ddfd6520$99f82f60$@net>
	<402F958A-515B-4402-A926-B7E4515D085F@sbcglobal.net>
	<4A9EF925.9060609@cox.net>
	<A6727037-B363-4ED4-B71C-E2337FC3D8CC@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021615g1c0f5af5wfa4d9581a1abfe07@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1D219BBB-C52F-4C3D-84BD-C081407BFD2E@sbcglobal.net>

No it has not been worked out. You are saying your dates for the WC  
are fluid, and the dates for the 2011 Nats are not set even  
tentatively. So there is a lot in the air.

Tony

On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:15 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> Actually it had been all worked out until "everyone" started chiming  
> in as to their preference for when the wc should be held and the  
> Nats should be held... can't please all the people.
>
> LOL
>
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:07 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net 
> > wrote:
> I absolutely agree. IRCHA will not move their dates unless forced to  
> by the AMA. And I doubt the AMA will do so.
>
> I find it hard to believe that this has not been worked out yet.
>
> Tony
>
> On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:00 PM, Bill's Email wrote:
>
>> Anthony Frackowiak wrote:
>>>
>>> Archie is absolutely correct.
>>>
>>> Tony
>>>
>>> On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford wrote:
>>>
>>>> IRCHA is a totally different animal though.  Kind of like having  
>>>> Joe Nall after the pattern worlds.  I?d say most people really  
>>>> didn?t care about the F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D stuff.
>>
>>
>> And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to an event  
>> is going to give them some clout when it comes to a schedule  
>> relative to the pattern NATS. The WC are a different thing, but  
>> IRCHA is not likely to budge for the pattern NATS if it came to that.
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Wed Sep  2 15:44:08 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 23:44:08 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <1D219BBB-C52F-4C3D-84BD-C081407BFD2E@sbcglobal.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net> <4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>
	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
	<010f01ca2c1f$ddfd6520$99f82f60$@net>
	<402F958A-515B-4402-A926-B7E4515D085F@sbcglobal.net>
	<4A9EF925.9060609@cox.net>
	<A6727037-B363-4ED4-B71C-E2337FC3D8CC@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021615g1c0f5af5wfa4d9581a1abfe07@mail.gmail.com>
	<1D219BBB-C52F-4C3D-84BD-C081407BFD2E@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <3454543c0909021644r67e66f23t2cc8260da907799c@mail.gmail.com>

Fluid meaning that the dates could move a few days forward or backward...
yes, absolutely.

Cast in concrete - when the 1st bulletin gets mailed out.

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:24 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net
> wrote:

> No it has not been worked out. You are saying your dates for the WC are
> fluid, and the dates for the 2011 Nats are not set even tentatively. So
> there is a lot in the air.
> Tony
>
>  On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:15 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
>  Actually it had been all worked out until "everyone" started chiming in
> as to their preference for when the wc should be held and the Nats should be
> held... can't please all the people.
>
> LOL
>
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:07 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <
> frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>> I absolutely agree. IRCHA will not move their dates unless forced to by
>> the AMA. And I doubt the AMA will do so.
>> I find it hard to believe that this has not been worked out yet.
>>
>> Tony
>>
>>   On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:00 PM, Bill's Email wrote:
>>
>>   Anthony Frackowiak wrote:
>>
>> Archie is absolutely correct.
>> Tony
>>
>>  On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford wrote:
>>
>>   IRCHA is a totally different animal though.  Kind of like having Joe
>> Nall after the pattern worlds.  I?d say most people really didn?t care about
>> the F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D stuff.
>>
>>
>>
>> And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to an event is
>> going to give them some clout when it comes to a schedule relative to the
>> pattern NATS. The WC are a different thing, but IRCHA is not likely to budge
>> for the pattern NATS if it came to that.
>>
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Wed Sep  2 17:07:40 2009
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 01:07:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909021644r67e66f23t2cc8260da907799c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net> <4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>
	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
	<010f01ca2c1f$ddfd6520$99f82f60$@net>
	<402F958A-515B-4402-A926-B7E4515D085F@sbcglobal.net>
	<4A9EF925.9060609@cox.net>
	<A6727037-B363-4ED4-B71C-E2337FC3D8CC@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021615g1c0f5af5wfa4d9581a1abfe07@mail.gmail.com>
	<1D219BBB-C52F-4C3D-84BD-C081407BFD2E@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021644r67e66f23t2cc8260da907799c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <277374.87592.qm@web33002.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Derek, 

I think it's a GREAT idea to have them in the order that you are submitting them. It is the only way I could attend both. I will attend the nats if it is done this way. If not, probably just the worlds. I can go to the nats any year, but not the worlds. Will be a new "learning" experience for me getting to watch how the best of all countries fly their sequences, and should make me a better pilot IMO. 

If I can't fly by the time I get to the nats, I won't learn it at the practice field anyway. Plus, we still will have our practice fields from Thursday on of the previous week (which is no different than any year), which is when some of us get there. Most I think get there on Saturday or Sunday. Not sure why some think it's a problem with practice fields. 

I can see the school part of this being an issue for some of the younger competitors, but my daughter started school a few weeks ago, attended the first week, then we were on vacation for the second week, she was back the third week. It wasn't a problem at all. 


 Thanks for putting this together so that we can host the world championship! I can't hardly wait to go! 



Chris 
 
 
 




________________________________
From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 2, 2009 4:44:07 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .


Fluid meaning that the dates could move a few days forward or backward... yes, absolutely.
 
Cast in concrete - when the 1st bulletin gets mailed out.


On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:24 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:

No it has not been worked out. You are saying your dates for the WC are fluid, and the dates for the 2011 Nats are not set even tentatively. So there is a lot in the air. 
>
>
>
>Tony
>
>
>On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:15 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
>Actually it had been all worked out until "everyone" started chiming in as to their preference for when the wc should be held and the Nats should be held... can't please all the people.
>> 
>>LOL
>>
>>
>>On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:07 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>
>>I absolutely agree. IRCHA will not move their dates unless forced to by the AMA. And I doubt the AMA will do so. 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>I find it hard to believe that this has not been worked out yet. 
>>>
>>>
>>>Tony
>>>
>>>
>>>On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:00 PM, Bill's Email wrote:
>>>
>>>Anthony Frackowiak wrote: 
>>>>
>>>>Archie is absolutely correct.  
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Tony
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>IRCHA is a totally different animal though.  Kind of like having Joe Nall after the pattern worlds.  I?d say most people really didn?t care about the F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D stuff.   
>>>>
>>>>And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to an event is going to give them some clout when it comes to a schedule relative to the pattern NATS. The WC are a different thing, but IRCHA is not likely to budge for the pattern NATS if it came to that.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>



      
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From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Wed Sep  2 17:25:47 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 01:25:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <277374.87592.qm@web33002.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net> <4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>
	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
	<010f01ca2c1f$ddfd6520$99f82f60$@net>
	<402F958A-515B-4402-A926-B7E4515D085F@sbcglobal.net>
	<4A9EF925.9060609@cox.net>
	<A6727037-B363-4ED4-B71C-E2337FC3D8CC@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021615g1c0f5af5wfa4d9581a1abfe07@mail.gmail.com>
	<1D219BBB-C52F-4C3D-84BD-C081407BFD2E@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021644r67e66f23t2cc8260da907799c@mail.gmail.com>
	<277374.87592.qm@web33002.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <96EE548D-B1B5-4AE1-87E0-8072D3B0C94E@sbcglobal.net>

Practice fields near the site will be a problem at least until the  
finals day. In the semi-finals you will have thirty or so WC fliers  
wanting to get in practice on that day off before the semi's are  
flown. Even worse will be trying to get a motel room before the WC's  
end.

I still don't see why September is not better. I just looked at the  
AMA site schedule for this month this year and there is very little  
going on. If held in September you could probably have several  
practice sites right at AMA.

Tony


On Sep 2, 2009, at 6:07 PM, krishlan fitzsimmons wrote:

> Derek,
>
> I think it's a GREAT idea to have them in the order that you are  
> submitting them. It is the only way I could attend both. I will  
> attend the nats if it is done this way. If not, probably just the  
> worlds. I can go to the nats any year, but not the worlds. Will be a  
> new "learning" experience for me getting to watch how the best of  
> all countries fly their sequences, and should make me a better pilot  
> IMO.
>
> If I can't fly by the time I get to the nats, I won't learn it at  
> the practice field anyway. Plus, we still will have our practice  
> fields from Thursday on of the previous week (which is no different  
> than any year), which is when some of us get there. Most I think get  
> there on Saturday or Sunday. Not sure why some think it's a problem  
> with practice fields.
>
> I can see the school part of this being an issue for some of the  
> younger competitors, but my daughter started school a few weeks ago,  
> attended the first week, then we were on vacation for the second  
> week, she was back the third week. It wasn't a problem at all.
>
>  Thanks for putting this together so that we can host the world  
> championship! I can't hardly wait to go!
>
>
> Chris
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 2, 2009 4:44:07 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
> Fluid meaning that the dates could move a few days forward or  
> backward... yes, absolutely.
>
> Cast in concrete - when the 1st bulletin gets mailed out.
>
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:24 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net 
> > wrote:
> No it has not been worked out. You are saying your dates for the WC  
> are fluid, and the dates for the 2011 Nats are not set even  
> tentatively. So there is a lot in the air.
>
> Tony
>
> On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:15 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
>> Actually it had been all worked out until "everyone" started  
>> chiming in as to their preference for when the wc should be held  
>> and the Nats should be held... can't please all the people.
>>
>> LOL
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:07 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net 
>> > wrote:
>> I absolutely agree. IRCHA will not move their dates unless forced  
>> to by the AMA. And I doubt the AMA will do so.
>>
>> I find it hard to believe that this has not been worked out yet.
>>
>> Tony
>>
>> On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:00 PM, Bill's Email wrote:
>>
>>> Anthony Frackowiak wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Archie is absolutely correct.
>>>>
>>>> Tony
>>>>
>>>> On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> IRCHA is a totally different animal though.  Kind of like having  
>>>>> Joe Nall after the pattern worlds.  I?d say most people really  
>>>>> didn?t care about the F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D stuff.
>>>
>>>
>>> And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to an event  
>>> is going to give them some clout when it comes to a schedule  
>>> relative to the pattern NATS. The WC are a different thing, but  
>>> IRCHA is not likely to budge for the pattern NATS if it came to  
>>> that.
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From frankjuliei at comcast.net  Wed Sep  2 17:44:41 2009
From: frankjuliei at comcast.net (frank)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 01:44:41 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Falcon Hobbies- NACA DUCT
Message-ID: <9BA5B7D5069C4118A395008112075A1B@FMILaptop>

Hey All.

The old Falcon Hobbies ( Canada ) used to carry small NACA Ducts. I've heard
they're out of business. Anyone have another source for these or want to
part with theirs?

Frank

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From chuenkan at comcast.net  Wed Sep  2 17:49:12 2009
From: chuenkan at comcast.net (Phil Spelt)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 01:49:12 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Falcon Hobbies- NACA DUCT
In-Reply-To: <9BA5B7D5069C4118A395008112075A1B@FMILaptop>
References: <9BA5B7D5069C4118A395008112075A1B@FMILaptop>
Message-ID: <20090903014912.33AC9115A2@bridi.netexpress.com>

At one point several years ago, Falcon linked up with MidWest Hobbies 
in northern Indiana -- I assume it's the same Falcon Hobbies??  You 
might try there...

At 09:44 PM 9/2/2009, you wrote:
>Hey All.
>The old Falcon Hobbies ( Canada ) used to carry small NACA Ducts. 
>I've heard they're out of business. Anyone have another source for 
>these or want to part with theirs?
>Frank
>_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

-->There are only two types of aircraft -- fighters and targets.

Phil Spelt, Webmaster & Past President, Knox County Radio Control Society, Inc.
        URL: http://www.kcrctn.com
AMA--1294,  Scientific Leader Member, SPA--177
       My URL: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/~chuenkan/
       (865) 435-1476 v  (865) 604-0541 c  
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From frankjuliei at comcast.net  Wed Sep  2 18:12:12 2009
From: frankjuliei at comcast.net (frank)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 02:12:12 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Falcon Hobbies- NACA DUCT
In-Reply-To: <20090903014912.33AC9115A2@bridi.netexpress.com>
References: <9BA5B7D5069C4118A395008112075A1B@FMILaptop>
	<20090903014912.33AC9115A2@bridi.netexpress.com>
Message-ID: <B0915C3C9AAA4F019D2D95F20D353FA1@FMILaptop>

Phil,

Found  a Midwest Hobbies in Elkhart. Think that is same one ?

 

Thanks

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Phil Spelt
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 9:49 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Falcon Hobbies- NACA DUCT

 

At one point several years ago, Falcon linked up with MidWest Hobbies in
northern Indiana -- I assume it's the same Falcon Hobbies??  You might try
there...

At 09:44 PM 9/2/2009, you wrote:



Hey All.
The old Falcon Hobbies ( Canada ) used to carry small NACA Ducts. Ive heard
theyre out of business. Anyone have another source for these or want to
part with theirs?
Frank
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

--> There are only two types of aircraft -- fighters and targets.

Phil Spelt, Webmaster & Past President, Knox County Radio Control Society,
Inc.
       URL: http://www.kcrctn.com <http://www.kcrctn.com/> 
AMA--1294,  Scientific Leader Member, SPA--177
      My URL: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/~chuenkan/
      (865) 435-1476 v  (865) 604-0541 c 

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From chuenkan at comcast.net  Wed Sep  2 18:26:50 2009
From: chuenkan at comcast.net (Phil Spelt)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 02:26:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Falcon Hobbies- NACA DUCT
In-Reply-To: <B0915C3C9AAA4F019D2D95F20D353FA1@FMILaptop>
References: <9BA5B7D5069C4118A395008112075A1B@FMILaptop>
	<20090903014912.33AC9115A2@bridi.netexpress.com>
	<B0915C3C9AAA4F019D2D95F20D353FA1@FMILaptop>
Message-ID: <20090903022650.56051115B1@bridi.netexpress.com>

Yep, that's the one...don't know whether Falcon is still part of 
them, or if it is the same "Falcon", but they used to import a line 
of very nice Italian molded plastic planes.  I'm still flying a 
Cessna 177 of theirs on floats -- pretty plane and very durable!!

At 10:12 PM 9/2/2009, you wrote:
>Phil,
>Found  a Midwest Hobbies in Elkhart. Think that is same one ?
>
>Thanks
>
>
>----------
>From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
>[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Phil Spelt
>Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 9:49 PM
>To: General pattern discussion
>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Falcon Hobbies- NACA DUCT
>
>At one point several years ago, Falcon linked up with MidWest 
>Hobbies in northern Indiana -- I assume it's the same Falcon 
>Hobbies??  You might try there...
>
>At 09:44 PM 9/2/2009, you wrote:
>
>Hey All.
>The old Falcon Hobbies ( Canada ) used to carry small NACA Ducts. 
>Ive heard theyre out of business. Anyone have another source for 
>these or want to part with theirs?
>Frank
>_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>--> There are only two types of aircraft -- fighters and targets.
>
>Phil Spelt, Webmaster & Past President, Knox County Radio Control 
>Society, Inc.
>        URL: http://www.kcrctn.com
>AMA--1294,  Scientific Leader Member, SPA--177
>       My URL: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/~chuenkan/
>       (865) 435-1476 v  (865) 604-0541 c
>_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

-->There are only two types of aircraft -- fighters and targets.

Phil Spelt, Webmaster & Past President, Knox County Radio Control Society, Inc.
        URL: http://www.kcrctn.com
AMA--1294,  Scientific Leader Member, SPA--177
       My URL: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/~chuenkan/
       (865) 435-1476 v  (865) 604-0541 c  
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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Wed Sep  2 18:43:33 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 02:43:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Used Pattern plane???
Message-ID: <009101ca2c40$509b13f0$f1d13bd0$@com>

 

 

From: nsrca-webteam-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-webteam-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Rene Grebe
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 1:38 PM
To: nsrca-webteam at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: [NSRCA-webteam] Used Pattern plane???

 

Hi All,
I'm an old member (and I mean really old) from the group on Distric 7
Pattern Animals. I have been out of pattern for almost 20 years and moved to
the Austin, Texas area. I visited the Nats in Muncie and the bug have bit me
again. I'm interested in buying an electric pattern a/c new or used.
Any offers, suggestions or comments will be promptly answered.
Thanks

Ren? Grebe
renegrebe39 at gmail.com
512/330-4485(H)  626/991-0842(C)

 


Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving
safely
in an attractive and well preserve body, but rather to skip in sideways,
body
thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming 'Woo Hoo, what a ride!!!.

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From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Wed Sep  2 19:32:40 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 03:32:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909021644r67e66f23t2cc8260da907799c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net> <4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>
	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
	<010f01ca2c1f$ddfd6520$99f82f60$@net>
	<402F958A-515B-4402-A926-B7E4515D085F@sbcglobal.net>
	<4A9EF925.9060609@cox.net>
	<A6727037-B363-4ED4-B71C-E2337FC3D8CC@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021615g1c0f5af5wfa4d9581a1abfe07@mail.gmail.com>
	<1D219BBB-C52F-4C3D-84BD-C081407BFD2E@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021644r67e66f23t2cc8260da907799c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <710413B9-487B-476F-B267-BF387DC2DB60@sbcglobal.net>

Derek,

Maybe I'm coming in late to this discussion, and for that I apologize.  
But I would like to ask a few more questions just for clarification.

You have stated before that the Pattern Nats for 2011 won't be  
scheduled until October of 2010. Has there been any serious discussion  
with the AMA about the 2011 Pattern Nats and if it will even be  
possible to do what you are stating? Can they can even be held after  
the WC? It would seem that this will take a monumental shift in the  
Center schedule.

Are the dates that you have put out for the WC's the only alternative  
right now? Do we even have the option of moving them later?

Thanks for your reply!

Tony


On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:44 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> Fluid meaning that the dates could move a few days forward or  
> backward... yes, absolutely.
>
> Cast in concrete - when the 1st bulletin gets mailed out.
>
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:24 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net 
> > wrote:
> No it has not been worked out. You are saying your dates for the WC  
> are fluid, and the dates for the 2011 Nats are not set even  
> tentatively. So there is a lot in the air.
>
> Tony
>
> On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:15 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
>> Actually it had been all worked out until "everyone" started  
>> chiming in as to their preference for when the wc should be held  
>> and the Nats should be held... can't please all the people.
>>
>> LOL
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:07 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net 
>> > wrote:
>> I absolutely agree. IRCHA will not move their dates unless forced  
>> to by the AMA. And I doubt the AMA will do so.
>>
>> I find it hard to believe that this has not been worked out yet.
>>
>> Tony
>>
>> On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:00 PM, Bill's Email wrote:
>>
>>> Anthony Frackowiak wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Archie is absolutely correct.
>>>>
>>>> Tony
>>>>
>>>> On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> IRCHA is a totally different animal though.  Kind of like having  
>>>>> Joe Nall after the pattern worlds.  I?d say most people really  
>>>>> didn?t care about the F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D stuff.
>>>
>>>
>>> And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to an event  
>>> is going to give them some clout when it comes to a schedule  
>>> relative to the pattern NATS. The WC are a different thing, but  
>>> IRCHA is not likely to budge for the pattern NATS if it came to  
>>> that.
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Wed Sep  2 19:43:02 2009
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 03:43:02 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Used Pattern plane???
In-Reply-To: <009101ca2c40$509b13f0$f1d13bd0$@com>
References: <009101ca2c40$509b13f0$f1d13bd0$@com>
Message-ID: <739225.29276.qm@web33006.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Rene, 

You probably don't remember me, but I was sitting with Rusty Fried when you chatted with him. I am the Kfactor editor, maybe that will ring a bell as we chatted about it. Anyway, it was a pleasure chatting with you there. I hope someone can help you out with a good plane!

 
Chris 
 
 
 




________________________________
From: Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 2, 2009 7:43:23 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Used Pattern plane???

 
 
 
From:nsrca-webteam-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-webteam-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Rene Grebe
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 1:38 PM
To: nsrca-webteam at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: [NSRCA-webteam] Used Pattern plane???
 
Hi All,
I'm an old member (and I mean really old) from the group on Distric 7 Pattern
Animals. I have been out of pattern for almost 20 years and moved to the
Austin, Texas area. I visited the Nats in Muncie and the bug have bit me again.
I'm interested in buying an electric pattern a/c new or used.
Any offers, suggestions or comments will be promptly answered.
Thanks

Ren? Grebe
renegrebe39 at gmail.com
512/330-4485(H)  626/991-0842(C)
 

Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely
in an attractive and well preserve body, but rather to skip in sideways, body
thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming 'Woo Hoo, what a ride!!!.


      
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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Wed Sep  2 19:58:23 2009
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 03:58:23 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <710413B9-487B-476F-B267-BF387DC2DB60@sbcglobal.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net> <4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>
	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
	<010f01ca2c1f$ddfd6520$99f82f60$@net>
	<402F958A-515B-4402-A926-B7E4515D085F@sbcglobal.net>
	<4A9EF925.9060609@cox.net>
	<A6727037-B363-4ED4-B71C-E2337FC3D8CC@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021615g1c0f5af5wfa4d9581a1abfe07@mail.gmail.com>
	<1D219BBB-C52F-4C3D-84BD-C081407BFD2E@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021644r67e66f23t2cc8260da907799c@mail.gmail.com>
	<710413B9-487B-476F-B267-BF387DC2DB60@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <255182.36322.qm@web33006.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Tony, 

This has been discussed quite a bit previous to this conversation on the officers list quite some time ago. Derek has done a huge amount of work to make this happen as you must know. I believe it had been discussed with the ama, and therefore the reason for the rough dates that we have. I could be wrong, but this is my recollection. 

I know it seems odd to you, as it did me at first, but I haven't been on the team before as you, nor have I ever had the chance to witness a "Worlds" as you have. This is my chance to see it. If it's right before the nats, that's great timing for me. And many that were asked, feel this way. 

It is wished by many of us that the nats date didn't have to be moved, but soaring could move up a week, and so on to make room for the worlds. The nats will be poorly attended if the two are separated IMO. A lot of people may want to see the worlds competition.  If they are separated, not many of us will be able to attend. Just my opinion though. Not discounting yours. I agree with you about it being hard to find a hotel, but I don't think any of the competitors will stick around for a local nats as they just flew the worlds. I would think our own worlds team may not attend the nats right after. Maybe the current team could chime in if they read this to say if they would have stuck around for a local nats in Portugal the week after the worlds. 

Think about a rotating nats. If it was held somewhere else in the country, the dates would most likely vary up to a month either way. 

Not arguing with you here. This is said in a calm tone. Just conversing. 

You coming to Hollister?

 
Chris 
 
 
 




________________________________
From: Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 2, 2009 8:32:37 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .

Derek,

Maybe I'm coming in late to this discussion, and for that I apologize. But I would like to ask a few more questions just for clarification. 

You have stated before that the Pattern Nats for 2011 won't be scheduled until October of 2010. Has there been any serious discussion with the AMA about the 2011 Pattern Nats and if it will even be possible to do what you are stating? Can they can even be held after the WC? It would seem that this will take a monumental shift in the Center schedule.

Are the dates that you have put out for the WC's the only alternative right now? Do we even have the option of moving them later?

Thanks for your reply!

Tony



On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:44 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

Fluid meaning that the dates could move a few days forward or backward... yes, absolutely.
> 
>Cast in concrete - when the 1st bulletin gets mailed out.
>
>
>On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:24 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>No it has not been worked out. You are saying your dates for the WC are fluid, and the dates for the 2011 Nats are not set even tentatively. So there is a lot in the air. 
>>
>>
>>Tony
>>
>>
>>On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:15 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>>
>>Actually it had been all worked out until "everyone" started chiming in as to their preference for when the wc should be held and the Nats should be held... can't please all the people.
>>> 
>>>LOL
>>>
>>>
>>>On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:07 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>I absolutely agree. IRCHA will not move their dates unless forced to by the AMA. And I doubt the AMA will do so. 
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I find it hard to believe that this has not been worked out yet. 
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Tony
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:00 PM, Bill's Email wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Anthony Frackowiak wrote: 
>>>>>Archie is absolutely correct.  
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Tony
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>IRCHA is a totally different animal though.  Kind of like having Joe Nall after the pattern worlds.  I?d say most people really didn?t care about the F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D stuff.   
>>>>>
>>>>>And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to an event is going to give them some clout when it comes to a schedule relative to the pattern NATS. The WC are a different thing, but IRCHA is not likely to budge for the pattern NATS if it came to that.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



      
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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Wed Sep  2 20:18:52 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 04:18:52 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <710413B9-487B-476F-B267-BF387DC2DB60@sbcglobal.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net>
	<4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>	<010f01ca2c1f$ddfd6520$99f82f60$@net>	<402F958A-515B-4402-A926-B7E4515D085F@sbcglobal.net>	<4A9EF925.9060609@cox.net>	<A6727037-B363-4ED4-B71C-E2337FC3D8CC@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021615g1c0f5af5wfa4d9581a1abfe07@mail.gmail.com>	<1D219BBB-C52F-4C3D-84BD-C081407BFD2E@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021644r67e66f23t2cc8260da907799c@mail.gmail.com>
	<710413B9-487B-476F-B267-BF387DC2DB60@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <001a01ca2c4d$a038ee70$e0aacb50$@com>

I love the questions - it gives us all a chance to fully understand what is
going on.

 

At the 2008 Nats I had a discussion with the AMA about the WC's and when
would be the best time to do it.  Several suggestions were made as to timing
but one of them (the current one of having the WC's at the end of the Nats
followed by the pattern Nats) made the best since logistically as well as
with timing on getting the facility.  Several different options of where to
put the WC's were considered and we finally settled on the "current" set of
dates as a place holder.

 

These dates were run by a number of people and everyone was in agreement,
including the CIAM, as to whether it would be feasible to host the event
during this time period.  The more people we talked to, and by fully
explaining the reasoning to them, the more they liked it.  We haven't been
operating in a vacuum with this - full cooperation with the AMA and the CIAM
has been done on this.  One can't do this without either party and I
definitely would be foolish to come up with dates without ensuring that the
AMA and the CIAM have bought into them.

 

Officially, the pattern Nats won't be scheduled until the planning meeting
next year - just like all events are scheduled each year at this planning
meeting.

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony
Frackowiak
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 8:33 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

 

Derek,

 

Maybe I'm coming in late to this discussion, and for that I apologize. But I
would like to ask a few more questions just for clarification. 

 

You have stated before that the Pattern Nats for 2011 won't be scheduled
until October of 2010. Has there been any serious discussion with the AMA
about the 2011 Pattern Nats and if it will even be possible to do what you
are stating? Can they can even be held after the WC? It would seem that this
will take a monumental shift in the Center schedule.

 

Are the dates that you have put out for the WC's the only alternative right
now? Do we even have the option of moving them later?

 

Thanks for your reply!

 

Tony

 

 

On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:44 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:





Fluid meaning that the dates could move a few days forward or backward...
yes, absolutely.

 

Cast in concrete - when the 1st bulletin gets mailed out.

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:24 PM, Anthony Frackowiak
<frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:

No it has not been worked out. You are saying your dates for the WC are
fluid, and the dates for the 2011 Nats are not set even tentatively. So
there is a lot in the air. 

 

Tony

 

On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:15 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

 

Actually it had been all worked out until "everyone" started chiming in as
to their preference for when the wc should be held and the Nats should be
held... can't please all the people.

 

LOL

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:07 PM, Anthony Frackowiak
<frackowiak at sbcglobal.net> wrote:

I absolutely agree. IRCHA will not move their dates unless forced to by the
AMA. And I doubt the AMA will do so. 

 

I find it hard to believe that this has not been worked out yet. 

 

Tony

 

On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:00 PM, Bill's Email wrote:

 

Anthony Frackowiak wrote: 

Archie is absolutely correct.  

 

Tony

 

On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford wrote:





IRCHA is a totally different animal though.  Kind of like having Joe Nall
after the pattern worlds.  I'd say most people really didn't care about the
F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D stuff.   



And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to an event is going
to give them some clout when it comes to a schedule relative to the pattern
NATS. The WC are a different thing, but IRCHA is not likely to budge for the
pattern NATS if it came to that.



_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

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From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Wed Sep  2 20:53:56 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 04:53:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <255182.36322.qm@web33006.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net> <4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>
	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
	<010f01ca2c1f$ddfd6520$99f82f60$@net>
	<402F958A-515B-4402-A926-B7E4515D085F@sbcglobal.net>
	<4A9EF925.9060609@cox.net>
	<A6727037-B363-4ED4-B71C-E2337FC3D8CC@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021615g1c0f5af5wfa4d9581a1abfe07@mail.gmail.com>
	<1D219BBB-C52F-4C3D-84BD-C081407BFD2E@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021644r67e66f23t2cc8260da907799c@mail.gmail.com>
	<710413B9-487B-476F-B267-BF387DC2DB60@sbcglobal.net>
	<255182.36322.qm@web33006.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <25CFF61F-D5DA-4A80-931B-511D2A349B8D@sbcglobal.net>

OK. I'm outta here. It has been decided and I wish the best for both  
the WC and the Pattern Nats!

Tony

On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:58 PM, krishlan fitzsimmons wrote:

> Tony,
>
> This has been discussed quite a bit previous to this conversation on  
> the officers list quite some time ago. Derek has done a huge amount  
> of work to make this happen as you must know. I believe it had been  
> discussed with the ama, and therefore the reason for the rough dates  
> that we have. I could be wrong, but this is my recollection.
>
> I know it seems odd to you, as it did me at first, but I haven't  
> been on the team before as you, nor have I ever had the chance to  
> witness a "Worlds" as you have. This is my chance to see it. If it's  
> right before the nats, that's great timing for me. And many that  
> were asked, feel this way.
>
> It is wished by many of us that the nats date didn't have to be  
> moved, but soaring could move up a week, and so on to make room for  
> the worlds. The nats will be poorly attended if the two are  
> separated IMO. A lot of people may want to see the worlds  
> competition.  If they are separated, not many of us will be able to  
> attend. Just my opinion though. Not discounting yours. I agree with  
> you about it being hard to find a hotel, but I don't think any of  
> the competitors will stick around for a local nats as they just flew  
> the worlds. I would think our own worlds team may not attend the  
> nats right after. Maybe the current team could chime in if they read  
> this to say if they would have stuck around for a local nats in  
> Portugal the week after the worlds.
>
> Think about a rotating nats. If it was held somewhere else in the  
> country, the dates would most likely vary up to a month either way.
>
> Not arguing with you here. This is said in a calm tone. Just  
> conversing.
>
> You coming to Hollister?
>
> Chris
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 2, 2009 8:32:37 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
> Derek,
>
> Maybe I'm coming in late to this discussion, and for that I  
> apologize. But I would like to ask a few more questions just for  
> clarification.
>
> You have stated before that the Pattern Nats for 2011 won't be  
> scheduled until October of 2010. Has there been any serious  
> discussion with the AMA about the 2011 Pattern Nats and if it will  
> even be possible to do what you are stating? Can they can even be  
> held after the WC? It would seem that this will take a monumental  
> shift in the Center schedule.
>
> Are the dates that you have put out for the WC's the only  
> alternative right now? Do we even have the option of moving them  
> later?
>
> Thanks for your reply!
>
> Tony
>
>
> On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:44 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
>> Fluid meaning that the dates could move a few days forward or  
>> backward... yes, absolutely.
>>
>> Cast in concrete - when the 1st bulletin gets mailed out.
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:24 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net 
>> > wrote:
>> No it has not been worked out. You are saying your dates for the WC  
>> are fluid, and the dates for the 2011 Nats are not set even  
>> tentatively. So there is a lot in the air.
>>
>> Tony
>>
>> On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:15 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>>
>>> Actually it had been all worked out until "everyone" started  
>>> chiming in as to their preference for when the wc should be held  
>>> and the Nats should be held... can't please all the people.
>>>
>>> LOL
>>>
>>> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:07 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net 
>>> > wrote:
>>> I absolutely agree. IRCHA will not move their dates unless forced  
>>> to by the AMA. And I doubt the AMA will do so.
>>>
>>> I find it hard to believe that this has not been worked out yet.
>>>
>>> Tony
>>>
>>> On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:00 PM, Bill's Email wrote:
>>>
>>>> Anthony Frackowiak wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Archie is absolutely correct.
>>>>>
>>>>> Tony
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> IRCHA is a totally different animal though.  Kind of like  
>>>>>> having Joe Nall after the pattern worlds.  I?d say most people  
>>>>>> really didn?t care about the F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more  
>>>>>> 3D stuff.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to an  
>>>> event is going to give them some clout when it comes to a  
>>>> schedule relative to the pattern NATS. The WC are a different  
>>>> thing, but IRCHA is not likely to budge for the pattern NATS if  
>>>> it came to that.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Thu Sep  3 05:47:40 2009
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 13:47:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <255182.36322.qm@web33006.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <323827.63437.qm@web51003.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

 Hey guys just a chime in and a perspective.
 I first heard about the proposed dates at the NSRCA officers meeting held at the Nats. 
 My initial reaction was how cool it will be that we will have 2 events back to back and what a privilege it is to host the worlds.
 I know that Derek has been busting his tail and doing his homework to get this done so I support him.
 So after some thought I've come to the conclusion that this is a pretty workable solution if all the logistics can be worked out with the AMA and event conflicts. 
 To the best of my knowledge there have been talks with Don Cherry of the AMA and I think for the most part the preliminary schedule is pretty close to what's going to happen.
 Someone had to take the ball here and make some decisions. I'm thinking that this is Derek's and the AMA's plan. Question is what would you have done if you were the leader of our organization?
 I think it was Doug who made the statement that the Worlds are a priority.
 He's right to a degree. We have been chosen to host the best flyers in the world and this has to be #1 on the list of things to accomplish in 2011. I will re access my personal needs and align myself with the task at hand. If I get lucky I get to do both the end of the worlds and compete in the Nats. Time and personal situations will dictate.
 Will the worlds hurt the Nats? Probably. Will finding volunteers be difficult? No doubt. Can we do it all? I'm pretty confident but it won't be easy and we need people to be understanding and flexable.
 I can't wait to see CLPR for myself.
 Thanks for letting me air my thoughts. Mike Mueller D5VP

--- On Wed, 9/2/09, krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com> wrote:

> From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Wednesday, September 2, 2009, 10:58 PM
> Tony, 
> 
> This has been discussed quite a bit previous to this
> conversation on the officers list quite some time ago. Derek
> has done a huge amount of work to make this happen as you
> must know. I believe it had been discussed with the ama, and
> therefore the reason for the rough dates that we have. I
> could be wrong, but this is my recollection. 
> 
> I know it seems odd to you, as it did me at first, but I
> haven't been on the team before as you, nor have I ever
> had the chance to witness a "Worlds" as you have.
> This is my chance to see it. If it's right before the
> nats, that's great timing for me. And many that were
> asked, feel this way. 
> 
> It is wished by many of us that the nats date didn't
> have to be moved, but soaring could move up a week, and so
> on to make room for the worlds. The nats
>  will be poorly attended if the two are separated IMO. A
> lot of people may want to see the worlds competition.?
> If they are separated, not many of us will be able to
> attend. Just my opinion though. Not discounting yours. I
> agree with you about it being hard to find a hotel, but I
> don't think any of the competitors will stick around for
> a local nats as they just flew the worlds. I would think our
> own worlds team may not attend the nats right after. Maybe
> the current team could chime in if they read this to say if
> they would have stuck around for a local nats in Portugal
> the week after the worlds. 
> 
> Think about a rotating nats. If it was held somewhere else
> in the country, the dates would most likely vary up to a
> month either way. 
> 
> Not arguing with you here. This is said in a calm tone.
> Just conversing. 
> 
> You coming to Hollister?
> ?Chris
>    ? 
> ?  ?
> 
> From:
> Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
> To: General
> pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent:
> Wednesday, September 2, 2009 8:32:37 PM
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
> . . .
> 
> 
> Derek,
> Maybe I'm coming in late to this discussion,
> and for that I apologize. But I would like to ask a few more
> questions just for clarification.?
> You have stated before that the Pattern Nats for
> 2011 won't be scheduled until October of 2010. Has there
> been any serious discussion with the AMA about the 2011
> Pattern Nats and if it will even be possible to do what you
> are stating? Can they can even be held after the WC? It
> would seem that this will take a monumental shift in the
> Center schedule.
> Are the dates that you have put out for the
> WC's the only alternative right now? Do we even have the
> option of moving them later?
> Thanks for your reply!
> Tony
> 
> On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:44 PM, Derek Koopowitz
> wrote:
> Fluid meaning that the
>  dates could move a few days forward or backward... yes,
> absolutely. ? Cast in concrete -
> when the 1st bulletin gets mailed out.
> 
>  On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:24
> PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
> wrote:
>   No it has not been
> worked out. You are saying your dates for the WC are fluid,
> and the dates for the 2011 Nats are not set even
> tentatively. So there is a lot in the air. 
>  Tony 
>    On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:15 PM,
> Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>   
> Actually it had been all worked out
>  until "everyone" started chiming in as to their
> preference for when the wc should be held and the Nats
> should be held... can't please all the people.
> ? LOL
> 
>  On Wed, Sep 2, 2009
> at 4:07 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
> wrote:
>   I absolutely agree.
> IRCHA will not move their dates unless forced to by the AMA.
> And I doubt the AMA will do so. 
>  I find it hard to believe that this has not
> been worked out yet.? 
>  Tony 
>      On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:00
> PM, Bill's Email wrote:
> 
>     
> Anthony Frackowiak wrote: Archie is absolutely correct.? 
>  Tony 
>   On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford
> wrote:
>  
>   IRCHA is a totally
> different animal though.? Kind of like having Joe Nall
> after the pattern worlds.? I?d say most people really
> didn?t
>  care about the F3C worlds.? IRCHA does a lot more 3D
> stuff.? ?
> 
> 
> And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to
> an event is going to give them some clout when it comes to a
> schedule relative to the pattern NATS. The WC are a
> different thing, but IRCHA is not likely to budge for the
> pattern NATS if it came to that.
>  
> 
>  
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
>  
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>   
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>  
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>  
>  _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
>       
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      

From drmikedds at sbcglobal.net  Thu Sep  3 05:55:18 2009
From: drmikedds at sbcglobal.net (michael s harrison)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 13:55:18 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <58F61158-B975-4CF1-96CA-A45F33A77D39@sbcglobal.net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<000501ca2b71$8fca5060$af5ef120$@com>	<C1C9B7D0-A5F7-4EF6-94B3-FEF1BC3B8B64@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909020820p75ecefbep2c21a8370ca62017@mail.gmail.com>	<1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>	<4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net>
	<4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
	<58F61158-B975-4CF1-96CA-A45F33A77D39@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <010901ca2c9e$1aa31230$4fe93690$@net>

My thoughts and opinion.  First of all, the Nats is being treated as if it
is just a local, fly for fun, whatever event.  The Nats is a national event
where the best in the US and those from any other country competes for the
National title.  This is the biggest competition in the United States.  It
is also the best competitive pattern event the US, possibly in the world.
There are a core group of individuals that make all that possible.  The
event has evolved, grown and matured over the course of many years.  It
works very well.  I would be very cautious about doing any major upheaval to
that event.

 

Very importantly also, the world championships is the the FAI worlds
premiere event in pattern.  It deserves its sole identity and space.  I
strongly recommend it has its own time and commitment.  It is 2 years away.
Now is the time to get the core group together to put an event together we
can all be proud of.  People that travel from all over the world to come
here to compete deserve our very best uncompromised effort.

 

It is very important we decide our philosophy in this issue.  Are we doing
this to please the casual flyer or the dedicated competitor?  Is it a
curiosity or a serious commitment to provide the very best arena to find the
best flyer in the nation and the world?

 

I say make the Nationals the best in the nation, make the World Championship
the best in the world.

 

I believe this twofer concept will make both events suffer.  I am opposed to
it.  

 

Separate the events by a substantial time frame.  Find someone dedicated to
making the world championship a truly world class event.  Build a team for
it.  Make it happen.

 

 

Regards,

Mike 

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony
Frackowiak
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 5:52 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

 

Not the same thing. The IRCHA meet is not a competition, practice fields are
not at a premium. I still say the WC's should be held in September.

 

Tony

 

On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:36 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:





So the IRCHA guys had their fly-in directly after the f3c world champs... I
think it worked for them.

 

Perhaps IRCHA can be persuaded to move their event out 1 week to accommodate
us?

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 3:28 PM, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net> wrote:

Archie Stafford wrote: 

I'm guessing the IRCHA guys will fight those dates as well as that is time
they normally have their fly in, and due to the size it has grown to, I
doubt they will be willing to give it up.

 

Arch

 

 

I heard they only got like 900 or so paid pilots this past year. Is that a
lot??







_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

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From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Thu Sep  3 06:32:41 2009
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 14:32:41 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] CA Model Osmose stabilizer
In-Reply-To: <010901ca2c9e$1aa31230$4fe93690$@net>
Message-ID: <7nafpc$19vjb7@dmzms99902.na.baesystems.com>

Guys,

 

I am wondering if anyone has a CA Models Osmose stabilizer they would
like to part with. Please let me know.

Thanks,

Jim

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of michael s
harrison
Sent: Thursday, September 03, 2009 9:55 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie .
.. . .

 

My thoughts and opinion.  First of all, the Nats is being treated as if
it is just a local, fly for fun, whatever event.  The Nats is a national
event where the best in the US and those from any other country competes
for the National title.  This is the biggest competition in the United
States.  It is also the best competitive pattern event the US, possibly
in the world.  There are a core group of individuals that make all that
possible.  The event has evolved, grown and matured over the course of
many years.  It works very well.  I would be very cautious about doing
any major upheaval to that event.

 

Very importantly also, the world championships is the the FAI worlds
premiere event in pattern.  It deserves its sole identity and space.  I
strongly recommend it has its own time and commitment.  It is 2 years
away.  Now is the time to get the core group together to put an event
together we can all be proud of.  People that travel from all over the
world to come here to compete deserve our very best uncompromised
effort.

 

It is very important we decide our philosophy in this issue.  Are we
doing this to please the casual flyer or the dedicated competitor?  Is
it a curiosity or a serious commitment to provide the very best arena to
find the best flyer in the nation and the world?

 

I say make the Nationals the best in the nation, make the World
Championship the best in the world.

 

I believe this twofer concept will make both events suffer.  I am
opposed to it.  

 

Separate the events by a substantial time frame.  Find someone dedicated
to making the world championship a truly world class event.  Build a
team for it.  Make it happen.

 

 

Regards,

Mike 

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony
Frackowiak
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 5:52 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie .
. . . .

 

Not the same thing. The IRCHA meet is not a competition, practice fields
are not at a premium. I still say the WC's should be held in September.

 

Tony

 

On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:36 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

 

So the IRCHA guys had their fly-in directly after the f3c world
champs... I think it worked for them.

 

Perhaps IRCHA can be persuaded to move their event out 1 week to
accommodate us?

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 3:28 PM, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net> wrote:

Archie Stafford wrote: 

I'm guessing the IRCHA guys will fight those dates as well as that is
time they normally have their fly in, and due to the size it has grown
to, I doubt they will be willing to give it up.

 

Arch

 

 

I heard they only got like 900 or so paid pilots this past year. Is that
a lot??






_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

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From pamrich47 at hotmail.com  Thu Sep  3 06:44:36 2009
From: pamrich47 at hotmail.com (Richard Strickland)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 14:44:36 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] CA Model Osmose stabilizer
In-Reply-To: <7nafpc$19vjb7@dmzms99902.na.baesystems.com>
References: <010901ca2c9e$1aa31230$4fe93690$@net>
	<7nafpc$19vjb7@dmzms99902.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <BAY128-W6A378FF04864F6FFFCD8DA0EF0@phx.gbl>


Narrow doorway?  ;O(

RS
 


Date: Thu, 3 Sep 2009 10:32:37 -0400
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] CA Model Osmose stabilizer





Guys,
 
I am wondering if anyone has a CA Models Osmose stabilizer they would like to part with. Please let me know.
Thanks,
Jim
 


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of michael s harrison
Sent: Thursday, September 03, 2009 9:55 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .. . .
 
My thoughts and opinion.  First of all, the Nats is being treated as if it is just a local, fly for fun, whatever event.  The Nats is a national event where the best in the US and those from any other country competes for the National title.  This is the biggest competition in the United States.  It is also the best competitive pattern event the US, possibly in the world.  There are a core group of individuals that make all that possible.  The event has evolved, grown and matured over the course of many years.  It works very well.  I would be very cautious about doing any major upheaval to that event.
 
Very importantly also, the world championships is the the FAI worlds premiere event in pattern.  It deserves its sole identity and space.  I strongly recommend it has its own time and commitment.  It is 2 years away.  Now is the time to get the core group together to put an event together we can all be proud of.  People that travel from all over the world to come here to compete deserve our very best uncompromised effort.
 
It is very important we decide our philosophy in this issue.  Are we doing this to please the casual flyer or the dedicated competitor?  Is it a curiosity or a serious commitment to provide the very best arena to find the best flyer in the nation and the world?
 
I say make the Nationals the best in the nation, make the World Championship the best in the world.
 
I believe this twofer concept will make both events suffer.  I am opposed to it.  
 
Separate the events by a substantial time frame.  Find someone dedicated to making the world championship a truly world class event.  Build a team for it.  Make it happen.
 
 
Regards,
Mike 
 


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Frackowiak
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 5:52 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . . . .
 
Not the same thing. The IRCHA meet is not a competition, practice fields are not at a premium. I still say the WC's should be held in September.

 

Tony

 


On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:36 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
 

So the IRCHA guys had their fly-in directly after the f3c world champs... I think it worked for them.

 

Perhaps IRCHA can be persuaded to move their event out 1 week to accommodate us?

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 3:28 PM, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net> wrote:


Archie Stafford wrote: 

I?m guessing the IRCHA guys will fight those dates as well as that is time they normally have their fly in, and due to the size it has grown to, I doubt they will be willing to give it up.


 
Arch


 
 
I heard they only got like 900 or so paid pilots this past year. Is that a lot??





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
 
_________________________________________________________________
Get back to school stuff for them and cashback for you.
http://www.bing.com/cashback?form=MSHYCB&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MSHYCB_BackToSchool_Cashback_BTSCashback_1x1
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From nsrcapilot at gmail.com  Thu Sep  3 06:52:06 2009
From: nsrcapilot at gmail.com (Jim Houck)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 14:52:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Used Pattern plane???
In-Reply-To: <009101ca2c40$509b13f0$f1d13bd0$@com>
References: <009101ca2c40$509b13f0$f1d13bd0$@com>
Message-ID: <381bf2de0909030752q3a7ae1eaga5428f57c37fba9c@mail.gmail.com>

Welcome to Austin.

Which field do you fly at in Austin, Texas.  I am a member of the Hill
Country Aeromodelers. Our field is in South Austin off of Slaughter.

We are having an electric fun fly you might be interested in on the 18th and
19th of September.  3H Hobby Shop will be there and they make a small (47")
electric pattern practice plane -- the Asperia I believe.



Jim Houck
http://www.hcamonline.org/


On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 9:43 PM, Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>wrote:

>
>
>
>
> *From:* nsrca-webteam-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:
> nsrca-webteam-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] *On Behalf Of *Rene Grebe
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 02, 2009 1:38 PM
> *To:* nsrca-webteam at lists.nsrca.org
> *Subject:* [NSRCA-webteam] Used Pattern plane???
>
>
>
> Hi All,
> I'm an old member (and I mean really old) from the group on Distric 7
> Pattern Animals. I have been out of pattern for almost 20 years and moved to
> the Austin, Texas area. I visited the Nats in Muncie and the bug have bit me
> again. I'm interested in buying an electric pattern a/c new or used.
> Any offers, suggestions or comments will be promptly answered.
> Thanks
>
> Ren? Grebe
> renegrebe39 at gmail.com
> 512/330-4485(H)  626/991-0842(C)
>
>
>
>
> Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving
> safely
> in an attractive and well preserve body, but rather to skip in sideways,
> body
> thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming 'Woo Hoo, what a
> ride!!!.
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Thu Sep  3 06:53:36 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 14:53:36 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Matt Liprie
In-Reply-To: <381bf2de0909030752q3a7ae1eaga5428f57c37fba9c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <009101ca2c40$509b13f0$f1d13bd0$@com>
	<381bf2de0909030752q3a7ae1eaga5428f57c37fba9c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B76CE@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

Does anyone have a phone number that they can give me for Matt (Offlist)

Thanks!

-Mark



From: nsrca-webteam-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-webteam-bounces at lists.nsrca.org> [mailto:nsrca-webteam-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-webteam-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>] On Behalf Of Rene Grebe
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 1:38 PM
To: nsrca-webteam at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-webteam at lists.nsrca.org>
Subject: [NSRCA-webteam] Used Pattern plane???



Hi All,
I'm an old member (and I mean really old) from the group on Distric 7 Pattern Animals. I have been out of pattern for almost 20 years and moved to the Austin, Texas area. I visited the Nats in Muncie and the bug have bit me again. I'm interested in buying an electric pattern a/c new or used.
Any offers, suggestions or comments will be promptly answered.
Thanks

Ren? Grebe
renegrebe39 at gmail.com<mailto:renegrebe39 at gmail.com>
512/330-4485(H)  626/991-0842(C)



Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely
in an attractive and well preserve body, but rather to skip in sideways, body
thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming 'Woo Hoo, what a ride!!!.

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



No virus found in this incoming message.
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From rharden1 at cox.net  Thu Sep  3 07:04:55 2009
From: rharden1 at cox.net (Robert Harden)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 15:04:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Great Planes
Message-ID: <9D84A6199A53447A990775C45F7F0862@MargaretPC>

Has anyone tried flying the Great Planes Sequence F3A 50" E-Performance XLC Series?  I'm thinking of getting one of those for a practice plane.

Bob Harden
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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Thu Sep  3 07:21:46 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 15:21:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <010901ca2c9e$1aa31230$4fe93690$@net>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>
	<4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>
	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net> <4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>
	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
	<58F61158-B975-4CF1-96CA-A45F33A77D39@sbcglobal.net>
	<010901ca2c9e$1aa31230$4fe93690$@net>
Message-ID: <3454543c0909030821u40699d59o99dc5b470bd0bee@mail.gmail.com>

If anyone has been reading my articles in the K-Factor you will see that we
have been looking for an event manager for the WC's for almost 6 months
now... no one has stepped forward.

I've seen some comments on this list from several people that obviously know
what it takes to run a world championship so my challenge to you all is this
- step up and take the event manager job and run the event the proper way.
If you don't want to be the event manager for the event (not CD it but plan
it) then please offer your services to help plan the event with the selected
event manager so that it can be the best world championship.  The Nats is a
standalone event and will remain as such.  It has its own event director and
core group of volunteers that help each and every year.

On Thu, Sep 3, 2009 at 6:54 AM, michael s harrison
<drmikedds at sbcglobal.net>wrote:

>  My thoughts and opinion.  First of all, the Nats is being treated as if
> it is just a local, fly for fun, whatever event.  The Nats is a national
> event where the best in the US and those from any other country competes for
> the National title.  This is the biggest competition in the United States.
> It is also the best competitive pattern event the US, possibly in the
> world.  There are a core group of individuals that make all that possible.
> The event has evolved, grown and matured over the course of many years.  It
> works very well.  I would be very cautious about doing any major upheaval to
> that event.
>
>
>
> Very importantly also, the world championships is the the FAI worlds
> premiere event in pattern.  It deserves its sole identity and space.  I
> strongly recommend it has its own time and commitment.  It is 2 years away.
> Now is the time to get the core group together to put an event together we
> can all be proud of.  People that travel from all over the world to come
> here to compete deserve our very best uncompromised effort.
>
>
>
> It is very important we decide our philosophy in this issue.  Are we doing
> this to please the casual flyer or the dedicated competitor?  Is it a
> curiosity or a serious commitment to provide the very best arena to find the
> best flyer in the nation and the world?
>
>
>
> I say make the Nationals the best in the nation, make the World
> Championship the best in the world.
>
>
>
> I believe this twofer concept will make both events suffer.  I am opposed
> to it.
>
>
>
> Separate the events by a substantial time frame.  Find someone dedicated to
> making the world championship a truly world class event.  Build a team for
> it.  Make it happen.
>
>
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Mike
>
>
>
> *From:* nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] *On Behalf Of *Anthony
> Frackowiak
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 02, 2009 5:52 PM
> *To:* General pattern discussion
> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie .
> . . . .
>
>
>
> Not the same thing. The IRCHA meet is not a competition, practice fields
> are not at a premium. I still say the WC's should be held in September.
>
>
>
> Tony
>
>
>
> On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:36 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
>
>
>  So the IRCHA guys had their fly-in directly after the f3c world champs...
> I think it worked for them.
>
>
>
> Perhaps IRCHA can be persuaded to move their event out 1 week to
> accommodate us?
>
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 3:28 PM, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net> wrote:
>
> Archie Stafford wrote:
>
> I?m guessing the IRCHA guys will fight those dates as well as that is time
> they normally have their fly in, and due to the size it has grown to, I
> doubt they will be willing to give it up.
>
>
>
> Arch
>
>
>
>
>
> I heard they only got like 900 or so paid pilots this past year. Is that a
> lot??
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From vanputte at cox.net  Thu Sep  3 07:40:45 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 15:40:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <323827.63437.qm@web51003.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <323827.63437.qm@web51003.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4EF471F0-4D4B-4D83-8549-2C6F7AA8EADD@cox.net>

Mike Mueller said, "Will finding volunteers be difficult? No doubt.  
Can we do it all? I'm pretty confident but it won't be easy and we  
need people to be understanding and flexable."

I think Tony Stillman will agree that, if we could get the country's  
R/C aerobatics pilots to come to an old Navy field on the Gulf Coast  
near Navarre, Florida and perform all the "skill jobs" required to  
run an F3A World Championships, like we did in 1999, I think we can  
handle putting on one in Muncie in 2011.

BTW, CPLR was there in 1999, and it is worth watching him fly.

Ron Van Putte
1999 F3A WC co-CD

On Sep 3, 2009, at 8:47 AM, mike mueller wrote:

>  Hey guys just a chime in and a perspective.
>  I first heard about the proposed dates at the NSRCA officers  
> meeting held at the Nats.
>  My initial reaction was how cool it will be that we will have 2  
> events back to back and what a privilege it is to host the worlds.
>  I know that Derek has been busting his tail and doing his homework  
> to get this done so I support him.
>  So after some thought I've come to the conclusion that this is a  
> pretty workable solution if all the logistics can be worked out  
> with the AMA and event conflicts.
>  To the best of my knowledge there have been talks with Don Cherry  
> of the AMA and I think for the most part the preliminary schedule  
> is pretty close to what's going to happen.
>  Someone had to take the ball here and make some decisions. I'm  
> thinking that this is Derek's and the AMA's plan. Question is what  
> would you have done if you were the leader of our organization?
>  I think it was Doug who made the statement that the Worlds are a  
> priority.
>  He's right to a degree. We have been chosen to host the best  
> flyers in the world and this has to be #1 on the list of things to  
> accomplish in 2011. I will re access my personal needs and align  
> myself with the task at hand. If I get lucky I get to do both the  
> end of the worlds and compete in the Nats. Time and personal  
> situations will dictate.
>  Will the worlds hurt the Nats? Probably. Will finding volunteers  
> be difficult? No doubt. Can we do it all? I'm pretty confident but  
> it won't be easy and we need people to be understanding and flexable.
>  I can't wait to see CLPR for myself.
>  Thanks for letting me air my thoughts. Mike Mueller D5VP
>
> --- On Wed, 9/2/09, krishlan fitzsimmons  
> <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
>> Muncie . . . . .
>> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> Date: Wednesday, September 2, 2009, 10:58 PM
>> Tony,
>>
>> This has been discussed quite a bit previous to this
>> conversation on the officers list quite some time ago. Derek
>> has done a huge amount of work to make this happen as you
>> must know. I believe it had been discussed with the ama, and
>> therefore the reason for the rough dates that we have. I
>> could be wrong, but this is my recollection.
>>
>> I know it seems odd to you, as it did me at first, but I
>> haven't been on the team before as you, nor have I ever
>> had the chance to witness a "Worlds" as you have.
>> This is my chance to see it. If it's right before the
>> nats, that's great timing for me. And many that were
>> asked, feel this way.
>>
>> It is wished by many of us that the nats date didn't
>> have to be moved, but soaring could move up a week, and so
>> on to make room for the worlds. The nats
>>  will be poorly attended if the two are separated IMO. A
>> lot of people may want to see the worlds competition.
>> If they are separated, not many of us will be able to
>> attend. Just my opinion though. Not discounting yours. I
>> agree with you about it being hard to find a hotel, but I
>> don't think any of the competitors will stick around for
>> a local nats as they just flew the worlds. I would think our
>> own worlds team may not attend the nats right after. Maybe
>> the current team could chime in if they read this to say if
>> they would have stuck around for a local nats in Portugal
>> the week after the worlds.
>>
>> Think about a rotating nats. If it was held somewhere else
>> in the country, the dates would most likely vary up to a
>> month either way.
>>
>> Not arguing with you here. This is said in a calm tone.
>> Just conversing.
>>
>> You coming to Hollister?
>>  Chris
>>
>>
>>
>> From:
>> Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
>> To: General
>> pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> Sent:
>> Wednesday, September 2, 2009 8:32:37 PM
>> Subject: Re:
>> [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
>> . . .
>>
>>
>> Derek,
>> Maybe I'm coming in late to this discussion,
>> and for that I apologize. But I would like to ask a few more
>> questions just for clarification.
>> You have stated before that the Pattern Nats for
>> 2011 won't be scheduled until October of 2010. Has there
>> been any serious discussion with the AMA about the 2011
>> Pattern Nats and if it will even be possible to do what you
>> are stating? Can they can even be held after the WC? It
>> would seem that this will take a monumental shift in the
>> Center schedule.
>> Are the dates that you have put out for the
>> WC's the only alternative right now? Do we even have the
>> option of moving them later?
>> Thanks for your reply!
>> Tony
>>
>> On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:44 PM, Derek Koopowitz
>> wrote:
>> Fluid meaning that the
>>  dates could move a few days forward or backward... yes,
>> absolutely.   Cast in concrete -
>> when the 1st bulletin gets mailed out.
>>
>>  On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:24
>> PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
>> wrote:
>>   No it has not been
>> worked out. You are saying your dates for the WC are fluid,
>> and the dates for the 2011 Nats are not set even
>> tentatively. So there is a lot in the air.
>>  Tony
>>    On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:15 PM,
>> Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>>
>> Actually it had been all worked out
>>  until "everyone" started chiming in as to their
>> preference for when the wc should be held and the Nats
>> should be held... can't please all the people.
>>   LOL
>>
>>  On Wed, Sep 2, 2009
>> at 4:07 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
>> wrote:
>>   I absolutely agree.
>> IRCHA will not move their dates unless forced to by the AMA.
>> And I doubt the AMA will do so.
>>  I find it hard to believe that this has not
>> been worked out yet.
>>  Tony
>>      On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:00
>> PM, Bill's Email wrote:
>>
>>
>> Anthony Frackowiak wrote: Archie is absolutely correct.
>>  Tony
>>   On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford
>> wrote:
>>
>>   IRCHA is a totally
>> different animal though.  Kind of like having Joe Nall
>> after the pattern worlds.  I?d say most people really
>> didn?t
>>  care about the F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D
>> stuff.
>>
>>
>> And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to
>> an event is going to give them some clout when it comes to a
>> schedule relative to the pattern NATS. The WC are a
>> different thing, but IRCHA is not likely to budge for the
>> pattern NATS if it came to that.
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Thu Sep  3 07:45:56 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 15:45:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <4EF471F0-4D4B-4D83-8549-2C6F7AA8EADD@cox.net>
References: <323827.63437.qm@web51003.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<4EF471F0-4D4B-4D83-8549-2C6F7AA8EADD@cox.net>
Message-ID: <CA222024-E1FF-4C86-A802-0EF0703469D1@sbcglobal.net>

Hi Ron,

What were the dates for the 1999 WC?

Tony

On Sep 3, 2009, at 8:40 AM, Ron Van Putte wrote:

> Mike Mueller said, "Will finding volunteers be difficult? No doubt.  
> Can we do it all? I'm pretty confident but it won't be easy and we  
> need people to be understanding and flexable."
>
> I think Tony Stillman will agree that, if we could get the country's  
> R/C aerobatics pilots to come to an old Navy field on the Gulf Coast  
> near Navarre, Florida and perform all the "skill jobs" required to  
> run an F3A World Championships, like we did in 1999, I think we can  
> handle putting on one in Muncie in 2011.
>
> BTW, CPLR was there in 1999, and it is worth watching him fly.
>
> Ron Van Putte
> 1999 F3A WC co-CD
>
> On Sep 3, 2009, at 8:47 AM, mike mueller wrote:
>
>> Hey guys just a chime in and a perspective.
>> I first heard about the proposed dates at the NSRCA officers  
>> meeting held at the Nats.
>> My initial reaction was how cool it will be that we will have 2  
>> events back to back and what a privilege it is to host the worlds.
>> I know that Derek has been busting his tail and doing his homework  
>> to get this done so I support him.
>> So after some thought I've come to the conclusion that this is a  
>> pretty workable solution if all the logistics can be worked out  
>> with the AMA and event conflicts.
>> To the best of my knowledge there have been talks with Don Cherry  
>> of the AMA and I think for the most part the preliminary schedule  
>> is pretty close to what's going to happen.
>> Someone had to take the ball here and make some decisions. I'm  
>> thinking that this is Derek's and the AMA's plan. Question is what  
>> would you have done if you were the leader of our organization?
>> I think it was Doug who made the statement that the Worlds are a  
>> priority.
>> He's right to a degree. We have been chosen to host the best flyers  
>> in the world and this has to be #1 on the list of things to  
>> accomplish in 2011. I will re access my personal needs and align  
>> myself with the task at hand. If I get lucky I get to do both the  
>> end of the worlds and compete in the Nats. Time and personal  
>> situations will dictate.
>> Will the worlds hurt the Nats? Probably. Will finding volunteers be  
>> difficult? No doubt. Can we do it all? I'm pretty confident but it  
>> won't be easy and we need people to be understanding and flexable.
>> I can't wait to see CLPR for myself.
>> Thanks for letting me air my thoughts. Mike Mueller D5VP
>>
>> --- On Wed, 9/2/09, krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com 
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
>>> Muncie . . . . .
>>> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>> Date: Wednesday, September 2, 2009, 10:58 PM
>>> Tony,
>>>
>>> This has been discussed quite a bit previous to this
>>> conversation on the officers list quite some time ago. Derek
>>> has done a huge amount of work to make this happen as you
>>> must know. I believe it had been discussed with the ama, and
>>> therefore the reason for the rough dates that we have. I
>>> could be wrong, but this is my recollection.
>>>
>>> I know it seems odd to you, as it did me at first, but I
>>> haven't been on the team before as you, nor have I ever
>>> had the chance to witness a "Worlds" as you have.
>>> This is my chance to see it. If it's right before the
>>> nats, that's great timing for me. And many that were
>>> asked, feel this way.
>>>
>>> It is wished by many of us that the nats date didn't
>>> have to be moved, but soaring could move up a week, and so
>>> on to make room for the worlds. The nats
>>> will be poorly attended if the two are separated IMO. A
>>> lot of people may want to see the worlds competition.
>>> If they are separated, not many of us will be able to
>>> attend. Just my opinion though. Not discounting yours. I
>>> agree with you about it being hard to find a hotel, but I
>>> don't think any of the competitors will stick around for
>>> a local nats as they just flew the worlds. I would think our
>>> own worlds team may not attend the nats right after. Maybe
>>> the current team could chime in if they read this to say if
>>> they would have stuck around for a local nats in Portugal
>>> the week after the worlds.
>>>
>>> Think about a rotating nats. If it was held somewhere else
>>> in the country, the dates would most likely vary up to a
>>> month either way.
>>>
>>> Not arguing with you here. This is said in a calm tone.
>>> Just conversing.
>>>
>>> You coming to Hollister?
>>> Chris
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> From:
>>> Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
>>> To: General
>>> pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>> Sent:
>>> Wednesday, September 2, 2009 8:32:37 PM
>>> Subject: Re:
>>> [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
>>> . . .
>>>
>>>
>>> Derek,
>>> Maybe I'm coming in late to this discussion,
>>> and for that I apologize. But I would like to ask a few more
>>> questions just for clarification.
>>> You have stated before that the Pattern Nats for
>>> 2011 won't be scheduled until October of 2010. Has there
>>> been any serious discussion with the AMA about the 2011
>>> Pattern Nats and if it will even be possible to do what you
>>> are stating? Can they can even be held after the WC? It
>>> would seem that this will take a monumental shift in the
>>> Center schedule.
>>> Are the dates that you have put out for the
>>> WC's the only alternative right now? Do we even have the
>>> option of moving them later?
>>> Thanks for your reply!
>>> Tony
>>>
>>> On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:44 PM, Derek Koopowitz
>>> wrote:
>>> Fluid meaning that the
>>> dates could move a few days forward or backward... yes,
>>> absolutely.   Cast in concrete -
>>> when the 1st bulletin gets mailed out.
>>>
>>> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:24
>>> PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>  No it has not been
>>> worked out. You are saying your dates for the WC are fluid,
>>> and the dates for the 2011 Nats are not set even
>>> tentatively. So there is a lot in the air.
>>> Tony
>>>   On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:15 PM,
>>> Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>>>
>>> Actually it had been all worked out
>>> until "everyone" started chiming in as to their
>>> preference for when the wc should be held and the Nats
>>> should be held... can't please all the people.
>>>  LOL
>>>
>>> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009
>>> at 4:07 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>  I absolutely agree.
>>> IRCHA will not move their dates unless forced to by the AMA.
>>> And I doubt the AMA will do so.
>>> I find it hard to believe that this has not
>>> been worked out yet.
>>> Tony
>>>     On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:00
>>> PM, Bill's Email wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Anthony Frackowiak wrote: Archie is absolutely correct.
>>> Tony
>>>  On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>  IRCHA is a totally
>>> different animal though.  Kind of like having Joe Nall
>>> after the pattern worlds.  I?d say most people really
>>> didn?t
>>> care about the F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D
>>> stuff.
>>>
>>>
>>> And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to
>>> an event is going to give them some clout when it comes to a
>>> schedule relative to the pattern NATS. The WC are a
>>> different thing, but IRCHA is not likely to budge for the
>>> pattern NATS if it came to that.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From tony at radiosouthrc.com  Thu Sep  3 07:53:21 2009
From: tony at radiosouthrc.com (Tony)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 15:53:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . ..
	.
In-Reply-To: <CA222024-E1FF-4C86-A802-0EF0703469D1@sbcglobal.net>
References: <323827.63437.qm@web51003.mail.re2.yahoo.com><4EF471F0-4D4B-4D83-8549-2C6F7AA8EADD@cox.net>
	<CA222024-E1FF-4C86-A802-0EF0703469D1@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <4D638B412E594E6C8501BC54F002B04B@Tony>

Absolutely!   I don't thing volunteers will be a problem, but someone needs
to get involved to run the event planning NOW... when we did it in 1999, we
started 2 years ahead of time.  That is NOW!!!


Tony Stillman, President
Radio South, Inc.
139 Altama Connector, Box 322
Brunswick, GA  31525
1-800-962-7802
www.radiosouthrc.com

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony
Frackowiak
Sent: Thursday, September 03, 2009 11:46 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . ..
.

Hi Ron,

What were the dates for the 1999 WC?

Tony

On Sep 3, 2009, at 8:40 AM, Ron Van Putte wrote:

> Mike Mueller said, "Will finding volunteers be difficult? No doubt.  
> Can we do it all? I'm pretty confident but it won't be easy and we  
> need people to be understanding and flexable."
>
> I think Tony Stillman will agree that, if we could get the country's  
> R/C aerobatics pilots to come to an old Navy field on the Gulf Coast  
> near Navarre, Florida and perform all the "skill jobs" required to  
> run an F3A World Championships, like we did in 1999, I think we can  
> handle putting on one in Muncie in 2011.
>
> BTW, CPLR was there in 1999, and it is worth watching him fly.
>
> Ron Van Putte
> 1999 F3A WC co-CD
>
> On Sep 3, 2009, at 8:47 AM, mike mueller wrote:
>
>> Hey guys just a chime in and a perspective.
>> I first heard about the proposed dates at the NSRCA officers  
>> meeting held at the Nats.
>> My initial reaction was how cool it will be that we will have 2  
>> events back to back and what a privilege it is to host the worlds.
>> I know that Derek has been busting his tail and doing his homework  
>> to get this done so I support him.
>> So after some thought I've come to the conclusion that this is a  
>> pretty workable solution if all the logistics can be worked out  
>> with the AMA and event conflicts.
>> To the best of my knowledge there have been talks with Don Cherry  
>> of the AMA and I think for the most part the preliminary schedule  
>> is pretty close to what's going to happen.
>> Someone had to take the ball here and make some decisions. I'm  
>> thinking that this is Derek's and the AMA's plan. Question is what  
>> would you have done if you were the leader of our organization?
>> I think it was Doug who made the statement that the Worlds are a  
>> priority.
>> He's right to a degree. We have been chosen to host the best flyers  
>> in the world and this has to be #1 on the list of things to  
>> accomplish in 2011. I will re access my personal needs and align  
>> myself with the task at hand. If I get lucky I get to do both the  
>> end of the worlds and compete in the Nats. Time and personal  
>> situations will dictate.
>> Will the worlds hurt the Nats? Probably. Will finding volunteers be  
>> difficult? No doubt. Can we do it all? I'm pretty confident but it  
>> won't be easy and we need people to be understanding and flexable.
>> I can't wait to see CLPR for myself.
>> Thanks for letting me air my thoughts. Mike Mueller D5VP
>>
>> --- On Wed, 9/2/09, krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com 
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
>>> Muncie . . . . .
>>> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>> Date: Wednesday, September 2, 2009, 10:58 PM
>>> Tony,
>>>
>>> This has been discussed quite a bit previous to this
>>> conversation on the officers list quite some time ago. Derek
>>> has done a huge amount of work to make this happen as you
>>> must know. I believe it had been discussed with the ama, and
>>> therefore the reason for the rough dates that we have. I
>>> could be wrong, but this is my recollection.
>>>
>>> I know it seems odd to you, as it did me at first, but I
>>> haven't been on the team before as you, nor have I ever
>>> had the chance to witness a "Worlds" as you have.
>>> This is my chance to see it. If it's right before the
>>> nats, that's great timing for me. And many that were
>>> asked, feel this way.
>>>
>>> It is wished by many of us that the nats date didn't
>>> have to be moved, but soaring could move up a week, and so
>>> on to make room for the worlds. The nats
>>> will be poorly attended if the two are separated IMO. A
>>> lot of people may want to see the worlds competition.
>>> If they are separated, not many of us will be able to
>>> attend. Just my opinion though. Not discounting yours. I
>>> agree with you about it being hard to find a hotel, but I
>>> don't think any of the competitors will stick around for
>>> a local nats as they just flew the worlds. I would think our
>>> own worlds team may not attend the nats right after. Maybe
>>> the current team could chime in if they read this to say if
>>> they would have stuck around for a local nats in Portugal
>>> the week after the worlds.
>>>
>>> Think about a rotating nats. If it was held somewhere else
>>> in the country, the dates would most likely vary up to a
>>> month either way.
>>>
>>> Not arguing with you here. This is said in a calm tone.
>>> Just conversing.
>>>
>>> You coming to Hollister?
>>> Chris
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> From:
>>> Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
>>> To: General
>>> pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>> Sent:
>>> Wednesday, September 2, 2009 8:32:37 PM
>>> Subject: Re:
>>> [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
>>> . . .
>>>
>>>
>>> Derek,
>>> Maybe I'm coming in late to this discussion,
>>> and for that I apologize. But I would like to ask a few more
>>> questions just for clarification.
>>> You have stated before that the Pattern Nats for
>>> 2011 won't be scheduled until October of 2010. Has there
>>> been any serious discussion with the AMA about the 2011
>>> Pattern Nats and if it will even be possible to do what you
>>> are stating? Can they can even be held after the WC? It
>>> would seem that this will take a monumental shift in the
>>> Center schedule.
>>> Are the dates that you have put out for the
>>> WC's the only alternative right now? Do we even have the
>>> option of moving them later?
>>> Thanks for your reply!
>>> Tony
>>>
>>> On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:44 PM, Derek Koopowitz
>>> wrote:
>>> Fluid meaning that the
>>> dates could move a few days forward or backward... yes,
>>> absolutely.   Cast in concrete -
>>> when the 1st bulletin gets mailed out.
>>>
>>> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:24
>>> PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>  No it has not been
>>> worked out. You are saying your dates for the WC are fluid,
>>> and the dates for the 2011 Nats are not set even
>>> tentatively. So there is a lot in the air.
>>> Tony
>>>   On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:15 PM,
>>> Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>>>
>>> Actually it had been all worked out
>>> until "everyone" started chiming in as to their
>>> preference for when the wc should be held and the Nats
>>> should be held... can't please all the people.
>>>  LOL
>>>
>>> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009
>>> at 4:07 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>  I absolutely agree.
>>> IRCHA will not move their dates unless forced to by the AMA.
>>> And I doubt the AMA will do so.
>>> I find it hard to believe that this has not
>>> been worked out yet.
>>> Tony
>>>     On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:00
>>> PM, Bill's Email wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Anthony Frackowiak wrote: Archie is absolutely correct.
>>> Tony
>>>  On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>  IRCHA is a totally
>>> different animal though.  Kind of like having Joe Nall
>>> after the pattern worlds.  I'd say most people really
>>> didn't
>>> care about the F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D
>>> stuff.
>>>
>>>
>>> And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to
>>> an event is going to give them some clout when it comes to a
>>> schedule relative to the pattern NATS. The WC are a
>>> different thing, but IRCHA is not likely to budge for the
>>> pattern NATS if it came to that.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From shannah1806 at gmail.com  Thu Sep  3 08:10:04 2009
From: shannah1806 at gmail.com (steve hannah)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 16:10:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Used Pattern plane???
In-Reply-To: <009101ca2c40$509b13f0$f1d13bd0$@com>
References: <009101ca2c40$509b13f0$f1d13bd0$@com>
Message-ID: <c3f99b710909030910k43eda8d7x76d4003b4a709309@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Rene,

Steve Hannah here.  I remember flying with you in District 7 back in the
day.

I did the same thing as you, only a couple years ago.  I had been out of
pattern for many years but when I saw the new generation of electric pattern
planes, well I got the bug.  I bought a used electric Oxai Pinnacle and went
on from there.

Tips for you, based on my experience:
- There's a big learning curve with this electric stuff, so either copy a
setup from someone or from someone's build thread on RCU or buy a used
plane.  If you copy motor/controller/prop setups and installation setups
then you are miles ahead.
- Don't buy cheap equipment or uncommon equipment, buy the stuff that
everyone else is using (Thunderpower charger & balancer or FMA charger).
Your up front investment in electric will be a little steeper than if you
were going back in with glow but these are mainly one time investments.  Buy
top quality, you will spend less in the long run.
- Avoid the temptation to buy chinese batteries.  They are cheap but my
experience with them is that they don't last as long as the real Korean
cells.  I like the PolyRC 5350 packs from RCLIPOS.COM, they are the best
overall value in my opinion. They have the performance and are inexpensive.
Thunderpowers are great as well.
- Just about any airframe you get that is made for electric will be fine.
I like the ones with the top hatch for battery access.  In my mind that is
mandatory.  I am too lazy to flip the airplane over after every flight to
change the batteries.  I fly the Pass-Port.  I like it.  It was easy to
build as well.
- Ask a lot of questions.  The RCU electric pattern forum is great.  So is
www.electric-f3a.com.  Obviously, this group is good too.
- Be prepared to spend a lot more time at the flying field.  Once you start
flying these things you will get the bug even worse.  I really enjoy
electric F3A.  I sold all my IMAC planes and this is all I fly.

Email me if you have any questions.
Steve

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 7:43 PM, Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>wrote:

>
>
>
>
> *From:* nsrca-webteam-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:
> nsrca-webteam-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] *On Behalf Of *Rene Grebe
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 02, 2009 1:38 PM
> *To:* nsrca-webteam at lists.nsrca.org
> *Subject:* [NSRCA-webteam] Used Pattern plane???
>
>
>
> Hi All,
> I'm an old member (and I mean really old) from the group on Distric 7
> Pattern Animals. I have been out of pattern for almost 20 years and moved to
> the Austin, Texas area. I visited the Nats in Muncie and the bug have bit me
> again. I'm interested in buying an electric pattern a/c new or used.
> Any offers, suggestions or comments will be promptly answered.
> Thanks
>
> Ren? Grebe
> renegrebe39 at gmail.com
> 512/330-4485(H)  626/991-0842(C)
>
>
>
>
> Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving
> safely
> in an attractive and well preserve body, but rather to skip in sideways,
> body
> thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming 'Woo Hoo, what a
> ride!!!.
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Thu Sep  3 08:10:07 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 16:10:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909030821u40699d59o99dc5b470bd0bee@mail.gmail.com>
References: <291198.24914.qm@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<1D00D586-9EB5-49BE-8E86-A2D5858CC907@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021343l7cb3f1f0wa266674fd86cdf08@mail.gmail.com>
	<4629E1AC-6F7B-4CA8-A31C-2D5A3BF6C2CB@sbcglobal.net>
	<3454543c0909021446o3d007d5dr62089ac982180b71@mail.gmail.com>
	<00ed01ca2c1a$a4da4420$ee8ecc60$@net> <4A9EF192.5020109@cox.net>
	<3454543c0909021536t6028a31uec439070c7790139@mail.gmail.com>
	<58F61158-B975-4CF1-96CA-A45F33A77D39@sbcglobal.net>
	<010901ca2c9e$1aa31230$4fe93690$@net>
	<3454543c0909030821u40699d59o99dc5b470bd0bee@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <C3DAB189-79DE-476D-BE63-2568F09964DC@sbcglobal.net>

Seems like the cart before the horse. I would have thought that any  
bid presented to the CIAM for the WC would have already identified key  
management personnel.

Tony


On Sep 3, 2009, at 8:21 AM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> If anyone has been reading my articles in the K-Factor you will see  
> that we have been looking for an event manager for the WC's for  
> almost 6 months now... no one has stepped forward.
>
> I've seen some comments on this list from several people that  
> obviously know what it takes to run a world championship so my  
> challenge to you all is this - step up and take the event manager  
> job and run the event the proper way.  If you don't want to be the  
> event manager for the event (not CD it but plan it) then please  
> offer your services to help plan the event with the selected event  
> manager so that it can be the best world championship.  The Nats is  
> a standalone event and will remain as such.  It has its own event  
> director and core group of volunteers that help each and every year.
>
> On Thu, Sep 3, 2009 at 6:54 AM, michael s harrison <drmikedds at sbcglobal.net 
> > wrote:
> My thoughts and opinion.  First of all, the Nats is being treated as  
> if it is just a local, fly for fun, whatever event.  The Nats is a  
> national event where the best in the US and those from any other  
> country competes for the National title.  This is the biggest  
> competition in the United States.  It is also the best competitive  
> pattern event the US, possibly in the world.  There are a core group  
> of individuals that make all that possible.  The event has evolved,  
> grown and matured over the course of many years.  It works very  
> well.  I would be very cautious about doing any major upheaval to  
> that event.
>
>
> Very importantly also, the world championships is the the FAI worlds  
> premiere event in pattern.  It deserves its sole identity and  
> space.  I strongly recommend it has its own time and commitment.  It  
> is 2 years away.  Now is the time to get the core group together to  
> put an event together we can all be proud of.  People that travel  
> from all over the world to come here to compete deserve our very  
> best uncompromised effort.
>
>
> It is very important we decide our philosophy in this issue.  Are we  
> doing this to please the casual flyer or the dedicated competitor?   
> Is it a curiosity or a serious commitment to provide the very best  
> arena to find the best flyer in the nation and the world?
>
>
> I say make the Nationals the best in the nation, make the World  
> Championship the best in the world.
>
>
> I believe this twofer concept will make both events suffer.  I am  
> opposed to it.
>
>
> Separate the events by a substantial time frame.  Find someone  
> dedicated to making the world championship a truly world class  
> event.  Build a team for it.  Make it happen.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Mike
>
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
> ] On Behalf Of Anthony Frackowiak
> Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 5:52 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
> Muncie . . . . .
>
>
>
>
> Not the same thing. The IRCHA meet is not a competition, practice  
> fields are not at a premium. I still say the WC's should be held in  
> September.
>
>
> Tony
>
>
> On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:36 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>
>
>
>
> So the IRCHA guys had their fly-in directly after the f3c world  
> champs... I think it worked for them.
>
>
> Perhaps IRCHA can be persuaded to move their event out 1 week to  
> accommodate us?
>
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 3:28 PM, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net> wrote:
>
> Archie Stafford wrote:
>
> I?m guessing the IRCHA guys will fight those dates as well as that  
> is time they normally have their fly in, and due to the size it has  
> grown to, I doubt they will be willing to give it up.
>
>
> Arch
>
>
>
> I heard they only got like 900 or so paid pilots this past year. Is  
> that a lot??
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From vanputte at cox.net  Thu Sep  3 08:11:14 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 16:11:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
	. .
In-Reply-To: <CA222024-E1FF-4C86-A802-0EF0703469D1@sbcglobal.net>
References: <323827.63437.qm@web51003.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<4EF471F0-4D4B-4D83-8549-2C6F7AA8EADD@cox.net>
	<CA222024-E1FF-4C86-A802-0EF0703469D1@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <CD5302A9-F3CF-4A63-B6BB-103FF4731E3C@cox.net>

September 10th to 19th .

Ron VP

On Sep 3, 2009, at 10:45 AM, Anthony Frackowiak wrote:

> Hi Ron,
>
> What were the dates for the 1999 WC?
>
> Tony
>
> On Sep 3, 2009, at 8:40 AM, Ron Van Putte wrote:
>
>> Mike Mueller said, "Will finding volunteers be difficult? No  
>> doubt. Can we do it all? I'm pretty confident but it won't be easy  
>> and we need people to be understanding and flexable."
>>
>> I think Tony Stillman will agree that, if we could get the  
>> country's R/C aerobatics pilots to come to an old Navy field on  
>> the Gulf Coast near Navarre, Florida and perform all the "skill  
>> jobs" required to run an F3A World Championships, like we did in  
>> 1999, I think we can handle putting on one in Muncie in 2011.
>>
>> BTW, CPLR was there in 1999, and it is worth watching him fly.
>>
>> Ron Van Putte
>> 1999 F3A WC co-CD
>>
>> On Sep 3, 2009, at 8:47 AM, mike mueller wrote:
>>
>>> Hey guys just a chime in and a perspective.
>>> I first heard about the proposed dates at the NSRCA officers  
>>> meeting held at the Nats.
>>> My initial reaction was how cool it will be that we will have 2  
>>> events back to back and what a privilege it is to host the worlds.
>>> I know that Derek has been busting his tail and doing his  
>>> homework to get this done so I support him.
>>> So after some thought I've come to the conclusion that this is a  
>>> pretty workable solution if all the logistics can be worked out  
>>> with the AMA and event conflicts.
>>> To the best of my knowledge there have been talks with Don Cherry  
>>> of the AMA and I think for the most part the preliminary schedule  
>>> is pretty close to what's going to happen.
>>> Someone had to take the ball here and make some decisions. I'm  
>>> thinking that this is Derek's and the AMA's plan. Question is  
>>> what would you have done if you were the leader of our organization?
>>> I think it was Doug who made the statement that the Worlds are a  
>>> priority.
>>> He's right to a degree. We have been chosen to host the best  
>>> flyers in the world and this has to be #1 on the list of things  
>>> to accomplish in 2011. I will re access my personal needs and  
>>> align myself with the task at hand. If I get lucky I get to do  
>>> both the end of the worlds and compete in the Nats. Time and  
>>> personal situations will dictate.
>>> Will the worlds hurt the Nats? Probably. Will finding volunteers  
>>> be difficult? No doubt. Can we do it all? I'm pretty confident  
>>> but it won't be easy and we need people to be understanding and  
>>> flexable.
>>> I can't wait to see CLPR for myself.
>>> Thanks for letting me air my thoughts. Mike Mueller D5VP
>>>
>>> --- On Wed, 9/2/09, krishlan fitzsimmons  
>>> <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
>>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at  
>>>> Muncie . . . . .
>>>> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>>> Date: Wednesday, September 2, 2009, 10:58 PM
>>>> Tony,
>>>>
>>>> This has been discussed quite a bit previous to this
>>>> conversation on the officers list quite some time ago. Derek
>>>> has done a huge amount of work to make this happen as you
>>>> must know. I believe it had been discussed with the ama, and
>>>> therefore the reason for the rough dates that we have. I
>>>> could be wrong, but this is my recollection.
>>>>
>>>> I know it seems odd to you, as it did me at first, but I
>>>> haven't been on the team before as you, nor have I ever
>>>> had the chance to witness a "Worlds" as you have.
>>>> This is my chance to see it. If it's right before the
>>>> nats, that's great timing for me. And many that were
>>>> asked, feel this way.
>>>>
>>>> It is wished by many of us that the nats date didn't
>>>> have to be moved, but soaring could move up a week, and so
>>>> on to make room for the worlds. The nats
>>>> will be poorly attended if the two are separated IMO. A
>>>> lot of people may want to see the worlds competition.
>>>> If they are separated, not many of us will be able to
>>>> attend. Just my opinion though. Not discounting yours. I
>>>> agree with you about it being hard to find a hotel, but I
>>>> don't think any of the competitors will stick around for
>>>> a local nats as they just flew the worlds. I would think our
>>>> own worlds team may not attend the nats right after. Maybe
>>>> the current team could chime in if they read this to say if
>>>> they would have stuck around for a local nats in Portugal
>>>> the week after the worlds.
>>>>
>>>> Think about a rotating nats. If it was held somewhere else
>>>> in the country, the dates would most likely vary up to a
>>>> month either way.
>>>>
>>>> Not arguing with you here. This is said in a calm tone.
>>>> Just conversing.
>>>>
>>>> You coming to Hollister?
>>>> Chris
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> From:
>>>> Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
>>>> To: General
>>>> pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>>> Sent:
>>>> Wednesday, September 2, 2009 8:32:37 PM
>>>> Subject: Re:
>>>> [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
>>>> . . .
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Derek,
>>>> Maybe I'm coming in late to this discussion,
>>>> and for that I apologize. But I would like to ask a few more
>>>> questions just for clarification.
>>>> You have stated before that the Pattern Nats for
>>>> 2011 won't be scheduled until October of 2010. Has there
>>>> been any serious discussion with the AMA about the 2011
>>>> Pattern Nats and if it will even be possible to do what you
>>>> are stating? Can they can even be held after the WC? It
>>>> would seem that this will take a monumental shift in the
>>>> Center schedule.
>>>> Are the dates that you have put out for the
>>>> WC's the only alternative right now? Do we even have the
>>>> option of moving them later?
>>>> Thanks for your reply!
>>>> Tony
>>>>
>>>> On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:44 PM, Derek Koopowitz
>>>> wrote:
>>>> Fluid meaning that the
>>>> dates could move a few days forward or backward... yes,
>>>> absolutely.   Cast in concrete -
>>>> when the 1st bulletin gets mailed out.
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:24
>>>> PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>  No it has not been
>>>> worked out. You are saying your dates for the WC are fluid,
>>>> and the dates for the 2011 Nats are not set even
>>>> tentatively. So there is a lot in the air.
>>>> Tony
>>>>   On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:15 PM,
>>>> Derek Koopowitz wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Actually it had been all worked out
>>>> until "everyone" started chiming in as to their
>>>> preference for when the wc should be held and the Nats
>>>> should be held... can't please all the people.
>>>>  LOL
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009
>>>> at 4:07 PM, Anthony Frackowiak <frackowiak at sbcglobal.net>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>  I absolutely agree.
>>>> IRCHA will not move their dates unless forced to by the AMA.
>>>> And I doubt the AMA will do so.
>>>> I find it hard to believe that this has not
>>>> been worked out yet.
>>>> Tony
>>>>     On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:00
>>>> PM, Bill's Email wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Anthony Frackowiak wrote: Archie is absolutely correct.
>>>> Tony
>>>>  On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Archie Stafford
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>  IRCHA is a totally
>>>> different animal though.  Kind of like having Joe Nall
>>>> after the pattern worlds.  I?d say most people really
>>>> didn?t
>>>> care about the F3C worlds.  IRCHA does a lot more 3D
>>>> stuff.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> And my point was that attracting 900 paid participants to
>>>> an event is going to give them some clout when it comes to a
>>>> schedule relative to the pattern NATS. The WC are a
>>>> different thing, but IRCHA is not likely to budge for the
>>>> pattern NATS if it came to that.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Thu Sep  3 08:54:01 2009
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 16:54:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . .
	.	. .
In-Reply-To: <010901ca2c9e$1aa31230$4fe93690$@net>
Message-ID: <20090903115359.J3WY8.10068.root@Web01>

Hear, Hear!

George
---- michael s harrison <drmikedds at sbcglobal.net> wrote: 

=============
My thoughts and opinion.  First of all, the Nats is being treated as if it
is just a local, fly for fun, whatever event.  The Nats is a national event
where the best in the US and those from any other country competes for the
National title.  This is the biggest competition in the United States.  It
is also the best competitive pattern event the US, possibly in the world.
There are a core group of individuals that make all that possible.  The
event has evolved, grown and matured over the course of many years.  It
works very well.  I would be very cautious about doing any major upheaval to
that event.

 

Very importantly also, the world championships is the the FAI worlds
premiere event in pattern.  It deserves its sole identity and space.  I
strongly recommend it has its own time and commitment.  It is 2 years away.
Now is the time to get the core group together to put an event together we
can all be proud of.  People that travel from all over the world to come
here to compete deserve our very best uncompromised effort.

 

It is very important we decide our philosophy in this issue.  Are we doing
this to please the casual flyer or the dedicated competitor?  Is it a
curiosity or a serious commitment to provide the very best arena to find the
best flyer in the nation and the world?

 

I say make the Nationals the best in the nation, make the World Championship
the best in the world.

 

I believe this twofer concept will make both events suffer.  I am opposed to
it.  

 

Separate the events by a substantial time frame.  Find someone dedicated to
making the world championship a truly world class event.  Build a team for
it.  Make it happen.

 

 

Regards,

Mike 

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony
Frackowiak
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 5:52 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . .
. .

 

Not the same thing. The IRCHA meet is not a competition, practice fields are
not at a premium. I still say the WC's should be held in September.

 

Tony

 

On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:36 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:





So the IRCHA guys had their fly-in directly after the f3c world champs... I
think it worked for them.

 

Perhaps IRCHA can be persuaded to move their event out 1 week to accommodate
us?

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 3:28 PM, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net> wrote:

Archie Stafford wrote: 

I'm guessing the IRCHA guys will fight those dates as well as that is time
they normally have their fly in, and due to the size it has grown to, I
doubt they will be willing to give it up.

 

Arch

 

 

I heard they only got like 900 or so paid pilots this past year. Is that a
lot??







_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 



From bob at toprudder.com  Thu Sep  3 10:06:51 2009
From: bob at toprudder.com (Bob Richards)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 18:06:51 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Used Pattern plane???
In-Reply-To: <381bf2de0909030752q3a7ae1eaga5428f57c37fba9c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <890869.99656.qm@web1109.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>

Is called "Aspera".? They have a REALLY COOL video of it on their website . ;->
http://www.3dhobbyshop.com/images/3DH-ASPERA.wmv
?
Bob R.

--- On Thu, 9/3/09, Jim Houck <nsrcapilot at gmail.com> wrote:



3H Hobby Shop will be there and they make a small (47")? electric pattern practice plane -- the Asperia I believe. 
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From dwaynenancy at suddenlink.net  Thu Sep  3 12:14:10 2009
From: dwaynenancy at suddenlink.net (Dwayne Brown)
Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 20:14:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . ..
	.
In-Reply-To: <4EF471F0-4D4B-4D83-8549-2C6F7AA8EADD@cox.net>
Message-ID: <3E819D0618C64A6186C7DB96309B87E0@YoursMine>

I can help if needed.  Dwayne Brown

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
Sent: Thursday, September 03, 2009 10:40 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie . . ..
.

Mike Mueller said, "Will finding volunteers be difficult? No doubt.  
Can we do it all? I'm pretty confident but it won't be easy and we  
need people to be understanding and flexable."

I think Tony Stillman will agree that, if we could get the country's  
R/C aerobatics pilots to come to an old Navy field on the Gulf Coast  
near Navarre, Florida and perform all the "skill jobs" required to  
run an F3A World Championships, like we did in 1999, I think we can  
handle putting on one in Muncie in 2011.

BTW, CPLR was there in 1999, and it is worth watching him fly.

Ron Van Putte
1999 F3A WC co-CD




From precisionaero at hotmail.com  Fri Sep  4 07:54:32 2009
From: precisionaero at hotmail.com (Michael Cohen)
Date: Fri, 04 Sep 2009 15:54:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers
In-Reply-To: <890869.99656.qm@web1109.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
References: <381bf2de0909030752q3a7ae1eaga5428f57c37fba9c@mail.gmail.com>
	<890869.99656.qm@web1109.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BLU115-W112AC684609025730D8F34A0EE0@phx.gbl>


Anyone know a good website to look at trailers on the smaller side of the market?  For just two pattern planes, even a 4' width X 8' length X 6' to 8' high trailer seems to be a little large, especially for storing it.  I was interested in looking at something at least shorter, height-wise.

 

Mike Cohen

_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live: Keep your friends up to date with what you do online.
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Fri Sep  4 08:08:42 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Fri, 04 Sep 2009 16:08:42 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers
In-Reply-To: <1321201542.2828611252080418264.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1980489757.2829371252080521454.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>



Hi Mike, 



I would like to get something similar? but made with aluminum.? I got the following but looks too small.? I wonder if this company could make it bigger.? 

Check these web sites : 



http://www.alumaklm.com/ae46_all-purpose_enclosed_trailer.html 



Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Michael Cohen" <precisionaero at hotmail.com> 
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 10:54:30 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers 

Anyone know a good website to look at trailers on the smaller side of the market?? For just two pattern planes, even a 4' width X 8' length X 6' to 8'?high trailer seems to be a little large, especially for storing it.? I was interested in looking at something at least shorter, height-wise. 
? 
Mike Cohen 






Windows Live: Keep your friends up to date with what you do online. Find out more. 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From rickrosinski at hotmail.com  Fri Sep  4 08:09:18 2009
From: rickrosinski at hotmail.com (Rick Rosinski)
Date: Fri, 04 Sep 2009 16:09:18 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers
In-Reply-To: <BLU115-W112AC684609025730D8F34A0EE0@phx.gbl>
References: <381bf2de0909030752q3a7ae1eaga5428f57c37fba9c@mail.gmail.com>
	<890869.99656.qm@web1109.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com> 
	<BLU115-W112AC684609025730D8F34A0EE0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY108-W8D0219B36CDC5F0E809DAC4EE0@phx.gbl>


Mike,

I just bought a 4'X8' trailer and build a box on top of it with ply wood.  I can easily fit two Black Magics in it and I built a shelf to put wings, transmitters, chargers etc on.  I can send you pics if you're interested.

Rick

This is the link to the trailer I bought.

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=42709

 



From: precisionaero at hotmail.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 2009 09:54:30 -0600
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers








Anyone know a good website to look at trailers on the smaller side of the market?  For just two pattern planes, even a 4' width X 8' length X 6' to 8' high trailer seems to be a little large, especially for storing it.  I was interested in looking at something at least shorter, height-wise.

 

Mike Cohen

Windows Live: Keep your friends up to date with what you do online. Find out more.
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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Fri Sep  4 09:53:06 2009
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Fri, 04 Sep 2009 17:53:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers
In-Reply-To: <BLU115-W112AC684609025730D8F34A0EE0@phx.gbl>
References: <381bf2de0909030752q3a7ae1eaga5428f57c37fba9c@mail.gmail.com>
	<890869.99656.qm@web1109.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
	<BLU115-W112AC684609025730D8F34A0EE0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <75862.80430.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Mike,
Did you see the grey one I had at the weak signals contest? I recently set that one up?as my pattern plane hauler and it works great. The size seems to be just right.

Anthony?




________________________________
From: Michael Cohen <precisionaero at hotmail.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 11:54:30 AM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers

Anyone know a good website to look at trailers on the smaller side of the market?? For just two pattern planes, even a 4' width X 8' length X 6' to 8'?high trailer seems to be a little large, especially for storing it.? I was interested in looking at something at least shorter, height-wise.
?
Mike Cohen

________________________________
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From renegrebe39 at gmail.com  Fri Sep  4 14:15:45 2009
From: renegrebe39 at gmail.com (Rene Grebe)
Date: Fri, 04 Sep 2009 22:15:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Speaking of the 2011 Worlds at Muncie
Message-ID: <3fb8560a0909041515q18a995e2n46bef38504d6d472@mail.gmail.com>

I'm back getting involved with Pattern and you can count on me for help.

Ren? Grebe
renegrebe39 at gmail.com
512/330-4485(H)  626/991-0842(C)
Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving
safely
in an attractive and well preserve body, but rather to skip in sideways,
body
thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming 'Woo Hoo, what a ride!!!.
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Fri Sep  4 16:43:31 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Sat, 05 Sep 2009 00:43:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers
In-Reply-To: <BLU115-W112AC684609025730D8F34A0EE0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <1989363982.3013461252111410580.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>



Check this one.? Probably is what we would like to find but we have to go to Spain to get it.? 



http://www.depablos.net/OFERTAREMOLQUES2009.pdf 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Michael Cohen" <precisionaero at hotmail.com> 
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 10:54:30 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers 

Anyone know a good website to look at trailers on the smaller side of the market?? For just two pattern planes, even a 4' width X 8' length X 6' to 8'?high trailer seems to be a little large, especially for storing it.? I was interested in looking at something at least shorter, height-wise. 
? 
Mike Cohen 






Windows Live: Keep your friends up to date with what you do online. Find out more. 
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From precisionaero at hotmail.com  Fri Sep  4 18:06:42 2009
From: precisionaero at hotmail.com (Michael Cohen)
Date: Sat, 05 Sep 2009 02:06:42 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers
In-Reply-To: <1989363982.3013461252111410580.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <BLU115-W112AC684609025730D8F34A0EE0@phx.gbl>
	<1989363982.3013461252111410580.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <BLU115-W28360E96E93EB8EDA01A12A0ED0@phx.gbl>


Lots of good ideas out there everyone, thanks.  As for the one is Spain, well, my companies HQ is there.  I wonder if they would check it on the airplane as oversized baggage......  Of course, I could always build something like it.  Now I have a winter design project.

 

Basically, heading out to St. Louis this past weekend made me think that here I am spending some money on a hotel, dinner, etc...  and I am there all by myself.  I like hanging out with the flyers, of course, but if the family could come, they could check out the town while the contest is going on and we could still meet up for dinner with everyone else and such.  They really aren't likely to hang around the field, and that is OK, but I might get in a lot less trouble with the boss if we still traveled around together.
 


Date: Sat, 5 Sep 2009 00:43:30 +0000
From: vicenterc at comcast.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers





Check this one.  Probably is what we would like to find but we have to go to Spain to get it.  

 

http://www.depablos.net/OFERTAREMOLQUES2009.pdf

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Cohen" <precisionaero at hotmail.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 10:54:30 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers



Anyone know a good website to look at trailers on the smaller side of the market?  For just two pattern planes, even a 4' width X 8' length X 6' to 8' high trailer seems to be a little large, especially for storing it.  I was interested in looking at something at least shorter, height-wise.
 
Mike Cohen








Windows Live: Keep your friends up to date with what you do online. Find out more. 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From brian_w_young at yahoo.com  Fri Sep  4 19:06:12 2009
From: brian_w_young at yahoo.com (brian young)
Date: Sat, 05 Sep 2009 03:06:12 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers
In-Reply-To: <1989363982.3013461252111410580.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <1989363982.3013461252111410580.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <649933.16861.qm@web112118.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

That one is nice. I bet a smallish car would handle it decently, or a bigger car and not take as big a hit on gas mileage.

I bet you could get someone to make it, modify it a little to have a ramp out the back to drag the 40% out. 




________________________________
From: "Vicente "Vince" Bortone" <vicenterc at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 7:43:30 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers


Check this one.  Probably is what we would like to find but we have to go to Spain to get it.  
 
http://www.depablos.net/OFERTAREMOLQUES2009.pdf

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Cohen" <precisionaero at hotmail.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 10:54:30 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers

 Anyone know a good website to look at trailers on the smaller side of the market?  For just two pattern planes, even a 4' width X 8' length X 6' to 8' high trailer seems to be a little large, especially for storing it.  I was interested in looking at something at least shorter, height-wise.
 
Mike Cohen


________________________________
 
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From troy at troynewman.net  Fri Sep  4 19:33:36 2009
From: troy at troynewman.net (Troy Newman)
Date: Sat, 05 Sep 2009 03:33:36 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers
In-Reply-To: <BLU115-W28360E96E93EB8EDA01A12A0ED0@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU115-W112AC684609025730D8F34A0EE0@phx.gbl><1989363982.3013461252111410580.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<BLU115-W28360E96E93EB8EDA01A12A0ED0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB20193A082@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>

Mike,

Go to the trailer dealers....

PACE, Featherlite and so on.

 

They can build you a custom trailer to your height needs. Basically the
same 6 x 10ft but have it say 65" tall. They build these anyway and can
customize to your needs. Normal trailers don't fit in normal garage
doors. They are usually too tall.

 

But you can measure it up and they can make one for you.  In most cases
the cost to customize is minimal from ordering a trailer. Of course it
can be a little more money than buying one they have sitting on the
lot.....

 

If you are going to travel, not just 10miles to the field and back, you
will benefit and wish you had...V nose for better gas mileage and a
little extra storage up front. Real Trailer radial tires for some reason
they always put crappy tires on the trailers...You need good radial
tires. And last but not least a side door at the front. It will benefit
you loading and unloading as well as when you leave the models in the
trailer to get at the stuff stored up front like a generator, fuel,
cooler, chairs, EZ up, and other needed items.

 

 

Troy

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Michael
Cohen
Sent: Friday, September 04, 2009 7:07 PM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers

 

Lots of good ideas out there everyone, thanks.  As for the one is Spain,
well, my companies HQ is there.  I wonder if they would check it on the
airplane as oversized baggage......  Of course, I could always build
something like it.  Now I have a winter design project.
 
Basically, heading out to St. Louis this past weekend made me think that
here I am spending some money on a hotel, dinner, etc...  and I am there
all by myself.  I like hanging out with the flyers, of course, but if
the family could come, they could check out the town while the contest
is going on and we could still meet up for dinner with everyone else and
such.  They really aren't likely to hang around the field, and that is
OK, but I might get in a lot less trouble with the boss if we still
traveled around together.
 

________________________________

Date: Sat, 5 Sep 2009 00:43:30 +0000
From: vicenterc at comcast.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers

Check this one.  Probably is what we would like to find but we have to
go to Spain to get it.  
 
http://www.depablos.net/OFERTAREMOLQUES2009.pdf

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Cohen" <precisionaero at hotmail.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 10:54:30 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers

Anyone know a good website to look at trailers on the smaller side of
the market?  For just two pattern planes, even a 4' width X 8' length X
6' to 8' high trailer seems to be a little large, especially for storing
it.  I was interested in looking at something at least shorter,
height-wise.
 
Mike Cohen



________________________________


Windows Live: Keep your friends up to date with what you do online. Find
out more.
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GL:ON:WL:en-US:SI_SB_online:082009>  
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing
list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Sat Sep  5 05:26:01 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Sat, 05 Sep 2009 13:26:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers
In-Reply-To: <1772553026.3093641252157111406.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1798901603.3093721252157160566.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>



Hi Brian, 



You are correct.? That one is made for small cars (Europe).? We just need to find out who can make it here using aluminum.? The key is?to reduce the weight so small cars can pull easier?or get good gas mileage. 



Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: " brian young" < brian _w_young at yahoo.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 10:06:11 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers 



That one is nice. I bet a smallish car would handle it decently, or a bigger car and not take as big a hit on gas mileage. 

I bet you could get someone to make it, modify it a little to have a ramp out the back to drag the 40% out. 




From: "Vicente "Vince" Bortone " < vicenterc @comcast.net> 
To: General pattern discussion < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 7:43:30 PM 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers 




Check this one.? Probably is what we would like to find but we have to go to Spain to get it.? 



http :// www . depablos .net/OFERTAREMOLQUES2009. pdf 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Michael Cohen" < precisionaero @ hotmail .com> 
To: nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 10:54:30 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers 

Anyone know a good website to look at trailers on the smaller side of the market?? For just two pattern planes, even a 4' width X 8' length X 6' to 8'?high trailer seems to be a little large, especially for storing it.? I was interested in looking at something at least shorter, height-wise. 
? 
Mike Cohen 








Windows Live: Keep your friends up to date with what you do online . Find out more. 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 

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From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Sat Sep  5 07:44:52 2009
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Sat, 05 Sep 2009 15:44:52 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Larks Annual Gulf Coast Pattern Championship
Message-ID: <20090905104450.5KN8H.204561.root@Web02>

Hello all!

I want to remind everyone that LARKS RC will again host the Gulf Coast Pattern Championship the weekend of October 3-4.   The field will be open all week before the contest if you want to come early and practice.  Our facility features a wide and long paved North South runway with no obstruction to either approach. We have an air conditioned club house with indoor plumbing and we have large covered areas north and south of the clubhouse with enough 4X8 tables for everyone to use a couple.  Each table has a pair of overhead electrical outlets.

We'll be flying all classes, Sportsman through FAI.  We will plan to fly the P11 schedule for FAI both days (at the request of the FAI guys represented by Earl Haury).

Please direct any questions my way.....email  glmiller3 at suddenlink.net 
                                                         phone    337 540-0375

George

  

From brian_w_young at yahoo.com  Sat Sep  5 08:10:08 2009
From: brian_w_young at yahoo.com (brian young)
Date: Sat, 05 Sep 2009 16:10:08 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kirby Chamblis - Nitro Circus
In-Reply-To: <1798901603.3093721252157160566.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <1798901603.3093721252157160566.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <88176.31026.qm@web112118.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

If any of you want to see something funny. Nitro Circus is a show on MTV they do some crazy stuff.

The current episode has a few stunts w/ Kirby Chamblis, one of the guys on the show hops in for a ride with Kirby and Kirby puts him through the wringer. They have a camera on this guys face...its quite funny....I don't think he pukes but gets close.

Brian



      
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From cahochhalter at yahoo.com  Sat Sep  5 08:16:01 2009
From: cahochhalter at yahoo.com (Charles Hochhalter)
Date: Sat, 05 Sep 2009 16:16:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers
In-Reply-To: <1798901603.3093721252157160566.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <855950.80989.qm@web180111.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

I cant remember who sells the locking aluminium frame work... kinda cool, you can frame your trailer up on the northern tools frame pretty quickly. Just need to get someone to skin it after you finish the inside.
?
Chuck

--- On Sat, 9/5/09, Vicente "Vince" Bortone <vicenterc at comcast.net> wrote:


From: Vicente "Vince" Bortone <vicenterc at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Saturday, September 5, 2009, 1:26 PM



#yiv1208304365 p {margin:0;}


Hi Brian,
?
You are correct.? That one is made for small cars (Europe).? We just need to find out who can make it here using aluminum.? The key is?to reduce the weight so small cars can pull easier?or get good gas mileage.
?
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "brian young" <brian_w_young at yahoo.com>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 10:06:11 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers





That one is nice. I bet a smallish car would handle it decently, or a bigger car and not take as big a hit on gas mileage.

I bet you could get someone to make it, modify it a little to have a ramp out the back to drag the 40% out. 





From: "Vicente "Vince" Bortone" <vicenterc at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 7:43:30 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers


#yiv1208304365 p {margin:0;}


Check this one.? Probably is what we would like to find but we have to go to Spain to get it.? 
?
http://www.depablos.net/OFERTAREMOLQUES2009.pdf

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Cohen" <precisionaero at hotmail.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 10:54:30 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers



#yiv1208304365 .hmmessage P
{
margin:0px;padding:0px;}
#yiv1208304365 {
font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana;}

Anyone know a good website to look at trailers on the smaller side of the market?? For just two pattern planes, even a 4' width X 8' length X 6' to 8'?high trailer seems to be a little large, especially for storing it.? I was interested in looking at something at least shorter, height-wise.
?
Mike Cohen






Windows Live: Keep your friends up to date with what you do online. Find out more. 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


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From tbruzewski at aol.com  Sat Sep  5 11:57:15 2009
From: tbruzewski at aol.com (tbruzewski at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 05 Sep 2009 19:57:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kirby Chamblis - Nitro Circus
In-Reply-To: <88176.31026.qm@web112118.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
References: <1798901603.3093721252157160566.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<88176.31026.qm@web112118.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <8CBFC7A279D776C-3870-DCCC@webmail-d061.sysops.aol.com>


 


 It looks like he needs to tighten his belts some the way he flops around.? Kirby sure is one heck of a pilot.

Tim



 

-----Original Message-----
From: brian young <brian_w_young at yahoo.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:10 pm
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kirby Chamblis - Nitro Circus










If any of you want to see something funny. Nitro Circus is a show on MTV they do some crazy stuff.

The current episode has a few stunts w/ Kirby Chamblis, one of the guys on the show hops in for a ride with Kirby and Kirby puts him through the wringer. They have a camera on this guys face...its quite funny....I don't think he pukes but gets close.

Brian




      
 





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



 

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From kennedybryan at bellsouth.net  Sat Sep  5 14:08:39 2009
From: kennedybryan at bellsouth.net (Bryan Kennedy)
Date: Sat, 05 Sep 2009 22:08:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers
In-Reply-To: <BLU115-W112AC684609025730D8F34A0EE0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <F322BE642C14480492F5BED55173BA7A@BryanKennedyPC>

Mike
 
Pace American is a good choice. They offer ITS (Independent Torsion
Suspension) Ride is great.  See link to my trailer
 
http://www.teamkennedy-rc.com/trailer.html
 
Regards
 
Bryan
 
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Michael
Cohen
Sent: Friday, September 04, 2009 11:55 AM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Airplane trailers
 
Anyone know a good website to look at trailers on the smaller side of
the market?  For just two pattern planes, even a 4' width X 8' length X
6' to 8' high trailer seems to be a little large, especially for storing
it.  I was interested in looking at something at least shorter,
height-wise.
 
Mike Cohen
  _____  

Windows Live: Keep your friends up to date with what you do online. Find
out more.
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From donramsey at gmail.com  Sun Sep  6 06:45:09 2009
From: donramsey at gmail.com (Don Ramsey)
Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2009 14:45:09 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] WC Results
In-Reply-To: <20090905104450.5KN8H.204561.root@Web02>
References: <20090905104450.5KN8H.204561.root@Web02>
Message-ID: <008e01ca2f00$a387ec60$ea97c520$@com>

For those who haven't seen them, I just posted the results for the Worlds
Championships 2007 & 2009 on 

http://pages.suddenlink.net/donramsey/

I'm looking for the results for other WCs but have been unable to find them.
If you have a link please let me know.

Thanks,
Don




From johnfuqua at embarqmail.com  Sun Sep  6 07:05:22 2009
From: johnfuqua at embarqmail.com (John Fuqua)
Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2009 15:05:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] WC Results
In-Reply-To: <008e01ca2f00$a387ec60$ea97c520$@com>
References: <20090905104450.5KN8H.204561.root@Web02>
	<008e01ca2f00$a387ec60$ea97c520$@com>
Message-ID: <0b1b01ca2f03$aac89580$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>

Don
I don't want to wait a year to hear your perspective of the WC.  How about
an update for us.
John

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Don Ramsey
Sent: Sunday, September 06, 2009 9:45 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] WC Results

For those who haven't seen them, I just posted the results for the Worlds
Championships 2007 & 2009 on 

http://pages.suddenlink.net/donramsey/

I'm looking for the results for other WCs but have been unable to find them.
If you have a link please let me know.

Thanks,
Don



_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From vanputte at cox.net  Sun Sep  6 07:11:21 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2009 15:11:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] WC Results
In-Reply-To: <008e01ca2f00$a387ec60$ea97c520$@com>
References: <20090905104450.5KN8H.204561.root@Web02>
	<008e01ca2f00$a387ec60$ea97c520$@com>
Message-ID: <81A4363B-372E-4E8B-AA61-63F50E81CD93@cox.net>

Contact Derek for the 1999 WC; he was the scorer.

Ron VP

On Sep 6, 2009, at 9:45 AM, Don Ramsey wrote:

> For those who haven't seen them, I just posted the results for the  
> Worlds
> Championships 2007 & 2009 on
>
> http://pages.suddenlink.net/donramsey/
>
> I'm looking for the results for other WCs but have been unable to  
> find them.
> If you have a link please let me know.
>
> Thanks,
> Don
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From vanputte at cox.net  Sun Sep  6 07:13:39 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2009 15:13:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] WC Results
In-Reply-To: <0b1b01ca2f03$aac89580$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
References: <20090905104450.5KN8H.204561.root@Web02>
	<008e01ca2f00$a387ec60$ea97c520$@com>
	<0b1b01ca2f03$aac89580$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
Message-ID: <7DC04ABB-605F-4683-A04D-E4CB1C4CDDFD@cox.net>

Yeah.  Here AND in the K-Factor (Right Chris?).

Ron VP

On Sep 6, 2009, at 10:06 AM, John Fuqua wrote:

> Don
> I don't want to wait a year to hear your perspective of the WC.   
> How about
> an update for us.
> John
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Don  
> Ramsey
> Sent: Sunday, September 06, 2009 9:45 AM
> To: 'General pattern discussion'
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] WC Results
>
> For those who haven't seen them, I just posted the results for the  
> Worlds
> Championships 2007 & 2009 on
>
> http://pages.suddenlink.net/donramsey/
>
> I'm looking for the results for other WCs but have been unable to  
> find them.
> If you have a link please let me know.
>
> Thanks,
> Don
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Sun Sep  6 07:15:23 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2009 15:15:23 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] WC Results
In-Reply-To: <81A4363B-372E-4E8B-AA61-63F50E81CD93@cox.net>
References: <20090905104450.5KN8H.204561.root@Web02><008e01ca2f00$a387ec60$ea97c520$@com>
	<81A4363B-372E-4E8B-AA61-63F50E81CD93@cox.net>
Message-ID: <208B1CC846EE44C9A733F5E550369BE6@UncleJasPC>

I've got the scores for 2001 on my page, www.jasonshulman.com under Ireland Worlds (scores)

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ron Van Putte" <vanputte at cox.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 06, 2009 11:10 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] WC Results


> Contact Derek for the 1999 WC; he was the scorer.
> 
> Ron VP
> 
> On Sep 6, 2009, at 9:45 AM, Don Ramsey wrote:
> 
>> For those who haven't seen them, I just posted the results for the  
>> Worlds
>> Championships 2007 & 2009 on
>>
>> http://pages.suddenlink.net/donramsey/
>>
>> I'm looking for the results for other WCs but have been unable to  
>> find them.
>> If you have a link please let me know.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Don
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Sun Sep  6 08:08:03 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2009 16:08:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] WC Results
In-Reply-To: <81A4363B-372E-4E8B-AA61-63F50E81CD93@cox.net>
References: <20090905104450.5KN8H.204561.root@Web02>	<008e01ca2f00$a387ec60$ea97c520$@com>
	<81A4363B-372E-4E8B-AA61-63F50E81CD93@cox.net>
Message-ID: <001301ca2f0c$33bdf300$9b39d900$@com>

Yup, still have them...

Here is Argentina as well...

http://www.argentinaf3a.com/

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
Sent: Sunday, September 06, 2009 8:11 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] WC Results

Contact Derek for the 1999 WC; he was the scorer.

Ron VP

On Sep 6, 2009, at 9:45 AM, Don Ramsey wrote:

> For those who haven't seen them, I just posted the results for the  
> Worlds
> Championships 2007 & 2009 on
>
> http://pages.suddenlink.net/donramsey/
>
> I'm looking for the results for other WCs but have been unable to  
> find them.
> If you have a link please let me know.
>
> Thanks,
> Don
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From joddino at socal.rr.com  Sun Sep  6 12:04:30 2009
From: joddino at socal.rr.com (James Oddino)
Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2009 20:04:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Composite ARF paint
Message-ID: <8E0EA780-EE08-42A9-9B02-3DEA3D0CF04C@socal.rr.com>

I'm trying to find out what kind of hardener I need for CompARF  
touchup paint.  I'm trying to hide the seams in my Integral.  The  
stuff I used on my Impact went belly up.  At one time I thought I read  
that it wasn't critical.  I wonder if I need it at all with electric?  
Any paint experts out there?  There doesn't seem to be any on RCU.

Jim

From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Sun Sep  6 14:14:15 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2009 22:14:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] RED BULL in SE
Message-ID: <8ED4B6398BAF492CA149F1DDC80E9692@UncleJasPC>

Fox is showing Red Bull Portugal

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Sun Sep  6 14:22:17 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2009 22:22:17 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] RED BULL in SE
In-Reply-To: <8ED4B6398BAF492CA149F1DDC80E9692@UncleJasPC>
References: <8ED4B6398BAF492CA149F1DDC80E9692@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <97FF3F1E91764158A83881B7B580765C@UncleJasPC>

Oops... it's FSFLA... Fox Sports Florida

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "J Shu" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 06, 2009 6:14 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] RED BULL in SE


> Fox is showing Red Bull Portugal
> 
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>

From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Sun Sep  6 15:09:16 2009
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2009 23:09:16 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] WC Results
In-Reply-To: <7DC04ABB-605F-4683-A04D-E4CB1C4CDDFD@cox.net>
References: <20090905104450.5KN8H.204561.root@Web02>
	<008e01ca2f00$a387ec60$ea97c520$@com>
	<0b1b01ca2f03$aac89580$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
	<7DC04ABB-605F-4683-A04D-E4CB1C4CDDFD@cox.net>
Message-ID: <712155.94736.qm@web33005.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I put in what I get sent Ron. Well, most of the time.  Right Ron? lol 
I missed putting Ron's article in the final proof for August. Probably gonna get fired now.. Sorry again Ron!

If someone was to send a nice writeup on the worlds, and pics, they would be appreciated by the whole Kfactor reading world! hint hint

 
Chris 
 
 
 




________________________________
From: Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 6, 2009 8:13:13 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] WC Results

Yeah.  Here AND in the K-Factor (Right Chris?).

Ron VP

On Sep 6, 2009, at 10:06 AM, John Fuqua wrote:

> Don
> I don't want to wait a year to hear your perspective of the WC.  How about
> an update for us.
> John
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Don Ramsey
> Sent: Sunday, September 06, 2009 9:45 AM
> To: 'General pattern discussion'
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] WC Results
> 
> For those who haven't seen them, I just posted the results for the Worlds
> Championships 2007 & 2009 on
> 
> http://pages.suddenlink.net/donramsey/
> 
> I'm looking for the results for other WCs but have been unable to find them.
> If you have a link please let me know.
> 
> Thanks,
> Don
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



      
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From precisionaero at hotmail.com  Sun Sep  6 15:53:34 2009
From: precisionaero at hotmail.com (Michael Cohen)
Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2009 23:53:34 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] YS 160DZ follow up, YS 140DZ for sale
In-Reply-To: <712155.94736.qm@web33005.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <20090905104450.5KN8H.204561.root@Web02>
	<008e01ca2f00$a387ec60$ea97c520$@com>
	<0b1b01ca2f03$aac89580$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
	<7DC04ABB-605F-4683-A04D-E4CB1C4CDDFD@cox.net> 
	<712155.94736.qm@web33005.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BLU115-W1106F180EA4F373B219C40A0EC0@phx.gbl>


Well, the 160DZ problem from a few weeks back is solved.  After successful ground runs I once again had a dead stick in flight.  I decided it was time to send it in to YS and I took the engine out of the plane.  Then, something on the front caught my eye as I was about to stick it into the plastic bag.  The fuel line at the front of the engine was split right at the bulge of the upper nipple.  Good grief Charlie Brown, can?t believe after the mid-air I did not check the simplest of things.  I took the engine (alsmost) completely apart!  Well, with a new fuel line the engine runs great, so now that the 160DZ is working, I have no need for a backup 140DZ, so it is for sale.  I have found it seems to like a 17X10N at Michigan altitude and at my former location of Albuquerque too.  It had plenty of power to pull my Brio through this years and last years Master?s sequence.  I am asking for $350 for the engine.  Please e-mail me privately if you are interested.  I am going to the D4 championship in a few weeks, so if you are headed there, I can bring it with me.  If you are not, I can ship it too.
 
Michael Cohen  

 

_________________________________________________________________
With Windows Live, you can organize, edit, and share your photos.
http://www.windowslive.com/Desktop/PhotoGallery
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From pcosky at comcast.net  Sun Sep  6 16:29:22 2009
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Mon, 07 Sep 2009 00:29:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Black Magic v2.2 for sale
Message-ID: <01f501ca2f52$51d50860$f57f1920$@net>

I have a BM v2.2 that is in the bones, just needs covered and finished. I
have two sets of wings for it and the horizontal stab is set up for servos,
but it also had a DEPS retrofitted. Price will depend on what all you want
with it. I will be at COMAIR so I could deliver it there. Email me at
pcosky at comast.net for prices or pics.

 

Pete

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From rcpilot at wowway.com  Mon Sep  7 14:00:22 2009
From: rcpilot at wowway.com (Ron Hansen)
Date: Mon, 07 Sep 2009 22:00:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
Message-ID: <0EC6FD6AF90B41F1BD1A1409469BA2E6@toshibauser>

Anyone have an Impulse Chin Cowl that they could sell me?
 
Ron Hansen
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From duane.e.beck at comcast.net  Mon Sep  7 17:35:08 2009
From: duane.e.beck at comcast.net (Duane Beck)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 01:35:08 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Re-fuel fittings
Message-ID: <4AA5B4C9.3020009@comcast.net>

What fitting(s) do you use for refueling a cowled engine?  There's not 
enough room behind my carb for the third fill line and it keeps getting 
torn from pulling it out and pushing it back in, and then leaking fuel.

Duane

From Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au  Mon Sep  7 18:35:19 2009
From: Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au (Koenig, Tom)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 02:35:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Graphtech F3A Gear
Message-ID: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C53949F5@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>

Hi again all,

I am just considering the GraphTech F3A long landing gear. Do any of you already have it in use? It appears to be a good bit of gear...any comments before I click 'buy'? It looks like it will be long enough for the bigger paint stirrers we use these days.

Thanks

Tom Koenig



________________________________
************************************************************************
*PLEASE NOTE* This email and any attachments may
be confidential. If received in error, please delete all
copies and advise the sender. The reproduction or
dissemination of this email or its attachments is
prohibited without the consent of the sender.

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From burtona at atmc.net  Mon Sep  7 19:04:43 2009
From: burtona at atmc.net (Dave Burton)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 03:04:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric props vs. standard pattern
In-Reply-To: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C53949F5@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>
References: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C53949F5@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>
Message-ID: <006301ca3031$0d880830$28981890$@net>

Why are we using the Electric style APC props on electric powered pattern
planes rather than the standard pattern props? We are turning the electric
motors at comparable RPMs to a glow engine. The standard pattern props are
stiffer and should be more efficient it seems to me. I can understand a
little weight savings if needed but is that the only reason for using the
E-props? What am I missing? Anyone compared similar E and standard props in
the same sizes? What results did you find? 
Dave Burton

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From rclen123 at roadrunner.com  Mon Sep  7 19:33:16 2009
From: rclen123 at roadrunner.com (rclen)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 03:33:16 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Graphtech F3A Gear
In-Reply-To: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C53949F5@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>
References: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C53949F5@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>
Message-ID: <4AA5D09A.5030207@roadrunner.com>

Koenig, Tom wrote:
>
> Hi again all,
>
> I am just considering the GraphTech F3A long landing gear. Do any of 
> you already have it in use? It appears to be a good bit of gear?any 
> comments before I click ?buy?? It looks like it will be long enough 
> for the bigger paint stirrers we use these days.
>
> Thanks
>
> **/Tom Koenig/**
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ************************************************************************
> *PLEASE NOTE* This email and any attachments may
> be confidential. If received in error, please delete all
> copies and advise the sender. The reproduction or
> dissemination of this email or its attachments is
> prohibited without the consent of the sender.
>
> WARNING RE VIRUSES: Our computer systems sweep
> outgoing email to guard against viruses, but no warranty
> is given that this email or its attachments are virus free.
> Before opening or using attachments, please check for
> viruses. Our liability is limited to the re-supply of any
> affected attachments.
>
> Any views expressed in this message are those of the
> individual sender, except where the sender expressly,
> and with authority, states them to be the views of the
> organisation.
> ************************************************************************
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
Hello Tom: Yes I am using there long gear on an Element 170 with no 
problems, and the price was very fair. Lynn Burks District 7

From kvelez at rochester.rr.com  Mon Sep  7 19:41:05 2009
From: kvelez at rochester.rr.com (Ken Velez)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 03:41:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric props vs. standard pattern
In-Reply-To: <006301ca3031$0d880830$28981890$@net>
Message-ID: <28A98DE6236B45CBB1D9F4031B5C4137@KEN>

Hi Dave,

 

It seems to me that the electrics are not turning comparable numbers. Most
setups are turning in the low to mid 6000 and only 1 or 2 set ups are in the
7000 and none in the 8000 that I know of. This is based on what I have
observed only; so there could be a setup turning higher numbers; and on a
10S battery. If you go to more cells = more Volts = more RPM's also more
Amps. FAI is caped to 10 cells not sure about AMA. My Hacker A-60 is on the
mid 7000 and we were using the 18.1X10-11-12 glow props; while it flies very
nice with these props the plane is very slow for top classes and or wind. So
right now I'm using an E prop; huge difference. It's also my understanding
that the E props are more efficient than the regular glow props not 100%
sure but pretty certain about it but you are correct about the stiffer is
more efficient when comparing 2 identical props lets say one plastic and one
carbon but not equal when comparing different airfoils. An APC 20X10 E will
be more efficient than a 20 X10 Glow and if you can make the APC 20X10E in
Carbon it will be more efficient than the original 20X10E etc. Just my
observations. 

 

Ken

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dave Burton
Sent: Monday, September 07, 2009 11:04 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric props vs. standard pattern

 

Why are we using the Electric style APC props on electric powered pattern
planes rather than the standard pattern props? We are turning the electric
motors at comparable RPMs to a glow engine. The standard pattern props are
stiffer and should be more efficient it seems to me. I can understand a
little weight savings if needed but is that the only reason for using the
E-props? What am I missing? Anyone compared similar E and standard props in
the same sizes? What results did you find? 
Dave Burton

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From kvelez at rochester.rr.com  Mon Sep  7 20:47:46 2009
From: kvelez at rochester.rr.com (Ken Velez)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 04:47:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Dave Snow Contact info
In-Reply-To: <168853.85107.qm@web33002.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <2331D02B4E9A400FBF76E81554A7FD40@ken42e65a0511d>

I'm looking for Dave Snow. Does anyone have his contact info that can send
it to me off list or forward this message to him please?

 

TIA

 

Ken

 

kvelez at rochester.rr.com

 

 

 

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From DaveL322 at comcast.net  Mon Sep  7 21:10:16 2009
From: DaveL322 at comcast.net (Dave)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 05:10:16 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric props vs. standard pattern
In-Reply-To: <28A98DE6236B45CBB1D9F4031B5C4137@KEN>
References: <006301ca3031$0d880830$28981890$@net>
	<28A98DE6236B45CBB1D9F4031B5C4137@KEN>
Message-ID: <375815E312874CC39A41DA40926C843D@davedesktop>

Dave,

 

The ideal prop airfoil shape is compromised to provide the needed structural
integrity to withstand aerodynamic, gyroscopic, and impulse loads (from
firing of combustion engines, and even pulses from electric motors).  Ideal
in this context meaning most thrust and/or speed for least amount of input
power.  Because the impulse loads from an electric motor are lower, and
electrics are generally run at lower RPM (primarily to take advantage of
larger more efficient props), it is possible to design a prop that is closer
to the ideal shape and lighter while still having the needed structural
integrity.

 

Several years ago, I played with a very high RPM outrunner (295 KV) and
checked many different props, including some E vs glow prop comparisons -

16x10E - 8400 RPM, 79 amps

16x10 - 8800 RPM, 69 amps

Performance in the air was very similar, but the E prop was much lighter
(about 65% the weight of the glow prop).  I preferred the glow prop because
it afforded the same performance with cooler motor, ESC, and lipo temps
(less mah discharged for an equal flight).

 

I've run high RPM (7500 - 8000) outrunners in pattern quite a bit, and had
always found the glow props to be better - in terms of lower input watts
needed and fewer mah consumed for equal flights...and I had a theory
why...but never "proved" it to myself until this past year.  I laminated a
number of E props of various sizes for various motors/RPMs with CF cloth,
and found on the higher RPM setups, the E props with CF would turn more RPM
and draw less amps..and in the air they indeed performed better than a stock
E prop or a similar sized glow prop.  With respect to pattern sized
motors/power...I saw very little improvement at <6500 RPM, but noticeable
improvement >7000 RPM.

 

The vast majority of electrics being used in pattern are <6500 RPM (and the
unload in the air is a reduction in amps, but very little increase in RPM),
while the majority of glow stuff is running between 7400 and 8400 (and can
unload to ~+10% RPM in the air)...so the difference in 6500 and 8700
(unloaded) is pretty substantial when you start looking at prop structure
needed to eliminate flexing.

 

Regards,

 

Dave Lockhart

DaveL322 at comcast.net

 

 

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ken Velez
Sent: Monday, September 07, 2009 11:41 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric props vs. standard pattern

 

Hi Dave,

 

It seems to me that the electrics are not turning comparable numbers. Most
setups are turning in the low to mid 6000 and only 1 or 2 set ups are in the
7000 and none in the 8000 that I know of. This is based on what I have
observed only; so there could be a setup turning higher numbers; and on a
10S battery. If you go to more cells = more Volts = more RPM's also more
Amps. FAI is caped to 10 cells not sure about AMA. My Hacker A-60 is on the
mid 7000 and we were using the 18.1X10-11-12 glow props; while it flies very
nice with these props the plane is very slow for top classes and or wind. So
right now I'm using an E prop; huge difference. It's also my understanding
that the E props are more efficient than the regular glow props not 100%
sure but pretty certain about it but you are correct about the stiffer is
more efficient when comparing 2 identical props lets say one plastic and one
carbon but not equal when comparing different airfoils. An APC 20X10 E will
be more efficient than a 20 X10 Glow and if you can make the APC 20X10E in
Carbon it will be more efficient than the original 20X10E etc. Just my
observations. 

 

Ken

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dave Burton
Sent: Monday, September 07, 2009 11:04 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric props vs. standard pattern

 

Why are we using the Electric style APC props on electric powered pattern
planes rather than the standard pattern props? We are turning the electric
motors at comparable RPMs to a glow engine. The standard pattern props are
stiffer and should be more efficient it seems to me. I can understand a
little weight savings if needed but is that the only reason for using the
E-props? What am I missing? Anyone compared similar E and standard props in
the same sizes? What results did you find? 
Dave Burton

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From jrm at ne-aero.com  Tue Sep  8 03:35:58 2009
From: jrm at ne-aero.com (John Marien)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 11:35:58 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Graphtech F3A Gear
In-Reply-To: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C53949F5@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>
References: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C53949F5@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>
Message-ID: <FA9E32E59B0E4EB28CDA8B789EDAEA22@icarus>

Tom,

 

I'm not using that specific landing gear from GraphTech.  However, GraphTech
is the supplier I use for all of the CF gear in my 2M Aquila F3A ARF/ARC
kits.

 

John

Northeast Aerodynamics, Inc.

PO Box 1054

Hollis, NH  03049

603.465.6508

http://www.ne-aero.com/

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Koenig, Tom
Sent: Monday, September 07, 2009 10:35 PM
To: 'NSRCA'
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Graphtech F3A Gear

 

Hi again all,

 

I am just considering the GraphTech F3A long landing gear. Do any of you
already have it in use? It appears to be a good bit of gear.any comments
before I click 'buy'? It looks like it will be long enough for the bigger
paint stirrers we use these days.

 

Thanks 

 

Tom Koenig

 

 

 

  _____  

************************************************************************
*PLEASE NOTE* This email and any attachments may
be confidential. If received in error, please delete all
copies and advise the sender. The reproduction or
dissemination of this email or its attachments is
prohibited without the consent of the sender.

WARNING RE VIRUSES: Our computer systems sweep
outgoing email to guard against viruses, but no warranty
is given that this email or its attachments are virus free.
Before opening or using attachments, please check for
viruses. Our liability is limited to the re-supply of any
affected attachments.

Any views expressed in this message are those of the
individual sender, except where the sender expressly,
and with authority, states them to be the views of the
organisation.
************************************************************************

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From getterflash at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  8 05:29:56 2009
From: getterflash at yahoo.com (Bob Kane)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 13:29:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric props vs. standard pattern
In-Reply-To: <375815E312874CC39A41DA40926C843D@davedesktop>
References: <006301ca3031$0d880830$28981890$@net>
	<28A98DE6236B45CBB1D9F4031B5C4137@KEN>
	<375815E312874CC39A41DA40926C843D@davedesktop>
Message-ID: <451808.99560.qm@web32704.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Nice analysis, thanks for sharing.

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com




________________________________
From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 8, 2009 1:06:03 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric props vs. standard pattern

 
Dave,
 
The ideal prop airfoil shape is
compromised to provide the needed structural integrity to withstand aerodynamic,
gyroscopic, and impulse loads (from firing of combustion engines, and even
pulses from electric motors).  Ideal in this context meaning most thrust
and/or speed for least amount of input power.  Because the impulse loads
from an electric motor are lower, and electrics are generally run at lower RPM
(primarily to take advantage of larger more efficient props), it is possible to
design a prop that is closer to the ideal shape and lighter while still having the
needed structural integrity.
 
Several years ago, I played with a very
high RPM outrunner (295 KV) and checked many different props, including some E
vs glow prop comparisons ?
16x10E ? 8400 RPM, 79 amps
16x10 ? 8800 RPM, 69 amps
Performance in the air was very similar,
but the E prop was much lighter (about 65% the weight of the glow prop).  I
preferred the glow prop because it afforded the same performance with cooler
motor, ESC, and lipo temps (less mah discharged for an equal flight).
 
I?ve run high RPM (7500 ?
8000) outrunners in pattern quite a bit, and had always found the glow props to
be better ? in terms of lower input watts needed and fewer mah consumed
for equal flights?..and I had a theory why?..but never ?proved?
it to myself until this past year.  I laminated a number of E props of
various sizes for various motors/RPMs with CF cloth, and found on the higher
RPM setups, the E props with CF would turn more RPM and draw less amps?.and
in the air they indeed performed better than a stock E prop or a similar sized
glow prop.  With respect to pattern sized motors/power?..I saw very
little improvement at <6500 RPM, but noticeable improvement >7000 RPM.
 
The vast majority of electrics being used
in pattern are <6500 RPM (and the unload in the air is a reduction in amps,
but very little increase in RPM), while the majority of glow stuff is running between
7400 and 8400 (and can unload to ~+10% RPM in the air)??.so the
difference in 6500 and 8700 (unloaded) is pretty substantial when you start
looking at prop structure needed to eliminate flexing.
 
Regards,
 
Dave Lockhart
DaveL322 at comcast.net
 
 
 

________________________________
 
From:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ken Velez
Sent: Monday, September 07, 2009
11:41 PM
To: ' General pattern discussion '
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Electric props vs. standard pattern
 
Hi Dave,
 
It seems to me that the electrics are not
turning comparable numbers. Most setups are turning in the low to mid 6000 and
only 1 or 2 set ups are in the 7000 and none in the 8000 that I know of. This
is based on what I have observed only; so there could be a setup turning higher
numbers; and on a 10S battery. If you go to more cells = more Volts = more
RPM?s also more Amps. FAI is caped to 10 cells not sure about AMA. My
Hacker A-60 is on the mid 7000 and we were using the 18.1X10-11-12 glow props;
while it flies very nice with these props the plane is very slow for top
classes and or wind. So right now I?m using an E prop; huge difference.
It?s also my understanding that the E props are more efficient than the
regular glow props not 100% sure but pretty certain about it but you are
correct about the stiffer is more efficient when comparing 2 identical props
lets say one plastic and one carbon but not equal when comparing different
airfoils. An APC 20X10 E will be more efficient than a 20 X10 Glow and if you
can make the APC 20X10E in Carbon it will be more efficient than the original
20X10E etc? Just my observations. 
 
Ken
 

________________________________
 
From:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dave Burton
Sent: Monday, September 07, 2009
11:04 PM
To: ' General pattern discussion '
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Electric props vs. standard pattern
 
Why are we using the Electric style APC props on electric
powered pattern planes rather than the standard pattern props? We are turning
the electric motors at comparable RPMs to a glow engine. The standard pattern
props are stiffer and should be more efficient it seems to me. I can understand
a little weight savings if needed but is that the only reason for using the E-props?
What am I missing? Anyone compared similar E and standard props in the same
sizes? What results did you find? 
Dave Burton


      
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From ronlock at comcast.net  Tue Sep  8 06:15:06 2009
From: ronlock at comcast.net (ronlock at comcast.net)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 14:15:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Re-fuel fittings
In-Reply-To: <1898188600.8333291252419293525.JavaMail.root@sz0086a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1004352841.8333411252419305392.JavaMail.root@sz0086a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>



Perhaps possible with your setup - 



Take line from tank clunk, route to outside of fuse.? Route a second line from engine fuel input nipple (pump, regulator etc) 

to outside of fuse.?? Fuel/de-fuel thru line to clunk.? Connect the two lines with barbed fitting to provide fuel to engine. 



Later, Ron Lockhart.???? (May be too simplistic & inexpensive for some <G>) 




----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Duane Beck" <duane.e.beck at comcast.net> 
To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Monday, September 7, 2009 9:35:05 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern 
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Re-fuel fittings 

What fitting(s) do you use for refueling a cowled engine? ?There's not 
enough room behind my carb for the third fill line and it keeps getting 
torn from pulling it out and pushing it back in, and then leaking fuel. 

Duane 
_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From rickwallace45 at gmail.com  Tue Sep  8 09:44:55 2009
From: rickwallace45 at gmail.com (richard wallace)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 17:44:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Re-fuel fittings
In-Reply-To: <1004352841.8333411252419305392.JavaMail.root@sz0086a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>
References: <1898188600.8333291252419293525.JavaMail.root@sz0086a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>
	<1004352841.8333411252419305392.JavaMail.root@sz0086a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <c8a7c8ec0909081044n1663eaf7q24df35e4f5ba4915@mail.gmail.com>

Been using Ron's setup forever, though I use aluminum tubing w/ no barbs and
it's been fine.  VERY simple, Very maintable - allows a 'pinch' test of the
needle setting  - very good for peace of mind.

Downside: It isn't pretty - there's a <gasp> exposed fuel line outside the
fuselage.... !

On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 10:15 AM, <ronlock at comcast.net> wrote:

>  Perhaps possible with your setup -
>
>
>
> Take line from tank clunk, route to outside of fuse.  Route a second line
> from engine fuel input nipple (pump, regulator etc)
>
> to outside of fuse.   Fuel/de-fuel thru line to clunk.  Connect the two
> lines with barbed fitting to provide fuel to engine.
>
>
>
> Later, Ron Lockhart.     (May be too simplistic & inexpensive for some <G>)
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Duane Beck" <duane.e.beck at comcast.net>
> To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Monday, September 7, 2009 9:35:05 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Re-fuel fittings
>
> What fitting(s) do you use for refueling a cowled engine?  There's not
> enough room behind my carb for the third fill line and it keeps getting
> torn from pulling it out and pushing it back in, and then leaking fuel.
>
> Duane
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Tue Sep  8 10:05:30 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 18:05:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Scoring Program
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B77C4@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

Hey all,

We're getting ready for our D4 Championship (pronounced Pyrotechnic Night fly/Steak Roast) and I have a question about using the PACSS when flying both P-09 and F-09.  We used it at the D4-D5 shootout and had problems getting it to keep the correct rounds.

What we would LIKE it to do, assume we fly 6 rounds (4P & 2F) is keep a composite prelim score (Keeping best 3 of 4 as a single score) and then combine that with the two F scores and keep the best 2 of 3.

Can the program be set up to do that? (Easily?) or would we be better off just holding 2 different contests and combining at the end in a spreadsheet?

Any help would be appreciated!

-Mark
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From jferrell13 at triad.rr.com  Tue Sep  8 10:22:03 2009
From: jferrell13 at triad.rr.com (John Ferrell)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 18:22:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Scoring Program
References: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B77C4@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <73B721A681A048FDB52C5F57FE958837@xppro2>

I need the same info!

John Ferrell  W8CCW
 
"Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice, and moderation in pursuit of justice is no virtue."
-Barry Goldwater
"You don't get harmony when everybody sings the same note."
-Doug Floyd

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Atwood, Mark 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 1:57 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Scoring Program


  Hey all,

   

  We're getting ready for our D4 Championship (pronounced Pyrotechnic Night fly/Steak Roast) and I have a question about using the PACSS when flying both P-09 and F-09.  We used it at the D4-D5 shootout and had problems getting it to keep the correct rounds.

   

  What we would LIKE it to do, assume we fly 6 rounds (4P & 2F) is keep a composite prelim score (Keeping best 3 of 4 as a single score) and then combine that with the two F scores and keep the best 2 of 3.

   

  Can the program be set up to do that? (Easily?) or would we be better off just holding 2 different contests and combining at the end in a spreadsheet?

   

  Any help would be appreciated!

   

  -Mark



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From mking46516 at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  8 10:39:26 2009
From: mking46516 at yahoo.com (Marty King)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 18:39:26 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Scoring Program
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B77C4@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <849032.96707.qm@web53001.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Mark,

Gene Maurice can answer your question....the last email I had for him was gene.maurice at comcast.net

Marty King



AMA 9945 LM, CD

NSRCA 2551

Angels Shadows

http://www.fancyflying.150m.com

--- On Tue, 9/8/09, Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com> wrote:

From: Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Scoring Program
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 8, 2009, 1:57 PM




 
 






Hey all, 

 ? 

We?re getting ready for our D4 Championship
(pronounced Pyrotechnic Night fly/Steak Roast) and I have a question about
using the PACSS when flying both P-09 and F-09.? We used it at the D4-D5
shootout and had problems getting it to keep the correct rounds. 

 ? 

What we would LIKE it to do, assume we fly 6 rounds (4P &
2F) is keep a composite prelim score (Keeping best 3 of 4 as a single score)
and then combine that with the two F scores and keep the best 2 of 3. 

 ? 

Can the program be set up to do that? (Easily?) or would we
be better off just holding 2 different contests and combining at the end in a
spreadsheet? 

 ? 

Any help would be appreciated! 

 ? 

-Mark 



 


-----Inline Attachment Follows-----

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From 1shinden at att.net  Tue Sep  8 12:06:51 2009
From: 1shinden at att.net (Mike Howard)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 20:06:51 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
In-Reply-To: <0EC6FD6AF90B41F1BD1A1409469BA2E6@toshibauser>
Message-ID: <626828.20301.qm@web81105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Ron, Have you tried Nedim Beck up in Canada, he did have some Impulse parts.? I think it's, NBengineering.
?
?
Mike

--- On Mon, 9/7/09, Ron Hansen <rcpilot at wowway.com> wrote:


From: Ron Hansen <rcpilot at wowway.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Monday, September 7, 2009, 10:00 PM








Anyone have an Impulse Chin Cowl that they could sell me?
?
Ron Hansen
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From billglaze at bellsouth.net  Tue Sep  8 12:15:05 2009
From: billglaze at bellsouth.net (Bill Glaze)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 20:15:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric props vs. standard pattern
References: <006301ca3031$0d880830$28981890$@net><28A98DE6236B45CBB1D9F4031B5C4137@KEN><375815E312874CC39A41DA40926C843D@davedesktop>
	<451808.99560.qm@web32704.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3D88BECD02DB40C284A746E90EC73794@glazecstp32xp>

Dqave:
Agreeing here with Bob.  I always make hard copies of in-depth stuff by the highly qualified guys, and file it away for rainy-day reading!<G>  Well worth the paper and drawer space.  (And no, it isn't filed and forgotten!)
Bill Glaze
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Bob Kane 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 9:29 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric props vs. standard pattern


  Nice analysis, thanks for sharing.


  Bob Kane
  getterflash at yahoo.com





------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
  To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  Sent: Tuesday, September 8, 2009 1:06:03 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric props vs. standard pattern


  Dave,



  The ideal prop airfoil shape is compromised to provide the needed structural integrity to withstand aerodynamic, gyroscopic, and impulse loads (from firing of combustion engines, and even pulses from electric motors).  Ideal in this context meaning most thrust and/or speed for least amount of input power.  Because the impulse loads from an electric motor are lower, and electrics are generally run at lower RPM (primarily to take advantage of larger more efficient props), it is possible to design a prop that is closer to the ideal shape and lighter while still having the needed structural integrity.



  Several years ago, I played with a very high RPM outrunner (295 KV) and checked many different props, including some E vs glow prop comparisons ?

  16x10E ? 8400 RPM, 79 amps

  16x10 ? 8800 RPM, 69 amps

  Performance in the air was very similar, but the E prop was much lighter (about 65% the weight of the glow prop).  I preferred the glow prop because it afforded the same performance with cooler motor, ESC, and lipo temps (less mah discharged for an equal flight).



  I?ve run high RPM (7500 ? 8000) outrunners in pattern quite a bit, and had always found the glow props to be better ? in terms of lower input watts needed and fewer mah consumed for equal flights?..and I had a theory why?..but never ?proved? it to myself until this past year.  I laminated a number of E props of various sizes for various motors/RPMs with CF cloth, and found on the higher RPM setups, the E props with CF would turn more RPM and draw less amps?.and in the air they indeed performed better than a stock E prop or a similar sized glow prop.  With respect to pattern sized motors/power?..I saw very little improvement at <6500 RPM, but noticeable improvement >7000 RPM.



  The vast majority of electrics being used in pattern are <6500 RPM (and the unload in the air is a reduction in amps, but very little increase in RPM), while the majority of glow stuff is running between 7400 and 8400 (and can unload to ~+10% RPM in the air)??.so the difference in 6500 and 8700 (unloaded) is pretty substantial when you start looking at prop structure needed to eliminate flexing.



  Regards,



  Dave Lockhart

  DaveL322 at comcast.net








------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ken Velez
  Sent: Monday, September 07, 2009 11:41 PM
  To: ' General pattern discussion '
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric props vs. standard pattern



  Hi Dave,



  It seems to me that the electrics are not turning comparable numbers. Most setups are turning in the low to mid 6000 and only 1 or 2 set ups are in the 7000 and none in the 8000 that I know of. This is based on what I have observed only; so there could be a setup turning higher numbers; and on a 10S battery. If you go to more cells = more Volts = more RPM?s also more Amps. FAI is caped to 10 cells not sure about AMA. My Hacker A-60 is on the mid 7000 and we were using the 18.1X10-11-12 glow props; while it flies very nice with these props the plane is very slow for top classes and or wind. So right now I?m using an E prop; huge difference. It?s also my understanding that the E props are more efficient than the regular glow props not 100% sure but pretty certain about it but you are correct about the stiffer is more efficient when comparing 2 identical props lets say one plastic and one carbon but not equal when comparing different airfoils. An APC 20X10 E will be more efficient than a 20 X10 Glow and if you can make the APC 20X10E in Carbon it will be more efficient than the original 20X10E etc? Just my observations. 



  Ken




------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dave Burton
  Sent: Monday, September 07, 2009 11:04 PM
  To: ' General pattern discussion '
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric props vs. standard pattern



  Why are we using the Electric style APC props on electric powered pattern planes rather than the standard pattern props? We are turning the electric motors at comparable RPMs to a glow engine. The standard pattern props are stiffer and should be more efficient it seems to me. I can understand a little weight savings if needed but is that the only reason for using the E-props? What am I missing? Anyone compared similar E and standard props in the same sizes? What results did you find? 
  Dave Burton





------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From nedim at nbengineering.net  Tue Sep  8 12:23:07 2009
From: nedim at nbengineering.net (Nedim Bek)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 20:23:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
In-Reply-To: <626828.20301.qm@web81105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <19740413172912.AD5320652BC1AA7E@edmwaa03.telusplanet.net>

Sorry, I don't have any.

Nedim

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Mike Howard
Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 2:07 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl

 


Ron, Have you tried Nedim Beck up in Canada, he did have some Impulse parts.
I think it's, NBengineering.

 

 

Mike

--- On Mon, 9/7/09, Ron Hansen <rcpilot at wowway.com> wrote:


From: Ron Hansen <rcpilot at wowway.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Monday, September 7, 2009, 10:00 PM

Anyone have an Impulse Chin Cowl that they could sell me?

 

Ron Hansen


-----Inline Attachment Follows-----

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
 
<http://us.mc811.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.o
rg> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
 <http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

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From gene.maurice at sgmservice.com  Tue Sep  8 12:29:32 2009
From: gene.maurice at sgmservice.com (gene.maurice at sgmservice.com)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 20:29:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Scoring Program
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B77C4@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
References: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B77C4@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <45630.98.230.161.226.1252441762.squirrel@webmail.sgmservice.com>

Mark,


Yes it can do it, it was part of the support the NATS. Give me a call whe
you can at 678-910-2298.


Gene Maurice



> Hey all,
>
> We're getting ready for our D4 Championship (pronounced Pyrotechnic Night
> fly/Steak Roast) and I have a question about using the PACSS when flying
> both P-09 and F-09.  We used it at the D4-D5 shootout and had problems
> getting it to keep the correct rounds.
>
> What we would LIKE it to do, assume we fly 6 rounds (4P & 2F) is keep a
> composite prelim score (Keeping best 3 of 4 as a single score) and then
> combine that with the two F scores and keep the best 2 of 3.
>
> Can the program be set up to do that? (Easily?) or would we be better off
> just holding 2 different contests and combining at the end in a
> spreadsheet?
>
> Any help would be appreciated!
>
> -Mark
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



From nedim at nbengineering.net  Tue Sep  8 12:31:45 2009
From: nedim at nbengineering.net (Nedim Bek)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 20:31:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
In-Reply-To: <19740413172912.AD5320652BC1AA7E@edmwaa03.telusplanet.net>
Message-ID: <19740413172912.A3923274E7D26639@edmwaa03.telusplanet.net>

Ron,

 

Please try the following link. BN Models is now selling Impulse XP. Baris at
BN (newly BM Models) can help you with this.

 

http://en.f3amodels-bm.com <http://en.f3amodels-bm.com/> 

 

Nedim

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Nedim Bek
Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 2:23 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl

 

Sorry, I don't have any.

Nedim

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Mike Howard
Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 2:07 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl

 


Ron, Have you tried Nedim Beck up in Canada, he did have some Impulse parts.
I think it's, NBengineering.

 

 

Mike

--- On Mon, 9/7/09, Ron Hansen <rcpilot at wowway.com> wrote:


From: Ron Hansen <rcpilot at wowway.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Monday, September 7, 2009, 10:00 PM

Anyone have an Impulse Chin Cowl that they could sell me?

 

Ron Hansen


-----Inline Attachment Follows-----

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
 
<http://us.mc811.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.o
rg> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
 <http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 



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From simestd at netexpress.com  Tue Sep  8 12:59:18 2009
From: simestd at netexpress.com (Tom Simes)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 20:59:18 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Careful with those SPAM controls please,
	Yahoo! mail delayed
Message-ID: <20090908125915.2bc109fb.simestd@netexpress.com>


Just FYI, Yahoo! is currently delaying delivery of some NSRCA list
messages.  According to the error message their servers are feeding
back, the delay is due to user complaints:

host a.mx.mail.yahoo.com[67.195.168.31] refused to talk to me: 421 4.7.0
[TS01] Messages from 209.112.194.3 temporarily deferred due to user
complaints - 4.16.55.1; see http://postmaster.yahoo.com/421-ts01.html

This is a temporary error, so the NSRCA list server will retry delivery,
and the messages are getting through eventually.  Ironically this
message will be delayed as well to those on Yahoo!.

Please be careful with your provider's anti-SPAM controls, the impact of
an accidental configuration can have unintended consequences beyond the
user who makes the mistake.  As always, if you have any questions or
problems with any of the NSRCA lists (or want to start a new one - yes,
I did read the latest K-Factor), feel free to drop me a line.

-- 
Tom
 
======================================================================
   "Z-80 system stack overflow.  Shut 'er down Scotty, the system's
         sucking mud" - Error message on TRS 80 Model-16B

Tom Simes                                       simestd at netexpress.com 
======================================================================

From rcpilot at wowway.com  Tue Sep  8 14:22:09 2009
From: rcpilot at wowway.com (Ron Hansen)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 22:22:09 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
In-Reply-To: <19740413172912.A3923274E7D26639@edmwaa03.telusplanet.net>
Message-ID: <630FD4252A5248848784887291EBEB92@toshibauser>

I'm trying to get one within the next two weeks.  Otherwise I'll fix the
one I have or make a new one.
 
Keep the suggestions coming.
 
Thanks
 
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Nedim Bek
Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 4:31 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
 
Ron,
 
Please try the following link. BN Models is now selling Impulse XP.
Baris at BN (newly BM Models) can help you with this.
 
http://en.f3amodels-bm.com <http://en.f3amodels-bm.com/> 
 
Nedim
 
  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Nedim Bek
Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 2:23 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
 
Sorry, I don't have any.
Nedim
 
  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Mike
Howard
Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 2:07 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
 

Ron, Have you tried Nedim Beck up in Canada, he did have some Impulse
parts.  I think it's, NBengineering.
 
 
Mike

--- On Mon, 9/7/09, Ron Hansen <rcpilot at wowway.com> wrote:

From: Ron Hansen <rcpilot at wowway.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Monday, September 7, 2009, 10:00 PM
Anyone have an Impulse Chin Cowl that they could sell me?
 
Ron Hansen

-----Inline Attachment Follows-----
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
 
<http://us.mc811.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsr
ca.org> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
 <http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
 


__________ NOD32 4406 (20090908) Information __________

This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
http://www.eset.com


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signature database 4407 (20090908) __________

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From mkmsg at cox.net  Tue Sep  8 14:50:07 2009
From: mkmsg at cox.net (MKMSG)
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2009 22:50:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Graphtech F3A Gear
References: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C53949F5@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>
Message-ID: <ACC0F337F0464D28B7E9CDF58D75FD2E@usera1262bf031>

Tom:  I just installed the GraphTech F3A gear in my Partner.  The gear is basically the same shape and length as the Bolly Long but with a bit less sweep back.  It will provide more than adequate clearance for any prop you'll use on an electric pattern model.  It appears very strong and has a very glossy finish.  The weight is just a few grams more than my Bolly Long.  I would purchase it again.

Mike  
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Koenig, Tom 
  To: 'NSRCA' 
  Sent: Monday, September 07, 2009 9:35 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Graphtech F3A Gear


  Hi again all,

   

  I am just considering the GraphTech F3A long landing gear. Do any of you already have it in use? It appears to be a good bit of gear.any comments before I click 'buy'? It looks like it will be long enough for the bigger paint stirrers we use these days.

   

  Thanks 

   

  Tom Koenig

   

   



------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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  *PLEASE NOTE* This email and any attachments may
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From Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au  Tue Sep  8 20:45:43 2009
From: Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au (Koenig, Tom)
Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2009 04:45:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Graphtech F3A Gear
In-Reply-To: <ACC0F337F0464D28B7E9CDF58D75FD2E@usera1262bf031>
References: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C53949F5@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>
	<ACC0F337F0464D28B7E9CDF58D75FD2E@usera1262bf031>
Message-ID: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C53949F9@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>

Hi  Mike and others,
I am trying to track down some remaining Bolly stock locally-but if that fails, I'll be ordering the Graphtech, which is the most likely scenario!

A Partner? I thought I was the last remaining soul who had some new PL kits left over!!!

Thanks

Tom Koenig

________________________________
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of MKMSG
Sent: Wednesday, 9 September 2009 8:50 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Graphtech F3A Gear

Tom:  I just installed the GraphTech F3A gear in my Partner.  The gear is basically the same shape and length as the Bolly Long but with a bit less sweep back.  It will provide more than adequate clearance for any prop you'll use on an electric pattern model.  It appears very strong and has a very glossy finish.  The weight is just a few grams more than my Bolly Long.  I would purchase it again.

Mike

________________________________
************************************************************************
*PLEASE NOTE* This email and any attachments may
be confidential. If received in error, please delete all
copies and advise the sender. The reproduction or
dissemination of this email or its attachments is
prohibited without the consent of the sender.

WARNING RE VIRUSES: Our computer systems sweep
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From k6xyz at sbcglobal.net  Tue Sep  8 21:00:15 2009
From: k6xyz at sbcglobal.net (Dave Harmon)
Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2009 05:00:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Graphtech F3A Gear
In-Reply-To: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C53949F9@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>
Message-ID: <8639111BD9F1493C8731B16BC82C7A1D@skunkputer>

Nope!

I have a couple PL's too!

 

Regards

Dave Harmon
NSRCA 586
K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
Sperry, Ok. 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Koenig, Tom
Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 11:46 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Graphtech F3A Gear

 

Hi  Mike and others,

I am trying to track down some remaining Bolly stock locally-but if that
fails, I'll be ordering the Graphtech, which is the most likely scenario!

 

A Partner? I thought I was the last remaining soul who had some new PL kits
left over!!!

 

Thanks

 

Tom Koenig

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of MKMSG
Sent: Wednesday, 9 September 2009 8:50 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Graphtech F3A Gear

 

Tom:  I just installed the GraphTech F3A gear in my Partner.  The gear is
basically the same shape and length as the Bolly Long but with a bit less
sweep back.  It will provide more than adequate clearance for any prop
you'll use on an electric pattern model.  It appears very strong and has a
very glossy finish.  The weight is just a few grams more than my Bolly Long.
I would purchase it again.

 

Mike  

 

  _____  

************************************************************************
*PLEASE NOTE* This email and any attachments may
be confidential. If received in error, please delete all
copies and advise the sender. The reproduction or
dissemination of this email or its attachments is
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From Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au  Tue Sep  8 21:44:52 2009
From: Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au (Koenig, Tom)
Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2009 05:44:52 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Graphtech F3A Gear
In-Reply-To: <8639111BD9F1493C8731B16BC82C7A1D@skunkputer>
References: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C53949F9@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>
	<8639111BD9F1493C8731B16BC82C7A1D@skunkputer>
Message-ID: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C53949FD@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>

Dave...offcourse!  I forgot about you.......hehehehehehe

We both will have the pleasure of crashing out of date aeroplanes!

Tom Koenig

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dave Harmon
Sent: Wednesday, 9 September 2009 3:00 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Graphtech F3A Gear

Nope!
I have a couple PL's too!


Regards

Dave Harmon
NSRCA 586
K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
Sperry, Ok.
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Koenig, Tom
Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 11:46 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Graphtech F3A Gear

Hi  Mike and others,
I am trying to track down some remaining Bolly stock locally-but if that fails, I'll be ordering the Graphtech, which is the most likely scenario!

A Partner? I thought I was the last remaining soul who had some new PL kits left over!!!

Thanks

Tom Koenig

________________________________
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of MKMSG
Sent: Wednesday, 9 September 2009 8:50 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Graphtech F3A Gear

Tom:  I just installed the GraphTech F3A gear in my Partner.  The gear is basically the same shape and length as the Bolly Long but with a bit less sweep back.  It will provide more than adequate clearance for any prop you'll use on an electric pattern model.  It appears very strong and has a very glossy finish.  The weight is just a few grams more than my Bolly Long.  I would purchase it again.

Mike

________________________________
************************************************************************
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copies and advise the sender. The reproduction or
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Any views expressed in this message are those of the
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organisation.
************************************************************************

________________________________
************************************************************************
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copies and advise the sender. The reproduction or
dissemination of this email or its attachments is
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WARNING RE VIRUSES: Our computer systems sweep
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From frankjuliei at comcast.net  Wed Sep  9 02:34:06 2009
From: frankjuliei at comcast.net (frank)
Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2009 10:34:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Scott McNickle "STRAT 2003"
Message-ID: <E3BAB5FD3C164E75900C12FF220A56F5@FMILaptop>

Hello All,

If anyone knows this fellow - a Sportsman flyer from Wheeling, West
Virginia, please ask him to contact me off list. He sent a private message
on RCU regarding my Focus 2 , but has not disabled his  block for reply
messages.

 

Thanks,

 

Frank Imbriaco

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From patterndude at tx.rr.com  Wed Sep  9 06:09:07 2009
From: patterndude at tx.rr.com (Lance Van Nostrand)
Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2009 14:09:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
References: <19740413172912.A3923274E7D26639@edmwaa03.telusplanet.net>
Message-ID: <D29BD92BE0844A7FB295C96F85D81D12@homer>

Nedim,
Welcome back from the worlds.  How's your order backlog coming (my order is in there)?
--Lance
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Nedim Bek 
  To: 'General pattern discussion' 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 3:31 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl


  Ron,

   

  Please try the following link. BN Models is now selling Impulse XP. Baris at BN (newly BM Models) can help you with this.

   

  http://en.f3amodels-bm.com

   

  Nedim

   


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Nedim Bek
  Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 2:23 PM
  To: 'General pattern discussion'
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl

   

  Sorry, I don't have any.

  Nedim

   


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Mike Howard
  Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 2:07 PM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl

   

        Ron, Have you tried Nedim Beck up in Canada, he did have some Impulse parts.  I think it's, NBengineering.

         

         

        Mike

        --- On Mon, 9/7/09, Ron Hansen <rcpilot at wowway.com> wrote:


          From: Ron Hansen <rcpilot at wowway.com>
          Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
          To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
          Date: Monday, September 7, 2009, 10:00 PM

          Anyone have an Impulse Chin Cowl that they could sell me?

           

          Ron Hansen


        -----Inline Attachment Follows-----

        _______________________________________________
        NSRCA-discussion mailing list
        NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
        http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
       

   



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------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


------------------------------------------------------------------------------



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From nedim at nbengineering.net  Wed Sep  9 12:33:07 2009
From: nedim at nbengineering.net (Nedim Bek)
Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2009 20:33:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
In-Reply-To: <D29BD92BE0844A7FB295C96F85D81D12@homer>
Message-ID: <19740414202024.319032552FB9406B@edmwaa01.telusplanet.net>

Lance, there is no back log in orders, I have only one order, that is yours.
I've sent you an email. Thanks.

 

Watching WC was really nice. Honesty, I wasn't too happy seeing Quique
ending up being in 7th place and also I'm disappointed observing some
Europeans getting easily scored.

One more observation, I was not impressed when I saw the German team manager
handing out German booze to every judge at the reception before the
competition.

 

Nedim

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Lance Van
Nostrand
Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2009 8:09 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl

 

Nedim,

Welcome back from the worlds.  How's your order backlog coming (my order is
in there)?

--Lance

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Nedim Bek <mailto:nedim at nbengineering.net>  

To: 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 3:31 PM

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl

 

Ron,

 

Please try the following link. BN Models is now selling Impulse XP. Baris at
BN (newly BM Models) can help you with this.

 

http://en.f3amodels-bm.com

 

Nedim

 


  _____  


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Nedim Bek
Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 2:23 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl

 

Sorry, I don't have any.

Nedim

 


  _____  


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Mike Howard
Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 2:07 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl

 


Ron, Have you tried Nedim Beck up in Canada, he did have some Impulse parts.
I think it's, NBengineering.

 

 

Mike

--- On Mon, 9/7/09, Ron Hansen <rcpilot at wowway.com> wrote:


From: Ron Hansen <rcpilot at wowway.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Monday, September 7, 2009, 10:00 PM

Anyone have an Impulse Chin Cowl that they could sell me?

 

Ron Hansen


-----Inline Attachment Follows-----

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
 
<http://us.mc811.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.o
rg> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
 <http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 



__________ NOD32 4406 (20090908) Information __________

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http://www.eset.com


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


  _____  



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Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.83/2353 - Release Date: 09/08/09
06:48:00



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From Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au  Wed Sep  9 13:41:55 2009
From: Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au (Koenig, Tom)
Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2009 21:41:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
In-Reply-To: <19740414202024.319032552FB9406B@edmwaa01.telusplanet.net>
References: <D29BD92BE0844A7FB295C96F85D81D12@homer>
	<19740414202024.319032552FB9406B@edmwaa01.telusplanet.net>
Message-ID: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C53949FE@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>

AH HA....that's where the Aussies went wrong!!

For a start we had no team manager...but perhaps we too should have 'lubricated' the judges with some of Australia's finest ale's!

I'm still killing myself with laughter.........we might adopt some new Team 'tactics' for 2011.

What would you boys like to drink in the States? Taking orders now....

Tom Koenig




From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Nedim Bek
Sent: Thursday, 10 September 2009 6:33 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl

Lance, there is no back log in orders, I have only one order, that is yours. I've sent you an email. Thanks.

Watching WC was really nice. Honesty, I wasn't too happy seeing Quique ending up being in 7th place and also I'm disappointed observing some Europeans getting easily scored.
One more observation, I was not impressed when I saw the German team manager handing out German booze to every judge at the reception before the competition.

Nedim

________________________________
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Lance Van Nostrand
Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2009 8:09 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl

Nedim,
Welcome back from the worlds.  How's your order backlog coming (my order is in there)?
--Lance
----- Original Message -----
From: Nedim Bek<mailto:nedim at nbengineering.net>
To: 'General pattern discussion'<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 3:31 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl

Ron,

Please try the following link. BN Models is now selling Impulse XP. Baris at BN (newly BM Models) can help you with this.

http://en.f3amodels-bm.com

Nedim

________________________________
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Nedim Bek
Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 2:23 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl

Sorry, I don't have any.
Nedim

________________________________
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Mike Howard
Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 2:07 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl

Ron, Have you tried Nedim Beck up in Canada, he did have some Impulse parts.  I think it's, NBengineering.


Mike

--- On Mon, 9/7/09, Ron Hansen <rcpilot at wowway.com> wrote:

From: Ron Hansen <rcpilot at wowway.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Impulse Chin Cowl
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Monday, September 7, 2009, 10:00 PM
Anyone have an Impulse Chin Cowl that they could sell me?

Ron Hansen

-----Inline Attachment Follows-----
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<http://us.mc811.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion




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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Wed Sep  9 20:36:17 2009
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 04:36:17 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
Message-ID: <948326.23139.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Hey guys, 

Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few emails regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send out an informative email. 

Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot going on behind the scenes that we have no control over. And also, there was the nats, and several personal issues I had to deal with. For a few months now, things are running behind. We are working with (once again) a new graphic person and should be getting back on track soon as she now seems to understand how we want things, and also things in my life have mostly been taken care of. 

I apologize to you all for the issue's not being timely. It's not what I strive for. I like for everyone to receive their issue at roughly the same time every month. It's not as easy as it would seem to achieve this. 

Once again, my apologies!

Chris   ?  ?  ?


      
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From adriancwong at earthlink.net  Wed Sep  9 20:43:48 2009
From: adriancwong at earthlink.net (adriancwong at earthlink.net)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 04:43:48 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
Message-ID: <16156934.1252557826798.JavaMail.root@wamui-haziran.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Chris,

No apologies' needed.

You're doing fine, we should be thanking you for doing a thankless job.

Adrian



-----Original Message-----
>From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
>Sent: Sep 10, 2009 12:36 AM
>To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
>
>Hey guys, 
>
>Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few emails regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send out an informative email. 
>
>Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot going on behind the scenes that we have no control over. And also, there was the nats, and several personal issues I had to deal with. For a few months now, things are running behind. We are working with (once again) a new graphic person and should be getting back on track soon as she now seems to understand how we want things, and also things in my life have mostly been taken care of. 
>
>I apologize to you all for the issue's not being timely. It's not what I strive for. I like for everyone to receive their issue at roughly the same time every month. It's not as easy as it would seem to achieve this. 
>
>Once again, my apologies!
>
>Chris   ?  ?  ?
>
>


From kysung at comcast.net  Wed Sep  9 20:47:31 2009
From: kysung at comcast.net (Kevin Sung)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 04:47:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
In-Reply-To: <948326.23139.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BJEAJBECNFKIGONMBLJLGEBFCGAA.kysung@comcast.net>

Chris,

Thank you very much for your continuous great work.  No apologies is needed.

Kevin
  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of krishlan
fitzsimmons
  Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2009 9:36 PM
  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors


        Hey guys,

        Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few emails
regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send out an informative email.

        Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot going on
behind the scenes that we have no control over. And also, there was the
nats, and several personal issues I had to deal with. For a few months now,
things are running behind. We are working with (once again) a new graphic
person and should be getting back on track soon as she now seems to
understand how we want things, and also things in my life have mostly been
taken care of.

        I apologize to you all for the issue's not being timely. It's not
what I strive for. I like for everyone to receive their issue at roughly the
same time every month. It's not as easy as it would seem to achieve this.

        Once again, my apologies!


        Chris




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From jlkonn at hotmail.com  Thu Sep 10 02:13:03 2009
From: jlkonn at hotmail.com (John Konneker)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 10:13:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
In-Reply-To: <948326.23139.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <948326.23139.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BLU106-W25F1F5F622CF26217B7A44CDE80@phx.gbl>


Chris,

Having worked with you those couple years I was the ad guy and a DVP I know what a great job you do.

I've said it before and I'll say it again...

Month in month and month out you're the hardest working guy in the NSRCA!

A big THANK YOU!

JLK
 


Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 21:36:14 -0700
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors





Hey guys, 

Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few emails regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send out an informative email. 

Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot going on behind the scenes that we have no control over. And also, there was the nats, and several personal issues I had to deal with. For a few months now, things are running behind. We are working with (once again) a new graphic person and should be getting back on track soon as she now seems to understand how we want things, and also things in my life have mostly been taken care of. 

I apologize to you all for the issue's not being timely. It's not what I strive for. I like for everyone to receive their issue at roughly the same time every month. It's not as easy as it would seem to achieve this. 

Once again, my apologies!


Chris 
 
 
 
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From KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com  Thu Sep 10 02:29:40 2009
From: KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com (Ken Thompson)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 10:29:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
References: <BJEAJBECNFKIGONMBLJLGEBFCGAA.kysung@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <002901ca3201$a6b757f0$0200a8c0@kencopepere>

Ditto!!!  No need to apologize...
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Kevin Sung 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2009 11:47 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors


  Chris,

  Thank you very much for your continuous great work.  No apologies is needed.

  Kevin
    -----Original Message-----
    From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of krishlan fitzsimmons
    Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2009 9:36 PM
    To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors


          Hey guys, 

          Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few emails regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send out an informative email. 

          Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot going on behind the scenes that we have no control over. And also, there was the nats, and several personal issues I had to deal with. For a few months now, things are running behind. We are working with (once again) a new graphic person and should be getting back on track soon as she now seems to understand how we want things, and also things in my life have mostly been taken care of. 

          I apologize to you all for the issue's not being timely. It's not what I strive for. I like for everyone to receive their issue at roughly the same time every month. It's not as easy as it would seem to achieve this. 

          Once again, my apologies!


          Chris 


         




------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From vanputte at cox.net  Thu Sep 10 05:12:10 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 13:12:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
In-Reply-To: <948326.23139.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <948326.23139.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BDB71139-12DF-4839-BEB3-D05DB4BB7DE6@cox.net>

Chris - We NSRCA members are spoiled.  We get a great K-Factor and  
about all we can whine about is occasional late issues, caused by  
circumstances that are not within your control.  Lighten up and think  
about those of us who are not whining, because we appreciate the good  
job you're doing.

Ron Van Putte

On Sep 9, 2009, at 11:36 PM, krishlan fitzsimmons wrote:

> Hey guys,
>
> Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few emails  
> regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send out an  
> informative email.
>
> Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot going on  
> behind the scenes that we have no control over. And also, there was  
> the nats, and several personal issues I had to deal with. For a few  
> months now, things are running behind. We are working with (once  
> again) a new graphic person and should be getting back on track  
> soon as she now seems to understand how we want things, and also  
> things in my life have mostly been taken care of.
>
> I apologize to you all for the issue's not being timely. It's not  
> what I strive for. I like for everyone to receive their issue at  
> roughly the same time every month. It's not as easy as it would  
> seem to achieve this.
>
> Once again, my apologies!
>
> Chris
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From jaqfly at prodigy.net  Thu Sep 10 05:32:07 2009
From: jaqfly at prodigy.net (Jim Quinn)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 13:32:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
In-Reply-To: <BDB71139-12DF-4839-BEB3-D05DB4BB7DE6@cox.net>
References: <948326.23139.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<BDB71139-12DF-4839-BEB3-D05DB4BB7DE6@cox.net>
Message-ID: <565216.36843.qm@web83303.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

Chris, You're the best! Your KFactors are?worth the wait whenever we get them!!!
?Jim Quinn 



----- Original Message ----
From: Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 9:11:28 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors

Chris - We NSRCA members are spoiled.? We get a great K-Factor and about all we can whine about is occasional late issues, caused by circumstances that are not within your control.? Lighten up and think about those of us who are not whining, because we appreciate the good job you're doing.

Ron Van Putte

On Sep 9, 2009, at 11:36 PM, krishlan fitzsimmons wrote:

> Hey guys,
> 
> Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few emails regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send out an informative email.
> 
> Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot going on behind the scenes that we have no control over. And also, there was the nats, and several personal issues I had to deal with. For a few months now, things are running behind. We are working with (once again) a new graphic person and should be getting back on track soon as she now seems to understand how we want things, and also things in my life have mostly been taken care of.
> 
> I apologize to you all for the issue's not being timely. It's not what I strive for. I like for everyone to receive their issue at roughly the same time every month. It's not as easy as it would seem to achieve this.
> 
> Once again, my apologies!
> 
> Chris
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 10 05:34:27 2009
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 13:34:27 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
In-Reply-To: <BLU106-W25F1F5F622CF26217B7A44CDE80@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <706420.2599.qm@web51011.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

 All that and he's a cool dude!!! Because he wears sporty sunglasses all the time. Now when he takes them off and shows off his Raccoon eyes it's a little weird. M2

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, John Konneker <jlkonn at hotmail.com> wrote:

> From: John Konneker <jlkonn at hotmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
> To: "Discussion List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009, 5:13 AM
> 
> 
> 
> #yiv723187718 .hmmessage P
> {
> margin:0px;padding:0px;}
> #yiv723187718 {
> font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana;}
> 
> 
>  
> Chris,
> 
> Having worked with you those couple years I was the ad guy
> and a DVP I know what a great job you do.
> 
> I've?said it before and I'll say it again...
> 
> Month in month and month out you're the hardest working
> guy in the NSRCA!
> 
> A big THANK YOU!
> 
> JLK
> ?
> 
> 
> Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 21:36:14 -0700
> From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey guys, 
> 
> Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few
> emails regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send
> out an informative email. 
> 
> Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot
> going on behind the scenes that we have no control over. And
> also, there was the nats, and several personal issues I had
> to deal with. For a few months now, things are running
> behind. We are working with (once again) a new graphic
> person and should be getting back on track soon as she now
> seems to understand how we want things, and also things in
> my life have mostly been taken care of. 
> 
> I apologize to you all for the issue's not being
> timely. It's not what I strive for. I like for everyone
> to receive their issue at roughly the same time every month.
> It's not as easy as it would seem to achieve this. 
> 
> Once again, my apologies!
> 
> 
> Chris 
> ?
> ?
> ?
>  
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      

From chuenkan at comcast.net  Thu Sep 10 05:54:53 2009
From: chuenkan at comcast.net (Phil Spelt)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 13:54:53 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
In-Reply-To: <565216.36843.qm@web83303.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
References: <948326.23139.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<BDB71139-12DF-4839-BEB3-D05DB4BB7DE6@cox.net>
	<565216.36843.qm@web83303.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20090910135453.1EA8911623@bridi.netexpress.com>

So, Jim, are you saying the KFactors are "worth their wait in Gold"??? :-Dmao

At 09:32 AM 9/10/2009, you wrote:
>Chris, You're the best! Your KFactors are worth the wait whenever we 
>get them!!!
>  Jim Quinn
>
>
>
>----- Original Message ----
>From: Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net>
>To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 9:11:28 AM
>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
>
>Chris - We NSRCA members are spoiled.  We get a great K-Factor and 
>about all we can whine about is occasional late issues, caused by 
>circumstances that are not within your control.  Lighten up and 
>think about those of us who are not whining, because we appreciate 
>the good job you're doing.
>
>Ron Van Putte
>
>On Sep 9, 2009, at 11:36 PM, krishlan fitzsimmons wrote:
>
> > Hey guys,
> >
> > Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few emails 
> regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send out an informative email.
> >
> > Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot going on 
> behind the scenes that we have no control over. And also, there was 
> the nats, and several personal issues I had to deal with. For a few 
> months now, things are running behind. We are working with (once 
> again) a new graphic person and should be getting back on track 
> soon as she now seems to understand how we want things, and also 
> things in my life have mostly been taken care of.
> >
> > I apologize to you all for the issue's not being timely. It's not 
> what I strive for. I like for everyone to receive their issue at 
> roughly the same time every month. It's not as easy as it would 
> seem to achieve this.
> >
> > Once again, my apologies!
> >
> > Chris
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

-->There are only two types of aircraft -- fighters and targets.

Phil Spelt, Webmaster & Past President, Knox County Radio Control Society, Inc.
        URL: http://www.kcrctn.com
AMA--1294,  Scientific Leader Member, SPA--177
       My URL: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/~chuenkan/
       (865) 435-1476 v  (865) 604-0541 c  
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From chadnortheast at shaw.ca  Thu Sep 10 06:08:00 2009
From: chadnortheast at shaw.ca (Chad Northeast)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 14:08:00 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
In-Reply-To: <20090910135453.1EA8911623@bridi.netexpress.com>
References: <948326.23139.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<BDB71139-12DF-4839-BEB3-D05DB4BB7DE6@cox.net>
	<565216.36843.qm@web83303.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
	<20090910135453.1EA8911623@bridi.netexpress.com>
Message-ID: <ccdea56666ba4.4aa8b3df@shaw.ca>

K-Factors are late?? I never even noticed!? I read em when I get em, don't care what the date is :-)

Chad

----- Original Message -----
From: Phil Spelt <chuenkan at comcast.net>
Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009 7:55 am
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
To: Jim Quinn <jaqfly at prodigy.net>, General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>

> So, Jim, are you saying the KFactors are "worth their wait in 
> Gold"??? :-Dmao
> 
> At 09:32 AM 9/10/2009, you wrote:
> >Chris, You're the best! Your KFactors are worth the wait 
> whenever we 
> >get them!!!
> >? Jim Quinn
> >
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message ----
> >From: Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net>
> >To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> >Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 9:11:28 AM
> >Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
> >
> >Chris - We NSRCA members are spoiled.? We get a great K-
> Factor and 
> >about all we can whine about is occasional late issues, caused 
> by 
> >circumstances that are not within your control.? Lighten 
> up and 
> >think about those of us who are not whining, because we 
> appreciate 
> >the good job you're doing.
> >
> >Ron Van Putte
> >
> >On Sep 9, 2009, at 11:36 PM, krishlan fitzsimmons wrote:
> >
> > > Hey guys,
> > >
> > > Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few 
> emails 
> > regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send out an 
> informative email.
> > >
> > > Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot 
> going on 
> > behind the scenes that we have no control over. And also, 
> there was 
> > the nats, and several personal issues I had to deal with. For 
> a few 
> > months now, things are running behind. We are working with 
> (once 
> > again) a new graphic person and should be getting back on 
> track 
> > soon as she now seems to understand how we want things, and 
> also 
> > things in my life have mostly been taken care of.
> > >
> > > I apologize to you all for the issue's not being timely. 
> It's not 
> > what I strive for. I like for everyone to receive their issue 
> at 
> > roughly the same time every month. It's not as easy as it 
> would 
> > seem to achieve this.
> > >
> > > Once again, my apologies!
> > >
> > > Chris
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> >NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> >http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> >NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> >http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> -->There are only two types of aircraft -- fighters and targets.
> 
> Phil Spelt, Webmaster & Past President, Knox County Radio 
> Control Society, Inc.
> ??????? URL: http://www.kcrctn.com
> AMA--1294,? Scientific Leader Member, SPA--177
> ?????? My URL: 
> http://mywebpages.comcast.net/~chuenkan/?????? (865) 435-1476 v? (865) 604-0541 c? 
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From AtwoodDon at aol.com  Thu Sep 10 06:39:19 2009
From: AtwoodDon at aol.com (AtwoodDon at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 14:39:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
Message-ID: <c7e.388ce5e9.37da6986@aol.com>

 
Alright, enough with the praise.  Personally, I plan on chastising  Chris 
severely at the Hollister contest by forcing a Corona or two on him and  not 
accept any excuses......    Seriously, keep up the  great work Chris, we 
appreciate it.....
 
Don

 
 
In a message dated 9/10/2009 6:34:42 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,  
mups1953 at yahoo.com writes:

All that  and he's a cool dude!!! Because he wears sporty sunglasses all 
the time. Now  when he takes them off and shows off his Raccoon eyes it's a 
little weird.  M2

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, John Konneker <jlkonn at hotmail.com>  wrote:

> From: John Konneker <jlkonn at hotmail.com>
>  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
> To: "Discussion List"  <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Thursday, September 10,  2009, 5:13 AM
> 
> 
> 
> #yiv723187718 .hmmessage  P
> {
> margin:0px;padding:0px;}
> #yiv723187718 {
>  font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana;}
> 
> 
>  
>  Chris,
> 
> Having worked with you those couple years I was the ad  guy
> and a DVP I know what a great job you do.
> 
>  I've said it before and I'll say it again...
> 
> Month in  month and month out you're the hardest working
> guy in the  NSRCA!
> 
> A big THANK YOU!
> 
> JLK
>  
> 
> 
> Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 21:36:14 -0700
>  From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com
> To:  nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion]  Kfactors
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey guys,  
> 
> Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a  few
> emails regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send
>  out an informative email. 
> 
> Kfactors have been behind lately  as there has been a lot
> going on behind the scenes that we have no  control over. And
> also, there was the nats, and several personal  issues I had
> to deal with. For a few months now, things are  running
> behind. We are working with (once again) a new graphic
>  person and should be getting back on track soon as she now
> seems to  understand how we want things, and also things in
> my life have mostly  been taken care of. 
> 
> I apologize to you all for the issue's  not being
> timely. It's not what I strive for. I like for  everyone
> to receive their issue at roughly the same time every  month.
> It's not as easy as it would seem to achieve this. 
>  
> Once again, my apologies!
> 
> 
> Chris 
>  
>  
>  
>  
> 
>  -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
>  _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion  mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion  mailing  list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From skitimberlakespartava at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 10 07:02:51 2009
From: skitimberlakespartava at yahoo.com (Roger Hammel)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 15:02:51 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] header help
Message-ID: <555674.20943.qm@web110601.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>









Have a new header - AAP #500 flex header from Advanced Aero Products I just installed - was unopened old stock. Old corrugated cooling type header would back out of the head no matter what - tried multiple copper washers.? I gave up. so installed new flex header.?No backing out, but motor noise substantially increased. Found that braided stainless header portion will leak air if I blow in exhaust end.? Anyone familiar with these flex headers ?? Is there something special I need to do to quiet them down and not leak ?? Thanks for any help.? Roger
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From bob at toprudder.com  Thu Sep 10 08:39:47 2009
From: bob at toprudder.com (Bob Richards)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 16:39:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] header help
In-Reply-To: <555674.20943.qm@web110601.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <306654.71317.qm@web1112.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>

I used one of those headers and had the exact problem you are having. In fact, most of the people I knew that used those headers had the same problem after using them for some time.
?
The braid is merely reinforcement for the flexible tubing inside the braid. My opinion is that that the internal convoluted tubing did not stand up to repeated flexing from the engine vibrations, eventually failed, and then started blowing exahust through the braid. I never took one apart to see inside, though.
?
Bob R.


--- On Thu, 9/10/09, Roger Hammel <skitimberlakespartava at yahoo.com> wrote:

















Have a new header - AAP #500 flex header from Advanced Aero Products I just installed - was unopened old stock. Old corrugated cooling type header would back out of the head no matter what - tried multiple copper washers.? I gave up. so installed new flex header.?No backing out, but motor noise substantially increased. Found that braided stainless header portion will leak air if I blow in exhaust end.? Anyone familiar with these flex headers ?? Is there something special I need to do to quiet them down and not leak ?? Thanks for any help.? Roger

?
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From geobet4 at verizon.net  Thu Sep 10 08:55:14 2009
From: geobet4 at verizon.net (GEORGE KENNIE)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 16:55:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
References: <948326.23139.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<BDB71139-12DF-4839-BEB3-D05DB4BB7DE6@cox.net>
	<565216.36843.qm@web83303.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
	<20090910135453.1EA8911623@bridi.netexpress.com>
	<ccdea56666ba4.4aa8b3df@shaw.ca>
Message-ID: <8FC3F293E4FF438087D7EDC22B731020@george15cf36d8>

Boy Chad,

You took the words right out of my mouth.....................
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Chad Northeast 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 10:07 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors


  K-Factors are late?  I never even noticed!  I read em when I get em, don't care what the date is :-)

  Chad

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Phil Spelt <chuenkan at comcast.net>
  Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009 7:55 am
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
  To: Jim Quinn <jaqfly at prodigy.net>, General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>

  > So, Jim, are you saying the KFactors are "worth their wait in 
  > Gold"??? :-Dmao
  > 
  > At 09:32 AM 9/10/2009, you wrote:
  > >Chris, You're the best! Your KFactors are worth the wait 
  > whenever we 
  > >get them!!!
  > >  Jim Quinn
  > >
  > >
  > >
  > >----- Original Message ----
  > >From: Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net>
  > >To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  > >Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 9:11:28 AM
  > >Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
  > >
  > >Chris - We NSRCA members are spoiled.  We get a great K-
  > Factor and 
  > >about all we can whine about is occasional late issues, caused 
  > by 
  > >circumstances that are not within your control.  Lighten 
  > up and 
  > >think about those of us who are not whining, because we 
  > appreciate 
  > >the good job you're doing.
  > >
  > >Ron Van Putte
  > >
  > >On Sep 9, 2009, at 11:36 PM, krishlan fitzsimmons wrote:
  > >
  > > > Hey guys,
  > > >
  > > > Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few 
  > emails 
  > > regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send out an 
  > informative email.
  > > >
  > > > Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot 
  > going on 
  > > behind the scenes that we have no control over. And also, 
  > there was 
  > > the nats, and several personal issues I had to deal with. For 
  > a few 
  > > months now, things are running behind. We are working with 
  > (once 
  > > again) a new graphic person and should be getting back on 
  > track 
  > > soon as she now seems to understand how we want things, and 
  > also 
  > > things in my life have mostly been taken care of.
  > > >
  > > > I apologize to you all for the issue's not being timely. 
  > It's not 
  > > what I strive for. I like for everyone to receive their issue 
  > at 
  > > roughly the same time every month. It's not as easy as it 
  > would 
  > > seem to achieve this.
  > > >
  > > > Once again, my apologies!
  > > >
  > > > Chris
  > > >
  > > >
  > > >
  > > >
  > > > _______________________________________________
  > > > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  > > > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  > > > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  > >
  > >_______________________________________________
  > >NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  > >NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  > >http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  > >
  > >_______________________________________________
  > >NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  > >NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  > >http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  > 
  > -->There are only two types of aircraft -- fighters and targets.
  > 
  > Phil Spelt, Webmaster & Past President, Knox County Radio 
  > Control Society, Inc.
  >         URL: http://www.kcrctn.com
  > AMA--1294,  Scientific Leader Member, SPA--177
  >        My URL: 
  > http://mywebpages.comcast.net/~chuenkan/       (865) 435-1476 v  (865) 604-0541 c  


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From rclen123 at roadrunner.com  Thu Sep 10 16:45:30 2009
From: rclen123 at roadrunner.com (rclen)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 00:45:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
In-Reply-To: <948326.23139.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <948326.23139.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4AA99DCC.7060100@roadrunner.com>

krishlan fitzsimmons wrote:
> Hey guys,
>
> Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few emails 
> regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send out an informative 
> email.
>
> Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot going on 
> behind the scenes that we have no control over. And also, there was 
> the nats, and several personal issues I had to deal with. For a few 
> months now, things are running behind. We are working with (once 
> again) a new graphic person and should be getting back on track soon 
> as she now seems to understand how we want things, and also things in 
> my life have mostly been taken care of.
>
> I apologize to you all for the issue's not being timely. It's not what 
> I strive for. I like for everyone to receive their issue at roughly 
> the same time every month. It's not as easy as it would seem to 
> achieve this.
>
> Once again, my apologies!
>
> */Chris /*
>  
>  
>  
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
Hello Chris:  Hey no apology needed because you are doing a great job as 
far as my opinion goes.  Lynn

From DaddyB3089 at aol.com  Thu Sep 10 17:12:38 2009
From: DaddyB3089 at aol.com (DaddyB3089 at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 01:12:38 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
Message-ID: <d2f.49eedc42.37dafe01@aol.com>

Chris,
I appreciate your explanation on the Kfactors late releases and would like  
to be the first to THANK YOU for the job that you do. 
 
Bill Mitchell
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From mwaustin54 at cox.net  Thu Sep 10 18:40:11 2009
From: mwaustin54 at cox.net (mwaustin54 at cox.net)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 02:40:11 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
Message-ID: <5535915.47185.1252636809064.JavaMail.mwaustin54@127.0.0.1>

Ron,

I have heard nobody whining, in fact only lots of praise for the job 
well done these guys do each month. I started this with a simple inquiry 
since I've not seen the last 2 mos subscription due to probable mail 
issues I'm trying to work out on my end.

Mike Austin


On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 6:11 AM , Ron Van Putte wrote:

> Chris - We NSRCA members are spoiled.  We get a great K-Factor and 
> about all we can whine about is occasional late issues, caused by 
> circumstances that are not within your control.  Lighten up and think 
> about those of us who are not whining, because we appreciate the good 
> job you're doing.
>
> Ron Van Putte
>
> On Sep 9, 2009, at 11:36 PM, krishlan fitzsimmons wrote:
>
>> Hey guys,
>>
>> Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few emails 
>> regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send out an 
>> informative email.
>>
>> Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot going on 
>> behind the scenes that we have no control over. And also, there was 
>> the nats, and several personal issues I had to deal with. For a few 
>> months now, things are running behind. We are working with (once 
>> again) a new graphic person and should be getting back on track  soon 
>> as she now seems to understand how we want things, and also  things 
>> in my life have mostly been taken care of.
>>
>> I apologize to you all for the issue's not being timely. It's not 
>> what I strive for. I like for everyone to receive their issue at 
>> roughly the same time every month. It's not as easy as it would  seem 
>> to achieve this.
>>
>> Once again, my apologies!
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From vanputte at cox.net  Thu Sep 10 19:02:18 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 03:02:18 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
In-Reply-To: <5535915.47185.1252636809064.JavaMail.mwaustin54@127.0.0.1>
References: <5535915.47185.1252636809064.JavaMail.mwaustin54@127.0.0.1>
Message-ID: <B48D4D4B-A787-4B61-9DE9-14C5A6A6B1FB@cox.net>

Hey, I wasn't accusing anyone specifically.  Only the guilty need  
feel offended.

Ron VP

On Sep 10, 2009, at 9:40 PM, mwaustin54 at cox.net wrote:

> Ron,
>
> I have heard nobody whining, in fact only lots of praise for the  
> job well done these guys do each month. I started this with a  
> simple inquiry since I've not seen the last 2 mos subscription due  
> to probable mail issues I'm trying to work out on my end.
>
> Mike Austin
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 6:11 AM , Ron Van Putte wrote:
>
>> Chris - We NSRCA members are spoiled.  We get a great K-Factor and  
>> about all we can whine about is occasional late issues, caused by  
>> circumstances that are not within your control.  Lighten up and  
>> think about those of us who are not whining, because we appreciate  
>> the good job you're doing.
>>
>> Ron Van Putte
>>
>> On Sep 9, 2009, at 11:36 PM, krishlan fitzsimmons wrote:
>>
>>> Hey guys,
>>>
>>> Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few emails  
>>> regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send out an  
>>> informative email.
>>>
>>> Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot going on  
>>> behind the scenes that we have no control over. And also, there  
>>> was the nats, and several personal issues I had to deal with. For  
>>> a few months now, things are running behind. We are working with  
>>> (once again) a new graphic person and should be getting back on  
>>> track  soon as she now seems to understand how we want things,  
>>> and also  things in my life have mostly been taken care of.
>>>
>>> I apologize to you all for the issue's not being timely. It's not  
>>> what I strive for. I like for everyone to receive their issue at  
>>> roughly the same time every month. It's not as easy as it would   
>>> seem to achieve this.
>>>
>>> Once again, my apologies!
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From vanputte at cox.net  Thu Sep 10 19:16:30 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 03:16:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] K&B 4C Plugs
Message-ID: <B11CF234-A753-458B-B913-8F3C160137EE@cox.net>

I have been wondering about how contributors to the NSRCA List feel  
about the performance characteristics of K&B 4C plugs (K&B 4444).   
Apparently the K&B 4C plugs have been discontinued, but some  
distributors still have good stocks of them.  I wondered about their  
performance because they appear very similar to OS F plugs, but cost  
much less.  In my limited experience with them, they appear to give  
very much the same performance as the OS F plugs.  I've seen used  
them locally in OS 1.40RX engines with very good success.

Does anyone have any comments about them?

Ron VP

From mwaustin54 at cox.net  Thu Sep 10 19:19:17 2009
From: mwaustin54 at cox.net (mwaustin54 at cox.net)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 03:19:17 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
Message-ID: <31977357.47251.1252639155625.JavaMail.mwaustin54@127.0.0.1>

Ron, No problem !! No offense taken.



On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 8:01 PM , Ron Van Putte wrote:

> Hey, I wasn't accusing anyone specifically.  Only the guilty need feel 
> offended.
>
> Ron VP
>
> On Sep 10, 2009, at 9:40 PM, mwaustin54 at cox.net wrote:
>
>> Ron,
>>
>> I have heard nobody whining, in fact only lots of praise for the  job 
>> well done these guys do each month. I started this with a  simple 
>> inquiry since I've not seen the last 2 mos subscription due  to 
>> probable mail issues I'm trying to work out on my end.
>>
>> Mike Austin
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 6:11 AM , Ron Van Putte wrote:
>>
>>> Chris - We NSRCA members are spoiled.  We get a great K-Factor and 
>>> about all we can whine about is occasional late issues, caused by 
>>> circumstances that are not within your control.  Lighten up and 
>>> think about those of us who are not whining, because we appreciate 
>>> the good job you're doing.
>>>
>>> Ron Van Putte
>>>
>>> On Sep 9, 2009, at 11:36 PM, krishlan fitzsimmons wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hey guys,
>>>>
>>>> Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few emails 
>>>> regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send out an 
>>>> informative email.
>>>>
>>>> Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot going on 
>>>> behind the scenes that we have no control over. And also, there 
>>>> was the nats, and several personal issues I had to deal with. For 
>>>> a few months now, things are running behind. We are working with 
>>>> (once again) a new graphic person and should be getting back on 
>>>> track  soon as she now seems to understand how we want things,  and 
>>>> also  things in my life have mostly been taken care of.
>>>>
>>>> I apologize to you all for the issue's not being timely. It's not 
>>>> what I strive for. I like for everyone to receive their issue at 
>>>> roughly the same time every month. It's not as easy as it would 
>>>> seem to achieve this.
>>>>
>>>> Once again, my apologies!
>>>>
>>>> Chris
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 10 21:05:01 2009
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 05:05:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
In-Reply-To: <31977357.47251.1252639155625.JavaMail.mwaustin54@127.0.0.1>
Message-ID: <344397.1676.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Hey Mike, 

I know you know this, but I didn't bring any names up and I never said to anyone, including the board, that anyone is whining or complaining. You were more than cordial in your emails! I took the several emails I have as concern and I can understand why. Before I was editor, I used to look forward to my Kfactor showing up just like everyone else. I can understand the concern when they are late. That is the reason I posted this. So everyone can know what you now know. 


As for all the praise and thanks from everyone, c'mon, cut it out. It's nice to hear, but I don't do this for that, and I'm not the only one that works for this organization. There's a lot that goes on behind the scenes. It's been a real eye opener for me about how professional this organization is, and I'm really happy that I got involved. It has taught me a lot, as has posting in the forums, and on here. But I still have a lot to learn. A work in progress, if you will. 

Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, mwaustin54 at cox.net <mwaustin54 at cox.net> wrote:

From: mwaustin54 at cox.net <mwaustin54 at cox.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Kfactors
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009, 8:19 PM

Ron, No problem !! No offense taken.



On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 8:01 PM , Ron Van Putte wrote:

> Hey, I wasn't accusing anyone specifically.? Only the guilty need feel offended.
> 
> Ron VP
> 
> On Sep 10, 2009, at 9:40 PM, mwaustin54 at cox.net wrote:
> 
>> Ron,
>> 
>> I have heard nobody whining, in fact only lots of praise for the? job well done these guys do each month. I started this with a? simple inquiry since I've not seen the last 2 mos subscription due? to probable mail issues I'm trying to work out on my end.
>> 
>> Mike Austin
>> 
>> 
>> On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 6:11 AM , Ron Van Putte wrote:
>> 
>>> Chris - We NSRCA members are spoiled.? We get a great K-Factor and about all we can whine about is occasional late issues, caused by circumstances that are not within your control.? Lighten up and think about those of us who are not whining, because we appreciate the good job you're doing.
>>> 
>>> Ron Van Putte
>>> 
>>> On Sep 9, 2009, at 11:36 PM, krishlan fitzsimmons wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Hey guys,
>>>> 
>>>> Sorry for posting this to the list, but I've had a few emails regarding it, so I thought I would be best to send out an informative email.
>>>> 
>>>> Kfactors have been behind lately as there has been a lot going on behind the scenes that we have no control over. And also, there was the nats, and several personal issues I had to deal with. For a few months now, things are running behind. We are working with (once again) a new graphic person and should be getting back on track? soon as she now seems to understand how we want things,? and also? things in my life have mostly been taken care of.
>>>> 
>>>> I apologize to you all for the issue's not being timely. It's not what I strive for. I like for everyone to receive their issue at roughly the same time every month. It's not as easy as it would seem to achieve this.
>>>> 
>>>> Once again, my apologies!
>>>> 
>>>> Chris
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



      
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From billglaze at bellsouth.net  Fri Sep 11 05:54:44 2009
From: billglaze at bellsouth.net (Bill Glaze)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 13:54:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] header help
References: <306654.71317.qm@web1112.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <6135A485BC254FB793193EA2C84B51A2@glazecstp32xp>

I had the same problem, plus--after working with the header for some time, it eventually stripped out the aluminum threads inside the exhaust port.  Frustrating, maddening.................
Bill Glaze
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Bob Richards 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 12:39 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] header help


        I used one of those headers and had the exact problem you are having. In fact, most of the people I knew that used those headers had the same problem after using them for some time.

        The braid is merely reinforcement for the flexible tubing inside the braid. My opinion is that that the internal convoluted tubing did not stand up to repeated flexing from the engine vibrations, eventually failed, and then started blowing exahust through the braid. I never took one apart to see inside, though.

        Bob R.


        --- On Thu, 9/10/09, Roger Hammel <skitimberlakespartava at yahoo.com> wrote:




                            Have a new header - AAP #500 flex header from Advanced Aero Products I just installed - was unopened old stock. Old corrugated cooling type header would back out of the head no matter what - tried multiple copper washers.  I gave up. so installed new flex header. No backing out, but motor noise substantially increased. Found that braided stainless header portion will leak air if I blow in exhaust end.  Anyone familiar with these flex headers ?  Is there something special I need to do to quiet them down and not leak ?  Thanks for any help.  Roger 
                     
               



       



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jlachow at hotmail.com  Fri Sep 11 06:55:49 2009
From: jlachow at hotmail.com (Joe Lachowski)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 14:55:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] K&B 4C Plugs
In-Reply-To: <B11CF234-A753-458B-B913-8F3C160137EE@cox.net>
References: <B11CF234-A753-458B-B913-8F3C160137EE@cox.net>
Message-ID: <SNT104-W235093B2873A2A10452A6ABBE70@phx.gbl>


Didn't like how they ran in the 140RX, but on the other hand the 1L's ran great in the RX.
 
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> From: vanputte at cox.net
> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 22:15:58 -0500
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] K&B 4C Plugs
> 
> I have been wondering about how contributors to the NSRCA List feel 
> about the performance characteristics of K&B 4C plugs (K&B 4444). 
> Apparently the K&B 4C plugs have been discontinued, but some 
> distributors still have good stocks of them. I wondered about their 
> performance because they appear very similar to OS F plugs, but cost 
> much less. In my limited experience with them, they appear to give 
> very much the same performance as the OS F plugs. I've seen used 
> them locally in OS 1.40RX engines with very good success.
> 
> Does anyone have any comments about them?
> 
> Ron VP
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail? is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. 
http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=PID23391::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HYGN_faster:082009
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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Fri Sep 11 07:54:36 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 15:54:36 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] K&B 4C Plugs
In-Reply-To: <SNT104-W235093B2873A2A10452A6ABBE70@phx.gbl>
References: <B11CF234-A753-458B-B913-8F3C160137EE@cox.net>
	<SNT104-W235093B2873A2A10452A6ABBE70@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <3454543c0909110854t73bd9e50q191e75563bbfb151@mail.gmail.com>

Ron,

I remember using them very successfully on the YS 120's and the early
140's.  When Donny Weitz worked for K&B he gave me a bunch of them to use
and I thought they were much better than the OS F plugs at that time.

On Fri, Sep 11, 2009 at 7:55 AM, Joe Lachowski <jlachow at hotmail.com> wrote:

> Didn't like how they ran in the 140RX, but on the other hand the 1L's ran
> great in the RX.
>
> > To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > From: vanputte at cox.net
> > Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 22:15:58 -0500
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] K&B 4C Plugs
> >
> > I have been wondering about how contributors to the NSRCA List feel
> > about the performance characteristics of K&B 4C plugs (K&B 4444).
> > Apparently the K&B 4C plugs have been discontinued, but some
> > distributors still have good stocks of them. I wondered about their
> > performance because they appear very similar to OS F plugs, but cost
> > much less. In my limited experience with them, they appear to give
> > very much the same performance as the OS F plugs. I've seen used
> > them locally in OS 1.40RX engines with very good success.
> >
> > Does anyone have any comments about them?
> >
> > Ron VP
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> ------------------------------
> Hotmail? is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. Try it
> now.<http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=PID23391::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HYGN_faster:082009>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From vanputte at cox.net  Fri Sep 11 08:35:43 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 16:35:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] K&B 4C Plugs
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909110854t73bd9e50q191e75563bbfb151@mail.gmail.com>
References: <B11CF234-A753-458B-B913-8F3C160137EE@cox.net>
	<SNT104-W235093B2873A2A10452A6ABBE70@phx.gbl>
	<3454543c0909110854t73bd9e50q191e75563bbfb151@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <C4407203-C922-437C-BF1B-C8B23D701627@cox.net>

Being of Scottish ancestry, I am always interested in a good buy.   
Dealers can get the K&B 4C plugs for about $2 each.  That's a lot  
better than the $8 - $9 for OS F plugs.

Ron

On Sep 11, 2009, at 10:54 AM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> Ron,
>
> I remember using them very successfully on the YS 120's and the  
> early 140's.  When Donny Weitz worked for K&B he gave me a bunch of  
> them to use and I thought they were much better than the OS F plugs  
> at that time.
>
> On Fri, Sep 11, 2009 at 7:55 AM, Joe Lachowski  
> <jlachow at hotmail.com> wrote:
> Didn't like how they ran in the 140RX, but on the other hand the  
> 1L's ran great in the RX.
>
> > To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > From: vanputte at cox.net
> > Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 22:15:58 -0500
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] K&B 4C Plugs
> >
> > I have been wondering about how contributors to the NSRCA List feel
> > about the performance characteristics of K&B 4C plugs (K&B 4444).
> > Apparently the K&B 4C plugs have been discontinued, but some
> > distributors still have good stocks of them. I wondered about their
> > performance because they appear very similar to OS F plugs, but cost
> > much less. In my limited experience with them, they appear to give
> > very much the same performance as the OS F plugs. I've seen used
> > them locally in OS 1.40RX engines with very good success.
> >
> > Does anyone have any comments about them?
> >
> > Ron VP
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> Hotmail? is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast.  
> Try it now.
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From pcosky at comcast.net  Fri Sep 11 09:38:14 2009
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 17:38:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Anyone going to COMAIR need a room
Message-ID: <C49E1486E69142A78EB3B01DDBCAEB7B@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>

I won't be going to COMAIR and have a reservation at the Hampton Inn Cincinnati Airport North. Anyone need a room that would like to take over this reservation?
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Fri Sep 11 11:54:29 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 19:54:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX muffler weight and JETT muffler question
Message-ID: <DA4E9520AB37476A9C5D0BD43A2EE6A5@UncleJasPC>

Hi all,

Just wondering if anyone has a 120AX muffler they can weigh for me? Mine on the plane and don't feel like unbolting it.

Also, anyone ever use the JETT 120 muffler? Comments?

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


From precisionaero at hotmail.com  Fri Sep 11 13:48:53 2009
From: precisionaero at hotmail.com (Michael Cohen)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 21:48:53 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Plane for sale
In-Reply-To: <DA4E9520AB37476A9C5D0BD43A2EE6A5@UncleJasPC>
References: <DA4E9520AB37476A9C5D0BD43A2EE6A5@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <BLU115-W24A70BDE64D60C43ED6A7FA0E70@phx.gbl>



I have a modest proposal for someone interested in a 2M pattern plane.  I would like to offer up one YS140DZ engine, one Johnson header, one NMP header, one Johnson Muffler, three JR 8231 Servos, one JR 8411 Servo modified with nylon gears, one JR 368 mini servo, one set of Bolly swept landing gear, one set of Bolly small wheel pants, one Hyde ?A? Mount, one 17X10N prop, and one 2.75 inch Diameter Tru-turn spinner, all for $600.  Act now and I will throw in a free nose ring that comes attached to CA Models Eclipse!
 
The Eclipse needs a landing gear plate and landing gear plate supports installed to get her flying again though.  I was flying it about a month ago when the plate popped while making a windy weather landing.  It was originally glued with epoxy, but Gorilla glue (or equivalent) would be better for the repair.  I am not going to have the chance repair it myself before the season is over, but I would like to get it out of my hanger.  I have a 1650 mAh NiMH battery too.  It should be just fine, but please cycle it before using it!  I can bring it to the D4 championship next weekend if you are going, or if it is a convenient drive for you.  I suppose I can ship too.  If you want pictures, drop me a line.  The Eclipse was the backup ship to my Brio, but I am going to be moving on to something else next year (once I figure out what that is), so I need to make some room.  Please e-mail me privately if interested.
 
Mike Cohen

_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail? is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. 
http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=PID23391::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HYGN_faster:082009
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From kvelez at rochester.rr.com  Fri Sep 11 17:06:24 2009
From: kvelez at rochester.rr.com (Ken Velez)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2009 01:06:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Test
In-Reply-To: <E3BAB5FD3C164E75900C12FF220A56F5@FMILaptop>
Message-ID: <F815F824CC5E42B989E31232D32DF82D@KEN>

Test

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From CHV69 at aol.com  Fri Sep 11 17:09:27 2009
From: CHV69 at aol.com (CHV69 at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2009 01:09:27 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Test
Message-ID: <c54.56db67b7.37dc4eba@aol.com>

test complete.
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From flyinbill1 at bellsouth.net  Fri Sep 11 17:25:27 2009
From: flyinbill1 at bellsouth.net (William C. Harden)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2009 01:25:27 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Test
In-Reply-To: <F815F824CC5E42B989E31232D32DF82D@KEN>
References: <E3BAB5FD3C164E75900C12FF220A56F5@FMILaptop>
	<F815F824CC5E42B989E31232D32DF82D@KEN>
Message-ID: <BF139BF253DC430AB2D1744D7604FD56@bill>

Test successful.

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ken Velez
Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 8:06 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Test

 

Test

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From jzeigenfus at comcast.net  Fri Sep 11 18:09:19 2009
From: jzeigenfus at comcast.net (jzeigenfus at comcast.net)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2009 02:09:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Test
In-Reply-To: <F815F824CC5E42B989E31232D32DF82D@KEN>
Message-ID: <1052062467.1447981252721358238.JavaMail.root@sz0093a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>

Got it here Ken. JEZ 
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ken Velez" <kvelez at rochester.rr.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 9:06:20 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern 
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Test 




Test 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From lld613 at psci.net  Fri Sep 11 19:44:54 2009
From: lld613 at psci.net (Lisa n Larry)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2009 03:44:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Plane for sale
In-Reply-To: <BLU115-W24A70BDE64D60C43ED6A7FA0E70@phx.gbl>
References: <DA4E9520AB37476A9C5D0BD43A2EE6A5@UncleJasPC>
	<BLU115-W24A70BDE64D60C43ED6A7FA0E70@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <7F5EDD63382F46AAA9A74CA3DBB79BF0@LLDPC>

I'm interested.Do you have a buy yet?

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Michael Cohen
Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 4:49 PM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Plane for sale

 

I have a modest proposal for someone interested in a 2M pattern plane.  I
would like to offer up one YS140DZ engine, one Johnson header, one NMP
header, one Johnson Muffler, three JR 8231 Servos, one JR 8411 Servo
modified with nylon gears, one JR 368 mini servo, one set of Bolly swept
landing gear, one set of Bolly small wheel pants, one Hyde "A" Mount, one
17X10N prop, and one 2.75 inch Diameter Tru-turn spinner, all for $600.  Act
now and I will throw in a free nose ring that comes attached to CA Models
Eclipse!

 

The Eclipse needs a landing gear plate and landing gear plate supports
installed to get her flying again though.  I was flying it about a month ago
when the plate popped while making a windy weather landing.  It was
originally glued with epoxy, but Gorilla glue (or equivalent) would be
better for the repair.  I am not going to have the chance repair it myself
before the season is over, but I would like to get it out of my hanger.  I
have a 1650 mAh NiMH battery too.  It should be just fine, but please cycle
it before using it!  I can bring it to the D4 championship next weekend if
you are going, or if it is a convenient drive for you.  I suppose I can ship
too.  If you want pictures, drop me a line.  The Eclipse was the backup ship
to my Brio, but I am going to be moving on to something else next year (once
I figure out what that is), so I need to make some room.  Please e-mail me
privately if interested.

 

Mike Cohen

 

  _____  

HotmailR is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. Try it now.
<http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=PID23391::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:
WM_HYGN_faster:082009> 

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From deanfunk1 at yahoo.com  Sat Sep 12 07:15:28 2009
From: deanfunk1 at yahoo.com (Dean Funk)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2009 15:15:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Black Magic VF3 Concours Winner for sale
Message-ID: <439898.12646.qm@web37404.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

My personal nats plane, 10 lbs 14 oz on nats scale with DZ 170. Plane featured on header of nsrca home page. Complete with brand new DZ 160 or without equipment.

 Contact me off list deanfunk at mindspring dot com


      

From pcosky at comcast.net  Sat Sep 12 15:32:13 2009
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2009 23:32:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] NSRCA-discussion] Black Magic v2.2 for sale
In-Reply-To: <01f501ca2f52$51d50860$f57f1920$@net>
References: <01f501ca2f52$51d50860$f57f1920$@net>
Message-ID: <002b01ca3401$59e5bb40$0db131c0$@net>

I have a BM v2.2 that is in the bones, all it needs is covered.  I have two
sets of wings for it and the horizontal stab is set up for servos, but it
also had a DEPS retrofitted. Price will depend on what all you want with it
but if you take everything I have for it the price starts at $750 and will
go down from there if there are things you don't want or need. E-mail  me at
pcosky at comcast.net with any questions.

 

Right now my travel plans are up in the air. I will either be at COMAIR in
Cincy or the meet in Bealeton, VA this coming weekend so delivery could be
arranged at one of those meets.

 

Pete

 

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From d_bodary at yahoo.com  Sat Sep 12 19:36:14 2009
From: d_bodary at yahoo.com (Dennis Bodary)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 2009 03:36:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Anyone going to COMAIR need a room
In-Reply-To: <C49E1486E69142A78EB3B01DDBCAEB7B@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
Message-ID: <300241.73913.qm@web51707.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Why won't you be at Comair?

--- On Fri, 9/11/09, Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net> wrote:


From: Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Anyone going to COMAIR need a room
To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Friday, September 11, 2009, 1:37 PM





I won't be going to COMAIR and have a reservation at the Hampton Inn Cincinnati Airport North. Anyone need a room that would like to take over this reservation?
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


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From astafford at swtexas.net  Sat Sep 12 20:13:44 2009
From: astafford at swtexas.net (Archie Stafford)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 2009 04:13:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Anyone going to COMAIR need a room
In-Reply-To: <300241.73913.qm@web51707.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <C49E1486E69142A78EB3B01DDBCAEB7B@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
	<300241.73913.qm@web51707.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <001101ca3428$3ff16000$bfd42000$@net>

Because I'm trying to get him to come over and hang out with me at the
Northern VA contest.I can't justify 10 hours to drive over there.

 

Arch

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dennis Bodary
Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2009 11:36 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Anyone going to COMAIR need a room

 


Why won't you be at Comair?

--- On Fri, 9/11/09, Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net> wrote:


From: Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Anyone going to COMAIR need a room
To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Friday, September 11, 2009, 1:37 PM

I won't be going to COMAIR and have a reservation at the Hampton Inn
Cincinnati Airport North. Anyone need a room that would like to take over
this reservation?


-----Inline Attachment Follows-----

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
<http://us.mc517.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.o
rg> 
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

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From d_bodary at yahoo.com  Sat Sep 12 20:46:37 2009
From: d_bodary at yahoo.com (Dennis Bodary)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 2009 04:46:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Anyone going to COMAIR need a room
In-Reply-To: <001101ca3428$3ff16000$bfd42000$@net>
Message-ID: <329326.2454.qm@web51707.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

But Arch i could justify you going to S&W fuels and picking me up some fuel and then the ten hour drive to COMAIR would be worth it for you. 
Or are you scared i'm going to whup ya? yeah that's what i thought LOL

--- On Sun, 9/13/09, Archie Stafford <astafford at swtexas.net> wrote:


From: Archie Stafford <astafford at swtexas.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Anyone going to COMAIR need a room
To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Sunday, September 13, 2009, 12:11 AM








Because I?m trying to get him to come over and hang out with me at the Northern VA contest?I can?t justify 10 hours to drive over there?
?
Arch
?

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dennis Bodary
Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2009 11:36 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Anyone going to COMAIR need a room
?




Why won't you be at Comair?

--- On Fri, 9/11/09, Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net> wrote:

From: Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Anyone going to COMAIR need a room
To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Friday, September 11, 2009, 1:37 PM


I won't be going to COMAIR and have a reservation at the Hampton Inn Cincinnati Airport North. Anyone need a room that would like to take over this reservation?

-----Inline Attachment Follows-----

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
?
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
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From pcosky at comcast.net  Sun Sep 13 03:53:37 2009
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 2009 11:53:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Anyone going to COMAIR need a room
In-Reply-To: <329326.2454.qm@web51707.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <001101ca3428$3ff16000$bfd42000$@net>
	<329326.2454.qm@web51707.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <001601ca3468$ebabd2f0$c30378d0$@net>

Dennis,

 

You could always come to St. Clairsville on Oct. 24th for the pattern primer. Arch WILL be there and then you can show him how it?s done?and you can help out.

 

As for COMAIR, if I can?t find someone to take over my reservation at the Hampton Inn I?ll be in Hebron.

 

Pete

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dennis Bodary
Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 12:47 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Anyone going to COMAIR need a room

 


But Arch i could justify you going to S&W fuels and picking me up some fuel and then the ten hour drive to COMAIR would be worth it for you. 

Or are you scared i'm going to whup ya? yeah that's what i thought LOL

--- On Sun, 9/13/09, Archie Stafford <astafford at swtexas.net> wrote:


From: Archie Stafford <astafford at swtexas.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Anyone going to COMAIR need a room
To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Sunday, September 13, 2009, 12:11 AM

Because I?m trying to get him to come over and hang out with me at the Northern VA contest?I can?t justify 10 hours to drive over there?

 

Arch

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dennis Bodary
Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2009 11:36 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Anyone going to COMAIR need a room

 


Why won't you be at Comair?

--- On Fri, 9/11/09, Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net> wrote:


From: Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Anyone going to COMAIR need a room
To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Friday, September 11, 2009, 1:37 PM

I won't be going to COMAIR and have a reservation at the Hampton Inn Cincinnati Airport North. Anyone need a room that would like to take over this reservation?


-----Inline Attachment Follows-----

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
 <http://us.mc517.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
 <http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 


-----Inline Attachment Follows-----

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
 <http://us.mc517.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
 <http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

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From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Sun Sep 13 12:23:33 2009
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 2009 20:23:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX muffler weight and JETT muffler
	question
In-Reply-To: <DA4E9520AB37476A9C5D0BD43A2EE6A5@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <7A493E1BC76D4B6E88E1DD545928FE75@jaysdesktop>

190 g w/stinger

Jay Marshall

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of J Shu
Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 3:54 PM
To: NSRCA
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX muffler weight and JETT muffler
question

Hi all,

Just wondering if anyone has a 120AX muffler they can weigh for me? Mine on
the plane and don't feel like unbolting it.

Also, anyone ever use the JETT 120 muffler? Comments?

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From dunnaway at hbcomm.net  Sun Sep 13 12:37:10 2009
From: dunnaway at hbcomm.net (Joe Dunnaway)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 2009 20:37:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Tulsa / Springfield Contest Results
In-Reply-To: <C49E1486E69142A78EB3B01DDBCAEB7B@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
References: <C49E1486E69142A78EB3B01DDBCAEB7B@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
Message-ID: <4AAD57C5.2090106@hbcomm.net>

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From rcpilot at wowway.com  Sun Sep 13 12:52:10 2009
From: rcpilot at wowway.com (Ron Hansen)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 2009 20:52:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] XPS Xtreme Link
Message-ID: <7CE1CADA45664B43B1D40D59EA64CE45@toshibauser>

Anyone out there flying with the Xtreme Power Systems (XPS) Xtreme Link
TX Module/Rx 2.4 system?
 
Pros and Cons would be appreciated.
 
Thanks
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From mklein25 at roadrunner.com  Sun Sep 13 14:40:44 2009
From: mklein25 at roadrunner.com (mklein25 at roadrunner.com)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 2009 22:40:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] XPS Xtreme Link
In-Reply-To: <7CE1CADA45664B43B1D40D59EA64CE45@toshibauser>
References: <7CE1CADA45664B43B1D40D59EA64CE45@toshibauser>
Message-ID: <555154585-1252881642-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-775745296-@bda480.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>

Ron - my dad and brother have had good success with the XPS.
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-----Original Message-----
From: "Ron Hansen" <rcpilot at wowway.com>

Date: Sun, 13 Sep 2009 16:52:07 
To: <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] XPS Xtreme Link


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Sun Sep 13 17:35:26 2009
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 01:35:26 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canalyzer
Message-ID: <450696.43729.qm@web33001.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Anyone know what incidence to set a Canalyzer at? 

Thanks!

Chris   ?  ?  ?


      
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From chad at f3acanada.org  Sun Sep 13 17:47:21 2009
From: chad at f3acanada.org (Chad Northeast)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 01:47:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canalyzer
In-Reply-To: <450696.43729.qm@web33001.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <450696.43729.qm@web33001.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4AADA0A2.8090502@f3acanada.org>

Start at -0.5 to the stab, adjust from there :-)

Chad

krishlan fitzsimmons wrote:
> Anyone know what incidence to set a Canalyzer at?
>
> Thanks!
>
> */Chris /*
>  
>  
>  
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

-- 
Chad

www.chadnortheast.ca


From jonlowe at aol.com  Sun Sep 13 18:51:33 2009
From: jonlowe at aol.com (Jon Lowe)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 02:51:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canalyzer
In-Reply-To: <450696.43729.qm@web33001.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <450696.43729.qm@web33001.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <8CC02FD6042BD4D-325C-23F99@webmail-m047.sysops.aol.com>

CPLR told me via email that +/- 1 degree made no difference on his 
Osmose.  YMMV.


Jon Lowe


-----Original Message-----
From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Sun, Sep 13, 2009 8:35 pm
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canalyzer













Anyone know what incidence to set a Canalyzer at?

Thanks!


Chris

?

?

?
















_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion






From don.ramsey at suddenlink.net  Mon Sep 14 03:17:04 2009
From: don.ramsey at suddenlink.net (Don Ramsey)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 11:17:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Contest Results
In-Reply-To: <20090905104450.5KN8H.204561.root@Web02>
References: <20090905104450.5KN8H.204561.root@Web02>
Message-ID: <003101ca352c$e4d18550$ae748ff0$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>

I've posted the Northern New Mexico Pattern Challenge and the 1999 World
Championship results on 





From don.ramsey at suddenlink.net  Mon Sep 14 03:32:47 2009
From: don.ramsey at suddenlink.net (Don Ramsey)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 11:32:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Contest Results
In-Reply-To: <003101ca352c$e4d18550$ae748ff0$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>
References: <20090905104450.5KN8H.204561.root@Web02>
	<003101ca352c$e4d18550$ae748ff0$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>
Message-ID: <003201ca352f$14927cc0$3db77640$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>

I don't know why the link didn't come through, it's on the original.  


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Don Ramsey
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 6:17 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Contest Results

I've posted the Northern New Mexico Pattern Challenge and the 1999 World
Championship results on 




_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From don.ramsey at suddenlink.net  Mon Sep 14 03:54:59 2009
From: don.ramsey at suddenlink.net (Don Ramsey)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 11:54:59 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Contest Results
In-Reply-To: <003201ca352f$14927cc0$3db77640$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>
References: <20090905104450.5KN8H.204561.root@Web02>	<003101ca352c$e4d18550$ae748ff0$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>
	<003201ca352f$14927cc0$3db77640$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>
Message-ID: <000001ca3532$2dbcb820$89362860$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>

Sorry one more time.  http://pages.suddenlink.net/donramsey
Something must be stripping the link.

Don


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Don Ramsey
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 6:33 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Contest Results

I don't know why the link didn't come through, it's on the original.  


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Don Ramsey
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 6:17 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Contest Results

I've posted the Northern New Mexico Pattern Challenge and the 1999 World
Championship results on 




_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From patterndude at tx.rr.com  Mon Sep 14 10:10:48 2009
From: patterndude at tx.rr.com (patterndude at tx.rr.com)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 18:10:48 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canalyzer
In-Reply-To: <8CC02FD6042BD4D-325C-23F99@webmail-m047.sysops.aol.com>
References: <450696.43729.qm@web33001.mail.mud.yahoo.com><8CC02FD6042BD4D-325C-23F99@webmail-m047.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <1975386181-1252951846-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1207800625-@bda251.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>

My experiments shw very little effect until its more negative. at 3-5 deg it rebalances the mix and really benefits planes with excessive R-E pitch mix

Lance
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com>

Date: Sun, 13 Sep 2009 22:51:21 
To: <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Canalyzer


CPLR told me via email that +/- 1 degree made no difference on his 
Osmose.  YMMV.


Jon Lowe


-----Original Message-----
From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Sun, Sep 13, 2009 8:35 pm
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canalyzer













Anyone know what incidence to set a Canalyzer at?

Thanks!


Chris

?

?

?
















_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From kennedybryan at bellsouth.net  Mon Sep 14 14:50:33 2009
From: kennedybryan at bellsouth.net (Bryan Kennedy)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 22:50:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 41st Annual Rocket City Pattern Contest
	(Huntsville, AL)
Message-ID: <528A9A3E9EDC49B4AE3713874183A57E@BryanKennedyPC>

Here are the standings for the 41st annual RCRC pattern contest. I will
be posting more info very soon but wanted to get the standings out.
Congratulations to all the winners!!!
 
 
Sportsman
 
1.	Larry Loucks
2.	Tom Stennis
3.	George Gordon
4.	Mike Norton
 
Intermediate
1.	Austin Wingo
2.	Victor Dias
3.	Tony Coberly
4.	Kirk Sutherland
5.	Lawrence Odom
6.	Houston Schweitzer
7.	Forrest Schaffer
8.	Douglas Harvel
9.	Mike Williams
 
Advanced
1.	Jamie Strong
2.	Michael Wingo
3.	Kenneth Blackwell
4.	Frank Chick
5.	Don Peck
 
Masters
1.	John Fuqua
2.	Marcio Jorge
3.	Chris Odom
4.	Jon Lowe
5.	Gary Courtney
6.	Ronald Van Putte
 
FAI
1.	Cameron Smith
2.	AC Glenn
3.	Albert Glenn
 
 
Thank you
 
Bryan Kennedy
Contest Director
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From tony at radiosouthrc.com  Tue Sep 15 05:40:04 2009
From: tony at radiosouthrc.com (Tony)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 13:40:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] NSRCA District 3 Championships
Message-ID: <8A1B9587840F4E779D06006172FC1791@Tony>

Attached is the flier for the District Champs.  

 

Tony Stillman, President

Radio South, Inc.

139 Altama Connector, Box 322

Brunswick, GA  31525

1-800-962-7802

www.radiosouthrc.com

 

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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Tue Sep 15 10:51:29 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 18:51:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)
Message-ID: <ED97555AA16F4597A50A4533F0DE91F9@UncleJasPC>

Has anyone (flying electric, sorry glow fliers) tried moving batteries to the extremes in the fuselages of their planes? Really low 
to really high? Results? I've often though about trying it, but new have. Just wondering if anyone has...

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


From jcombs1947 at att.net  Tue Sep 15 11:31:03 2009
From: jcombs1947 at att.net (Jerry Combs)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 19:31:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)
References: <ED97555AA16F4597A50A4533F0DE91F9@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <4557A91B5F8046F0BAD82DFCFAD7E4F5@D4KBKQ71>

Hi Jason,

I know that this may not be totally true for 2m pattern planes but I have 
done this on my F3P indoor models and yes it makes a very big difference in 
how the plane flies.  I balance my models in all 3 axis.

Jerry 


From jlachow at hotmail.com  Tue Sep 15 11:45:30 2009
From: jlachow at hotmail.com (Joe Lachowski)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 19:45:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Oxai Beryll For Sale
Message-ID: <SNT104-W4E31A436E9DF0729A0195BBE30@phx.gbl>


I'll be at the FARM contest this weekend  in Virginia.  If there is anyone possibly interested, I will bring it down.

 

Beryll is setup with a Hacker C50 13XL and Hacker Controller. JR Servos all around. MK Linkages. Plane has 207 flights on it. Some very minor wear. Plane flys fine. Too many pattern planes.  At least $5000 is into the cost of it. Asking $2300.  Wheel pants were removed to use bigger wheels on a grasss field.  Servos are 3421sa's on elevator, 9411sa's on ailerons, and a 8411sa on rudder. Also, comes with wing, stab and fuselage covers.
 

Will sell  as stripped down airframe for $1350.00.


No trades.

_________________________________________________________________
Bing brings you health info from trusted sources.
http://www.bing.com/search?q=pet+allergy&form=MHEINA&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TXT_MHEINA_Health_Health_PetAllergy_1x1
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From rharn at carolina.rr.com  Tue Sep 15 15:58:23 2009
From: rharn at carolina.rr.com (rharn)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 23:58:23 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Oxai Beryll For Sale
In-Reply-To: <SNT104-W4E31A436E9DF0729A0195BBE30@phx.gbl>
References: <SNT104-W4E31A436E9DF0729A0195BBE30@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAABeGCaS+7axDt+NuNO0OrS7CgAAAEAAAAGqs40XOsX5Lk1/4dThypToBAAAAAA==@carolina.rr.com>

I'm interested. Contact me offline. rharn at carolina.rr.com

 

  _____  

From: Joe Lachowski [mailto:jlachow at hotmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 3:45 PM
To: NSRCA Discussion List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Oxai Beryll For Sale

 

I'll be at the FARM contest this weekend  in Virginia.  If there is anyone
possibly interested, I will bring it down.
 
Beryll is setup with a Hacker C50 13XL and Hacker Controller. JR Servos all
around. MK Linkages. Plane has 207 flights on it. Some very minor wear.
Plane flys fine. Too many pattern planes.  At least $5000 is into the cost
of it. Asking $2300.  Wheel pants were removed to use bigger wheels on a
grasss field.  Servos are 3421sa's on elevator, 9411sa's on ailerons, and a
8411sa on rudder. Also, comes with wing, stab and fuselage covers.
 
Will sell  as stripped down airframe for $1350.00.

No trades.

  _____  

Bing brings you health info from trusted sources. Try it now!
<http://www.bing.com/search?q=pet+allergy&form=MHEINA&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TXT_
MHEINA_Health_Health_PetAllergy_1x1> 

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From ejhaury at comcast.net  Tue Sep 15 16:15:38 2009
From: ejhaury at comcast.net (Earl Haury)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 00:15:38 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)
In-Reply-To: <ED97555AA16F4597A50A4533F0DE91F9@UncleJasPC>
References: <ED97555AA16F4597A50A4533F0DE91F9@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <8623748A24224BEE9D6BE5E99626ABC1@EarlPC>

Jason, looks like you're not getting any takers on this item. It seems 
logical that anything of significant mass (batteries) should be close to the 
roll center of the airplane, and I mount mine that way. I flew an Abbra for 
a season with the batts centered and liked the way it flew. OTOH, several 
folks have competed successfully with the Abbra with batts hanging low in 
the cowl - so go figure.

Guess you'll just have to do the experiment (and let us know what you 
observe).

Earl


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "J Shu" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 1:51 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)


> Has anyone (flying electric, sorry glow fliers) tried moving batteries to 
> the extremes in the fuselages of their planes? Really low to really high? 
> Results? I've often though about trying it, but new have. Just wondering 
> if anyone has...
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


From AtwoodDon at aol.com  Tue Sep 15 16:19:55 2009
From: AtwoodDon at aol.com (AtwoodDon at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 00:19:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)
Message-ID: <c11.36b0f60d.37e18954@aol.com>

On my e-planes, the landing gear plate is right where I would like the  
batteries to sit so the choice is above or below the plate.  I have not  tried 
below the plate yet so can't comment on that.
 
Anyone been successful at some other type of mounting approach?  I  have 
thought about splitting the 5S packs and put one above and one below.   
However, that seemed like a hard way to approach the test so did not try  it.
 
Don
 
 
In a message dated 9/15/2009 5:15:53 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,  
ejhaury at comcast.net writes:

Jason,  looks like you're not getting any takers on this item. It seems 
logical  that anything of significant mass (batteries) should be close to 
the 
roll  center of the airplane, and I mount mine that way. I flew an Abbra 
for 
a  season with the batts centered and liked the way it flew. OTOH, several  
folks have competed successfully with the Abbra with batts hanging low in  
the cowl - so go figure.

Guess you'll just have to do the  experiment (and let us know what you  
observe).

Earl


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "J  Shu" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: "NSRCA"  <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009  1:51 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric  pilots)


> Has anyone (flying electric, sorry glow fliers) tried  moving batteries 
to 
> the extremes in the fuselages of their planes?  Really low to really 
high? 
> Results? I've often though about trying  it, but new have. Just wondering 
> if anyone has...
>
>  Regards,
> Jason
> www.shulmanaviation.com
>  www.composite-arf.com
>
>  _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion  mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion  

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion  mailing  list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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From dkrev at shaw.ca  Tue Sep 15 17:34:49 2009
From: dkrev at shaw.ca (Dave Reaville)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 01:34:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] BCPA Contest Results
Message-ID: <2A3A148CE98B49C99F129488B0375A46@Dave007>

Hi folks

For those interested I have listed the following links for the BC Precision Aerobatics Contest this past weekend in Mission, BC Canada. Also a link to my Creswell pictures :-)

Results http://members.shaw.ca/patternwestnews/result/bcpa09.htm

Pictures http://picasaweb.google.com/Dave.Reaville/BCPrecisionAerobaticsChampionships2009

Report http://members.shaw.ca/patternwestnews/report/bcpa09.htm

Creswell, OR USA Pictures http://picasaweb.google.com/Dave.Reaville/Creswell2009#

Thanks,

Dave Reaville
NSRCA I-VP Canada 
NSRCA 3156
MAAC 56510 
http://members.shaw.ca/patternwestnews/
http://patternwest.blogspot.com/
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From vanputte at cox.net  Tue Sep 15 18:39:30 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 02:39:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)
In-Reply-To: <ED97555AA16F4597A50A4533F0DE91F9@UncleJasPC>
References: <ED97555AA16F4597A50A4533F0DE91F9@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <D07BD9BE-B76E-40DB-B187-6E7C770302D5@cox.net>

I tried moving the batteries aft in my Genesis last weekend and noted  
no significant effects.  I forgot to strap them down and they tried  
to go to the tail.  They broke the air dam, but the battery leads  
would only let the batteries go aft about six inches.  I do not plan  
to repeat the experiment.

Ron VP

On Sep 15, 2009, at 1:51 PM, J Shu wrote:

> Has anyone (flying electric, sorry glow fliers) tried moving  
> batteries to the extremes in the fuselages of their planes? Really  
> low to really high? Results? I've often though about trying it, but  
> new have. Just wondering if anyone has...
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Tue Sep 15 18:46:46 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 02:46:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)
In-Reply-To: <D07BD9BE-B76E-40DB-B187-6E7C770302D5@cox.net>
References: <ED97555AA16F4597A50A4533F0DE91F9@UncleJasPC>
	<D07BD9BE-B76E-40DB-B187-6E7C770302D5@cox.net>
Message-ID: <D114A88C2B514CAFBEC401D872708DF5@UncleJasPC>

I almost know that feeling Ron. In Poland during a practice flight, I forgot to put the straps across my 10S 6000 packs. I flew a 
long 10 minute flight snapping here, there and everywhere... when I landed, I went to undo the straps and they were already on the 
sides of the fuselage, still. The batteries stayed put, thus my belief in the floor should ALWAYS have velcro on it holding the 
battery down!

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ron Van Putte" <vanputte at cox.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 10:39 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)


>I tried moving the batteries aft in my Genesis last weekend and noted  no significant effects.  I forgot to strap them down and 
>they tried  to go to the tail.  They broke the air dam, but the battery leads  would only let the batteries go aft about six 
>inches.  I do not plan  to repeat the experiment.
>
> Ron VP
>
> On Sep 15, 2009, at 1:51 PM, J Shu wrote:
>
>> Has anyone (flying electric, sorry glow fliers) tried moving  batteries to the extremes in the fuselages of their planes? Really 
>> low to really high? Results? I've often though about trying it, but  new have. Just wondering if anyone has...
>>
>> Regards,
>> Jason
>> www.shulmanaviation.com
>> www.composite-arf.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 


From txf3a at entouch.net  Tue Sep 15 19:09:18 2009
From: txf3a at entouch.net (Andre Bouchard)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 03:09:18 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)
In-Reply-To: <8623748A24224BEE9D6BE5E99626ABC1@EarlPC>
Message-ID: <9A.83.00456.CD650BA4@mxo6.broadbandsupport.net>

JAS

Base on my experience I agree with the previous observations about battery
placement on foamies.  That being said, the battery weight can be up to 20%
of the foamy weight, so small displacement can have a big effect.

The center of vertical mass mattered back in the top-mounted tuned pipe
days--those airplanes pulled to the canopy in verticals (OK, some of this
was design), so people reconfigured the mass.  The relative mass above C/L
was probably less than 7% of airframe weight and was not that far from the
CG...probably proportional to mounting the batteries in the belly pan of
today's 2m designs.

Battery weight is about 10% of our typical 2M weights.  The significance of
off-center mass will of course depend on distance of the mass from the
center line, however, given the above observations I suspect battery
placement (vertically) should be important....but no one with the belly pan
mounting ever seems to complain!

Andre

     

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 7:15 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)

Jason, looks like you're not getting any takers on this item. It seems 
logical that anything of significant mass (batteries) should be close to the

roll center of the airplane, and I mount mine that way. I flew an Abbra for 
a season with the batts centered and liked the way it flew. OTOH, several 
folks have competed successfully with the Abbra with batts hanging low in 
the cowl - so go figure.

Guess you'll just have to do the experiment (and let us know what you 
observe).

Earl


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "J Shu" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 1:51 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)


> Has anyone (flying electric, sorry glow fliers) tried moving batteries to 
> the extremes in the fuselages of their planes? Really low to really high? 
> Results? I've often though about trying it, but new have. Just wondering 
> if anyone has...
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.100/2374 - Release Date: 09/15/09
20:00:00


From vicenterc at comcast.net  Wed Sep 16 02:55:50 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 10:55:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)
In-Reply-To: <1701879210.1848851253098421180.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <996180767.1849071253098548561.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>



Jason, 



I have the Abbra in both versions electric (Hacker C50)?and glow with YS 160.? After some time flying both with the same static CG came to the conclusion that the equivalent static CG of the electric has to be forward of the glow to get both planes to fly similar.? Therefore, the inertia effect of the heavy items is important since the electric motor is lighter than the YS engine and the batteries are heavy and closer to the CG.? This was very surprising to me since usually we think that if the plane have the same static CG they should fly similar.? It took me some time to realize this. In the electric Abbra the static CG is around 1/2" forward of the glow version.? It is important to mention that the Abbra was originally design for gas engine ( ZDZ 40).? This engine is a lot heavier than the electric or YS engines.? I suspect that this plane trims a lot better with the gas engine due to the inertia effect of the heavy engine in the nose.? In conclusion, a good electric pattern design should have the nose a little longer. 



I am converting to electric one of my YS powered Abbras .? I will try to place the batteries closer to the C/L of the fuselage and see the effect flying both planes back-to-back.? It will take me some time to report but I am planing to let you know if I notice a difference.?? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "J Shu " < jshulman @ cfl . rr .com> 
To: " NSRCA " < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 1:51:18 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: [ NSRCA -discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots) 

Has anyone (flying electric, sorry glow fliers) tried moving batteries to the extremes in the fuselages of their planes? Really low 
to really high? Results? I've often though about trying it, but new have. Just wondering if anyone has... 

Regards, 
Jason 
www . shulmanaviation .com 
www .composite-arf.com 

_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA -discussion mailing list 
NSRCA -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Wed Sep 16 03:17:45 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 11:17:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D57EB8F6@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

I think you'll find that the battery weight of your F3A plane is also in excess of 20% of the total weight.  A 10s pack is certainly over 1000gms making it more than 20% of a 5kg legal airframe. 

I suspect moving that amount of mass vertically has the same significant impact that it does on the foamies. 

That said, the same is maybe MORE true of our changing mass fuel tanks. While they weigh less, they flux from over a lb to almost nothing during flight.   Being high or low in the fuse will certainly impact trim.  We seem to just fly with it. 

My guess is you're trimming out any issues a high or low battery causes and moving on. 
--------------------------
Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld


----- Original Message -----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org <nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
To: 'General pattern discussion' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue Sep 15 23:09:16 2009
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)

JAS

Base on my experience I agree with the previous observations about battery
placement on foamies.  That being said, the battery weight can be up to 20%
of the foamy weight, so small displacement can have a big effect.

The center of vertical mass mattered back in the top-mounted tuned pipe
days--those airplanes pulled to the canopy in verticals (OK, some of this
was design), so people reconfigured the mass.  The relative mass above C/L
was probably less than 7% of airframe weight and was not that far from the
CG...probably proportional to mounting the batteries in the belly pan of
today's 2m designs.

Battery weight is about 10% of our typical 2M weights.  The significance of
off-center mass will of course depend on distance of the mass from the
center line, however, given the above observations I suspect battery
placement (vertically) should be important....but no one with the belly pan
mounting ever seems to complain!

Andre

     

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 7:15 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)

Jason, looks like you're not getting any takers on this item. It seems 
logical that anything of significant mass (batteries) should be close to the

roll center of the airplane, and I mount mine that way. I flew an Abbra for 
a season with the batts centered and liked the way it flew. OTOH, several 
folks have competed successfully with the Abbra with batts hanging low in 
the cowl - so go figure.

Guess you'll just have to do the experiment (and let us know what you 
observe).

Earl


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "J Shu" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 1:51 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)


> Has anyone (flying electric, sorry glow fliers) tried moving batteries to 
> the extremes in the fuselages of their planes? Really low to really high? 
> Results? I've often though about trying it, but new have. Just wondering 
> if anyone has...
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.100/2374 - Release Date: 09/15/09
20:00:00

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Wed Sep 16 04:27:04 2009
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 12:27:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D57EB8F6@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <325579.58988.qm@web51009.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

 Most planes I've had would have been difficult to move the lipo's very much. Seems like I always end up in a snug nook near the structure for the landing gears on the front to back balance. I would think that top to bottom balance would effect rolling but it's so close to the center it would be hard to detect.
 Mark is right that the lipo is around 20% of the total mass.
                                                   M2

--- On Wed, 9/16/09, Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com> wrote:

> From: Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)
> To: "'nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Wednesday, September 16, 2009, 6:09 AM
> I think you'll find that the battery
> weight of your F3A plane is also in excess of 20% of the
> total weight.? A 10s pack is certainly over 1000gms
> making it more than 20% of a 5kg legal airframe. 
> 
> I suspect moving that amount of mass vertically has the
> same significant impact that it does on the foamies. 
> 
> That said, the same is maybe MORE true of our changing mass
> fuel tanks. While they weigh less, they flux from over a lb
> to almost nothing during flight.???Being high
> or low in the fuse will certainly impact trim.? We seem
> to just fly with it. 
> 
> My guess is you're trimming out any issues a high or low
> battery causes and moving on. 
> --------------------------
> Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> <nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
> To: 'General pattern discussion' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Tue Sep 15 23:09:16 2009
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low
> (electric pilots)
> 
> JAS
> 
> Base on my experience I agree with the previous
> observations about battery
> placement on foamies.? That being said, the battery
> weight can be up to 20%
> of the foamy weight, so small displacement can have a big
> effect.
> 
> The center of vertical mass mattered back in the
> top-mounted tuned pipe
> days--those airplanes pulled to the canopy in verticals
> (OK, some of this
> was design), so people reconfigured the mass.? The
> relative mass above C/L
> was probably less than 7% of airframe weight and was not
> that far from the
> CG...probably proportional to mounting the batteries in the
> belly pan of
> today's 2m designs.
> 
> Battery weight is about 10% of our typical 2M
> weights.? The significance of
> off-center mass will of course depend on distance of the
> mass from the
> center line, however, given the above observations I
> suspect battery
> placement (vertically) should be important....but no one
> with the belly pan
> mounting ever seems to complain!
> 
> Andre
> 
> ? ???
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]
> On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 7:15 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low
> (electric pilots)
> 
> Jason, looks like you're not getting any takers on this
> item. It seems 
> logical that anything of significant mass (batteries)
> should be close to the
> 
> roll center of the airplane, and I mount mine that way. I
> flew an Abbra for 
> a season with the batts centered and liked the way it flew.
> OTOH, several 
> folks have competed successfully with the Abbra with batts
> hanging low in 
> the cowl - so go figure.
> 
> Guess you'll just have to do the experiment (and let us
> know what you 
> observe).
> 
> Earl
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "J Shu" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
> To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 1:51 PM
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric
> pilots)
> 
> 
> > Has anyone (flying electric, sorry glow fliers) tried
> moving batteries to 
> > the extremes in the fuselages of their planes? Really
> low to really high? 
> > Results? I've often though about trying it, but new
> have. Just wondering 
> > if anyone has...
> >
> > Regards,
> > Jason
> > www.shulmanaviation.com
> > www.composite-arf.com
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.100/2374 -
> Release Date: 09/15/09
> 20:00:00
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
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> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 


      

From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Wed Sep 16 07:32:59 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 15:32:59 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships and Night fly!
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7A08@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

For those planning to attend the District 4 championship pattern contest and our annual steak roast/night fly/ fireworks extravaganza,  The host club is the Flying Cardinals RC Club of Northern Kentucky (Cincinnati)

http://www.flyingcardinals.org/

The field should be open for practice all day Friday, though we'll be using some time to set up the boxes.

For anyone that hasn't been there before...well, you're missing something unique.    It's worth the trip!!

Directions are on the web site with lots of hotel availability 10 min from the field at the intersection of I275 and I75.

-Mark
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From precisionaero at hotmail.com  Wed Sep 16 07:37:33 2009
From: precisionaero at hotmail.com (Michael Cohen)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 15:37:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Don Szczur
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7A08@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
References: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7A08@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <BLU115-W2963539C6A2B02C28B9824A0E20@phx.gbl>


Anyone have an e-mail address for Don Szczur?

 

Mike Cohen

 

_________________________________________________________________
Bing brings you health info from trusted sources.
http://www.bing.com/search?q=pet+allergy&form=MHEINA&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TXT_MHEINA_Health_Health_PetAllergy_1x1
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From jnhiller at earthlink.net  Wed Sep 16 08:03:28 2009
From: jnhiller at earthlink.net (J N Hiller)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 16:03:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] BCPA Contest Results
In-Reply-To: <2A3A148CE98B49C99F129488B0375A46@Dave007>
Message-ID: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPIEMGEMAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>

Thanks Dave.
Great site, photos; looks like a good time. I've got to get a passport.
Jim Hiller

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Dave Reaville
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 6:35 PM
To: NSRCA discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] BCPA Contest Results

Hi folks

For those interested I have listed the following links for the BC Precision
Aerobatics Contest this past weekend in Mission, BC Canada. Also a link to
my Creswell pictures :-)

Results http://members.shaw.ca/patternwestnews/result/bcpa09.htm

Pictures
http://picasaweb.google.com/Dave.Reaville/BCPrecisionAerobaticsChampionships
2009

Report http://members.shaw.ca/patternwestnews/report/bcpa09.htm

Creswell, OR USA Pictures
http://picasaweb.google.com/Dave.Reaville/Creswell2009#

Thanks,

Dave Reaville
NSRCA I-VP Canada
NSRCA 3156
MAAC 56510
http://members.shaw.ca/patternwestnews/
http://patternwest.blogspot.com/
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From jonlowe at aol.com  Wed Sep 16 08:30:07 2009
From: jonlowe at aol.com (Jon Lowe)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 16:30:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted:  Smaragd Horizontals
Message-ID: <8CC05020D683899-4DE8-5528@webmail-d035.sysops.aol.com>

Anyone have a pair of PL Prod Smaragd horizontals laying around?  We've 
got a club member, new to pattern,  who bought a nice used one, but 
someone got over zealous with the monokote iron at some point and 
melted the foam internally in a couple of spots.

Thanks.


Jon Lowe

From scrsmith57 at comcast.net  Wed Sep 16 09:23:18 2009
From: scrsmith57 at comcast.net (scrsmith57 at comcast.net)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 17:23:18 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Don Szczur
In-Reply-To: <BLU115-W2963539C6A2B02C28B9824A0E20@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <1571715114.1975721253121797414.JavaMail.root@sz0076a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

Here ya go Mike.
tocdon at netscape.net

Scott Smith

----- Original Message -----

From: Michael Cohen 

To: NSRCA 

Sent: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 15:37:31 +0000 (UTC)

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Don Szczur













Anyone have an e-mail address for Don Szczur?


 


Mike Cohen


 



Bing brings you health info from trusted sources. Try it now!


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From d_bodary at yahoo.com  Wed Sep 16 09:27:56 2009
From: d_bodary at yahoo.com (Dennis Bodary)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 17:27:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted:  Smaragd Horizontals
In-Reply-To: <8CC05020D683899-4DE8-5528@webmail-d035.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <751935.16695.qm@web51710.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

I have a set of stabs and elevators. for? a Smaragd. I will be at the District 4 championships this weekend. 
Dennis Bodary

--- On Wed, 9/16/09, Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com> wrote:


From: Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted: Smaragd Horizontals
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Wednesday, September 16, 2009, 12:29 PM


Anyone have a pair of PL Prod Smaragd horizontals laying around?? We've got a club member, new to pattern,? who bought a nice used one, but someone got over zealous with the monokote iron at some point and melted the foam internally in a couple of spots.

Thanks.


Jon Lowe
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



      
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From dkrev at shaw.ca  Wed Sep 16 09:29:41 2009
From: dkrev at shaw.ca (Dave Reaville)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 17:29:41 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] BCPA Contest Results
References: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPIEMGEMAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <9E8DBA611F294E519A45E09C37F50EFF@Dave007>

Hi Jim 

Come on up anytime.  We will gladly show you a little Canadian hospitality West Coast Style!  Unfortunately this was our last event of the season so you'll have to wait a bit :-)

Dave
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: J N Hiller 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 9:03 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] BCPA Contest Results


  Thanks Dave.

  Great site, photos; looks like a good time. I've got to get a passport.

  Jim Hiller

   

  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Dave Reaville
  Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 6:35 PM
  To: NSRCA discussion
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] BCPA Contest Results

   

  Hi folks

   

  For those interested I have listed the following links for the BC Precision Aerobatics Contest this past weekend in Mission, BC Canada. Also a link to my Creswell pictures :-)

   

  Results http://members.shaw.ca/patternwestnews/result/bcpa09.htm

   

  Pictures http://picasaweb.google.com/Dave.Reaville/BCPrecisionAerobaticsChampionships2009

   

  Report http://members.shaw.ca/patternwestnews/report/bcpa09.htm

   

  Creswell, OR USA Pictures http://picasaweb.google.com/Dave.Reaville/Creswell2009#

   

  Thanks,

   

  Dave Reaville
  NSRCA I-VP Canada 
  NSRCA 3156
  MAAC 56510 
  http://members.shaw.ca/patternwestnews/
  http://patternwest.blogspot.com/



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From schroetere at bellsouth.net  Wed Sep 16 09:30:21 2009
From: schroetere at bellsouth.net (Emory Schroeter)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 17:30:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted:  Smaragd Horizontals
In-Reply-To: <8CC05020D683899-4DE8-5528@webmail-d035.sysops.aol.com>
References: <8CC05020D683899-4DE8-5528@webmail-d035.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <797949.12588.qm@web83904.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

Hey John,

I have some Black Magic v2 stabs lying around. You could rename the plane a Smaragic :-)

Emory.




________________________________
From: Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 12:29:52 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted: Smaragd Horizontals

Anyone have a pair of PL Prod Smaragd horizontals laying around?? We've got a club member, new to pattern,? who bought a nice used one, but someone got over zealous with the monokote iron at some point and melted the foam internally in a couple of spots.

Thanks.


Jon Lowe
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From d_bodary at yahoo.com  Wed Sep 16 09:34:46 2009
From: d_bodary at yahoo.com (Dennis Bodary)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 17:34:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships and Night fly!
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7A08@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <670059.12226.qm@web51712.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

I will be there late Thursday night.

--- On Wed, 9/16/09, Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com> wrote:


From: Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships and Night fly!
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Wednesday, September 16, 2009, 11:24 AM








For those planning to attend the District 4 championship pattern contest and our annual steak roast/night fly/ fireworks extravaganza,? The host club is the Flying Cardinals RC Club of Northern Kentucky (Cincinnati)
?
http://www.flyingcardinals.org/
?
The field should be open for practice all day Friday, though we?ll be using some time to set up the boxes.
?
For anyone that hasn?t been there before?well, you?re missing something unique.??? It?s worth the trip!!
?
Directions are on the web site with lots of hotel availability 10 min from the field at the intersection of I275 and I75.
?
-Mark
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From vanputte at cox.net  Wed Sep 16 09:40:35 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 17:40:35 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted:  Smaragd Horizontals
In-Reply-To: <797949.12588.qm@web83904.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
References: <8CC05020D683899-4DE8-5528@webmail-d035.sysops.aol.com>
	<797949.12588.qm@web83904.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <71BF85B7-9AAB-4BB5-AD87-BD2244789CB4@cox.net>

Not only that, Emory has a couple of Black Magic V3s that have been  
lying around since June.  I wonder if he ever plans to fly them.

Ron VP

On Sep 16, 2009, at 12:30 PM, Emory Schroeter wrote:

> Hey John,
>
> I have some Black Magic v2 stabs lying around. You could rename the  
> plane a Smaragic :-)
>
> Emory.
>
> From: Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com>
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 12:29:52 PM
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted: Smaragd Horizontals
>
> Anyone have a pair of PL Prod Smaragd horizontals laying around?   
> We've got a club member, new to pattern,  who bought a nice used  
> one, but someone got over zealous with the monokote iron at some  
> point and melted the foam internally in a couple of spots.
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> Jon Lowe
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Wed Sep 16 09:53:36 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 17:53:36 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships and Night fly!
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D57EB8FA@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

Are you bringing a night fly plane??  
--------------------------
Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld


----- Original Message -----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org <nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wed Sep 16 13:34:44 2009
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships and Night fly!

I will be there late Thursday night.

--- On Wed, 9/16/09, Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com> wrote:




From: Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships and Night fly!
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Wednesday, September 16, 2009, 11:24 AM



For those planning to attend the District 4 championship pattern contest and our annual steak roast/night fly/ fireworks extravaganza,  The host club is the Flying Cardinals RC Club of Northern Kentucky (Cincinnati)


 


http://www.flyingcardinals.org/


 


The field should be open for practice all day Friday, though we?ll be using some time to set up the boxes.


 


For anyone that hasn?t been there before?well, you?re missing something unique.    It?s worth the trip!!


 


Directions are on the web site with lots of hotel availability 10 min from the field at the intersection of I275 and I75.


 


-Mark


-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org <http://us.mc517.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.75/2341 - Release Date: 09/16/09 05:51:00

  

From schroetere at bellsouth.net  Wed Sep 16 10:30:54 2009
From: schroetere at bellsouth.net (Emory Schroeter)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 18:30:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted:  Smaragd Horizontals
In-Reply-To: <71BF85B7-9AAB-4BB5-AD87-BD2244789CB4@cox.net>
References: <8CC05020D683899-4DE8-5528@webmail-d035.sysops.aol.com>
	<797949.12588.qm@web83904.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
	<71BF85B7-9AAB-4BB5-AD87-BD2244789CB4@cox.net>
Message-ID: <317387.60656.qm@web83904.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

Yeah, that's true. For that matter, I have a couple of V3 stabs laying around, although I still have some fuselages for those airplanes. I get 'em done soon, although?I quit giving myself deadlines.

Emory




________________________________
From: Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 1:40:29 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted: Smaragd Horizontals

Not only that, Emory has a couple of Black Magic V3s that have been lying around since June.? I wonder if he ever plans to fly them.

Ron VP

On Sep 16, 2009, at 12:30 PM, Emory Schroeter wrote:

> Hey John,
> 
> I have some Black Magic v2 stabs lying around. You could rename the plane a Smaragic :-)
> 
> Emory.
> 
> From: Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com>
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 12:29:52 PM
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted: Smaragd Horizontals
> 
> Anyone have a pair of PL Prod Smaragd horizontals laying around?? We've got a club member, new to pattern,? who bought a nice used one, but someone got over zealous with the monokote iron at some point and melted the foam internally in a couple of spots.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> Jon Lowe
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From txf3a at entouch.net  Wed Sep 16 15:31:44 2009
From: txf3a at entouch.net (Andre Bouchard)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 23:31:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D57EB8F6@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <FE.36.08777.B5571BA4@mxo4.broadbandsupport.net>

Agree +20%--apologies for the math problem!

I believe I have experienced the same effect Vincent described...inertial
effects.

ab

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Atwood, Mark
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 6:09 AM
To: 'nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)

I think you'll find that the battery weight of your F3A plane is also in
excess of 20% of the total weight.  A 10s pack is certainly over 1000gms
making it more than 20% of a 5kg legal airframe. 

I suspect moving that amount of mass vertically has the same significant
impact that it does on the foamies. 

That said, the same is maybe MORE true of our changing mass fuel tanks.
While they weigh less, they flux from over a lb to almost nothing during
flight.   Being high or low in the fuse will certainly impact trim.  We seem
to just fly with it. 

My guess is you're trimming out any issues a high or low battery causes and
moving on. 
--------------------------
Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld


----- Original Message -----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
<nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
To: 'General pattern discussion' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue Sep 15 23:09:16 2009
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)

JAS

Base on my experience I agree with the previous observations about battery
placement on foamies.  That being said, the battery weight can be up to 20%
of the foamy weight, so small displacement can have a big effect.

The center of vertical mass mattered back in the top-mounted tuned pipe
days--those airplanes pulled to the canopy in verticals (OK, some of this
was design), so people reconfigured the mass.  The relative mass above C/L
was probably less than 7% of airframe weight and was not that far from the
CG...probably proportional to mounting the batteries in the belly pan of
today's 2m designs.

Battery weight is about 10% of our typical 2M weights.  The significance of
off-center mass will of course depend on distance of the mass from the
center line, however, given the above observations I suspect battery
placement (vertically) should be important....but no one with the belly pan
mounting ever seems to complain!

Andre

     

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 7:15 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)

Jason, looks like you're not getting any takers on this item. It seems 
logical that anything of significant mass (batteries) should be close to the

roll center of the airplane, and I mount mine that way. I flew an Abbra for 
a season with the batts centered and liked the way it flew. OTOH, several 
folks have competed successfully with the Abbra with batts hanging low in 
the cowl - so go figure.

Guess you'll just have to do the experiment (and let us know what you 
observe).

Earl


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "J Shu" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 1:51 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries high or low (electric pilots)


> Has anyone (flying electric, sorry glow fliers) tried moving batteries to 
> the extremes in the fuselages of their planes? Really low to really high? 
> Results? I've often though about trying it, but new have. Just wondering 
> if anyone has...
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.100/2374 - Release Date: 09/15/09
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_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
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17:49:00


From trexlesh at msn.com  Wed Sep 16 15:35:36 2009
From: trexlesh at msn.com (Rex)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 23:35:36 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FW: [NSRCA-dist8] FW: Planes
In-Reply-To: <BAY119-W33058E44C4D46BBA119B9ECCE20@phx.gbl>
References: <SNT114-DS14DC16F34338D33B6FBADCA2E20@phx.gbl>
	<BAY119-W33058E44C4D46BBA119B9ECCE20@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY119-W36504F6449BE6462A4595BCCE20@phx.gbl>



 


From: trexlesh at msn.com
To: nsrca-dist8 at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 16:34:18 -0700
Subject: [NSRCA-dist8] FW: Planes



Folks I got the following email from a friend in the Eugene area....  The Focus was bought from Gordon Anderson a
few years ago and never flown since.  It has an OS 160 on it...  This is a good deal...  the Radio is brand new, and never used!  I'm sure he'd be willing  to seperate the items.
 
Rex
 


From: Jeffgmb at msn.com
To: trexlesh at msn.com
Subject: Planes
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 21:44:14 -0700




 
 
How have you been ? I have my Edge 540 which I only flew once.  and my Focus plus  my JR pcm 10X never used all  for sale. If you Know of anybody please let me know. 1500.00 for all... 
 
 
 
Thanks 
 
Jeff
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From patternrules at yahoo.com  Wed Sep 16 16:13:55 2009
From: patternrules at yahoo.com (Steven Maxwell)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 00:13:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale 85 HV ESC and 4- 8411 servos
Message-ID: <956712.4791.qm@web111305.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1112626#post13132108

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1112621

Thanks 
Steve Maxwell


      
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From patternrules at yahoo.com  Wed Sep 16 16:20:30 2009
From: patternrules at yahoo.com (Steven Maxwell)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 00:20:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] for sale forgot JR 921 RX
Message-ID: <985051.65170.qm@web111312.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

 I'm getting ready to order a 9303 and would like to sell the 921 rx that comes with it 
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1111456

Thanks
 Steve Maxwell


      
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From tocdon at netscape.net  Wed Sep 16 17:48:54 2009
From: tocdon at netscape.net (tocdon at netscape.net)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 01:48:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Don Szczur
In-Reply-To: <1571715114.1975721253121797414.JavaMail.root@sz0076a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <8CC05501621A59A-450C-BEB6@webmail-m080.sysops.aol.com>

Here..


-----Original Message-----
From: scrsmith57 at comcast.net
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wed, Sep 16, 2009 1:23 pm
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Don Szczur


Here ya go Mike.
tocdon at netscape.net

Scott Smith

----- Original Message -----

From: Michael Cohen 

To: NSRCA 

Sent: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 15:37:31 +0000 (UTC)

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Don Szczur













Anyone have an e-mail address for Don Szczur?


?


Mike Cohen


?

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From kvelez at rochester.rr.com  Wed Sep 16 18:31:44 2009
From: kvelez at rochester.rr.com (Ken Velez)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 02:31:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark
In-Reply-To: <956712.4791.qm@web111305.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1D30BFA58DD3472BA1D2493C5E155A72@ken42e65a0511d>

Hi all,

 

Posting for a friend.

 

New, Spark F3A for sale; painted on the Magic Scheme

http://krill-model.com/eu/en/index.php?id=designdetail
<http://krill-model.com/eu/en/index.php?id=designdetail&model=105&design=48>
&model=105&design=48

 

The only thing done to the frame was the installation on the elevator and
ailerons control horns

Everything else is still brand new.

 

Please contact me of list if interested pictures available on request.

 

Thanks

 

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From precisionaero at hotmail.com  Thu Sep 17 03:19:15 2009
From: precisionaero at hotmail.com (Michael Cohen)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 11:19:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Don Szczur
In-Reply-To: <8CC05501621A59A-450C-BEB6@webmail-m080.sysops.aol.com>
References: <1571715114.1975721253121797414.JavaMail.root@sz0076a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<8CC05501621A59A-450C-BEB6@webmail-m080.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <BLU115-W20B45D187EAE66A0DED8BA0E10@phx.gbl>


Thanks
 


To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 21:48:27 -0400
From: tocdon at netscape.net
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Don Szczur

Here..


-----Original Message-----
From: scrsmith57 at comcast.net
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wed, Sep 16, 2009 1:23 pm
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Don Szczur




Here ya go Mike.
tocdon at netscape.net

Scott Smith

----- Original Message -----

From: Michael Cohen 

To: NSRCA 

Sent: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 15:37:31 +0000 (UTC)

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Don Szczur













Anyone have an e-mail address for Don Szczur?


 


Mike Cohen


 



Bing brings you health info from trusted sources. Try it now!



_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service.
http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/171222984/direct/01/
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From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Thu Sep 17 06:24:50 2009
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 14:24:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Hobbycity E-setup
In-Reply-To: <8A1B9587840F4E779D06006172FC1791@Tony>
Message-ID: <814i1h$4cirs0@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>

Guys - I am working on a friend's airplane that has this equipment:
This is the link of the engine
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=7709

This is the ESC
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=4691


This is the Battery
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=7299


This is in fact real friend, and not a fictitious story to hide my conversion to electric :).  This is the Turnigy motor, 100 controller, and 4S 4900 Zippy setup for an Osmose 110.  If anyone has experience with this setup please email me props used or things I should know about this.

Thanks,
Jim



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Tony
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 9:40 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] NSRCA District 3 Championships

Attached is the flier for the District Champs...

Tony Stillman, President
Radio South, Inc.
139 Altama Connector, Box 322
Brunswick, GA  31525
1-800-962-7802
www.radiosouthrc.com

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From jlkonn at hotmail.com  Thu Sep 17 06:33:26 2009
From: jlkonn at hotmail.com (John Konneker)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 14:33:26 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt
Message-ID: <BLU106-W10D56DE2AB125E22010CEBCDE10@phx.gbl>


I was telling Mike Mueller about a picture I saw once on  RCU of the aluminum shipping crate Wolfgang Matt
uses.  The picture was of him in an airport and the crate on a dolly.  Does this ring a bell with anyone?
JLK
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Thu Sep 17 08:20:13 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 16:20:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt
In-Reply-To: <BLU106-W10D56DE2AB125E22010CEBCDE10@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU106-W10D56DE2AB125E22010CEBCDE10@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <1D0A2BC44962466490ADC4F2A0AE8F6A@UncleJasPC>

Ding Ding Ding

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: John Konneker 
  To: Discussion List 
  Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 10:33 AM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt


  I was telling Mike Mueller about a picture I saw once on  RCU of the aluminum shipping crate Wolfgang Matt
  uses.  The picture was of him in an airport and the crate on a dolly.  Does this ring a bell with anyone?
  JLK



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jlkonn at hotmail.com  Thu Sep 17 09:22:44 2009
From: jlkonn at hotmail.com (John Konneker)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 17:22:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt
In-Reply-To: <1D0A2BC44962466490ADC4F2A0AE8F6A@UncleJasPC>
References: <BLU106-W10D56DE2AB125E22010CEBCDE10@phx.gbl>
	<1D0A2BC44962466490ADC4F2A0AE8F6A@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <BLU106-W118B141D96347C5063510CCDE10@phx.gbl>

 I was kinda hopin' for a link to a picture...  :)
JLK

From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 12:19:58 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt






Ding Ding Ding

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: 
  John Konneker 
  
  To: Discussion List 
  Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 10:33 
  AM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang 
  Matt
  
I was telling Mike Mueller about a picture I saw once on  
  RCU of the aluminum shipping crate Wolfgang Matt
uses.  The picture 
  was of him in an airport and the crate on a dolly.  Does this ring a bell 
  with anyone?
JLK

  
  

  
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion 
  mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jlkonn at hotmail.com  Thu Sep 17 09:23:25 2009
From: jlkonn at hotmail.com (John Konneker)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 17:23:25 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt
In-Reply-To: <1D0A2BC44962466490ADC4F2A0AE8F6A@UncleJasPC>
References: <BLU106-W10D56DE2AB125E22010CEBCDE10@phx.gbl>
	<1D0A2BC44962466490ADC4F2A0AE8F6A@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <BLU106-W274BE5D9F2F1DE14717AEFCDE10@phx.gbl>


From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 12:19:58 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt






Ding Ding Ding

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: 
  John Konneker 
  
  To: Discussion List 
  Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 10:33 
  AM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang 
  Matt
  
I was telling Mike Mueller about a picture I saw once on  
  RCU of the aluminum shipping crate Wolfgang Matt
uses.  The picture 
  was of him in an airport and the crate on a dolly.  Does this ring a bell 
  with anyone?
JLK

  
  

  
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion 
  mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Thu Sep 17 09:25:25 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 17:25:25 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt
In-Reply-To: <BLU106-W118B141D96347C5063510CCDE10@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU106-W10D56DE2AB125E22010CEBCDE10@phx.gbl><1D0A2BC44962466490ADC4F2A0AE8F6A@UncleJasPC>
	<BLU106-W118B141D96347C5063510CCDE10@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <5E30957CC18548DCB54EE2C0A1F10B8C@UncleJasPC>

You didn't say that, you just asked if it rang a bell...lol.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: John Konneker 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 1:22 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt


  I was kinda hopin' for a link to a picture...  :)
  JLK


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com
  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 12:19:58 -0400
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt


  Ding Ding Ding

  Regards,
  Jason
  www.shulmanaviation.com
  www.composite-arf.com

    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: John Konneker 
    To: Discussion List 
    Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 10:33 AM
    Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt


    I was telling Mike Mueller about a picture I saw once on  RCU of the aluminum shipping crate Wolfgang Matt
    uses.  The picture was of him in an airport and the crate on a dolly.  Does this ring a bell with anyone?
    JLK

----------------------------------------------------------------------------


    _______________________________________________
    NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
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  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Thu Sep 17 09:29:54 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 17:29:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt
In-Reply-To: <BLU106-W118B141D96347C5063510CCDE10@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU106-W10D56DE2AB125E22010CEBCDE10@phx.gbl><1D0A2BC44962466490ADC4F2A0AE8F6A@UncleJasPC>
	<BLU106-W118B141D96347C5063510CCDE10@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <5B5DFFCC23194AEDABC79C8D7DFF9F40@UncleJasPC>

I went back and looked at my pics just in case I had one... nope. It was in the Argentina thread I believe. Woulda been near the last pages.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: John Konneker 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 1:22 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt


  I was kinda hopin' for a link to a picture...  :)
  JLK


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com
  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 12:19:58 -0400
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt


  Ding Ding Ding

  Regards,
  Jason
  www.shulmanaviation.com
  www.composite-arf.com

    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: John Konneker 
    To: Discussion List 
    Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 10:33 AM
    Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt


    I was telling Mike Mueller about a picture I saw once on  RCU of the aluminum shipping crate Wolfgang Matt
    uses.  The picture was of him in an airport and the crate on a dolly.  Does this ring a bell with anyone?
    JLK

----------------------------------------------------------------------------


    _______________________________________________
    NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jonlowe at aol.com  Thu Sep 17 09:34:22 2009
From: jonlowe at aol.com (Jon Lowe)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 17:34:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted:  Smaragd Horizontals
In-Reply-To: <751935.16695.qm@web51710.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <8CC05D429891623-4DE8-1476E@webmail-d035.sysops.aol.com>

Dennis,
I responded back offlist.  Did you get my email?


Jon Lowe


-----Original Message-----
From: Dennis Bodary <d_bodary at yahoo.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wed, Sep 16, 2009 12:27 pm
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted:  Smaragd Horizontals














I have a set of stabs and elevators. for? a Smaragd. I will be at the 
District 4 championships this weekend.


Dennis Bodary

--- On Wed, 9/16/09, Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com> wrote:




From: Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted: Smaragd Horizontals
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Wednesday, September 16, 2009, 12:29 PM



Anyone have a pair of PL Prod Smaragd horizontals laying around?? We've 
got a club member, new to pattern,? who bought a nice used one, but 
someone got over zealous with the monokote iron at some point and 
melted the foam internally in a couple of spots.

Thanks.


Jon Lowe
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


















_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion






From jlkonn at hotmail.com  Thu Sep 17 09:57:39 2009
From: jlkonn at hotmail.com (John Konneker)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 17:57:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt
In-Reply-To: <5B5DFFCC23194AEDABC79C8D7DFF9F40@UncleJasPC>
References: <BLU106-W10D56DE2AB125E22010CEBCDE10@phx.gbl><1D0A2BC44962466490ADC4F2A0AE8F6A@UncleJasPC>
	<BLU106-W118B141D96347C5063510CCDE10@phx.gbl> 
	<5B5DFFCC23194AEDABC79C8D7DFF9F40@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <BLU106-W3509AC7258FFCD906CADFCDE10@phx.gbl>


Yeah, I went thru that thread real quick this morning.  I probably overlooked it.
I'll go back again.
Thanks!
JLK

From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 13:29:46 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang Matt










I went back and looked at my pics 
just in case I had one... nope. It was in the Argentina thread I believe. Woulda 
been near the last pages.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: 
  John Konneker 
  
  To: General pattern discussion 
  
  Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 1:22 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang 
  Matt
  
I was kinda hopin' for a link to a 
  picture...  :)
JLK


  
  From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: 
  Thu, 17 Sep 2009 12:19:58 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang 
  Matt


  

  Ding Ding Ding
  
Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

  
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: 
    John 
    Konneker 
    To: Discussion List 
    Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 
    10:33 AM
    Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wolfgang 
    Matt
    
I was telling Mike Mueller about a picture I saw once 
    on  RCU of the aluminum shipping crate Wolfgang Matt
uses.  The 
    picture was of him in an airport and the crate on a dolly.  Does this 
    ring a bell with anyone?
JLK

    

    
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion 
    mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

  
  


  
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion 
  mailing 
  list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From d_bodary at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 17 10:13:34 2009
From: d_bodary at yahoo.com (Dennis Bodary)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 18:13:34 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships and Night fly!
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D57EB8FA@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <427962.32741.qm@web51707.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

That is a negative. This year concentrating on the flying. 

--- On Wed, 9/16/09, Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com> wrote:


From: Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships and Night fly!
To: "'nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Wednesday, September 16, 2009, 1:44 PM


Are you bringing a night fly plane??? 
--------------------------
Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld


----- Original Message -----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org <nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wed Sep 16 13:34:44 2009
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships and Night fly!

I will be there late Thursday night.

--- On Wed, 9/16/09, Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com> wrote:




From: Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships and Night fly!
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Wednesday, September 16, 2009, 11:24 AM



For those planning to attend the District 4 championship pattern contest and our annual steak roast/night fly/ fireworks extravaganza,? The host club is the Flying Cardinals RC Club of Northern Kentucky (Cincinnati)





http://www.flyingcardinals.org/ 





The field should be open for practice all day Friday, though we?ll be using some time to set up the boxes.





For anyone that hasn?t been there before?well, you?re missing something unique.? ? It?s worth the trip!!





Directions are on the web site with lots of hotel availability 10 min from the field at the intersection of I275 and I75.





-Mark


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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


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? 
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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 17 11:26:42 2009
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 19:26:42 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted:  Smaragd Horizontals
In-Reply-To: <8CC05D429891623-4DE8-1476E@webmail-d035.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <519882.93140.qm@web51002.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

 John I had a Smaragd with a Temptation wing and stab on it. It flew excellent. Mike

--- On Thu, 9/17/09, Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com> wrote:

> From: Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted:  Smaragd Horizontals
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Thursday, September 17, 2009, 12:33 PM
> Dennis,
> I responded back offlist.? Did you get my email?
> 
> 
> Jon Lowe
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dennis Bodary <d_bodary at yahoo.com>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Wed, Sep 16, 2009 12:27 pm
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted:? Smaragd
> Horizontals
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a set of stabs and elevators. for? a Smaragd. I
> will be at the District 4 championships this weekend.
> 
> 
> Dennis Bodary
> 
> --- On Wed, 9/16/09, Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com>
> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com>
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted: Smaragd Horizontals
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Wednesday, September 16, 2009, 12:29 PM
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone have a pair of PL Prod Smaragd horizontals laying
> around?? We've got a club member, new to pattern,? who
> bought a nice used one, but someone got over zealous with
> the monokote iron at some point and melted the foam
> internally in a couple of spots.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> Jon Lowe
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      

From patternrules at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 17 12:10:05 2009
From: patternrules at yahoo.com (Steven Maxwell)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 20:10:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale 85 HV ESC and 4- 8411 servos
Message-ID: <334760.1777.qm@web111309.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

85HV sold



________________________________
From: Steven Maxwell <patternrules at yahoo.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 8:13:53 PM
Subject: For sale 85 HV ESC and 4- 8411 servos


http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1112626#post13132108

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1112621

Thanks 
Steve Maxwell



      
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From seefo at san.rr.com  Thu Sep 17 13:39:14 2009
From: seefo at san.rr.com (seefo at san.rr.com)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 21:39:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR Receivers For Sale
In-Reply-To: <519882.93140.qm@web51002.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20090917213912.0CBZQ.627851.root@cdptpa-web05-z01>

Hey guys,

I've got some older 72 Mhz JR SPCM receivers for sale if interested. Trying to come up with some money for airplanes for next year basically which will make Mike H happy (going to build a couple BM3's).

4 x JR-950S 10ch - $50 each OBO.

1 x JR-649S 9ch - $40.

Prices do not include shipping. If I have a crystal for your channel, I'll include it for the same price. Contact me off-list at the following:

seefo at san.rr.com
dcronkhite at gmail.com
dcronkhite at soe.sony.com

-Doug




From don.ramsey at suddenlink.net  Thu Sep 17 14:56:53 2009
From: don.ramsey at suddenlink.net (Don Ramsey)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 22:56:53 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Contest results
In-Reply-To: <20090917213912.0CBZQ.627851.root@cdptpa-web05-z01>
References: <519882.93140.qm@web51002.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<20090917213912.0CBZQ.627851.root@cdptpa-web05-z01>
Message-ID: <013f01ca37ea$276f21f0$764d65d0$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>

If anyone is interested in the 2005 World F3A Championship results, I've got
them posted on 
http://pages.suddenlink.net/donramsey/

Don


From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Thu Sep 17 21:15:24 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 05:15:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District Vice President Nominations
Message-ID: <004a01ca381f$01ef6bd0$05ce4370$@com>

Several district Vice President's will term out of their positions, or are
choosing not to run again, and we need to find qualified replacements for
them.  District nominations are needed for District 3, 5, 6, 7 and 8.  We
also need to find a replacement for our Canadian representative, Dave
Reaville, who is also leaving his post.  If you have any interest in serving
the NSRCA and your district then please send your nomination to to the
Secretary (Jim Quinn) by September 30th, 2009 along with a campaign
statement that we can put into the November issue of the K-Factor.
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From joncarter60 at comcast.net  Thu Sep 17 21:19:01 2009
From: joncarter60 at comcast.net (Jon Carter)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 05:19:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 6th Annual Bob Whitacre Memorial Pattern Contest
In-Reply-To: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB201939DF5@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>
References: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB201939DF5@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>
Message-ID: <006c01ca381f$87cd97e0$6501a8c0@jcsmachine>

Just a reminder that I hope to see all of you at the 6th Annual Bob Whitacre
Memorial Pattern contest this weekend (Sep 19th & 20th) in sunny Hollister
CA!!

 

We will have fun!

 

Jon Carter - CD

 

 

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Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
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From k6xyz at sbcglobal.net  Thu Sep 17 21:35:03 2009
From: k6xyz at sbcglobal.net (Dave Harmon)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 05:35:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 6th Annual Bob Whitacre Memorial Pattern
	Contest
In-Reply-To: <006c01ca381f$87cd97e0$6501a8c0@jcsmachine>
Message-ID: <1539F7DDD5B2446F826FF2B3F1097B40@skunkputer>

Bob was a good guy...here he is on the right.

 

Regards

Dave Harmon
NSRCA 586
K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
Sperry, Ok. 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Jon Carter
Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 12:19 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 6th Annual Bob Whitacre Memorial Pattern Contest

 

Just a reminder that I hope to see all of you at the 6th Annual Bob Whitacre
Memorial Pattern contest this weekend (Sep 19th & 20th) in sunny Hollister
CA!!

 

We will have fun!

 

Jon Carter - CD

 



 

 

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 8.5.392 / Virus Database: 270.13.49/2295 - Release Date: 08/10/09
18:19:00


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From KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com  Fri Sep 18 02:22:52 2009
From: KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com (Ken Thompson)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 10:22:52 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Off Topic...
Message-ID: <005101ca384a$704a66e0$0200a8c0@kencopepere>

Not sure how many have seen this, but I thought it was worth sharing...off topic...

http://www.terrafugia.com/Video_News_Release.html

Ken
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From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Fri Sep 18 04:46:39 2009
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 12:46:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Jacksonville Hotels?
In-Reply-To: <004a01ca381f$01ef6bd0$05ce4370$@com>
Message-ID: <7nafpc$1fe7e0@dmzms99902.na.baesystems.com>

Anyone look up Jacksonville hotel deals yet for next weekend?
Thanks,
Jim
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From jonlowe at aol.com  Fri Sep 18 05:15:05 2009
From: jonlowe at aol.com (Jon Lowe)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 13:15:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Jacksonville Hotels?
In-Reply-To: <7nafpc$1fe7e0@dmzms99902.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <8CC0679220A97E9-4DE8-1E138@webmail-d035.sysops.aol.com>

I'm at the Jacksonville Airport Microtel.  Just Google that and it will 
come up.  Stayed there last year, nice place.


Jon Lowe


-----Original Message-----
From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Fri, Sep 18, 2009 7:46 am
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Jacksonville Hotels?























Anyone look up Jacksonville hotel deals yet for next weekend?



Thanks,



Jim












_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion






From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Fri Sep 18 06:38:03 2009
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 14:38:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Jacksonville Hotels?
In-Reply-To: <8CC0679220A97E9-4DE8-1E138@webmail-d035.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <814i1h$4clrdm@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>

Thanks Jon,

Red Roof inn at the airport is $45/night, two adults.  This will be the first contest in many years my wife/daughter attends with me so we are looking forward to it.
Thanks,
Jim

Jim Woodward
Program Manager
Security & Survivability Systems

BAE Systems Land & Armaments
1371 SW 8th ST #3
Pompano Beach, FL  33059
F.954.784.3179
C.954.829.9469


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Jon Lowe
Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 9:15 AM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Jacksonville Hotels?

I'm at the Jacksonville Airport Microtel.  Just Google that and it will 
come up.  Stayed there last year, nice place.


Jon Lowe


-----Original Message-----
From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Fri, Sep 18, 2009 7:46 am
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Jacksonville Hotels?























Anyone look up Jacksonville hotel deals yet for next weekend?



Thanks,



Jim












_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Fri Sep 18 07:06:25 2009
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 15:06:25 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale 85 HV ESC and 4- 8411 servos
In-Reply-To: <956712.4791.qm@web111305.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
References: <956712.4791.qm@web111305.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <657534.96908.qm@web82101.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Steve,
I am very interested in the ESC and the Castle link. Shoot me an email. If I don't get right back to you it will be because I am at the District Championships this weekend.

Thanks
Anthony
aabdu at sbcglobal.net




________________________________
From: Steven Maxwell <patternrules at yahoo.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 7:13:53 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale 85 HV ESC and 4- 8411 servos


http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1112626#post13132108

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1112621

Thanks?
Steve Maxwell
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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Fri Sep 18 07:18:05 2009
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 15:18:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark
In-Reply-To: <1D30BFA58DD3472BA1D2493C5E155A72@ken42e65a0511d>
References: <1D30BFA58DD3472BA1D2493C5E155A72@ken42e65a0511d>
Message-ID: <897605.62294.qm@web82103.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Ken,
Very interested. Please contact me off list with the particulars including price.

Thank you
Anthony
aabdu at sbcglobal.net




________________________________
From: Ken Velez <kvelez at rochester.rr.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 9:31:40 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark


Hi all,
?
Posting for a friend.
?
New, Spark F3A for sale; painted on the Magic Scheme
http://krill-model.com/eu/en/index.php?id=designdetail&model=105&design=48
?
The only thing done to the frame was the installation on the elevator and ailerons control horns
Everything else is still brand new.
?
Please contact me of list if interested pictures available on request.
?
Thanks
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From patternrules at yahoo.com  Fri Sep 18 07:31:58 2009
From: patternrules at yahoo.com (Steven Maxwell)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 15:31:58 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale 85 HV ESC and 4- 8411 servos
In-Reply-To: <657534.96908.qm@web82101.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <956712.4791.qm@web111305.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<657534.96908.qm@web82101.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <320525.44854.qm@web111305.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

 Sorry Anthony the ESC and servos are sold.



________________________________
From: Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 11:06:23 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale 85 HV ESC and 4- 8411 servos


Steve,
I am very interested in the ESC and the Castle link. Shoot me an email. If I don't get right back to you it will be because I am at the District Championships this weekend.
 
Thanks
Anthony
aabdu at sbcglobal.net




________________________________
 From: Steven Maxwell <patternrules at yahoo.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 7:13:53 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale 85 HV ESC and 4- 8411 servos


http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1112626#post13132108

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1112621

Thanks 
Steve Maxwell



      
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From jerry at buddengineering.com  Fri Sep 18 09:53:46 2009
From: jerry at buddengineering.com (Budd Engineering)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 17:53:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 6th Annual Bob Whitacre Memorial Pattern
	Contest
In-Reply-To: <1539F7DDD5B2446F826FF2B3F1097B40@skunkputer>
References: <1539F7DDD5B2446F826FF2B3F1097B40@skunkputer>
Message-ID: <9C94839C-00F0-4266-A00C-FEC6E0D5E4F4@buddengineering.com>

Yeah he was.  Who's that ugly guy in the middle?

: P

Jerry

Budd Engineering
jerry at buddengineering.com
http://www.buddengineering.com

On Sep 17, 2009, at 10:34 PM, Dave Harmon wrote:

> Bob was a good guy?..here he is on the right.
>
> Regards
>
> Dave Harmon
> NSRCA 586
> K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
> Sperry, Ok.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
> ] On Behalf Of Jon Carter
> Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 12:19 AM
> To: 'General pattern discussion'
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 6th Annual Bob Whitacre Memorial Pattern  
> Contest
>
> Just a reminder that I hope to see all of you at the 6th Annual Bob  
> Whitacre Memorial Pattern contest this weekend (Sep 19th & 20th) in  
> sunny Hollister CA!!
>
> We will have fun!
>
> Jon Carter ? CD
>
> <image001.jpg>
>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 8.5.392 / Virus Database: 270.13.49/2295 - Release Date:  
> 08/10/09 18:19:00
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From k6xyz at sbcglobal.net  Fri Sep 18 10:27:36 2009
From: k6xyz at sbcglobal.net (Dave Harmon)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 18:27:36 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 6th Annual Bob Whitacre Memorial
	PatternContest
In-Reply-To: <9C94839C-00F0-4266-A00C-FEC6E0D5E4F4@buddengineering.com>
Message-ID: <AC18D1A598E4429CBB9DA6B9EE404F3D@skunkputer>

Danged if I know but he sure has a lot of white PPG Concept on his face!!

 

Regards

Dave Harmon
NSRCA 586
K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
Sperry, Ok. 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Budd
Engineering
Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 12:54 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 6th Annual Bob Whitacre Memorial
PatternContest

 

Yeah he was.  Who's that ugly guy in the middle?

 

: P

 

Jerry


Budd Engineering

jerry at buddengineering.com

http://www.buddengineering.com

 

On Sep 17, 2009, at 10:34 PM, Dave Harmon wrote:





Bob was a good guy...here he is on the right.

 

Regards

Dave Harmon
NSRCA 586
K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
Sperry, Ok.

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Jon Carter
Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 12:19 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 6th Annual Bob Whitacre Memorial Pattern Contest

 

Just a reminder that I hope to see all of you at the 6th Annual Bob Whitacre
Memorial Pattern contest this weekend (Sep 19th & 20th) in sunny Hollister
CA!!

 

We will have fun!

 

Jon Carter - CD

 

<image001.jpg>

 

 

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 8.5.392 / Virus Database: 270.13.49/2295 - Release Date: 08/10/09
18:19:00

 

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

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From pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net  Fri Sep 18 14:35:18 2009
From: pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net (Ihncheol Park)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 22:35:18 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] threading balsa
In-Reply-To: <AC18D1A598E4429CBB9DA6B9EE404F3D@skunkputer>
Message-ID: <632798.60277.qm@web83905.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

I have a question to ask.
How do you people thread balsa?
I need to put thread on balsa (3mm) and 3mm ply glued together (root rib).

So far, tab doesn't make much of thread and crush the balsa.
By the way, I can't put anything inside at this time.

Thanks,

Ihncheol

From duane.e.beck at comcast.net  Fri Sep 18 14:48:39 2009
From: duane.e.beck at comcast.net (Duane Beck)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 22:48:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] threading balsa
In-Reply-To: <632798.60277.qm@web83905.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
References: <632798.60277.qm@web83905.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4AB40E44.4000208@comcast.net>

I would try putting a drop or two of thin CA on the edges of the hole, 
let it cure thoroughly, then tap (or thread the screw in the hole).

Duane

Ihncheol Park wrote:
> I have a question to ask.
> How do you people thread balsa?
> I need to put thread on balsa (3mm) and 3mm ply glued together (root rib).
> 
> So far, tab doesn't make much of thread and crush the balsa.
> By the way, I can't put anything inside at this time.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Ihncheol


From KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com  Fri Sep 18 16:06:31 2009
From: KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com (Ken Thompson)
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 00:06:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] threading balsa
References: <632798.60277.qm@web83905.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
	<4AB40E44.4000208@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <006a01ca38bd$c25ab7a0$0200a8c0@kencopepere>

Duane's right...drill the hole, wick a bit of thin CA in, let it cure...tap 
the hole, then wick the thin in again to harden...let it cure and run the 
screw in and out a few times, ready to go...

Ken
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Duane Beck" <duane.e.beck at comcast.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 5:48 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] threading balsa


>I would try putting a drop or two of thin CA on the edges of the hole, let 
>it cure thoroughly, then tap (or thread the screw in the hole).
>
> Duane
>
> Ihncheol Park wrote:
>> I have a question to ask.
>> How do you people thread balsa?
>> I need to put thread on balsa (3mm) and 3mm ply glued together (root 
>> rib).
>>
>> So far, tab doesn't make much of thread and crush the balsa.
>> By the way, I can't put anything inside at this time.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Ihncheol
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Sat Sep 19 15:01:46 2009
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 23:01:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting UAV
Message-ID: <FECB1E07979148398AFD926C2213FE3B@jaysdesktop>

 

 

Jay Marshall 


http://www.sciencefriday.com/videos/watch/10224

 

 

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From getterflash at yahoo.com  Sun Sep 20 12:26:50 2009
From: getterflash at yahoo.com (Bob Kane)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 20:26:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
Message-ID: <241516.93049.qm@web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I just got home from the D4 Finals contest and want to thank Robert and Amy Pannell, Mark Atwood and team, and all the Flying Cardinals club members for a great weekend.  See you all on the contest trail next year.


Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com


      

From pcosky at comcast.net  Sun Sep 20 12:32:14 2009
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 20:32:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
In-Reply-To: <241516.93049.qm@web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <241516.93049.qm@web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <001001ca3a31$8d658690$a83093b0$@net>

I'll echo that, The Pannell's, Atwood and the club put on a great meet and
is well worth the 5 1/2hr drive.

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 4:27 PM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org; dist4 at nsrca.org
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals

I just got home from the D4 Finals contest and want to thank Robert and Amy
Pannell, Mark Atwood and team, and all the Flying Cardinals club members for
a great weekend.  See you all on the contest trail next year.


Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com


      
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



From KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com  Sun Sep 20 12:32:38 2009
From: KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com (Ken Thompson)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 20:32:38 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
References: <241516.93049.qm@web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <000c01ca3a31$a18b7440$0200a8c0@kencopepere>

I sure miss that contest...


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bob Kane" <getterflash at yahoo.com>
To: <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>; <dist4 at nsrca.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 3:26 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals


>I just got home from the D4 Finals contest and want to thank Robert and Amy 
>Pannell, Mark Atwood and team, and all the Flying Cardinals club members 
>for a great weekend.  See you all on the contest trail next year.
>
>
> Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Sun Sep 20 12:44:01 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 20:44:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again
In-Reply-To: <000c01ca3a31$a18b7440$0200a8c0@kencopepere>
References: <241516.93049.qm@web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<000c01ca3a31$a18b7440$0200a8c0@kencopepere>
Message-ID: <0AF92800CA894475B26A9E585F40E27D@UncleJasPC>

Hi All,

I've posted in RCU about some issues I'm having with my OS-120AX and was wondering what you might think?

Here's the the link: http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_9110170/tm.htm

And what it says:

I'm hoping this thread will help answer some questions about the OS-120AX that I am having.

I've got it in an 8lb 2oz, 110 sized pattern plane, stock muffler, 420cc tank (14oz), OS-F plug, 3-line system (Vent, carb clunk 
line, fill clunk line), 15x10 APC and for break-in, PowerMaster 10% with 29% Caster... will switch to 15% with 16-18% Synthetic 
after this gallon.

The tank is fairly close to inline with the carb, maybe 1/2" higher. On neg/inverted pushes the motor seems to starve until I close 
the throttle a little. On pos/upright pulls it seems ok, maybe a slight richening. There is a nice smoke trail as after my first 
flight I wasn't rich enough and the flight ended a bit early. I'm sure it will run a bit easier after it's broken in, but has anyone 
tried a foam clunk like the YS's use?

Any other tips? It has enough power with this set-up to go through the F-09 sequence, but about half way through it starts this 
'cutting out' deal. It's just annoying to have to power back as you're climbing to keep it running.

Also, what differences has anyone noticed flying the 15x10 to 16x8 in testing.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


From getterflash at yahoo.com  Sun Sep 20 13:03:41 2009
From: getterflash at yahoo.com (Bob Kane)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 21:03:41 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
In-Reply-To: <000c01ca3a31$a18b7440$0200a8c0@kencopepere>
Message-ID: <836270.8252.qm@web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

The steaks were something to behold this year . . . . . . 


Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com


--- On Sun, 9/20/09, Ken Thompson <KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com> wrote:

> From: Ken Thompson <KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Sunday, September 20, 2009, 4:33 PM
> I sure miss that contest...
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Bob Kane" <getterflash at yahoo.com>
> To: <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>;
> <dist4 at nsrca.org>
> Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 3:26 PM
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
> 
> 
> >I just got home from the D4 Finals contest and want to
> thank Robert and Amy 
> >Pannell, Mark Atwood and team, and all the Flying
> Cardinals club members 
> >for a great weekend.? See you all on the contest
> trail next year.
> >
> >
> > Bob Kane
> > getterflash at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 


      

From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Sun Sep 20 13:44:12 2009
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 21:44:12 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again
In-Reply-To: <0AF92800CA894475B26A9E585F40E27D@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <A520F3AB926D405A830D5D626AE79003@jaysdesktop>

I had the same problems until I put a pump on it - solved all of the
problems.

Jay Marshall

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of J Shu
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 4:43 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again

Hi All,

I've posted in RCU about some issues I'm having with my OS-120AX and was
wondering what you might think?

Here's the the link: http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_9110170/tm.htm

And what it says:

I'm hoping this thread will help answer some questions about the OS-120AX
that I am having.

I've got it in an 8lb 2oz, 110 sized pattern plane, stock muffler, 420cc
tank (14oz), OS-F plug, 3-line system (Vent, carb clunk 
line, fill clunk line), 15x10 APC and for break-in, PowerMaster 10% with 29%
Caster... will switch to 15% with 16-18% Synthetic 
after this gallon.

The tank is fairly close to inline with the carb, maybe 1/2" higher. On
neg/inverted pushes the motor seems to starve until I close 
the throttle a little. On pos/upright pulls it seems ok, maybe a slight
richening. There is a nice smoke trail as after my first 
flight I wasn't rich enough and the flight ended a bit early. I'm sure it
will run a bit easier after it's broken in, but has anyone 
tried a foam clunk like the YS's use?

Any other tips? It has enough power with this set-up to go through the F-09
sequence, but about half way through it starts this 
'cutting out' deal. It's just annoying to have to power back as you're
climbing to keep it running.

Also, what differences has anyone noticed flying the 15x10 to 16x8 in
testing.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From d_bodary at yahoo.com  Sun Sep 20 14:03:54 2009
From: d_bodary at yahoo.com (Dennis Bodary)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 22:03:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted:  Smaragd Horizontals
In-Reply-To: <519882.93140.qm@web51002.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <384091.84664.qm@web51710.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

yes i did

--- On Thu, 9/17/09, mike mueller <mups1953 at yahoo.com> wrote:


From: mike mueller <mups1953 at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted: Smaragd Horizontals
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Thursday, September 17, 2009, 3:26 PM


John I had a Smaragd with a Temptation wing and stab on it. It flew excellent. Mike

--- On Thu, 9/17/09, Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com> wrote:

> From: Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted:? Smaragd Horizontals
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Thursday, September 17, 2009, 12:33 PM
> Dennis,
> I responded back offlist.? Did you get my email?
> 
> 
> Jon Lowe
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dennis Bodary <d_bodary at yahoo.com>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Wed, Sep 16, 2009 12:27 pm
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted:? Smaragd
> Horizontals
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a set of stabs and elevators. for? a Smaragd. I
> will be at the District 4 championships this weekend.
> 
> 
> Dennis Bodary
> 
> --- On Wed, 9/16/09, Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com>
> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com>
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wanted: Smaragd Horizontals
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Wednesday, September 16, 2009, 12:29 PM
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone have a pair of PL Prod Smaragd horizontals laying
> around?? We've got a club member, new to pattern,? who
> bought a nice used one, but someone got over zealous with
> the monokote iron at some point and melted the foam
> internally in a couple of spots.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> Jon Lowe
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


? ? ? 
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



      
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From ahrensw at charter.net  Sun Sep 20 14:04:53 2009
From: ahrensw at charter.net (Bill Ahrens)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 22:04:53 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
In-Reply-To: <836270.8252.qm@web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <000c01ca3a31$a18b7440$0200a8c0@kencopepere>
	<836270.8252.qm@web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <007f01ca3a3e$5a8d6640$0fa832c0$@net>

I would like to 2nd the thank you to all of D4 for a great contest,
something like 35 flyers and to get (4) rounds in less than 9 hours Saturday
was amazing.  Also I believe the steaks this year were over 2 pounds!!!

Bill Ahrens    

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 4:04 PM
To: Ken Thompson; General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals

The steaks were something to behold this year . . . . . . 


Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com


--- On Sun, 9/20/09, Ken Thompson <KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com> wrote:

> From: Ken Thompson <KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Sunday, September 20, 2009, 4:33 PM
> I sure miss that contest...
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Bob Kane" <getterflash at yahoo.com>
> To: <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>;
> <dist4 at nsrca.org>
> Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 3:26 PM
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
> 
> 
> >I just got home from the D4 Finals contest and want to
> thank Robert and Amy 
> >Pannell, Mark Atwood and team, and all the Flying
> Cardinals club members 
> >for a great weekend.? See you all on the contest
> trail next year.
> >
> >
> > Bob Kane
> > getterflash at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 


      
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



From don.ramsey at suddenlink.net  Sun Sep 20 16:02:05 2009
From: don.ramsey at suddenlink.net (Don Ramsey)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 00:02:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Contest Results
In-Reply-To: <9C94839C-00F0-4266-A00C-FEC6E0D5E4F4@buddengineering.com>
References: <1539F7DDD5B2446F826FF2B3F1097B40@skunkputer>
	<9C94839C-00F0-4266-A00C-FEC6E0D5E4F4@buddengineering.com>
Message-ID: <01f801ca3a4e$c6b57000$54205000$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>

Results for the North Dallas Contest, Frisco, TX is posted on
http://pages.suddenlink.net/donramsey/
 
Don
 
 
 
 
 
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From precisionaero at hotmail.com  Sun Sep 20 16:43:50 2009
From: precisionaero at hotmail.com (Michael Cohen)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 00:43:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
In-Reply-To: <007f01ca3a3e$5a8d6640$0fa832c0$@net>
References: <000c01ca3a31$a18b7440$0200a8c0@kencopepere>
	<836270.8252.qm@web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com> 
	<007f01ca3a3e$5a8d6640$0fa832c0$@net>
Message-ID: <BLU115-W257EAEE90D258458788698A0DD0@phx.gbl>


I would like to chime in and also say thanks to our CD/hosts at the D4 champs.  It was a great contest/social event.  It was my first time trying out night flying too.  I would say it was half fun/half terror.  In the future, I will need more lights!  I was got disoriented several times and had that moment of panic where I didn't quite know where I was headed.  I did recover, but it wasn't exactly graceful.  Come to think of it, its not much different than my first round of the contest season!

 

Thanks again Mark, Bob, Amy, and the Flying Cardinals.  See you next year.

 

Mike Cohen
 
> From: ahrensw at charter.net
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 17:04:41 -0500
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
> 
> I would like to 2nd the thank you to all of D4 for a great contest,
> something like 35 flyers and to get (4) rounds in less than 9 hours Saturday
> was amazing. Also I believe the steaks this year were over 2 pounds!!!
> 
> Bill Ahrens 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bob Kane
> Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 4:04 PM
> To: Ken Thompson; General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
> 
> The steaks were something to behold this year . . . . . . 
> 
> 
> Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
> 
> 
> --- On Sun, 9/20/09, Ken Thompson <KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com> wrote:
> 
> > From: Ken Thompson <KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
> > To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > Date: Sunday, September 20, 2009, 4:33 PM
> > I sure miss that contest...
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > From: "Bob Kane" <getterflash at yahoo.com>
> > To: <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>;
> > <dist4 at nsrca.org>
> > Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 3:26 PM
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
> > 
> > 
> > >I just got home from the D4 Finals contest and want to
> > thank Robert and Amy 
> > >Pannell, Mark Atwood and team, and all the Flying
> > Cardinals club members 
> > >for a great weekend.  See you all on the contest
> > trail next year.
> > >
> > >
> > > Bob Kane
> > > getterflash at yahoo.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_________________________________________________________________
Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free.
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From jnhiller at earthlink.net  Sun Sep 20 16:55:56 2009
From: jnhiller at earthlink.net (J N Hiller)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 00:55:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again
In-Reply-To: <0AF92800CA894475B26A9E585F40E27D@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPCEOEEMAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>

Jason I've been running a 120-AX for over two years. I have gotten by
(barely) without adding a pump by slightly restricting the muffler outlet
with a brass tube extension. The engine acts as if it doesn't have enough
muffler backpressure to the tank. I stripped the following explanation from
a 2-year old e-mail.

"Here is a photo of the exhaust restrictor I am trying on my 120-AX. The
13/32 (3/8 ID) brass tube is flared on one end to prevent it from coming out
of the exhaust hose coupler. I experienced lean running at full throttle on
an extended vertical running a 16-10 prop (APC). This is a lot of load and I
tried 10-20 fuel which helped but the transition was still too rich when the
high speed was adjusted rich enough to support an extended vertical. I
thought a little more fuel pressure (muffler back pressure) might help. I
also tried a 3/8 tube, which I felt was pulling the RPM down. This one
seamed to do the trick. I was able to adjust the high-speed needle in about
1/4 turn (now open 1 1/2). The transition on the bottom of the six sided
outside is now immediate. It will go lean when pulling vertical if the
throttle is advanced rapidly after pulling to vertical. If the throttle is
advanced slow enough for the RPM's to come up it works fine. I expect the
problem would not exist if running less prop load and more RPM's. I just
like the way the airplane flies with the 16-10."

My current flying style includes advancing the throttle as I begin pulling
vertical, achieving WOT about the time the airplane gets vertical. This
seams to work ok but if I go vertical before adding throttle it will go
lean.
I also experienced erratic running when the rear bearing was going bad. They
don't last very long. I am currently running the 140 RX-FI bearing as
suggested here about a year ago. OS # 29430010 It takes a while for the
noticeable seal drag to go away but after a season it still feels smooth as
new.

For what it's worth!
Jim Hiller


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of J Shu
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 1:43 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again

Hi All,

I've posted in RCU about some issues I'm having with my OS-120AX and was
wondering what you might think?

Here's the the link: http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_9110170/tm.htm

And what it says:

I'm hoping this thread will help answer some questions about the OS-120AX
that I am having.

I've got it in an 8lb 2oz, 110 sized pattern plane, stock muffler, 420cc
tank (14oz), OS-F plug, 3-line system (Vent, carb clunk
line, fill clunk line), 15x10 APC and for break-in, PowerMaster 10% with 29%
Caster... will switch to 15% with 16-18% Synthetic
after this gallon.

The tank is fairly close to inline with the carb, maybe 1/2" higher. On
neg/inverted pushes the motor seems to starve until I close
the throttle a little. On pos/upright pulls it seems ok, maybe a slight
richening. There is a nice smoke trail as after my first
flight I wasn't rich enough and the flight ended a bit early. I'm sure it
will run a bit easier after it's broken in, but has anyone
tried a foam clunk like the YS's use?

Any other tips? It has enough power with this set-up to go through the F-09
sequence, but about half way through it starts this
'cutting out' deal. It's just annoying to have to power back as you're
climbing to keep it running.

Also, what differences has anyone noticed flying the 15x10 to 16x8 in
testing.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net  Sun Sep 20 17:25:57 2009
From: pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net (Ihncheol Park)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 01:25:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again
In-Reply-To: <0AF92800CA894475B26A9E585F40E27D@UncleJasPC>
References: <241516.93049.qm@web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<000c01ca3a31$a18b7440$0200a8c0@kencopepere>
	<0AF92800CA894475B26A9E585F40E27D@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <000001ca3a5a$769def50$63d9cdf0$@net>

Jason,

Sounds like not enough muffler pressure for tank.  Pump, regulator, header
tank, or a Macs one piece muffler (not exactly sure if the pressure is
higher on Macs muffler, but it usually increase output a little) may help.

OS used to sell a fuel nipple that has longer threaded side. One that some
of us used on 160 back plate for crank case prssure?  I once moved the
nipple from the muffler body to exhaust port side to increase the pressure.
If you can find a longer threaded fuel nipple, grind about 1/2 of the
threaded side in angle.  Then, install it facing the exhaust.  It helps one
a couple of old engines.

Are you using Control Line fuel?

Ihncheol

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of J Shu
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 3:43 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again

Hi All,

I've posted in RCU about some issues I'm having with my OS-120AX and was
wondering what you might think?

Here's the the link: http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_9110170/tm.htm

And what it says:

I'm hoping this thread will help answer some questions about the OS-120AX
that I am having.

I've got it in an 8lb 2oz, 110 sized pattern plane, stock muffler, 420cc
tank (14oz), OS-F plug, 3-line system (Vent, carb clunk 
line, fill clunk line), 15x10 APC and for break-in, PowerMaster 10% with 29%
Caster... will switch to 15% with 16-18% Synthetic 
after this gallon.

The tank is fairly close to inline with the carb, maybe 1/2" higher. On
neg/inverted pushes the motor seems to starve until I close 
the throttle a little. On pos/upright pulls it seems ok, maybe a slight
richening. There is a nice smoke trail as after my first 
flight I wasn't rich enough and the flight ended a bit early. I'm sure it
will run a bit easier after it's broken in, but has anyone 
tried a foam clunk like the YS's use?

Any other tips? It has enough power with this set-up to go through the F-09
sequence, but about half way through it starts this 
'cutting out' deal. It's just annoying to have to power back as you're
climbing to keep it running.

Also, what differences has anyone noticed flying the 15x10 to 16x8 in
testing.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From jnhiller at earthlink.net  Sun Sep 20 17:28:40 2009
From: jnhiller at earthlink.net (J N Hiller)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 01:28:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again
In-Reply-To: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPCEOEEMAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPKEOEEMAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>

Sorry I left out one important dimension. The brass tube was cut with a
tubing cutter which pinches the diameter in the process. I went to the shop
and measured the actual inside diameter of the extension / restrictor to be
.345"
Jim

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of J N Hiller
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 5:54 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again

Jason I've been running a 120-AX for over two years. I have gotten by
(barely) without adding a pump by slightly restricting the muffler outlet
with a brass tube extension. The engine acts as if it doesn't have enough
muffler backpressure to the tank. I stripped the following explanation from
a 2-year old e-mail.

"Here is a photo of the exhaust restrictor I am trying on my 120-AX. The
13/32 (3/8 ID) brass tube is flared on one end to prevent it from coming out
of the exhaust hose coupler. I experienced lean running at full throttle on
an extended vertical running a 16-10 prop (APC). This is a lot of load and I
tried 10-20 fuel which helped but the transition was still too rich when the
high speed was adjusted rich enough to support an extended vertical. I
thought a little more fuel pressure (muffler back pressure) might help. I
also tried a 3/8 tube, which I felt was pulling the RPM down. This one
seamed to do the trick. I was able to adjust the high-speed needle in about
1/4 turn (now open 1 1/2). The transition on the bottom of the six sided
outside is now immediate. It will go lean when pulling vertical if the
throttle is advanced rapidly after pulling to vertical. If the throttle is
advanced slow enough for the RPM's to come up it works fine. I expect the
problem would not exist if running less prop load and more RPM's. I just
like the way the airplane flies with the 16-10."

My current flying style includes advancing the throttle as I begin pulling
vertical, achieving WOT about the time the airplane gets vertical. This
seams to work ok but if I go vertical before adding throttle it will go
lean.
I also experienced erratic running when the rear bearing was going bad. They
don't last very long. I am currently running the 140 RX-FI bearing as
suggested here about a year ago. OS # 29430010 It takes a while for the
noticeable seal drag to go away but after a season it still feels smooth as
new.

For what it's worth!
Jim Hiller


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of J Shu
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 1:43 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again

Hi All,

I've posted in RCU about some issues I'm having with my OS-120AX and was
wondering what you might think?

Here's the the link: http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_9110170/tm.htm

And what it says:

I'm hoping this thread will help answer some questions about the OS-120AX
that I am having.

I've got it in an 8lb 2oz, 110 sized pattern plane, stock muffler, 420cc
tank (14oz), OS-F plug, 3-line system (Vent, carb clunk
line, fill clunk line), 15x10 APC and for break-in, PowerMaster 10% with 29%
Caster... will switch to 15% with 16-18% Synthetic
after this gallon.

The tank is fairly close to inline with the carb, maybe 1/2" higher. On
neg/inverted pushes the motor seems to starve until I close
the throttle a little. On pos/upright pulls it seems ok, maybe a slight
richening. There is a nice smoke trail as after my first
flight I wasn't rich enough and the flight ended a bit early. I'm sure it
will run a bit easier after it's broken in, but has anyone
tried a foam clunk like the YS's use?

Any other tips? It has enough power with this set-up to go through the F-09
sequence, but about half way through it starts this
'cutting out' deal. It's just annoying to have to power back as you're
climbing to keep it running.

Also, what differences has anyone noticed flying the 15x10 to 16x8 in
testing.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 21 04:49:38 2009
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 12:49:38 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
In-Reply-To: <BLU115-W257EAEE90D258458788698A0DD0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <870217.36377.qm@web51011.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

 Great contest guys. This years event solidified my belief that this is the best contest of the year on our circuit.
 35 fliers is better than expected and it's even better because of all the newbies coming into the fold. 6 guys in Sportsman is testament to the grass roots effort being put forth by the guys in D4. The future look brighter than ever.
 Amy, Bob, Mark, and the host club. Thanks for your fine effort.
 I have to admit that I'm looking forward to some time off. About this time of the year I find myself a tad worn out. 
 Overall the Midwest had an above average contest season. All of the many contests surrounding the Chicago area were well supported and well ran. Thanks to all who took the time to attend them and host them. 
                          Mike Mueller D5AVP 

--- On Sun, 9/20/09, Michael Cohen <precisionaero at hotmail.com> wrote:

> From: Michael Cohen <precisionaero at hotmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
> To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Sunday, September 20, 2009, 7:43 PM
> 
> 
> 
> #yiv639788086 .hmmessage P
> {
> margin:0px;padding:0px;}
> #yiv639788086 {
> font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana;}
> 
> 
>  
> I would like to chime in and also say thanks to our
> CD/hosts at the D4 champs.? It was a?great
> contest/social event.??It was my first time trying
> out?night flying too.? I would say it was half
> fun/half terror.??In the future, I will need more
> lights!? I was?got disoriented several times
> and?had that moment of panic where I didn't quite
> know where I?was headed.? I did recover, but it
> wasn't exactly graceful.? Come to think of it, its
> not much different than my first round of the contest
> season!
> 
> ?
> 
> Thanks again Mark, Bob, Amy, and the?Flying
> Cardinals.? See you next year.
> 
> ?
> 
> Mike Cohen
> ?
> > From: ahrensw at charter.net
> > To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 17:04:41 -0500
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
> > 
> > I would like to 2nd the thank you to all of D4 for a
> great contest,
> > something like 35 flyers and to get (4) rounds in less
> than 9 hours Saturday
> > was amazing. Also I believe the steaks this year were
> over 2 pounds!!!
> > 
> > Bill Ahrens 
> > 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On
> Behalf Of Bob Kane
> > Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 4:04 PM
> > To: Ken Thompson; General pattern discussion
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
> > 
> > The steaks were something to behold this year . . . .
> . . 
> > 
> > 
> > Bob Kane
> > getterflash at yahoo.com
> > 
> > 
> > --- On Sun, 9/20/09, Ken Thompson
> <KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com> wrote:
> > 
> > > From: Ken Thompson
> <KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com>
> > > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
> > > To: "General pattern discussion"
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > > Date: Sunday, September 20, 2009, 4:33 PM
> > > I sure miss that contest...
> > > 
> > > 
> > > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > > From: "Bob Kane"
> <getterflash at yahoo.com>
> > > To: <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>;
> > > <dist4 at nsrca.org>
> > > Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 3:26 PM
> > > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
> > > 
> > > 
> > > >I just got home from the D4 Finals contest
> and want to
> > > thank Robert and Amy 
> > > >Pannell, Mark Atwood and team, and all the
> Flying
> > > Cardinals club members 
> > > >for a great weekend.? See you all on the
> contest
> > > trail next year.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Bob Kane
> > > > getterflash at yahoo.com
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> _______________________________________________
> > > > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > > > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > > >
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > > 
> > > 
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > >
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> >
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> >
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows
> Live Hotmail Free. Sign
> up now. 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      

From love2flypattern at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 21 06:45:33 2009
From: love2flypattern at yahoo.com (Jarvis Johnson)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 14:45:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Hobbycity E-setup
In-Reply-To: <814i1h$4cirs0@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <26196.97249.qm@web52705.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Hey, Jim
There did you find a Osmose 110, is it glow
?
Thank's
jarvis

--- On Thu, 9/17/09, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote:


From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hobbycity E-setup
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Thursday, September 17, 2009, 7:24 AM








Guys ? I am working on a friend?s airplane that has this equipment:
This is the link of the engine
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=7709
?
This is the ESC
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=4691
?
?
This is the Battery
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=7299
?
?
This is in fact real friend, and not a fictitious story to hide my conversion to electric J.? This is the Turnigy motor, 100 controller, and 4S 4900 Zippy setup for an Osmose 110.? If anyone has experience with this setup please email me props used or things I should know about this.
?
Thanks,
Jim
?

?
?


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Tony
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 9:40 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] NSRCA District 3 Championships
?
Attached is the flier for the District Champs?? 
?
Tony Stillman, President
Radio South, Inc.
139 Altama Connector, Box 322
Brunswick, GA? 31525
1-800-962-7802
www.radiosouthrc.com
?
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Mon Sep 21 06:49:54 2009
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 14:49:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Hobbycity E-setup
In-Reply-To: <26196.97249.qm@web52705.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <7naet7$1hrovo@dmzms99901.na.baesystems.com>

Hi Jarvis,

I hope you are doing well out in CA.  The Osmose 110 is made by CA Models and it is sharp!  The fuselage is painted fiberglass, wings are 1 piece, stab is fixed.  The chin cowl is nicely divided to make it glow or electric.  I copied Marcelo in case you are interested in his email.

Thanks,
Jim



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Jarvis Johnson
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 10:46 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hobbycity E-setup

Hey, Jim
There did you find a Osmose 110, is it glow

Thank's
jarvis

--- On Thu, 9/17/09, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote:

From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hobbycity E-setup
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Thursday, September 17, 2009, 7:24 AM
Guys ? I am working on a friend?s airplane that has this equipment:
This is the link of the engine
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=7709

This is the ESC
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=4691


This is the Battery
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=7299


This is in fact real friend, and not a fictitious story to hide my conversion to electric ?.  This is the Turnigy motor, 100 controller, and 4S 4900 Zippy setup for an Osmose 110.  If anyone has experience with this setup please email me props used or things I should know about this.

Thanks,
Jim



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Tony
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 9:40 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] NSRCA District 3 Championships

Attached is the flier for the District Champs?

Tony Stillman, President
Radio South, Inc.
139 Altama Connector, Box 322
Brunswick, GA  31525
1-800-962-7802
www.radiosouthrc.com


-----Inline Attachment Follows-----
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<http://us.mc527.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Mon Sep 21 07:24:26 2009
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 15:24:26 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
In-Reply-To: <836270.8252.qm@web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <836270.8252.qm@web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <545041.72026.qm@web82106.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I would also like to thank all the organizers and the attendees. It was an absolutely FANTASTIC contest that turned into what felt like a Saturday evening Bar-B-Que or a family reunion. Between the wonderful smell of steaks roasting, Bob kane's great portable concert hall, the ridiculous desert spread, and the friendly conversations all around, it could not have been any better. My goal next year is to do whatever it takes to bring at least one sport flyer to this contest because there is no way in the world that anyone could attend and not be permamently hooked on pattern!

Did anyone else notice the spectator turn out for the contest? It was nice to see such enthusiasm for the sport. I know the expectation of carnage brought out the masses and I hope it continues to grow. On that note, Mark and Bob P. Did a great job of keeping things moving. I will plan to take the Friday before the contest off next year so I am not so travel weary.

Thanks again for a great pattern season and I will be looking forward to seeing you all again soon! Be safe this off season and build em straight!

Anthony


________________________________
From: Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>
To: Ken Thompson <KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com>; General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 5:03:39 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals

The steaks were something to behold this year . . . . . . 


Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com


--- On Sun, 9/20/09, Ken Thompson <KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com> wrote:

> From: Ken Thompson <KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Sunday, September 20, 2009, 4:33 PM
> I sure miss that contest...
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Bob Kane" <getterflash at yahoo.com>
> To: <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>;
> <dist4 at nsrca.org>
> Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 3:26 PM
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Finals
> 
> 
> >I just got home from the D4 Finals contest and want to
> thank Robert and Amy 
> >Pannell, Mark Atwood and team, and all the Flying
> Cardinals club members 
> >for a great weekend.? See you all on the contest
> trail next year.
> >
> >
> > Bob Kane
> > getterflash at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 


? ? ? 
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From ronlock at comcast.net  Mon Sep 21 08:37:33 2009
From: ronlock at comcast.net (ronlock at comcast.net)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 16:37:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again
In-Reply-To: <0AF92800CA894475B26A9E585F40E27D@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <858577454.4795171253551052995.JavaMail.root@sz0086a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>



29% castor - sounds like CL stunt fuel.? Does it get tail heavy during flight?? <G> 

I'd suspect some of problem will go away when you switch to more typical pattern fuel mixtures. 



Couldn't hurt to move tank down to on carb centerline. 



Ive had excellent results for years with DuBro sintered brass fuel line?clunk.? Maybe YS foam clunk?would be as good? 



Ron Lockhart 


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "J Shu" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 4:43:02 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern 
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again 

Hi All, 

I've posted in RCU about some issues I'm having with my OS-120AX and was wondering what you might think? 

Here's the the link: http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_9110170/tm.htm 

And what it says: 

I'm hoping this thread will help answer some questions about the OS-120AX that I am having. 

I've got it in an 8lb 2oz, 110 sized pattern plane, stock muffler, 420cc tank (14oz), OS-F plug, 3-line system (Vent, carb clunk 
line, fill clunk line), 15x10 APC and for break-in, PowerMaster 10% with 29% Caster... will switch to 15% with 16-18% Synthetic 
after this gallon. 

The tank is fairly close to inline with the carb, maybe 1/2" higher. On neg/inverted pushes the motor seems to starve until I close 
the throttle a little. On pos/upright pulls it seems ok, maybe a slight richening. There is a nice smoke trail as after my first 
flight I wasn't rich enough and the flight ended a bit early. I'm sure it will run a bit easier after it's broken in, but has anyone 
tried a foam clunk like the YS's use? 

Any other tips? It has enough power with this set-up to go through the F-09 sequence, but about half way through it starts this 
'cutting out' deal. It's just annoying to have to power back as you're climbing to keep it running. 

Also, what differences has anyone noticed flying the 15x10 to 16x8 in testing. 

Regards, 
Jason 
www.shulmanaviation.com 
www.composite-arf.com 

_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From kvelez at rochester.rr.com  Mon Sep 21 08:49:37 2009
From: kvelez at rochester.rr.com (Ken Velez)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 16:49:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark
In-Reply-To: <897605.62294.qm@web82103.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <B1EF60962F0A4ADBAE4ADF6A807945A4@KEN>

Hi Anthony,

 

Did you get my email?

 

I sent you a couple emails before, a few month ago you were looking for an
almost ready electric plane and I emailed you and never got a response back.

 

Ken

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony
Abdullah
Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 11:09 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark

 

Ken,

Very interested. Please contact me off list with the particulars including
price.

 

Thank you

Anthony

aabdu at sbcglobal.net

 

  _____  

From: Ken Velez <kvelez at rochester.rr.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 9:31:40 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark

Hi all,

 

Posting for a friend.

 

New, Spark F3A for sale; painted on the Magic Scheme

http://krill-model.com/eu/en/index.php?id=designdetail&model=105&design=48

 

The only thing done to the frame was the installation on the elevator and
ailerons control horns

Everything else is still brand new.

 

Please contact me of list if interested pictures available on request.

 

Thanks

 

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From anthonyr105 at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 21 09:36:46 2009
From: anthonyr105 at hotmail.com (Anthony Romano)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 17:36:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark
In-Reply-To: <B1EF60962F0A4ADBAE4ADF6A807945A4@KEN>
References: <897605.62294.qm@web82103.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <COL123-W16E901C601B2459A0A4144E2DD0@phx.gbl>


Hi Ken,

 Wrong Anthony. Missed you at NEAT over the weekend.

 

Anthony Romano
 


From: kvelez at rochester.rr.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 12:49:35 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark









Hi Anthony,
 
Did you get my email?
 
I sent you a couple emails before, a few month ago you were looking for an almost ready electric plane and I emailed you and never got a response back?
 
Ken
 




From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Abdullah
Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 11:09 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark
 


Ken,

Very interested. Please contact me off list with the particulars including price.

 

Thank you

Anthony

aabdu at sbcglobal.net

 




From: Ken Velez <kvelez at rochester.rr.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 9:31:40 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark

Hi all,
 
Posting for a friend.
 
New, Spark F3A for sale; painted on the Magic Scheme
http://krill-model.com/eu/en/index.php?id=designdetail&model=105&design=48
 
The only thing done to the frame was the installation on the elevator and ailerons control horns
Everything else is still brand new.
 
Please contact me of list if interested pictures available on request.
 
Thanks
  		 	   		  
_________________________________________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/choosepc/?ocid=ftp_val_wl_290
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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Mon Sep 21 10:14:22 2009
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 18:14:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark
In-Reply-To: <B1EF60962F0A4ADBAE4ADF6A807945A4@KEN>
References: <B1EF60962F0A4ADBAE4ADF6A807945A4@KEN>
Message-ID: <447768.4759.qm@web82106.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Ken,
My filter is acting very strange lately. I just got your email about the Spark this morning. I hate that I didn't get your earlier corresponndence as I ordered and received a new custom scheme Integral for about the same money. I am very interested but will have to move a couple of things before I can commit to it. You wouldn't happen to be interested in a completely?RTF El Nino complete with YS 140L and a synthesized JR 9303?

I appreciate your follow up and will try to do some fundraising so I can j fity another pattern plane in the budget. I will keep you posted. Of course if you get a viable offer in the meantime don't hesitate to move it. Shipping won't be a problem by the way as I am just over two hours away from Buffalo.

Thanks again
Anthony


________________________________
From: Ken Velez <kvelez at rochester.rr.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 12:49:35 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark


Hi Anthony,
?
Did you get my email?
?
I sent you a couple emails before, a few month ago you were looking for an almost ready electric plane and I emailed you and never got a response back?
?
Ken
?

________________________________

From:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Abdullah
Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 11:09 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark
?
Ken,
Very interested. Please contact me off list with the particulars including price.
?
Thank you
Anthony
aabdu at sbcglobal.net
?

________________________________

From:Ken Velez < kvelez at rochester.rr.com >
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 9:31:40 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark
Hi all,
?
Posting for a friend.
?
New, Spark F3A for sale; painted on the Magic Scheme
http://krill-model.com/eu/en/index.php?id=designdetail&model=105&design=48
?
The only thing done to the frame was the installation on the elevator and ailerons control horns
Everything else is still brand new.
?
Please contact me of list if interested pictures available on request.
?
Thanks
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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Mon Sep 21 10:15:37 2009
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 18:15:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark
In-Reply-To: <COL123-W16E901C601B2459A0A4144E2DD0@phx.gbl>
References: <897605.62294.qm@web82103.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<COL123-W16E901C601B2459A0A4144E2DD0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <386185.63122.qm@web82103.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Sorry, I meant for my last email to be off list!

Anthony




________________________________
From: Anthony Romano <anthonyr105 at hotmail.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 1:36:46 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark

Hi Ken,
?Wrong Anthony. Missed you at NEAT over the weekend.
?
Anthony Romano
?
________________________________
From: kvelez at rochester.rr.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 12:49:35 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark


Hi Anthony,
?
Did you get my email?
?
I sent you a couple emails before, a few month ago you were looking for an almost ready electric plane and I emailed you and never got a response back?
?
Ken
?

________________________________

From:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Abdullah
Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 11:09 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark
?
Ken,
Very interested. Please contact me off list with the particulars including price.
?
Thank you
Anthony
aabdu at sbcglobal.net
?

________________________________

From:Ken Velez <kvelez at rochester.rr.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 9:31:40 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For sale Krill Model Spark
Hi all,
?
Posting for a friend.
?
New, Spark F3A for sale; painted on the Magic Scheme
http://krill-model.com/eu/en/index.php?id=designdetail&model=105&design=48
?
The only thing done to the frame was the installation on the elevator and ailerons control horns
Everything else is still brand new.
?
Please contact me of list if interested pictures available on request.
?
Thanks
?
________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you. 
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From pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net  Mon Sep 21 10:41:45 2009
From: pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net (Ihncheol Park)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 18:41:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 4 of DS4321SA for sale
In-Reply-To: <447768.4759.qm@web82106.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <397829.90896.qm@web83903.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

I have a local customer who asked me if I can help sell these for $60.00 each shipped.
they are all new in package.
if anyone interested, reply me directly.  Since he purhcased from me, 
Thanks,

Ihncheol

From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Mon Sep 21 11:17:40 2009
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 19:17:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
Message-ID: <814i7o$45srfq@dmzms99802.na.baesystems.com>

Guys,


http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&P=8&I=LXXMV8

Here is an interesting product link for those using JR/Spectrum 2.4 systems.

Thanks,
Jim
Team Futaba

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From bob at toprudder.com  Mon Sep 21 11:38:24 2009
From: bob at toprudder.com (Bob Richards)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 19:38:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again
In-Reply-To: <858577454.4795171253551052995.JavaMail.root@sz0086a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <844638.5327.qm@web1113.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>



--- On Mon, 9/21/09, ronlock at comcast.net <ronlock at comcast.net> wrote:



#yiv757226774 p {margin:0;}


29% castor - sounds like CL stunt fuel.? Does it get tail heavy during flight?? <G>
?
LOL!! And the elevator gets stiff, too!
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From bob at toprudder.com  Mon Sep 21 11:43:59 2009
From: bob at toprudder.com (Bob Richards)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 19:43:59 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <814i7o$45srfq@dmzms99802.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <109505.41821.qm@web1105.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>

Hey, I love my FASST systems. However, you can buy a Spektrum module for a Futaba, with rx, for $110.? This FASST module for a JR radio, with no rx, is $189. Hmmmm....
?
Bob R.


--- On Mon, 9/21/09, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote:


From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Monday, September 21, 2009, 4:17 PM








Guys,
?

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&P=8&I=LXXMV8

Here is an interesting product link for those using JR/Spectrum 2.4 systems.
?
Thanks,
Jim
Team Futaba
?
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jlachow at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 21 11:48:48 2009
From: jlachow at hotmail.com (Joe Lachowski)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 19:48:48 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <109505.41821.qm@web1105.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
References: <814i7o$45srfq@dmzms99802.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <SNT104-W298FC0FB813D6C4E568CC8BBDD0@phx.gbl>


But who really wants to end up with a Fubar radio.
 


Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 12:43:57 -0700
From: bob at toprudder.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve






Hey, I love my FASST systems. However, you can buy a Spektrum module for a Futaba, with rx, for $110.  This FASST module for a JR radio, with no rx, is $189. Hmmmm....
 
Bob R.


--- On Mon, 9/21/09, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote:


From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Monday, September 21, 2009, 4:17 PM






Guys,
 

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&P=8&I=LXXMV8

Here is an interesting product link for those using JR/Spectrum 2.4 systems.

 

Thanks,

Jim

Team Futaba

 



-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 		 	   		  
_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail? has ever-growing storage! Don?t worry about storage limits.
http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Storage?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_Storage_062009
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From love2flypattern at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 21 12:59:29 2009
From: love2flypattern at yahoo.com (Jarvis Johnson)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 20:59:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Hobbycity E-setup
In-Reply-To: <7naet7$1hrovo@dmzms99901.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <289739.11959.qm@web52702.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Hey Jim
Thank's, things are going well, just got back from hollister contest, good
turn out. I checked CA's web site no picture, can you post, an what's the cost.
?
Thank's
Jarvis

--- On Mon, 9/21/09, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote:


From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hobbycity E-setup
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Cc: "Camodel" <info at camodel.com.ar>
Date: Monday, September 21, 2009, 7:49 AM








Hi Jarvis,
?
I hope you are doing well out in CA.? The Osmose 110 is made by CA Models and it is sharp!? The fuselage is painted fiberglass, wings are 1 piece, stab is fixed.? The chin cowl is nicely divided to make it glow or electric.? I copied Marcelo in case you are interested in his email.
?
Thanks,
Jim
?
?
?

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Jarvis Johnson
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 10:46 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hobbycity E-setup
?





Hey, Jim

There did you find a Osmose 110, is it glow

?

Thank's

jarvis

--- On Thu, 9/17/09, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote:


From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Hobbycity E-setup
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Thursday, September 17, 2009, 7:24 AM


Guys ? I am working on a friend?s airplane that has this equipment:
This is the link of the engine
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=7709
?
This is the ESC
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=4691
?
?
This is the Battery
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=7299
?
?
This is in fact real friend, and not a fictitious story to hide my conversion to electric J.? This is the Turnigy motor, 100 controller, and 4S 4900 Zippy setup for an Osmose 110.? If anyone has experience with this setup please email me props used or things I should know about this.
?
Thanks,
Jim
?

?
?


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Tony
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 9:40 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] NSRCA District 3 Championships
?
Attached is the flier for the District Champs?? 
?
Tony Stillman, President
Radio South, Inc.
139 Altama Connector, Box 322
Brunswick, GA? 31525
1-800-962-7802
www.radiosouthrc.com
?

-----Inline Attachment Follows-----

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
?
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 21 14:10:57 2009
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 22:10:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <814i7o$45srfq@dmzms99802.na.baesystems.com>
References: <814i7o$45srfq@dmzms99802.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <BLU121-W2104AF7C8DB581CB4A571BE8DD0@phx.gbl>


Cool! A downgrade path for my JR!   :)

 

Ed
 


From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 15:17:24 -0400
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve





Guys,
 

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&P=8&I=LXXMV8

Here is an interesting product link for those using JR/Spectrum 2.4 systems.
 
Thanks,
Jim
Team Futaba
 
_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft.
http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/171222986/direct/01/
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From pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net  Mon Sep 21 14:15:05 2009
From: pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net (Ihncheol Park)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 22:15:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 4 of DS4321SA for sale
In-Reply-To: <397829.90896.qm@web83903.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <766309.82340.qm@web83905.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

All 4 servos sold.
Thanks,
That was really quick.

Ihncheol

--- On Mon, 9/21/09, Ihncheol Park <pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net> wrote:

> From: Ihncheol Park <pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net>
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 4 of DS4321SA for sale
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Monday, September 21, 2009, 1:41 PM
> I have a local customer who asked me
> if I can help sell these for $60.00 each shipped.
> they are all new in package.
> if anyone interested, reply me directly.? Since he
> purhcased from me, 
> Thanks,
> 
> Ihncheol
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 

From chuenkan at comcast.net  Mon Sep 21 14:28:29 2009
From: chuenkan at comcast.net (Phil Spelt)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 22:28:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <814i7o$45srfq@dmzms99802.na.baesystems.com>
References: <814i7o$45srfq@dmzms99802.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <20090921222829.7D8231162C@bridi.netexpress.com>

Thank you for the link, Jim.  I always appreciate receiving links to 
various things in the R/C Pattern sport.

As a long-time JR user, however, I cannot imagine why ANYONE would 
consider doing that. I just don't understand people who insist on 
using inferior equipment...ROFL!!!!!!

At 03:17 PM 9/21/2009, you wrote:
>Content-Language: en-US
>Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
> 
>boundary="_000_9C8CE150BB11C5468B364357E2B376BE0408E25FGLDMS99941goldl_"
>
>Guys,
>
>
><http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&P=8&I=LXXMV8>http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&P=8&I=LXXMV8
>
>Here is an interesting product link for those using JR/Spectrum 2.4 systems.
>
>Thanks,
>Jim
>Team Futaba
>
>_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

-->There are only two types of aircraft -- fighters and targets.

Phil Spelt, Webmaster & Past President, Knox County Radio Control Society, Inc.
        URL: http://www.kcrctn.com
AMA--1294,  Scientific Leader Member, SPA--177
       My URL: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/~chuenkan/
       (865) 435-1476 v  (865) 604-0541 c  
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From chuenkan at comcast.net  Mon Sep 21 14:29:46 2009
From: chuenkan at comcast.net (Phil Spelt)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 22:29:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again
In-Reply-To: <844638.5327.qm@web1113.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
References: <858577454.4795171253551052995.JavaMail.root@sz0086a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>
	<844638.5327.qm@web1113.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20090921222946.54D531162C@bridi.netexpress.com>

Whoa, Castor oil does THAT????  I'll have to try it!!!  lol...

At 03:38 PM 9/21/2009, you wrote:


>--- On Mon, 9/21/09, ronlock at comcast.net <ronlock at comcast.net> wrote:
>
>29% castor - sounds like CL stunt fuel.  Does it get tail heavy 
>during flight?  <G>
>
>
>LOL!! And the elevator gets stiff, too!
>_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

-->There are only two types of aircraft -- fighters and targets.

Phil Spelt, Webmaster & Past President, Knox County Radio Control Society, Inc.
        URL: http://www.kcrctn.com
AMA--1294,  Scientific Leader Member, SPA--177
       My URL: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/~chuenkan/
       (865) 435-1476 v  (865) 604-0541 c  
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From chuenkan at comcast.net  Mon Sep 21 14:30:28 2009
From: chuenkan at comcast.net (Phil Spelt)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 22:30:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <109505.41821.qm@web1105.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
References: <814i7o$45srfq@dmzms99802.na.baesystems.com>
	<109505.41821.qm@web1105.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20090921223028.09EC01162C@bridi.netexpress.com>

Hey, Bob, seemy previous post on the subject... :-)

At 03:43 PM 9/21/2009, you wrote:
>Hey, I love my FASST systems. However, you can buy a Spektrum module 
>for a Futaba, with rx, for $110.  This FASST module for a JR radio, 
>with no rx, is $189. Hmmmm....
>
>Bob R.
>
>
>--- On Mon, 9/21/09, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) 
><jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote:
>
>From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
>Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
>To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>Date: Monday, September 21, 2009, 4:17 PM
>
>Guys,
>
>
>
>
><http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&P=8&I=LXXMV8>http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&P=8&I=LXXMV8
>
>Here is an interesting product link for those using JR/Spectrum 2.4 systems.
>
>
>
>Thanks,
>
>Jim
>
>Team Futaba
>
>
>
>-----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>
>_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
><http://us.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

-->There are only two types of aircraft -- fighters and targets.

Phil Spelt, Webmaster & Past President, Knox County Radio Control Society, Inc.
        URL: http://www.kcrctn.com
AMA--1294,  Scientific Leader Member, SPA--177
       My URL: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/~chuenkan/
       (865) 435-1476 v  (865) 604-0541 c  
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From rcpilot at wowway.com  Mon Sep 21 14:51:52 2009
From: rcpilot at wowway.com (Ron Hansen)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 22:51:52 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 2 Meter Planes Available in Fall 2009
Message-ID: <346DB91CA6494FFBA2EF437C826BCC16@toshibauser>

I'm looking to buy a composite 2M plane this fall (electric).
 
In the absence of a Buyers Guide I need help locating all of the designs
available for sale this fall.
 
Please send me links to planes that will be for sale this fall both in
the US and abroad.
 
Thanks Ron.
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Mon Sep 21 15:29:50 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 23:29:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again
In-Reply-To: <844638.5327.qm@web1113.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
References: <844638.5327.qm@web1113.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <D511AB4CF6A444129F023905BDC1EC9D@UncleJasPC>

Ok, ok, ok.... I get it. I flew one more tank and then left the 29% (didn't say CL anywhere on the can) fuel at the field. I ran 2 tanks of 15/16 and it worked much better... but still some hesitation. Is 16% oil enough? I felt like the YS guys using no smoke fuel (of course mine ran the whole flight... sorry couldn't resist). The worst part of all this... SLIME!!!! How can you guys do this... YUCK...lol.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Bob Richards 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 3:38 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again




        --- On Mon, 9/21/09, ronlock at comcast.net <ronlock at comcast.net> wrote:



          29% castor - sounds like CL stunt fuel.  Does it get tail heavy during flight?  <G>

        LOL!! And the elevator gets stiff, too! 



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From tocdon at netscape.net  Mon Sep 21 15:32:47 2009
From: tocdon at netscape.net (tocdon at netscape.net)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 23:32:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Don Szczur
In-Reply-To: <BLU115-W20B45D187EAE66A0DED8BA0E10@phx.gbl>
References: <1571715114.1975721253121797414.JavaMail.root@sz0076a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net><8CC05501621A59A-450C-BEB6@webmail-m080.sysops.aol.com>
	<BLU115-W20B45D187EAE66A0DED8BA0E10@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <8CC092AE93642B5-11E0-1B993@webmail-d037.sysops.aol.com>


This is my mailing list account.? Also at?dszczur at verizon.net.



The tocdon is supposed to be the spam-catcher for?high volume email- set up years ago, which I thought?would get a?lot of junk spam.? Funny how little spam gets on this toc e-mail account- like none.? Any case, for your reference.



Don


-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Cohen <precisionaero at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thu, Sep 17, 2009 7:19 am
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Don Szczur



Thanks
?
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 21:48:27 -0400
From: tocdon at netscape.net
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Don Szczur

Here..


-----Original Message-----
From: scrsmith57 at comcast.net
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wed, Sep 16, 2009 1:23 pm
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Don Szczur


Here ya go Mike.
tocdon at netscape.net

Scott Smith

----- Original Message -----

From: Michael Cohen 

To: NSRCA 

Sent: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 15:37:31 +0000 (UTC)

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Don Szczur













Anyone have an e-mail address for Don Szczur?


?


Mike Cohen


?

Bing brings you health info from trusted sources. Try it now!





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service. Get it now. = 


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From precisionaero at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 21 15:41:47 2009
From: precisionaero at hotmail.com (Michael Cohen)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 23:41:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 2 Meter Planes Available in Fall 2009
In-Reply-To: <346DB91CA6494FFBA2EF437C826BCC16@toshibauser>
References: <346DB91CA6494FFBA2EF437C826BCC16@toshibauser>
Message-ID: <BLU115-W158BC554E2B2E16A7B1573A0DD0@phx.gbl>


Ron, I have been compiling a list myself of all websites I could find.  Hope this helps:
 
Integral/Valiant http://www.carf-models.com
 
Oxai                             not working                  
 
Pass-port                     http://www.netboxhobby.com
 
Black Magic                 http://www.customairframes.com/
 
Delro                            http://www.electric-f3a.com/
 
ZN Line                       http://www.znline.com/
 
Extreme Flight RC        http://www.extremeflightrc.com/index.html
            
I believe Chris Moon will be importing the ZN Line, but I have included the one in Europe so you can stare and drool.
 
Mike Cohen

________________________________
> From: rcpilot at wowway.com
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 18:51:52 -0400
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 2 Meter Planes Available in Fall 2009
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I?m looking to buy a composite 2M plane this fall
> (electric).
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> In the absence of a Buyers Guide I need help locating all of
> the designs available for sale this fall.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Please send me links to planes that will be for sale this
> fall both in the US and abroad.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks Ron.
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
Ready for Fall shows? Use Bing to find helpful ratings and reviews on digital tv's.
http://www.bing.com/shopping/search?q=digital+tv's&form=MSHNCB&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MSHNCB_Vertical_Shopping_DigitalTVs_1x1
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From ojfrets at earthlink.net  Mon Sep 21 15:43:02 2009
From: ojfrets at earthlink.net (ORLANDO  FRETS)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 23:43:02 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again
In-Reply-To: <D511AB4CF6A444129F023905BDC1EC9D@UncleJasPC>
References: <844638.5327.qm@web1113.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
	<D511AB4CF6A444129F023905BDC1EC9D@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <2292F7EF386B42FE86C7771E71C7A8B0@OrlandoPC>

Jas:
I'm from the old school that says don't use less than 20%. Worked for me so
far after 55 yrs. 


Orlando Frets

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of J Shu
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 7:30 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes again

Ok, ok, ok.... I get it. I flew one more tank and then left the 29% (didn't
say CL anywhere on the can) fuel at the field. I ran 2 tanks of 15/16 and it
worked much better... but still some hesitation. Is 16% oil enough? I felt
like the YS guys using no smoke fuel (of course mine ran the whole flight...
sorry couldn't resist). The worst part of all this... SLIME!!!! How can you
guys do this... YUCK...lol.

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


	----- Original Message ----- 
	From: Bob Richards <mailto:bob at toprudder.com>  
	To: General pattern discussion
<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  
	Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 3:38 PM
	Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS-120AX questions/thoughts... yes
again



--- On Mon, 9/21/09, ronlock at comcast.net <ronlock at comcast.net> wrote:



	29% castor - sounds like CL stunt fuel.  Does it get tail heavy
during flight?  <G>
	 

LOL!! And the elevator gets stiff, too!

	
________________________________


	

	_______________________________________________
	NSRCA-discussion mailing list
	NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
	http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



From mwaustin54 at cox.net  Mon Sep 21 17:44:51 2009
From: mwaustin54 at cox.net (mwaustin54 at cox.net)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 01:44:51 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Email address
Message-ID: <3072561.68352.1253583889343.JavaMail.mwaustin54@127.0.0.1>

Anyone have Jarvis Johnson's email address?

Thanks,
Mike

From love2flypattern at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 21 17:53:24 2009
From: love2flypattern at yahoo.com (Jarvis Johnson)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 01:53:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Email address
In-Reply-To: <3072561.68352.1253583889343.JavaMail.mwaustin54@127.0.0.1>
Message-ID: <316937.29369.qm@web52709.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Hey Mike
e-mail?? love2flypattern at yahoo.com

Jarvis
--- On Mon, 9/21/09, mwaustin54 at cox.net <mwaustin54 at cox.net> wrote:


From: mwaustin54 at cox.net <mwaustin54 at cox.net>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Email address
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Monday, September 21, 2009, 6:44 PM


Anyone have Jarvis Johnson's email address?

Thanks,
Mike
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



      
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From rob at koolsoft.com  Mon Sep 21 19:01:20 2009
From: rob at koolsoft.com (Robert L. Beaubien)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 03:01:20 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Lancaster Pre-Registration
Message-ID: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB20193A1BF@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>

... is online. 

 

Contest Flyer: http://www.patternflying.net/NewsDetailPage.aspx?ID=61

 

Pre-Registration: http://www.patternflying.net/TempRegistrationPage.aspx

 

Hope to see you there.

 

- Robert Beaubien

- NSRCA District 7 Webmaster

-

"No trees were harmed in the sending of this message, however a large
number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced."

 

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From jpavlick at idseng.com  Mon Sep 21 19:41:19 2009
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 03:41:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <BLU121-W2104AF7C8DB581CB4A571BE8DD0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <272414.90665.qm@web80506.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Yeah WTF? I fly Futaba but?I don't see any reason why a JR user would want (or need) to use a Futaba 2.4 receiver.
?
John Pavlick

--- On Mon, 9/21/09, Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com> wrote:


From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Monday, September 21, 2009, 6:10 PM




#yiv840284775 .hmmessage P
{
margin:0px;padding:0px;}
#yiv840284775 {
font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana;}

Cool! A downgrade path for my JR!?? :)
?
Ed
?


From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 15:17:24 -0400
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve



#yiv840284775 .ExternalClass p.EC_MsoNormal, #yiv840284775 .ExternalClass li.EC_MsoNormal, #yiv840284775 .ExternalClass div.EC_MsoNormal
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Guys,
?

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&P=8&I=LXXMV8

Here is an interesting product link for those using JR/Spectrum 2.4 systems.
?
Thanks,
Jim
Team Futaba
?


Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. Get it now. 
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From wemodels at cox.net  Mon Sep 21 22:11:30 2009
From: wemodels at cox.net (Bill's Email)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 06:11:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <272414.90665.qm@web80506.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <272414.90665.qm@web80506.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4AB86A8B.1070305@cox.net>

John Pavlick wrote:
> Yeah WTF? I fly Futaba but I don't see any reason why a JR user would 
> want (or need) to use a Futaba 2.4 receiver.
>  
>
Well, I may be the only person on Earth this applies to , but I have a 
9303 that I like but never fly since switching over to 2.4 FASST from 
ham band. So now I can put this module in it and use it on any of my 
FASST equipped planes. Sort of cool.



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From ejhaury at comcast.net  Tue Sep 22 03:13:01 2009
From: ejhaury at comcast.net (Earl Haury)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 11:13:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] North Dallas Contest
Message-ID: <6DEA79E1AE1743BC827E9E99EFC7836E@EarlPC>

A big thank-you to Dave Cotton, his "staff", and the North Dallas R/C club for another excellent contest this past week end! 

Earl
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From schale at optonline.net  Tue Sep 22 04:43:40 2009
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 12:43:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <BLU115-W158BC554E2B2E16A7B1573A0DD0@phx.gbl>
References: <346DB91CA6494FFBA2EF437C826BCC16@toshibauser>
	<BLU115-W158BC554E2B2E16A7B1573A0DD0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <4AB8C61E.40103@optonline.net>

OK don't kick me off the list but I flew an IMAC contest last weekend.  
(yes in Basic with a pattern plane :) )
Has any thought been given to flying unknowns as the IMAC guys do?  If 
you are not familiar with it, on a 2 day contest the unknown is handed 
out after flying is done on the first day.  The unknown is appropriate 
for your class and is the same nationwide for that weekend.  You are on 
an honor system not to fly it or use a sim (I suspect some people do) 
and the first flight of day 2 is the unknown.  I believe it can not be a 
dropped round.  Basic class flies their usual sequence no unknown.  It 
adds a bit of excitement to the 2nd day of the contest.  You have to be 
able to do a bunch of maneuvers not in this years sequence but 
appropriate for the class.  So practice time might be more than 6 
identical flights of your current sequence.  And most importantly it may 
provide for some separation for the top fliers in each class.  I had a 
lot of fun discussing the sequences with my friends that were there, and 
watching and listening to them after flying it.  Hard to fly a sequence 
for the first time without making a significant error.

Stuart


From anthonyr105 at hotmail.com  Tue Sep 22 04:50:16 2009
From: anthonyr105 at hotmail.com (Anthony Romano)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 12:50:16 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <4AB8C61E.40103@optonline.net>
References: <346DB91CA6494FFBA2EF437C826BCC16@toshibauser>
	<BLU115-W158BC554E2B2E16A7B1573A0DD0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <COL123-W333F031996C09B0A16023EE2DC0@phx.gbl>


Hi Stu,

 Did you happen to find out how they deal with the scoring? If it is national and everyone is using the same program maybe an update could be available for the CD to download prior to the event?

 One thing I noticed was a lot of judges with the aresti in one hand and score sheet in the other while judging. Lots of looking away during the flight. I looked over a few shoulder and would have put down some similar numbers.

 

Anthony
 
> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:42:06 -0400
> From: schale at optonline.net
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> 
> OK don't kick me off the list but I flew an IMAC contest last weekend. 
> (yes in Basic with a pattern plane :) )
> Has any thought been given to flying unknowns as the IMAC guys do? If 
> you are not familiar with it, on a 2 day contest the unknown is handed 
> out after flying is done on the first day. The unknown is appropriate 
> for your class and is the same nationwide for that weekend. You are on 
> an honor system not to fly it or use a sim (I suspect some people do) 
> and the first flight of day 2 is the unknown. I believe it can not be a 
> dropped round. Basic class flies their usual sequence no unknown. It 
> adds a bit of excitement to the 2nd day of the contest. You have to be 
> able to do a bunch of maneuvers not in this years sequence but 
> appropriate for the class. So practice time might be more than 6 
> identical flights of your current sequence. And most importantly it may 
> provide for some separation for the top fliers in each class. I had a 
> lot of fun discussing the sequences with my friends that were there, and 
> watching and listening to them after flying it. Hard to fly a sequence 
> for the first time without making a significant error.
> 
> Stuart
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
 		 	   		  
_________________________________________________________________
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From jpavlick at idseng.com  Tue Sep 22 05:15:08 2009
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 13:15:08 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <4AB86A8B.1070305@cox.net>
Message-ID: <170092.13065.qm@web80501.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Bill,
You are a one-percenter among the one-percenters! LOL 
?
I actually bought the Spektrum module with Rx for my Futaba 12Fg because it was such a good deal. I'm going to use this setup for indoor this year with some of those really small Spektrum receivers. It's also great for the E-Flite Bind-N-Fly models. I just didn't see the point in going "the other way" but?I guess in your case it makes sense.
?
John Pavlick

--- On Tue, 9/22/09, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net> wrote:


From: Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 22, 2009, 2:11 AM


John Pavlick wrote: 





Yeah WTF? I fly Futaba but?I don't see any reason why a JR user would want (or need) to use a Futaba 2.4 receiver.
?Well, I may be the only person on Earth this applies to , but I have a 9303 that I like but never fly since switching over to 2.4 FASST from ham band. So now I can put this module in it and use it on any of my FASST equipped planes. Sort of cool.




-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From schale at optonline.net  Tue Sep 22 05:30:23 2009
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 13:30:23 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <COL123-W333F031996C09B0A16023EE2DC0@phx.gbl>
References: <346DB91CA6494FFBA2EF437C826BCC16@toshibauser>
	<BLU115-W158BC554E2B2E16A7B1573A0DD0@phx.gbl>
	<COL123-W333F031996C09B0A16023EE2DC0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <4AB8D119.3090704@optonline.net>

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From humptybump at sbcglobal.net  Tue Sep 22 05:36:45 2009
From: humptybump at sbcglobal.net (Richard Lewis)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 13:36:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] North Dallas Contest
In-Reply-To: <6DEA79E1AE1743BC827E9E99EFC7836E@EarlPC>
References: <6DEA79E1AE1743BC827E9E99EFC7836E@EarlPC>
Message-ID: <879856.13766.qm@web80505.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Dave, Glen, and his whole crew did a great job.? The weather was fantastic.? It was very interesting to finally see the P-11 in a real competition environment.

I was sad to see the low turnout for?one of the best contests at?one of the best venues, run by some of the?best guys in the district, especially in Sportsman (0) and Intermediate (2).? I'm not reading any particualr meaing into it.? We've?had?reasonably good numbers in the lower classes this year,?but it is a reminder that we need to be diligent in our efforts to bolster our lower ranks and the thus solidify the future of our hobby.

Richard




________________________________
From: Earl Haury <ejhaury at comcast.net>
To: "Discussion List, NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 6:12:38 AM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] North Dallas Contest


A big thank-you to Dave Cotton, his "staff", and the North Dallas R/C club for another excellent contest this past week end! 
?
Earl
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From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Tue Sep 22 05:46:57 2009
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 13:46:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <COL123-W333F031996C09B0A16023EE2DC0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <814i1h$4csr4m@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>

Unknowns in pattern?  IMAC versus pattern?

I've flown a bunch of IMAC over the last 4 years.  IMAC and Pattern answer two different questions, and each group has DISTINCTLY different personalities.  At the end of a pattern contest, you will see who flew the sequences the best (usually the best pilot).  At the end of an IMAC contest, you will get closer to seeing who the best pilot is in that class.  There are pros and cons for each, each fitting the personalities of the groups.

Pattern:  Is about learning the fundamentals of precision flight. Group is not too excited about changing sequences too often, especially for the lower classes.  It is a pattern-truth that the lower classes are designed to build piloting skill and teach precision aerobatics fundamentals (wings level and such).  This group recognizes that guys don't get to fly every day, and the goal is "fly your sequence the best you can."  Lower classes are not considered "destination" classes.  Pattern guys almost 100% of the time can get into Advanced and Masters, with F3A being hit or miss.  Pattern guys believe it is "fair" that the competition is only the  "known" sequences because this levels the playing field - anyone can compete because we know what is going to be flown ahead of time, and the tier-2 kind of pilot has a competitive chance against tier-1 pilot, per se'.   Pattern guys want to know what the rules are, and then build a plane within the rules and maximize what they can.  Pattern guys are open, and keep all contests open to whoever can make it.

IMAC:  almost 100% opposite to the pattern personality.  Guys don't like rules!  Do not want rules applied to planes (... no support for even adequate mufflers or tuned pipes/silencers). Not willing to "describe" airspace or where maneuvers are flown (read ACS definition if like and let us know what the criteria is).  IMAC does not encourage moving up in the way the culture of pattern does - plenty of guys in IMAC will fly Basic or Sportsman for many years.  Intermediate is realistically the destination class.  Few make it into Advanced, and less into Unlimited.  IMAC guys want to fly new sequences every year, and this sort of offsets the motivation for moving up.  IMAC guys have some affinity for "freestyle" and undisciplined flying - they like that you don't have to practice the know sequence all the time.  All you need to do is keep "close" in the knowns, and score a high unknown round and you can win the contest due to the higher weighting the unknown round carries.  IMAC guys don't really focus on getting better geometry out of maneuvers  - as hitting snap rolls will make or break you IMAC score.  Using the 0.5/point per 5 degree rule, "snap-rolls" are in fact the whole secret to scoring IMAC patterns well - it is a maneuver within a maneuver and you need to learn how your plane snaps at low speed, high speed, power-on, and power-off.  If you can't hit a snap roll exit, don't even think about getting into Advanced or Unlimited.  This group likes "exclusivity" or "invitational" events, and this also makes its way into the regional championships.

So - there are totally different personalities at work for both organizations.  I like flying unknowns, but I don't think it is a good mix for precision aerobatics events.   Guys moved from F3A into Masters to get away from the two known sequences, so I don't think unknowns for the AMA classes really fits into the culture, or our goals of "precision" aerobatics.
Thanks,
Jim


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Romano
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:50 AM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

Hi Stu,
 Did you happen to find out how they deal with the scoring? If it is national and everyone is using the same program maybe an update could be available for the CD to download prior to the event?
 One thing I noticed was a lot of judges with the aresti in one hand and score sheet in the other while judging. Lots of looking away during the flight. I looked over a few shoulder and would have put down some similar numbers.

Anthony

> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:42:06 -0400
> From: schale at optonline.net
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> OK don't kick me off the list but I flew an IMAC contest last weekend.
> (yes in Basic with a pattern plane :) )
> Has any thought been given to flying unknowns as the IMAC guys do? If
> you are not familiar with it, on a 2 day contest the unknown is handed
> out after flying is done on the first day. The unknown is appropriate
> for your class and is the same nationwide for that weekend. You are on
> an honor system not to fly it or use a sim (I suspect some people do)
> and the first flight of day 2 is the unknown. I believe it can not be a
> dropped round. Basic class flies their usual sequence no unknown. It
> adds a bit of excitement to the 2nd day of the contest. You have to be
> able to do a bunch of maneuvers not in this years sequence but
> appropriate for the class. So practice time might be more than 6
> identical flights of your current sequence. And most importantly it may
> provide for some separation for the top fliers in each class. I had a
> lot of fun discussing the sequences with my friends that were there, and
> watching and listening to them after flying it. Hard to fly a sequence
> for the first time without making a significant error.
>
> Stuart
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
________________________________
Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail(r). See how.<http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_QuickAdd_062009>
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From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Tue Sep 22 05:57:06 2009
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 13:57:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <814i1h$4csr4m@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <172176.92709.qm@web51002.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

 Wow Jim that is the best explaination of the difference I've ever seen. Thanks for that post I will save it and use it again.
 I'd love to try IMAC someday but it's a time and resource problem to do so at this point. We have a number of IMAC guys at my field and I like them all. I find we have a lot in common but your right about the differences too. Thanks, Mike Mueller

--- On Tue, 9/22/09, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote:

> From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Tuesday, September 22, 2009, 8:46 AM
> 
> 
> 
>  
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> Unknowns in pattern?? IMAC
> versus pattern??  
> 
>  ? 
> 
> I?ve flown a bunch of
> IMAC over the last 4 years.?
> IMAC and Pattern answer two different questions, and each
> group has DISTINCTLY different
> personalities.? At the end of a pattern contest, you
> will see who flew the
> sequences the best (usually the best pilot).? At the
> end of an IMAC
> contest, you will get closer to seeing who the best pilot
> is in that
> class.? There are pros and cons for each, each fitting
> the personalities
> of the groups. 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> Pattern:? Is about
> learning the fundamentals of precision
> flight. Group is not too excited about changing sequences
> too often, especially
> for the lower classes.? It is a pattern-truth that the
> lower classes are
> designed to build piloting skill and teach precision
> aerobatics fundamentals
> (wings level and such).? This group recognizes that
> guys don?t get
> to fly every day, and the goal is ?fly your sequence
> the best you can.??
> Lower classes are not considered ?destination?
> classes.?
> Pattern guys almost 100% of the time can get into Advanced
> and Masters, with
> F3A being hit or miss.? Pattern guys believe it is
> ?fair? that
> the competition is only the ??known?
> sequences because this
> levels the playing field ? anyone can compete because
> we know what is
> going to be flown ahead of time, and the tier-2 kind of
> pilot has a competitive
> chance against tier-1 pilot, per se?.?
> ?Pattern guys want to
> know what the rules are, and then build a plane within the
> rules and maximize
> what they can.? Pattern guys are open, and keep all
> contests open to
> whoever can make it. 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> IMAC:? almost 100%
> opposite to the pattern
> personality.? Guys don?t like rules!? Do
> not want rules applied
> to planes (? no support for even adequate mufflers or
> tuned
> pipes/silencers). Not willing to ?describe?
> airspace or where
> maneuvers are flown (read ACS definition if like and let us
> know what the criteria
> is).? IMAC does not encourage moving up in the way the
> culture of pattern
> does ? plenty of guys in IMAC will fly Basic or
> Sportsman for many
> years.? Intermediate is realistically the destination
> class.? Few
> make it into Advanced, and less into Unlimited.? IMAC
> guys want to fly new
> sequences every year, and this sort of offsets the
> motivation for moving
> up.? IMAC guys have some affinity for
> ?freestyle? and
> undisciplined flying ? they like that you don?t
> have to practice
> the know sequence all the time.? All you need to do is
> keep ?close?
> in the knowns, and score a high unknown round and you can
> win the contest due
> to the higher weighting the unknown round carries.?
> IMAC guys don?t
> really focus on getting better geometry out of
> maneuvers? - as hitting
> snap rolls will make or break you IMAC score.? Using
> the 0.5/point per 5
> degree rule, ?snap-rolls? are in fact the whole
> secret to scoring
> IMAC patterns well ? it is a maneuver within a
> maneuver and you need to
> learn how your plane snaps at low speed, high speed,
> power-on, and
> power-off.? If you can?t hit a snap roll exit,
> don?t even
> think about getting into Advanced or Unlimited.? This
> group likes ?exclusivity?
> or ?invitational? events, and this also makes
> its way into the
> regional championships.?  
> 
>  ? 
> 
> So ? there are totally
> different personalities at work for
> both organizations.? I like flying unknowns, but I
> don?t think it is
> a good mix for precision aerobatics events.?
> ?Guys moved from F3A into
> Masters to get away from the two known sequences, so I
> don?t think
> unknowns for the AMA classes really fits into the culture,
> or our goals of ?precision?
> aerobatics. 
> 
> Thanks, 
> 
> Jim 
> 
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On
> Behalf Of Anthony
> Romano
> 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:50 AM
> 
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> Hi?Stu,
> 
> ?Did you happen to find out how they deal with the
> scoring? If it is
> national and?everyone is using the same program maybe
> an update could be
> available for the?CD to download prior to the event?
> 
> ?One thing I noticed?was?a lot of judges
> with the aresti in one
> hand and score sheet in the other while judging. Lots of
> looking away during
> the flight. I looked over a few shoulder and would have put
> down some similar
> numbers.
> 
> ?
> 
> Anthony
> 
> ?
> 
> > Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:42:06 -0400
> 
> > From: schale at optonline.net
> 
> > To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> 
> > 
> 
> > OK don't kick me off the list but I flew an IMAC
> contest last weekend. 
> 
> > (yes in Basic with a pattern plane :) )
> 
> > Has any thought been given to flying unknowns as the
> IMAC guys do? If 
> 
> > you are not familiar with it, on a 2 day contest the
> unknown is handed 
> 
> > out after flying is done on the first day. The unknown
> is appropriate 
> 
> > for your class and is the same nationwide for that
> weekend. You are on 
> 
> > an honor system not to fly it or use a sim (I suspect
> some people do) 
> 
> > and the first flight of day 2 is the unknown. I
> believe it can not be a 
> 
> > dropped round. Basic class flies their usual sequence
> no unknown. It 
> 
> > adds a bit of excitement to the 2nd day of the
> contest. You have to be 
> 
> > able to do a bunch of maneuvers not in this years
> sequence but 
> 
> > appropriate for the class. So practice time might be
> more than 6 
> 
> > identical flights of your current sequence. And most
> importantly it may 
> 
> > provide for some separation for the top fliers in each
> class. I had a 
> 
> > lot of fun discussing the sequences with my friends
> that were there, and 
> 
> > watching and listening to them after flying it. Hard
> to fly a sequence 
> 
> > for the first time without making a significant
> error.
> 
> > 
> 
> > Stuart
> 
> > 
> 
> > _______________________________________________
> 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> >
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Insert
> movie times and more without leaving Hotmail?. See how. 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      

From bob at toprudder.com  Tue Sep 22 06:02:30 2009
From: bob at toprudder.com (Bob Richards)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 14:02:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <170092.13065.qm@web80501.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <397270.4688.qm@web1112.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>

Personally, I like the FASST system. I must have a dozen 2.4g receivers now. I have nothing against the JR/Spektrum, a lot of my friends fly JR (I am in a very small minority in my club flying Futaba). I will admit that I bought the Spektrum module for one of my old Futaba transmitters, so that I could do the "bind-n-fly" thing as well.
?
I will tell you guys a funny story. I was at Efest this year. I was flying a Vapor over in the corner for the ultralight planes, and heard someone walk up behing a friend of mine (Jeff Phillips, Radioactive Airshow Team) and start asking him how he liked the Vapors. Well, I thought it must be someone who had never flown a Vapor, so I turned around and handed him my transmitter, an old Futaba 7UA with a Spektrum module, so he could fly it. It happened to be Peter Goldsmith. :-)? I wish I had said "feel the difference" to him. 
?
Bob R.


--- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote:









Bill,
You are a one-percenter among the one-percenters! LOL 
?
I actually bought the Spektrum module with Rx for my Futaba 12Fg because it was such a good deal. I'm going to use this setup for indoor this year with some of those really small Spektrum receivers. It's also great for the E-Flite Bind-N-Fly models. I just didn't see the point in going "the other way" but?I guess in your case it makes sense.
?
John Pavlick




?
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From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Tue Sep 22 06:14:05 2009
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 14:14:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <172176.92709.qm@web51002.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <814i1h$4csuhl@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>

Thanks Mike.  Give IMAC a try if you can borrow a plane and practice snap rolls with it.  I think though you will be surprised that the skills that separate pilots in pattern (like maintaining heading control and distance, wings level, geometry), are not so rewarded in scoring in the IMAC sequences (or read as these same skill areas are not so downgraded in IMAC like they would be in pattern).   One reason the geometry falls away, is that the "family of maneuvers" descriptions, such as Family 1, will turn what is in pattern as a "Figure N (centered of course)", into a maneuver consisting of lines and radii - none of the radii need to match, none of the lines need to match, no centering criteria.  Again, different strokes as the saying goes.
Thanks,
Jim



-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:57 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

 Wow Jim that is the best explaination of the difference I've ever seen. Thanks for that post I will save it and use it again.
 I'd love to try IMAC someday but it's a time and resource problem to do so at this point. We have a number of IMAC guys at my field and I like them all. I find we have a lot in common but your right about the differences too. Thanks, Mike Mueller

--- On Tue, 9/22/09, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote:

> From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Tuesday, September 22, 2009, 8:46 AM
> 
> 
> 
>  
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> Unknowns in pattern?? IMAC
> versus pattern??  
> 
>  ? 
> 
> I?ve flown a bunch of
> IMAC over the last 4 years.?
> IMAC and Pattern answer two different questions, and each
> group has DISTINCTLY different
> personalities.? At the end of a pattern contest, you
> will see who flew the
> sequences the best (usually the best pilot).? At the
> end of an IMAC
> contest, you will get closer to seeing who the best pilot
> is in that
> class.? There are pros and cons for each, each fitting
> the personalities
> of the groups. 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> Pattern:? Is about
> learning the fundamentals of precision
> flight. Group is not too excited about changing sequences
> too often, especially
> for the lower classes.? It is a pattern-truth that the
> lower classes are
> designed to build piloting skill and teach precision
> aerobatics fundamentals
> (wings level and such).? This group recognizes that
> guys don?t get
> to fly every day, and the goal is ?fly your sequence
> the best you can.??
> Lower classes are not considered ?destination?
> classes.?
> Pattern guys almost 100% of the time can get into Advanced
> and Masters, with
> F3A being hit or miss.? Pattern guys believe it is
> ?fair? that
> the competition is only the ??known?
> sequences because this
> levels the playing field ? anyone can compete because
> we know what is
> going to be flown ahead of time, and the tier-2 kind of
> pilot has a competitive
> chance against tier-1 pilot, per se?.?
> ?Pattern guys want to
> know what the rules are, and then build a plane within the
> rules and maximize
> what they can.? Pattern guys are open, and keep all
> contests open to
> whoever can make it. 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> IMAC:? almost 100%
> opposite to the pattern
> personality.? Guys don?t like rules!? Do
> not want rules applied
> to planes (? no support for even adequate mufflers or
> tuned
> pipes/silencers). Not willing to ?describe?
> airspace or where
> maneuvers are flown (read ACS definition if like and let us
> know what the criteria
> is).? IMAC does not encourage moving up in the way the
> culture of pattern
> does ? plenty of guys in IMAC will fly Basic or
> Sportsman for many
> years.? Intermediate is realistically the destination
> class.? Few
> make it into Advanced, and less into Unlimited.? IMAC
> guys want to fly new
> sequences every year, and this sort of offsets the
> motivation for moving
> up.? IMAC guys have some affinity for
> ?freestyle? and
> undisciplined flying ? they like that you don?t
> have to practice
> the know sequence all the time.? All you need to do is
> keep ?close?
> in the knowns, and score a high unknown round and you can
> win the contest due
> to the higher weighting the unknown round carries.?
> IMAC guys don?t
> really focus on getting better geometry out of
> maneuvers? - as hitting
> snap rolls will make or break you IMAC score.? Using
> the 0.5/point per 5
> degree rule, ?snap-rolls? are in fact the whole
> secret to scoring
> IMAC patterns well ? it is a maneuver within a
> maneuver and you need to
> learn how your plane snaps at low speed, high speed,
> power-on, and
> power-off.? If you can?t hit a snap roll exit,
> don?t even
> think about getting into Advanced or Unlimited.? This
> group likes ?exclusivity?
> or ?invitational? events, and this also makes
> its way into the
> regional championships.?  
> 
>  ? 
> 
> So ? there are totally
> different personalities at work for
> both organizations.? I like flying unknowns, but I
> don?t think it is
> a good mix for precision aerobatics events.?
> ?Guys moved from F3A into
> Masters to get away from the two known sequences, so I
> don?t think
> unknowns for the AMA classes really fits into the culture,
> or our goals of ?precision?
> aerobatics. 
> 
> Thanks, 
> 
> Jim 
> 
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On
> Behalf Of Anthony
> Romano
> 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:50 AM
> 
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> Hi?Stu,
> 
> ?Did you happen to find out how they deal with the
> scoring? If it is
> national and?everyone is using the same program maybe
> an update could be
> available for the?CD to download prior to the event?
> 
> ?One thing I noticed?was?a lot of judges
> with the aresti in one
> hand and score sheet in the other while judging. Lots of
> looking away during
> the flight. I looked over a few shoulder and would have put
> down some similar
> numbers.
> 
> ?
> 
> Anthony
> 
> ?
> 
> > Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:42:06 -0400
> 
> > From: schale at optonline.net
> 
> > To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> 
> > 
> 
> > OK don't kick me off the list but I flew an IMAC
> contest last weekend. 
> 
> > (yes in Basic with a pattern plane :) )
> 
> > Has any thought been given to flying unknowns as the
> IMAC guys do? If 
> 
> > you are not familiar with it, on a 2 day contest the
> unknown is handed 
> 
> > out after flying is done on the first day. The unknown
> is appropriate 
> 
> > for your class and is the same nationwide for that
> weekend. You are on 
> 
> > an honor system not to fly it or use a sim (I suspect
> some people do) 
> 
> > and the first flight of day 2 is the unknown. I
> believe it can not be a 
> 
> > dropped round. Basic class flies their usual sequence
> no unknown. It 
> 
> > adds a bit of excitement to the 2nd day of the
> contest. You have to be 
> 
> > able to do a bunch of maneuvers not in this years
> sequence but 
> 
> > appropriate for the class. So practice time might be
> more than 6 
> 
> > identical flights of your current sequence. And most
> importantly it may 
> 
> > provide for some separation for the top fliers in each
> class. I had a 
> 
> > lot of fun discussing the sequences with my friends
> that were there, and 
> 
> > watching and listening to them after flying it. Hard
> to fly a sequence 
> 
> > for the first time without making a significant
> error.
> 
> > 
> 
> > Stuart
> 
> > 
> 
> > _______________________________________________
> 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> >
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Insert
> movie times and more without leaving Hotmail?. See how. 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep 22 06:21:15 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 14:21:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <1940040966.4137541253629215073.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1057451466.4138151253629274632.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>



I fly IMAC Intermediate class since many years ago.? Probably 1-2 contest per year because contest is too far from KC.? Jim is very close in his description.? However, I found that if you fly with the same goals we fly in pattern you will have very high chance to win in IMAC .? The rules are very close (read the snap roll and you will be surprised?how?close is to?pattern AMA and F3A, IMAC and IAC ).? I think the Sportsman?s IMAC pilots get stuck in that class because they have to fly partial rollers in Intermediate IMAC without learning?to do slow roll first.? Looks like? IMAC don't want to do slow roll because is a pattern maneuver.? If you check the IAC maneuvers you will find that they have slow roll.? In conclusion, I believe?we have very close goals but we are?always looking for ways to find differences when really there is not a huge difference after we read the rulebooks.? 



? 



By the way, I am using soft mount in my YAK (DA 100 with canisters and 3 lade prop).? One time I got to a contest and started the engine to get ready.? A couple of?pilots in the other side of the field came to ask me if my motor was electric.? IMAC guys do not use soft mounts just because pattern guys use soft mounts.? It is similar to the elimination of center manuevers to the judges.? The excuse to eliminate center manuevers was because IMAC goal is to reduce the footprint.? However, I don't understand how you reduce the footprint without doing the center manuever in the center.? Go and?figure.? ?? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 



? 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "mike mueller" <mups1953 at yahoo.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:57:05 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

?Wow Jim that is the best explaination of the difference I've ever seen. Thanks for that post I will save it and use it again. 
?I'd love to try IMAC someday but it's a time and resource problem to do so at this point. We have a number of IMAC guys at my field and I like them all. I find we have a lot in common but your right about the differences too. Thanks, Mike Mueller 

--- On Tue, 9/22/09, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote: 

> From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
> Date: Tuesday, September 22, 2009, 8:46 AM 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> Unknowns in pattern?? IMAC 
> versus pattern?? ? 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> I?ve flown a bunch of 
> IMAC over the last 4 years.? 
> IMAC and Pattern answer two different questions, and each 
> group has DISTINCTLY different 
> personalities.? At the end of a pattern contest, you 
> will see who flew the 
> sequences the best (usually the best pilot).? At the 
> end of an IMAC 
> contest, you will get closer to seeing who the best pilot 
> is in that 
> class.? There are pros and cons for each, each fitting 
> the personalities 
> of the groups. 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> Pattern:? Is about 
> learning the fundamentals of precision 
> flight. Group is not too excited about changing sequences 
> too often, especially 
> for the lower classes.? It is a pattern-truth that the 
> lower classes are 
> designed to build piloting skill and teach precision 
> aerobatics fundamentals 
> (wings level and such).? This group recognizes that 
> guys don?t get 
> to fly every day, and the goal is ?fly your sequence 
> the best you can.?? 
> Lower classes are not considered ?destination? 
> classes.? 
> Pattern guys almost 100% of the time can get into Advanced 
> and Masters, with 
> F3A being hit or miss.? Pattern guys believe it is 
> ?fair? that 
> the competition is only the ??known? 
> sequences because this 
> levels the playing field ? anyone can compete because 
> we know what is 
> going to be flown ahead of time, and the tier-2 kind of 
> pilot has a competitive 
> chance against tier-1 pilot, per se?.? 
> ?Pattern guys want to 
> know what the rules are, and then build a plane within the 
> rules and maximize 
> what they can.? Pattern guys are open, and keep all 
> contests open to 
> whoever can make it. 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> IMAC :? almost 100% 
> opposite to the pattern 
> personality.? Guys don?t like rules!? Do 
> not want rules applied 
> to planes (? no support for even adequate mufflers or 
> tuned 
> pipes/silencers). Not willing to ?describe? 
> airspace or where 
> maneuvers are flown (read ACS definition if like and let us 
> know what the criteria 
> is).? IMAC does not encourage moving up in the way the 
> culture of pattern 
> does ? plenty of guys in IMAC will fly Basic or 
> Sportsman for many 
> years.? Intermediate is realistically the destination 
> class.? Few 
> make it into Advanced, and less into Unlimited.? IMAC 
> guys want to fly new 
> sequences every year, and this sort of offsets the 
> motivation for moving 
> up.? IMAC guys have some affinity for 
> ?freestyle? and 
> undisciplined flying ? they like that you don?t 
> have to practice 
> the know sequence all the time.? All you need to do is 
> keep ?close? 
> in the knowns, and score a high unknown round and you can 
> win the contest due 
> to the higher weighting the unknown round carries.? 
> IMAC guys don?t 
> really focus on getting better geometry out of 
> maneuvers? - as hitting 
> snap rolls will make or break you IMAC score.? Using 
> the 0.5/point per 5 
> degree rule, ?snap-rolls? are in fact the whole 
> secret to scoring 
> IMAC patterns well ? it is a maneuver within a 
> maneuver and you need to 
> learn how your plane snaps at low speed, high speed, 
> power-on, and 
> power-off.? If you can?t hit a snap roll exit, 
> don?t even 
> think about getting into Advanced or Unlimited.? This 
> group likes ?exclusivity? 
> or ?invitational? events, and this also makes 
> its way into the 
> regional championships.? ? 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> So ? there are totally 
> different personalities at work for 
> both organizations.? I like flying unknowns, but I 
> don?t think it is 
> a good mix for precision aerobatics events.? 
> ?Guys moved from F3A into 
> Masters to get away from the two known sequences, so I 
> don?t think 
> unknowns for the AMA classes really fits into the culture, 
> or our goals of ?precision? 
> aerobatics. 
> 
> Thanks, 
> 
> Jim 
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: 
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On 
> Behalf Of Anthony 
> Romano 
> 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:50 AM 
> 
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> Hi?Stu, 
> 
> ?Did you happen to find out how they deal with the 
> scoring? If it is 
> national and?everyone is using the same program maybe 
> an update could be 
> available for the?CD to download prior to the event? 
> 
> ?One thing I noticed?was?a lot of judges 
> with the aresti in one 
> hand and score sheet in the other while judging. Lots of 
> looking away during 
> the flight. I looked over a few shoulder and would have put 
> down some similar 
> numbers. 
> 
> ? 
> 
> Anthony 
> 
> ? 
> 
> > Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:42:06 -0400 
> 
> > From: schale at optonline.net 
> 
> > To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> 
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> 
> > 
> 
> > OK don't kick me off the list but I flew an IMAC 
> contest last weekend. 
> 
> > (yes in Basic with a pattern plane :) ) 
> 
> > Has any thought been given to flying unknowns as the 
> IMAC guys do? If 
> 
> > you are not familiar with it, on a 2 day contest the 
> unknown is handed 
> 
> > out after flying is done on the first day. The unknown 
> is appropriate 
> 
> > for your class and is the same nationwide for that 
> weekend. You are on 
> 
> > an honor system not to fly it or use a sim (I suspect 
> some people do) 
> 
> > and the first flight of day 2 is the unknown. I 
> believe it can not be a 
> 
> > dropped round. Basic class flies their usual sequence 
> no unknown. It 
> 
> > adds a bit of excitement to the 2nd day of the 
> contest. You have to be 
> 
> > able to do a bunch of maneuvers not in this years 
> sequence but 
> 
> > appropriate for the class. So practice time might be 
> more than 6 
> 
> > identical flights of your current sequence. And most 
> importantly it may 
> 
> > provide for some separation for the top fliers in each 
> class. I had a 
> 
> > lot of fun discussing the sequences with my friends 
> that were there, and 
> 
> > watching and listening to them after flying it. Hard 
> to fly a sequence 
> 
> > for the first time without making a significant 
> error. 
> 
> > 
> 
> > Stuart 
> 
> > 
> 
> > _______________________________________________ 
> 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> 
> > 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Insert 
> movie times and more without leaving Hotmail?. See how. 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


?? ? ? 
_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Tue Sep 22 06:30:30 2009
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 14:30:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 2 Meter Planes Available in Fall 2009
In-Reply-To: <346DB91CA6494FFBA2EF437C826BCC16@toshibauser>
References: <346DB91CA6494FFBA2EF437C826BCC16@toshibauser>
Message-ID: <405494.41942.qm@web82106.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Whoa!!

Ron, are you actually going to be flyin electric next year? Wow, and you are one of the few I saw that didn't lose a round to a deadstick this year :o)

Choosing a new pattern plane is exciting, have fun with it. 

Anthony

________________________________
From: Ron Hansen <rcpilot at wowway.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 6:51:52 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 2 Meter Planes Available in Fall 2009


I?m looking to buy a composite 2M plane this fall (electric).
?
In the absence of a Buyers Guide I need help locating all of the designs available for sale this fall.
?
Please send me links to planes that will be for sale this fall both in the USand abroad.
?
Thanks Ron.
-------------- next part --------------
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From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Tue Sep 22 06:30:31 2009
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 14:30:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <1057451466.4138151253629274632.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <7naet7$1ibgp6@dmzms99901.na.baesystems.com>

Vicente  - good points too ?the rolling circle is tough and this particular maneuver also discourages some folks from moving up.  Like you said, there are many similarities too.  The hardest thing about flying IMAC and pattern is going from a lot of IMAC practice, to flying the smaller pattern plane again.  IMAC in the South East anyway, is strongly encouraging to fly the 40% planes as close to the runway as possible ? well inside 150 meters to put a number on it.  So, going from flying a huge plane close, to a smaller plane ?far? away, is very uncomfortable for me.  It takes like 10-20 flights to feel ?ahead? of the pattern plane again if say, you dedicated 6 weeks to IMAC flying then switched back to pattern.  However, going from the pattern plane to IMAC plane is cake ? you are ready for competition in 3 flights.
Jim



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Vicente "Vince" Bortone
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 10:21 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns


I fly IMAC Intermediate class since many years ago.  Probably 1-2 contest per year because contest is too far from KC.  Jim is very close in his description.  However, I found that if you fly with the same goals we fly in pattern you will have very high chance to win in IMAC.  The rules are very close (read the snap roll and you will be surprised how close is to pattern AMA and F3A, IMAC and IAC).  I think the Sportsman?s IMAC pilots get stuck in that class because they have to fly partial rollers in Intermediate IMAC without learning to do slow roll first.  Looks like IMAC don't want to do slow roll because is a pattern maneuver.  If you check the IAC maneuvers you will find that they have slow roll.  In conclusion, I believe we have very close goals but we are always looking for ways to find differences when really there is not a huge difference after we read the rulebooks.



By the way, I am using soft mount in my YAK (DA 100 with canisters and 3 lade prop).  One time I got to a contest and started the engine to get ready.  A couple of pilots in the other side of the field came to ask me if my motor was electric.  IMAC guys do not use soft mounts just because pattern guys use soft mounts.  It is similar to the elimination of center manuevers to the judges.  The excuse to eliminate center manuevers was because IMAC goal is to reduce the footprint.  However, I don't understand how you reduce the footprint without doing the center manuever in the center.  Go and figure.

Vicente "Vince" Bortone



----- Original Message -----
From: "mike mueller" <mups1953 at yahoo.com>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:57:05 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

 Wow Jim that is the best explaination of the difference I've ever seen. Thanks for that post I will save it and use it again.
 I'd love to try IMAC someday but it's a time and resource problem to do so at this point. We have a number of IMAC guys at my field and I like them all. I find we have a lot in common but your right about the differences too. Thanks, Mike Mueller

--- On Tue, 9/22/09, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote:

> From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Tuesday, September 22, 2009, 8:46 AM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Unknowns in pattern?  IMAC
> versus pattern?
>
>
>
> I?ve flown a bunch of
> IMAC over the last 4 years.
> IMAC and Pattern answer two different questions, and each
> group has DISTINCTLY different
> personalities.  At the end of a pattern contest, you
> will see who flew the
> sequences the best (usually the best pilot).  At the
> end of an IMAC
> contest, you will get closer to seeing who the best pilot
> is in that
> class.  There are pros and cons for each, each fitting
> the personalities
> of the groups.
>
>
>
> Pattern:  Is about
> learning the fundamentals of precision
> flight. Group is not too excited about changing sequences
> too often, especially
> for the lower classes.  It is a pattern-truth that the
> lower classes are
> designed to build piloting skill and teach precision
> aerobatics fundamentals
> (wings level and such).  This group recognizes that
> guys don?t get
> to fly every day, and the goal is ?fly your sequence
> the best you can.?
> Lower classes are not considered ?destination?
> classes.
> Pattern guys almost 100% of the time can get into Advanced
> and Masters, with
> F3A being hit or miss.  Pattern guys believe it is
> ?fair? that
> the competition is only the  ?known?
> sequences because this
> levels the playing field ? anyone can compete because
> we know what is
> going to be flown ahead of time, and the tier-2 kind of
> pilot has a competitive
> chance against tier-1 pilot, per se?.
>  Pattern guys want to
> know what the rules are, and then build a plane within the
> rules and maximize
> what they can.  Pattern guys are open, and keep all
> contests open to
> whoever can make it.
>
>
>
> IMAC:  almost 100%
> opposite to the pattern
> personality.  Guys don?t like rules!  Do
> not want rules applied
> to planes (? no support for even adequate mufflers or
> tuned
> pipes/silencers). Not willing to ?describe?
> airspace or where
> maneuvers are flown (read ACS definition if like and let us
> know what the criteria
> is).  IMAC does not encourage moving up in the way the
> culture of pattern
> does ? plenty of guys in IMAC will fly Basic or
> Sportsman for many
> years.  Intermediate is realistically the destination
> class.  Few
> make it into Advanced, and less into Unlimited.  IMAC
> guys want to fly new
> sequences every year, and this sort of offsets the
> motivation for moving
> up.  IMAC guys have some affinity for
> ?freestyle? and
> undisciplined flying ? they like that you don?t
> have to practice
> the know sequence all the time.  All you need to do is
> keep ?close?
> in the knowns, and score a high unknown round and you can
> win the contest due
> to the higher weighting the unknown round carries.
> IMAC guys don?t
> really focus on getting better geometry out of
> maneuvers  - as hitting
> snap rolls will make or break you IMAC score.  Using
> the 0.5/point per 5
> degree rule, ?snap-rolls? are in fact the whole
> secret to scoring
> IMAC patterns well ? it is a maneuver within a
> maneuver and you need to
> learn how your plane snaps at low speed, high speed,
> power-on, and
> power-off.  If you can?t hit a snap roll exit,
> don?t even
> think about getting into Advanced or Unlimited.  This
> group likes ?exclusivity?
> or ?invitational? events, and this also makes
> its way into the
> regional championships.
>
>
>
> So ? there are totally
> different personalities at work for
> both organizations.  I like flying unknowns, but I
> don?t think it is
> a good mix for precision aerobatics events.
>  Guys moved from F3A into
> Masters to get away from the two known sequences, so I
> don?t think
> unknowns for the AMA classes really fits into the culture,
> or our goals of ?precision?
> aerobatics.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On
> Behalf Of Anthony
> Romano
>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:50 AM
>
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Stu,
>
>  Did you happen to find out how they deal with the
> scoring? If it is
> national and everyone is using the same program maybe
> an update could be
> available for the CD to download prior to the event?
>
>  One thing I noticed was a lot of judges
> with the aresti in one
> hand and score sheet in the other while judging. Lots of
> looking away during
> the flight. I looked over a few shoulder and would have put
> down some similar
> numbers.
>
>
>
> Anthony
>
>
>
> > Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:42:06 -0400
>
> > From: schale at optonline.net
>
> > To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> >
>
> > OK don't kick me off the list but I flew an IMAC
> contest last weekend.
>
> > (yes in Basic with a pattern plane :) )
>
> > Has any thought been given to flying unknowns as the
> IMAC guys do? If
>
> > you are not familiar with it, on a 2 day contest the
> unknown is handed
>
> > out after flying is done on the first day. The unknown
> is appropriate
>
> > for your class and is the same nationwide for that
> weekend. You are on
>
> > an honor system not to fly it or use a sim (I suspect
> some people do)
>
> > and the first flight of day 2 is the unknown. I
> believe it can not be a
>
> > dropped round. Basic class flies their usual sequence
> no unknown. It
>
> > adds a bit of excitement to the 2nd day of the
> contest. You have to be
>
> > able to do a bunch of maneuvers not in this years
> sequence but
>
> > appropriate for the class. So practice time might be
> more than 6
>
> > identical flights of your current sequence. And most
> importantly it may
>
> > provide for some separation for the top fliers in each
> class. I had a
>
> > lot of fun discussing the sequences with my friends
> that were there, and
>
> > watching and listening to them after flying it. Hard
> to fly a sequence
>
> > for the first time without making a significant
> error.
>
> >
>
> > Stuart
>
> >
>
> > _______________________________________________
>
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>
> >
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Insert
> movie times and more without leaving Hotmail?. See how.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep 22 06:45:08 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 14:45:08 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <1323422894.4146611253630375833.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <490551371.4150331253630708071.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>



3-4 years?I was flying a QQ-YAK with OS 160 against other 7-8 pilots using 35-40% planes.? This was Sportsman class.? I never though that I could win using this plane.? Well, I finishing winning all rounds including the unknowns . I didn't fly close and small.? I was doing the center maneuvers in the center trying to use less?space.? As you know, there is very strong competition in the Sportsman class.? Probably the IMAC pilots in this region are?following the rulebook closer than the Southeast region.? ? 


Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jim Woodward (US SSA)" < jim . woodward @ baesystems .com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:30:05 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 




Vicente ?- good points too ?the rolling circle is tough and this particular maneuver also discourages some folks from moving up.? Like you said, there are many similarities too.? The hardest thing about flying IMAC and pattern is going from a lot of IMAC practice, to flying the smaller pattern plane again.? IMAC in the South East anyway, is strongly encouraging to fly the 40% planes as close to the runway as possible ? well inside 150 meters to put a number on it. ?So, going from flying a huge plane close, to a smaller plane ?far? away, is very uncomfortable for me.? It takes like 10-20 flights to feel ?ahead? of the pattern plane again if say, you dedicated 6 weeks to IMAC flying then switched back to pattern.? However, going from the pattern plane to IMAC plane is cake ? you are ready for competition in 3 flights. 

Jim 










From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org [mailto: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 10:21 AM 
To: General pattern discussion 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 




I fly IMAC Intermediate class since many years ago.? Probably 1-2 contest per year because contest is too far from KC.? Jim is very close in his description.? However, I found that if you fly with the same goals we fly in pattern you will have very high chance to win in IMAC .? The rules are very close (read the snap roll and you will be surprised?how?close is to?pattern AMA and F3A, IMAC and IAC).? I think the Sportsman?s IMAC pilots get stuck in that class because they have to fly partial rollers in Intermediate IMAC without learning?to do slow roll first.? Looks like? IMAC don't want to do slow roll because is a pattern maneuver.? If you check the IAC maneuvers you will find that they have slow roll.? In conclusion, I believe?we have very close goals but we are?always looking for ways to find differences when really there is not a huge difference after we read the rulebooks.? 



By the way, I am using soft mount in my YAK (DA 100 with canisters and 3 lade prop).? One time I got to a contest and started the engine to get ready.? A couple of?pilots in the other side of the field came to ask me if my motor was electric.? IMAC guys do not use soft mounts just because pattern guys use soft mounts.? It is similar to the elimination of center manuevers to the judges.? The excuse to eliminate center manuevers was because IMAC goal is to reduce the footprint.? However, I don't understand how you reduce the footprint without doing the center manuever in the center.? Go and?figure.? ?? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "mike mueller" <mups1953 at yahoo.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:57:05 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

?Wow Jim that is the best explaination of the difference I've ever seen. Thanks for that post I will save it and use it again. 
?I'd love to try IMAC someday but it's a time and resource problem to do so at this point. We have a number of IMAC guys at my field and I like them all. I find we have a lot in common but your right about the differences too. Thanks, Mike Mueller 

--- On Tue, 9/22/09, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) < jim . woodward @ baesystems .com> wrote: 

> From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) < jim . woodward @ baesystems .com> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
> Date: Tuesday, September 22, 2009, 8:46 AM 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> Unknowns in pattern?? IMAC 
> versus pattern?? ? 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> I?ve flown a bunch of 
> IMAC over the last 4 years.? 
> IMAC and Pattern answer two different questions, and each 
> group has DISTINCTLY different 
> personalities.? At the end of a pattern contest, you 
> will see who flew the 
> sequences the best (usually the best pilot).? At the 
> end of an IMAC 
> contest, you will get closer to seeing who the best pilot 
> is in that 
> class.? There are pros and cons for each, each fitting 
> the personalities 
> of the groups. 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> Pattern:? Is about 
> learning the fundamentals of precision 
> flight. Group is not too excited about changing sequences 
> too often, especially 
> for the lower classes.? It is a pattern-truth that the 
> lower classes are 
> designed to build piloting skill and teach precision 
> aerobatics fundamentals 
> (wings level and such).? This group recognizes that 
> guys don?t get 
> to fly every day, and the goal is ?fly your sequence 
> the best you can.?? 
> Lower classes are not considered ?destination? 
> classes.? 
> Pattern guys almost 100% of the time can get into Advanced 
> and Masters, with 
> F3A being hit or miss.? Pattern guys believe it is 
> ?fair? that 
> the competition is only the ??known? 
> sequences because this 
> levels the playing field ? anyone can compete because 
> we know what is 
> going to be flown ahead of time, and the tier-2 kind of 
> pilot has a competitive 
> chance against tier-1 pilot, per se?.? 
> ?Pattern guys want to 
> know what the rules are, and then build a plane within the 
> rules and maximize 
> what they can.? Pattern guys are open, and keep all 
> contests open to 
> whoever can make it. 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> IMAC :? almost 100% 
> opposite to the pattern 
> personality.? Guys don?t like rules!? Do 
> not want rules applied 
> to planes (? no support for even adequate mufflers or 
> tuned 
> pipes/silencers). Not willing to ?describe? 
> airspace or where 
> maneuvers are flown (read ACS definition if like and let us 
> know what the criteria 
> is).? IMAC does not encourage moving up in the way the 
> culture of pattern 
> does ? plenty of guys in IMAC will fly Basic or 
> Sportsman for many 
> years.? Intermediate is realistically the destination 
> class.? Few 
> make it into Advanced, and less into Unlimited.? IMAC 
> guys want to fly new 
> sequences every year, and this sort of offsets the 
> motivation for moving 
> up.? IMAC guys have some affinity for 
> ?freestyle? and 
> undisciplined flying ? they like that you don?t 
> have to practice 
> the know sequence all the time.? All you need to do is 
> keep ?close? 
> in the knowns, and score a high unknown round and you can 
> win the contest due 
> to the higher weighting the unknown round carries.? 
> IMAC guys don?t 
> really focus on getting better geometry out of 
> maneuvers? - as hitting 
> snap rolls will make or break you IMAC score.? Using 
> the 0.5/point per 5 
> degree rule, ?snap-rolls? are in fact the whole 
> secret to scoring 
> IMAC patterns well ? it is a maneuver within a 
> maneuver and you need to 
> learn how your plane snaps at low speed, high speed, 
> power-on, and 
> power-off.? If you can?t hit a snap roll exit, 
> don?t even 
> think about getting into Advanced or Unlimited.? This 
> group likes ?exclusivity? 
> or ?invitational? events, and this also makes 
> its way into the 
> regional championships.? ? 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> So ? there are totally 
> different personalities at work for 
> both organizations.? I like flying unknowns, but I 
> don?t think it is 
> a good mix for precision aerobatics events.? 
> ?Guys moved from F3A into 
> Masters to get away from the two known sequences, so I 
> don?t think 
> unknowns for the AMA classes really fits into the culture, 
> or our goals of ?precision? 
> aerobatics. 
> 
> Thanks, 
> 
> Jim 
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: 
> nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org 
> [mailto: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On 
> Behalf Of Anthony 
> Romano 
> 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:50 AM 
> 
> To: nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> Hi?Stu, 
> 
> ?Did you happen to find out how they deal with the 
> scoring? If it is 
> national and?everyone is using the same program maybe 
> an update could be 
> available for the?CD to download prior to the event? 
> 
> ?One thing I noticed?was?a lot of judges 
> with the aresti in one 
> hand and score sheet in the other while judging. Lots of 
> looking away during 
> the flight. I looked over a few shoulder and would have put 
> down some similar 
> numbers. 
> 
> ? 
> 
> Anthony 
> 
> ? 
> 
> > Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:42:06 -0400 
> 
> > From: schale at optonline.net 
> 
> > To: nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
> 
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> 
> > 
> 
> > OK don't kick me off the list but I flew an IMAC 
> contest last weekend. 
> 
> > (yes in Basic with a pattern plane :) ) 
> 
> > Has any thought been given to flying unknowns as the 
> IMAC guys do? If 
> 
> > you are not familiar with it, on a 2 day contest the 
> unknown is handed 
> 
> > out after flying is done on the first day. The unknown 
> is appropriate 
> 
> > for your class and is the same nationwide for that 
> weekend. You are on 
> 
> > an honor system not to fly it or use a sim (I suspect 
> some people do) 
> 
> > and the first flight of day 2 is the unknown. I 
> believe it can not be a 
> 
> > dropped round. Basic class flies their usual sequence 
> no unknown. It 
> 
> > adds a bit of excitement to the 2nd day of the 
> contest. You have to be 
> 
> > able to do a bunch of maneuvers not in this years 
> sequence but 
> 
> > appropriate for the class. So practice time might be 
> more than 6 
> 
> > identical flights of your current sequence. And most 
> importantly it may 
> 
> > provide for some separation for the top fliers in each 
> class. I had a 
> 
> > lot of fun discussing the sequences with my friends 
> that were there, and 
> 
> > watching and listening to them after flying it. Hard 
> to fly a sequence 
> 
> > for the first time without making a significant 
> error. 
> 
> > 
> 
> > Stuart 
> 
> > 
> 
> > _______________________________________________ 
> 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
> 
> > 
> http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Insert 
> movie times and more without leaving Hotmail?. See how. 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
> http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 


?? ? ? 
_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 
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From schale at optonline.net  Tue Sep 22 07:18:07 2009
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 15:18:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <1057451466.4138151253629274632.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <1057451466.4138151253629274632.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <4AB8EA58.5070801@optonline.net>

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From schale at optonline.net  Tue Sep 22 07:36:58 2009
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 15:36:58 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <1057451466.4138151253629274632.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <1057451466.4138151253629274632.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <4AB8EEC1.6070704@optonline.net>

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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep 22 07:37:54 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 15:37:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <2013444194.4176361253633827602.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1263356613.4176751253633873575.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>



Stuart, 



Yes, I agree that unknowns might add an interesting twist to pattern.??Probably for Advanced and Masters would be very interesting.? In this way, we have more to do when waiting for the sun to move out.? 



I also agree to all your comments below.? In conclusion, if you fly IMAC using the same principles we use to fly pattern you will have very high chances to do well.? Clearly, you did.? 



In regard sound, that is becoming a huge issue.??I believe that there is a group that is suggesting to do sound test as prescribed in the rulebook in all contests. 



Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate class.? As we know, there is not way to do?rollers by rolling fast.? IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's class.? I am not sure why?since IAC includes the?slow roll. 



We arrive to the same conclusion.??We had fun.? ??? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Stuart Chale " < schale @ optonline .net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 10:16:40 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

I didn't mean for this to be an IMAC vs pattern discussion.? Guess it was inevitable.? I brought it up because I though unknowns might add an interesting twist to a pattern contest. 

My thoughts on IMAC vs Pattern.? Yes IMAC places a lot of emphasis on spins and snaps.? I lost a lot of points due to my spin entries (some forced to spin on center) 
Sound score too subjective. 
ACS score not well described, also subjective.? On the other hand I practiced the basic IMAC pattern in a pattern box and flew it like that at the contest.? Generally flying a bit further out than the IMAC guys, using both ends of "my" box and trying to center all of the center maneuvers.? I scored 17 10's 2 8's and 1 9 on the ACS scores.? Looking at several other scores in all classes (all scores are posted on the IMAC site for every contest)? showed me that they liked it.? Most other pilots did not score as high in the ACS scores.? 
Lack of centering or positioning.? I don't understand it at all.? A center maneuver should be centered for the highest score.? I suspect putting my center maneuvers on center helped the ACS score however.? Many pilots performed maneuvers too close to the flight line and geometry could not be seen.? I am not sure what is taught in the judging schools about this. 
Some maneuvers do allow different radii in some places many do not.? minor point.? Most of the rest of the geometry is very similar, 45 degree lines are strictly grades, placing rolls center of lines, wing overs, are clearly downgraded, pendulum swings on stall turns etc. 
No slow rolls :(, integrated rolls in loops do not have an angular or rolling speed requirement just need to be centered, also :( 
Classes are more bottom heavy.?? Sequences in advanced and unlimited are down right hard.? The advanced sequence is harder than out Masters sequence.? 
Rolling circles or part of circles are introduced in the intermediate class I believe (3rd class or 5) 

Is it different? Yes, Do I agree with everything the way they do it? No, Was it interesting having a 2 meter plane be dwarfed by over 20 other planes at the field? Yes,? Did I have fun?? Absolutely 

Stuart C. 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote: 




I fly IMAC Intermediate class since many years ago.? Probably 1-2 contest per year because contest is too far from KC.? Jim is very close in his description.? However, I found that if you fly with the same goals we fly in pattern you will have very high chance to win in IMAC .? The rules are very close (read the snap roll and you will be surprised?how?close is to?pattern AMA and F3A, IMAC and IAC ).? I think the Sportsman?s IMAC pilots get stuck in that class because they have to fly partial rollers in Intermediate IMAC without learning?to do slow roll first.? Looks like? IMAC don't want to do slow roll because is a pattern maneuver.? If you check the IAC maneuvers you will find that they have slow roll.? In conclusion, I believe?we have very close goals but we are?always looking for ways to find differences when really there is not a huge difference after we read the rulebooks.? 



By the way, I am using soft mount in my YAK (DA 100 with canisters and 3 lade prop).? One time I got to a contest and started the engine to get ready.? A couple of?pilots in the other side of the field came to ask me if my motor was electric.? IMAC guys do not use soft mounts just because pattern guys use soft mounts.? It is similar to the elimination of center manuevers to the judges.? The excuse to eliminate center manuevers was because IMAC goal is to reduce the footprint.? However, I don't understand how you reduce the footprint without doing the center manuever in the center.? Go and?figure.? ?? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "mike mueller" <mups1953 at yahoo.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:57:05 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

?Wow Jim that is the best explaination of the difference I've ever seen. Thanks for that post I will save it and use it again. 
?I'd love to try IMAC someday but it's a time and resource problem to do so at this point. We have a number of IMAC guys at my field and I like them all. I find we have a lot in common but your right about the differences too. Thanks, Mike Mueller 

--- On Tue, 9/22/09, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote: 

> From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
> Date: Tuesday, September 22, 2009, 8:46 AM 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> Unknowns in pattern?? IMAC 
> versus pattern?? ? 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> I?ve flown a bunch of 
> IMAC over the last 4 years.? 
> IMAC and Pattern answer two different questions, and each 
> group has DISTINCTLY different 
> personalities.? At the end of a pattern contest, you 
> will see who flew the 
> sequences the best (usually the best pilot).? At the 
> end of an IMAC 
> contest, you will get closer to seeing who the best pilot 
> is in that 
> class.? There are pros and cons for each, each fitting 
> the personalities 
> of the groups. 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> Pattern:? Is about 
> learning the fundamentals of precision 
> flight. Group is not too excited about changing sequences 
> too often, especially 
> for the lower classes.? It is a pattern-truth that the 
> lower classes are 
> designed to build piloting skill and teach precision 
> aerobatics fundamentals 
> (wings level and such).? This group recognizes that 
> guys don?t get 
> to fly every day, and the goal is ?fly your sequence 
> the best you can.?? 
> Lower classes are not considered ?destination? 
> classes.? 
> Pattern guys almost 100% of the time can get into Advanced 
> and Masters, with 
> F3A being hit or miss.? Pattern guys believe it is 
> ?fair? that 
> the competition is only the ??known? 
> sequences because this 
> levels the playing field ? anyone can compete because 
> we know what is 
> going to be flown ahead of time, and the tier-2 kind of 
> pilot has a competitive 
> chance against tier-1 pilot, per se?.? 
> ?Pattern guys want to 
> know what the rules are, and then build a plane within the 
> rules and maximize 
> what they can.? Pattern guys are open, and keep all 
> contests open to 
> whoever can make it. 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> IMAC :? almost 100% 
> opposite to the pattern 
> personality.? Guys don?t like rules!? Do 
> not want rules applied 
> to planes (? no support for even adequate mufflers or 
> tuned 
> pipes/silencers). Not willing to ?describe? 
> airspace or where 
> maneuvers are flown (read ACS definition if like and let us 
> know what the criteria 
> is).? IMAC does not encourage moving up in the way the 
> culture of pattern 
> does ? plenty of guys in IMAC will fly Basic or 
> Sportsman for many 
> years.? Intermediate is realistically the destination 
> class.? Few 
> make it into Advanced, and less into Unlimited.? IMAC 
> guys want to fly new 
> sequences every year, and this sort of offsets the 
> motivation for moving 
> up.? IMAC guys have some affinity for 
> ?freestyle? and 
> undisciplined flying ? they like that you don?t 
> have to practice 
> the know sequence all the time.? All you need to do is 
> keep ?close? 
> in the knowns, and score a high unknown round and you can 
> win the contest due 
> to the higher weighting the unknown round carries.? 
> IMAC guys don?t 
> really focus on getting better geometry out of 
> maneuvers? - as hitting 
> snap rolls will make or break you IMAC score.? Using 
> the 0.5/point per 5 
> degree rule, ?snap-rolls? are in fact the whole 
> secret to scoring 
> IMAC patterns well ? it is a maneuver within a 
> maneuver and you need to 
> learn how your plane snaps at low speed, high speed, 
> power-on, and 
> power-off.? If you can?t hit a snap roll exit, 
> don?t even 
> think about getting into Advanced or Unlimited.? This 
> group likes ?exclusivity? 
> or ?invitational? events, and this also makes 
> its way into the 
> regional championships.? ? 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> So ? there are totally 
> different personalities at work for 
> both organizations.? I like flying unknowns, but I 
> don?t think it is 
> a good mix for precision aerobatics events.? 
> ?Guys moved from F3A into 
> Masters to get away from the two known sequences, so I 
> don?t think 
> unknowns for the AMA classes really fits into the culture, 
> or our goals of ?precision? 
> aerobatics. 
> 
> Thanks, 
> 
> Jim 
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: 
> nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org 
> [ mailto: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org ] On 
> Behalf Of Anthony 
> Romano 
> 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:50 AM 
> 
> To: nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> Hi?Stu, 
> 
> ?Did you happen to find out how they deal with the 
> scoring? If it is 
> national and?everyone is using the same program maybe 
> an update could be 
> available for the?CD to download prior to the event? 
> 
> ?One thing I noticed?was?a lot of judges 
> with the aresti in one 
> hand and score sheet in the other while judging. Lots of 
> looking away during 
> the flight. I looked over a few shoulder and would have put 
> down some similar 
> numbers. 
> 
> ? 
> 
> Anthony 
> 
> ? 
> 
> > Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:42:06 -0400 
> 
> > From: schale @ optonline .net 
> 
> > To: nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
> 
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> 
> > 
> 
> > OK don't kick me off the list but I flew an IMAC 
> contest last weekend. 
> 
> > (yes in Basic with a pattern plane :) ) 
> 
> > Has any thought been given to flying unknowns as the 
> IMAC guys do? If 
> 
> > you are not familiar with it, on a 2 day contest the 
> unknown is handed 
> 
> > out after flying is done on the first day. The unknown 
> is appropriate 
> 
> > for your class and is the same nationwide for that 
> weekend. You are on 
> 
> > an honor system not to fly it or use a sim (I suspect 
> some people do) 
> 
> > and the first flight of day 2 is the unknown. I 
> believe it can not be a 
> 
> > dropped round. Basic class flies their usual sequence 
> no unknown. It 
> 
> > adds a bit of excitement to the 2nd day of the 
> contest. You have to be 
> 
> > able to do a bunch of maneuvers not in this years 
> sequence but 
> 
> > appropriate for the class. So practice time might be 
> more than 6 
> 
> > identical flights of your current sequence. And most 
> importantly it may 
> 
> > provide for some separation for the top fliers in each 
> class. I had a 
> 
> > lot of fun discussing the sequences with my friends 
> that were there, and 
> 
> > watching and listening to them after flying it. Hard 
> to fly a sequence 
> 
> > for the first time without making a significant 
> error. 
> 
> > 
> 
> > Stuart 
> 
> > 
> 
> > _______________________________________________ 
> 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
> 
> > 
> http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Insert 
> movie times and more without leaving Hotmail?. See how. 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
> http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 


?? ? ? 
_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion
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From seefo at san.rr.com  Tue Sep 22 07:44:30 2009
From: seefo at san.rr.com (Doug Cronkhite)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 15:44:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <1263356613.4176751253633873575.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <1263356613.4176751253633873575.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <4AB8F0C6.6050005@san.rr.com>

Vince,

The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll. The IAC 
Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to differentiate it 
from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never 
flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.

-Doug



>  
>
> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate 
> class.  As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.  
> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's class.  I am 
> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
>
>  
>


From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep 22 07:51:39 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 15:51:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <4AB8EEC1.6070704@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <670632260.4184101253634697875.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>



Well, I have been flying mine with zero?problems.? Around 500-600 flights in 4 years.? Never had a single issue.? I am using Hyde mount.? The DA?is one of the best motors I have?in around 40?years in the hobby.? My plane uses around 200 mah per flight when hard mounted motors uses almost double (two round of 10 maneuvers each).? I am using two LiPos ?with?1,100 mah in this plane.? Without soft mount?it will be practically impossible to get the results I am getting.? Sound test shows?around 90db using 3 blade prop.? This is the only evidence I have now.? I know that many in Europe are?using different types of soft mounts in gasoline engines.? I really don't see where is the problem.? ? 



There is another pilot flying a DA170 in my club that got convinced after the results I got.? He is also using soft mount.?? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Stuart Chale " < schale @ optonline .net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 10:35:29 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

Almost forgot.? I have been told by a local DA user that DA does not recommend soft mounting for their motors. 
Stuart 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote: 




I fly IMAC Intermediate class since many years ago.? Probably 1-2 contest per year because contest is too far from KC.? Jim is very close in his description.? However, I found that if you fly with the same goals we fly in pattern you will have very high chance to win in IMAC .? The rules are very close (read the snap roll and you will be surprised?how?close is to?pattern AMA and F3A, IMAC and IAC ).? I think the Sportsman?s IMAC pilots get stuck in that class because they have to fly partial rollers in Intermediate IMAC without learning?to do slow roll first.? Looks like? IMAC don't want to do slow roll because is a pattern maneuver.? If you check the IAC maneuvers you will find that they have slow roll.? In conclusion, I believe?we have very close goals but we are?always looking for ways to find differences when really there is not a huge difference after we read the rulebooks.? 



By the way, I am using soft mount in my YAK (DA 100 with canisters and 3 lade prop).? One time I got to a contest and started the engine to get ready.? A couple of?pilots in the other side of the field came to ask me if my motor was electric.? IMAC guys do not use soft mounts just because pattern guys use soft mounts.? It is similar to the elimination of center manuevers to the judges.? The excuse to eliminate center manuevers was because IMAC goal is to reduce the footprint.? However, I don't understand how you reduce the footprint without doing the center manuever in the center.? Go and?figure.? ?? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "mike mueller" <mups1953 at yahoo.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:57:05 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

?Wow Jim that is the best explaination of the difference I've ever seen. Thanks for that post I will save it and use it again. 
?I'd love to try IMAC someday but it's a time and resource problem to do so at this point. We have a number of IMAC guys at my field and I like them all. I find we have a lot in common but your right about the differences too. Thanks, Mike Mueller 

--- On Tue, 9/22/09, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote: 

> From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
> Date: Tuesday, September 22, 2009, 8:46 AM 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> Unknowns in pattern?? IMAC 
> versus pattern?? ? 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> I?ve flown a bunch of 
> IMAC over the last 4 years.? 
> IMAC and Pattern answer two different questions, and each 
> group has DISTINCTLY different 
> personalities.? At the end of a pattern contest, you 
> will see who flew the 
> sequences the best (usually the best pilot).? At the 
> end of an IMAC 
> contest, you will get closer to seeing who the best pilot 
> is in that 
> class.? There are pros and cons for each, each fitting 
> the personalities 
> of the groups. 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> Pattern:? Is about 
> learning the fundamentals of precision 
> flight. Group is not too excited about changing sequences 
> too often, especially 
> for the lower classes.? It is a pattern-truth that the 
> lower classes are 
> designed to build piloting skill and teach precision 
> aerobatics fundamentals 
> (wings level and such).? This group recognizes that 
> guys don?t get 
> to fly every day, and the goal is ?fly your sequence 
> the best you can.?? 
> Lower classes are not considered ?destination? 
> classes.? 
> Pattern guys almost 100% of the time can get into Advanced 
> and Masters, with 
> F3A being hit or miss.? Pattern guys believe it is 
> ?fair? that 
> the competition is only the ??known? 
> sequences because this 
> levels the playing field ? anyone can compete because 
> we know what is 
> going to be flown ahead of time, and the tier-2 kind of 
> pilot has a competitive 
> chance against tier-1 pilot, per se?.? 
> ?Pattern guys want to 
> know what the rules are, and then build a plane within the 
> rules and maximize 
> what they can.? Pattern guys are open, and keep all 
> contests open to 
> whoever can make it. 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> IMAC :? almost 100% 
> opposite to the pattern 
> personality.? Guys don?t like rules!? Do 
> not want rules applied 
> to planes (? no support for even adequate mufflers or 
> tuned 
> pipes/silencers). Not willing to ?describe? 
> airspace or where 
> maneuvers are flown (read ACS definition if like and let us 
> know what the criteria 
> is).? IMAC does not encourage moving up in the way the 
> culture of pattern 
> does ? plenty of guys in IMAC will fly Basic or 
> Sportsman for many 
> years.? Intermediate is realistically the destination 
> class.? Few 
> make it into Advanced, and less into Unlimited.? IMAC 
> guys want to fly new 
> sequences every year, and this sort of offsets the 
> motivation for moving 
> up.? IMAC guys have some affinity for 
> ?freestyle? and 
> undisciplined flying ? they like that you don?t 
> have to practice 
> the know sequence all the time.? All you need to do is 
> keep ?close? 
> in the knowns, and score a high unknown round and you can 
> win the contest due 
> to the higher weighting the unknown round carries.? 
> IMAC guys don?t 
> really focus on getting better geometry out of 
> maneuvers? - as hitting 
> snap rolls will make or break you IMAC score.? Using 
> the 0.5/point per 5 
> degree rule, ?snap-rolls? are in fact the whole 
> secret to scoring 
> IMAC patterns well ? it is a maneuver within a 
> maneuver and you need to 
> learn how your plane snaps at low speed, high speed, 
> power-on, and 
> power-off.? If you can?t hit a snap roll exit, 
> don?t even 
> think about getting into Advanced or Unlimited.? This 
> group likes ?exclusivity? 
> or ?invitational? events, and this also makes 
> its way into the 
> regional championships.? ? 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> So ? there are totally 
> different personalities at work for 
> both organizations.? I like flying unknowns, but I 
> don?t think it is 
> a good mix for precision aerobatics events.? 
> ?Guys moved from F3A into 
> Masters to get away from the two known sequences, so I 
> don?t think 
> unknowns for the AMA classes really fits into the culture, 
> or our goals of ?precision? 
> aerobatics. 
> 
> Thanks, 
> 
> Jim 
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: 
> nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org 
> [ mailto: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org ] On 
> Behalf Of Anthony 
> Romano 
> 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:50 AM 
> 
> To: nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> Hi?Stu, 
> 
> ?Did you happen to find out how they deal with the 
> scoring? If it is 
> national and?everyone is using the same program maybe 
> an update could be 
> available for the?CD to download prior to the event? 
> 
> ?One thing I noticed?was?a lot of judges 
> with the aresti in one 
> hand and score sheet in the other while judging. Lots of 
> looking away during 
> the flight. I looked over a few shoulder and would have put 
> down some similar 
> numbers. 
> 
> ? 
> 
> Anthony 
> 
> ? 
> 
> > Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:42:06 -0400 
> 
> > From: schale @ optonline .net 
> 
> > To: nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
> 
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> 
> > 
> 
> > OK don't kick me off the list but I flew an IMAC 
> contest last weekend. 
> 
> > (yes in Basic with a pattern plane :) ) 
> 
> > Has any thought been given to flying unknowns as the 
> IMAC guys do? If 
> 
> > you are not familiar with it, on a 2 day contest the 
> unknown is handed 
> 
> > out after flying is done on the first day. The unknown 
> is appropriate 
> 
> > for your class and is the same nationwide for that 
> weekend. You are on 
> 
> > an honor system not to fly it or use a sim (I suspect 
> some people do) 
> 
> > and the first flight of day 2 is the unknown. I 
> believe it can not be a 
> 
> > dropped round. Basic class flies their usual sequence 
> no unknown. It 
> 
> > adds a bit of excitement to the 2nd day of the 
> contest. You have to be 
> 
> > able to do a bunch of maneuvers not in this years 
> sequence but 
> 
> > appropriate for the class. So practice time might be 
> more than 6 
> 
> > identical flights of your current sequence. And most 
> importantly it may 
> 
> > provide for some separation for the top fliers in each 
> class. I had a 
> 
> > lot of fun discussing the sequences with my friends 
> that were there, and 
> 
> > watching and listening to them after flying it. Hard 
> to fly a sequence 
> 
> > for the first time without making a significant 
> error. 
> 
> > 
> 
> > Stuart 
> 
> > 
> 
> > _______________________________________________ 
> 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
> 
> > 
> http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Insert 
> movie times and more without leaving Hotmail?. See how. 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
> http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 


?? ? ? 
_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion
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From jpavlick at idseng.com  Tue Sep 22 07:57:15 2009
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 15:57:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <4AB8EEC1.6070704@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <648038.42239.qm@web80506.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Why is that? Because it may reduce bearing life-span?
?
John Pavlick

--- On Tue, 9/22/09, Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net> wrote:


From: Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 22, 2009, 11:35 AM


Almost forgot.? I have been told by a local DA user that DA does not recommend soft mounting for their motors.
Stuart

Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote: 

#yiv1491826773 p {margin:0;}


I fly IMAC Intermediate class since many years ago.? Probably 1-2 contest per year because contest is too far from KC.? Jim is very close in his description.? However, I found that if you fly with the same goals we fly in pattern you will have very high chance to win in IMAC.? The rules are very close (read the snap roll and you will be surprised?how?close is to?pattern AMA and F3A, IMAC and IAC).? I think the Sportsman?s IMAC pilots get stuck in that class because they have to fly partial rollers in Intermediate IMAC without learning?to do slow roll first.? Looks like?IMAC don't want to do slow roll because is a pattern maneuver.? If you check the IAC maneuvers you will find that they have slow roll.? In conclusion, I believe?we have very close goals but we are?always looking for ways to find differences when really there is not a huge difference after we read the rulebooks.?
?
By the way, I am using soft mount in my YAK (DA 100 with canisters and 3 lade prop).? One time I got to a contest and started the engine to get ready.? A couple of?pilots in the other side of the field came to ask me if my motor was electric.? IMAC guys do not use soft mounts just because pattern guys use soft mounts.? It is similar to the elimination of center manuevers to the judges.? The excuse to eliminate center manuevers was because IMAC goal is to reduce the footprint.? However, I don't understand how you reduce the footprint without doing the center manuever in the center.? Go and?figure.? ?? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone
?
----- Original Message -----
From: "mike mueller" <mups1953 at yahoo.com>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:57:05 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

?Wow Jim that is the best explaination of the difference I've ever seen. Thanks for that post I will save it and use it again.
?I'd love to try IMAC someday but it's a time and resource problem to do so at this point. We have a number of IMAC guys at my field and I like them all. I find we have a lot in common but your right about the differences too. Thanks, Mike Mueller

--- On Tue, 9/22/09, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote:

> From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Tuesday, September 22, 2009, 8:46 AM
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> 
> 
> 
> Unknowns in pattern?? IMAC
> versus pattern?? ?
> 
> ?? 
> 
> I?ve flown a bunch of
> IMAC over the last 4 years.?
> IMAC and Pattern answer two different questions, and each
> group has DISTINCTLY different
> personalities.? At the end of a pattern contest, you
> will see who flew the
> sequences the best (usually the best pilot).? At the
> end of an IMAC
> contest, you will get closer to seeing who the best pilot
> is in that
> class.? There are pros and cons for each, each fitting
> the personalities
> of the groups. 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> Pattern:? Is about
> learning the fundamentals of precision
> flight. Group is not too excited about changing sequences
> too often, especially
> for the lower classes.? It is a pattern-truth that the
> lower classes are
> designed to build piloting skill and teach precision
> aerobatics fundamentals
> (wings level and such).? This group recognizes that
> guys don?t get
> to fly every day, and the goal is ?fly your sequence
> the best you can.??
> Lower classes are not considered ?destination?
> classes.?
> Pattern guys almost 100% of the time can get into Advanced
> and Masters, with
> F3A being hit or miss.? Pattern guys believe it is
> ?fair? that
> the competition is only the ??known?
> sequences because this
> levels the playing field ? anyone can compete because
> we know what is
> going to be flown ahead of time, and the tier-2 kind of
> pilot has a competitive
> chance against tier-1 pilot, per se?.?
> ?Pattern guys want to
> know what the rules are, and then build a plane within the
> rules and maximize
> what they can.? Pattern guys are open, and keep all
> contests open to
> whoever can make it. 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> IMAC:? almost 100%
> opposite to the pattern
> personality.? Guys don?t like rules!? Do
> not want rules applied
> to planes (? no support for even adequate mufflers or
> tuned
> pipes/silencers). Not willing to ?describe?
> airspace or where
> maneuvers are flown (read ACS definition if like and let us
> know what the criteria
> is).? IMAC does not encourage moving up in the way the
> culture of pattern
> does ? plenty of guys in IMAC will fly Basic or
> Sportsman for many
> years.? Intermediate is realistically the destination
> class.? Few
> make it into Advanced, and less into Unlimited.? IMAC
> guys want to fly new
> sequences every year, and this sort of offsets the
> motivation for moving
> up.? IMAC guys have some affinity for
> ?freestyle? and
> undisciplined flying ? they like that you don?t
> have to practice
> the know sequence all the time.? All you need to do is
> keep ?close?
> in the knowns, and score a high unknown round and you can
> win the contest due
> to the higher weighting the unknown round carries.?
> IMAC guys don?t
> really focus on getting better geometry out of
> maneuvers? - as hitting
> snap rolls will make or break you IMAC score.? Using
> the 0.5/point per 5
> degree rule, ?snap-rolls? are in fact the whole
> secret to scoring
> IMAC patterns well ? it is a maneuver within a
> maneuver and you need to
> learn how your plane snaps at low speed, high speed,
> power-on, and
> power-off.? If you can?t hit a snap roll exit,
> don?t even
> think about getting into Advanced or Unlimited.? This
> group likes ?exclusivity?
> or ?invitational? events, and this also makes
> its way into the
> regional championships.? ?
> 
> ?? 
> 
> So ? there are totally
> different personalities at work for
> both organizations.? I like flying unknowns, but I
> don?t think it is
> a good mix for precision aerobatics events.?
> ?Guys moved from F3A into
> Masters to get away from the two known sequences, so I
> don?t think
> unknowns for the AMA classes really fits into the culture,
> or our goals of ?precision?
> aerobatics. 
> 
> Thanks, 
> 
> Jim 
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On
> Behalf Of Anthony
> Romano
> 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:50 AM
> 
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 
> 
> Hi?Stu,
> 
> ?Did you happen to find out how they deal with the
> scoring? If it is
> national and?everyone is using the same program maybe
> an update could be
> available for the?CD to download prior to the event?
> 
> ?One thing I noticed?was?a lot of judges
> with the aresti in one
> hand and score sheet in the other while judging. Lots of
> looking away during
> the flight. I looked over a few shoulder and would have put
> down some similar
> numbers.
> 
> ?
> 
> Anthony
> 
> ?
> 
> > Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:42:06 -0400
> 
> > From: schale at optonline.net
> 
> > To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> 
> > 
> 
> > OK don't kick me off the list but I flew an IMAC
> contest last weekend. 
> 
> > (yes in Basic with a pattern plane :) )
> 
> > Has any thought been given to flying unknowns as the
> IMAC guys do? If 
> 
> > you are not familiar with it, on a 2 day contest the
> unknown is handed 
> 
> > out after flying is done on the first day. The unknown
> is appropriate 
> 
> > for your class and is the same nationwide for that
> weekend. You are on 
> 
> > an honor system not to fly it or use a sim (I suspect
> some people do) 
> 
> > and the first flight of day 2 is the unknown. I
> believe it can not be a 
> 
> > dropped round. Basic class flies their usual sequence
> no unknown. It 
> 
> > adds a bit of excitement to the 2nd day of the
> contest. You have to be 
> 
> > able to do a bunch of maneuvers not in this years
> sequence but 
> 
> > appropriate for the class. So practice time might be
> more than 6 
> 
> > identical flights of your current sequence. And most
> importantly it may 
> 
> > provide for some separation for the top fliers in each
> class. I had a 
> 
> > lot of fun discussing the sequences with my friends
> that were there, and 
> 
> > watching and listening to them after flying it. Hard
> to fly a sequence 
> 
> > for the first time without making a significant
> error.
> 
> > 
> 
> > Stuart
> 
> > 
> 
> > _______________________________________________
> 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> >
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Insert
> movie times and more without leaving Hotmail?. See how. 
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


?? ? ?
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


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From getterflash at yahoo.com  Tue Sep 22 08:17:19 2009
From: getterflash at yahoo.com (Bob Kane)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 16:17:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <4AB8EA58.5070801@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <625009.8862.qm@web32702.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Early on I tried both IMAC and Precision Aerobatics. I got turned off of IMAC when at a contest I questioned why my scores were so low on a simple 1/2 reverse Cuban 8 turnaround. The response was my line was too steep. When I commented that the maneuver is defined as a 45 degree line, they replied "we don't do them that way".  


Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com





      

From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep 22 08:31:28 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 16:31:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <625009.8862.qm@web32702.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1731125613.4204501253637088280.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>



Bob, 



I fly IMAC with other three good friends.? Actually I am the only pattern pilot in the club.? Probably the main reason why I fly IMAC .??We practice together and comment on downgrades.? We really don't see many differences and I see judging in this region been very close to pattern.?? 



Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bob Kane" < getterflash @yahoo.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 11:17:17 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

Early on I tried both IMAC and Precision Aerobatics. I got turned off of IMAC when at a contest I questioned why my scores were so low on a simple 1/2 reverse Cuban 8 turnaround. The response was my line was too steep. When I commented that the maneuver is defined as a 45 degree line, they replied "we don't do them that way". ? 


Bob Kane 
getterflash @yahoo.com 





?? ? ? 
_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep 22 08:42:40 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 16:42:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <702974926.4210211253637678723.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <2083051087.4210971253637759637.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>




Doug, 



You are correct.? I just wanted to say that there is a maneuvers called slow roll that is not mention?in the? IMAC rule book.? I got the description from the IAC web site.? Here the description: 



Slow rolls have to be flown normally on a straight line (exception is the avalanche). The roll rate has to be constant and the longitudinal axis of the plane has to go straight. This requires constantly changing rudder and elevator control inputs throughout the roll. 



I wonder how this maneuver is judged.? Base on the description it is required to use rudder and elevator.? I?suspect that the judge has the authority to downgrade if the pilots is trying to avoid using rudder and elevator during the roll.??I really don't know how this is done in the real planes but I will guess that a?pilot will try to do slower?roll rate to get maximum points.? Again, I?could be wrong in my interpretation and?I am sure that you will know more details.? ??? 


Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Doug Cronkhite " < seefo @ san . rr .com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 10:44:06 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

Vince, 

The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll. The IAC 
Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to differentiate it 
from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never 
flown at anything but maximum roll rate available. 

-Doug 



> ? 
> 
> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate 
> class. ?As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast. ? 
> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's class. ?I am 
> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll. 
> 
> ? 
> 

_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Doug Cronkhite " < seefo @ san . rr .com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 10:44:06 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

Vince, 

The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll. The IAC 
Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to differentiate it 
from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never 
flown at anything but maximum roll rate available. 

-Doug 



> ? 
> 
> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate 
> class. ?As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast. ? 
> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's class. ?I am 
> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll. 
> 
> ? 
> 

_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
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From drmikedds at sbcglobal.net  Tue Sep 22 09:35:58 2009
From: drmikedds at sbcglobal.net (michael s harrison)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 17:35:58 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] North Dallas Contest
In-Reply-To: <879856.13766.qm@web80505.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <6DEA79E1AE1743BC827E9E99EFC7836E@EarlPC>
	<879856.13766.qm@web80505.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <000101ca3bab$14853100$3d8f9300$@net>

Ditto Here.  Great job guys and a great site.  

Many thanks for the many years you have done this.

 

Mike

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Richard Lewis
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:37 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] North Dallas Contest

 

Dave, Glen, and his whole crew did a great job.  The weather was fantastic.
It was very interesting to finally see the P-11 in a real competition
environment.

 

I was sad to see the low turnout for one of the best contests at one of the
best venues, run by some of the best guys in the district, especially in
Sportsman (0) and Intermediate (2).  I'm not reading any particualr meaing
into it.  We've had reasonably good numbers in the lower classes this year,
but it is a reminder that we need to be diligent in our efforts to bolster
our lower ranks and the thus solidify the future of our hobby.

 

Richard

 

  _____  

From: Earl Haury <ejhaury at comcast.net>
To: "Discussion List, NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 6:12:38 AM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] North Dallas Contest

A big thank-you to Dave Cotton, his "staff", and the North Dallas R/C club
for another excellent contest this past week end! 

 

Earl

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From jnhiller at earthlink.net  Tue Sep 22 10:13:51 2009
From: jnhiller at earthlink.net (J N Hiller)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 18:13:51 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <2083051087.4210971253637759637.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPOEPFEMAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>

This has been an informative discussion. I started trying to fly the Sportsman sequence yesterday. Maneuver #3 is an inside loop with a half roll over the top, exit inverted. This appears to be an integrated half roll through 90 degrees of arc. 
Am I reading this correctly? 
Is the maneuver flight detail spelled out somewhere that I could reference?
Thanks
Jim Hiller
 
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Vicente "Vince" Bortone
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:43 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
 
Doug,
 
You are correct.  I just wanted to say that there is a maneuvers called slow roll that is not mention in the IMAC rule book.  I got the description from the IAC web site.  Here the description:
 
Slow rolls have to be flown normally on a straight line (exception is the avalanche). The roll rate has to be constant and the longitudinal axis of the plane has to go straight. This requires constantly changing rudder and elevator control inputs throughout the roll. 
 
I wonder how this maneuver is judged.  Base on the description it is required to use rudder and elevator.  I suspect that the judge has the authority to downgrade if the pilots is trying to avoid using rudder and elevator during the roll.  I really don't know how this is done in the real planes but I will guess that a pilot will try to do slower roll rate to get maximum points.  Again, I could be wrong in my interpretation and I am sure that you will know more details.     

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Cronkhite" <seefo at san.rr.com>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 10:44:06 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

Vince,

The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll. The IAC 
Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to differentiate it 
from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never 
flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.

-Doug



>  
>
> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate 
> class.  As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.  
> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's class.  I am 
> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
>
>  
>

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Tue Sep 22 10:18:40 2009
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 18:18:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPOEPFEMAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <7naet7$1ifvhh@dmzms99901.na.baesystems.com>

Jim,

There is no description on when to start or end the ? roll.  However, if try to get to cute with it, and stop the roll rate, you will be subject to the 0.5 point per 5 degree rule for the remainder of the roll.  Most guys fly it as a medium roll rate across the top.
Jim W.



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of J N Hiller
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 2:12 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

This has been an informative discussion. I started trying to fly the Sportsman sequence yesterday. Maneuver #3 is an inside loop with a half roll over the top, exit inverted. This appears to be an integrated half roll through 90 degrees of arc.
Am I reading this correctly?
Is the maneuver flight detail spelled out somewhere that I could reference?
Thanks
Jim Hiller

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Vicente "Vince" Bortone
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:43 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns


Doug,



You are correct.  I just wanted to say that there is a maneuvers called slow roll that is not mention in the IMAC rule book.  I got the description from the IAC web site.  Here the description:



Slow rolls have to be flown normally on a straight line (exception is the avalanche). The roll rate has to be constant and the longitudinal axis of the plane has to go straight. This requires constantly changing rudder and elevator control inputs throughout the roll.



I wonder how this maneuver is judged.  Base on the description it is required to use rudder and elevator.  I suspect that the judge has the authority to downgrade if the pilots is trying to avoid using rudder and elevator during the roll.  I really don't know how this is done in the real planes but I will guess that a pilot will try to do slower roll rate to get maximum points.  Again, I could be wrong in my interpretation and I am sure that you will know more details.

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Cronkhite" <seefo at san.rr.com>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 10:44:06 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

Vince,

The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll. The IAC
Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to differentiate it
from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.

-Doug



>
>
> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
> class.  As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's class.  I am
> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
>
>
>

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From schale at optonline.net  Tue Sep 22 10:31:28 2009
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 18:31:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPOEPFEMAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>
References: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPOEPFEMAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <4AB91798.1060501@optonline.net>

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From ghwatson at comcast.net  Tue Sep 22 10:34:33 2009
From: ghwatson at comcast.net (Glen Watson)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 18:34:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] North Dallas Contest
In-Reply-To: <879856.13766.qm@web80505.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <6DEA79E1AE1743BC827E9E99EFC7836E@EarlPC>
	<879856.13766.qm@web80505.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <0ECDBEA079DD4B528D81D4AEE0CE65A8@telapoint.local>

Many thanks to the www.NDRCC.com <http://www.ndrcc.com/>  club folks for
hosting another great contest.  FAI flew P-11 which was fun to see and judge
for the first time.

 

As for the turnout I believe this year's event was impacted by the event
held in Tulsa the previous weekend.  I am all for having as many events
within an annual period in D6 as possible however it's up to us in D6 to be
sensitive to scheduling events that are close together in time and geography
that might have a negative impact to potential attendance of a single event.
Out of necessity a positive outcome to low attendance is having folks in
Intermediate and Advanced judge Masters and FAI.  In the long term this
benefits future contests by having a deeper resource pool of competent
judges to cover all classes.  A nice to have would be having who judged what
from year to year tracked so a CD or whomever at an event knows who is able
to judge when determining judge assignments at an event.

 

Glen Watson

D6

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Richard Lewis
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:37 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] North Dallas Contest

 

Dave, Glen, and his whole crew did a great job.  The weather was fantastic.
It was very interesting to finally see the P-11 in a real competition
environment.

 

I was sad to see the low turnout for one of the best contests at one of the
best venues, run by some of the best guys in the district, especially in
Sportsman (0) and Intermediate (2).  I'm not reading any particualr meaing
into it.  We've had reasonably good numbers in the lower classes this year,
but it is a reminder that we need to be diligent in our efforts to bolster
our lower ranks and the thus solidify the future of our hobby.

 

Richard

 

  _____  

From: Earl Haury <ejhaury at comcast.net>
To: "Discussion List, NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 6:12:38 AM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] North Dallas Contest

A big thank-you to Dave Cotton, his "staff", and the North Dallas R/C club
for another excellent contest this past week end! 

 

Earl

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From jnhiller at earthlink.net  Tue Sep 22 10:47:10 2009
From: jnhiller at earthlink.net (J N Hiller)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 18:47:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <4AB91798.1060501@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPAEPHEMAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>

Thanks guys that will make it a little easier. ?I will then assume that the slash marks through the loop only indicate centering the rolling element.
It looked nice through 90 degrees of ark with a very slow rate but I only got one out of maybe a dozen attempts that looked decent. 
Jim
 
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Stuart Chale
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 11:30 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
 
Another of the differences between IMAC and pattern.  No roll rate is specified and no arc is specified.  The requirements are that the roll be in the arc and be centered at the top so most pilots do a fairly quick roll across the top of the loop.
Stuart

J N Hiller wrote: 
This has been an informative discussion. I started trying to fly the Sportsman sequence yesterday. Maneuver #3 is an inside loop with a half roll over the top, exit inverted. This appears to be an integrated half roll through 90 degrees of arc. 
Am I reading this correctly? 
Is the maneuver flight detail spelled out somewhere that I could reference?
Thanks
Jim Hiller
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org <mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>  [ mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Vicente "Vince" Bortone
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:43 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
Doug,
 
You are correct.  I just wanted to say that there is a maneuvers called slow roll that is not mention in the IMAC rule book.  I got the description from the IAC web site.  Here the description:
 
Slow rolls have to be flown normally on a straight line (exception is the avalanche). The roll rate has to be constant and the longitudinal axis of the plane has to go straight. This requires constantly changing rudder and elevator control inputs throughout the roll. 
 
I wonder how this maneuver is judged.  Base on the description it is required to use rudder and elevator.  I suspect that the judge has the authority to downgrade if the pilots is trying to avoid using rudder and elevator during the roll.  I really don't know how this is done in the real planes but I will guess that a pilot will try to do slower roll rate to get maximum points.  Again, I could be wrong in my interpretation and I am sure that you will know more details.     

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Cronkhite" <seefo at san.rr.com> <mailto:seefo at san.rr.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 10:44:06 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

Vince,

The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll. The IAC 
Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to differentiate it 
from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never 
flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.

-Doug



>  
>
> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate 
> class.  As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.  
> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's class.  I am 
> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
>
>  
>

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org <mailto:NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
 



  _____  



 
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org <mailto:NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
? 
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From pcosky at comcast.net  Tue Sep 22 11:04:44 2009
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 19:04:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Black Magic v2.2 for sale
In-Reply-To: <002b01ca3401$59e5bb40$0db131c0$@net>
References: <01f501ca2f52$51d50860$f57f1920$@net>
	<002b01ca3401$59e5bb40$0db131c0$@net>
Message-ID: <01df01ca3bb7$a9c00c70$fd402550$@net>

I have a BM v2.2 that is in the bones, all it needs is covered.  I have two
sets of wings for it and the horizontal stab is set up for servos, but it
also had a DEPS retrofitted. Price will depend on what all you want with it
but if you take everything I have for it the price starts at $750 and will
go down from there if there are things you don't want or need. E-mail  me at
pcosky at comcast.net with any questions.

 

I will ship anywhere in the lower 48 at the buyers expense. The plane and
pictures are posted on RCU.

 

Pete

 

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From dkrev at shaw.ca  Tue Sep 22 11:13:13 2009
From: dkrev at shaw.ca (dkrev at shaw.ca)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 19:13:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <814i1h$4csr4m@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>
References: <COL123-W333F031996C09B0A16023EE2DC0@phx.gbl><814i1h$4csr4m@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <1870935301-1253646791-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-97053327-@bda515.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>

For discussion..... At the last two pattern events in BC, the FAI guys not only flew a round of F-09 but also a round of unknowns. They were picked by the pilots on Saturday night and flown the following day. The maneuvers were picked out of the FAI rule book and then printed up for all competitors and judges to peruse that evening. It was a lot of fun and everyone enjoyed it. The feedback was very positive and it will probably be done again next year.... Not sure though. We also had a D-7 member in Frank Capone fly it so he can maybe give you his own impressions of it.  The scoring was done by carrying forward the best 3 of 4 P-09 scores, normalized it to 1000, adding the normalized D and unknown rounds each to the total and the winner is determined.   FWIW 
Sent from Dave's Crackberry

-----Original Message-----
From: "Woodward, Jim (US SSA)" <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>

Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 09:46:45 
To: General pattern discussion<nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From pcosky at comcast.net  Tue Sep 22 14:35:56 2009
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 22:35:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Black Magic v2.2 for sale
In-Reply-To: <01df01ca3bb7$a9c00c70$fd402550$@net>
References: <01f501ca2f52$51d50860$f57f1920$@net>	<002b01ca3401$59e5bb40$0db131c0$@net>
	<01df01ca3bb7$a9c00c70$fd402550$@net>
Message-ID: <01fb01ca3bd5$2b469800$81d3c800$@net>

I forgot to add that I have it listed higher on RCU so if you are interested
or know someone who is but not on the  NSRCA list make sure to contact me
via e-mail so I can make sure you or they get a discounted price.

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Pete Cosky
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 3:06 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Black Magic v2.2 for sale

 

I have a BM v2.2 that is in the bones, all it needs is covered.  I have two
sets of wings for it and the horizontal stab is set up for servos, but it
also had a DEPS retrofitted. Price will depend on what all you want with it
but if you take everything I have for it the price starts at $750 and will
go down from there if there are things you don't want or need. E-mail  me at
pcosky at comcast.net with any questions.

 

I will ship anywhere in the lower 48 at the buyers expense. The plane and
pictures are posted on RCU.

 

Pete

 

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From wemodels at cox.net  Tue Sep 22 14:53:41 2009
From: wemodels at cox.net (Bill's Email)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 22:53:41 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <2083051087.4210971253637759637.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <2083051087.4210971253637759637.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <4AB95573.3010000@cox.net>

Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote:
>
> Doug,
>
>  
>
> You are correct.  I just wanted to say that there is a maneuvers 
> called slow roll that is not mention in the IMAC rule book.  I got the 
> description from the IAC web site.  Here the description:
>
>  
>
> *Slow rolls *have to be flown normally on a straight line (exception 
> is the avalanche). The roll rate has to be constant and the 
> longitudinal axis of the plane has to go straight. *This requires 
> constantly changing rudder and elevator control inputs throughout the 
> roll. *
>
>  
>
> I wonder how this maneuver is judged.  Base on the description it is 
> required to use rudder and elevator.  I suspect that the judge has the 
> authority to downgrade if the pilots is trying to avoid using rudder 
> and elevator during the roll.  I really don't know how this is done in 
> the real planes but I will guess that a pilot will try to do 
> slower roll rate to get maximum points.  Again, I could be wrong in my 
> interpretation and I am sure that you will know more details.     
>
>
> Vicente "Vince" Bortone
>
IAC does have a "slow roll" in the glider catalog. As Doug said, the 
traditional "slow roll" merely means a normal aileron roll without any 
hesitations (points). Nothing in the description you quoted mentions a 
particular roll rate, only that the rate must be constant.

As far as control inputs go, if you want to see an IAC judge laughs 
themselves unconscious tell them that you think a figure should be 
downgraded because the pilot failed to use the rudder or what ever.

In IAC and IMAC it does not matter how a pilot achieves the criteria, 
all that matters is how well those criteria are met. Period.

And Doug is right about the IAC roll rate. They will roll as fast as the 
plane is capable of rolling. 


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From wemodels at cox.net  Tue Sep 22 14:55:49 2009
From: wemodels at cox.net (Bill's Email)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 22:55:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPOEPFEMAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>
References: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPOEPFEMAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <4AB955F3.1020502@cox.net>

J N Hiller wrote:
>
> This has been an informative discussion. I started trying to fly the 
> Sportsman sequence yesterday. Maneuver #3 is an inside loop with a 
> half roll over the top, exit inverted. This appears to be an 
> integrated half roll through 90 degrees of arc.
>
> Am I reading this correctly?
>
> Is the maneuver flight detail spelled out somewhere that I could 
> reference?
>
> Thanks
>
> Jim Hiller
>
>
In IMAC there is no criteria for how many degrees of arc you take for 
the half roll. What you are judged on is placing the roll centered on 
the apex of the loop and flying an arced line during the 1/2 loop.  Your 
roll rate will determine how many degrees of arc you take.


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From wemodels at cox.net  Tue Sep 22 14:57:54 2009
From: wemodels at cox.net (Bill's Email)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 22:57:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPAEPHEMAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>
References: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPAEPHEMAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <4AB95670.7070603@cox.net>

J N Hiller wrote:
>
> Thanks guys that will make it a little easier.  I will then assume 
> that the slash marks through the loop only indicate centering the 
> rolling element.
>
> It looked nice through 90 degrees of ark with a very slow rate but I 
> only got one out of maybe a dozen attempts that looked decent.
>
> Jim
>
>  
>


Those marks are from the Aresti catalog and indicate where on the loop a 
roll element can be placed.


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From Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au  Tue Sep 22 16:18:59 2009
From: Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au (Koenig, Tom)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 00:18:59 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] World Champs?
Message-ID: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C5394A10@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>

Hi again all,

My flying offsider and Aussie Team member has just returned from Europe, where he took part in the W/C and had a little holiday afterwards.

I 'de-briefed' him considerably and found his opinions/learnings very, very interesting. (what I could get out of him!!!)

Now I know that the US had a good contingent of spectators, support etc-as well as the Team..........

I am busting to hear this discussion list 'alive' with reports/opinions of what their take was on the Worlds!!!?????

This is the biggest event in our little universe....and NOTHING????????????????? Why is everyone so quiet?

Have we all become so afraid in this world of political correctness/madness, that we cannot express an opinion (be it good or bad?!)

Please...let us all know what went on. Damn the consequences! Give us the juicy bits...please?

Eager to hear opinions and reports!



Tom Koenig



________________________________
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From bob at toprudder.com  Tue Sep 22 17:04:11 2009
From: bob at toprudder.com (Bob Richards)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 01:04:11 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <648038.42239.qm@web80506.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <330532.87172.qm@web1104.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>

Don't know about DA, but I do know that one problem with soft mounting the larger engines is the muffler connection. This is not as much of an issue with headers and cannisters as it is with the standard mufflers or wrap-around Pitts mufflers.

--- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote:









Why is that? Because it may reduce bearing life-span?
?
John Pavlick


?

?
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From shannah1806 at gmail.com  Tue Sep 22 17:16:38 2009
From: shannah1806 at gmail.com (steve hannah)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 01:16:38 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <4AB95670.7070603@cox.net>
References: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPAEPHEMAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>
	<4AB95670.7070603@cox.net>
Message-ID: <c3f99b710909221816u47533297se20e8b2b0127f87f@mail.gmail.com>

I think this thread started as a query into unknowns.  Jim W's post pretty
well hit the nail on the head.  Leave the unknowns to IMAC.  When I switched
from F3A to IMAC (actually the JR SCAT series) in 2002 I started flying
Intermediate and really liked the unknowns.  Flying those unknown sequences
was very easy.  I found the degree of difficulty of maneuvers between
intermediate and the then F3A sequence to be compatible.  Unknowns were no
more difficult and, since I had been flying competitive pattern for 12 years
I had little trouble adapting.  I was typically the most experienced pilot
in the class so I had little trouble.  Moving up the ladder saw an
exponential increase in the degree of difficulty for the maneuvers as well
as for the unknowns.  It is true, you have to kick butt in the unknown in
order to win.  So, at every contest I would spend saturday night learning
and memorizing my unknown.  I'd get the sequence and stick fly it until I
fell asleep.  I got to where I really hated that.  It wasn't fun.  Flying
Unlimited in 2007, including the TAS, burned me out on this whole thing and
cured me of any desire to fly unknowns ever again.

When I started flying pattern again in 2008, it was like a breath of fresh
air to me.  The contests were fun again.  I am a competitive guy and I
stopped having fun at IMAC contests.  They were just too much work.

Pattern contests are much lower key and relaxing.  IMAC events are hectic.
The unknowns put a cramp on your fun as well.  I would always be thinking at
the evening group dinner "I can't have that extra beer, I need to leave NOW
in order to have enough time to cram the Unlimited Unknown sequence into
memory".  That sucked.

As for the never ending debate of which is better/tougher/more precise, I'll
say this.  Flying Pattern made me a good IMAC pilot.  Then, flying IMAC made
me a much better Pattern flier.  They're all good.  Everyone should try
both.  Just leave the unknowns to IMAC, Keep them easy enough to memorize in
10 minutes in the morning so you can have a few beers and shoot the bull
with your buddies at night.

Steve

On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 3:57 PM, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net> wrote:

>  J N Hiller wrote:
>
>  Thanks guys that will make it a little easier.  I will then assume that
> the slash marks through the loop only indicate centering the rolling
> element.
>
> It looked nice through 90 degrees of ark with a very slow rate but I only
> got one out of maybe a dozen attempts that looked decent.
>
> Jim
>
>
>
>
>
> Those marks are from the Aresti catalog and indicate where on the loop a
> roll element can be placed.
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep 22 17:18:29 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 01:18:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <1668996638.4459931253668381084.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <273908324.4462211253668708647.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

Bill check below in italics. 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bill's Email" < wemodels @cox.net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 5:53:39 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote: 





Doug, 



You are correct.? I just wanted to say that there is a maneuvers called slow roll that is not mention?in the? IMAC rule book.? I got the description from the IAC web site.? Here the description: 



Slow rolls have to be flown normally on a straight line (exception is the avalanche). The roll rate has to be constant and the longitudinal axis of the plane has to go straight. This requires constantly changing rudder and elevator control inputs throughout the roll. 



I wonder how this maneuver is judged.? Base on the description it is required to use rudder and elevator.? I?suspect that the judge has the authority to downgrade if the pilots is trying to avoid using rudder and elevator during the roll.??I really don't know how this is done in the real planes but I will guess that a?pilot will try to do slower?roll rate to get maximum points.? Again, I?could be wrong in my interpretation and?I am sure that you will know more details.? ??? 


Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
IAC does have a "slow roll" in the glider catalog. Yes, I saw it .? Requires that?a judge to measure the time to roll.? Very time consuming.? I think it is called super slow roll. ? As Doug said, the traditional "slow roll" merely means a normal aileron roll without any hesitations (points). Nothing in the description you quoted mentions a particular roll rate, only that the rate must be constant. Correct. However, the descriptions adds the following:?? " the plane has to go straight. This requires constantly changing rudder and elevator control inputs throughout the roll".? For me this means that the pilots has to show complete control during the roll.? Clearly this is very difficult to show if the plane rolls extremely fast and the pilot does not do any effort to demonstrate what the description of the maneuver is calling for.??Probably they don't require a time since they want to avoid having a separate judge?measuring the time to roll.??Interesting situation and will be good to ask? IAC certified judge.? I have the opportunity to go and help at? IAC contest?every year.??I will try to remember and ask about this in the next chance.? ??? 





As far as control inputs go, if you want to see an IAC judge laughs themselves unconscious tell them that you think a figure should be downgraded because the pilot failed to use the rudder or what ever. It is in the IAC rule book.? A good judge should follow the description of the maneuver and use it to give the appropriate downgrades if any.? 

In IAC and IMAC it does not matter how a pilot achieves the criteria, all that matters is how well those criteria are met. Period.? Agree if follow what is in the rule book.? If the rule book is wrong it should be modified to called fast roll.? 

And Doug is right about the IAC roll rate. They will roll as fast as the plane is capable of rolling. This interpretation?goes against what is?in the rule book.? The maneuver is called slow roll no fast roll.? The description and name of the maneuver?does not say the fastest roll possible.? Of course, for the pilot it?is?easier to roll?as fast as possible.? The?judge has the ultimate responsibility to write down the score.?? 



Regards, 



Vicente "Vince" Bortone ??? ? 



_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion
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From wemodels at cox.net  Tue Sep 22 17:26:31 2009
From: wemodels at cox.net (Bill's Email)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 01:26:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <273908324.4462211253668708647.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <273908324.4462211253668708647.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <4AB97945.4050003@cox.net>

Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote:
> Bill check below in italics.
>
> Vicente "Vince" Bortone
>
Good enough. For the record I have attended an IAC judges school and 
have been an assistant judge at an IAC contest. I am also the past 
Chairman on the IMAC Rules and Standards Committee. I have a passing 
knowledge of the IAC rules and the IMAC rules. In both IMAC and IAC the 
roll rate is not a criteria for anything except the super slow roll in 
the IAC glider catalog. Not sure what else there is to say about the 
subject.




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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Tue Sep 22 17:58:32 2009
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 01:58:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <397270.4688.qm@web1112.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
References: <170092.13065.qm@web80501.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<397270.4688.qm@web1112.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BLU121-W23BF3145D6E5E8259C96C4E8DB0@phx.gbl>


In all seriousness, I think it makes little sense to cross over brands this way.  FASST, JR, or Airtronics; things work just fine.  I could see the initial idea that Horizon had with Spektrum to get the world moving to Spread Spectrum with their modules, but I think that time has passed us by.  As far as preserving the value of an investment in a transmitter by moving to another brand of receivers with a module - why? Go with a brand you like and don't look back to gimmicks to cross over part way.  You always lose something in the process.

 

Ed
 


Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 07:01:51 -0700
From: bob at toprudder.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve






Personally, I like the FASST system. I must have a dozen 2.4g receivers now. I have nothing against the JR/Spektrum, a lot of my friends fly JR (I am in a very small minority in my club flying Futaba). I will admit that I bought the Spektrum module for one of my old Futaba transmitters, so that I could do the "bind-n-fly" thing as well.
 
I will tell you guys a funny story. I was at Efest this year. I was flying a Vapor over in the corner for the ultralight planes, and heard someone walk up behing a friend of mine (Jeff Phillips, Radioactive Airshow Team) and start asking him how he liked the Vapors. Well, I thought it must be someone who had never flown a Vapor, so I turned around and handed him my transmitter, an old Futaba 7UA with a Spektrum module, so he could fly it. It happened to be Peter Goldsmith. :-)  I wish I had said "feel the difference" to him. 
 
Bob R.


--- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote:









Bill,
You are a one-percenter among the one-percenters! LOL 
 
I actually bought the Spektrum module with Rx for my Futaba 12Fg because it was such a good deal. I'm going to use this setup for indoor this year with some of those really small Spektrum receivers. It's also great for the E-Flite Bind-N-Fly models. I just didn't see the point in going "the other way" but I guess in your case it makes sense.
 
John Pavlick




 
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Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft.
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep 22 18:03:22 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 02:03:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <772894276.4479831253671396034.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <127773668.4479851253671401772.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>



Bob, 



You are correct.? There are flex headers available for gas engines.? I am using those with extremely good results.? The one I have now have around 500 flights with no problems.? If forgot the brand now but I could find if interested.? The canister should be soft mounted in the back.? This allows free movement and avoid bending stresses that could break the header.? 

Regards, 


Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bob Richards" <bob at toprudder.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:04:10 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

Don't know about DA, but I do know that one problem with soft mounting the larger engines is the muffler connection. This is not as much of an issue with headers and cannisters as it is with the standard mufflers or wrap-around Pitts mufflers. 

--- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote: 






Why is that? Because it may reduce bearing life-span? 

John Pavlick 






_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Tue Sep 22 18:08:19 2009
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 02:08:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <4AB8F0C6.6050005@san.rr.com>
References: <1263356613.4176751253633873575.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<4AB8F0C6.6050005@san.rr.com>
Message-ID: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl>


It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend to work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a pattern airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I found that I really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.  I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10 minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was really not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just getting old...

 

Ed
 
> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
> From: seefo at san.rr.com
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> 
> Vince,
> 
> The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll. The IAC 
> Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to differentiate it 
> from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never 
> flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
> 
> -Doug
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> >
> > Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate 
> > class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast. 
> > IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's class. I am 
> > not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
> >
> > 
> >
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_________________________________________________________________
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep 22 18:26:06 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 02:26:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <231090792.4488071253672718989.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1691272347.4488291253672765778.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>




Bill, 



I am sorry that we don't agree.??I just reading what is written in the rule book.? With your credentials you should be able to explain?what is in the rule book.? We have the problem that we first wear the pilot hat and forget that it is more important to wear the judge hat.??Judges have the main responsibility to follow what is in the rule book and use it to make the playing field equal for all pilots.? I recognize that it is very difficult?task.? 



Best regards,? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bill's Email" < wemodels @cox.net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:26:29 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote: 


Bill check below in italics. 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

Good enough. For the record I have attended an IAC judges school and have been an assistant judge at an IAC contest. I am also the past Chairman on the IMAC Rules and Standards Committee. I have a passing knowledge of the IAC rules and the IMAC rules. In both IMAC and IAC the roll rate is not a criteria for anything except the super slow roll in the IAC glider catalog. Not sure what else there is to say about the subject. 





_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion
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From wemodels at cox.net  Tue Sep 22 21:21:03 2009
From: wemodels at cox.net (Bill's Email)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 05:21:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <1691272347.4488291253672765778.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <1691272347.4488291253672765778.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <4AB9B03D.5080005@cox.net>

What is interesting is at the IAC schools they will stress that some of 
the best judges are not pilots at all. In models we fall into this idea 
that the higher class you fly the better judge you are and honestly I 
have not really seen that to be the case. I have seen some uper class 
pilots who were terrible judges and who barely know the actual criteria. 
And I have seen lower class pilots who actually know the criteria who 
make great judges.



Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote:
>
> Bill,
>
>  
>
> I am sorry that we don't agree.  I just reading what is written in the 
> rule book.  With your credentials you should be able to explain what 
> is in the rule book.  We have the problem that we first wear the pilot 
> hat and forget that it is more important to wear the judge 
> hat.  Judges have the main responsibility to follow what is in the 
> rule book and use it to make the playing field equal for all pilots.  
> I recognize that it is very difficult task. 
>
>  
>
> Best regards, 
>
> Vicente "Vince" Bortone
>

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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Wed Sep 23 04:12:53 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 12:12:53 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <4AB9B03D.5080005@cox.net>
Message-ID: <1641812742.4572511253707971420.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>



Bill, 



Good poing,? I agree 100%.? Thanks, 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bill's Email" <wemodels at cox.net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 12:21:01 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

What is interesting is at the IAC schools they will stress that some of the best judges are not pilots at all. In models we fall into this idea that the higher class you fly the better judge you are and honestly I have not really seen that to be the case. I have seen some uper class pilots who were terrible judges and who barely know the actual criteria. And I have seen lower class pilots who actually know the criteria who make great judges. 



Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote: 





Bill, 



I am sorry that we don't agree.??I just reading what is written in the rule book.? With your credentials you should be able to explain?what is in the rule book.? We have the problem that we first wear the pilot hat and forget that it is more important to wear the judge hat.??Judges have the main responsibility to follow what is in the rule book and use it to make the playing field equal for all pilots.? I recognize that it is very difficult?task.? 



Best regards,? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 


_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Wed Sep 23 04:32:32 2009
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 12:32:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <c3f99b710909221816u47533297se20e8b2b0127f87f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <814i1h$4cvi97@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>

Hi Steve,

Hopefully we'll cross paths in the future, maybe at the 2010 pattern nats.  Thanks for sharing your experience below.  Just to add some more thoughts about the unknowns.  Unknowns invite a "team" approach to flying them successfully.  Most the pilots will take their unknown, and go to their most experienced friend that can read arestii, and ask for it to be deciphered.  Groups of 3-5 pilots will go through and try to get them sorted out.  You then leave the field or dinner thinking you got them right.  Later in the hotel room, you realize that some particular snap & roll combination is "same direction" instead of the typical opposite direction (for instance).  Then, you doubt the whole thing and study it again.  In the morning, you go to your buds and see if they caught the mistake, but then sort of hope the other 'competition' didn't catch it.

So here goes the sequence of events morning of - if you are the person folks are relying on to "call-correctly" for them, it can really cramp your morning.  You will be studying the other classes unknown nearly as much as your own.  If you call for them (sometimes a couple people let's say) before you fly, YOU better have a good caller lined up to help keep you own head straight.  It puts more pressure on you to "call-correctly" for someone, than to fly your own sequence.  It also puts you in an uncomfortable spot to say "no" to the task when you absolutely need to.  You will quickly look around and realize that other pilots have that "super-experienced" caller working with them all the time - maybe for years.  If your flying group doesn't have that, all of you are at the disadvantage.

As the unknown flier - there are tricks to memorizing the sequence (Don S.'s latest video covers one technique nicely for it), but the bottom line is that your caller will make-or-break this round for you, and in short, the contest outcome.  Reading aresti is a skill.  Flying unknowns with the same composure and "presentation" that you fly the knowns with a huge new skill to learn.  If you are really practicing with IMAC dedication, you should probably fly 65% of the knowns, and 35% of learning how your airplane does every other maneuver not in your known.  The benefit is that learning how to approach unknowns and fly them confidently will accelerate your skill growth and make you a better pilot fast.  You knees may shake like you are on the Nationals flight line though!  I always have a good feeling of accomplishment for pulling off a clean unknown, that you don't always have after even a really good known flight.   Unknowns offer a lot and they will make your head stronger for flying, show where your weaknesses as a pilot are, but they come at the price of a lot of studying, dramatic changes in the final pilot positions, and needing a good "team approach" to pull the flights off cleanly.

Thanks,
Jim



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of steve hannah
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:17 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

I think this thread started as a query into unknowns.  Jim W's post pretty well hit the nail on the head.  Leave the unknowns to IMAC.  When I switched from F3A to IMAC (actually the JR SCAT series) in 2002 I started flying Intermediate and really liked the unknowns.  Flying those unknown sequences was very easy.  I found the degree of difficulty of maneuvers between intermediate and the then F3A sequence to be compatible.  Unknowns were no more difficult and, since I had been flying competitive pattern for 12 years I had little trouble adapting.  I was typically the most experienced pilot in the class so I had little trouble.  Moving up the ladder saw an exponential increase in the degree of difficulty for the maneuvers as well as for the unknowns.  It is true, you have to kick butt in the unknown in order to win.  So, at every contest I would spend saturday night learning and memorizing my unknown.  I'd get the sequence and stick fly it until I fell asleep.  I got to where I really hated that.  It wasn't fun.  Flying Unlimited in 2007, including the TAS, burned me out on this whole thing and cured me of any desire to fly unknowns ever again.

When I started flying pattern again in 2008, it was like a breath of fresh air to me.  The contests were fun again.  I am a competitive guy and I stopped having fun at IMAC contests.  They were just too much work.

Pattern contests are much lower key and relaxing.  IMAC events are hectic.  The unknowns put a cramp on your fun as well.  I would always be thinking at the evening group dinner "I can't have that extra beer, I need to leave NOW in order to have enough time to cram the Unlimited Unknown sequence into memory".  That sucked.

As for the never ending debate of which is better/tougher/more precise, I'll say this.  Flying Pattern made me a good IMAC pilot.  Then, flying IMAC made me a much better Pattern flier.  They're all good.  Everyone should try both.  Just leave the unknowns to IMAC, Keep them easy enough to memorize in 10 minutes in the morning so you can have a few beers and shoot the bull with your buddies at night.

Steve
On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 3:57 PM, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net<mailto:wemodels at cox.net>> wrote:
J N Hiller wrote:

Thanks guys that will make it a little easier.  I will then assume that the slash marks through the loop only indicate centering the rolling element.

It looked nice through 90 degrees of ark with a very slow rate but I only got one out of maybe a dozen attempts that looked decent.

Jim



Those marks are from the Aresti catalog and indicate where on the loop a roll element can be placed.


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From chuenkan at comcast.net  Wed Sep 23 05:07:29 2009
From: chuenkan at comcast.net (Phil Spelt)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 13:07:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl>
References: <1263356613.4176751253633873575.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<4AB8F0C6.6050005@san.rr.com>
	<BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <20090923130725.DEBF5115F3@bridi.netexpress.com>

Or, Wiser, Ed???? >:-}

At 10:08 PM 9/22/2009, you wrote:
>...I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 
>10 minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was 
>really not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than 
>knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just getting old...
>
>Ed
>
> > Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
> > From: seefo at san.rr.com
> > To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> >
> > Vince,
> >
> > The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll. The IAC
> > Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to differentiate it
> > from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
> > flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
> >
> > -Doug
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
> > > class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
> > > IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's class. I am
> > > not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>----------
>Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. 
><http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/171222985/direct/01/>Sign up now.
>_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

-->There are only two types of aircraft -- fighters and targets.

Phil Spelt, Webmaster & Past President, Knox County Radio Control Society, Inc.
        URL: http://www.kcrctn.com
AMA--1294,  Scientific Leader Member, SPA--177
       My URL: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/~chuenkan/
       (865) 435-1476 v  (865) 604-0541 c  
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From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Wed Sep 23 05:16:08 2009
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 13:16:08 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <814i1h$4cvlqs@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>

Ed - I know you worked hard and invested again in getting the 40% Carden out of mothballs, just to encourage yourself and other with the F3M flying.  Thanks for doing so.  The sequence is difficult.  While flying it myself, I did like the challenge of making the 40% plane fit in the box, and having centered maneuvers again.  I'm not sure where it will all go, but thanks for making the effort to give it a shot!!!
Jim



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ed Alt
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 10:08 PM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend to work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a pattern airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I found that I really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.  I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10 minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was really not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just getting old...

Ed

> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
> From: seefo at san.rr.com
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> Vince,
>
> The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll. The IAC
> Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to differentiate it
> from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
> flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
>
> -Doug
>
>
>
> >
> >
> > Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
> > class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
> > IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's class. I am
> > not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
> >
> >
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
________________________________
Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. Sign up now.<http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/171222985/direct/01/>
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From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Wed Sep 23 05:22:40 2009
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 13:22:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <c3f99b710909221816u47533297se20e8b2b0127f87f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48693.95004.qm@web51008.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

 Something not being mentioned and a little off from the original thought about adding unknowns into pattern is the cost of IMAC vs: the cost of pattern. 
 I'd say that the 2 planes I fly now which are an Integral with and AXI F3A and a Sickle with a Plettenberg ran me in the range of about $3000 each. I consider both to be no comprimise top level competitive modern no holds barred pattern planes. What I mean is these planes in no way limit my abilities. What would a comparable top level 40% IMAC plane cost me?
                 Thanks, Mike Mueller

--- On Tue, 9/22/09, steve hannah <shannah1806 at gmail.com> wrote:

> From: steve hannah <shannah1806 at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Tuesday, September 22, 2009, 8:16 PM
> I think this thread started as a query into
> unknowns.? Jim W's post pretty well hit the nail on the
> head.? Leave the unknowns to IMAC.? When I switched from
> F3A to IMAC (actually the JR SCAT series) in 2002 I started
> flying Intermediate and really liked the unknowns.? Flying
> those unknown sequences was very easy.? I found the degree
> of difficulty of maneuvers between intermediate and the then
> F3A sequence to be compatible.? Unknowns were no more
> difficult and, since I had been flying competitive pattern
> for 12 years I had little trouble adapting.? I was
> typically the most experienced pilot in the class so I had
> little trouble.? Moving up the ladder saw an exponential
> increase in the degree of difficulty for the maneuvers as
> well as for the unknowns.? It is true, you have to kick
> butt in the unknown in order to win.? So, at every contest
> I would spend saturday night learning and memorizing my
> unknown.? I'd get the sequence and stick fly it until I
> fell asleep.? I got to where I really hated that.? It
> wasn't fun.? Flying Unlimited in 2007, including the
> TAS, burned me out on this whole thing and cured me of any
> desire to fly unknowns ever again.
> 
> 
> When I started flying pattern again in 2008, it was like a
> breath of fresh air to me.? The contests were fun again.?
> I am a competitive guy and I stopped having fun at IMAC
> contests.? They were just too much work.? 
> 
> 
> Pattern contests are much lower key and relaxing.? IMAC
> events are hectic.? The unknowns put a cramp on your fun as
> well.? I would always be thinking at the evening group
> dinner "I can't have that extra beer, I need to
> leave NOW in order to have enough time to cram the Unlimited
> Unknown sequence into memory".? That sucked.
> 
> 
> As for the never ending debate of which is
> better/tougher/more precise, I'll say this.? Flying
> Pattern made me a good IMAC pilot.? Then, flying IMAC made
> me a much better Pattern flier.? They're all good.?
> Everyone should try both.? Just leave the unknowns to IMAC,
> Keep them easy enough to memorize in 10 minutes in the
> morning so you can have a few beers and shoot the bull with
> your buddies at night.
> 
> 
> Steve
> 
> On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 3:57 PM,
> Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net>
> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
> J N Hiller wrote:
> 
>   
>   
>   
>   
>   
>   
> 
>   
>   
>   Thanks guys that
> will
> make it a little easier. ?I will then assume
> that the slash marks
> through the loop only indicate centering the rolling
> element.
>   It
> looked nice through 90
> degrees of ark with a very slow rate but I
> only got one out of maybe a dozen attempts that looked
> decent. 
>   Jim
>   ?
>   
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Those marks are from the Aresti catalog and indicate where
> on the loop
> a roll element can be placed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      

From vicenterc at comcast.net  Wed Sep 23 06:03:13 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 14:03:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <1614085311.4604491253714580926.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <172919646.4604511253714592064.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>




Mike, 



A good friend just finished one.? With DA 170, canister, soft mount, and 15 servos the cost was over $6,000.? Extra 260 from ACE. 



Now, I am looking for an electric IMAC plane.? I wish that someone builds a kit using the same technology we use to build pattern planes (ie Integral).? Yes, it will need to be below 11 lbs to be competitive.? There will be no noise issues.? Let's try to find one.? I asked Jason S. and he told me that the market is not there to justify the production of this plane.? I think the time is coming because the noise and footprint issues are getting worse and worse.? 



I found one that comes 12 lbs ready to fly.??This is the Extreme Flight Extra 260?that is 78" and 76" long.? It is not for sale yet but it is coming.? This could be good choice for now.? Probably we could reduce the weight by?using some pattern techniques.? 



Yes, I want to use the same equipment we have now?for electric pattern planes.? This will reduce the cost.? ? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "mike mueller" <mups1953 at yahoo.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 8:22:38 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

?Something not being mentioned and a little off from the original thought about adding unknowns into pattern is the cost of IMAC vs: the cost of pattern. 
?I'd say that the 2 planes I fly now which are an Integral with and AXI F3A and a Sickle with a Plettenberg ran me in the range of about $3000 each. I consider both to be no comprimise top level competitive modern no holds barred pattern planes. What I mean is these planes in no way limit my abilities. What would a comparable top level 40% IMAC plane cost me? 
?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Thanks, Mike Mueller 

--- On Tue, 9/22/09, steve hannah <shannah1806 at gmail.com> wrote: 

> From: steve hannah <shannah1806 at gmail.com> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
> Date: Tuesday, September 22, 2009, 8:16 PM 
> I think this thread started as a query into 
> unknowns.? Jim W's post pretty well hit the nail on the 
> head.? Leave the unknowns to IMAC.? When I switched from 
> F3A to IMAC (actually the JR SCAT series) in 2002 I started 
> flying Intermediate and really liked the unknowns.? Flying 
> those unknown sequences was very easy.? I found the degree 
> of difficulty of maneuvers between intermediate and the then 
> F3A sequence to be compatible.? Unknowns were no more 
> difficult and, since I had been flying competitive pattern 
> for 12 years I had little trouble adapting.? I was 
> typically the most experienced pilot in the class so I had 
> little trouble.? Moving up the ladder saw an exponential 
> increase in the degree of difficulty for the maneuvers as 
> well as for the unknowns.? It is true, you have to kick 
> butt in the unknown in order to win.? So, at every contest 
> I would spend saturday night learning and memorizing my 
> unknown.? I'd get the sequence and stick fly it until I 
> fell asleep.? I got to where I really hated that.? It 
> wasn't fun.? Flying Unlimited in 2007, including the 
> TAS, burned me out on this whole thing and cured me of any 
> desire to fly unknowns ever again. 
> 
> 
> When I started flying pattern again in 2008, it was like a 
> breath of fresh air to me.? The contests were fun again.? 
> I am a competitive guy and I stopped having fun at IMAC 
> contests.? They were just too much work.? 
> 
> 
> Pattern contests are much lower key and relaxing.? IMAC 
> events are hectic.? The unknowns put a cramp on your fun as 
> well.? I would always be thinking at the evening group 
> dinner "I can't have that extra beer, I need to 
> leave NOW in order to have enough time to cram the Unlimited 
> Unknown sequence into memory".? That sucked. 
> 
> 
> As for the never ending debate of which is 
> better/tougher/more precise, I'll say this.? Flying 
> Pattern made me a good IMAC pilot.? Then, flying IMAC made 
> me a much better Pattern flier.? They're all good.? 
> Everyone should try both.? Just leave the unknowns to IMAC, 
> Keep them easy enough to memorize in 10 minutes in the 
> morning so you can have a few beers and shoot the bull with 
> your buddies at night. 
> 
> 
> Steve 
> 
> On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 3:57 PM, 
> Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net> 
> wrote: 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> J N Hiller wrote: 
> 
> ? 
> ? 
> ? 
> ? 
> ? 
> ? 
> 
> ? 
> ? 
> ? Thanks guys that 
> will 
> make it a little easier. ?I will then assume 
> that the slash marks 
> through the loop only indicate centering the rolling 
> element. 
> ? It 
> looked nice through 90 
> degrees of ark with a very slow rate but I 
> only got one out of maybe a dozen attempts that looked 
> decent. 
> ? Jim 
> ? ? 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Those marks are from the Aresti catalog and indicate where 
> on the loop 
> a roll element can be placed. 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


?? ? ? 
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From shannah1806 at gmail.com  Wed Sep 23 06:33:52 2009
From: shannah1806 at gmail.com (steve hannah)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 14:33:52 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <814i1h$4cvi97@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>
References: <c3f99b710909221816u47533297se20e8b2b0127f87f@mail.gmail.com>
	<814i1h$4cvi97@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <c3f99b710909230733w72bbc60cl24dc76a65dbe93f2@mail.gmail.com>

Boy ain't that the truth about calling. I had a hard time saying NO.
The other thing that happens is that you get to sit in the judges
chair and watch 15 guys from another class fly their unknown then you
have to shake that off and go fly yours.

On Wednesday, September 23, 2009, Woodward, Jim (US SSA)
<jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Steve,
>
>
>
> Hopefully we?ll cross paths in the future, maybe at the
> 2010 pattern nats.? Thanks for sharing your experience below.? Just
> to add some more thoughts about the unknowns.? Unknowns invite a ?team?
> approach to flying them successfully.? Most the pilots will take their
> unknown, and go to their most experienced friend that can read arestii, and ask
> for it to be deciphered.? Groups of 3-5 pilots will go through and try to
> get them sorted out.? You then leave the field or dinner thinking you got
> them right.? Later in the hotel room, you realize that some particular
> snap & roll combination is ?same direction? instead of the
> typical opposite direction (for instance).? Then, you doubt the whole
> thing and study it again.? In the morning, you go to your buds and see if
> they caught the mistake, but then sort of hope the other ?competition?
> didn?t catch it.
>
>
>
> So here goes the sequence of events morning of ? if you
> are the person folks are relying on to ?call-correctly? for them,
> it can really cramp your morning.? You will be studying the other classes
> unknown nearly as much as your own.? If you call for them (sometimes a
> couple people let?s say) before you fly, YOU better have a good caller
> lined up to help keep you own head straight.? It puts more pressure on you
> to ?call-correctly? for someone, than to fly your own
> sequence.? It also puts you in an uncomfortable spot to say ?no?
> to the task when you absolutely need to.? You will quickly look around and
> realize that other pilots have that ?super-experienced? caller
> working with them all the time ? maybe for years.? If your flying
> group doesn?t have that, all of you are at the disadvantage.
>
>
>
> As the unknown flier ? there are tricks to memorizing the
> sequence (Don S.?s latest video covers one technique nicely for it), but
> the bottom line is that your caller will make-or-break this round for you, and
> in short, the contest outcome.? Reading aresti is a skill.? Flying
> unknowns with the same composure and ?presentation? that you fly
> the knowns with a huge new skill to learn.? If you are really practicing
> with IMAC dedication, you should probably fly 65% of the knowns, and 35% of
> learning how your airplane does every other maneuver not in your known.? The
> benefit is that learning how to approach unknowns and fly them confidently will
> accelerate your skill growth and make you a better pilot fast.? You knees
> may shake like you are on the Nationals flight line though!? I always have
> a good feeling of accomplishment for pulling off a clean unknown, that you don?t
> always have after even a really good known flight. ??Unknowns offer a
> lot and they will make your head stronger for flying, show where your
> weaknesses as a pilot are, but they come at the price of a lot of studying,
> dramatic changes in the final pilot positions, and needing a good ?team
> approach? to pull the flights off cleanly.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of steve
> hannah
> Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:17 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
>
>
>
>
> I think this thread started as
> a query into unknowns.? Jim W's post pretty well hit the nail on the
> head.? Leave the unknowns to IMAC.? When I switched from F3A to IMAC
> (actually the JR SCAT series) in 2002 I started flying Intermediate and really
> liked the unknowns.? Flying those unknown sequences was very easy.? I
> found the degree of difficulty of maneuvers between intermediate and the then
> F3A sequence to be compatible.? Unknowns were no more difficult and, since
> I had been flying competitive pattern for 12 years I had little trouble
> adapting.? I was typically the most experienced pilot in the class so I
> had little trouble.? Moving up the ladder saw an exponential increase in
> the degree of difficulty for the maneuvers as well as for the unknowns.
> It is true, you have to kick butt in the unknown in order to win.? So, at
> every contest I would spend saturday night learning and memorizing my
> unknown.? I'd get the sequence and stick fly it until I fell asleep.
> I got to where I really hated that.? It wasn't fun.? Flying Unlimited
> in 2007, including the TAS, burned me out on this whole thing and cured me of
> any desire to fly unknowns ever again.
>
> When I started flying pattern again in 2008, it was like a breath of fresh air
> to me.? The contests were fun again.? I am a competitive guy and I
> stopped having fun at IMAC contests.? They were just too much work.
>
> Pattern contests are much lower key and relaxing.? IMAC events are
> hectic.? The unknowns put a cramp on your fun as well.? I would
> always be thinking at the evening group dinner "I can't have that extra
> beer, I need to leave NOW in order to have enough time to cram the Unlimited Unknown
> sequence into memory".? That sucked.
>
> As for the never ending debate of which is better/tougher/more precise, I'll
> say this.? Flying Pattern made me a good IMAC pilot.? Then, flying
> IMAC made me a much better Pattern flier.? They're all good.
> Everyone should try both.? Just leave the unknowns to IMAC, Keep them easy
> enough to memorize in 10 minutes in the morning so you can have a few beers and
> shoot the bull with your buddies at night.
>
> Steve
>
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 3:57 PM, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net?<javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'wemodels at cox.net');>> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> J N Hiller wrote:
>
>
>
> Thanks
> guys that will make it a little easier. ?I will then assume that the slash
> marks through the loop only indicate centering the rolling element.
>
> It
> looked nice through 90 degrees of ark with a very slow rate but I only got one
> out of maybe a dozen attempts that looked decent.
>
> Jim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Those marks are from the Aresti
> catalog and indicate where on the loop a roll element can be placed.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Wed Sep 23 06:40:31 2009
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 14:40:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <c3f99b710909230733w72bbc60cl24dc76a65dbe93f2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <814i7o$461vsc@dmzms99802.na.baesystems.com>

True that!  Basically, the "unknowns" and how they shape the event from all angles, is part-n-parcel to the IMAC experience, personality, and culture.
Thanks,
Jim



-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of steve hannah
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 10:34 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

Boy ain't that the truth about calling. I had a hard time saying NO.
The other thing that happens is that you get to sit in the judges
chair and watch 15 guys from another class fly their unknown then you
have to shake that off and go fly yours.

On Wednesday, September 23, 2009, Woodward, Jim (US SSA)
<jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Steve,
>
>
>
> Hopefully we'll cross paths in the future, maybe at the
> 2010 pattern nats.? Thanks for sharing your experience below.? Just
> to add some more thoughts about the unknowns.? Unknowns invite a "team"
> approach to flying them successfully.? Most the pilots will take their
> unknown, and go to their most experienced friend that can read arestii, and ask
> for it to be deciphered.? Groups of 3-5 pilots will go through and try to
> get them sorted out.? You then leave the field or dinner thinking you got
> them right.? Later in the hotel room, you realize that some particular
> snap & roll combination is "same direction" instead of the
> typical opposite direction (for instance).? Then, you doubt the whole
> thing and study it again.? In the morning, you go to your buds and see if
> they caught the mistake, but then sort of hope the other 'competition'
> didn't catch it.
>
>
>
> So here goes the sequence of events morning of - if you
> are the person folks are relying on to "call-correctly" for them,
> it can really cramp your morning.? You will be studying the other classes
> unknown nearly as much as your own.? If you call for them (sometimes a
> couple people let's say) before you fly, YOU better have a good caller
> lined up to help keep you own head straight.? It puts more pressure on you
> to "call-correctly" for someone, than to fly your own
> sequence.? It also puts you in an uncomfortable spot to say "no"
> to the task when you absolutely need to.? You will quickly look around and
> realize that other pilots have that "super-experienced" caller
> working with them all the time - maybe for years.? If your flying
> group doesn't have that, all of you are at the disadvantage.
>
>
>
> As the unknown flier - there are tricks to memorizing the
> sequence (Don S.'s latest video covers one technique nicely for it), but
> the bottom line is that your caller will make-or-break this round for you, and
> in short, the contest outcome.? Reading aresti is a skill.? Flying
> unknowns with the same composure and "presentation" that you fly
> the knowns with a huge new skill to learn.? If you are really practicing
> with IMAC dedication, you should probably fly 65% of the knowns, and 35% of
> learning how your airplane does every other maneuver not in your known.? The
> benefit is that learning how to approach unknowns and fly them confidently will
> accelerate your skill growth and make you a better pilot fast.? You knees
> may shake like you are on the Nationals flight line though!? I always have
> a good feeling of accomplishment for pulling off a clean unknown, that you don't
> always have after even a really good known flight. ??Unknowns offer a
> lot and they will make your head stronger for flying, show where your
> weaknesses as a pilot are, but they come at the price of a lot of studying,
> dramatic changes in the final pilot positions, and needing a good "team
> approach" to pull the flights off cleanly.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of steve
> hannah
> Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:17 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
>
>
>
>
> I think this thread started as
> a query into unknowns.? Jim W's post pretty well hit the nail on the
> head.? Leave the unknowns to IMAC.? When I switched from F3A to IMAC
> (actually the JR SCAT series) in 2002 I started flying Intermediate and really
> liked the unknowns.? Flying those unknown sequences was very easy.? I
> found the degree of difficulty of maneuvers between intermediate and the then
> F3A sequence to be compatible.? Unknowns were no more difficult and, since
> I had been flying competitive pattern for 12 years I had little trouble
> adapting.? I was typically the most experienced pilot in the class so I
> had little trouble.? Moving up the ladder saw an exponential increase in
> the degree of difficulty for the maneuvers as well as for the unknowns.
> It is true, you have to kick butt in the unknown in order to win.? So, at
> every contest I would spend saturday night learning and memorizing my
> unknown.? I'd get the sequence and stick fly it until I fell asleep.
> I got to where I really hated that.? It wasn't fun.? Flying Unlimited
> in 2007, including the TAS, burned me out on this whole thing and cured me of
> any desire to fly unknowns ever again.
>
> When I started flying pattern again in 2008, it was like a breath of fresh air
> to me.? The contests were fun again.? I am a competitive guy and I
> stopped having fun at IMAC contests.? They were just too much work.
>
> Pattern contests are much lower key and relaxing.? IMAC events are
> hectic.? The unknowns put a cramp on your fun as well.? I would
> always be thinking at the evening group dinner "I can't have that extra
> beer, I need to leave NOW in order to have enough time to cram the Unlimited Unknown
> sequence into memory".? That sucked.
>
> As for the never ending debate of which is better/tougher/more precise, I'll
> say this.? Flying Pattern made me a good IMAC pilot.? Then, flying
> IMAC made me a much better Pattern flier.? They're all good.
> Everyone should try both.? Just leave the unknowns to IMAC, Keep them easy
> enough to memorize in 10 minutes in the morning so you can have a few beers and
> shoot the bull with your buddies at night.
>
> Steve
>
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 3:57 PM, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net?<javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'wemodels at cox.net');>> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> J N Hiller wrote:
>
>
>
> Thanks
> guys that will make it a little easier. ?I will then assume that the slash
> marks through the loop only indicate centering the rolling element.
>
> It
> looked nice through 90 degrees of ark with a very slow rate but I only got one
> out of maybe a dozen attempts that looked decent.
>
> Jim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Those marks are from the Aresti
> catalog and indicate where on the loop a roll element can be placed.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From rcpilot at wowway.com  Wed Sep 23 07:30:01 2009
From: rcpilot at wowway.com (RON HANSEN)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 15:30:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <1417000792.1975911253719595549.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
Message-ID: <1949197942.1977161253719799757.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>



I'm still flying 72 MHz using my JR 10X radio.? I need to switch to 2.4 this winter.? This module is the solution to my problem.? I love the 10X, 9303 and 12X radios.? I don't like the DSM2 technology, I feel frequency hopping is a superior technology not to mention you can't use DSM2 in Europe.? Either Europe will eventually approve DSM2 or JR will switch to frequency hopping worldwide .? This solution will afford me more time to see what JR decides to do.? So I plan to try this module out on my foamies and park flyers and if I experience no problems I will use it in my pattern planes come this spring unless JR makes a switch to frequency hopping.? I know there are a lot of people in my situation. 



Ron 
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com> 
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:58:31 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve 

In all seriousness, I think it makes little sense to cross over brands this way.? FASST, JR, or Airtronics; things work just fine.? I could see?the initial idea that Horizon?had with Spektrum to get the world moving to Spread Spectrum with their modules, but I think that time has passed us by.? As far as preserving the value of an investment in a transmitter by moving to another brand of receivers with a module - why??Go with a brand you like and don't look back to gimmicks to cross over part way.? You always lose something in the process. 
? 
Ed 
? 





Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 07:01:51 -0700 
From: bob at toprudder.com 
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve 


Personally, I like the FASST system. I must have a dozen 2.4g receivers now. I have nothing against the JR/Spektrum, a lot of my friends fly JR (I am in a very small minority in my club flying Futaba). I will admit that I bought the Spektrum module for one of my old Futaba transmitters, so that I could do the "bind-n-fly" thing as well. 

I will tell you guys a funny story. I was at Efest this year. I was flying a Vapor over in the corner for the ultralight planes, and heard someone walk up behing a friend of mine (Jeff Phillips, Radioactive Airshow Team) and start asking him how he liked the Vapors. Well, I thought it must be someone who had never flown a Vapor, so I turned around and handed him my transmitter, an old Futaba 7UA with a Spektrum module, so he could fly it. It happened to be Peter Goldsmith. :-)? I wish I had said "feel the difference" to him. 

Bob R. 


--- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote: 






Bill, 
You are a one-percenter among the one-percenters! LOL 

I actually bought the Spektrum module with Rx for my Futaba 12Fg because it was such a good deal. I'm going to use this setup for indoor this year with some of those really small Spektrum receivers. It's also great for the E-Flite Bind-N-Fly models. I just didn't see the point in going "the other way" but?I guess in your case it makes sense. 

John Pavlick 




? 

Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. Get it now. 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jlkonn at hotmail.com  Wed Sep 23 07:33:19 2009
From: jlkonn at hotmail.com (John Konneker)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 15:33:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <1949197942.1977161253719799757.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
References: <1417000792.1975911253719595549.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
Message-ID: <BLU106-W31B03D65EECD2CF4A6339CDDB0@phx.gbl>


"not to mention you can't use DSM2 in Europe"

Wonder what QQ did in Portugal?
Anybody?
JLK

Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 11:29:59 -0400
From: rcpilot at wowway.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve



I'm still flying 72 MHz using my JR 10X radio.  I need to switch to 2.4 this winter.  This module is the solution to my problem.  I love the 10X, 9303 and 12X radios.  I don't like the DSM2 technology, I feel frequency hopping is a superior technology not to mention you can't use DSM2 in Europe.  Either Europe will eventually approve DSM2 or JR will switch to frequency hopping worldwide.  This solution will afford me more time to see what JR decides to do.  So I plan to try this module out on my foamies and park flyers and if I experience no problems I will use it in my pattern planes come this spring unless JR makes a switch to frequency hopping.  I know there are a lot of people in my situation.

 

Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:58:31 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve



In all seriousness, I think it makes little sense to cross over brands this way.  FASST, JR, or Airtronics; things work just fine.  I could see the initial idea that Horizon had with Spektrum to get the world moving to Spread Spectrum with their modules, but I think that time has passed us by.  As far as preserving the value of an investment in a transmitter by moving to another brand of receivers with a module - why? Go with a brand you like and don't look back to gimmicks to cross over part way.  You always lose something in the process.
 
Ed
 







Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 07:01:51 -0700
From: bob at toprudder.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve







Personally, I like the FASST system. I must have a dozen 2.4g receivers now. I have nothing against the JR/Spektrum, a lot of my friends fly JR (I am in a very small minority in my club flying Futaba). I will admit that I bought the Spektrum module for one of my old Futaba transmitters, so that I could do the "bind-n-fly" thing as well.
 
I will tell you guys a funny story. I was at Efest this year. I was flying a Vapor over in the corner for the ultralight planes, and heard someone walk up behing a friend of mine (Jeff Phillips, Radioactive Airshow Team) and start asking him how he liked the Vapors. Well, I thought it must be someone who had never flown a Vapor, so I turned around and handed him my transmitter, an old Futaba 7UA with a Spektrum module, so he could fly it. It happened to be Peter Goldsmith. :-)  I wish I had said "feel the difference" to him. 
 
Bob R.


--- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote:









Bill,
You are a one-percenter among the one-percenters! LOL 
 
I actually bought the Spektrum module with Rx for my Futaba 12Fg because it was such a good deal. I'm going to use this setup for indoor this year with some of those really small Spektrum receivers. It's also great for the E-Flite Bind-N-Fly models. I just didn't see the point in going "the other way" but I guess in your case it makes sense.
 
John Pavlick




 


Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. Get it now. 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 		 	   		  
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From rcmaster199 at aol.com  Wed Sep 23 08:32:47 2009
From: rcmaster199 at aol.com (rcmaster199 at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 16:32:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com>

It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some just never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat differentiating maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor Pattern circles. They simply consume too much real estate and contradict the very essence of why we in Pattern moved to quiet our models. Noise reduction footprint was at the core of that effort some 25 years ago.


?


As my good friend Dean Pappas?and I have discussed?on many occasions, rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as neat as circles and consume no more footprint than the typical schedule would. Oh BTW, these are far less difficult to judge objectively


?


MattK










-----Original Message-----

From: Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt;

To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns








It's funny.? I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend to work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a pattern airplane.? Ofcourse it doesn't quite?measure up, but I found that I really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through rolls where the only?skill involved is being able to stop on time.? I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10 minutes of 3d-ish garbage,?until I finally realized that it was really?not?very satisfying.? Foamies are more fun these days than knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.?? I guess I'm just getting old...

?

Ed

?

&gt; Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700

&gt; From: seefo at san.rr.com

&gt; To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

&gt; Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

&gt; 

&gt; Vince,

&gt; 

&gt; The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll. The IAC 

&gt; Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to differentiate it 

&gt; from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never 

&gt; flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.

&gt; 

&gt; -Doug

&gt; 

&gt; 

&gt; 

&gt; &gt; 

&gt; &gt;

&gt; &gt; Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate 

&gt; &gt; class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast. 

&gt; &gt; IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's class. I am 

&gt; &gt; not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.

&gt; &gt;

&gt; &gt; 

&gt; &gt;

&gt; 

&gt; _______________________________________________

&gt; NSRCA-discussion mailing list

&gt; NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

&gt; http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion





Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. Sign up now. = 


_______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion  

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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Wed Sep 23 08:53:39 2009
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 16:53:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <1949197942.1977161253719799757.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
References: <1417000792.1975911253719595549.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
Message-ID: <BLU121-W9B6539356DC9BE56C83AAE8DB0@phx.gbl>


Are you aware of situations where DSM doesn't work?
 


Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 11:29:59 -0400
From: rcpilot at wowway.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve





I'm still flying 72 MHz using my JR 10X radio.  I need to switch to 2.4 this winter.  This module is the solution to my problem.  I love the 10X, 9303 and 12X radios.  I don't like the DSM2 technology, I feel frequency hopping is a superior technology not to mention you can't use DSM2 in Europe.  Either Europe will eventually approve DSM2 or JR will switch to frequency hopping worldwide.  This solution will afford me more time to see what JR decides to do.  So I plan to try this module out on my foamies and park flyers and if I experience no problems I will use it in my pattern planes come this spring unless JR makes a switch to frequency hopping.  I know there are a lot of people in my situation.

 

Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:58:31 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve



In all seriousness, I think it makes little sense to cross over brands this way.  FASST, JR, or Airtronics; things work just fine.  I could see the initial idea that Horizon had with Spektrum to get the world moving to Spread Spectrum with their modules, but I think that time has passed us by.  As far as preserving the value of an investment in a transmitter by moving to another brand of receivers with a module - why? Go with a brand you like and don't look back to gimmicks to cross over part way.  You always lose something in the process.
 
Ed
 







Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 07:01:51 -0700
From: bob at toprudder.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve







Personally, I like the FASST system. I must have a dozen 2.4g receivers now. I have nothing against the JR/Spektrum, a lot of my friends fly JR (I am in a very small minority in my club flying Futaba). I will admit that I bought the Spektrum module for one of my old Futaba transmitters, so that I could do the "bind-n-fly" thing as well.
 
I will tell you guys a funny story. I was at Efest this year. I was flying a Vapor over in the corner for the ultralight planes, and heard someone walk up behing a friend of mine (Jeff Phillips, Radioactive Airshow Team) and start asking him how he liked the Vapors. Well, I thought it must be someone who had never flown a Vapor, so I turned around and handed him my transmitter, an old Futaba 7UA with a Spektrum module, so he could fly it. It happened to be Peter Goldsmith. :-)  I wish I had said "feel the difference" to him. 
 
Bob R.


--- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote:









Bill,
You are a one-percenter among the one-percenters! LOL 
 
I actually bought the Spektrum module with Rx for my Futaba 12Fg because it was such a good deal. I'm going to use this setup for indoor this year with some of those really small Spektrum receivers. It's also great for the E-Flite Bind-N-Fly models. I just didn't see the point in going "the other way" but I guess in your case it makes sense.
 
John Pavlick




 


Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. Get it now. 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 		 	   		  
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From geobet4 at verizon.net  Wed Sep 23 09:13:25 2009
From: geobet4 at verizon.net (GEORGE KENNIE)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 17:13:25 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M
Message-ID: <D5C0973A3E6E489C9EFB663C69A252D9@george15cf36d8>




I need a little help understanding the correct execution of the # 1 Maneuver in P-11.

The Aresti shows the model approaching from the left. As the first radius is completed and the model assumes a vertical track,
the requirement is to execute 3 points of a 4 point roll centered on the upline with the stall turn executed at the apex of the line.
Due to the fact that I like to present the canopy to the judges on the stall I will roll left on the upline (trust me, I can do it either way
and I realize there is no mandate, it's just my own aesthetic preference).
Now comes the sticky wicket,......on the down line I will be rolling to the right in preparation for the entry radius into the integrated
1/2 outside. The fact that the 1/4 roll was also centered on the downline will display that outside preparation position for the 1/2 
duration of the downline. My question is: .........as I enter the bottom radius and start my roll, is there a roll direction requirement?
If I roll LEFT (which will present the canopy) the judges could easily become confused and think that I'm doing an inside 1/2 loop
at the bottom, which is really not the case as I had to push to initiate the 1/2 loop. If I roll to the RIGHT the last 1/2 of the loop looks 
like an inside 1/2 loop. So, I guess my basic question is, am I free to roll according to my whim?   

I was unable to find any written FAI maneuver descriptions on our site. Is there a link that I'm missing? 

Thanks Guys,

Georgie
 
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Wed Sep 23 09:18:26 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 17:18:26 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M
In-Reply-To: <D5C0973A3E6E489C9EFB663C69A252D9@george15cf36d8>
References: <D5C0973A3E6E489C9EFB663C69A252D9@george15cf36d8>
Message-ID: <FDBD00260BE84B85996A3C7222C62726@UncleJasPC>

roll direction is not specified, chose the way you prefer

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: GEORGE KENNIE 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:13 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M





  I need a little help understanding the correct execution of the # 1 Maneuver in P-11.

  The Aresti shows the model approaching from the left. As the first radius is completed and the model assumes a vertical track,
  the requirement is to execute 3 points of a 4 point roll centered on the upline with the stall turn executed at the apex of the line.
  Due to the fact that I like to present the canopy to the judges on the stall I will roll left on the upline (trust me, I can do it either way
  and I realize there is no mandate, it's just my own aesthetic preference).
  Now comes the sticky wicket,......on the down line I will be rolling to the right in preparation for the entry radius into the integrated
  1/2 outside. The fact that the 1/4 roll was also centered on the downline will display that outside preparation position for the 1/2 
  duration of the downline. My question is: .........as I enter the bottom radius and start my roll, is there a roll direction requirement?
  If I roll LEFT (which will present the canopy) the judges could easily become confused and think that I'm doing an inside 1/2 loop
  at the bottom, which is really not the case as I had to push to initiate the 1/2 loop. If I roll to the RIGHT the last 1/2 of the loop looks 
  like an inside 1/2 loop. So, I guess my basic question is, am I free to roll according to my whim?   

  I was unable to find any written FAI maneuver descriptions on our site. Is there a link that I'm missing? 

  Thanks Guys,

  Georgie



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Wed Sep 23 09:29:09 2009
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 17:29:09 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M
In-Reply-To: <FDBD00260BE84B85996A3C7222C62726@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <7nafpc$1h7hc9@dmzms99902.na.baesystems.com>

It will also be difficult to match the roll-rates of the non-point roll elements.
jim

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of J Shu
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:18 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] M

roll direction is not specified, chose the way you prefer

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com<http://www.shulmanaviation.com>
www.composite-arf.com<http://www.composite-arf.com>
----- Original Message -----
From: GEORGE KENNIE<mailto:geobet4 at verizon.net>
To: General pattern discussion<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:13 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M




I need a little help understanding the correct execution of the # 1 Maneuver in P-11.

The Aresti shows the model approaching from the left. As the first radius is completed and the model assumes a vertical track,
the requirement is to execute 3 points of a 4 point roll centered on the upline with the stall turn executed at the apex of the line.
Due to the fact that I like to present the canopy to the judges on the stall I will roll left on the upline (trust me, I can do it either way
and I realize there is no mandate, it's just my own aesthetic preference).
Now comes the sticky wicket,......on the down line I will be rolling to the right in preparation for the entry radius into the integrated
1/2 outside. The fact that the 1/4 roll was also centered on the downline will display that outside preparation position for the 1/2
duration of the downline. My question is: .........as I enter the bottom radius and start my roll, is there a roll direction requirement?
If I roll LEFT (which will present the canopy) the judges could easily become confused and think that I'm doing an inside 1/2 loop
at the bottom, which is really not the case as I had to push to initiate the 1/2 loop. If I roll to the RIGHT the last 1/2 of the loop looks
like an inside 1/2 loop. So, I guess my basic question is, am I free to roll according to my whim?

I was unable to find any written FAI maneuver descriptions on our site. Is there a link that I'm missing?

Thanks Guys,

Georgie

________________________________
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From moleski at canisius.edu  Wed Sep 23 09:39:24 2009
From: moleski at canisius.edu (Martin X. Moleski, SJ)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 17:39:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M
In-Reply-To: <D5C0973A3E6E489C9EFB663C69A252D9@george15cf36d8>
References: <D5C0973A3E6E489C9EFB663C69A252D9@george15cf36d8>
Message-ID: <4ABA5D47.2060702@canisius.edu>

GEORGE KENNIE wrote:

> I was unable to find any written FAI maneuver descriptions on our site.
> Is there a link that I'm missing?

Judging section, on the right-hand side?

http://nsrca.us/judging-sequences/judgehome.html

					Marty

From DaveL322 at comcast.net  Wed Sep 23 09:43:23 2009
From: DaveL322 at comcast.net (Dave)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 17:43:23 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M
In-Reply-To: <7nafpc$1h7hc9@dmzms99902.na.baesystems.com>
References: <FDBD00260BE84B85996A3C7222C62726@UncleJasPC>
	<7nafpc$1h7hc9@dmzms99902.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <3E14533998834D0BA3F64B55046BA152@davedesktop>

I don?t believe there is a requirement (in FAI) for the rate of the ? roll
to match the rate of the 1/4rolls.

 

Regards,


Dave

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Woodward, Jim
(US SSA)
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:29 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] M

 

It will also be difficult to match the roll-rates of the non-point roll
elements.

jim

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of J Shu
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:18 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] M

 

roll direction is not specified, chose the way you prefer


Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

----- Original Message ----- 

From: GEORGE KENNIE <mailto:geobet4 at verizon.net>  

To: General pattern discussion <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:13 PM

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M

 

 

 

 

I need a little help understanding the correct execution of the # 1 Maneuver
in P-11.

 

The Aresti shows the model approaching from the left. As the first radius is
completed and the model assumes a vertical track,

the requirement is to execute 3 points of a 4 point roll centered on the
upline with the stall turn executed at the apex of the line.

Due to the fact that I like to present the canopy to the judges on the stall
I will roll left on the upline (trust me, I can do it either way

and I realize there is no mandate, it's just my own aesthetic preference).

Now comes the sticky wicket,......on the down line I will be rolling to the
right in preparation for the entry radius into the integrated

1/2 outside. The fact that the 1/4 roll was also centered on the downline
will display that outside preparation position for the 1/2 

duration of the downline. My question is: .........as I enter the bottom
radius and start my roll, is there a roll direction requirement?

If I roll LEFT (which will present the canopy) the judges could easily
become confused and think that I'm doing an inside 1/2 loop

at the bottom, which is really not the case as I had to push to initiate the
1/2 loop. If I roll to the RIGHT the last 1/2 of the loop looks 

like an inside 1/2 loop. So, I guess my basic question is, am I free to roll
according to my whim?   

 

I was unable to find any written FAI maneuver descriptions on our site. Is
there a link that I'm missing? 

 

Thanks Guys,

 

Georgie

 


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From rcpilot at wowway.com  Wed Sep 23 09:47:07 2009
From: rcpilot at wowway.com (RON HANSEN)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 17:47:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <350281092.2013831253727846753.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
Message-ID: <697909526.2014441253728026563.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>

The issue isn't whether frequency hopping is better than DSM but rather will JR stick with DSM indefinitely.? I don't want to spend $1400 on a new transmitter that will be out of style in the near future.? Matter of fact, you can buy conversion kits from German companies (Weatronics and ACT) that are? better than both DSM and FASST.? The Germans use frequency hopping where the transmitter and receiver talk back and forth to each other.? These German systems aren't cheap but they are certainly better than what we have in the US.? Regardless of what system you go with 2.4 GHz is better than 72 MHz. 
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com> 
To: "NSRCA List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 12:53:37 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve 

Are you aware of situations where DSM doesn't work? 
? 

Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 11:29:59 -0400 
From: rcpilot at wowway.com 
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve 


I'm still flying 72 MHz using my JR 10X radio.? I need to switch to 2.4 this winter.? This module is the solution to my problem.? I love the 10X, 9303 and 12X radios.? I don't like the DSM2 technology, I feel frequency hopping is a superior technology not to mention you can't use DSM2 in Europe.? Either Europe will eventually approve DSM2 or JR will switch to frequency hopping worldwide.? This solution will afford me more time to see what JR decides to do.? So I plan to try this module out on my foamies and park flyers and if I experience no problems I will use it in my pattern planes come this spring unless JR makes a switch to frequency hopping.? I know there are a lot of people in my situation. 
? 
Ron 
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com> 
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:58:31 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve 

In all seriousness, I think it makes little sense to cross over brands this way.? FASST, JR, or Airtronics; things work just fine.? I could see?the initial idea that Horizon?had with Spektrum to get the world moving to Spread Spectrum with their modules, but I think that time has passed us by.? As far as preserving the value of an investment in a transmitter by moving to another brand of receivers with a module - why??Go with a brand you like and don't look back to gimmicks to cross over part way.? You always lose something in the process. 
? 
Ed 
? 





Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 07:01:51 -0700 
From: bob at toprudder.com 
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve 



Personally, I like the FASST system. I must have a dozen 2.4g receivers now. I have nothing against the JR/Spektrum, a lot of my friends fly JR (I am in a very small minority in my club flying Futaba). I will admit that I bought the Spektrum module for one of my old Futaba transmitters, so that I could do the "bind-n-fly" thing as well. 

I will tell you guys a funny story. I was at Efest this year. I was flying a Vapor over in the corner for the ultralight planes, and heard someone walk up behing a friend of mine (Jeff Phillips, Radioactive Airshow Team) and start asking him how he liked the Vapors. Well, I thought it must be someone who had never flown a Vapor, so I turned around and handed him my transmitter, an old Futaba 7UA with a Spektrum module, so he could fly it. It happened to be Peter Goldsmith. :-)? I wish I had said "feel the difference" to him. 

Bob R. 


--- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote: 






Bill, 
You are a one-percenter among the one-percenters! LOL 

I actually bought the Spektrum module with Rx for my Futaba 12Fg because it was such a good deal. I'm going to use this setup for indoor this year with some of those really small Spektrum receivers. It's also great for the E-Flite Bind-N-Fly models. I just didn't see the point in going "the other way" but?I guess in your case it makes sense. 

John Pavlick 




? 

Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. Get it now. 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 

Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail?. See how. 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From tony at radiosouthrc.com  Wed Sep 23 10:07:19 2009
From: tony at radiosouthrc.com (Tony)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 18:07:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <697909526.2014441253728026563.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
References: <350281092.2013831253727846753.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
	<697909526.2014441253728026563.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
Message-ID: <77801960F67D465FA352349306CED63E@Tony>

JR is not Spektrum..  JR has been selling 2.4Ghz frequency hopping gear in
Europe for almost a year.  Check it out under the Graupner name.

For all the info go to  http://www.graupner-ifs-system.de/en.html

 

 

Tony Stillman, President

Radio South, Inc.

139 Altama Connector, Box 322

Brunswick, GA  31525

1-800-962-7802

www.radiosouthrc.com

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of RON HANSEN
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:47 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

 

The issue isn't whether frequency hopping is better than DSM but rather will
JR stick with DSM indefinitely.  I don't want to spend $1400 on a new
transmitter that will be out of style in the near future.  Matter of fact,
you can buy conversion kits from German companies (Weatronics and ACT) that
are better than both DSM and FASST.  The Germans use frequency hopping where
the transmitter and receiver talk back and forth to each other.  These
German systems aren't cheap but they are certainly better than what we have
in the US.  Regardless of what system you go with 2.4 GHz is better than 72
MHz.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: "NSRCA List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 12:53:37 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

Are you aware of situations where DSM doesn't work?
 

  _____  

Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 11:29:59 -0400
From: rcpilot at wowway.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

I'm still flying 72 MHz using my JR 10X radio.  I need to switch to 2.4 this
winter.  This module is the solution to my problem.  I love the 10X, 9303
and 12X radios.  I don't like the DSM2 technology, I feel frequency hopping
is a superior technology not to mention you can't use DSM2 in Europe.
Either Europe will eventually approve DSM2 or JR will switch to frequency
hopping worldwide.  This solution will afford me more time to see what JR
decides to do.  So I plan to try this module out on my foamies and park
flyers and if I experience no problems I will use it in my pattern planes
come this spring unless JR makes a switch to frequency hopping.  I know
there are a lot of people in my situation.
 
Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:58:31 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

In all seriousness, I think it makes little sense to cross over brands this
way.  FASST, JR, or Airtronics; things work just fine.  I could see the
initial idea that Horizon had with Spektrum to get the world moving to
Spread Spectrum with their modules, but I think that time has passed us by.
As far as preserving the value of an investment in a transmitter by moving
to another brand of receivers with a module - why? Go with a brand you like
and don't look back to gimmicks to cross over part way.  You always lose
something in the process.
 
Ed
 

  _____  


Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 07:01:51 -0700
From: bob at toprudder.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve




Personally, I like the FASST system. I must have a dozen 2.4g receivers now.
I have nothing against the JR/Spektrum, a lot of my friends fly JR (I am in
a very small minority in my club flying Futaba). I will admit that I bought
the Spektrum module for one of my old Futaba transmitters, so that I could
do the "bind-n-fly" thing as well.

 

I will tell you guys a funny story. I was at Efest this year. I was flying a
Vapor over in the corner for the ultralight planes, and heard someone walk
up behing a friend of mine (Jeff Phillips, Radioactive Airshow Team) and
start asking him how he liked the Vapors. Well, I thought it must be someone
who had never flown a Vapor, so I turned around and handed him my
transmitter, an old Futaba 7UA with a Spektrum module, so he could fly it.
It happened to be Peter Goldsmith. :-)  I wish I had said "feel the
difference" to him. 

 

Bob R.



--- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote:

 


Bill,

You are a one-percenter among the one-percenters! LOL 

 

I actually bought the Spektrum module with Rx for my Futaba 12Fg because it
was such a good deal. I'm going to use this setup for indoor this year with
some of those really small Spektrum receivers. It's also great for the
E-Flite Bind-N-Fly models. I just didn't see the point in going "the other
way" but I guess in your case it makes sense.

 

John Pavlick

 


 

 

  _____  

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_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing
list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

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From don.ramsey at suddenlink.net  Wed Sep 23 10:19:17 2009
From: don.ramsey at suddenlink.net (Don Ramsey)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 18:19:17 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com>
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl>
	<8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>

Matt,
 
You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to have
rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a good argument;
loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate, etc.  But, they still
want the rolling circles in all future patterns and especially F patterns.
It sure limits the number of fields that can fly those patterns unless the
pilots decide to roll in.
 
Don
 
 
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
rcmaster199 at aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
 
It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some just never
get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat differentiating maneuvers BUT
not desirable in neither IMAC nor Pattern circles. They simply consume too
much real estate and contradict the very essence of why we in Pattern moved
to quiet our models. Noise reduction footprint was at the core of that
effort some 25 years ago.
 
As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many occasions,
rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as neat as circles and
consume no more footprint than the typical schedule would. Oh BTW, these are
far less difficult to judge objectively
 
MattK
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend to work
on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a pattern airplane.
Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I found that I really have no
enthusiasm left for wapping through rolls where the only skill involved is
being able to stop on time.  I admit, on the last flight of the day I
digressed and did about 10 minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally
realized that it was really not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these
days than knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just
getting old...
 
Ed
 
> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
> From: seefo at san.rr.com
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> 
> Vince,
> 
> The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll. The IAC 
> Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to differentiate it 
> from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never 
> flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
> 
> -Doug
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> >
> > Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate 
> > class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast. 
> > IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's class. I am 
> > not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
> >
> > 
> >
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  _____  

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From DaveL322 at comcast.net  Wed Sep 23 10:25:03 2009
From: DaveL322 at comcast.net (Dave)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 18:25:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <77801960F67D465FA352349306CED63E@Tony>
References: <350281092.2013831253727846753.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com><697909526.2014441253728026563.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
	<77801960F67D465FA352349306CED63E@Tony>
Message-ID: <BAA9D52C7A9941D884FF6A22A7D360A7@davedesktop>

DSM was/is a protocol used by the original Spektrum DX6 radio.  Horizon is
the manufacturer of Spektrum and distributes internationally.

 

DSM2 is a protocol used by newer Spektrum radios and JR.  Horizon is the
importer and distributor in North American for JR.  As Tony points out, DSM2
is not the only protocol used by JR.

 

Regards,


Dave Lockhart, Team JR



 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Tony
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 2:07 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

 

JR is not Spektrum..  JR has been selling 2.4Ghz frequency hopping gear in
Europe for almost a year.  Check it out under the Graupner name.

For all the info go to  http://www.graupner-ifs-system.de/en.html

 

 

Tony Stillman, President

Radio South, Inc.

139 Altama Connector, Box 322

Brunswick, GA  31525

1-800-962-7802

www.radiosouthrc.com

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of RON HANSEN
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:47 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

 

The issue isn't whether frequency hopping is better than DSM but rather will
JR stick with DSM indefinitely.  I don't want to spend $1400 on a new
transmitter that will be out of style in the near future.  Matter of fact,
you can buy conversion kits from German companies (Weatronics and ACT) that
are better than both DSM and FASST.  The Germans use frequency hopping where
the transmitter and receiver talk back and forth to each other.  These
German systems aren't cheap but they are certainly better than what we have
in the US.  Regardless of what system you go with 2.4 GHz is better than 72
MHz.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: "NSRCA List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 12:53:37 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

Are you aware of situations where DSM doesn't work?
 

  _____  

Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 11:29:59 -0400
From: rcpilot at wowway.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

I'm still flying 72 MHz using my JR 10X radio.  I need to switch to 2.4 this
winter.  This module is the solution to my problem.  I love the 10X, 9303
and 12X radios.  I don't like the DSM2 technology, I feel frequency hopping
is a superior technology not to mention you can't use DSM2 in Europe.
Either Europe will eventually approve DSM2 or JR will switch to frequency
hopping worldwide.  This solution will afford me more time to see what JR
decides to do.  So I plan to try this module out on my foamies and park
flyers and if I experience no problems I will use it in my pattern planes
come this spring unless JR makes a switch to frequency hopping.  I know
there are a lot of people in my situation.
 
Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:58:31 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

In all seriousness, I think it makes little sense to cross over brands this
way.  FASST, JR, or Airtronics; things work just fine.  I could see the
initial idea that Horizon had with Spektrum to get the world moving to
Spread Spectrum with their modules, but I think that time has passed us by.
As far as preserving the value of an investment in a transmitter by moving
to another brand of receivers with a module - why? Go with a brand you like
and don't look back to gimmicks to cross over part way.  You always lose
something in the process.
 
Ed
 

  _____  


Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 07:01:51 -0700
From: bob at toprudder.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve


Personally, I like the FASST system. I must have a dozen 2.4g receivers now.
I have nothing against the JR/Spektrum, a lot of my friends fly JR (I am in
a very small minority in my club flying Futaba). I will admit that I bought
the Spektrum module for one of my old Futaba transmitters, so that I could
do the "bind-n-fly" thing as well.

 

I will tell you guys a funny story. I was at Efest this year. I was flying a
Vapor over in the corner for the ultralight planes, and heard someone walk
up behing a friend of mine (Jeff Phillips, Radioactive Airshow Team) and
start asking him how he liked the Vapors. Well, I thought it must be someone
who had never flown a Vapor, so I turned around and handed him my
transmitter, an old Futaba 7UA with a Spektrum module, so he could fly it.
It happened to be Peter Goldsmith. :-)  I wish I had said "feel the
difference" to him. 

 

Bob R.



--- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote:

 


Bill,

You are a one-percenter among the one-percenters! LOL 

 

I actually bought the Spektrum module with Rx for my Futaba 12Fg because it
was such a good deal. I'm going to use this setup for indoor this year with
some of those really small Spektrum receivers. It's also great for the
E-Flite Bind-N-Fly models. I just didn't see the point in going "the other
way" but I guess in your case it makes sense.

 

John Pavlick

 


 

 

  _____  

Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. Get it now.
<http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/171222986/direct/01/>  
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing
list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

  _____  

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From rcpilot at wowway.com  Wed Sep 23 10:35:11 2009
From: rcpilot at wowway.com (RON HANSEN)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 18:35:11 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <561332308.2025481253730865446.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
Message-ID: <1256835684.2025651253730909313.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>



I'm aware of the JR selling radios in Europe under the Graupner name.? Those radios are using the Xtreme Performance Systems (XPS) Xtreme Link technology (a form of frequency hopping).? From what I understand, those radios look the same from the outside but the programming interface is different and from what I hear is actually better than the JR programming.? Why doesn't JR offer that frequency hopping technology in the US? ? I might buy one.? However, I've heard good and bad about the XPS systems. 



Everyone, (Futaba, Hitec, Airtronics, Multiplex, Weatronics, XPS, Graupner, and ACT) is all using some form of frequency hopping!!!? Why???? Because it must be better.? I like the JR radios and accessories just not their choice to use DSM over frequency hopping.? Especially if they decide to switch to frequency hopping in the future. 


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tony" <tony at radiosouthrc.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 2:07:12 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve 




JR is not Spektrum?.? JR has been selling 2.4Ghz frequency hopping gear in Europe for almost a year.? Check it out under the Graupner name. 

For all the info go to? http://www.graupner-ifs-system.de/en.html 






Tony Stillman, President 

Radio South, Inc. 

139 Altama Connector, Box 322 

Brunswick , GA? 31525 

1-800-962-7802 

www.radiosouthrc.com 




From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of RON HANSEN 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:47 PM 
To: General pattern discussion 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve 




The issue isn't whether frequency hopping is better than DSM but rather will JR stick with DSM indefinitely.? I don't want to spend $1400 on a new transmitter that will be out of style in the near future.? Matter of fact, you can buy conversion kits from German companies (Weatronics and ACT) that are?better than both DSM and FASST.? The Germans use frequency hopping where the transmitter and receiver talk back and forth to each other.? These German systems aren't cheap but they are certainly better than what we have in the US.? Regardless of what system you go with 2.4 GHz is better than 72 MHz. 
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com> 
To: "NSRCA List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 12:53:37 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve 

Are you aware of situations where DSM doesn't work? 
? 



Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 11:29:59 -0400 
From: rcpilot at wowway.com 
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve 


I'm still flying 72 MHz using my JR 10X radio.? I need to switch to 2.4 this winter.? This module is the solution to my problem.? I love the 10X, 9303 and 12X radios.? I don't like the DSM2 technology, I feel frequency hopping is a superior technology not to mention you can't use DSM2 in Europe.? Either Europe will eventually approve DSM2 or JR will switch to frequency hopping worldwide.? This solution will afford me more time to see what JR decides to do.? So I plan to try this module out on my foamies and park flyers and if I experience no problems I will use it in my pattern planes come this spring unless JR makes a switch to frequency hopping.? I know there are a lot of people in my situation. 
? 
Ron 
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com> 
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:58:31 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve 

In all seriousness, I think it makes little sense to cross over brands this way.? FASST, JR, or Airtronics; things work just fine.? I could see?the initial idea that Horizon?had with Spektrum to get the world moving to Spread Spectrum with their modules, but I think that time has passed us by.? As far as preserving the value of an investment in a transmitter by moving to another brand of receivers with a module - why??Go with a brand you like and don't look back to gimmicks to cross over part way.? You always lose something in the process. 
? 
Ed 
? 




Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 07:01:51 -0700 
From: bob at toprudder.com 
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve 




Personally, I like the FASST system. I must have a dozen 2.4g receivers now. I have nothing against the JR/Spektrum, a lot of my friends fly JR (I am in a very small minority in my club flying Futaba). I will admit that I bought the Spektrum module for one of my old Futaba transmitters, so that I could do the "bind-n-fly" thing as well. 





I will tell you guys a funny story. I was at Efest this year. I was flying a Vapor over in the corner for the ultralight planes, and heard someone walk up behing a friend of mine (Jeff Phillips, Radioactive Airshow Team) and start asking him how he liked the Vapors. Well, I thought it must be someone who had never flown a Vapor, so I turned around and handed him my transmitter, an old Futaba 7UA with a Spektrum module, so he could fly it. It happened to be Peter Goldsmith. :-)? I wish I had said "feel the difference" to him. 





Bob R. 




--- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote: 







Bill, 


You are a one-percenter among the one-percenters! LOL 





I actually bought the Spektrum module with Rx for my Futaba 12Fg because it was such a good deal. I'm going to use this setup for indoor this year with some of those really small Spektrum receivers. It's also great for the E-Flite Bind-N-Fly models. I just didn't see the point in going "the other way" but?I guess in your case it makes sense. 





John Pavlick 





? 





Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. Get it now. 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 





Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail?. See how. 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Wed Sep 23 10:40:21 2009
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 18:40:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M
In-Reply-To: <3E14533998834D0BA3F64B55046BA152@davedesktop>
Message-ID: <814i1h$4d0rcq@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>

Thanks Dave,

I was falling back to the position that all rolls in a maneuver have to match roll rates (excluding point rolls).  It would be easier to perform the maneuver if the ? roll integrated in the ? loop does not have to match the other roll rates.
Thanks,
Jim


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:43 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] M

I don't believe there is a requirement (in FAI) for the rate of the ? roll to match the rate of the 1/4rolls.

Regards,

Dave

________________________________
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Woodward, Jim (US SSA)
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:29 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] M

It will also be difficult to match the roll-rates of the non-point roll elements.
jim

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of J Shu
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:18 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] M

roll direction is not specified, chose the way you prefer

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com<http://www.shulmanaviation.com>
www.composite-arf.com<http://www.composite-arf.com>
----- Original Message -----
From: GEORGE KENNIE<mailto:geobet4 at verizon.net>
To: General pattern discussion<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:13 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M




I need a little help understanding the correct execution of the # 1 Maneuver in P-11.

The Aresti shows the model approaching from the left. As the first radius is completed and the model assumes a vertical track,
the requirement is to execute 3 points of a 4 point roll centered on the upline with the stall turn executed at the apex of the line.
Due to the fact that I like to present the canopy to the judges on the stall I will roll left on the upline (trust me, I can do it either way
and I realize there is no mandate, it's just my own aesthetic preference).
Now comes the sticky wicket,......on the down line I will be rolling to the right in preparation for the entry radius into the integrated
1/2 outside. The fact that the 1/4 roll was also centered on the downline will display that outside preparation position for the 1/2
duration of the downline. My question is: .........as I enter the bottom radius and start my roll, is there a roll direction requirement?
If I roll LEFT (which will present the canopy) the judges could easily become confused and think that I'm doing an inside 1/2 loop
at the bottom, which is really not the case as I had to push to initiate the 1/2 loop. If I roll to the RIGHT the last 1/2 of the loop looks
like an inside 1/2 loop. So, I guess my basic question is, am I free to roll according to my whim?

I was unable to find any written FAI maneuver descriptions on our site. Is there a link that I'm missing?

Thanks Guys,

Georgie

________________________________
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Wed Sep 23 10:54:32 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 18:54:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <697909526.2014441253728026563.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
References: <350281092.2013831253727846753.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
	<697909526.2014441253728026563.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C0D@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

Offlist!

BY AIRTRONICS!!!! ??   Seriously though..  2.4 Frequency Hopping (similar to Futaba) and less than $500.  ?

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of RON HANSEN
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:47 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

The issue isn't whether frequency hopping is better than DSM but rather will JR stick with DSM indefinitely.  I don't want to spend $1400 on a new transmitter that will be out of style in the near future.  Matter of fact, you can buy conversion kits from German companies (Weatronics and ACT) that are better than both DSM and FASST.  The Germans use frequency hopping where the transmitter and receiver talk back and forth to each other.  These German systems aren't cheap but they are certainly better than what we have in the US.  Regardless of what system you go with 2.4 GHz is better than 72 MHz.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: "NSRCA List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 12:53:37 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

Are you aware of situations where DSM doesn't work?

________________________________
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 11:29:59 -0400
From: rcpilot at wowway.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
I'm still flying 72 MHz using my JR 10X radio.  I need to switch to 2.4 this winter.  This module is the solution to my problem.  I love the 10X, 9303 and 12X radios.  I don't like the DSM2 technology, I feel frequency hopping is a superior technology not to mention you can't use DSM2 in Europe.  Either Europe will eventually approve DSM2 or JR will switch to frequency hopping worldwide.  This solution will afford me more time to see what JR decides to do.  So I plan to try this module out on my foamies and park flyers and if I experience no problems I will use it in my pattern planes come this spring unless JR makes a switch to frequency hopping.  I know there are a lot of people in my situation.

Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:58:31 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

In all seriousness, I think it makes little sense to cross over brands this way.  FASST, JR, or Airtronics; things work just fine.  I could see the initial idea that Horizon had with Spektrum to get the world moving to Spread Spectrum with their modules, but I think that time has passed us by.  As far as preserving the value of an investment in a transmitter by moving to another brand of receivers with a module - why? Go with a brand you like and don't look back to gimmicks to cross over part way.  You always lose something in the process.

Ed

________________________________

Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 07:01:51 -0700
From: bob at toprudder.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

Personally, I like the FASST system. I must have a dozen 2.4g receivers now. I have nothing against the JR/Spektrum, a lot of my friends fly JR (I am in a very small minority in my club flying Futaba). I will admit that I bought the Spektrum module for one of my old Futaba transmitters, so that I could do the "bind-n-fly" thing as well.

I will tell you guys a funny story. I was at Efest this year. I was flying a Vapor over in the corner for the ultralight planes, and heard someone walk up behing a friend of mine (Jeff Phillips, Radioactive Airshow Team) and start asking him how he liked the Vapors. Well, I thought it must be someone who had never flown a Vapor, so I turned around and handed him my transmitter, an old Futaba 7UA with a Spektrum module, so he could fly it. It happened to be Peter Goldsmith. :-)  I wish I had said "feel the difference" to him.

Bob R.


--- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote:

Bill,
You are a one-percenter among the one-percenters! LOL

I actually bought the Spektrum module with Rx for my Futaba 12Fg because it was such a good deal. I'm going to use this setup for indoor this year with some of those really small Spektrum receivers. It's also great for the E-Flite Bind-N-Fly models. I just didn't see the point in going "the other way" but I guess in your case it makes sense.

John Pavlick








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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Wed Sep 23 10:57:31 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 18:57:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C0D@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
References: <350281092.2013831253727846753.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
	<697909526.2014441253728026563.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
	<99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C0D@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C0E@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

Ok?that was MEANT to be offlist ? ?

Sorry Everyone? was just trying to have some fun with Ron.

-M

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Atwood, Mark
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 2:45 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

Offlist!

BY AIRTRONICS!!!! ??   Seriously though..  2.4 Frequency Hopping (similar to Futaba) and less than $500.  ?

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of RON HANSEN
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:47 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

The issue isn't whether frequency hopping is better than DSM but rather will JR stick with DSM indefinitely.  I don't want to spend $1400 on a new transmitter that will be out of style in the near future.  Matter of fact, you can buy conversion kits from German companies (Weatronics and ACT) that are better than both DSM and FASST.  The Germans use frequency hopping where the transmitter and receiver talk back and forth to each other.  These German systems aren't cheap but they are certainly better than what we have in the US.  Regardless of what system you go with 2.4 GHz is better than 72 MHz.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: "NSRCA List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 12:53:37 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

Are you aware of situations where DSM doesn't work?

________________________________
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 11:29:59 -0400
From: rcpilot at wowway.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
I'm still flying 72 MHz using my JR 10X radio.  I need to switch to 2.4 this winter.  This module is the solution to my problem.  I love the 10X, 9303 and 12X radios.  I don't like the DSM2 technology, I feel frequency hopping is a superior technology not to mention you can't use DSM2 in Europe.  Either Europe will eventually approve DSM2 or JR will switch to frequency hopping worldwide.  This solution will afford me more time to see what JR decides to do.  So I plan to try this module out on my foamies and park flyers and if I experience no problems I will use it in my pattern planes come this spring unless JR makes a switch to frequency hopping.  I know there are a lot of people in my situation.

Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:58:31 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

In all seriousness, I think it makes little sense to cross over brands this way.  FASST, JR, or Airtronics; things work just fine.  I could see the initial idea that Horizon had with Spektrum to get the world moving to Spread Spectrum with their modules, but I think that time has passed us by.  As far as preserving the value of an investment in a transmitter by moving to another brand of receivers with a module - why? Go with a brand you like and don't look back to gimmicks to cross over part way.  You always lose something in the process.

Ed

________________________________

Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 07:01:51 -0700
From: bob at toprudder.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
Personally, I like the FASST system. I must have a dozen 2.4g receivers now. I have nothing against the JR/Spektrum, a lot of my friends fly JR (I am in a very small minority in my club flying Futaba). I will admit that I bought the Spektrum module for one of my old Futaba transmitters, so that I could do the "bind-n-fly" thing as well.

I will tell you guys a funny story. I was at Efest this year. I was flying a Vapor over in the corner for the ultralight planes, and heard someone walk up behing a friend of mine (Jeff Phillips, Radioactive Airshow Team) and start asking him how he liked the Vapors. Well, I thought it must be someone who had never flown a Vapor, so I turned around and handed him my transmitter, an old Futaba 7UA with a Spektrum module, so he could fly it. It happened to be Peter Goldsmith. :-)  I wish I had said "feel the difference" to him.

Bob R.


--- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote:

Bill,
You are a one-percenter among the one-percenters! LOL

I actually bought the Spektrum module with Rx for my Futaba 12Fg because it was such a good deal. I'm going to use this setup for indoor this year with some of those really small Spektrum receivers. It's also great for the E-Flite Bind-N-Fly models. I just didn't see the point in going "the other way" but I guess in your case it makes sense.

John Pavlick








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_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.103/2378 - Release Date: 09/23/09 05:52:00

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From vanputte at cox.net  Wed Sep 23 10:57:32 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 18:57:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl>
	<8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com>
	<01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>
Message-ID: <B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net>

I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships  
host gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total  
list is  predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with  
predominantly European judges. The preponderance of European judges  
dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of  
judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the  
U.S., Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China,  
Japan, Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made  
up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?   
As the host organization, the NSRCA does.

Ron VP

On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:

> Matt,
>
> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to  
> have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a  
> good argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate,  
> etc.  But, they still want the rolling circles in all future  
> patterns and especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of  
> fields that can fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll  
> in.
>
> Don
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com
>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
>
>
> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some  
> just never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat  
> differentiating maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor  
> Pattern circles. They simply consume too much real estate and  
> contradict the very essence of why we in Pattern moved to quiet our  
> models. Noise reduction footprint was at the core of that effort  
> some 25 years ago.
>
>
>
> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many  
> occasions, rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as  
> neat as circles and consume no more footprint than the typical  
> schedule would. Oh BTW, these are far less difficult to judge  
> objectively
>
>
>
> MattK
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend  
> to work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a  
> pattern airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I  
> found that I really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through  
> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.   
> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10  
> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was  
> really not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than  
> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just  
> getting old...
>
> Ed
>
> > Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
> > From: seefo at san.rr.com
> > To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> >
> > Vince,
> >
> > The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.  
> The IAC
> > Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to  
> differentiate it
> > from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
> > flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
> >
> > -Doug
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
> > > class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
> > > IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's  
> class. I am
> > > not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. Sign  
> up now. =
>
> _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Wed Sep 23 11:00:01 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 19:00:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net>
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl>
	<8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com>
	<01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>
	<B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C10@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

Only Ron...who was actually around in 1911, would plan to still be around in 2111 :)

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 2:57 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships  
host gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total  
list is  predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with  
predominantly European judges. The preponderance of European judges  
dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of  
judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the  
U.S., Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China,  
Japan, Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made  
up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?   
As the host organization, the NSRCA does.

Ron VP

On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:

> Matt,
>
> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to  
> have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a  
> good argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate,  
> etc.  But, they still want the rolling circles in all future  
> patterns and especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of  
> fields that can fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll  
> in.
>
> Don
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com
>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
>
>
> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some  
> just never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat  
> differentiating maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor  
> Pattern circles. They simply consume too much real estate and  
> contradict the very essence of why we in Pattern moved to quiet our  
> models. Noise reduction footprint was at the core of that effort  
> some 25 years ago.
>
>
>
> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many  
> occasions, rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as  
> neat as circles and consume no more footprint than the typical  
> schedule would. Oh BTW, these are far less difficult to judge  
> objectively
>
>
>
> MattK
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend  
> to work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a  
> pattern airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I  
> found that I really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through  
> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.   
> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10  
> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was  
> really not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than  
> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just  
> getting old...
>
> Ed
>
> > Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
> > From: seefo at san.rr.com
> > To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> >
> > Vince,
> >
> > The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.  
> The IAC
> > Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to  
> differentiate it
> > from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
> > flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
> >
> > -Doug
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
> > > class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
> > > IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's  
> class. I am
> > > not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. Sign  
> up now. =
>
> _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.103/2378 - Release Date: 09/23/09 05:52:00

From vanputte at cox.net  Wed Sep 23 11:01:54 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 19:01:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Fwd:  unknowns
References: <B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net>
Message-ID: <DF82AAA6-85B5-4445-9E86-D0B2F0151CB7@cox.net>

Sigh!  I should have written:

"I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships  
host gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total  
list is  predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with  
predominantly European judges. The preponderance of European judges  
dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of  
judges for the 2011 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the  
U.S., Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China,  
Japan, Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made  
up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?   
As the host organization, the NSRCA does."

Ron VP


Begin forwarded message:

> I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships  
> host gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total  
> list is  predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with  
> predominantly European judges. The preponderance of European judges  
> dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of  
> judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the  
> U.S., Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China,  
> Japan, Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made  
> up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?   
> As the host organization, the NSRCA does.
>
> Ron VP


From vanputte at cox.net  Wed Sep 23 11:08:36 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 19:08:36 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C10@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl>
	<8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com>
	<01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>
	<B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net>
	<99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C10@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <FA888E76-D629-467E-A879-9539F29B2693@cox.net>

I kinda wish that people like Mark didn't read my stuff quite so  
carefully.  I also wonder why he isn't at work.  Hmmmm, maybe he is.   
I'll never tell.

2111?  I'll only be 176 years old.

Ron VP

On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:50 PM, Atwood, Mark wrote:

> Only Ron...who was actually around in 1911, would plan to still be  
> around in 2111 :)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 2:57 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships
> host gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total
> list is  predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with
> predominantly European judges. The preponderance of European judges
> dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of
> judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the
> U.S., Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China,
> Japan, Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made
> up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?
> As the host organization, the NSRCA does.
>
> Ron VP
>
> On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:
>
>> Matt,
>>
>> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to
>> have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a
>> good argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate,
>> etc.  But, they still want the rolling circles in all future
>> patterns and especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of
>> fields that can fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll
>> in.
>>
>> Don
>>
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-
>> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com
>>
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>>
>>
>> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some
>> just never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat
>> differentiating maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor
>> Pattern circles. They simply consume too much real estate and
>> contradict the very essence of why we in Pattern moved to quiet our
>> models. Noise reduction footprint was at the core of that effort
>> some 25 years ago.
>>
>>
>>
>> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many
>> occasions, rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as
>> neat as circles and consume no more footprint than the typical
>> schedule would. Oh BTW, these are far less difficult to judge
>> objectively
>>
>>
>>
>> MattK
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>> It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend
>> to work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a
>> pattern airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I
>> found that I really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through
>> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.
>> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10
>> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was
>> really not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than
>> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just
>> getting old...
>>
>> Ed
>>
>>> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
>>> From: seefo at san.rr.com
>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>
>>> Vince,
>>>
>>> The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.
>> The IAC
>>> Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to
>> differentiate it
>>> from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
>>> flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
>>>
>>> -Doug
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
>>>> class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
>>>> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's
>> class. I am
>>>> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. Sign
>> up now. =
>>
>> _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion
>> mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://
>> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.103/2378 - Release Date:  
> 09/23/09 05:52:00
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Wed Sep 23 11:17:35 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 19:17:35 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <FA888E76-D629-467E-A879-9539F29B2693@cox.net>
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl>
	<8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com>
	<01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>
	<B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net>
	<99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C10@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
	<FA888E76-D629-467E-A879-9539F29B2693@cox.net>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C16@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

I'm only 18 with 27 years of experience :)

Of course I'm at work, who has time for this at home?  Just don't tell my boss!

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 3:08 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

I kinda wish that people like Mark didn't read my stuff quite so  
carefully.  I also wonder why he isn't at work.  Hmmmm, maybe he is.   
I'll never tell.

2111?  I'll only be 176 years old.

Ron VP

On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:50 PM, Atwood, Mark wrote:

> Only Ron...who was actually around in 1911, would plan to still be  
> around in 2111 :)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 2:57 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships
> host gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total
> list is  predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with
> predominantly European judges. The preponderance of European judges
> dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of
> judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the
> U.S., Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China,
> Japan, Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made
> up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?
> As the host organization, the NSRCA does.
>
> Ron VP
>
> On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:
>
>> Matt,
>>
>> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to
>> have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a
>> good argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate,
>> etc.  But, they still want the rolling circles in all future
>> patterns and especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of
>> fields that can fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll
>> in.
>>
>> Don
>>
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-
>> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com
>>
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>>
>>
>> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some
>> just never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat
>> differentiating maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor
>> Pattern circles. They simply consume too much real estate and
>> contradict the very essence of why we in Pattern moved to quiet our
>> models. Noise reduction footprint was at the core of that effort
>> some 25 years ago.
>>
>>
>>
>> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many
>> occasions, rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as
>> neat as circles and consume no more footprint than the typical
>> schedule would. Oh BTW, these are far less difficult to judge
>> objectively
>>
>>
>>
>> MattK
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>> It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend
>> to work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a
>> pattern airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I
>> found that I really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through
>> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.
>> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10
>> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was
>> really not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than
>> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just
>> getting old...
>>
>> Ed
>>
>>> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
>>> From: seefo at san.rr.com
>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>
>>> Vince,
>>>
>>> The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.
>> The IAC
>>> Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to
>> differentiate it
>>> from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
>>> flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
>>>
>>> -Doug
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
>>>> class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
>>>> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's
>> class. I am
>>>> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. Sign
>> up now. =
>>
>> _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion
>> mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://
>> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.103/2378 - Release Date:  
> 09/23/09 05:52:00
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.103/2378 - Release Date: 09/23/09 05:52:00

From tony at radiosouthrc.com  Wed Sep 23 11:18:19 2009
From: tony at radiosouthrc.com (Tony)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 19:18:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <FA888E76-D629-467E-A879-9539F29B2693@cox.net>
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl><8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com><01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net><B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net><99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C10@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
	<FA888E76-D629-467E-A879-9539F29B2693@cox.net>
Message-ID: <1AD924559E6346539369DDC4BBDAA782@Tony>

Ron:
The only problem with that is that there is actually a ratio that has to be
met.  The ratio is based on the countries that attend.  So, if predominately
European countries attend, the judges must be predominately European.

Isn't the FAI a wonderful organization?  Kind of reminds you of the UN
doesn't it?  

Anybody out there ready to organize a NEW international body for Aero
modeling???


Tony Stillman, President
Radio South, Inc.
139 Altama Connector, Box 322
Brunswick, GA  31525
1-800-962-7802
www.radiosouthrc.com

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 3:08 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

I kinda wish that people like Mark didn't read my stuff quite so  
carefully.  I also wonder why he isn't at work.  Hmmmm, maybe he is.   
I'll never tell.

2111?  I'll only be 176 years old.

Ron VP

On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:50 PM, Atwood, Mark wrote:

> Only Ron...who was actually around in 1911, would plan to still be  
> around in 2111 :)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 2:57 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships
> host gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total
> list is  predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with
> predominantly European judges. The preponderance of European judges
> dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of
> judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the
> U.S., Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China,
> Japan, Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made
> up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?
> As the host organization, the NSRCA does.
>
> Ron VP
>
> On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:
>
>> Matt,
>>
>> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to
>> have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a
>> good argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate,
>> etc.  But, they still want the rolling circles in all future
>> patterns and especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of
>> fields that can fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll
>> in.
>>
>> Don
>>
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-
>> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com
>>
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>>
>>
>> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some
>> just never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat
>> differentiating maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor
>> Pattern circles. They simply consume too much real estate and
>> contradict the very essence of why we in Pattern moved to quiet our
>> models. Noise reduction footprint was at the core of that effort
>> some 25 years ago.
>>
>>
>>
>> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many
>> occasions, rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as
>> neat as circles and consume no more footprint than the typical
>> schedule would. Oh BTW, these are far less difficult to judge
>> objectively
>>
>>
>>
>> MattK
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>> It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend
>> to work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a
>> pattern airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I
>> found that I really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through
>> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.
>> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10
>> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was
>> really not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than
>> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just
>> getting old...
>>
>> Ed
>>
>>> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
>>> From: seefo at san.rr.com
>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>
>>> Vince,
>>>
>>> The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.
>> The IAC
>>> Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to
>> differentiate it
>>> from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
>>> flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
>>>
>>> -Doug
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
>>>> class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
>>>> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's
>> class. I am
>>>> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. Sign
>> up now. =
>>
>> _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion
>> mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://
>> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.103/2378 - Release Date:  
> 09/23/09 05:52:00
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From vanputte at cox.net  Wed Sep 23 11:23:26 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 19:23:26 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <1AD924559E6346539369DDC4BBDAA782@Tony>
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl><8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com><01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net><B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net><99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C10@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
	<FA888E76-D629-467E-A879-9539F29B2693@cox.net>
	<1AD924559E6346539369DDC4BBDAA782@Tony>
Message-ID: <67E323E3-F997-4EFB-AD4A-61CBF0994F5A@cox.net>

OK, we will push the ratio to the limit!

Ron VP

On Sep 23, 2009, at 2:18 PM, Tony wrote:

> Ron:
> The only problem with that is that there is actually a ratio that  
> has to be
> met.  The ratio is based on the countries that attend.  So, if  
> predominately
> European countries attend, the judges must be predominately European.
>
> Isn't the FAI a wonderful organization?  Kind of reminds you of the UN
> doesn't it?
>
> Anybody out there ready to organize a NEW international body for Aero
> modeling???
>
>
> Tony Stillman, President
> Radio South, Inc.
> 139 Altama Connector, Box 322
> Brunswick, GA  31525
> 1-800-962-7802
> www.radiosouthrc.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron  
> Van Putte
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 3:08 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> I kinda wish that people like Mark didn't read my stuff quite so
> carefully.  I also wonder why he isn't at work.  Hmmmm, maybe he is.
> I'll never tell.
>
> 2111?  I'll only be 176 years old.
>
> Ron VP
>
> On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:50 PM, Atwood, Mark wrote:
>
>> Only Ron...who was actually around in 1911, would plan to still be
>> around in 2111 :)
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-
>> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 2:57 PM
>> To: General pattern discussion
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>> I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships
>> host gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total
>> list is  predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with
>> predominantly European judges. The preponderance of European judges
>> dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of
>> judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the
>> U.S., Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China,
>> Japan, Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made
>> up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?
>> As the host organization, the NSRCA does.
>>
>> Ron VP
>>
>> On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:
>>
>>> Matt,
>>>
>>> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to
>>> have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a
>>> good argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate,
>>> etc.  But, they still want the rolling circles in all future
>>> patterns and especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of
>>> fields that can fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll
>>> in.
>>>
>>> Don
>>>
>>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-
>>> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com
>>>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some
>>> just never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat
>>> differentiating maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor
>>> Pattern circles. They simply consume too much real estate and
>>> contradict the very essence of why we in Pattern moved to quiet our
>>> models. Noise reduction footprint was at the core of that effort
>>> some 25 years ago.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many
>>> occasions, rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as
>>> neat as circles and consume no more footprint than the typical
>>> schedule would. Oh BTW, these are far less difficult to judge
>>> objectively
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> MattK
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>
>>> It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend
>>> to work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a
>>> pattern airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I
>>> found that I really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through
>>> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.
>>> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10
>>> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was
>>> really not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than
>>> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just
>>> getting old...
>>>
>>> Ed
>>>
>>>> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
>>>> From: seefo at san.rr.com
>>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>>
>>>> Vince,
>>>>
>>>> The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.
>>> The IAC
>>>> Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to
>>> differentiate it
>>>> from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is  
>>>> never
>>>> flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
>>>>
>>>> -Doug
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
>>>>> class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
>>>>> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's
>>> class. I am
>>>>> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. Sign
>>> up now. =
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion
>>> mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://
>>> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.103/2378 - Release Date:
>> 09/23/09 05:52:00
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Wed Sep 23 11:32:50 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 19:32:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C10@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl>
	<8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com>
	<01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>
	<B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net>
	<99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C10@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <DB75823B-369F-4502-BF58-E991425EE5AD@gmail.com>

LOL

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 23, 2009, at 11:50 AM, "Atwood, Mark" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>  
wrote:

> Only Ron...who was actually around in 1911, would plan to still be  
> around in 2111 :)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 2:57 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships
> host gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total
> list is  predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with
> predominantly European judges. The preponderance of European judges
> dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of
> judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the
> U.S., Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China,
> Japan, Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made
> up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?
> As the host organization, the NSRCA does.
>
> Ron VP
>
> On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:
>
>> Matt,
>>
>> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to
>> have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a
>> good argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate,
>> etc.  But, they still want the rolling circles in all future
>> patterns and especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of
>> fields that can fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll
>> in.
>>
>> Don
>>
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-
>> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com
>>
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>>
>>
>> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some
>> just never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat
>> differentiating maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor
>> Pattern circles. They simply consume too much real estate and
>> contradict the very essence of why we in Pattern moved to quiet our
>> models. Noise reduction footprint was at the core of that effort
>> some 25 years ago.
>>
>>
>>
>> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many
>> occasions, rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as
>> neat as circles and consume no more footprint than the typical
>> schedule would. Oh BTW, these are far less difficult to judge
>> objectively
>>
>>
>>
>> MattK
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>> It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend
>> to work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a
>> pattern airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I
>> found that I really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through
>> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.
>> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10
>> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was
>> really not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than
>> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just
>> getting old...
>>
>> Ed
>>
>>> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
>>> From: seefo at san.rr.com
>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>
>>> Vince,
>>>
>>> The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.
>> The IAC
>>> Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to
>> differentiate it
>>> from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
>>> flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
>>>
>>> -Doug
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
>>>> class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
>>>> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's
>> class. I am
>>>> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. Sign
>> up now. =
>>
>> _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion
>> mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://
>> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.103/2378 - Release Date:  
> 09/23/09 05:52:00
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From tony at radiosouthrc.com  Wed Sep 23 11:40:55 2009
From: tony at radiosouthrc.com (Tony)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 19:40:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <67E323E3-F997-4EFB-AD4A-61CBF0994F5A@cox.net>
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl><8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com><01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net><B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net><99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C10@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com><FA888E76-D629-467E-A879-9539F29B2693@cox.net><1AD924559E6346539369DDC4BBDAA782@Tony>
	<67E323E3-F997-4EFB-AD4A-61CBF0994F5A@cox.net>
Message-ID: <6CE9ABE397114EFD8FE340444A4C2D96@Tony>

SOUNDS GOOD TO ME!!!!

Tony Stillman, President
Radio South, Inc.
139 Altama Connector, Box 322
Brunswick, GA  31525
1-800-962-7802
www.radiosouthrc.com

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 3:23 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

OK, we will push the ratio to the limit!

Ron VP

On Sep 23, 2009, at 2:18 PM, Tony wrote:

> Ron:
> The only problem with that is that there is actually a ratio that  
> has to be
> met.  The ratio is based on the countries that attend.  So, if  
> predominately
> European countries attend, the judges must be predominately European.
>
> Isn't the FAI a wonderful organization?  Kind of reminds you of the UN
> doesn't it?
>
> Anybody out there ready to organize a NEW international body for Aero
> modeling???
>
>
> Tony Stillman, President
> Radio South, Inc.
> 139 Altama Connector, Box 322
> Brunswick, GA  31525
> 1-800-962-7802
> www.radiosouthrc.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron  
> Van Putte
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 3:08 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> I kinda wish that people like Mark didn't read my stuff quite so
> carefully.  I also wonder why he isn't at work.  Hmmmm, maybe he is.
> I'll never tell.
>
> 2111?  I'll only be 176 years old.
>
> Ron VP
>
> On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:50 PM, Atwood, Mark wrote:
>
>> Only Ron...who was actually around in 1911, would plan to still be
>> around in 2111 :)
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-
>> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 2:57 PM
>> To: General pattern discussion
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>> I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships
>> host gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total
>> list is  predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with
>> predominantly European judges. The preponderance of European judges
>> dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of
>> judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the
>> U.S., Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China,
>> Japan, Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made
>> up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?
>> As the host organization, the NSRCA does.
>>
>> Ron VP
>>
>> On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:
>>
>>> Matt,
>>>
>>> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to
>>> have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a
>>> good argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate,
>>> etc.  But, they still want the rolling circles in all future
>>> patterns and especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of
>>> fields that can fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll
>>> in.
>>>
>>> Don
>>>
>>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-
>>> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com
>>>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some
>>> just never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat
>>> differentiating maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor
>>> Pattern circles. They simply consume too much real estate and
>>> contradict the very essence of why we in Pattern moved to quiet our
>>> models. Noise reduction footprint was at the core of that effort
>>> some 25 years ago.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many
>>> occasions, rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as
>>> neat as circles and consume no more footprint than the typical
>>> schedule would. Oh BTW, these are far less difficult to judge
>>> objectively
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> MattK
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>
>>> It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend
>>> to work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a
>>> pattern airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I
>>> found that I really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through
>>> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.
>>> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10
>>> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was
>>> really not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than
>>> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just
>>> getting old...
>>>
>>> Ed
>>>
>>>> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
>>>> From: seefo at san.rr.com
>>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>>
>>>> Vince,
>>>>
>>>> The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.
>>> The IAC
>>>> Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to
>>> differentiate it
>>>> from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is  
>>>> never
>>>> flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
>>>>
>>>> -Doug
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
>>>>> class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
>>>>> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's
>>> class. I am
>>>>> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. Sign
>>> up now. =
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion
>>> mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://
>>> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.103/2378 - Release Date:
>> 09/23/09 05:52:00
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From edskorepa at q.com  Wed Sep 23 12:53:24 2009
From: edskorepa at q.com (ed skorepa)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 20:53:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
References: <350281092.2013831253727846753.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com><697909526.2014441253728026563.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
	<77801960F67D465FA352349306CED63E@Tony>
Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP4729027DF5D2846FF42A3AB4DB0@phx.gbl>

Tony, JR has nothing to do with Graupner-IFS system. It's an Extreme Power System developed right here in Lake Havasu City, AR. Graupner just changed the name from XPS to IFS. As for which system is the best? Must be DUPLEX by JETI. ed
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Tony 
  To: 'General pattern discussion' 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 12:07 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve


  JR is not Spektrum..  JR has been selling 2.4Ghz frequency hopping gear in Europe for almost a year.  Check it out under the Graupner name.

  For all the info go to  http://www.graupner-ifs-system.de/en.html

   

   

  Tony Stillman, President

  Radio South, Inc.

  139 Altama Connector, Box 322

  Brunswick, GA  31525

  1-800-962-7802

  www.radiosouthrc.com


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of RON HANSEN
  Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:47 PM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

   

  The issue isn't whether frequency hopping is better than DSM but rather will JR stick with DSM indefinitely.  I don't want to spend $1400 on a new transmitter that will be out of style in the near future.  Matter of fact, you can buy conversion kits from German companies (Weatronics and ACT) that are better than both DSM and FASST.  The Germans use frequency hopping where the transmitter and receiver talk back and forth to each other.  These German systems aren't cheap but they are certainly better than what we have in the US.  Regardless of what system you go with 2.4 GHz is better than 72 MHz.
  ----- Original Message -----
  From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
  To: "NSRCA List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 12:53:37 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

  Are you aware of situations where DSM doesn't work?
   


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 11:29:59 -0400
  From: rcpilot at wowway.com
  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

  I'm still flying 72 MHz using my JR 10X radio.  I need to switch to 2.4 this winter.  This module is the solution to my problem.  I love the 10X, 9303 and 12X radios.  I don't like the DSM2 technology, I feel frequency hopping is a superior technology not to mention you can't use DSM2 in Europe.  Either Europe will eventually approve DSM2 or JR will switch to frequency hopping worldwide.  This solution will afford me more time to see what JR decides to do.  So I plan to try this module out on my foamies and park flyers and if I experience no problems I will use it in my pattern planes come this spring unless JR makes a switch to frequency hopping.  I know there are a lot of people in my situation.
   
  Ron
  ----- Original Message -----
  From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:58:31 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

  In all seriousness, I think it makes little sense to cross over brands this way.  FASST, JR, or Airtronics; things work just fine.  I could see the initial idea that Horizon had with Spektrum to get the world moving to Spread Spectrum with their modules, but I think that time has passed us by.  As far as preserving the value of an investment in a transmitter by moving to another brand of receivers with a module - why? Go with a brand you like and don't look back to gimmicks to cross over part way.  You always lose something in the process.
   
  Ed
   


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 07:01:51 -0700
  From: bob at toprudder.com
  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve



        Personally, I like the FASST system. I must have a dozen 2.4g receivers now. I have nothing against the JR/Spektrum, a lot of my friends fly JR (I am in a very small minority in my club flying Futaba). I will admit that I bought the Spektrum module for one of my old Futaba transmitters, so that I could do the "bind-n-fly" thing as well.

         

        I will tell you guys a funny story. I was at Efest this year. I was flying a Vapor over in the corner for the ultralight planes, and heard someone walk up behing a friend of mine (Jeff Phillips, Radioactive Airshow Team) and start asking him how he liked the Vapors. Well, I thought it must be someone who had never flown a Vapor, so I turned around and handed him my transmitter, an old Futaba 7UA with a Spektrum module, so he could fly it. It happened to be Peter Goldsmith. :-)  I wish I had said "feel the difference" to him. 

         

        Bob R.



        --- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote:

           

                Bill,

                You are a one-percenter among the one-percenters! LOL 

                 

                I actually bought the Spektrum module with Rx for my Futaba 12Fg because it was such a good deal. I'm going to use this setup for indoor this year with some of those really small Spektrum receivers. It's also great for the E-Flite Bind-N-Fly models. I just didn't see the point in going "the other way" but I guess in your case it makes sense.

                 

                John Pavlick
               

           


           
       

   


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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From frankjuliei at comcast.net  Wed Sep 23 13:20:36 2009
From: frankjuliei at comcast.net (frank)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 21:20:36 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable
	Generator-Model # Gen 1100
Message-ID: <23F019FDD5CA4B849897ED1211CFEFD0@FMILaptop>

Anyone out there using one ? $299 w/ 1 yr. warranty, online .

 

Frank

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From milehipilot at gmail.com  Wed Sep 23 13:52:57 2009
From: milehipilot at gmail.com (milehipilot at gmail.com)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 21:52:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <77801960F67D465FA352349306CED63E@Tony>
References: <350281092.2013831253727846753.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com><697909526.2014441253728026563.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com><77801960F67D465FA352349306CED63E@Tony>
Message-ID: <272248167-1253742772-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1815511746-@bda479.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>

That's graupner, not JR right Tony? The MX-16 is available from XPS. 
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-----Original Message-----
From: "Tony" <tony at radiosouthrc.com>

Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 14:07:12 
To: 'General pattern discussion'<nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au  Wed Sep 23 14:15:18 2009
From: Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au (Koenig, Tom)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 22:15:18 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net>
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl>
	<8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com>
	<01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>
	<B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net>
Message-ID: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C5394A16@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>

Ron and all,

I LOVE your suggestion. At least then we may have a chance of obtaining the correct placings and/or the correct world champion?
Also-do not forget the cost savings to the organisation in that the airfares will be considerably cheaper by obtaining more 'local' judges. This is a big driver for the 'European' hosts....and why countries like Australia and NZ tend be disregarded if at all possible. We have issues in that Southern hemisphere countries always come from Winter climates where we have limited oppertunities to actually prepare/practice for a Northern (summer)world champs.

I have also heard suggestions from W/C contest pilots ( not just the aussie team btw), that the they wished they could not be 'identified'i.e that they be infront of some sort of screen whereby the judges could not identify the actual pilot.

Sure-some models could be used as a way of identifying the pilot, but there are plenty of the 'same' models being used these days.

I thought that was a cool and perhaps 'do-able' thing? More realistic than some sort of computerised/video 'tracking', despite such technology existing.

Tom

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
Sent: Thursday, 24 September 2009 4:57
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships host gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total list is  predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with predominantly European judges. The preponderance of European judges
dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of
judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the U.S., Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China, Japan, Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made
up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?
As the host organization, the NSRCA does.

Ron VP

On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:

> Matt,
>
> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to
> have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a good
> argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate, etc.
> But, they still want the rolling circles in all future patterns and
> especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of fields that can
> fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll in.
>
> Don
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com
>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
>
>
> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some just
> never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat differentiating
> maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor Pattern circles. They
> simply consume too much real estate and contradict the very essence of
> why we in Pattern moved to quiet our models. Noise reduction footprint
> was at the core of that effort some 25 years ago.
>
>
>
> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many occasions,
> rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as neat as circles
> and consume no more footprint than the typical schedule would. Oh BTW,
> these are far less difficult to judge objectively
>
>
>
> MattK
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend to
> work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a pattern
> airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I found that I
> really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through
> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.
> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10
> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was really
> not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than
> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just
> getting old...
>
> Ed
>
> > Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
> > From: seefo at san.rr.com
> > To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> >
> > Vince,
> >
> > The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.
> The IAC
> > Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to
> differentiate it
> > from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
> > flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
> >
> > -Doug
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
> > > class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
> > > IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's
> class. I am
> > > not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. Sign up
> now. =
>
> _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion
> mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From jtkeiser at comcast.net  Wed Sep 23 14:17:22 2009
From: jtkeiser at comcast.net (jtkeiser at comcast.net)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 22:17:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <210672208.4877761253743373164.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1932816071.4883711253744231609.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>




Jim. 



Been reading all the comments about "unknowns" and thought I'd add my view. I started flying AMA pattern around 1978. At that time, the Masters class made up their own sequence from a list of approved maneuvers, essentially a Freestyle. Being a Novice, I never got to do this, and by the time I reached Masters (some ten or twelve years later), the rules had changed and we were flying turnaround. I think we lost something when the Freestyle went away. 



?I left the model world for a dozen years and started flying IAC competition at first in a Pitts, then a Giles 202, and now a Sukhoi 26. Like most newcomers, I started in Sportsman, won a few contests and started up the ladder. At the second level (or third if you count Basic), Intermediate, you are introduced to both Freestyles and Unknowns. For me, this added a whole new level of interest. You might think creating a Freestyle program is a simple matter of selecting maneuvers that add up to the allowable K, and meet the other constraints such as the right number of rolls, snaps, spins,?etc. Not so! It forces you to understand your skills and the capabilities of your airplane. My Freestle might be a disaster for another pilot in another plane - its tailored to my flying style and the strenghts of the Sukhoi. No doubt, working this out over the years has made me a better pilot and made me understand the airplane's capabilities as well. 



The "Unknown" - well, that separates the men from the boys, so to speak. In most IAC contests where the competition is reasonably close, the Unkown is the decider. Usually, it is not the most difficult sequence. All the maneuvers that can be included are published at the begining of the year, and the allowable K is less than that of the Known or the Freestyle.? Generally, it favors the best pilots. Of course, you don't have a caller, so you have to make up a sequence card that you read during the flight, and/or, if you prefer, try to memorize the sequence. Personnaly, I have found the memory alternative to be a disaster for me. Nonetheless, I find?this is the most interesting round of the competition. Yes, it requires that you spend some time Sat night thinking it through, but that's why I came here - I can drink a beer with friends anytime. I guess it just depends on how you view a contest weekend - are you there to compete and win, or? socialize? ?I belive both are valid reasons for attending, and lately, I often find myself in the latter group. 



Five or six years ago, I decided to get back to model competition. Both AMA Pattern and IMAC. Not a serious threat to anyone (at 73 you don't do anything seriuosly), but I do try to make a respectable showing. I've been favorably impressed with what I've seen in IMAC - it's like pattern contests were 20 or 30 years ago. Lots of enthusiasm, a bunch of newcomers, even some young kids. I haven't seen any kids (defined as less the 20, maybe 30 ), at a pa ttern contest since I've returned to the scene. Sad. 



Would an "Unknown" be good for pattern ?? For me, it would make it more interesting, as would a Freestyle, but I don't know if it would?attract any new blood.? If a Freestyle and /or an Unkown were introduced to AMA Pattern, the best, most dedicated pilots would still win - it would just be a more interest ing and fun contest. And that's what its all about. 



Jack 







From: "Jim Woodward (US SSA)" <jim.woodward at baesystems.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 10:40:08 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

True that! ?Basically, the "unknowns" and how they shape the event from all angles, is part-n-parcel to the IMAC experience, personality, and culture. 
Thanks, 
Jim 



-----Original Message----- 
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of steve hannah 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 10:34 AM 
To: General pattern discussion 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 

Boy ain't that the truth about calling. I had a hard time saying NO. 
The other thing that happens is that you get to sit in the judges 
chair and watch 15 guys from another class fly their unknown then you 
have to shake that off and go fly yours. 

On Wednesday, September 23, 2009, Woodward, Jim (US SSA) 
<jim.woodward at baesystems.com> wrote: 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Steve, 
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully we'll cross paths in the future, maybe at the 
> 2010 pattern nats.? Thanks for sharing your experience below.? Just 
> to add some more thoughts about the unknowns.? Unknowns invite a "team" 
> approach to flying them successfully.? Most the pilots will take their 
> unknown, and go to their most experienced friend that can read arestii, and ask 
> for it to be deciphered.? Groups of 3-5 pilots will go through and try to 
> get them sorted out.? You then leave the field or dinner thinking you got 
> them right.? Later in the hotel room, you realize that some particular 
> snap & roll combination is "same direction" instead of the 
> typical opposite direction (for instance).? Then, you doubt the whole 
> thing and study it again.? In the morning, you go to your buds and see if 
> they caught the mistake, but then sort of hope the other 'competition' 
> didn't catch it. 
> 
> 
> 
> So here goes the sequence of events morning of - if you 
> are the person folks are relying on to "call-correctly" for them, 
> it can really cramp your morning.? You will be studying the other classes 
> unknown nearly as much as your own.? If you call for them (sometimes a 
> couple people let's say) before you fly, YOU better have a good caller 
> lined up to help keep you own head straight.? It puts more pressure on you 
> to "call-correctly" for someone, than to fly your own 
> sequence.? It also puts you in an uncomfortable spot to say "no" 
> to the task when you absolutely need to.? You will quickly look around and 
> realize that other pilots have that "super-experienced" caller 
> working with them all the time - maybe for years.? If your flying 
> group doesn't have that, all of you are at the disadvantage. 
> 
> 
> 
> As the unknown flier - there are tricks to memorizing the 
> sequence (Don S.'s latest video covers one technique nicely for it), but 
> the bottom line is that your caller will make-or-break this round for you, and 
> in short, the contest outcome.? Reading aresti is a skill.? Flying 
> unknowns with the same composure and "presentation" that you fly 
> the knowns with a huge new skill to learn.? If you are really practicing 
> with IMAC dedication, you should probably fly 65% of the knowns, and 35% of 
> learning how your airplane does every other maneuver not in your known.? The 
> benefit is that learning how to approach unknowns and fly them confidently will 
> accelerate your skill growth and make you a better pilot fast.? You knees 
> may shake like you are on the Nationals flight line though!? I always have 
> a good feeling of accomplishment for pulling off a clean unknown, that you don't 
> always have after even a really good known flight. ??Unknowns offer a 
> lot and they will make your head stronger for flying, show where your 
> weaknesses as a pilot are, but they come at the price of a lot of studying, 
> dramatic changes in the final pilot positions, and needing a good "team 
> approach" to pull the flights off cleanly. 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks, 
> 
> Jim 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: 
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of steve 
> hannah 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:17 PM 
> To: General pattern discussion 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think this thread started as 
> a query into unknowns.? Jim W's post pretty well hit the nail on the 
> head.? Leave the unknowns to IMAC.? When I switched from F3A to IMAC 
> (actually the JR SCAT series) in 2002 I started flying Intermediate and really 
> liked the unknowns.? Flying those unknown sequences was very easy.? I 
> found the degree of difficulty of maneuvers between intermediate and the then 
> F3A sequence to be compatible.? Unknowns were no more difficult and, since 
> I had been flying competitive pattern for 12 years I had little trouble 
> adapting.? I was typically the most experienced pilot in the class so I 
> had little trouble.? Moving up the ladder saw an exponential increase in 
> the degree of difficulty for the maneuvers as well as for the unknowns. 
> It is true, you have to kick butt in the unknown in order to win.? So, at 
> every contest I would spend saturday night learning and memorizing my 
> unknown.? I'd get the sequence and stick fly it until I fell asleep. 
> I got to where I really hated that.? It wasn't fun.? Flying Unlimited 
> in 2007, including the TAS, burned me out on this whole thing and cured me of 
> any desire to fly unknowns ever again. 
> 
> When I started flying pattern again in 2008, it was like a breath of fresh air 
> to me.? The contests were fun again.? I am a competitive guy and I 
> stopped having fun at IMAC contests.? They were just too much work. 
> 
> Pattern contests are much lower key and relaxing.? IMAC events are 
> hectic.? The unknowns put a cramp on your fun as well.? I would 
> always be thinking at the evening group dinner "I can't have that extra 
> beer, I need to leave NOW in order to have enough time to cram the Unlimited Unknown 
> sequence into memory".? That sucked. 
> 
> As for the never ending debate of which is better/tougher/more precise, I'll 
> say this.? Flying Pattern made me a good IMAC pilot.? Then, flying 
> IMAC made me a much better Pattern flier.? They're all good. 
> Everyone should try both.? Just leave the unknowns to IMAC, Keep them easy 
> enough to memorize in 10 minutes in the morning so you can have a few beers and 
> shoot the bull with your buddies at night. 
> 
> Steve 
> 
> 
> 
> On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 3:57 PM, Bill's Email <wemodels at cox.net?<javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'wemodels at cox.net');>> wrote: 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> J N Hiller wrote: 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks 
> guys that will make it a little easier. ?I will then assume that the slash 
> marks through the loop only indicate centering the rolling element. 
> 
> It 
> looked nice through 90 degrees of ark with a very slow rate but I only got one 
> out of maybe a dozen attempts that looked decent. 
> 
> Jim 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Those marks are from the Aresti 
> catalog and indicate where on the loop a roll element can be placed. 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
_______________________________________________ 
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From tony at radiosouthrc.com  Wed Sep 23 15:46:08 2009
From: tony at radiosouthrc.com (Tony)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 23:46:08 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C5394A16@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl><8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com><01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net><B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net>
	<724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C5394A16@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>
Message-ID: <844B2CBE8DB644FC9C737D3F2E5BFD40@Tony>

Tom:
As a past 4-time USA F3A Team Manager, I saw a BUNCH of "unknown" pilots fly
FANTASTIC sequences and not get anywhere near the score they deserved...  I
can remember in Poland sitting with Chris Lakin and Kirk Grey watching
several pilots and one was just fantastic!  Chris and Kirk looked at each
other and we need to check his scores!  When they came out they were very
low...  very sad.


Tony Stillman, President
Radio South, Inc.
139 Altama Connector, Box 322
Brunswick, GA  31525
1-800-962-7802
www.radiosouthrc.com

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Koenig, Tom
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 6:15 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

Ron and all,

I LOVE your suggestion. At least then we may have a chance of obtaining the
correct placings and/or the correct world champion?
Also-do not forget the cost savings to the organisation in that the airfares
will be considerably cheaper by obtaining more 'local' judges. This is a big
driver for the 'European' hosts....and why countries like Australia and NZ
tend be disregarded if at all possible. We have issues in that Southern
hemisphere countries always come from Winter climates where we have limited
oppertunities to actually prepare/practice for a Northern (summer)world
champs.

I have also heard suggestions from W/C contest pilots ( not just the aussie
team btw), that the they wished they could not be 'identified'i.e that they
be infront of some sort of screen whereby the judges could not identify the
actual pilot.

Sure-some models could be used as a way of identifying the pilot, but there
are plenty of the 'same' models being used these days.

I thought that was a cool and perhaps 'do-able' thing? More realistic than
some sort of computerised/video 'tracking', despite such technology
existing.

Tom

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
Sent: Thursday, 24 September 2009 4:57
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships host
gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total list is
predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with predominantly
European judges. The preponderance of European judges
dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of
judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the U.S.,
Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China, Japan,
Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made
up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?
As the host organization, the NSRCA does.

Ron VP

On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:

> Matt,
>
> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to
> have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a good
> argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate, etc.
> But, they still want the rolling circles in all future patterns and
> especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of fields that can
> fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll in.
>
> Don
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com
>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
>
>
> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some just
> never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat differentiating
> maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor Pattern circles. They
> simply consume too much real estate and contradict the very essence of
> why we in Pattern moved to quiet our models. Noise reduction footprint
> was at the core of that effort some 25 years ago.
>
>
>
> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many occasions,
> rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as neat as circles
> and consume no more footprint than the typical schedule would. Oh BTW,
> these are far less difficult to judge objectively
>
>
>
> MattK
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend to
> work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a pattern
> airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I found that I
> really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through
> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.
> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10
> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was really
> not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than
> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just
> getting old...
>
> Ed
>
> > Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
> > From: seefo at san.rr.com
> > To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
> >
> > Vince,
> >
> > The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.
> The IAC
> > Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to
> differentiate it
> > from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
> > flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
> >
> > -Doug
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
> > > class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
> > > IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's
> class. I am
> > > not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. Sign up
> now. =
>
> _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion
> mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From vanputte at cox.net  Wed Sep 23 15:53:25 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 23:53:25 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <844B2CBE8DB644FC9C737D3F2E5BFD40@Tony>
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl><8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com><01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net><B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net>
	<724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C5394A16@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>
	<844B2CBE8DB644FC9C737D3F2E5BFD40@Tony>
Message-ID: <88BDAC1F-2B84-4D75-B97F-642E29326AB3@cox.net>

I am probably going to be sorry I ever wrote what is below, but I  
think now is the time.

If you've never critically watched an F3A World Championships, you  
can't understand what goes on.  You can fly a perfect flight and get  
hammered.

First, many country's judges NEVER judge at all between F3A World  
Championships.  Many poor judges, in my opinion, are at EVERY F3A  
World Championships.  Just why some countries continue to send the  
same poor judges, again my opinion, over and over, I don't understand.

Second, it seems that there is an understanding on how scoring will  
be done among some countries' judges.  For example, at one F3A World  
Championships, flying far out not only was not downgraded, but flying  
at 150 meters, where the aircraft is supposed to be, was downgraded.   
At others, rules will be "bent" by the judges and it is up to the  
pilots and team managers to figure out what (that's not in the rules)  
the judges are looking for.

At the 1995 F3A World Championships in Kasaoka, Japan, I was the U.S.  
judge.  During the Preliminaries, one country's judge was censured in  
front of all the other judges for scoring the pilots from his  
country's team too high.  Then, in the Finals, I found out later that  
it was determined that I was favoring the U.S. pilots, but I did not,  
to my knowledge, change my judging standards.  Apparently I either  
didn't judge fairly, or I didn't get the word that the judging  
standards were to be changed for the Finals.

You can ask Tony Stillman, Quique Somenzini, Chip Hyde, Jason  
Shulman, Sean McMurtry,  or any other active pilots at the F3A world- 
class level, what they think of F3A World Championships judges.  Just  
don't ask them to do it publicly, where any F3A judges might read/ 
hear it, or they would be sure to be 'rewarded' by those judges at  
the next F3A WC.

Ron Van Putte

On Sep 23, 2009, at 6:46 PM, Tony wrote:

> Tom:
> As a past 4-time USA F3A Team Manager, I saw a BUNCH of "unknown"  
> pilots fly
> FANTASTIC sequences and not get anywhere near the score they  
> deserved...  I
> can remember in Poland sitting with Chris Lakin and Kirk Grey watching
> several pilots and one was just fantastic!  Chris and Kirk looked  
> at each
> other and we need to check his scores!  When they came out they  
> were very
> low...  very sad.
>
>
> Tony Stillman, President
> Radio South, Inc.
> 139 Altama Connector, Box 322
> Brunswick, GA  31525
> 1-800-962-7802
> www.radiosouthrc.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of  
> Koenig, Tom
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 6:15 PM
> To: 'General pattern discussion'
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> Ron and all,
>
> I LOVE your suggestion. At least then we may have a chance of  
> obtaining the
> correct placings and/or the correct world champion?
> Also-do not forget the cost savings to the organisation in that the  
> airfares
> will be considerably cheaper by obtaining more 'local' judges. This  
> is a big
> driver for the 'European' hosts....and why countries like Australia  
> and NZ
> tend be disregarded if at all possible. We have issues in that  
> Southern
> hemisphere countries always come from Winter climates where we have  
> limited
> oppertunities to actually prepare/practice for a Northern (summer) 
> world
> champs.
>
> I have also heard suggestions from W/C contest pilots ( not just  
> the aussie
> team btw), that the they wished they could not be 'identified'i.e  
> that they
> be infront of some sort of screen whereby the judges could not  
> identify the
> actual pilot.
>
> Sure-some models could be used as a way of identifying the pilot,  
> but there
> are plenty of the 'same' models being used these days.
>
> I thought that was a cool and perhaps 'do-able' thing? More  
> realistic than
> some sort of computerised/video 'tracking', despite such technology
> existing.
>
> Tom
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron  
> Van Putte
> Sent: Thursday, 24 September 2009 4:57
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships  
> host
> gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total list is
> predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with predominantly
> European judges. The preponderance of European judges
> dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of
> judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the U.S.,
> Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China, Japan,
> Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made
> up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?
> As the host organization, the NSRCA does.
>
> Ron VP
>
> On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:
>
>> Matt,
>>
>> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to
>> have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a good
>> argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate, etc.
>> But, they still want the rolling circles in all future patterns and
>> especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of fields that can
>> fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll in.
>>
>> Don
>>
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-
>> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com
>>
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>>
>>
>> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some just
>> never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat differentiating
>> maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor Pattern circles. They
>> simply consume too much real estate and contradict the very  
>> essence of
>> why we in Pattern moved to quiet our models. Noise reduction  
>> footprint
>> was at the core of that effort some 25 years ago.
>>
>>
>>
>> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many occasions,
>> rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as neat as circles
>> and consume no more footprint than the typical schedule would. Oh  
>> BTW,
>> these are far less difficult to judge objectively
>>
>>
>>
>> MattK
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>> It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend to
>> work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a  
>> pattern
>> airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I found that I
>> really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through
>> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.
>> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10
>> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was  
>> really
>> not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than
>> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just
>> getting old...
>>
>> Ed
>>
>>> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
>>> From: seefo at san.rr.com
>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>
>>> Vince,
>>>
>>> The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.
>> The IAC
>>> Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to
>> differentiate it
>>> from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
>>> flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
>>>
>>> -Doug
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
>>>> class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
>>>> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's
>> class. I am
>>>> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free.  
>> Sign up
>> now. =
>>
>> _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion
>> mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://
>> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> ********************************************************************** 
> **
> *PLEASE NOTE* This email and any attachments may
> be confidential. If received in error, please delete all
> copies and advise the sender. The reproduction or
> dissemination of this email or its attachments is
> prohibited without the consent of the sender.
>
> WARNING RE VIRUSES: Our computer systems sweep
> outgoing email to guard against viruses, but no warranty
> is given that this email or its attachments are virus free.
> Before opening or using attachments, please check for
> viruses. Our liability is limited to the re-supply of any
> affected attachments.
>
> Any views expressed in this message are those of the
> individual sender, except where the sender expressly,
> and with authority, states them to be the views of the
> organisation.
> ********************************************************************** 
> **
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From tony at radiosouthrc.com  Wed Sep 23 16:32:43 2009
From: tony at radiosouthrc.com (Tony)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 00:32:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <88BDAC1F-2B84-4D75-B97F-642E29326AB3@cox.net>
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl><8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com><01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net><B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net><724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C5394A16@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au><844B2CBE8DB644FC9C737D3F2E5BFD40@Tony>
	<88BDAC1F-2B84-4D75-B97F-642E29326AB3@cox.net>
Message-ID: <B99DB26E6DBF4B239A320635AB357754@Tony>

Ron is absolutely correct!  My "sorry I ever wrote what is below" statement
would be that the very best judged contest I attended was, in my opinion,
the F3A Team Trials when they were a separate event.  

The absolutely worst contest was just about every F3A World Championships I
have attended either as a CD or a Team Manager!  



Tony Stillman, President
Radio South, Inc.
139 Altama Connector, Box 322
Brunswick, GA  31525
1-800-962-7802
www.radiosouthrc.com
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 7:53 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

I am probably going to be sorry I ever wrote what is below, but I  
think now is the time.

If you've never critically watched an F3A World Championships, you  
can't understand what goes on.  You can fly a perfect flight and get  
hammered.

First, many country's judges NEVER judge at all between F3A World  
Championships.  Many poor judges, in my opinion, are at EVERY F3A  
World Championships.  Just why some countries continue to send the  
same poor judges, again my opinion, over and over, I don't understand.

Second, it seems that there is an understanding on how scoring will  
be done among some countries' judges.  For example, at one F3A World  
Championships, flying far out not only was not downgraded, but flying  
at 150 meters, where the aircraft is supposed to be, was downgraded.   
At others, rules will be "bent" by the judges and it is up to the  
pilots and team managers to figure out what (that's not in the rules)  
the judges are looking for.

At the 1995 F3A World Championships in Kasaoka, Japan, I was the U.S.  
judge.  During the Preliminaries, one country's judge was censured in  
front of all the other judges for scoring the pilots from his  
country's team too high.  Then, in the Finals, I found out later that  
it was determined that I was favoring the U.S. pilots, but I did not,  
to my knowledge, change my judging standards.  Apparently I either  
didn't judge fairly, or I didn't get the word that the judging  
standards were to be changed for the Finals.

You can ask Tony Stillman, Quique Somenzini, Chip Hyde, Jason  
Shulman, Sean McMurtry,  or any other active pilots at the F3A world- 
class level, what they think of F3A World Championships judges.  Just  
don't ask them to do it publicly, where any F3A judges might read/ 
hear it, or they would be sure to be 'rewarded' by those judges at  
the next F3A WC.

Ron Van Putte

On Sep 23, 2009, at 6:46 PM, Tony wrote:

> Tom:
> As a past 4-time USA F3A Team Manager, I saw a BUNCH of "unknown"  
> pilots fly
> FANTASTIC sequences and not get anywhere near the score they  
> deserved...  I
> can remember in Poland sitting with Chris Lakin and Kirk Grey watching
> several pilots and one was just fantastic!  Chris and Kirk looked  
> at each
> other and we need to check his scores!  When they came out they  
> were very
> low...  very sad.
>
>
> Tony Stillman, President
> Radio South, Inc.
> 139 Altama Connector, Box 322
> Brunswick, GA  31525
> 1-800-962-7802
> www.radiosouthrc.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of  
> Koenig, Tom
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 6:15 PM
> To: 'General pattern discussion'
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> Ron and all,
>
> I LOVE your suggestion. At least then we may have a chance of  
> obtaining the
> correct placings and/or the correct world champion?
> Also-do not forget the cost savings to the organisation in that the  
> airfares
> will be considerably cheaper by obtaining more 'local' judges. This  
> is a big
> driver for the 'European' hosts....and why countries like Australia  
> and NZ
> tend be disregarded if at all possible. We have issues in that  
> Southern
> hemisphere countries always come from Winter climates where we have  
> limited
> oppertunities to actually prepare/practice for a Northern (summer) 
> world
> champs.
>
> I have also heard suggestions from W/C contest pilots ( not just  
> the aussie
> team btw), that the they wished they could not be 'identified'i.e  
> that they
> be infront of some sort of screen whereby the judges could not  
> identify the
> actual pilot.
>
> Sure-some models could be used as a way of identifying the pilot,  
> but there
> are plenty of the 'same' models being used these days.
>
> I thought that was a cool and perhaps 'do-able' thing? More  
> realistic than
> some sort of computerised/video 'tracking', despite such technology
> existing.
>
> Tom
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron  
> Van Putte
> Sent: Thursday, 24 September 2009 4:57
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships  
> host
> gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total list is
> predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with predominantly
> European judges. The preponderance of European judges
> dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of
> judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the U.S.,
> Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China, Japan,
> Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made
> up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?
> As the host organization, the NSRCA does.
>
> Ron VP
>
> On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:
>
>> Matt,
>>
>> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to
>> have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a good
>> argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate, etc.
>> But, they still want the rolling circles in all future patterns and
>> especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of fields that can
>> fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll in.
>>
>> Don
>>
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-
>> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com
>>
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>>
>>
>> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some just
>> never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat differentiating
>> maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor Pattern circles. They
>> simply consume too much real estate and contradict the very  
>> essence of
>> why we in Pattern moved to quiet our models. Noise reduction  
>> footprint
>> was at the core of that effort some 25 years ago.
>>
>>
>>
>> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many occasions,
>> rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as neat as circles
>> and consume no more footprint than the typical schedule would. Oh  
>> BTW,
>> these are far less difficult to judge objectively
>>
>>
>>
>> MattK
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>> It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend to
>> work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a  
>> pattern
>> airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I found that I
>> really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through
>> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.
>> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10
>> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was  
>> really
>> not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than
>> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just
>> getting old...
>>
>> Ed
>>
>>> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
>>> From: seefo at san.rr.com
>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>
>>> Vince,
>>>
>>> The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.
>> The IAC
>>> Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to
>> differentiate it
>>> from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
>>> flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
>>>
>>> -Doug
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
>>>> class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
>>>> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's
>> class. I am
>>>> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free.  
>> Sign up
>> now. =
>>
>> _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion
>> mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://
>> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> ********************************************************************** 
> **
> *PLEASE NOTE* This email and any attachments may
> be confidential. If received in error, please delete all
> copies and advise the sender. The reproduction or
> dissemination of this email or its attachments is
> prohibited without the consent of the sender.
>
> WARNING RE VIRUSES: Our computer systems sweep
> outgoing email to guard against viruses, but no warranty
> is given that this email or its attachments are virus free.
> Before opening or using attachments, please check for
> viruses. Our liability is limited to the re-supply of any
> affected attachments.
>
> Any views expressed in this message are those of the
> individual sender, except where the sender expressly,
> and with authority, states them to be the views of the
> organisation.
> ********************************************************************** 
> **
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From rcmaster199 at aol.com  Wed Sep 23 16:59:45 2009
From: rcmaster199 at aol.com (rcmaster199 at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 00:59:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C16@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
References: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7C16@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <8CC0AC969C1CEF4-2C84-1B9B3@webmail-d006.sysops.aol.com>

 Hmmmm! You probably don't have kids, especially teenagers. The teens would tell you you have no experience and don't know nuthin....and believe it (VBG)



MattK



 






-----Original Message-----

From: Atwood, Mark &lt;atwoodm at paragon-inc.com&gt;

To: General pattern discussion &lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;

Sent: Wed, Sep 23, 2009 3:08 pm

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns



  
    I'm only 18 with 27 years of experience :)    Of course I'm at work, who has time for this at home?  Just don't tell my boss!    -----Original Message-----  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]   On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte  Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 3:08 PM  To: General pattern discussion  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns    I kinda wish that people like Mark didn't read my stuff quite so    carefully.  I also wonder why he isn't at work.  Hmmmm, maybe he is.     I'll never tell.    2111?  I'll only be 176 years old.    Ron VP    On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:50 PM, Atwood, Mark wrote:    &gt; Only Ron...who was actually around in 1911, would plan to still be    &gt; around in 2111 :)  &gt;  &gt; -----Original Message-----  &gt; From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-   &gt; discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte  &gt; Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 2:5
 7 PM  &gt; To: General pattern discussion  &gt; Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns  &gt;  &gt; I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships  &gt; host gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total  &gt; list is  predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with  &gt; predominantly European judges. The preponderance of European judges  &gt; dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of  &gt; judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the  &gt; U.S., Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China,  &gt; Japan, Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made  &gt; up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?  &gt; As the host organization, the NSRCA does.  &gt;  &gt; Ron VP  &gt;  &gt; On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:  &gt;  &gt;&gt; Matt,  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt; You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to  &
 gt;&gt; have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I mad


e a  &gt;&gt; good argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate,  &gt;&gt; etc.  But, they still want the rolling circles in all future  &gt;&gt; patterns and especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of  &gt;&gt; fields that can fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll  &gt;&gt; in.  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt; Don  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt; From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-  &gt;&gt; discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt; Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM  &gt;&gt; To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  &gt;&gt; Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt; It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some  &gt;&gt; just never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat  &gt;&gt; differentiating maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor  &gt;&gt; Pattern circles. They simply consume too much real estate and  &gt;&g
 t; contradict the very essence of why we in Pattern moved to quiet our  &gt;&gt; models. Noise reduction footprint was at the core of that effort  &gt;&gt; some 25 years ago.  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt; As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many  &gt;&gt; occasions, rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as  &gt;&gt; neat as circles and consume no more footprint than the typical  &gt;&gt; schedule would. Oh BTW, these are far less difficult to judge  &gt;&gt; objectively  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt; MattK  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt; -----Original Message-----  &gt;&gt; From: Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt;  &gt;&gt; To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  &gt;&gt; Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm  &gt;&gt; Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt; It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend  &gt;&gt; to work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was 
 fly it like a  &gt;&gt; pattern airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite


 measure up, but I  &gt;&gt; found that I really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through  &gt;&gt; rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.  &gt;&gt; I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10  &gt;&gt; minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was  &gt;&gt; really not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than  &gt;&gt; knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just  &gt;&gt; getting old...  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt; Ed  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;&gt; Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700  &gt;&gt;&gt; From: seefo at san.rr.com  &gt;&gt;&gt; To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  &gt;&gt;&gt; Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns  &gt;&gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;&gt; Vince,  &gt;&gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;&gt; The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.  &gt;&gt; The IAC  &gt;&gt;&gt; Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to  &gt;&gt; differentiate it  &gt;&gt;&gt; from a poin
 t roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never  &gt;&gt;&gt; flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.  &gt;&gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;&gt; -Doug  &gt;&gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate  &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.  &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's  &gt;&gt; class. I am  &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.  &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt;&gt; _______________________________________________  &gt;&gt;&gt; NSRCA-discussion mailing list  &gt;&gt;&gt; NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  &gt;&gt;&gt; http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt; Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. Sign  &gt;&gt; up now. =  &gt;&gt;  &gt;&gt; ____
 ___________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion  &gt;&


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From Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au  Wed Sep 23 17:04:33 2009
From: Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au (Koenig, Tom)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 01:04:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <88BDAC1F-2B84-4D75-B97F-642E29326AB3@cox.net>
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl><8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com><01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net><B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net>
	<724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C5394A16@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>
	<844B2CBE8DB644FC9C737D3F2E5BFD40@Tony>
	<88BDAC1F-2B84-4D75-B97F-642E29326AB3@cox.net>
Message-ID: <724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C5394A17@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au>

Tony -Ron,

I applaud that you guys spoke up. I am sure you could tell us more. But I understand the predicament that a pilot(s) and some judge(s) face when competing at that level, and heaven forbid, even at a local or national level.

Quite frankly-I am a little disillusioned about the whole thing, while at the same time realising it is a fact of life as an F3A flier/national competitor!!

But IF no one talks about it-then the only choice we have is to perpetuate a system that quite frankly is ill.

Something needs to be done or else the W/C become a meaningless exercise and expense for pilots and a Gravy train for judges.

Unless one has represented at a National level, it is almost impossible to comprehend the enormous sacrifice that is made both financially and personal by these guys. True, we choose our own poison and therefore we have nothing to complain about...but...the W/C is the pinnacle of our sport. It is on a path to mediocrity!

I just wished I was financially sound/mad enough to justify spending 10 grand or more for the pleasure of doing a mere four flights, then being judged by a bunch of roosters who may have already determined beforehand who flies good enough to warrant their 'vote'???

The sad thing is, I doubt it's deliberate, and if it is, then we have a REAL problem

Let's face it; it almost seems universal that this years results were not correct. There...I said it!!

True-I have nothing to worry about as I am not on the world stage-therefore I can express an opinion. But when I hear about the things that I continue to hear about at a worlds-then what is one to do??? Deliberately fly incorrectly?? The stall turns were not stall turns, the snaps were not snaps, the spins were not spinning, wings level was 15 to 25 deg wings down??????

I am quite capable of flying to what the judges want...but it is wrong, the judges should want what the rule book says, NOT what the PR profile might be of either a country or pilot.

Speak up lads...the system is broken, and we need to fix it or else the W/C will be about as interesting as the election of your local politician!!!

Tom Koenig
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van Putte
Sent: Thursday, 24 September 2009 9:53 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

I am probably going to be sorry I ever wrote what is below, but I
think now is the time.

If you've never critically watched an F3A World Championships, you
can't understand what goes on.  You can fly a perfect flight and get
hammered.

First, many country's judges NEVER judge at all between F3A World
Championships.  Many poor judges, in my opinion, are at EVERY F3A
World Championships.  Just why some countries continue to send the
same poor judges, again my opinion, over and over, I don't understand.

Second, it seems that there is an understanding on how scoring will
be done among some countries' judges.  For example, at one F3A World
Championships, flying far out not only was not downgraded, but flying
at 150 meters, where the aircraft is supposed to be, was downgraded.
At others, rules will be "bent" by the judges and it is up to the
pilots and team managers to figure out what (that's not in the rules)
the judges are looking for.

At the 1995 F3A World Championships in Kasaoka, Japan, I was the U.S.
judge.  During the Preliminaries, one country's judge was censured in
front of all the other judges for scoring the pilots from his
country's team too high.  Then, in the Finals, I found out later that
it was determined that I was favoring the U.S. pilots, but I did not,
to my knowledge, change my judging standards.  Apparently I either
didn't judge fairly, or I didn't get the word that the judging
standards were to be changed for the Finals.

You can ask Tony Stillman, Quique Somenzini, Chip Hyde, Jason
Shulman, Sean McMurtry,  or any other active pilots at the F3A world-
class level, what they think of F3A World Championships judges.  Just
don't ask them to do it publicly, where any F3A judges might read/
hear it, or they would be sure to be 'rewarded' by those judges at
the next F3A WC.

Ron Van Putte

On Sep 23, 2009, at 6:46 PM, Tony wrote:

> Tom:
> As a past 4-time USA F3A Team Manager, I saw a BUNCH of "unknown"
> pilots fly
> FANTASTIC sequences and not get anywhere near the score they
> deserved...  I
> can remember in Poland sitting with Chris Lakin and Kirk Grey watching
> several pilots and one was just fantastic!  Chris and Kirk looked
> at each
> other and we need to check his scores!  When they came out they
> were very
> low...  very sad.
>
>
> Tony Stillman, President
> Radio South, Inc.
> 139 Altama Connector, Box 322
> Brunswick, GA  31525
> 1-800-962-7802
> www.radiosouthrc.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
> Koenig, Tom
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 6:15 PM
> To: 'General pattern discussion'
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> Ron and all,
>
> I LOVE your suggestion. At least then we may have a chance of
> obtaining the
> correct placings and/or the correct world champion?
> Also-do not forget the cost savings to the organisation in that the
> airfares
> will be considerably cheaper by obtaining more 'local' judges. This
> is a big
> driver for the 'European' hosts....and why countries like Australia
> and NZ
> tend be disregarded if at all possible. We have issues in that
> Southern
> hemisphere countries always come from Winter climates where we have
> limited
> oppertunities to actually prepare/practice for a Northern (summer)
> world
> champs.
>
> I have also heard suggestions from W/C contest pilots ( not just
> the aussie
> team btw), that the they wished they could not be 'identified'i.e
> that they
> be infront of some sort of screen whereby the judges could not
> identify the
> actual pilot.
>
> Sure-some models could be used as a way of identifying the pilot,
> but there
> are plenty of the 'same' models being used these days.
>
> I thought that was a cool and perhaps 'do-able' thing? More
> realistic than
> some sort of computerised/video 'tracking', despite such technology
> existing.
>
> Tom
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron
> Van Putte
> Sent: Thursday, 24 September 2009 4:57
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships
> host
> gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total list is
> predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with predominantly
> European judges. The preponderance of European judges
> dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of
> judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the U.S.,
> Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China, Japan,
> Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made
> up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?
> As the host organization, the NSRCA does.
>
> Ron VP
>
> On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:
>
>> Matt,
>>
>> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to
>> have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a good
>> argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate, etc.
>> But, they still want the rolling circles in all future patterns and
>> especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of fields that can
>> fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll in.
>>
>> Don
>>
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-
>> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com
>>
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>>
>>
>> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some just
>> never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat differentiating
>> maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor Pattern circles. They
>> simply consume too much real estate and contradict the very
>> essence of
>> why we in Pattern moved to quiet our models. Noise reduction
>> footprint
>> was at the core of that effort some 25 years ago.
>>
>>
>>
>> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many occasions,
>> rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as neat as circles
>> and consume no more footprint than the typical schedule would. Oh
>> BTW,
>> these are far less difficult to judge objectively
>>
>>
>>
>> MattK
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>> It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend to
>> work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a
>> pattern
>> airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I found that I
>> really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through
>> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.
>> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10
>> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was
>> really
>> not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than
>> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just
>> getting old...
>>
>> Ed
>>
>>> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
>>> From: seefo at san.rr.com
>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>
>>> Vince,
>>>
>>> The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.
>> The IAC
>>> Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to
>> differentiate it
>>> from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
>>> flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
>>>
>>> -Doug
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
>>>> class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
>>>> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's
>> class. I am
>>>> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free.
>> Sign up
>> now. =
>>
>> _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion
>> mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://
>> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
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> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From rcmaster199 at aol.com  Wed Sep 23 17:11:17 2009
From: rcmaster199 at aol.com (rcmaster199 at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 01:11:17 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>
References: <01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net>
Message-ID: <8CC0ACAFE0F632D-2C84-1BBBA@webmail-d006.sysops.aol.com>

 Don,



That's totally expected. I know that Dean has recommended to the schedules committee to start to incorporate the vertical complex maneuvers but to apparently deaf ears.



The powers that be don't want them at least not now..



I agree with you that here, real estate is harder to come by, particularly in the northeast



Matt



 






-----Original Message-----

From: Don Ramsey &lt;don.ramsey at suddenlink.net&gt;

To: 'General pattern discussion' &lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;

Sent: Wed, Sep 23, 2009 2:19 pm

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns



  
                                        
    
Matt,
    
?
    
You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want  to have rolling circles.? I objected  strongly and thought I made a good argument; loss of fields, over houses, too  much real estate, etc.? But, they still  want the rolling circles in all future patterns and especially F patterns.? It sure limits the number of fields that can fly  those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll in.
    
?
    
Don
    
?
    
?
    
    
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org  [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com

  Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM

  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
    
    
?
    
    
It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same  lessons but some just never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat  differentiating maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor Pattern  circles. They simply consume too much real estate and contradict the very  essence of why we in Pattern moved to quiet our models. Noise reduction  footprint was at the core of that effort some 25 years ago.
    
    
    
?
    
    
    
As my good friend Dean Pappas?and I have  discussed?on many occasions, rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are  just as neat as circles and consume no more footprint than the typical schedule  would. Oh BTW, these are far less difficult to judge objectively
    
    
    
?
    
    
    
MattK
    
    
    
?
    
    
    
?
    
    
-----Original Message-----

  From: Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt;

  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

  Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm

  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
    
    
It's funny.? I brought my  40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend to work on the F3M stuff and all I  wanted to do was fly it like a pattern airplane.? Ofcourse it doesn't  quite?measure up, but I found that I really have no enthusiasm left for  wapping through rolls where the only?skill involved is being able to stop  on time.? I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about  10 minutes of 3d-ish garbage,?until I finally realized that it was  really?not?very satisfying.? Foamies are more fun these days  than knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.?? I guess I'm just  getting old...

  ?

  Ed

  ?

  &gt; Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700

  &gt; From: seefo at san.rr.com

  &gt; To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

  &gt; Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

  &gt; 

  &gt; Vince,

  &gt; 

  &gt; The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.  The IAC 

  &gt; Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to differentiate it 

  &gt; from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never 

  &gt; flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.

  &gt; 

  &gt; -Doug

  &gt; 

  &gt; 

  &gt; 

  &gt; &gt; 

  &gt; &gt;

  &gt; &gt; Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate 

  &gt; &gt; class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast. 

  &gt; &gt; IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's class. I am  

  &gt; &gt; not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.

  &gt; &gt;

  &gt; &gt; 

  &gt; &gt;

  &gt; 

  &gt; _______________________________________________

  &gt; NSRCA-discussion mailing list

  &gt; NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

  &gt; http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
    
        
    
Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail  Free. Sign  up now. = 
    
    
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From rcmaster199 at aol.com  Wed Sep 23 17:16:47 2009
From: rcmaster199 at aol.com (rcmaster199 at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 01:16:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Webra Bearings
In-Reply-To: <4AB86A8B.1070305@cox.net>
References: <4AB86A8B.1070305@cox.net>
Message-ID: <8CC0ACBC664CFB6-2C84-1BCB9@webmail-d006.sysops.aol.com>

Hey gang,



I don't remember what the bearing number is for a Webra 145/160. Mine is beginning to feel a little worn and the engine is beginning to run erratically.



Or if someone has a NIP for the Webra, please contact me off list



MattK

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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Wed Sep 23 17:22:34 2009
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 01:22:34 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
In-Reply-To: <BLU0-SMTP4729027DF5D2846FF42A3AB4DB0@phx.gbl>
References: <350281092.2013831253727846753.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com><697909526.2014441253728026563.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com>
	<77801960F67D465FA352349306CED63E@Tony>
Message-ID: <BLU121-W1004236C33E048E636F652E8DA0@phx.gbl>


XPS is not using a frequency hopping technology.  It's another direct sequence spead spectrum radio which supposedly has the capability to switch to an alternate channel if a lot of interference is being experienced on the (single) channel that it occupies.  By some reports, that switchover mechanism wasn't working when first released.  By now, who knows.  It's basically a Zigbee based radio, not really designed for airborne apps, actually more suited to distributed mesh networks.  Apparently it works, but I think it's less than ideal for RC aircraft.  

 

Ed
 


From: edskorepa at q.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 14:53:18 -0600
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve








Tony, JR has nothing to do with Graupner-IFS system. It's an Extreme Power System developed right here in Lake Havasu City, AR. Graupner just changed the name from XPS to IFS. As for which system is the best? Must be DUPLEX by JETI. ed

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Tony 
To: 'General pattern discussion' 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 12:07 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve



JR is not Spektrum?.  JR has been selling 2.4Ghz frequency hopping gear in Europe for almost a year.  Check it out under the Graupner name.
For all the info go to  http://www.graupner-ifs-system.de/en.html
 
 

Tony Stillman, President
Radio South, Inc.
139 Altama Connector, Box 322
Brunswick, GA  31525
1-800-962-7802
www.radiosouthrc.com




From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of RON HANSEN
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:47 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
 

The issue isn't whether frequency hopping is better than DSM but rather will JR stick with DSM indefinitely.  I don't want to spend $1400 on a new transmitter that will be out of style in the near future.  Matter of fact, you can buy conversion kits from German companies (Weatronics and ACT) that are better than both DSM and FASST.  The Germans use frequency hopping where the transmitter and receiver talk back and forth to each other.  These German systems aren't cheap but they are certainly better than what we have in the US.  Regardless of what system you go with 2.4 GHz is better than 72 MHz.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: "NSRCA List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 12:53:37 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

Are you aware of situations where DSM doesn't work?
 



Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 11:29:59 -0400
From: rcpilot at wowway.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

I'm still flying 72 MHz using my JR 10X radio.  I need to switch to 2.4 this winter.  This module is the solution to my problem.  I love the 10X, 9303 and 12X radios.  I don't like the DSM2 technology, I feel frequency hopping is a superior technology not to mention you can't use DSM2 in Europe.  Either Europe will eventually approve DSM2 or JR will switch to frequency hopping worldwide.  This solution will afford me more time to see what JR decides to do.  So I plan to try this module out on my foamies and park flyers and if I experience no problems I will use it in my pattern planes come this spring unless JR makes a switch to frequency hopping.  I know there are a lot of people in my situation.
 
Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:58:31 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

In all seriousness, I think it makes little sense to cross over brands this way.  FASST, JR, or Airtronics; things work just fine.  I could see the initial idea that Horizon had with Spektrum to get the world moving to Spread Spectrum with their modules, but I think that time has passed us by.  As far as preserving the value of an investment in a transmitter by moving to another brand of receivers with a module - why? Go with a brand you like and don't look back to gimmicks to cross over part way.  You always lose something in the process.
 
Ed
 




Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 07:01:51 -0700
From: bob at toprudder.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve







Personally, I like the FASST system. I must have a dozen 2.4g receivers now. I have nothing against the JR/Spektrum, a lot of my friends fly JR (I am in a very small minority in my club flying Futaba). I will admit that I bought the Spektrum module for one of my old Futaba transmitters, so that I could do the "bind-n-fly" thing as well.

 

I will tell you guys a funny story. I was at Efest this year. I was flying a Vapor over in the corner for the ultralight planes, and heard someone walk up behing a friend of mine (Jeff Phillips, Radioactive Airshow Team) and start asking him how he liked the Vapors. Well, I thought it must be someone who had never flown a Vapor, so I turned around and handed him my transmitter, an old Futaba 7UA with a Spektrum module, so he could fly it. It happened to be Peter Goldsmith. :-)  I wish I had said "feel the difference" to him. 

 

Bob R.



--- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote:

 






Bill,

You are a one-percenter among the one-percenters! LOL 

 

I actually bought the Spektrum module with Rx for my Futaba 12Fg because it was such a good deal. I'm going to use this setup for indoor this year with some of those really small Spektrum receivers. It's also great for the E-Flite Bind-N-Fly models. I just didn't see the point in going "the other way" but I guess in your case it makes sense.

 

John Pavlick
 


 
 




Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. Get it now. 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
 



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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Wed Sep 23 17:55:26 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 01:55:26 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M
In-Reply-To: <852988490.4936251253757041247.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <49443565.4938271253757324821.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

I am behind.? Does the?fully integrated half roll has to?cover the complete 1/2 loop on bottom?? Therefore, the wings needs to be at 45 degrees in the lower point?? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jim Woodward (US SSA)" < jim . woodward @ baesystems .com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:40:12 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] M 




Thanks Dave, 



I was falling back to the position that all rolls in a maneuver have to match roll rates (excluding point rolls).? It would be easier to perform the maneuver if the ? roll integrated in the ? loop does not have to match the other roll rates. 

Thanks, 

Jim 







From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org [ mailto : nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of Dave 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:43 PM 
To: 'General pattern discussion' 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] M 



I don?t believe there is a requirement (in FAI) for the rate of the ? roll to match the rate of the 1/4rolls. 



Regards, 


Dave 






From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org [ mailto : nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of Woodward, Jim (US SSA) 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:29 PM 
To: General pattern discussion 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] M 




It will also be difficult to match the roll-rates of the non-point roll elements. 

jim 





From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org [ mailto : nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of J Shu 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:18 PM 
To: General pattern discussion 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] M 




roll direction is not specified, chose the way you prefer 



Regards, 
Jason 
www.shulmanaviation.com 
www.composite-arf.com 




----- Original Message ----- 


From: GEORGE KENNIE 


To: General pattern discussion 


Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:13 PM 


Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M 














I need a little help understanding the correct execution of the # 1 Maneuver in P-11. 





The Aresti shows the model approaching from the left. As the first radius is completed and the model assumes a vertical track, 


the requirement is to execute 3 points of?a 4 point roll centered on the upline with the stall turn executed at the apex of the line. 


Due to the fact that I like to present the canopy to the judges on the stall I will roll left on the upline (trust me, I can do it either way 


and I realize there is no mandate,?it's just my own aesthetic preference). 


Now comes the sticky wicket,......on the down line I will be rolling to the right?in preparation for the entry radius into the integrated 


1/2 outside. The fact that the 1/4 roll was also centered on the downline will display that outside preparation position for the 1/2 


duration of the downline. My question is: .........as I enter the bottom radius and start my roll, is there a roll direction requirement? 


If I roll LEFT (which will present the canopy) the judges could easily become confused and think that I'm doing an inside 1/2 loop 


at the?bottom, which is really not the case as I had to push to initiate the 1/2 loop. If I roll to the RIGHT the last 1/2 of the loop looks 


like an inside 1/2 loop. So, I guess?my basic question is, am I free to roll according to my whim?? ?? 





I was unable to find any written FAI maneuver descriptions on our site. Is there a link that I'm missing? 





Thanks Guys, 





Georgie 






_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 
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From AtwoodDon at aol.com  Wed Sep 23 18:00:18 2009
From: AtwoodDon at aol.com (AtwoodDon at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 02:00:18 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M
Message-ID: <d04.614d386d.37ec2c9f@aol.com>

Yes, the half roll should last thru the half loop and you need to be at  
knife-edge at the bottom of the center half loop.
Don
 
 
In a message dated 9/23/2009 6:55:52 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,  
vicenterc at comcast.net writes:

I am  behind.  Does the fully integrated half roll has to cover the  
complete 1/2 loop on bottom?  Therefore, the wings needs to be at 45  degrees in 
the lower point?  

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-----  Original Message -----
From: "Jim Woodward (US SSA)"  <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
To: "General pattern discussion"  <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23,  2009 1:40:12 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re:  [NSRCA-discussion] M


Thanks  Dave, 
I  was falling back to the position that all rolls in a maneuver have to 
match  roll rates (excluding point rolls).  It would be easier to perform the  
maneuver if the ? roll integrated in the ? loop does not have to match the  
other roll rates. 
Thanks, 
Jim 
 
 
From:  nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org  
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of  Dave
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:43 PM
To:  'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion]  M

I  don?t believe there is a requirement (in FAI) for the rate of the ? roll 
to  match the rate of the 1/4rolls. 
Regards, 

Dave 
 
  
____________________________________
 
From:  nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org  
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of  Woodward, Jim (US SSA)
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:29  PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re:  [NSRCA-discussion] M
 
It  will also be difficult to match the roll-rates of the non-point roll  
elements. 
jim
 
 
From:  nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org  
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of J  Shu
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:18 PM
To:  General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion]  M

 
roll direction is not  specified, chose the way you prefer
 

Regards,
Jason
_www.shulmanaviation.com_ (http://www.shulmanaviation.com/) 
_www.composite-arf.com_ (http://www.composite-arf.com/) 

 
----- Original  Message ----- 
 
From: _GEORGE KENNIE_ (mailto:geobet4 at verizon.net)  
 
To: _General pattern  discussion_ (mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org) 
 
 
Sent: Wednesday,  September 23, 2009 1:13 PM
 
Subject:  [NSRCA-discussion] M
 

 

 

 

 
I need a little  help understanding the correct execution of the # 1 
Maneuver in  P-11.
 

 
The Aresti shows  the model approaching from the left. As the first radius 
is completed and  the model assumes a vertical track,
 
the requirement  is to execute 3 points of a 4 point roll centered on the 
upline with  the stall turn executed at the apex of the line.
 
Due to the fact  that I like to present the canopy to the judges on the 
stall I will roll  left on the upline (trust me, I can do it either way
 
and I realize  there is no mandate, it's just my own aesthetic  preference).
 
Now comes the  sticky wicket,......on the down line I will be rolling to 
the right in  preparation for the entry radius into the integrated
 
1/2 outside. The  fact that the 1/4 roll was also centered on the downline 
will display that  outside preparation position for the 1/2 
 
duration of the  downline. My question is: .........as I enter the bottom 
radius and start my  roll, is there a roll direction requirement?
 
If I roll LEFT  (which will present the canopy) the judges could easily 
become confused and  think that I'm doing an inside 1/2 loop
 
at  the bottom, which is really not the case as I had to push to initiate  
the 1/2 loop. If I roll to the RIGHT the last 1/2 of the loop looks  
 
like an inside  1/2 loop. So, I guess my basic question is, am I free to 
roll according  to my whim?   
 

 
I was unable to  find any written FAI maneuver descriptions on our site. Is 
there a link that  I'm missing? 
 

 
Thanks  Guys,
 

 
Georgie
 

  
____________________________________
 
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion  mailing  list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion mailing 
list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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From billglaze at bellsouth.net  Wed Sep 23 18:01:34 2009
From: billglaze at bellsouth.net (Bill Glaze)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 02:01:34 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
References: <BLU121-W658EFF7B8CC355BC3C479E8DB0@phx.gbl><8CC0A828FF4AFAC-6A8-86E9@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com><01b101ca3c7a$5e634080$1b29c180$@ramsey@suddenlink.net><B2A99B28-6473-401B-AFC8-F6663109658D@cox.net><724ADB95DA93CC4BA53B10F84AF85777C5394A16@CBRMAIL10.actewagl.production.com.au><844B2CBE8DB644FC9C737D3F2E5BFD40@Tony><88BDAC1F-2B84-4D75-B97F-642E29326AB3@cox.net>
	<B99DB26E6DBF4B239A320635AB357754@Tony>
Message-ID: <2B082F03A381472B9F79366980044506@glazecstp32xp>

Gentlemen:  Thanks for writing.  Suspicions confirmed.  Bill Glaze
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tony" <tony at radiosouthrc.com>
To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 8:32 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns


> Ron is absolutely correct!  My "sorry I ever wrote what is below" 
> statement
> would be that the very best judged contest I attended was, in my opinion,
> the F3A Team Trials when they were a separate event.
>
> The absolutely worst contest was just about every F3A World Championships 
> I
> have attended either as a CD or a Team Manager!
>
>
>
> Tony Stillman, President
> Radio South, Inc.
> 139 Altama Connector, Box 322
> Brunswick, GA  31525
> 1-800-962-7802
> www.radiosouthrc.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van 
> Putte
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 7:53 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> I am probably going to be sorry I ever wrote what is below, but I
> think now is the time.
>
> If you've never critically watched an F3A World Championships, you
> can't understand what goes on.  You can fly a perfect flight and get
> hammered.
>
> First, many country's judges NEVER judge at all between F3A World
> Championships.  Many poor judges, in my opinion, are at EVERY F3A
> World Championships.  Just why some countries continue to send the
> same poor judges, again my opinion, over and over, I don't understand.
>
> Second, it seems that there is an understanding on how scoring will
> be done among some countries' judges.  For example, at one F3A World
> Championships, flying far out not only was not downgraded, but flying
> at 150 meters, where the aircraft is supposed to be, was downgraded.
> At others, rules will be "bent" by the judges and it is up to the
> pilots and team managers to figure out what (that's not in the rules)
> the judges are looking for.
>
> At the 1995 F3A World Championships in Kasaoka, Japan, I was the U.S.
> judge.  During the Preliminaries, one country's judge was censured in
> front of all the other judges for scoring the pilots from his
> country's team too high.  Then, in the Finals, I found out later that
> it was determined that I was favoring the U.S. pilots, but I did not,
> to my knowledge, change my judging standards.  Apparently I either
> didn't judge fairly, or I didn't get the word that the judging
> standards were to be changed for the Finals.
>
> You can ask Tony Stillman, Quique Somenzini, Chip Hyde, Jason
> Shulman, Sean McMurtry,  or any other active pilots at the F3A world-
> class level, what they think of F3A World Championships judges.  Just
> don't ask them to do it publicly, where any F3A judges might read/
> hear it, or they would be sure to be 'rewarded' by those judges at
> the next F3A WC.
>
> Ron Van Putte
>
> On Sep 23, 2009, at 6:46 PM, Tony wrote:
>
>> Tom:
>> As a past 4-time USA F3A Team Manager, I saw a BUNCH of "unknown"
>> pilots fly
>> FANTASTIC sequences and not get anywhere near the score they
>> deserved...  I
>> can remember in Poland sitting with Chris Lakin and Kirk Grey watching
>> several pilots and one was just fantastic!  Chris and Kirk looked
>> at each
>> other and we need to check his scores!  When they came out they
>> were very
>> low...  very sad.
>>
>>
>> Tony Stillman, President
>> Radio South, Inc.
>> 139 Altama Connector, Box 322
>> Brunswick, GA  31525
>> 1-800-962-7802
>> www.radiosouthrc.com
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
>> Koenig, Tom
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 6:15 PM
>> To: 'General pattern discussion'
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>> Ron and all,
>>
>> I LOVE your suggestion. At least then we may have a chance of
>> obtaining the
>> correct placings and/or the correct world champion?
>> Also-do not forget the cost savings to the organisation in that the
>> airfares
>> will be considerably cheaper by obtaining more 'local' judges. This
>> is a big
>> driver for the 'European' hosts....and why countries like Australia
>> and NZ
>> tend be disregarded if at all possible. We have issues in that
>> Southern
>> hemisphere countries always come from Winter climates where we have
>> limited
>> oppertunities to actually prepare/practice for a Northern (summer)
>> world
>> champs.
>>
>> I have also heard suggestions from W/C contest pilots ( not just
>> the aussie
>> team btw), that the they wished they could not be 'identified'i.e
>> that they
>> be infront of some sort of screen whereby the judges could not
>> identify the
>> actual pilot.
>>
>> Sure-some models could be used as a way of identifying the pilot,
>> but there
>> are plenty of the 'same' models being used these days.
>>
>> I thought that was a cool and perhaps 'do-able' thing? More
>> realistic than
>> some sort of computerised/video 'tracking', despite such technology
>> existing.
>>
>> Tom
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron
>> Van Putte
>> Sent: Thursday, 24 September 2009 4:57
>> To: General pattern discussion
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>> I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships
>> host
>> gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total list is
>> predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with predominantly
>> European judges. The preponderance of European judges
>> dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of
>> judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the U.S.,
>> Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China, Japan,
>> Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made
>> up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?
>> As the host organization, the NSRCA does.
>>
>> Ron VP
>>
>> On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:
>>
>>> Matt,
>>>
>>> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to
>>> have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a good
>>> argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate, etc.
>>> But, they still want the rolling circles in all future patterns and
>>> especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of fields that can
>>> fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll in.
>>>
>>> Don
>>>
>>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-
>>> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com
>>>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some just
>>> never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat differentiating
>>> maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor Pattern circles. They
>>> simply consume too much real estate and contradict the very
>>> essence of
>>> why we in Pattern moved to quiet our models. Noise reduction
>>> footprint
>>> was at the core of that effort some 25 years ago.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many occasions,
>>> rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as neat as circles
>>> and consume no more footprint than the typical schedule would. Oh
>>> BTW,
>>> these are far less difficult to judge objectively
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> MattK
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>
>>> It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend to
>>> work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a
>>> pattern
>>> airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I found that I
>>> really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through
>>> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.
>>> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10
>>> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was
>>> really
>>> not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than
>>> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just
>>> getting old...
>>>
>>> Ed
>>>
>>>> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
>>>> From: seefo at san.rr.com
>>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>>
>>>> Vince,
>>>>
>>>> The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.
>>> The IAC
>>>> Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to
>>> differentiate it
>>>> from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
>>>> flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
>>>>
>>>> -Doug
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
>>>>> class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
>>>>> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's
>>> class. I am
>>>>> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free.
>>> Sign up
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>>>
>>> _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion
>>> mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://
>>> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From astafford at swtexas.net  Wed Sep 23 18:01:44 2009
From: astafford at swtexas.net (Archie Stafford)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 02:01:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M
In-Reply-To: <49443565.4938271253757324821.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <49443565.4938271253757324821.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <63F42304-4D73-43B8-B018-961A38B1E8C3@swtexas.net>

The wings are knife-edge at the bottom.

Arch

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 23, 2009, at 9:55 PM, "Vicente \"Vince\" Bortone" <vicenterc at comcast.net 
 > wrote:

> I am behind.  Does the fully integrated half roll has to cover the  
> complete 1/2 loop on bottom?  Therefore, the wings needs to be at 45  
> degrees in the lower point?
>
> Vicente "Vince" Bortone
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jim Woodward (US SSA)" <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:40:12 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada  
> Central
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] M
>
> Thanks Dave,
>
> I was falling back to the position that all rolls in a maneuver have  
> to match roll rates (excluding point rolls).  It would be easier to  
> perform the maneuver if the ? roll integrated in the ? loop does not 
>  have to match the other roll rates.
> Thanks,
> Jim
>
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dave
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:43 PM
> To: 'General pattern discussion'
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] M
>
> I don?t believe there is a requirement (in FAI) for the rate of the  
> ? roll to match the rate of the 1/4rolls.
>
> Regards,
>
> Dave
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Woodward, Jim (US  
> SSA)
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:29 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] M
>
> It will also be difficult to match the roll-rates of the non-point  
> roll elements.
> jim
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of J Shu
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:18 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] M
>
> roll direction is not specified, chose the way you prefer
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: GEORGE KENNIE
> To: General pattern discussion
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:13 PM
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M
>
>
>
>
> I need a little help understanding the correct execution of the # 1  
> Maneuver in P-11.
>
> The Aresti shows the model approaching from the left. As the first  
> radius is completed and the model assumes a vertical track,
> the requirement is to execute 3 points of a 4 point roll centered on  
> the upline with the stall turn executed at the apex of the line.
> Due to the fact that I like to present the canopy to the judges on  
> the stall I will roll left on the upline (trust me, I can do it  
> either way
> and I realize there is no mandate, it's just my own aesthetic  
> preference).
> Now comes the sticky wicket,......on the down line I will be rolling  
> to the right in preparation for the entry radius into the integrated
> 1/2 outside. The fact that the 1/4 roll was also centered on the  
> downline will display that outside preparation position for the 1/2
> duration of the downline. My question is: .........as I enter the  
> bottom radius and start my roll, is there a roll direction  
> requirement?
> If I roll LEFT (which will present the canopy) the judges could  
> easily become confused and think that I'm doing an inside 1/2 loop
> at the bottom, which is really not the case as I had to push to  
> initiate the 1/2 loop. If I roll to the RIGHT the last 1/2 of the  
> loop looks
> like an inside 1/2 loop. So, I guess my basic question is, am I free  
> to roll according to my whim?
>
> I was unable to find any written FAI maneuver descriptions on our  
> site. Is there a link that I'm missing?
>
> Thanks Guys,
>
> Georgie
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Wed Sep 23 18:11:54 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 02:11:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Unknowns (now about judging)
Message-ID: <002001ca3cbc$5fbbc5a0$1f3350e0$@com>

I really don't see what purpose this thread is going to serve. we (us - this
list) cannot control what the quality of the judges are going to be at any
world championship.  We (the NSRCA and the AMA) can only control which US
judge is presented to the CIAM - we should also not influence how other
countries select their judges either.  That is their right and they control
that process.

Making statements that the WC's are somehow using judges that don't judge by
the rules isn't fair to those judges that judged at the WC's at all.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but let's at least give them (judges)
the benefit of the doubt in that they judged the flights according to the
way they saw it.  Please remember that there are 20 judges there and I
seriously doubt that the majority of them were in collusion and were
determined to pick "their" guy as the champion.  Also please remember that
in the finals, 5 judges were only judging the left turnaround maneuvers
only, 5 different judges were judging the right turnaround maneuvers only,
and 10 different judges were judging the center maneuvers only.  No one is
perfect if they missed seeing a line off by 5/10/15 degrees, or an
over/under rotation on a roll (snap) by 5/10 degrees.

I'll leave you with a quote - "Try as hard as we may for perfection, the net
result of our labors is an amazing variety of imperfectness.  We are
surprised at our own versatility in being able to fail in so many different
ways.".
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From gseeling at q.com  Wed Sep 23 18:33:39 2009
From: gseeling at q.com (gseeling)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 02:33:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve
References: <350281092.2013831253727846753.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com><697909526.2014441253728026563.JavaMail.root@md04.wow.synacor.com><77801960F67D465FA352349306CED63E@Tony>
	<BLU0-SMTP4729027DF5D2846FF42A3AB4DB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP6304A72E4AC1F58379FA76DCDA0@phx.gbl>

only the greesers fly JETI look out for the CAT in the back yard!!!!!!!!
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: ed skorepa 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 2:53 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve


  Tony, JR has nothing to do with Graupner-IFS system. It's an Extreme Power System developed right here in Lake Havasu City, AR. Graupner just changed the name from XPS to IFS. As for which system is the best? Must be DUPLEX by JETI. ed
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Tony 
    To: 'General pattern discussion' 
    Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 12:07 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve


    JR is not Spektrum..  JR has been selling 2.4Ghz frequency hopping gear in Europe for almost a year.  Check it out under the Graupner name.

    For all the info go to  http://www.graupner-ifs-system.de/en.html

     

     

    Tony Stillman, President

    Radio South, Inc.

    139 Altama Connector, Box 322

    Brunswick, GA  31525

    1-800-962-7802

    www.radiosouthrc.com


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of RON HANSEN
    Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:47 PM
    To: General pattern discussion
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

     

    The issue isn't whether frequency hopping is better than DSM but rather will JR stick with DSM indefinitely.  I don't want to spend $1400 on a new transmitter that will be out of style in the near future.  Matter of fact, you can buy conversion kits from German companies (Weatronics and ACT) that are better than both DSM and FASST.  The Germans use frequency hopping where the transmitter and receiver talk back and forth to each other.  These German systems aren't cheap but they are certainly better than what we have in the US.  Regardless of what system you go with 2.4 GHz is better than 72 MHz.
    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
    To: "NSRCA List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
    Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 12:53:37 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

    Are you aware of situations where DSM doesn't work?
     


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 11:29:59 -0400
    From: rcpilot at wowway.com
    To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

    I'm still flying 72 MHz using my JR 10X radio.  I need to switch to 2.4 this winter.  This module is the solution to my problem.  I love the 10X, 9303 and 12X radios.  I don't like the DSM2 technology, I feel frequency hopping is a superior technology not to mention you can't use DSM2 in Europe.  Either Europe will eventually approve DSM2 or JR will switch to frequency hopping worldwide.  This solution will afford me more time to see what JR decides to do.  So I plan to try this module out on my foamies and park flyers and if I experience no problems I will use it in my pattern planes come this spring unless JR makes a switch to frequency hopping.  I know there are a lot of people in my situation.
     
    Ron
    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Ed Alt" <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
    To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 9:58:31 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve

    In all seriousness, I think it makes little sense to cross over brands this way.  FASST, JR, or Airtronics; things work just fine.  I could see the initial idea that Horizon had with Spektrum to get the world moving to Spread Spectrum with their modules, but I think that time has passed us by.  As far as preserving the value of an investment in a transmitter by moving to another brand of receivers with a module - why? Go with a brand you like and don't look back to gimmicks to cross over part way.  You always lose something in the process.
     
    Ed
     


----------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 07:01:51 -0700
    From: bob at toprudder.com
    To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Spectrum and Hobbico... new 2.4 alternatitve



          Personally, I like the FASST system. I must have a dozen 2.4g receivers now. I have nothing against the JR/Spektrum, a lot of my friends fly JR (I am in a very small minority in my club flying Futaba). I will admit that I bought the Spektrum module for one of my old Futaba transmitters, so that I could do the "bind-n-fly" thing as well.

           

          I will tell you guys a funny story. I was at Efest this year. I was flying a Vapor over in the corner for the ultralight planes, and heard someone walk up behing a friend of mine (Jeff Phillips, Radioactive Airshow Team) and start asking him how he liked the Vapors. Well, I thought it must be someone who had never flown a Vapor, so I turned around and handed him my transmitter, an old Futaba 7UA with a Spektrum module, so he could fly it. It happened to be Peter Goldsmith. :-)  I wish I had said "feel the difference" to him. 

           

          Bob R.



          --- On Tue, 9/22/09, John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> wrote:

             

                  Bill,

                  You are a one-percenter among the one-percenters! LOL 

                   

                  I actually bought the Spektrum module with Rx for my Futaba 12Fg because it was such a good deal. I'm going to use this setup for indoor this year with some of those really small Spektrum receivers. It's also great for the E-Flite Bind-N-Fly models. I just didn't see the point in going "the other way" but I guess in your case it makes sense.

                   

                  John Pavlick
                 

             


             
         

     


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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Wed Sep 23 18:38:32 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 02:38:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
In-Reply-To: <80912003.4951371253759080685.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1438036480.4958341253759912496.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>



What activities the judges have before starting the WC?? I assume that event of this level requires that judges are calibrated before the contest.? This is more important in this case because they came from all continents.? 



In 2003 I have the opportunity to organize the flying judging for the US Scale Masters.? We had 60?pilots in 4 dasy ?of flying.??We had 12 judges.??We started to practice judging one year before the contest.??Yes, one year.? We meet every two weeks to study the rule book and make sure all understood the rules.? We went to local airports to see real planes landing and taking off to get the speed perception that is very important in?scale competition.? Around two months before the contest we invited pilots to fly scale planes in front of us.? We judged and discussed the downgrades after each fly.? At the end of this process?all judges were withing one?1/2 point.? I had only one pilot?complaining?because he got zeros from 4 judges in two rounds.? He asked me why.? I?judged one of the round.? This?pilot was flying?a C-47 that was a work-of-art.??The engines?came to life with electric starters so he?never touched the plane when got ready to fly.??He also dressed like the real C-47 pilots in that time.? It was amazing.? However, he forgot the rule that the center of the runway is the dead line and he crossed that line in two rounds in two?maneuvers.? Believe me, it is hard to write that zero in that particular case.? All judges were so well calibrated and understood the rules that they were sure when?they wrote the zero.???It was very easy for me to explain to that pilot.?? This was?my best aeromodeling experience.? If someone wants to see pictures I have a?power point file with pictures of this event.? Just send me an e-mail?and I will send you?the file.? 



In conclusion,??I?really think that judges for the WC has to be at the site at least one week before the contest.? During the week prior they should have?calibration/re-training activities.? I am sure that they will find a lot of?pilots that will be willing to fly so they can practice.?????? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bill Glaze" < billglaze @ bellsouth .net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 9:01:39 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [ NSRCA -discussion] unknowns 

Gentlemen: ?Thanks for writing. ?Suspicions confirmed. ?Bill Glaze 
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tony" <tony@ radiosouthrc .com> 
To: " 'General pattern discussion' " < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 8:32 PM 
Subject: Re: [ NSRCA -discussion] unknowns 


> Ron is absolutely correct! ?My "sorry I ever wrote what is below" 
> statement 
> would be that the very best judged contest I attended was, in my opinion, 
> the F3A Team Trials when they were a separate event. 
> 
> The absolutely worst contest was just about every F3A World Championships 
> I 
> have attended either as a CD or a Team Manager! 
> 
> 
> 
> Tony Stillman, President 
> Radio South, Inc. 
> 139 Altama Connector, Box 322 
> Brunswick, GA ?31525 
> 1-800-962-7802 
> www . radiosouthrc .com 
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org 
> [ mailto : nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of Ron Van 
> Putte 
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 7:53 PM 
> To: General pattern discussion 
> Subject: Re: [ NSRCA -discussion] unknowns 
> 
> I am probably going to be sorry I ever wrote what is below, but I 
> think now is the time. 
> 
> If you've never critically watched an F3A World Championships, you 
> can't understand what goes on. ?You can fly a perfect flight and get 
> hammered. 
> 
> First, many country's judges NEVER judge at all between F3A World 
> Championships. ?Many poor judges, in my opinion, are at EVERY F3A 
> World Championships. ?Just why some countries continue to send the 
> same poor judges, again my opinion, over and over, I don't understand. 
> 
> Second, it seems that there is an understanding on how scoring will 
> be done among some countries' judges. ?For example, at one F3A World 
> Championships, flying far out not only was not downgraded, but flying 
> at 150 meters, where the aircraft is supposed to be, was downgraded. 
> At others, rules will be "bent" by the judges and it is up to the 
> pilots and team managers to figure out what (that's not in the rules) 
> the judges are looking for. 
> 
> At the 1995 F3A World Championships in Kasaoka , Japan, I was the U.S. 
> judge. ?During the Preliminaries, one country's judge was censured in 
> front of all the other judges for scoring the pilots from his 
> country's team too high. ?Then, in the Finals, I found out later that 
> it was determined that I was favoring the U.S. pilots, but I did not, 
> to my knowledge, change my judging standards. ?Apparently I either 
> didn't judge fairly, or I didn't get the word that the judging 
> standards were to be changed for the Finals. 
> 
> You can ask Tony Stillman, Quique Somenzini , Chip Hyde, Jason 
> Shulman , Sean McMurtry , ?or any other active pilots at the F3A world- 
> class level, what they think of F3A World Championships judges. ?Just 
> don't ask them to do it publicly, where any F3A judges might read/ 
> hear it, or they would be sure to be 'rewarded' by those judges at 
> the next F3A WC. 
> 
> Ron Van Putte 
> 
> On Sep 23, 2009, at 6:46 PM, Tony wrote: 
> 
>> Tom: 
>> As a past 4-time USA F3A Team Manager, I saw a BUNCH of "unknown" 
>> pilots fly 
>> FANTASTIC sequences and not get anywhere near the score they 
>> deserved... ?I 
>> can remember in Poland sitting with Chris Lakin and Kirk Grey watching 
>> several pilots and one was just fantastic! ?Chris and Kirk looked 
>> at each 
>> other and we need to check his scores! ?When they came out they 
>> were very 
>> low... ?very sad. 
>> 
>> 
>> Tony Stillman, President 
>> Radio South, Inc. 
>> 139 Altama Connector, Box 322 
>> Brunswick, GA ?31525 
>> 1-800-962-7802 
>> www . radiosouthrc .com 
>> 
>> -----Original Message----- 
>> From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org 
>> [ mailto : nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of 
>> Koenig , Tom 
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 6:15 PM 
>> To: 'General pattern discussion' 
>> Subject: Re: [ NSRCA -discussion] unknowns 
>> 
>> Ron and all, 
>> 
>> I LOVE your suggestion. At least then we may have a chance of 
>> obtaining the 
>> correct placings and/or the correct world champion? 
>> Also-do not forget the cost savings to the organisation in that the 
>> airfares 
>> will be considerably cheaper by obtaining more 'local' judges. This 
>> is a big 
>> driver for the 'European' hosts....and why countries like Australia 
>> and NZ 
>> tend be disregarded if at all possible. We have issues in that 
>> Southern 
>> hemisphere countries always come from Winter climates where we have 
>> limited 
>> oppertunities to actually prepare/practice for a Northern (summer) 
>> world 
>> champs. 
>> 
>> I have also heard suggestions from W/C contest pilots ( not just 
>> the aussie 
>> team btw ), that the they wished they could not be 'identified'i .e 
>> that they 
>> be infront of some sort of screen whereby the judges could not 
>> identify the 
>> actual pilot. 
>> 
>> Sure-some models could be used as a way of identifying the pilot, 
>> but there 
>> are plenty of the 'same' models being used these days. 
>> 
>> I thought that was a cool and perhaps 'do-able' thing? More 
>> realistic than 
>> some sort of computerised/video 'tracking' , despite such technology 
>> existing. 
>> 
>> Tom 
>> 
>> -----Original Message----- 
>> From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org 
>> [ mailto : nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of Ron 
>> Van Putte 
>> Sent: Thursday, 24 September 2009 4:57 
>> To: General pattern discussion 
>> Subject: Re: [ NSRCA -discussion] unknowns 
>> 
>> I smile every time I think about this: ?The F3A World Championships 
>> host 
>> gets a list of potential judges from which to pick. ?The total list is 
>> predominantly European judges. ?Most F3A WCs end up with predominantly 
>> European judges. The preponderance of European judges 
>> dictates how judging will be done. ? However, what if the list of 
>> judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the U.S., 
>> Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand , Australia, China, Japan, 
>> Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made 
>> up of predominantly European judges? ?Who gets to pick the judges? 
>> As the host organization, the NSRCA does. 
>> 
>> Ron VP 
>> 
>> On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote: 
>> 
>>> Matt, 
>>> 
>>> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to 
>>> have rolling circles. ?I objected strongly and thought I made a good 
>>> argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate, etc. 
>>> But, they still want the rolling circles in all future patterns and 
>>> especially F patterns. ?It sure limits the number of fields that can 
>>> fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll in. 
>>> 
>>> Don 
>>> 
>>> From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org [ mailto : nsrca - 
>>> discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199@ aol .com 
>>> 
>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM 
>>> To: nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
>>> Subject: Re: [ NSRCA -discussion] unknowns 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some just 
>>> never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat differentiating 
>>> maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor Pattern circles. They 
>>> simply consume too much real estate and contradict the very 
>>> essence of 
>>> why we in Pattern moved to quiet our models. Noise reduction 
>>> footprint 
>>> was at the core of that effort some 25 years ago. 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many occasions, 
>>> rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as neat as circles 
>>> and consume no more footprint than the typical schedule would. Oh 
>>> BTW, 
>>> these are far less difficult to judge objectively 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> MattK 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message----- 
>>> From: Ed Alt < ed_alt @ hotmail .com> 
>>> To: nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
>>> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm 
>>> Subject: Re: [ NSRCA -discussion] unknowns 
>>> 
>>> It's funny. ?I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend to 
>>> work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a 
>>> pattern 
>>> airplane. ? Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I found that I 
>>> really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through 
>>> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time. 
>>> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10 
>>> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was 
>>> really 
>>> not very satisfying. ? Foamies are more fun these days than 
>>> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser . ? I guess I'm just 
>>> getting old... 
>>> 
>>> Ed 
>>> 
>>>> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700 
>>>> From: seefo @ san . rr .com 
>>>> To: nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
>>>> Subject: Re: [ NSRCA -discussion] unknowns 
>>>> 
>>>> Vince, 
>>>> 
>>>> The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll. 
>>> The IAC 
>>>> Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to 
>>> differentiate it 
>>>> from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never 
>>>> flown at anything but maximum roll rate available. 
>>>> 
>>>> -Doug 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate 
>>>>> class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast. 
>>>>> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's 
>>> class. I am 
>>>>> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll. 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________ 
>>>> NSRCA -discussion mailing list 
>>>> NSRCA -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
>>>> http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
>>> 
>>> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. 
>>> Sign up 
>>> now. = 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________ ? NSRCA -discussion 
>>> mailing list ? NSRCA -discussion at lists. nsrca .org ? http :// 
>>> lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
>>> _______________________________________________ 
>>> NSRCA -discussion mailing list 
>>> NSRCA -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
>>> http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________ 
>> NSRCA -discussion mailing list 
>> NSRCA -discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
>> http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
>> 
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>> *PLEASE NOTE* This email and any attachments may 
>> be confidential. If received in error, please delete all 
>> copies and advise the sender. The reproduction or 
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> 
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From vanputte at cox.net  Wed Sep 23 19:02:31 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 03:02:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Unknowns (now about judging)
In-Reply-To: <002001ca3cbc$5fbbc5a0$1f3350e0$@com>
References: <002001ca3cbc$5fbbc5a0$1f3350e0$@com>
Message-ID: <FDE78DCF-60C1-4B93-941A-A480B6F8DB6E@cox.net>

Every once in a while, those of us who really care about R/C  
aerobatic competition have to scream to be heard above the "go along  
to get along" guys and the "we can't do anything about it, so let's  
just stop talking about it" crowd.  I believe we (NSRCA) need to push  
the required judging representation ratios as hard as we can to get  
as many non-European judges in the judging chairs as we can in 2011.

Ron VP

On Sep 23, 2009, at 9:11 PM, Derek Koopowitz wrote:

> I really don?t see what purpose this thread is going to serve? we  
> (us ? this list) cannot control what the quality of the judges are  
> going to be at any world championship.  We (the NSRCA and the AMA)  
> can only control which US judge is presented to the CIAM ? we  
> should also not influence how other countries select their judges  
> either.  That is their right and they control that process.
>
> Making statements that the WC?s are somehow using judges that don?t  
> judge by the rules isn?t fair to those judges that judged at the  
> WC?s at all.  Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but let?s at  
> least give them (judges) the benefit of the doubt in that they  
> judged the flights according to the way they saw it.  Please  
> remember that there are 20 judges there and I seriously doubt that  
> the majority of them were in collusion and were determined to pick  
> ?their? guy as the champion.  Also please remember that in the  
> finals, 5 judges were only judging the left turnaround maneuvers  
> only, 5 different judges were judging the right turnaround  
> maneuvers only, and 10 different judges were judging the center  
> maneuvers only.  No one is perfect if they missed seeing a line off  
> by 5/10/15 degrees, or an over/under rotation on a roll (snap) by  
> 5/10 degrees.
>
>
> I?ll leave you with a quote ? ?Try as hard as we may for  
> perfection, the net result of our labors is an amazing variety of  
> imperfectness.  We are surprised at our own versatility in being  
> able to fail in so many different ways.?.
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From burtona at atmc.net  Wed Sep 23 19:22:12 2009
From: burtona at atmc.net (Dave Burton)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 03:22:12 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Vince Bortone Power Point file
In-Reply-To: <1438036480.4958341253759912496.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <80912003.4951371253759080685.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<1438036480.4958341253759912496.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <014901ca3cc6$39dd0e20$ad972a60$@net>

Vince, I?d like to see the power point file of the scale event.

burtona at atmc.net

Thanks?

Dave Burton

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Vicente "Vince" Bortone
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 10:39 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

 

What activities the judges have before starting the WC?  I assume that event of this level requires that judges are calibrated before the contest.  This is more important in this case because they came from all continents.  

 

In 2003 I have the opportunity to organize the flying judging for the US Scale Masters.  We had 60 pilots in 4 dasy of flying.  We had 12 judges.  We started to practice judging one year before the contest.  Yes, one year.  We meet every two weeks to study the rule book and make sure all understood the rules.  We went to local airports to see real planes landing and taking off to get the speed perception that is very important in scale competition.  Around two months before the contest we invited pilots to fly scale planes in front of us.  We judged and discussed the downgrades after each fly.  At the end of this process all judges were withing one 1/2 point.  I had only one pilot complaining because he got zeros from 4 judges in two rounds.  He asked me why.  I judged one of the round.  This pilot was flying a C-47 that was a work-of-art.  The engines came to life with electric starters so he never touched the plane when got ready to fly.  He also dressed like the real C-47 pilots in that time.  It was amazing.  However, he forgot the rule that the center of the runway is the dead line and he crossed that line in two rounds in two maneuvers.  Believe me, it is hard to write that zero in that particular case.  All judges were so well calibrated and understood the rules that they were sure when they wrote the zero.   It was very easy for me to explain to that pilot.   This was my best aeromodeling experience.  If someone wants to see pictures I have a power point file with pictures of this event.  Just send me an e-mail and I will send you the file. 

 

In conclusion,  I really think that judges for the WC has to be at the site at least one week before the contest.  During the week prior they should have calibration/re-training activities.  I am sure that they will find a lot of pilots that will be willing to fly so they can practice.       

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Glaze" <billglaze at bellsouth.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 9:01:39 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

Gentlemen:  Thanks for writing.  Suspicions confirmed.  Bill Glaze
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tony" <tony at radiosouthrc.com>
To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 8:32 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns


> Ron is absolutely correct!  My "sorry I ever wrote what is below" 
> statement
> would be that the very best judged contest I attended was, in my opinion,
> the F3A Team Trials when they were a separate event.
>
> The absolutely worst contest was just about every F3A World Championships 
> I
> have attended either as a CD or a Team Manager!
>
>
>
> Tony Stillman, President
> Radio South, Inc.
> 139 Altama Connector, Box 322
> Brunswick, GA  31525
> 1-800-962-7802
> www.radiosouthrc.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron Van 
> Putte
> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 7:53 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>
> I am probably going to be sorry I ever wrote what is below, but I
> think now is the time.
>
> If you've never critically watched an F3A World Championships, you
> can't understand what goes on.  You can fly a perfect flight and get
> hammered.
>
> First, many country's judges NEVER judge at all between F3A World
> Championships.  Many poor judges, in my opinion, are at EVERY F3A
> World Championships.  Just why some countries continue to send the
> same poor judges, again my opinion, over and over, I don't understand.
>
> Second, it seems that there is an understanding on how scoring will
> be done among some countries' judges.  For example, at one F3A World
> Championships, flying far out not only was not downgraded, but flying
> at 150 meters, where the aircraft is supposed to be, was downgraded.
> At others, rules will be "bent" by the judges and it is up to the
> pilots and team managers to figure out what (that's not in the rules)
> the judges are looking for.
>
> At the 1995 F3A World Championships in Kasaoka, Japan, I was the U.S.
> judge.  During the Preliminaries, one country's judge was censured in
> front of all the other judges for scoring the pilots from his
> country's team too high.  Then, in the Finals, I found out later that
> it was determined that I was favoring the U.S. pilots, but I did not,
> to my knowledge, change my judging standards.  Apparently I either
> didn't judge fairly, or I didn't get the word that the judging
> standards were to be changed for the Finals.
>
> You can ask Tony Stillman, Quique Somenzini, Chip Hyde, Jason
> Shulman, Sean McMurtry,  or any other active pilots at the F3A world-
> class level, what they think of F3A World Championships judges.  Just
> don't ask them to do it publicly, where any F3A judges might read/
> hear it, or they would be sure to be 'rewarded' by those judges at
> the next F3A WC.
>
> Ron Van Putte
>
> On Sep 23, 2009, at 6:46 PM, Tony wrote:
>
>> Tom:
>> As a past 4-time USA F3A Team Manager, I saw a BUNCH of "unknown"
>> pilots fly
>> FANTASTIC sequences and not get anywhere near the score they
>> deserved...  I
>> can remember in Poland sitting with Chris Lakin and Kirk Grey watching
>> several pilots and one was just fantastic!  Chris and Kirk looked
>> at each
>> other and we need to check his scores!  When they came out they
>> were very
>> low...  very sad.
>>
>>
>> Tony Stillman, President
>> Radio South, Inc.
>> 139 Altama Connector, Box 322
>> Brunswick, GA  31525
>> 1-800-962-7802
>> www.radiosouthrc.com
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
>> Koenig, Tom
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 6:15 PM
>> To: 'General pattern discussion'
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>> Ron and all,
>>
>> I LOVE your suggestion. At least then we may have a chance of
>> obtaining the
>> correct placings and/or the correct world champion?
>> Also-do not forget the cost savings to the organisation in that the
>> airfares
>> will be considerably cheaper by obtaining more 'local' judges. This
>> is a big
>> driver for the 'European' hosts....and why countries like Australia
>> and NZ
>> tend be disregarded if at all possible. We have issues in that
>> Southern
>> hemisphere countries always come from Winter climates where we have
>> limited
>> oppertunities to actually prepare/practice for a Northern (summer)
>> world
>> champs.
>>
>> I have also heard suggestions from W/C contest pilots ( not just
>> the aussie
>> team btw), that the they wished they could not be 'identified'i.e
>> that they
>> be infront of some sort of screen whereby the judges could not
>> identify the
>> actual pilot.
>>
>> Sure-some models could be used as a way of identifying the pilot,
>> but there
>> are plenty of the 'same' models being used these days.
>>
>> I thought that was a cool and perhaps 'do-able' thing? More
>> realistic than
>> some sort of computerised/video 'tracking', despite such technology
>> existing.
>>
>> Tom
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ron
>> Van Putte
>> Sent: Thursday, 24 September 2009 4:57
>> To: General pattern discussion
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>
>> I smile every time I think about this:  The F3A World Championships
>> host
>> gets a list of potential judges from which to pick.  The total list is
>> predominantly European judges.  Most F3A WCs end up with predominantly
>> European judges. The preponderance of European judges
>> dictates how judging will be done.   However, what if the list of
>> judges for the 2111 F3A WC is mostly made up of a judge from the U.S.,
>> Canada, Mexico, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia, China, Japan,
>> Argentina, Venezuela, etc , such that it that it is NOT made
>> up of predominantly European judges?  Who gets to pick the judges?
>> As the host organization, the NSRCA does.
>>
>> Ron VP
>>
>> On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Don Ramsey wrote:
>>
>>> Matt,
>>>
>>> You will be disappointed to know that all the World Judges want to
>>> have rolling circles.  I objected strongly and thought I made a good
>>> argument; loss of fields, over houses, too much real estate, etc.
>>> But, they still want the rolling circles in all future patterns and
>>> especially F patterns.  It sure limits the number of fields that can
>>> fly those patterns unless the pilots decide to roll in.
>>>
>>> Don
>>>
>>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-
>>> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of rcmaster199 at aol.com
>>>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 11:32 AM
>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> It seems to me that we keep "learning" the same lessons but some just
>>> never get the memo. Rolling circles are very neat differentiating
>>> maneuvers BUT not desirable in neither IMAC nor Pattern circles. They
>>> simply consume too much real estate and contradict the very
>>> essence of
>>> why we in Pattern moved to quiet our models. Noise reduction
>>> footprint
>>> was at the core of that effort some 25 years ago.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> As my good friend Dean Pappas and I have discussed on many occasions,
>>> rolling loops, segments, variations, etc. are just as neat as circles
>>> and consume no more footprint than the typical schedule would. Oh
>>> BTW,
>>> these are far less difficult to judge objectively
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> MattK
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> Sent: Tue, Sep 22, 2009 10:08 pm
>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>
>>> It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend to
>>> work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a
>>> pattern
>>> airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I found that I
>>> really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through
>>> rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.
>>> I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10
>>> minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was
>>> really
>>> not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than
>>> knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just
>>> getting old...
>>>
>>> Ed
>>>
>>>> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
>>>> From: seefo at san.rr.com
>>>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
>>>>
>>>> Vince,
>>>>
>>>> The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll.
>>> The IAC
>>>> Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to
>>> differentiate it
>>>> from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never
>>>> flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
>>>>
>>>> -Doug
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate
>>>>> class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast.
>>>>> IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's
>>> class. I am
>>>>> not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free.
>>> Sign up
>>> now. =
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________  NSRCA-discussion
>>> mailing list  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org  http://
>>> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
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>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
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>> **
>> *PLEASE NOTE* This email and any attachments may
>> be confidential. If received in error, please delete all
>> copies and advise the sender. The reproduction or
>> dissemination of this email or its attachments is
>> prohibited without the consent of the sender.
>>
>> WARNING RE VIRUSES: Our computer systems sweep
>> outgoing email to guard against viruses, but no warranty
>> is given that this email or its attachments are virus free.
>> Before opening or using attachments, please check for
>> viruses. Our liability is limited to the re-supply of any
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From geobet4 at verizon.net  Thu Sep 24 04:25:10 2009
From: geobet4 at verizon.net (GEORGE KENNIE)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 12:25:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M
References: <D5C0973A3E6E489C9EFB663C69A252D9@george15cf36d8>
	<FDBD00260BE84B85996A3C7222C62726@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <0D554B3BB9904CEFB3F381C46A1A3FA0@george15cf36d8>

Thanks Jay
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: J Shu 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:18 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] M


  roll direction is not specified, chose the way you prefer

  Regards,
  Jason
  www.shulmanaviation.com
  www.composite-arf.com

    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: GEORGE KENNIE 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:13 PM
    Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] M





    I need a little help understanding the correct execution of the # 1 Maneuver in P-11.

    The Aresti shows the model approaching from the left. As the first radius is completed and the model assumes a vertical track,
    the requirement is to execute 3 points of a 4 point roll centered on the upline with the stall turn executed at the apex of the line.
    Due to the fact that I like to present the canopy to the judges on the stall I will roll left on the upline (trust me, I can do it either way
    and I realize there is no mandate, it's just my own aesthetic preference).
    Now comes the sticky wicket,......on the down line I will be rolling to the right in preparation for the entry radius into the integrated
    1/2 outside. The fact that the 1/4 roll was also centered on the downline will display that outside preparation position for the 1/2 
    duration of the downline. My question is: .........as I enter the bottom radius and start my roll, is there a roll direction requirement?
    If I roll LEFT (which will present the canopy) the judges could easily become confused and think that I'm doing an inside 1/2 loop
    at the bottom, which is really not the case as I had to push to initiate the 1/2 loop. If I roll to the RIGHT the last 1/2 of the loop looks 
    like an inside 1/2 loop. So, I guess my basic question is, am I free to roll according to my whim?   

    I was unable to find any written FAI maneuver descriptions on our site. Is there a link that I'm missing? 

    Thanks Guys,

    Georgie



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From jferrell13 at triad.rr.com  Thu Sep 24 04:58:37 2009
From: jferrell13 at triad.rr.com (John Ferrell)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 12:58:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Unknowns (now about judging)
References: <002001ca3cbc$5fbbc5a0$1f3350e0$@com>
Message-ID: <79582F1A3A7C4F2C8CA36C67733783BA@xppro2>

Unknowns (now about judging)The first step in resolving any problem is accepting that there is a problem.
Perhaps some things can be fixed and perhaps they are as good as they get.

John Ferrell  W8CCW
 
"Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice, and moderation in pursuit of justice is no virtue."
-Barry Goldwater
"You don't get harmony when everybody sings the same note."
-Doug Floyd

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Derek Koopowitz 
  To: 'General pattern discussion' 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 10:11 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Unknowns (now about judging)


  I really don't see what purpose this thread is going to serve. we (us - this list) cannot control what the quality of the judges are going to be at any world championship.  We (the NSRCA and the AMA) can only control which US judge is presented to the CIAM - we should also not influence how other countries select their judges either.  That is their right and they control that process.

  Making statements that the WC's are somehow using judges that don't judge by the rules isn't fair to those judges that judged at the WC's at all.  Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but let's at least give them (judges) the benefit of the doubt in that they judged the flights according to the way they saw it.  Please remember that there are 20 judges there and I seriously doubt that the majority of them were in collusion and were determined to pick "their" guy as the champion.  Also please remember that in the finals, 5 judges were only judging the left turnaround maneuvers only, 5 different judges were judging the right turnaround maneuvers only, and 10 different judges were judging the center maneuvers only.  No one is perfect if they missed seeing a line off by 5/10/15 degrees, or an over/under rotation on a roll (snap) by 5/10 degrees.


  I'll leave you with a quote - "Try as hard as we may for perfection, the net result of our labors is an amazing variety of imperfectness.  We are surprised at our own versatility in being able to fail in so many different ways.".



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From schale at optonline.net  Thu Sep 24 05:58:44 2009
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 13:58:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <4AB8F0C6.6050005@san.rr.com>
References: <1263356613.4176751253633873575.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<4AB8F0C6.6050005@san.rr.com>
Message-ID: <4ABB7ACE.5090006@optonline.net>

I love the way the question I posed about adding an unkown to pattern 
has morphed into multiple topics, currently world championship judging :)

One other nice idea that IMAC has implemented is in their contest 
management software.  As a member of the web team I would love to see us 
be able to do something similar (I have no idea what is involved).  I am 
sure this feature brings a lot more use to their website than we get.  
Like we have, all of their contests are listed from their website.  
However you can sign up for any contest in a uniform manner.  Some of 
our districts did or does have this feature but it is not uniformly 
implemented.  You can also see who is registered for a contest, how many 
people are going, how many in each class, etc.  Once the contest is 
complete the scoring program that they use generates a report that gets 
uploaded to the web as results for that contest.  This is a very 
interesting feature.  Final results with round scores including dropped 
rounds etc are posted.  If you click on your name or any pilot you will 
see all of their individual scores for the contest.  No need to rummage 
through scoring sheets to find yours.  You can see how you scored in 
each maneuver through the contest or compared to other fliers.
An example of their contest results page.
http://www.mini-iac.com/Regions/NorthCentral/NCContestResults/tabid/101/Default.aspx

Stuart



From anthonyr105 at hotmail.com  Thu Sep 24 06:18:32 2009
From: anthonyr105 at hotmail.com (Anthony Romano)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 14:18:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <4ABB7ACE.5090006@optonline.net>
References: <1263356613.4176751253633873575.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<4AB8F0C6.6050005@san.rr.com>
Message-ID: <COL123-W27B035E6FC7B10DF4B45A1E2DA0@phx.gbl>


Pretty amazing how much info is there. The AMA can't even get the Nats results right.

 

Anthony
 
> Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 09:57:34 -0400
> From: schale at optonline.net
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
> 
> I love the way the question I posed about adding an unkown to pattern 
> has morphed into multiple topics, currently world championship judging :)
> 
> One other nice idea that IMAC has implemented is in their contest 
> management software. As a member of the web team I would love to see us 
> be able to do something similar (I have no idea what is involved). I am 
> sure this feature brings a lot more use to their website than we get. 
> Like we have, all of their contests are listed from their website. 
> However you can sign up for any contest in a uniform manner. Some of 
> our districts did or does have this feature but it is not uniformly 
> implemented. You can also see who is registered for a contest, how many 
> people are going, how many in each class, etc. Once the contest is 
> complete the scoring program that they use generates a report that gets 
> uploaded to the web as results for that contest. This is a very 
> interesting feature. Final results with round scores including dropped 
> rounds etc are posted. If you click on your name or any pilot you will 
> see all of their individual scores for the contest. No need to rummage 
> through scoring sheets to find yours. You can see how you scored in 
> each maneuver through the contest or compared to other fliers.
> An example of their contest results page.
> http://www.mini-iac.com/Regions/NorthCentral/NCContestResults/tabid/101/Default.aspx
> 
> Stuart
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
 		 	   		  
_________________________________________________________________
Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail?.
http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_QuickAdd_062009
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From jpavlick at idseng.com  Thu Sep 24 06:31:15 2009
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 14:31:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <COL123-W27B035E6FC7B10DF4B45A1E2DA0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <980302.7650.qm@web80506.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Wow, that is nice. Do they have district points and championships in IMAC too? I know we?maintain our contest records?by?the district and then post results on "district" websites but it is nice to see everything in one place.
?
John Pavlick

--- On Thu, 9/24/09, Anthony Romano <anthonyr105 at hotmail.com> wrote:


From: Anthony Romano <anthonyr105 at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Thursday, September 24, 2009, 10:18 AM




Pretty amazing how much info is there. The AMA can't even get the Nats results right.
?
Anthony
?
> Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 09:57:34 -0400
> From: schale at optonline.net
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
> 
> I love the way the question I posed about adding an unkown to pattern 
> has morphed into multiple topics, currently world championship judging :)
> 
> One other nice idea that IMAC has implemented is in their contest 
> management software. As a member of the web team I would love to see us 
> be able to do something similar (I have no idea what is involved). I am 
> sure this feature brings a lot more use to their website than we get. 
> Like we have, all of their contests are listed from their website. 
> However you can sign up for any contest in a uniform manner. Some of 
> our districts did or does have this feature but it is not uniformly 
> implemented. You can also see who is registered for a contest, how many 
> people are going, how many in each class, etc. Once the contest is 
> complete the scoring program that they use generates a report that gets 
> uploaded to the web as results for that contest. This is a very 
> interesting feature. Final results with round scores including dropped 
> rounds etc are posted. If you click on your name or any pilot you will 
> see all of their individual scores for the contest. No need to rummage 
> through scoring sheets to find yours. You can see how you scored in 
> each maneuver through the contest or compared to other fliers.
> An example of their contest results page.
> http://www.mini-iac.com/Regions/NorthCentral/NCContestResults/tabid/101/Default.aspx
> 
> Stuart
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail?. See how. 
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From schale at optonline.net  Thu Sep 24 06:40:28 2009
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 14:40:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <980302.7650.qm@web80506.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <980302.7650.qm@web80506.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4ABB84B0.2040400@optonline.net>

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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Thu Sep 24 06:40:35 2009
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 14:40:35 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <23F019FDD5CA4B849897ED1211CFEFD0@FMILaptop>
References: <23F019FDD5CA4B849897ED1211CFEFD0@FMILaptop>
Message-ID: <497110.58170.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I am EXTREMELY interested in the answer to this question. I am very much in the market for a generator but have not been able to force myself to pull the trigger on the Honda Generator yet. I know it is the "accepted" standard to run RC power sources and chargers but I am open to other less costly alternatives.

Anthony



________________________________
From: frank <frankjuliei at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 5:20:50 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100


Anyone out there using one ? $299 w/ 1 yr. warranty, online .
?
Frank
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Thu Sep 24 07:09:01 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 15:09:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
 Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <497110.58170.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <472570117.5098391253804939624.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

I got a gen set at home depot in the same price range.? It didn't want to run the IOTA and I returned.? Looks like this one is different but not sure.? I returned and got the Honda.? The Honda is the best way to?go. 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Anthony Abdullah " < aabdu @ sbcglobal .net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 9:40:31 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 



I am EXTREMELY interested in the answer to this question. I am very much in the market for a generator but have not been able to force myself to pull the trigger on the Honda Generator yet. I know it is the "accepted" standard to run RC power sources and chargers but I am open to other less costly alternatives. 

Anthony 



From: frank < frankjuliei @comcast.net> 
To: General pattern discussion < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 5:20:50 PM 
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 




Anyone out there using one ? $299 w/ 1 yr. warranty, online . 



Frank 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion
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From schale at optonline.net  Thu Sep 24 07:13:53 2009
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 15:13:53 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
 Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <472570117.5098391253804939624.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <472570117.5098391253804939624.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <4ABB8C87.5040909@optonline.net>

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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Thu Sep 24 07:22:18 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 15:22:18 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
 Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <4ABB8C87.5040909@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <805054821.5105851253805737740.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

It was also very noisy compared with the Honda.? The db published was close to the Honda but the Honda was a lot quieter.? I know the premium cost of the Honda is a lot more but you get what you paid.... 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Stuart Chale " < schale @ optonline .net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 10:13:11 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 

Cheap but 60.75 pounds 
The Honda is 29 pounds. 
Stuart 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote: 


I got a gen set at home depot in the same price range.? It didn't want to run the IOTA and I returned.? Looks like this one is different but not sure.? I returned and got the Honda.? The Honda is the best way to?go. 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Anthony Abdullah " < aabdu @ sbcglobal .net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 9:40:31 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 



I am EXTREMELY interested in the answer to this question. I am very much in the market for a generator but have not been able to force myself to pull the trigger on the Honda Generator yet. I know it is the "accepted" standard to run RC power sources and chargers but I am open to other less costly alternatives. 

Anthony 



From: frank < frankjuliei @comcast.net> 
To: General pattern discussion < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 5:20:50 PM 
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 




Anyone out there using one ? $299 w/ 1 yr. warranty, online . 



Frank 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
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From frankjuliei at comcast.net  Thu Sep 24 12:23:56 2009
From: frankjuliei at comcast.net (frank)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 20:23:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <805054821.5105851253805737740.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <4ABB8C87.5040909@optonline.net>
	<805054821.5105851253805737740.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <14935733CAC34C0BB85D6B65652C94DF@FMILaptop>

The noise doesn't affect my situation as much as others.  I 'm familiar with
Honda quality - currently own two Honda vehicles and a Honda mower. LOL. Got
255K miles on my first ( 92) Accord and could have gone another 100K. No
doubt their 1000 is the cream of the crop- but it's a bit pricy, IMO. At
last glance, the Home Depot generator  weighed very near what the Honda
weighs-unless I read the stats for the wrong model. As long as it handles
the job, I'm satisfied .Keep the oil clean and keep it from over-heating and
it should last. The HD warranty for one year is a good way out if it is a
bomb. They said that they would repair it for free or  issue a refund . Now,
someone out there must have one to give us a report.

 

Frank

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Vicente
"Vince" Bortone
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 11:22 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

 

It was also very noisy compared with the Honda.  The db published was close
to the Honda but the Honda was a lot quieter.  I know the premium cost of
the Honda is a lot more but you get what you paid....

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Stuart Chale" <schale at optonline.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 10:13:11 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

Cheap but 60.75 pounds
The Honda is 29 pounds.
Stuart

Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote: 

I got a gen set at home depot in the same price range.  It didn't want to
run the IOTA and I returned.  Looks like this one is different but not sure.
I returned and got the Honda.  The Honda is the best way to go.

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Abdullah"  <mailto:aabdu at sbcglobal.net> <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
To: "General pattern discussion"  <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
<nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 9:40:31 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

I am EXTREMELY interested in the answer to this question. I am very much in
the market for a generator but have not been able to force myself to pull
the trigger on the Honda Generator yet. I know it is the "accepted" standard
to run RC power sources and chargers but I am open to other less costly
alternatives.

 

Anthony

 

  _____  

From: frank  <mailto:frankjuliei at comcast.net> <frankjuliei at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion  <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
<nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 5:20:50 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable
Generator-Model # Gen 1100

Anyone out there using one ? $299 w/ 1 yr. warranty, online .

 

Frank


_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing
list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion






  _____  



 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing
list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  


_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing
list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From verne at twmi.rr.com  Thu Sep 24 13:33:27 2009
From: verne at twmi.rr.com (Verne Koester)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 21:33:27 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four
	stroke	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <497110.58170.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <23F019FDD5CA4B849897ED1211CFEFD0@FMILaptop>
	<497110.58170.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <005901ca3d5e$af11a5f0$0d34f1d0$@rr.com>

Anthony,

If you get one of the cheap copies, please park in the back of the parking
lot so the rest of us can hear our planes and each other..  ;>)

 

Verne

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony
Abdullah
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 10:41 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

 

I am EXTREMELY interested in the answer to this question. I am very much in
the market for a generator but have not been able to force myself to pull
the trigger on the Honda Generator yet. I know it is the "accepted" standard
to run RC power sources and chargers but I am open to other less costly
alternatives.

 

Anthony

 

  _____  

From: frank <frankjuliei at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 5:20:50 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable
Generator-Model # Gen 1100

Anyone out there using one ? $299 w/ 1 yr. warranty, online .

 

Frank

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From verne at twmi.rr.com  Thu Sep 24 13:36:55 2009
From: verne at twmi.rr.com (Verne Koester)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 21:36:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <4ABB8C87.5040909@optonline.net>
References: <472570117.5098391253804939624.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<4ABB8C87.5040909@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <005e01ca3d5f$2b1a45d0$814ed170$@rr.com>

You obviously haven?t seen Anthony?s arms. Rest assured that he?d use less effort picking up one 60 pound generator than you or I would use picking up 4 Hondas.....

 

Verne

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Stuart Chale
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 11:13 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

 

Cheap but 60.75 pounds
The Honda is 29 pounds.
Stuart

Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote: 

I got a gen set at home depot in the same price range.  It didn't want to run the IOTA and I returned.  Looks like this one is different but not sure.  I returned and got the Honda.  The Honda is the best way to go.

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Abdullah"  <mailto:aabdu at sbcglobal.net> <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
To: "General pattern discussion"  <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 9:40:31 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

I am EXTREMELY interested in the answer to this question. I am very much in the market for a generator but have not been able to force myself to pull the trigger on the Honda Generator yet. I know it is the "accepted" standard to run RC power sources and chargers but I am open to other less costly alternatives.

 

Anthony

 

  _____  

From: frank  <mailto:frankjuliei at comcast.net> <frankjuliei at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion  <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 5:20:50 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

Anyone out there using one ? $299 w/ 1 yr. warranty, online .

 

Frank


_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 



  _____  



 
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Thu Sep 24 13:51:53 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 21:51:53 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
 Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <14935733CAC34C0BB85D6B65652C94DF@FMILaptop>
Message-ID: <842810525.5299471253829112834.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>



Frank, 



The one I got for unknown reason didn't like when I plugged the IOTA transformer.? I could run other loads but I could not use it for charging the batteries at the field.? Please don't ask me why.? HD has an excellent service.? I explained the situation and they refunded my credit card.? Good luck, 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "frank" < frankjuliei @comcast.net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 3:24:10 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 




The noise doesn ?t affect my situation as much as others. ?I ?m familiar with Honda quality ? currently own two Honda vehicles and a Honda mower. LOL. Got 255K miles on my first ( 92) Accord and could have gone another 100K. No doubt their 1000 is the cream of the crop- but it?s a bit pricy, IMO. At last glance, the Home Depot generator ?weighed very near what the Honda weighs-unless I read the stats for the wrong model. As long as it handles the job, I?m satisfied .Keep the oil clean and keep it from over-heating and it should last. The HD warranty for one year is a good way out if it is a bomb. They said that they would repair it for free or ?issue a refund . Now, someone out there must have one to give us a report. 



Frank 






From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org [mailto: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 11:22 AM 
To: General pattern discussion 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 




It was also very noisy compared with the Honda.? The db published was close to the Honda but the Honda was a lot quieter.? I know the premium cost of the Honda is a lot more but you get what you paid.... 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Stuart Chale" <schale at optonline.net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 10:13:11 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 

Cheap but 60.75 pounds 
The Honda is 29 pounds. 
Stuart 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote: 


I got a gen set at home depot in the same price range.? It didn't want to run the IOTA and I returned.? Looks like this one is different but not sure.? I returned and got the Honda.? The Honda is the best way to?go. 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Anthony Abdullah" <aabdu at sbcglobal.net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 9:40:31 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 



I am EXTREMELY interested in the answer to this question. I am very much in the market for a generator but have not been able to force myself to pull the trigger on the Honda Generator yet. I know it is the "accepted" standard to run RC power sources and chargers but I am open to other less costly alternatives. 





Anthony 







From: frank < frankjuliei @comcast.net> 
To: General pattern discussion < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 5:20:50 PM 
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 


Anyone out there using one ? $299 w/ 1 yr. warranty, online . 



Frank 


_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 
? _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion ? 


_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org http://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/listinfo/ nsrca -discussion
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From brian_w_young at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 24 15:00:07 2009
From: brian_w_young at yahoo.com (Brian)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 23:00:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four
	stroke	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
Message-ID: <20090924230006.98DDD1164F@bridi.netexpress.com>

Try to find a used honda, got mine with low miles for $600. Ebay 

-----Original Message-----
From: frank <frankjuliei at comcast.net>
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 4:24 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

The noise doesn?t affect my situation as much as others. ?I ?m familiar with Honda quality ? currently own two Honda vehicles and a Honda mower. LOL. Got 255K miles on my first ( 92) Accord and could have gone another 100K. No doubt their 1000 is the cream of the crop- but it?s a bit pricy, IMO. At last glance, the Home Depot generator ?weighed very near what the Honda weighs-unless I read the stats for the wrong model. As long as it handles the job, I?m satisfied .Keep the oil clean and keep it from over-heating and it should last. The HD warranty for one year is a good way out if it is a bomb. They said that they would repair it for free or ?issue a refund . Now, someone out there must have one to give us a report.
?
Frank
?
 
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Vicente "Vince" Bortone
 Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 11:22 AM
 To: General pattern discussion
 Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
?
It was also very noisy compared with the Honda.? The db published was close to the Honda but the Honda was a lot quieter.? I know the premium cost of the Honda is a lot more but

[The entire original message is not included]
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From jerry at buddengineering.com  Thu Sep 24 15:51:16 2009
From: jerry at buddengineering.com (Budd Engineering)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 23:51:16 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four
	stroke	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <20090924230006.98DDD1164F@bridi.netexpress.com>
References: <20090924230006.98DDD1164F@bridi.netexpress.com>
Message-ID: <8F1F34D5-A51B-427F-A38F-B745CFDBFEB9@buddengineering.com>

I bought a new Honda EU1000i for $650, shipped, from  
www.mayberrys.com, works great!

Jerry

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 24, 2009, at 3:59 PM, Brian <brian_w_young at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Try to find a used honda, got mine with low miles for $600. Ebay
>
> From: frank <frankjuliei at comcast.net>
> Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 4:24 PM
> To: 'General pattern discussion' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four  
> stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
>
> The noise doesn?t affect my situation as much as others.  I ?m  
> familiar with Honda quality ? currently own two Honda vehicles and a 
>  Honda mower. LOL. Got 255K miles on my first ( 92) Accord and could 
>  have gone another 100K. No doubt their 1000 is the cream of the cro 
> p- but it?s a bit pricy, IMO. At last glance, the Home Depot generat 
> or  weighed very near what the Honda weighs-unless I read the stats  
> for the wrong model. As long as it handles the job, I?m satisfied .K 
> eep the oil clean and keep it from over-heating and it should last.  
> The HD warranty for one year is a good way out if it is a bomb. They 
>  said that they would repair it for free or  issue a refund . Now, s 
> omeone out there must have one to give us a report.
>
> Frank
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at listsnsrca.orgBehalf Of Vicente "Vince" Bortone
> Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 11:22 AM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four  
> stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
>
> It was also very noisy compared with the Honda.  The db published  
> was close to the Honda but the Honda was a lot quieter.  I know the  
> premium cost of the Honda is a lot more but
>
>
> [The entire original message is not included]
> ___________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.or
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 24 16:21:19 2009
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 00:21:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <8F1F34D5-A51B-427F-A38F-B745CFDBFEB9@buddengineering.com>
Message-ID: <824769.82250.qm@web33005.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I got the Kipor 2000. It has been flawless for the 2 seasons I have had it. It goes for about $700 shipped. The Kipor 1000 is $475 shipped on ebay. It is the same as the Honda, same size, weight, sound, but less cost. #1 selling brand in Europe they claim. 

Spend the extra $175 over the home depot noise maker. You, and the other pilots will be glad you did. It's well worth it. 

Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Thu, 9/24/09, Budd Engineering <jerry at buddengineering.com> wrote:

From: Budd Engineering <jerry at buddengineering.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Thursday, September 24, 2009, 4:49 PM

I bought a new Honda EU1000i for $650, shipped, from www.mayberrys.com, works great!
Jerry

Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 24, 2009, at 3:59 PM, Brian <brian_w_young at yahoo.com> wrote:



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Try to find a used honda, got mine with low miles for $600. Ebay 

From: frank <frankjuliei at comcast.net>
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 4:24 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

The noise doesn?t affect my situation as much as others. ?I ?m familiar with Honda quality ? currently own two Honda vehicles and a Honda mower. LOL. Got 255K miles on my first ( 92) Accord and could have gone another 100K. No doubt their 1000 is the cream of the crop- but it?s a bit pricy, IMO. At last glance, the Home Depot generator ?weighed very near what the Honda weighs-unless I read the stats for the wrong model. As long as it handles the job, I?m satisfied .Keep the oil clean and keep it from over-heating and it should last. The HD warranty for one year is a good way out if it is a bomb. They said that they would repair it for free or ?issue a refund . Now, someone out there must have one to give us a report. ?Frank ? From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at listsnsrca.orgBehalf Of Vicente "Vince" Bortone
 Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 11:22 AM
 To: General pattern discussion
 Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 ?It was also very noisy compared with the Honda.? The db published was close to the Honda but the Honda was a lot quieter.? I know the premium cost of the Honda is a lot more but

[The entire original message is not included]___________NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.or
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From frankjuliei at comcast.net  Thu Sep 24 16:45:48 2009
From: frankjuliei at comcast.net (frank)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 00:45:48 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100
	fourstroke	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <8F1F34D5-A51B-427F-A38F-B745CFDBFEB9@buddengineering.com>
References: <20090924230006.98DDD1164F@bridi.netexpress.com>
	<8F1F34D5-A51B-427F-A38F-B745CFDBFEB9@buddengineering.com>
Message-ID: <AF37C96A334C4F9396C6B257877639C1@FMILaptop>

Mayberry's is near me and it bugs me that I'd  have to pay 7% NJ sales tax
help replenish the coffes for NJ's notoriously crooked politicians- but
things aren't much better in Cal.- or elsewhere, for that matter.

Frank

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Budd
Engineering
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 7:50 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 fourstroke
Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

 

I bought a new Honda EU1000i for $650, shipped, from www.mayberrys.com,
works great!

 

Jerry

Sent from my iPhone


On Sep 24, 2009, at 3:59 PM, Brian <brian_w_young at yahoo.com> wrote:

Try to find a used honda, got mine with low miles for $600. Ebay 


  _____  


From: frank <frankjuliei at comcast.net>
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 4:24 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

The noise doesn't affect my situation as much as others.  I 'm familiar with
Honda quality - currently own two Honda vehicles and a Honda mower. LOL. Got
255K miles on my first ( 92) Accord and could have gone another 100K. No
doubt their 1000 is the cream of the crop- but it's a bit pricy, IMO. At
last glance, the Home Depot generator  weighed very near what the Honda
weighs-unless I read the stats for the wrong model. As long as it handles
the job, I'm satisfied .Keep the oil clean and keep it from over-heating and
it should last. The HD warranty for one year is a good way out if it is a
bomb. They said that they would repair it for free or  issue a refund . Now,
someone out there must have one to give us a report.

 

Frank

 


  _____  


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at listsnsrca.orgBehalf Of Vicente "Vince"
Bortone
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 11:22 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

 

It was also very noisy compared with the Honda.  The db published was close
to the Honda but the Honda was a lot quieter.  I know the premium cost of
the Honda is a lot more but



[The entire original message is not included]

___________

NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.or
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From vanputte at cox.net  Thu Sep 24 16:49:10 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 00:49:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100
	fourstroke	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <AF37C96A334C4F9396C6B257877639C1@FMILaptop>
References: <20090924230006.98DDD1164F@bridi.netexpress.com>
	<8F1F34D5-A51B-427F-A38F-B745CFDBFEB9@buddengineering.com>
	<AF37C96A334C4F9396C6B257877639C1@FMILaptop>
Message-ID: <5F0874CC-02F8-4519-9627-91D3D000C739@cox.net>

Isn't "crooked politician" redundant?

Ron VP

On Sep 24, 2009, at 7:46 PM, frank wrote:

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> Mayberry?s is near me and it bugs me that I?d  have to pay 7% NJ  
> sales tax help replenish the coffes for NJ?s notoriously crooked  
> politicians- but things aren?t much better in Cal.- or elsewhere,  
> for that matter.
>
> Frank
>
>
>
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Budd Engineering
> Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 7:50 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100  
> fourstroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
>
>
>
> I bought a new Honda EU1000i for $650, shipped, from  
> www.mayberrys.com, works great!
>
>
>
> Jerry
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
> On Sep 24, 2009, at 3:59 PM, Brian <brian_w_young at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Try to find a used honda, got mine with low miles for $600. Ebay
>>
>> From: frank <frankjuliei at comcast.net>
>> Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 4:24 PM
>> To: 'General pattern discussion' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four  
>> stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
>>
>> The noise doesn?t affect my situation as much as others.  I ?m  
>> familiar with Honda quality ? currently own two Honda vehicles and  
>> a Honda mower. LOL. Got 255K miles on my first ( 92) Accord and  
>> could have gone another 100K. No doubt their 1000 is the cream of  
>> the crop- but it?s a bit pricy, IMO. At last glance, the Home  
>> Depot generator  weighed very near what the Honda weighs-unless I  
>> read the stats for the wrong model. As long as it handles the job,  
>> I?m satisfied .Keep the oil clean and keep it from over-heating  
>> and it should last. The HD warranty for one year is a good way out  
>> if it is a bomb. They said that they would repair it for free or   
>> issue a refund . Now, someone out there must have one to give us a  
>> report.
>>
>>
>>
>> Frank
>>
>>
>>
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
>> discussion-bounces at listsnsrca.orgBehalf Of Vicente "Vince" Bortone
>> Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 11:22 AM
>> To: General pattern discussion
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four  
>> stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
>>
>>
>>
>> It was also very noisy compared with the Honda.  The db published  
>> was close to the Honda but the Honda was a lot quieter.  I know  
>> the premium cost of the Honda is a lot more but
>>
>>
>>
>> [The entire original message is not included]
>>
>> ___________
>>
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.or
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From frankjuliei at comcast.net  Thu Sep 24 16:49:50 2009
From: frankjuliei at comcast.net (frank)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 00:49:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <842810525.5299471253829112834.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <14935733CAC34C0BB85D6B65652C94DF@FMILaptop>
	<842810525.5299471253829112834.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <6BDB965425464D2CB73D2FF3A7744393@FMILaptop>

Thanks , Vince- no matter how cheap, if it doesn't handle the job, it's
useless. Now I've  got my answer.

Frank

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Vicente
"Vince" Bortone
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 5:52 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

 

Frank,

 

The one I got for unknown reason didn't like when I plugged the IOTA
transformer.  I could run other loads but I could not use it for charging
the batteries at the field.  Please don't ask me why.  HD has an excellent
service.  I explained the situation and they refunded my credit card.  Good
luck,

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "frank" <frankjuliei at comcast.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 3:24:10 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

The noise doesn't affect my situation as much as others.  I 'm familiar with
Honda quality - currently own two Honda vehicles and a Honda mower. LOL. Got
255K miles on my first ( 92) Accord and could have gone another 100K. No
doubt their 1000 is the cream of the crop- but it's a bit pricy, IMO. At
last glance, the Home Depot generator  weighed very near what the Honda
weighs-unless I read the stats for the wrong model. As long as it handles
the job, I'm satisfied .Keep the oil clean and keep it from over-heating and
it should last. The HD warranty for one year is a good way out if it is a
bomb. They said that they would repair it for free or  issue a refund . Now,
someone out there must have one to give us a report.

 

Frank

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Vicente
"Vince" Bortone
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 11:22 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

 

It was also very noisy compared with the Honda.  The db published was close
to the Honda but the Honda was a lot quieter.  I know the premium cost of
the Honda is a lot more but you get what you paid....

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Stuart Chale" <schale at optonline.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 10:13:11 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

Cheap but 60.75 pounds
The Honda is 29 pounds.
Stuart

Vicente "Vince" Bortone wrote: 

I got a gen set at home depot in the same price range.  It didn't want to
run the IOTA and I returned.  Looks like this one is different but not sure.
I returned and got the Honda.  The Honda is the best way to go.

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Abdullah"  <mailto:aabdu at sbcglobal.net> <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
To: "General pattern discussion"  <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
<nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 9:40:31 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

I am EXTREMELY interested in the answer to this question. I am very much in
the market for a generator but have not been able to force myself to pull
the trigger on the Honda Generator yet. I know it is the "accepted" standard
to run RC power sources and chargers but I am open to other less costly
alternatives.

 

Anthony

 

  _____  

From: frank  <mailto:frankjuliei at comcast.net> <frankjuliei at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion  <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
<nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 5:20:50 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable
Generator-Model # Gen 1100

Anyone out there using one ? $299 w/ 1 yr. warranty, online .

 

Frank


_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing
list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 
 





  _____  



 
 
 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing
list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  


_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing
list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing
list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Thu Sep 24 16:58:01 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 00:58:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four
	stroke	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <8F1F34D5-A51B-427F-A38F-B745CFDBFEB9@buddengineering.com>
Message-ID: <405189538.5369821253840281363.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

That is very good deal.? I paid a lot more.? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Budd Engineering" <jerry at buddengineering.com> 
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 6:49:59 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke????????Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 


I bought a new Honda EU1000i for $650, shipped, from www.mayberrys.com , works great! 


Jerry 

Sent from my iPhone 

On Sep 24, 2009, at 3:59 PM, Brian < brian_w_young at yahoo.com > wrote: 





Try to find a used honda, got mine with low miles for $600. Ebay 


From: frank < frankjuliei at comcast.net > 
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 4:24 PM 
To: 'General pattern discussion' < nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org > 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 




The noise doesn?t affect my situation as much as others. ?I ?m familiar with Honda quality ? currently own two Honda vehicles and a Honda mower. LOL. Got 255K miles on my first ( 92) Accord and could have gone another 100K. No doubt their 1000 is the cream of the crop- but it?s a bit pricy, IMO. At last glance, the Home Depot generator ?weighed very near what the Honda weighs-unless I read the stats for the wrong model. As long as it handles the job, I?m satisfied .Keep the oil clean and keep it from over-heating and it should last. The HD warranty for one year is a good way out if it is a bomb. They said that they would repair it for free or ?issue a refund . Now, someone out there must have one to give us a report. 



Frank 






From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at listsnsrca.org Behalf Of Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 11:22 AM 
To: General pattern discussion 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 




It was also very noisy compared with the Honda.? The db published was close to the Honda but the Honda was a lot quieter.? I know the premium cost of the Honda is a lot more but 

[The entire original message is not included] 


___________ 


NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.or 
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From bob at toprudder.com  Thu Sep 24 17:02:37 2009
From: bob at toprudder.com (Bob Richards)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 01:02:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Unknowns (now about judging)
In-Reply-To: <79582F1A3A7C4F2C8CA36C67733783BA@xppro2>
Message-ID: <241926.91142.qm@web1102.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>

"Discontent is the first step in the progress of a man or a nation."

--- On Thu, 9/24/09, John Ferrell <jferrell13 at triad.rr.com> wrote:






The first step in resolving any problem is accepting that there is a problem.
Perhaps some things can be fixed and perhaps?they are as good as they get.
?
John Ferrell? W8CCW
?
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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 24 17:03:11 2009
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 01:03:11 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 fourstroke
	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <AF37C96A334C4F9396C6B257877639C1@FMILaptop>
Message-ID: <309716.99307.qm@web33008.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

We're at 8.75-9.75% where I am in Cali. Maybe that's why I order so much on line, out of state. 

It's funny really, pay 25% (or so) when you earn your money, and pay almost 10% when you want to spend it. 

Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Thu, 9/24/09, frank <frankjuliei at comcast.net> wrote:

From: frank <frankjuliei at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 fourstroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Thursday, September 24, 2009, 5:46 PM




 
 

 







Mayberry?s is near me and it bugs me that
I?d ?have to pay 7% NJ sales tax help replenish the coffes for NJ?s notoriously
crooked politicians- but things aren?t much better in Cal.- or elsewhere, for
that matter. 

Frank 

 ? 









From:
nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Budd Engineering

Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009
7:50 PM

To: General
 pattern discussion

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 fourstroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 



 ? 



I bought a new Honda EU1000i for $650, shipped, from www.mayberrys.com, works great! 





 ? 





Jerry



Sent from my iPhone 







On Sep 24, 2009, at 3:59 PM, Brian <brian_w_young at yahoo.com>
wrote: 





 

Try to find a used honda, got mine
with low miles for $600. Ebay  







From: frank <frankjuliei at comcast.net>

Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 4:24
PM

To: ' General
 pattern discussion ' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot
"Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 

The noise doesn?t affect my situation as
much as others. ?I ?m familiar with Honda quality ? currently own two
Honda vehicles and a Honda mower. LOL. Got 255K miles on my first ( 92) Accord
and could have gone another 100K. No doubt their 1000 is the cream of the crop-
but it?s a bit pricy, IMO. At last glance, the Home Depot generator
?weighed very near what the Honda weighs-unless I read the stats for the
wrong model. As long as it handles the job, I?m satisfied .Keep the oil clean
and keep it from over-heating and it should last. The HD warranty for one year
is a good way out if it is a bomb. They said that they would repair it for free
or ?issue a refund . Now, someone out there must have one to give us a
report. 

 ? 

Frank 

 ? 









From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at listsnsrca.orgBehalf Of Vicente "Vince" Bortone

Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009
11:22 AM

To:
 General pattern discussion

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 



 ? 



It was also very noisy compared with the
Honda.? The db published was close to the Honda but the Honda was a lot
quieter.? I know the premium cost of the Honda is a lot more but 







[The entire original message is not included] 









___________ 









NSRCA-discussion
mailing list

NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.or

http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 







 


-----Inline Attachment Follows-----

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From wemodels at cox.net  Thu Sep 24 17:14:49 2009
From: wemodels at cox.net (Bill's Email)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 01:14:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100
 four	stroke	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <405189538.5369821253840281363.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <405189538.5369821253840281363.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <4ABC1987.4070909@cox.net>

 I bought one of these:

http://www.honeywellgenerators.com/products/hw2000i

At Home Despot a few months ago in SOCAL. They were selling them for 
$299. Works great. Just a hint more noise than a Honda or Yamaha but 
still very quiet. I have not seen them around since the Home Depot sale. 
2KW, quiet, and $300, I wish I had gotten 2 of them!!






From frankjuliei at comcast.net  Thu Sep 24 17:23:46 2009
From: frankjuliei at comcast.net (frank)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 01:23:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100
	four	stroke	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <4ABC1987.4070909@cox.net>
References: <405189538.5369821253840281363.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<4ABC1987.4070909@cox.net>
Message-ID: <2B93E15B6D8847B5B45C167318AA7998@FMILaptop>

Bill,
I haven't seen this one.( Honeywell) The unit I am talking about is online
order, only. It is called the Sportsman 1100, model # GEN 1100. Vince B. has
indicated that he had one, but it couldn't cut the mustard.
Frank

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bill's Email
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 9:15 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

 I bought one of these:

http://www.honeywellgenerators.com/products/hw2000i

At Home Despot a few months ago in SOCAL. They were selling them for 
$299. Works great. Just a hint more noise than a Honda or Yamaha but 
still very quiet. I have not seen them around since the Home Depot sale. 
2KW, quiet, and $300, I wish I had gotten 2 of them!!





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From jferrell13 at triad.rr.com  Thu Sep 24 18:17:26 2009
From: jferrell13 at triad.rr.com (John Ferrell)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 02:17:26 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Unknowns (now about judging)
References: <241926.91142.qm@web1102.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1F8E80D06D104875809A1C2D938AD4C1@xppro2>

That one is a keeper!

John Ferrell  W8CCW
 
"Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice, and moderation in pursuit of justice is no virtue."
-Barry Goldwater
"You don't get harmony when everybody sings the same note."
-Doug Floyd

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Bob Richards 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 9:02 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Unknowns (now about judging)


        "Discontent is the first step in the progress of a man or a nation."

        --- On Thu, 9/24/09, John Ferrell <jferrell13 at triad.rr.com> wrote:



          The first step in resolving any problem is accepting that there is a problem.
          Perhaps some things can be fixed and perhaps they are as good as they get.

          John Ferrell  W8CCW
           
       



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Thu Sep 24 18:19:39 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 02:19:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100
	four	stroke	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <2B93E15B6D8847B5B45C167318AA7998@FMILaptop>
Message-ID: <1840235271.5398251253845179362.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>



Frank, 



Now I am not 100% sure if the gen set is the same model.? The price was very similar.? You still can take the risk and order it.? If does not work you can? returned.? The return part was easy for me because they told me to take it to the local HD .? They will give you instructions by phone if you have to returned.? I am sorry for the confusion. 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "frank" < frankjuliei @comcast.net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 8:24:01 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four????????stroke????????Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 

Bill, 
I haven't seen this one.( Honeywell) The unit I am talking about is online 
order, only. It is called the Sportsman 1100, model # GEN 1100. Vince B. has 
indicated that he had one, but it couldn't cut the mustard. 
Frank 

-----Original Message----- 
From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org 
[ mailto : nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of Bill's Email 
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 9:15 PM 
To: General pattern discussion 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke 
Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 

?I bought one of these: 

http :// www . honeywellgenerators .com/products/hw2000i 

At Home Despot a few months ago in SOCAL . They were selling them for 
$299. Works great. Just a hint more noise than a Honda or Yamaha but 
still very quiet. I have not seen them around since the Home Depot sale. 
2KW, quiet, and $300, I wish I had gotten 2 of them!! 





_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 

_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Fri Sep 25 04:59:13 2009
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 12:59:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <005901ca3d5e$af11a5f0$0d34f1d0$@rr.com>
References: <23F019FDD5CA4B849897ED1211CFEFD0@FMILaptop>
	<497110.58170.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<005901ca3d5e$af11a5f0$0d34f1d0$@rr.com>
Message-ID: <979317.37088.qm@web82108.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Exploring options but I am pretty set on getting the Honda. If?I were to hear about an alternative that was as?quiet, as good, and much less?expensive than the Honda I would?consider it. Otherwise I will spend the extra cheddar and get the?good stuff.?




________________________________
From: Verne Koester <verne at twmi.rr.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 5:33:40 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100


Anthony,
If you get one of the cheap copies, please park in the back of the parking lot so the rest of us can hear our planes and each other?.? ;>)
?
Verne
?
From:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Abdullah
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 10:41 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
?
I am EXTREMELY interested in the answer to this question. I am very much in the market for a generator but have not been able to force myself to pull the trigger on the Honda Generator yet. I know it is the "accepted" standard to run RC power sources and chargers but I am open to other less costly alternatives.
?
Anthony
?

________________________________

From:frank <frankjuliei at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 5:20:50 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
Anyone out there using one ? $299 w/ 1 yr. warranty, online .
?
Frank
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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Fri Sep 25 05:19:54 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 13:19:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four
	stroke	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <979317.37088.qm@web82108.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <23F019FDD5CA4B849897ED1211CFEFD0@FMILaptop>
	<497110.58170.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<005901ca3d5e$af11a5f0$0d34f1d0$@rr.com>
	<979317.37088.qm@web82108.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7CCD@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

This appears to be the only comparable generator to the Honda.

http://www.kipornorthamerica.com/Sinemaster1.aspx

They list for about $150 less than the Honda.  I just don?t know anyone running one.  Basically the same weight, power, noise specs as the Honda (actually lists it as being quieter)   They?re available on Amazon for $510

http://www.amazon.com/Kipor-IG1000-1000-Inverter-Generator/dp/B000RUQN3Q

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Abdullah
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 8:59 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

Exploring options but I am pretty set on getting the Honda. If I were to hear about an alternative that was as quiet, as good, and much less expensive than the Honda I would consider it. Otherwise I will spend the extra cheddar and get the good stuff.

________________________________
From: Verne Koester <verne at twmi.rr.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 5:33:40 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
Anthony,
If you get one of the cheap copies, please park in the back of the parking lot so the rest of us can hear our planes and each other?.  ;>)

Verne

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Abdullah
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 10:41 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100

I am EXTREMELY interested in the answer to this question. I am very much in the market for a generator but have not been able to force myself to pull the trigger on the Honda Generator yet. I know it is the "accepted" standard to run RC power sources and chargers but I am open to other less costly alternatives.

Anthony

________________________________
From: frank <frankjuliei at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 5:20:50 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
Anyone out there using one ? $299 w/ 1 yr. warranty, online .

Frank

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Fri Sep 25 05:23:41 2009
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 13:23:41 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7CCD@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <240435.93916.qm@web33007.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I am running a Kipor Mark. 2 seasons on it. No problems. It's worth more than what they are asking. 

Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Fri, 9/25/09, Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com> wrote:

From: Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Friday, September 25, 2009, 6:10 AM




 
 







This appears to be the only comparable generator to the Honda.   

 ? 

http://www.kipornorthamerica.com/Sinemaster1.aspx 

 ? 

They list for about $150 less than the Honda.  I just don?t know
anyone running one.  Basically the same weight, power, noise specs as the Honda
(actually lists it as being quieter)   They?re available on Amazon for $510 

 ? 

http://www.amazon.com/Kipor-IG1000-1000-Inverter-Generator/dp/B000RUQN3Q
 

 ? 





From:
nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]
On Behalf Of Anthony Abdullah

Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 8:59 AM

To: General pattern discussion

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four
stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 





 ? 





Exploring options but I am pretty set on getting the Honda.
If?I were to hear about an alternative that was as?quiet, as good,
and much less?expensive than the Honda I would?consider it. Otherwise
I will spend the extra cheddar and get the?good stuff.? 





 ? 









From: Verne Koester <verne at twmi.rr.com>

To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>

Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 5:33:40 PM

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four
stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 



Anthony, 

If you get one of the cheap copies, please park in the back of
the parking lot so the rest of us can hear our planes and each other?.?
;>) 

? 

Verne 

? 





From:
nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony
Abdullah

Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 10:41 AM

To: General pattern discussion

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four
stroke Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 





? 





I am EXTREMELY interested in the answer to this question. I
am very much in the market for a generator but have not been able to force
myself to pull the trigger on the Honda Generator yet. I know it is the
"accepted" standard to run RC power sources and chargers but I am
open to other less costly alternatives. 





? 





Anthony 





? 









From: frank <frankjuliei at comcast.net>

To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>

Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 5:20:50 PM

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100 



Anyone
out there using one ? $299 w/ 1 yr. warranty, online . 

? 

Frank 

















No virus
found in this incoming message.

Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.112/2392 - Release Date: 09/25/09
05:51:00 



 


-----Inline Attachment Follows-----

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From tkeithblack at gmail.com  Fri Sep 25 07:36:37 2009
From: tkeithblack at gmail.com (Keith Black)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 15:36:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <4ABB7ACE.5090006@optonline.net>
References: <1263356613.4176751253633873575.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<4AB8F0C6.6050005@san.rr.com> <4ABB7ACE.5090006@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <77f26e410909250836g11762559rb0bb52ca14a71e64@mail.gmail.com>

That is awesome!  I wonder if we could borrow some of the technology from
them to do that for pattern?

On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 8:57 AM, Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net> wrote:

> I love the way the question I posed about adding an unkown to pattern has
> morphed into multiple topics, currently world championship judging :)
>
> One other nice idea that IMAC has implemented is in their contest
> management software.  As a member of the web team I would love to see us be
> able to do something similar (I have no idea what is involved).  I am sure
> this feature brings a lot more use to their website than we get.  Like we
> have, all of their contests are listed from their website.  However you can
> sign up for any contest in a uniform manner.  Some of our districts did or
> does have this feature but it is not uniformly implemented.  You can also
> see who is registered for a contest, how many people are going, how many in
> each class, etc.  Once the contest is complete the scoring program that they
> use generates a report that gets uploaded to the web as results for that
> contest.  This is a very interesting feature.  Final results with round
> scores including dropped rounds etc are posted.  If you click on your name
> or any pilot you will see all of their individual scores for the contest.
>  No need to rummage through scoring sheets to find yours.  You can see how
> you scored in each maneuver through the contest or compared to other fliers.
> An example of their contest results page.
>
> http://www.mini-iac.com/Regions/NorthCentral/NCContestResults/tabid/101/Default.aspx
>
> Stuart
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Fri Sep 25 07:45:09 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 15:45:09 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <77f26e410909250836g11762559rb0bb52ca14a71e64@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1263356613.4176751253633873575.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<4AB8F0C6.6050005@san.rr.com> <4ABB7ACE.5090006@optonline.net>
	<77f26e410909250836g11762559rb0bb52ca14a71e64@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7CFA@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

This is actually a pretty amazing site and we would do extremely well to try and pursue something like this.   I have to believe that Jim could create the export file from PACSS very easily...the trick will be how that gets uploaded.  We would need to use AMA numbers as a unique ID for each Pilot so we don't end up with 4 misspellings of the same person, but that would be simple

The best part is all the data that would be available to the pilot.  National and regional averages on a maneuver by maneuver basis.  It would be nice for analyzing your own scores.

The contest registration could be huge too, though I can see the downside in that a contest that has poor early registration, may end up with even less attendance since that might dissuade even more from coming, but overall it would be a tremendous asset.



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Keith Black
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 11:37 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

That is awesome!  I wonder if we could borrow some of the technology from them to do that for pattern?
On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 8:57 AM, Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net<mailto:schale at optonline.net>> wrote:
I love the way the question I posed about adding an unkown to pattern has morphed into multiple topics, currently world championship judging :)

One other nice idea that IMAC has implemented is in their contest management software.  As a member of the web team I would love to see us be able to do something similar (I have no idea what is involved).  I am sure this feature brings a lot more use to their website than we get.  Like we have, all of their contests are listed from their website.  However you can sign up for any contest in a uniform manner.  Some of our districts did or does have this feature but it is not uniformly implemented.  You can also see who is registered for a contest, how many people are going, how many in each class, etc.  Once the contest is complete the scoring program that they use generates a report that gets uploaded to the web as results for that contest.  This is a very interesting feature.  Final results with round scores including dropped rounds etc are posted.  If you click on your name or any pilot you will see all of their individual scores for the contest.  No need to rummage through scoring sheets to find yours.  You can see how you scored in each maneuver through the contest or compared to other fliers.
An example of their contest results page.
http://www.mini-iac.com/Regions/NorthCentral/NCContestResults/tabid/101/Default.aspx

Stuart


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
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From pcosky at comcast.net  Fri Sep 25 08:20:15 2009
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 16:20:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
References: <1263356613.4176751253633873575.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net><4AB8F0C6.6050005@san.rr.com>
	<4ABB7ACE.5090006@optonline.net><77f26e410909250836g11762559rb0bb52ca14a71e64@mail.gmail.com>
	<99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7CFA@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <BBECE807289B4152BA1782174057CEC1@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>

I've been in touch with IMAC about their site and how it works...it's a heavily customized version of a CMS platform and the data of the contestants is manually checked from uploaded files. They do however use one scoring software to minimize the work.

Pete
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Atwood, Mark 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 11:35 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC


  This is actually a pretty amazing site and we would do extremely well to try and pursue something like this.   I have to believe that Jim could create the export file from PACSS very easily.the trick will be how that gets uploaded.  We would need to use AMA numbers as a unique ID for each Pilot so we don't end up with 4 misspellings of the same person, but that would be simple

   

  The best part is all the data that would be available to the pilot.  National and regional averages on a maneuver by maneuver basis.  It would be nice for analyzing your own scores.

   

  The contest registration could be huge too, though I can see the downside in that a contest that has poor early registration, may end up with even less attendance since that might dissuade even more from coming, but overall it would be a tremendous asset.

   

   

   

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Keith Black
  Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 11:37 AM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

   

  That is awesome!  I wonder if we could borrow some of the technology from them to do that for pattern?

  On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 8:57 AM, Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net> wrote:

  I love the way the question I posed about adding an unkown to pattern has morphed into multiple topics, currently world championship judging :)

  One other nice idea that IMAC has implemented is in their contest management software.  As a member of the web team I would love to see us be able to do something similar (I have no idea what is involved).  I am sure this feature brings a lot more use to their website than we get.  Like we have, all of their contests are listed from their website.  However you can sign up for any contest in a uniform manner.  Some of our districts did or does have this feature but it is not uniformly implemented.  You can also see who is registered for a contest, how many people are going, how many in each class, etc.  Once the contest is complete the scoring program that they use generates a report that gets uploaded to the web as results for that contest.  This is a very interesting feature.  Final results with round scores including dropped rounds etc are posted.  If you click on your name or any pilot you will see all of their individual scores for the contest.  No need to rummage through scoring sheets to find yours.  You can see how you scored in each maneuver through the contest or compared to other fliers.
  An example of their contest results page.
  http://www.mini-iac.com/Regions/NorthCentral/NCContestResults/tabid/101/Default.aspx

  Stuart


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

   

  No virus found in this incoming message.
  Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
  Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.112/2392 - Release Date: 09/25/09 05:51:00



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
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  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From gene.maurice at sgmservice.com  Fri Sep 25 09:20:52 2009
From: gene.maurice at sgmservice.com (Gene Maurice)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 17:20:52 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7CFA@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
References: <1263356613.4176751253633873575.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>	<4AB8F0C6.6050005@san.rr.com>
	<4ABB7ACE.5090006@optonline.net>	<77f26e410909250836g11762559rb0bb52ca14a71e64@mail.gmail.com>
	<99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7CFA@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <001501ca3e04$87d07f60$97717e20$@maurice@sgmservice.com>

PACSS already creates a couple of different export files, individual
contestant results an contest results in csv format. It also has the
capability of uploading to a web site. Currently it uploads the entire
database to an FTP directory on the PACSS web site. 

 

BTW, AMA number is the key in the system 

 

 

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Atwood, Mark
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 11:36 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

 

This is actually a pretty amazing site and we would do extremely well to try
and pursue something like this.   I have to believe that Jim could create
the export file from PACSS very easily.the trick will be how that gets
uploaded.  We would need to use AMA numbers as a unique ID for each Pilot so
we don't end up with 4 misspellings of the same person, but that would be
simple

 

The best part is all the data that would be available to the pilot.
National and regional averages on a maneuver by maneuver basis.  It would be
nice for analyzing your own scores.

 

The contest registration could be huge too, though I can see the downside in
that a contest that has poor early registration, may end up with even less
attendance since that might dissuade even more from coming, but overall it
would be a tremendous asset.

 

 

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Keith Black
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 11:37 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

 

That is awesome!  I wonder if we could borrow some of the technology from
them to do that for pattern?

On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 8:57 AM, Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net> wrote:

I love the way the question I posed about adding an unkown to pattern has
morphed into multiple topics, currently world championship judging :)

One other nice idea that IMAC has implemented is in their contest management
software.  As a member of the web team I would love to see us be able to do
something similar (I have no idea what is involved).  I am sure this feature
brings a lot more use to their website than we get.  Like we have, all of
their contests are listed from their website.  However you can sign up for
any contest in a uniform manner.  Some of our districts did or does have
this feature but it is not uniformly implemented.  You can also see who is
registered for a contest, how many people are going, how many in each class,
etc.  Once the contest is complete the scoring program that they use
generates a report that gets uploaded to the web as results for that
contest.  This is a very interesting feature.  Final results with round
scores including dropped rounds etc are posted.  If you click on your name
or any pilot you will see all of their individual scores for the contest.
No need to rummage through scoring sheets to find yours.  You can see how
you scored in each maneuver through the contest or compared to other fliers.
An example of their contest results page.
http://www.mini-iac.com/Regions/NorthCentral/NCContestResults/tabid/101/Defa
ult.aspx

Stuart


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.112/2392 - Release Date: 09/25/09
05:51:00

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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Fri Sep 25 09:22:00 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 17:22:00 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <BBECE807289B4152BA1782174057CEC1@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
References: <1263356613.4176751253633873575.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net><4AB8F0C6.6050005@san.rr.com>
	<4ABB7ACE.5090006@optonline.net><77f26e410909250836g11762559rb0bb52ca14a71e64@mail.gmail.com>
	<99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7CFA@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
	<BBECE807289B4152BA1782174057CEC1@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7D02@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

Which CMS are they using?

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Pete Cosky
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 12:20 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

I've been in touch with IMAC about their site and how it works...it's a heavily customized version of a CMS platform and the data of the contestants is manually checked from uploaded files. They do however use one scoring software to minimize the work.

Pete
----- Original Message -----
From: Atwood, Mark<mailto:atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
To: General pattern discussion<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 11:35 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

This is actually a pretty amazing site and we would do extremely well to try and pursue something like this.   I have to believe that Jim could create the export file from PACSS very easily...the trick will be how that gets uploaded.  We would need to use AMA numbers as a unique ID for each Pilot so we don't end up with 4 misspellings of the same person, but that would be simple

The best part is all the data that would be available to the pilot.  National and regional averages on a maneuver by maneuver basis.  It would be nice for analyzing your own scores.

The contest registration could be huge too, though I can see the downside in that a contest that has poor early registration, may end up with even less attendance since that might dissuade even more from coming, but overall it would be a tremendous asset.



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Keith Black
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 11:37 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

That is awesome!  I wonder if we could borrow some of the technology from them to do that for pattern?
On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 8:57 AM, Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net<mailto:schale at optonline.net>> wrote:
I love the way the question I posed about adding an unkown to pattern has morphed into multiple topics, currently world championship judging :)

One other nice idea that IMAC has implemented is in their contest management software.  As a member of the web team I would love to see us be able to do something similar (I have no idea what is involved).  I am sure this feature brings a lot more use to their website than we get.  Like we have, all of their contests are listed from their website.  However you can sign up for any contest in a uniform manner.  Some of our districts did or does have this feature but it is not uniformly implemented.  You can also see who is registered for a contest, how many people are going, how many in each class, etc.  Once the contest is complete the scoring program that they use generates a report that gets uploaded to the web as results for that contest.  This is a very interesting feature.  Final results with round scores including dropped rounds etc are posted.  If you click on your name or any pilot you will see all of their individual scores for the contest.  No need to rummage through scoring sheets to find yours.  You can see how you scored in each maneuver through the contest or compared to other fliers.
An example of their contest results page.
http://www.mini-iac.com/Regions/NorthCentral/NCContestResults/tabid/101/Default.aspx

Stuart


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.112/2392 - Release Date: 09/25/09 05:51:00

________________________________
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Fri Sep 25 09:26:04 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 17:26:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <001501ca3e04$87d07f60$97717e20$@maurice@sgmservice.com>
References: <1263356613.4176751253633873575.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>	<4AB8F0C6.6050005@san.rr.com>	<4ABB7ACE.5090006@optonline.net>	<77f26e410909250836g11762559rb0bb52ca14a71e64@mail.gmail.com>	<99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7CFA@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
	<001501ca3e04$87d07f60$97717e20$@maurice@sgmservice.com>
Message-ID: <005101ca3e05$3b7e9330$b27bb990$@com>

Rather than forcing each CD to use the same scoring software all we need to
do is come up with a standard reporting format that we can use to upload
data and then the various scoring programs can be modified to create this
data file and for the CD to send it to a central location.

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Gene Maurice
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 10:21 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

 

PACSS already creates a couple of different export files, individual
contestant results an contest results in csv format. It also has the
capability of uploading to a web site. Currently it uploads the entire
database to an FTP directory on the PACSS web site. 

 

BTW, AMA number is the key in the system 

 

 

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Atwood, Mark
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 11:36 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

 

This is actually a pretty amazing site and we would do extremely well to try
and pursue something like this.   I have to believe that Jim could create
the export file from PACSS very easily.the trick will be how that gets
uploaded.  We would need to use AMA numbers as a unique ID for each Pilot so
we don't end up with 4 misspellings of the same person, but that would be
simple

 

The best part is all the data that would be available to the pilot.
National and regional averages on a maneuver by maneuver basis.  It would be
nice for analyzing your own scores.

 

The contest registration could be huge too, though I can see the downside in
that a contest that has poor early registration, may end up with even less
attendance since that might dissuade even more from coming, but overall it
would be a tremendous asset.

 

 

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Keith Black
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 11:37 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

 

That is awesome!  I wonder if we could borrow some of the technology from
them to do that for pattern?

On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 8:57 AM, Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net> wrote:

I love the way the question I posed about adding an unkown to pattern has
morphed into multiple topics, currently world championship judging :)

One other nice idea that IMAC has implemented is in their contest management
software.  As a member of the web team I would love to see us be able to do
something similar (I have no idea what is involved).  I am sure this feature
brings a lot more use to their website than we get.  Like we have, all of
their contests are listed from their website.  However you can sign up for
any contest in a uniform manner.  Some of our districts did or does have
this feature but it is not uniformly implemented.  You can also see who is
registered for a contest, how many people are going, how many in each class,
etc.  Once the contest is complete the scoring program that they use
generates a report that gets uploaded to the web as results for that
contest.  This is a very interesting feature.  Final results with round
scores including dropped rounds etc are posted.  If you click on your name
or any pilot you will see all of their individual scores for the contest.
No need to rummage through scoring sheets to find yours.  You can see how
you scored in each maneuver through the contest or compared to other fliers.
An example of their contest results page.
http://www.mini-iac.com/Regions/NorthCentral/NCContestResults/tabid/101/Defa
ult.aspx

Stuart


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

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Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Fri Sep 25 09:30:16 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 17:30:16 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <005101ca3e05$3b7e9330$b27bb990$@com>
References: <1263356613.4176751253633873575.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<4AB8F0C6.6050005@san.rr.com>	<4ABB7ACE.5090006@optonline.net>
	<77f26e410909250836g11762559rb0bb52ca14a71e64@mail.gmail.com>
	<99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7CFA@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
	<001501ca3e04$87d07f60$97717e20$@maurice@sgmservice.com>
	<005101ca3e05$3b7e9330$b27bb990$@com>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7D05@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

And I think it will be a "pull" type system in that you won't have to coax people to use it if indeed the information gets out there in a timely manner.  Once a contestant gets the chance to see all the data...they'll push their local CD's hard to do the same.  It will snowball in a good way.

And if THAT'S in place...imagine how great the info for the Nats and for the Worlds could be???   People from various countries able to click on their guy and see all of his raw scores and then compare to the current leaders...etc.



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Derek Koopowitz
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 1:26 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

Rather than forcing each CD to use the same scoring software all we need to do is come up with a standard reporting format that we can use to upload data and then the various scoring programs can be modified to create this data file and for the CD to send it to a central location.

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Gene Maurice
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 10:21 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

PACSS already creates a couple of different export files, individual contestant results an contest results in csv format. It also has the capability of uploading to a web site. Currently it uploads the entire database to an FTP directory on the PACSS web site.

BTW, AMA number is the key in the system



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Atwood, Mark
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 11:36 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

This is actually a pretty amazing site and we would do extremely well to try and pursue something like this.   I have to believe that Jim could create the export file from PACSS very easily...the trick will be how that gets uploaded.  We would need to use AMA numbers as a unique ID for each Pilot so we don't end up with 4 misspellings of the same person, but that would be simple

The best part is all the data that would be available to the pilot.  National and regional averages on a maneuver by maneuver basis.  It would be nice for analyzing your own scores.

The contest registration could be huge too, though I can see the downside in that a contest that has poor early registration, may end up with even less attendance since that might dissuade even more from coming, but overall it would be a tremendous asset.



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Keith Black
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 11:37 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

That is awesome!  I wonder if we could borrow some of the technology from them to do that for pattern?
On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 8:57 AM, Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net<mailto:schale at optonline.net>> wrote:
I love the way the question I posed about adding an unkown to pattern has morphed into multiple topics, currently world championship judging :)

One other nice idea that IMAC has implemented is in their contest management software.  As a member of the web team I would love to see us be able to do something similar (I have no idea what is involved).  I am sure this feature brings a lot more use to their website than we get.  Like we have, all of their contests are listed from their website.  However you can sign up for any contest in a uniform manner.  Some of our districts did or does have this feature but it is not uniformly implemented.  You can also see who is registered for a contest, how many people are going, how many in each class, etc.  Once the contest is complete the scoring program that they use generates a report that gets uploaded to the web as results for that contest.  This is a very interesting feature.  Final results with round scores including dropped rounds etc are posted.  If you click on your name or any pilot you will see all of their individual scores for the contest.  No need to rummage through scoring sheets to find yours.  You can see how you scored in each maneuver through the contest or compared to other fliers.
An example of their contest results page.
http://www.mini-iac.com/Regions/NorthCentral/NCContestResults/tabid/101/Default.aspx

Stuart


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org<mailto:NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.112/2392 - Release Date: 09/25/09 05:51:00

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From duane.e.beck at comcast.net  Fri Sep 25 09:33:02 2009
From: duane.e.beck at comcast.net (Duane Beck)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 17:33:02 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <005101ca3e05$3b7e9330$b27bb990$@com>
Message-ID: <452070950.3881161253899982055.JavaMail.root@sz0056a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>

XML Schema!  :)

Duane

> From: "Derek Koopowitz" <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 1:25:48 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
>
> Rather than forcing each CD to use the same scoring software all we
> need to do is come up with a standard reporting format that we can use
> to upload data and then the various scoring programs can be modified
> to create this data file and for the CD to send it to a central
> location.

From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Fri Sep 25 09:35:13 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 17:35:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <452070950.3881161253899982055.JavaMail.root@sz0056a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>
References: <005101ca3e05$3b7e9330$b27bb990$@com>
	<452070950.3881161253899982055.JavaMail.root@sz0056a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7D08@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

I agree.  Shouldn't be hard to define an XML layout that would work for this and we already have the unique primary key.  Might be an issue with international competitors, but I'm sure we could get around that.

The big work is on the web site side.

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Duane Beck
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 1:33 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

XML Schema!  :)

Duane

> From: "Derek Koopowitz" <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 1:25:48 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
>
> Rather than forcing each CD to use the same scoring software all we
> need to do is come up with a standard reporting format that we can use
> to upload data and then the various scoring programs can be modified
> to create this data file and for the CD to send it to a central
> location.
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
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From schale at optonline.net  Fri Sep 25 10:48:18 2009
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 18:48:18 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <005101ca3e05$3b7e9330$b27bb990$@com>
References: <1263356613.4176751253633873575.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<4AB8F0C6.6050005@san.rr.com> <4ABB7ACE.5090006@optonline.net>
	<77f26e410909250836g11762559rb0bb52ca14a71e64@mail.gmail.com>
	<99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7CFA@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
	<001501ca3e04$87d07f60$97717e20$%maurice@sgmservice.com>
	<005101ca3e05$3b7e9330$b27bb990$@com>
Message-ID: <4ABD1067.8090303@optonline.net>

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From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Fri Sep 25 11:17:10 2009
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 19:17:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <4ABD1067.8090303@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <A0C9F66D780F491E9E10931660D17F2C@jaysdesktop>

Didn't we go through this last year?

We also now have a new web site that use a CMS (Jooma)  and a database
(MySQL). Why not use them?

 

Jay Marshall 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Stuart Chale
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 2:48 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

 

I have been playing with their software "score"  It is available from the
IMAC site.  The program produces the reports in the same format that you see
on the site as well as the standings sheet that you would post  at a contest
(same format).  I think this works so well because everyone uses the same
software.  The full contest results including individual scores etc were on
the site 2 days after the contest.  The software is easy to use and with the
individual maneuver scores posted allows you to recreate the contest or a
round to see "what if"  I didn't 0 the spin or flop the stall turn.  How
would the results have changed.  (Yes I admit it I did that.  I got a 0 on
a few spins).  I have not played with PACSS in  along time so I do not know
if it produces the same output.
The results are output onto several html pages (already formatted)  that can
be just uploaded to our site with an HTML page listing the contests linking
to the results as they have done.  
Here is a test that I did with 2 flyers entered into the Score program.
IMAC has 2 sequences per flight but the software can output 1 or 2.  
The contest results page would have a link to this page (just a test)
http://angelsonly.com/scoretest/report_results.html
>From there you can click on individual pilots etc.  I am not sure if the
regional point leaders are done manually or automatically.

Stuart

Derek Koopowitz wrote: 

Rather than forcing each CD to use the same scoring software all we need to
do is come up with a standard reporting format that we can use to upload
data and then the various scoring programs can be modified to create this
data file and for the CD to send it to a central location.

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Gene Maurice
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 10:21 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

 

PACSS already creates a couple of different export files, individual
contestant results an contest results in csv format. It also has the
capability of uploading to a web site. Currently it uploads the entire
database to an FTP directory on the PACSS web site. 

 

BTW, AMA number is the key in the system 

 

 

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Atwood, Mark
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 11:36 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

 

This is actually a pretty amazing site and we would do extremely well to try
and pursue something like this.   I have to believe that Jim could create
the export file from PACSS very easily.the trick will be how that gets
uploaded.  We would need to use AMA numbers as a unique ID for each Pilot so
we don't end up with 4 misspellings of the same person, but that would be
simple

 

The best part is all the data that would be available to the pilot.
National and regional averages on a maneuver by maneuver basis.  It would be
nice for analyzing your own scores.

 

The contest registration could be huge too, though I can see the downside in
that a contest that has poor early registration, may end up with even less
attendance since that might dissuade even more from coming, but overall it
would be a tremendous asset.

 

 

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Keith Black
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 11:37 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

 

That is awesome!  I wonder if we could borrow some of the technology from
them to do that for pattern?

On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 8:57 AM, Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net> wrote:

I love the way the question I posed about adding an unkown to pattern has
morphed into multiple topics, currently world championship judging :)

One other nice idea that IMAC has implemented is in their contest management
software.  As a member of the web team I would love to see us be able to do
something similar (I have no idea what is involved).  I am sure this feature
brings a lot more use to their website than we get.  Like we have, all of
their contests are listed from their website.  However you can sign up for
any contest in a uniform manner.  Some of our districts did or does have
this feature but it is not uniformly implemented.  You can also see who is
registered for a contest, how many people are going, how many in each class,
etc.  Once the contest is complete the scoring program that they use
generates a report that gets uploaded to the web as results for that
contest.  This is a very interesting feature.  Final results with round
scores including dropped rounds etc are posted.  If you click on your name
or any pilot you will see all of their individual scores for the contest.
No need to rummage through scoring sheets to find yours.  You can see how
you scored in each maneuver through the contest or compared to other fliers.
An example of their contest results page.
http://www.mini-iac.com/Regions/NorthCentral/NCContestResults/tabid/101/Defa
ult.aspx

Stuart


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.112/2392 - Release Date: 09/25/09
05:51:00






  _____  



 
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  
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From pcosky at comcast.net  Fri Sep 25 12:12:56 2009
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 20:12:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
References: <A0C9F66D780F491E9E10931660D17F2C@jaysdesktop>
Message-ID: <527E9BDA13E343668BF2A8F6FEC82EBD@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>

Joomla and MySQL could certainly do what is necessary, what we need is an actual developer who can write the code for the modules. If all our scoring software can output the same formatted CSV then it would be much easier for a code writer.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Jay Marshall 
  To: 'General pattern discussion' 
  Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 3:16 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC


  Didn't we go through this last year?

  We also now have a new web site that use a CMS (Jooma)  and a database (MySQL). Why not use them?



  Jay Marshall 

  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Stuart Chale
  Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 2:48 PM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC



  I have been playing with their software "score"  It is available from the IMAC site.  The program produces the reports in the same format that you see on the site as well as the standings sheet that you would post  at a contest (same format).  I think this works so well because everyone uses the same software.  The full contest results including individual scores etc were on the site 2 days after the contest.  The software is easy to use and with the individual maneuver scores posted allows you to recreate the contest or a round to see "what if"  I didn't 0 the spin or flop the stall turn.  How would the results have changed.  (Yes I admit it I did that.  I got a 0 on  a few spins).  I have not played with PACSS in  along time so I do not know if it produces the same output.
  The results are output onto several html pages (already formatted)  that can be just uploaded to our site with an HTML page listing the contests linking to the results as they have done.  
  Here is a test that I did with 2 flyers entered into the Score program.  IMAC has 2 sequences per flight but the software can output 1 or 2.  
  The contest results page would have a link to this page (just a test)   http://angelsonly.com/scoretest/report_results.html
  >From there you can click on individual pilots etc.  I am not sure if the regional point leaders are done manually or automatically.

  Stuart

  Derek Koopowitz wrote: 

  Rather than forcing each CD to use the same scoring software all we need to do is come up with a standard reporting format that we can use to upload data and then the various scoring programs can be modified to create this data file and for the CD to send it to a central location.



  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Gene Maurice
  Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 10:21 AM
  To: 'General pattern discussion'
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC



  PACSS already creates a couple of different export files, individual contestant results an contest results in csv format. It also has the capability of uploading to a web site. Currently it uploads the entire database to an FTP directory on the PACSS web site. 



  BTW, AMA number is the key in the system 







  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Atwood, Mark
  Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 11:36 AM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC



  This is actually a pretty amazing site and we would do extremely well to try and pursue something like this.   I have to believe that Jim could create the export file from PACSS very easily.the trick will be how that gets uploaded.  We would need to use AMA numbers as a unique ID for each Pilot so we don't end up with 4 misspellings of the same person, but that would be simple



  The best part is all the data that would be available to the pilot.  National and regional averages on a maneuver by maneuver basis.  It would be nice for analyzing your own scores.



  The contest registration could be huge too, though I can see the downside in that a contest that has poor early registration, may end up with even less attendance since that might dissuade even more from coming, but overall it would be a tremendous asset.







  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Keith Black
  Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 11:37 AM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC



  That is awesome!  I wonder if we could borrow some of the technology from them to do that for pattern?

  On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 8:57 AM, Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net> wrote:

  I love the way the question I posed about adding an unkown to pattern has morphed into multiple topics, currently world championship judging :)

  One other nice idea that IMAC has implemented is in their contest management software.  As a member of the web team I would love to see us be able to do something similar (I have no idea what is involved).  I am sure this feature brings a lot more use to their website than we get.  Like we have, all of their contests are listed from their website.  However you can sign up for any contest in a uniform manner.  Some of our districts did or does have this feature but it is not uniformly implemented.  You can also see who is registered for a contest, how many people are going, how many in each class, etc.  Once the contest is complete the scoring program that they use generates a report that gets uploaded to the web as results for that contest.  This is a very interesting feature.  Final results with round scores including dropped rounds etc are posted.  If you click on your name or any pilot you will see all of their individual scores for the contest.  No need to rummage through scoring sheets to find yours.  You can see how you scored in each maneuver through the contest or compared to other fliers.
  An example of their contest results page.
  http://www.mini-iac.com/Regions/NorthCentral/NCContestResults/tabid/101/Default.aspx

  Stuart


  _______________________________________________
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  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



  No virus found in this incoming message.
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From schale at optonline.net  Fri Sep 25 12:23:31 2009
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 20:23:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <527E9BDA13E343668BF2A8F6FEC82EBD@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
References: <A0C9F66D780F491E9E10931660D17F2C@jaysdesktop>
	<527E9BDA13E343668BF2A8F6FEC82EBD@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
Message-ID: <4ABD26B2.9080900@optonline.net>

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From moleski at canisius.edu  Fri Sep 25 14:08:39 2009
From: moleski at canisius.edu (Martin X. Moleski, SJ)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 22:08:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <452070950.3881161253899982055.JavaMail.root@sz0056a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>
References: <452070950.3881161253899982055.JavaMail.root@sz0056a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <4ABD3F5F.8040302@canisius.edu>

Duane Beck wrote:

> XML Schema!  :)

YAML?

			Marty

From patterndude at tx.rr.com  Sat Sep 26 06:49:38 2009
From: patterndude at tx.rr.com (patterndude at tx.rr.com)
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2009 14:49:38 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
In-Reply-To: <4ABD26B2.9080900@optonline.net>
References: <A0C9F66D780F491E9E10931660D17F2C@jaysdesktop><527E9BDA13E343668BF2A8F6FEC82EBD@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com><4ABD26B2.9080900@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <651198757-1253976575-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-409357900-@bda251.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>

Why not copy/purchase from IMAC?
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

-----Original Message-----
From: Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net>

Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 16:23:14 
To: General pattern discussion<nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC


_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From bob at toprudder.com  Sat Sep 26 07:19:15 2009
From: bob at toprudder.com (Bob Richards)
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2009 15:19:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Home Depot "Sportsman 1100 four stroke
	Portable Generator-Model # Gen 1100
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7CCD@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <171888.22380.qm@web1104.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>

I recently went through this exercise. I decided to try an ETQ 750 from Home Depot.
http://www.homedepot.com/Outdoors-Generators/h_d1/N-5yc1vZb8xpZ66xh1/R-100669124/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053
?
It will not handle much inrush current such as from an RV converter, but it will handle my 12V 20A power supply, which is the main reason I bought it. It is very light and quiet, I kept it, but I would not buy it again. (BTW, that is my review at the link above).
?
Another possibility is this:
?
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200342355_200342355
?
It has good feedback ratings. I have not seen one run, however.
?
Probably the least expensive option is this:
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200313480_200313480
?
It is two stroke, so you have to mix fuel, and the exhaust smells a little, but I've seen these run and they are not that bad. 
?
I just recently sold my old motorhome and bought a small toyhauler. I needed a good generator that was able to run my A/C. I've been following a generator thread on www.rv.net for a while now, and the general consensus on 3500w generators was that the Champion RV ready models are the best buy, so I bought one from Lowes for $329. 
http://www.championpowerequipment.com/40026.php
Works great. Not as quiet as the Honda inverter models, but cost a small fraction of those. It is much quieter than most of the generators running at my clubs recent Fly-For-Tots event, including some of the built-in Onans in some of the motorhomes. It is heavy, though.
?
My long range plans include saving money so I can buy a couple of the Honda 2000w inverter model generators. Two can be ganged together for 4000w and run the camper. One can be used for charging airplanes. But, for less than the cost of one of these, I can now do both, seperately. 
?
Bob R.
?

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From teamvertical at excite.com  Sat Sep 26 09:19:51 2009
From: teamvertical at excite.com (David)
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2009 17:19:51 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC
Message-ID: <20090926131949.14692@web013.roc2.bluetie.com>

And while we are doing this lets make the KFactor an online only publication saving the NSRCA money. Then the NSRCA could promote a premiere event like the Tucson Shootout with the extra money. I am being serious as the majority of the votes said make the KFactor an online only publication.
Dave





-----Original Message-----
From: patterndude at tx.rr.com
Date: 09/26/2009 11:07 AM
To: "General pattern discussion" 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] More Pattern vs IMAC

Note: Original message sent as attachment 

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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Sat Sep 26 18:35:39 2009
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2009 02:35:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
References: <814i1h$4cvlqs@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP4849E6A08654473C31AF47E8D70@phx.gbl>

Jim:
Most of the current F3M sequence works pretty well.  I need a better 3 blader on this thing to get the vertical penetration where it needs to be.  Probably will pick up a Mezjlik 28.5x12x3. I'm flying it at a fairly slow pace and still getting used to how the old Carden lumbers through snaps compared to a pattern bird.  Once I get its snap behavior back in my head, and sort out that roller going from R-L, it will be fine.  When I turn the sequence around and do the roller L-R it works out fine, but I can't get the wind to cooperate lately.  It's just surface rust, I've not been practicing rollers in any meaningful way for a long time now.  I'm also constrained by the local field boundaries so keeping the roller in tight and looking like anything reasonable is a challenge too.

What's the word on a new sequence for 2010?

Ed
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 8:16 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns


  Ed - I know you worked hard and invested again in getting the 40% Carden out of mothballs, just to encourage yourself and other with the F3M flying.  Thanks for doing so.  The sequence is difficult.  While flying it myself, I did like the challenge of making the 40% plane fit in the box, and having centered maneuvers again.  I'm not sure where it will all go, but thanks for making the effort to give it a shot!!!

  Jim

   

   

   

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ed Alt
  Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 10:08 PM
  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns

   

  It's funny.  I brought my 40% Carden out of mothballs last weekend to work on the F3M stuff and all I wanted to do was fly it like a pattern airplane.  Ofcourse it doesn't quite measure up, but I found that I really have no enthusiasm left for wapping through rolls where the only skill involved is being able to stop on time.  I admit, on the last flight of the day I digressed and did about 10 minutes of 3d-ish garbage, until I finally realized that it was really not very satisfying.  Foamies are more fun these days than knocking the sticks around on a 40 % gasser.   I guess I'm just getting old...
   
  Ed
   
  > Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:44:06 -0700
  > From: seefo at san.rr.com
  > To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] unknowns
  > 
  > Vince,
  > 
  > The "Slow Roll" in IAC does not equate to a pattern slow roll. The IAC 
  > Slow Roll is just a roll, and the term slow is used to differentiate it 
  > from a point roll or snap roll. In truth, the IAC slow roll is never 
  > flown at anything but maximum roll rate available.
  > 
  > -Doug
  > 
  > 
  > 
  > > 
  > >
  > > Yes, partial rolling circles are introduced in the Intermediate 
  > > class. As we know, there is not way to do rollers by rolling fast. 
  > > IMAC is missing to introduce the slow roll in Sportsman's class. I am 
  > > not sure why since IAC includes the slow roll.
  > >
  > > 
  > >
  > 
  > _______________________________________________
  > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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From chad at f3acanada.org  Sun Sep 27 14:50:16 2009
From: chad at f3acanada.org (Chad Northeast)
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2009 22:50:16 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 5114 G3 Rx's FS
In-Reply-To: <BLU0-SMTP4849E6A08654473C31AF47E8D70@phx.gbl>
References: <814i1h$4cvlqs@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>
	<BLU0-SMTP4849E6A08654473C31AF47E8D70@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <4ABFEC1C.9050102@f3acanada.org>

Hey Guys,

Maybe someone out there is still using 72? :-)

I have four G3's that have no home, I don't think these are worth much 
anymore, so $350 for all 4?  Three are used in very good shape, one is 
new but not in the box anymore (although it still has the tie-wrap on 
the antenna).

Contact me offline if interested,

chad at f3acanada.org

Chad



From warrior523 at mchsi.com  Sun Sep 27 16:40:11 2009
From: warrior523 at mchsi.com (Dan)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 00:40:11 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon
Message-ID: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>

Just a shout out to Todd Schmidt (CD) and the Bourbon County (gotta love that name) RC Club, in Ft. Scott, KS.  Their contest was held this weekend and it was just as much fun this year as all the years in the past.  A small club with a huge amount of hospitality.  It is great to fly at a club that seems to really enjoy all of us being there.  Great job BBRC and great work Todd.

Try to put this event on your calenders for next season, I am betting you won't regret it one bit.

Dan Curtis
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From dunnaway at hbcomm.net  Sun Sep 27 17:05:47 2009
From: dunnaway at hbcomm.net (Joe Dunnaway)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 01:05:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
In-Reply-To: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>
References: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>
Message-ID: <4AC00BE7.6010004@hbcomm.net>

    Can the "Half Square on Corners /w half rolls" vary in length on the 
legs as long as the rolls are centered in the lines?   It is a turn 
around maneuver and most turn around maneuvers can be used to adjust 
height. 
My view would be that both legs should be equal but I can see where it 
could be argued that since you are adjusting your exit height, you 
should be able to vary the length.

Jeff Buchner asked me this at the Ft. Scott contest and I'm not sure of 
the answer.


Joe D.



From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Sun Sep 27 17:12:56 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 01:12:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D57EB928@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

????  Aren't you by definition "adjusting the height" going from a low line to a high line?  That makes no sense!  (Said with a grin, not to be taken as a harsh critique). 

No, the legs need to be equal. You can adjust to ANY height you want and still have equal length lines. They both grow or shrink as needed.   If you start too late and have to cut the first leg short to stay in the box then you're stuck with a short second leg. 
--------------------------
Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld


----- Original Message -----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org <nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Sun Sep 27 21:05:43 2009
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question

    Can the "Half Square on Corners /w half rolls" vary in length on the 
legs as long as the rolls are centered in the lines?   It is a turn 
around maneuver and most turn around maneuvers can be used to adjust 
height. 
My view would be that both legs should be equal but I can see where it 
could be argued that since you are adjusting your exit height, you 
should be able to vary the length.

Jeff Buchner asked me this at the Ft. Scott contest and I'm not sure of 
the answer.


Joe D.


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From vanputte at cox.net  Sun Sep 27 17:15:09 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 01:15:09 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
In-Reply-To: <4AC00BE7.6010004@hbcomm.net>
References: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>
	<4AC00BE7.6010004@hbcomm.net>
Message-ID: <BD055534-E659-4DC1-AB5F-D8B0797E3CF6@cox.net>

My only reaction is that a square has equal sides, so a 1/2 square  
should as well and we should downgrade for unequal lengths for the  
same reason that we downgrade for square loops with unequal sides.

Ron VP

On Sep 27, 2009, at 8:05 PM, Joe Dunnaway wrote:

>    Can the "Half Square on Corners /w half rolls" vary in length on  
> the legs as long as the rolls are centered in the lines?   It is a  
> turn around maneuver and most turn around maneuvers can be used to  
> adjust height. My view would be that both legs should be equal but  
> I can see where it could be argued that since you are adjusting  
> your exit height, you should be able to vary the length.
>
> Jeff Buchner asked me this at the Ft. Scott contest and I'm not  
> sure of the answer.
>
>
> Joe D.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From rickwallace45 at gmail.com  Sun Sep 27 17:16:15 2009
From: rickwallace45 at gmail.com (richard wallace)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 01:16:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
In-Reply-To: <4AC00BE7.6010004@hbcomm.net>
References: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>
	<4AC00BE7.6010004@hbcomm.net>
Message-ID: <c8a7c8ec0909271816i22a50b6aq85aae49e7ec622b0@mail.gmail.com>

Hi, Joe -
Pretty sure the climbing legs have to be equal in length.

According to the rulebook maneuver description, downgrade #2 is:

Climbing and descending paths not of equal length. (also shown as 'climbing
legs not of equal length' in the Masters sequence diagram...)

>From that legs must be of equal length; Height MUST be adjusted in this
maneuver since the plane enters at the bottom of the box and exits at the
top....

Things like turnaround top hats are exempt from the 'equal vertical length'
thing, but both legs of this one are climbing... So they can be of any
length BUT the lengths must be equal...

My $0.02...

Rick


On Sun, Sep 27, 2009 at 9:05 PM, Joe Dunnaway <dunnaway at hbcomm.net> wrote:

>   Can the "Half Square on Corners /w half rolls" vary in length on the legs
> as long as the rolls are centered in the lines?   It is a turn around
> maneuver and most turn around maneuvers can be used to adjust height. My
> view would be that both legs should be equal but I can see where it could be
> argued that since you are adjusting your exit height, you should be able to
> vary the length.
>
> Jeff Buchner asked me this at the Ft. Scott contest and I'm not sure of the
> answer.
>
>
> Joe D.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Sun Sep 27 17:30:50 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 01:30:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
In-Reply-To: <2095423406.6199861254101295174.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <389122342.6200501254101449677.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>



Hi Joe, 



Here is my guess.? It is very good question: 



The name of the maneuver takes precedence.? We can adjust the altitude by increasing or decreasing the length of both sides of the 1/2 square.? Therefore,?both have to be equal.? This is because we will need to preserve the square shape.? This is not necessarily the case in other?other turnaround maneuvers.? 



I found the description.? Here is: 



Square Loop on Corner with Two Half Rolls: Model pulls through one-eighth (1/8) loop to a 45- degree climb and completes a square loop. Model executes a half roll in the first and third legs. Downgrades: Model pulls through one-eighth (1/8) loop to a 45- degree climb and completes a square loop. Model executes a half roll in the first and third legs. Downgrades: 

1. All sides not at 45 degrees to horizon. All sides not at 45 degrees to horizon. 

2. Loop not square with sides of equal length. Loop not square with sides of equal length. 

3. Loop segments not round and of equal radius. Loop segments not round and of equal radius. 

4. Half rolls not 180 degrees. Half rolls not 180 degrees. 

5. Wings not level during one-quarter loops. Wings not level during one-quarter loops. 

6. Changes in heading during rolls and loops. Changes in heading during rolls and loops. 

7. Rolls not centered in legs. Rolls not centered in legs. 

8. Rolls not in first and third legs score zero (0). Rolls not in first and third legs score zero (0). 

9. Roll rates not constant Roll rates not constant 



OK.? I hope that this is clear.? Have?a nice?week.? 




Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Joe Dunnaway " < dunnaway @ hbcomm .net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2009 8:05:43 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question 

?? ?Can the "Half Square on Corners /w half rolls" vary in length on the 
legs as long as the rolls are centered in the lines? ? It is a turn 
around maneuver and most turn around maneuvers can be used to adjust 
height. 
My view would be that both legs should be equal but I can see where it 
could be argued that since you are adjusting your exit height, you 
should be able to vary the length. 

Jeff Buchner asked me this at the Ft. Scott contest and I'm not sure of 
the answer. 


Joe D. 


_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Sun Sep 27 17:33:19 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 01:33:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon
In-Reply-To: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>
Message-ID: <1252340409.6201381254101598598.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

Yes, I second Dan.? We had a great weekend. 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dan" <warrior523 at mchsi.com> 
To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2009 7:39:51 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon 


Just a shout out to Todd Schmidt (CD) and the Bourbon County (gotta love that name) RC Club, in Ft. Scott, KS.? Their contest was held this weekend and it was just as much fun this year as all the years in the past.? A small club with a huge amount of hospitality.? It is great to fly at a club that seems to really enjoy all of us being there.? Great job BBRC and great work Todd. 

Try to put this event on your calenders for next season, I am betting you won't regret it one bit. 

Dan Curtis 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From warrior523 at mchsi.com  Sun Sep 27 17:33:23 2009
From: warrior523 at mchsi.com (Dan)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 01:33:23 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
References: <389122342.6200501254101449677.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <001201ca3fdb$a84396f0$6a00a8c0@warrior>

Vince,

Looks like item #2 in the description pretty well sums it up.  Legs equal but still allows for alt. adjustment by overall size of the half square.

Dan
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2009 8:30 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question


  Hi Joe,



  Here is my guess.  It is very good question:



  The name of the maneuver takes precedence.  We can adjust the altitude by increasing or decreasing the length of both sides of the 1/2 square.  Therefore, both have to be equal.  This is because we will need to preserve the square shape.  This is not necessarily the case in other other turnaround maneuvers. 



  I found the description.  Here is:



  Square Loop on Corner with Two Half Rolls: Model pulls through one-eighth (1/8) loop to a 45- degree climb and completes a square loop. Model executes a half roll in the first and third legs. Downgrades: 

  1. All sides not at 45 degrees to horizon. 

  2. Loop not square with sides of equal length. 

  3. Loop segments not round and of equal radius. 

  4. Half rolls not 180 degrees. 

  5. Wings not level during one-quarter loops. 

  6. Changes in heading during rolls and loops. 

  7. Rolls not centered in legs. 

  8. Rolls not in first and third legs score zero (0). 

  9. Roll rates not constant 



  OK.  I hope that this is clear.  Have a nice week.  




  Vicente "Vince" Bortone

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: "Joe Dunnaway" <dunnaway at hbcomm.net>
  To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2009 8:05:43 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question

      Can the "Half Square on Corners /w half rolls" vary in length on the 
  legs as long as the rolls are centered in the lines?   It is a turn 
  around maneuver and most turn around maneuvers can be used to adjust 
  height. 
  My view would be that both legs should be equal but I can see where it 
  could be argued that since you are adjusting your exit height, you 
  should be able to vary the length.

  Jeff Buchner asked me this at the Ft. Scott contest and I'm not sure of 
  the answer.


  Joe D.


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion




------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From dunnaway at hbcomm.net  Sun Sep 27 17:34:22 2009
From: dunnaway at hbcomm.net (Joe Dunnaway)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 01:34:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
In-Reply-To: <c8a7c8ec0909271816i22a50b6aq85aae49e7ec622b0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>	<4AC00BE7.6010004@hbcomm.net>
	<c8a7c8ec0909271816i22a50b6aq85aae49e7ec622b0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4AC01297.2040708@hbcomm.net>

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From jlkonn at hotmail.com  Sun Sep 27 17:36:50 2009
From: jlkonn at hotmail.com (John Konneker)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 01:36:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon
In-Reply-To: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>
References: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>
Message-ID: <BLU106-W251B9BCB655E7A55096E77CDD60@phx.gbl>


I second all the above!
Great contest and a great club!
Thanks Todd!
JLK

From: warrior523 at mchsi.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2009 19:39:51 -0500
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon










Just a shout out to Todd Schmidt (CD) and the 
Bourbon County (gotta love that name) RC Club, in Ft. Scott, KS.  Their 
contest was held this weekend and it was just as much fun this year as all the 
years in the past.  A small club with a huge amount of hospitality.  
It is great to fly at a club that seems to really enjoy all of us being 
there.  Great job BBRC and great work Todd.
 
Try to put this event on your calenders for next 
season, I am betting you won't regret it one bit.
 
Dan Curtis 		 	   		  
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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Sun Sep 27 18:25:06 2009
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 02:25:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
References: <389122342.6200501254101449677.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP4540D4182BCB8C5763139E8D60@phx.gbl>

Correct, otherwise the maneuver would need to be called a 1/2 rectangle.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2009 8:30 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question


  Hi Joe,



  Here is my guess.  It is very good question:



  The name of the maneuver takes precedence.  We can adjust the altitude by increasing or decreasing the length of both sides of the 1/2 square.  Therefore, both have to be equal.  This is because we will need to preserve the square shape.  This is not necessarily the case in other other turnaround maneuvers. 



  I found the description.  Here is:



  Square Loop on Corner with Two Half Rolls: Model pulls through one-eighth (1/8) loop to a 45- degree climb and completes a square loop. Model executes a half roll in the first and third legs. Downgrades: 

  1. All sides not at 45 degrees to horizon. 

  2. Loop not square with sides of equal length. 

  3. Loop segments not round and of equal radius. 

  4. Half rolls not 180 degrees. 

  5. Wings not level during one-quarter loops. 

  6. Changes in heading during rolls and loops. 

  7. Rolls not centered in legs. 

  8. Rolls not in first and third legs score zero (0). 

  9. Roll rates not constant 



  OK.  I hope that this is clear.  Have a nice week.  




  Vicente "Vince" Bortone

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: "Joe Dunnaway" <dunnaway at hbcomm.net>
  To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2009 8:05:43 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question

      Can the "Half Square on Corners /w half rolls" vary in length on the 
  legs as long as the rolls are centered in the lines?   It is a turn 
  around maneuver and most turn around maneuvers can be used to adjust 
  height. 
  My view would be that both legs should be equal but I can see where it 
  could be argued that since you are adjusting your exit height, you 
  should be able to vary the length.

  Jeff Buchner asked me this at the Ft. Scott contest and I'm not sure of 
  the answer.


  Joe D.


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion




------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net  Sun Sep 27 18:45:09 2009
From: pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net (Ihncheol Park)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 02:45:09 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon
In-Reply-To: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>
References: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>
Message-ID: <000601ca3fe5$afbd9b60$0f38d220$@net>

Yes! It was a great contest.  Todd and the club members did a wonderful job.

I would like to personally thank to Joe Dunnaway, Jeff Buchner, Steve Ford
for helping me setting the engine on Friday until sunset.  If you guys
weren't there, I couldn't even fly.

I would also like to thank all those who judged and gave great inputs!  That
includes Dan also.

It was great to see all those people  and finally flew a contest after a
long absent (about 6 years now).  

As Jeff Buchner said, one reason to fly at contest is also to have "FUN".

 

Thanks again to all those who helped!!

 

I will see you guys again next year with a lot more practice.

 

Ihncheol Park

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dan
Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2009 7:40 PM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon

 

Just a shout out to Todd Schmidt (CD) and the Bourbon County (gotta love
that name) RC Club, in Ft. Scott, KS.  Their contest was held this weekend
and it was just as much fun this year as all the years in the past.  A small
club with a huge amount of hospitality.  It is great to fly at a club that
seems to really enjoy all of us being there.  Great job BBRC and great work
Todd.

 

Try to put this event on your calenders for next season, I am betting you
won't regret it one bit.

 

Dan Curtis

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From steveandlaurel at valornet.com  Sun Sep 27 18:49:33 2009
From: steveandlaurel at valornet.com (Steve Ford)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 02:49:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon
References: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>
Message-ID: <6CF68801BB4A4B7C8918AC27EB1DF6B0@Home>

Super contest Todd and the BCRC.  Great time.

Steve Ford
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Dan 
  To: NSRCA Mailing List 
  Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2009 7:39 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon


  Just a shout out to Todd Schmidt (CD) and the Bourbon County (gotta love that name) RC Club, in Ft. Scott, KS.  Their contest was held this weekend and it was just as much fun this year as all the years in the past.  A small club with a huge amount of hospitality.  It is great to fly at a club that seems to really enjoy all of us being there.  Great job BBRC and great work Todd.

  Try to put this event on your calenders for next season, I am betting you won't regret it one bit.

  Dan Curtis


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Sun Sep 27 20:19:48 2009
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 04:19:48 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
In-Reply-To: <4AC00BE7.6010004@hbcomm.net>
Message-ID: <30825.86205.qm@web33008.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I don't think it would be considered a half square if the lines weren't equal length. That would make it a half rectangle. 

Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Sun, 9/27/09, Joe Dunnaway <dunnaway at hbcomm.net> wrote:

From: Joe Dunnaway <dunnaway at hbcomm.net>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Sunday, September 27, 2009, 6:05 PM

???Can the "Half Square on Corners /w half rolls" vary in length on the legs as long as the rolls are centered in the lines????It is a turn around maneuver and most turn around maneuvers can be used to adjust height. My view would be that both legs should be equal but I can see where it could be argued that since you are adjusting your exit height, you should be able to vary the length.

Jeff Buchner asked me this at the Ft. Scott contest and I'm not sure of the answer.


Joe D.


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



      
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From 1shinden at att.net  Mon Sep 28 01:43:46 2009
From: 1shinden at att.net (Mike Howard)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 09:43:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon
In-Reply-To: <6CF68801BB4A4B7C8918AC27EB1DF6B0@Home>
Message-ID: <256299.18227.qm@web81108.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Yes it was a great contest, good weather, good friends,Todd and crew makes it look easy, Thanks to all.? See ya next year.
?
?
Mike

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, Steve Ford <steveandlaurel at valornet.com> wrote:


From: Steve Ford <steveandlaurel at valornet.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:49 AM





Super contest Todd and the BCRC.? Great time.
?
Steve Ford

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Dan 
To: NSRCA Mailing List 
Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2009 7:39 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon


Just a shout out to Todd Schmidt (CD) and the Bourbon County (gotta love that name) RC Club, in Ft. Scott, KS.? Their contest was held this weekend and it was just as much fun this year as all the years in the past.? A small club with a huge amount of hospitality.? It is great to fly at a club that seems to really enjoy all of us being there.? Great job BBRC and great work Todd.
?
Try to put this event on your calenders for next season, I am betting you won't regret it one bit.
?
Dan Curtis



_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From bob.lavey at cox.net  Mon Sep 28 02:49:56 2009
From: bob.lavey at cox.net (Bob Lavey)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 10:49:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon
In-Reply-To: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>
References: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>
Message-ID: <C099FE71E1524646817AF9CB0994B424@LAVEYFAMILYXP>

I'll second that, Dan.  We had a ball up there.  The field was in terrific
shape, and the hosting club treated us great.  The pilots flew very well in
wildly changing wind conditions, and most importantly, everyone was having
fun.
 
Bob


  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Dan
Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2009 7:40 PM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon


Just a shout out to Todd Schmidt (CD) and the Bourbon County (gotta love
that name) RC Club, in Ft. Scott, KS.  Their contest was held this weekend
and it was just as much fun this year as all the years in the past.  A small
club with a huge amount of hospitality.  It is great to fly at a club that
seems to really enjoy all of us being there.  Great job BBRC and great work
Todd.
 
Try to put this event on your calenders for next season, I am betting you
won't regret it one bit.
 
Dan Curtis

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From jlachow at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 28 04:14:46 2009
From: jlachow at hotmail.com (Joe Lachowski)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 12:14:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
In-Reply-To: <30825.86205.qm@web33008.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <4AC00BE7.6010004@hbcomm.net>
Message-ID: <SNT104-W464C729EA966E5B84086D3BBD60@phx.gbl>


Yes, but shouldn't the top line appear a little smaller/shorter since it is further away/higher?<g>
 


Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2009 21:19:45 -0700
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question





I don't think it would be considered a half square if the lines weren't equal length. That would make it a half rectangle. 


Chris 
 
 
 

--- On Sun, 9/27/09, Joe Dunnaway <dunnaway at hbcomm.net> wrote:


From: Joe Dunnaway <dunnaway at hbcomm.net>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Sunday, September 27, 2009, 6:05 PM


   Can the "Half Square on Corners /w half rolls" vary in length on the legs as long as the rolls are centered in the lines?   It is a turn around maneuver and most turn around maneuvers can be used to adjust height. My view would be that both legs should be equal but I can see where it could be argued that since you are adjusting your exit height, you should be able to vary the length.

Jeff Buchner asked me this at the Ft. Scott contest and I'm not sure of the answer.


Joe D.


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 		 	   		  
_________________________________________________________________
Microsoft brings you a new way to search the web.  Try  Bing? now
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From pcosky at comcast.net  Mon Sep 28 06:23:03 2009
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:23:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Stuff for sale
Message-ID: <23DC0909A7064A5C82AA6DE7C9DD6570@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>

In addition to my Black Magic that is listed on RCU (price now reduced on RCU and further discounts for NSRCA members just like what I did with my fuselage jigs...membership has it's privileges) I also have the following for sale that I don't think I'll be needing

ES Carbon Fiber pipe ESD4C160C7 $80
Hatori Flex Header new but out of pack $35
Johnson flex header used for 6 flights $25

There may be some more stuff as I clean the work shop so stay tuned.
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From pcosky at comcast.net  Mon Sep 28 07:22:35 2009
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 15:22:35 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Stuff for sale
References: <23DC0909A7064A5C82AA6DE7C9DD6570@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
Message-ID: <D9F28952EC3F488A948368A4E46171A8@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>

ES Pipe is SOLD pending funds.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Pete Cosky 
  To: NSRCA Mailing List 
  Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 10:22 AM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Stuff for sale


  In addition to my Black Magic that is listed on RCU (price now reduced on RCU and further discounts for NSRCA members just like what I did with my fuselage jigs...membership has it's privileges) I also have the following for sale that I don't think I'll be needing

  ES Carbon Fiber pipe ESD4C160C7 $80
  Hatori Flex Header new but out of pack $35
  Johnson flex header used for 6 flights $25

  There may be some more stuff as I clean the work shop so stay tuned.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jnhiller at earthlink.net  Mon Sep 28 08:19:23 2009
From: jnhiller at earthlink.net (J N Hiller)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:19:23 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
In-Reply-To: <SNT104-W464C729EA966E5B84086D3BBD60@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPIECLENAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>

That maneuver is even more difficult to judge.
Jim Hiller

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Joe Lachowski
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 5:15 AM
To: NSRCA Discussion List
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging
Question

Yes, but shouldn't the top line appear a little smaller/shorter since it is
further away/higher?<g>

  _____

Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2009 21:19:45 -0700
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging
Question
I don't think it would be considered a half square if the lines weren't
equal length. That would make it a half rectangle.
Chris





--- On Sun, 9/27/09, Joe Dunnaway <dunnaway at hbcomm.net> wrote:

From: Joe Dunnaway <dunnaway at hbcomm.net>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Sunday, September 27, 2009, 6:05 PM
   Can the "Half Square on Corners /w half rolls" vary in length on the legs
as long as the rolls are centered in the lines?   It is a turn around
maneuver and most turn around maneuvers can be used to adjust height. My
view would be that both legs should be equal but I can see where it could be
argued that since you are adjusting your exit height, you should be able to
vary the length.

Jeff Buchner asked me this at the Ft. Scott contest and I'm not sure of the
answer.


Joe D.


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
<http:///mc/compose?to=NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

  _____

Microsoft brings you a new way to search the web. Try Bing? now
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From jlkonn at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 28 08:22:30 2009
From: jlkonn at hotmail.com (John Konneker)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:22:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Pattern sources of supply
Message-ID: <BLU106-W4A888878F90045D4DC2D6CDD60@phx.gbl>


The other day I think someone was asking for a list of pattern suppliers.
Here's Chris Moon's new website that just came on line today.

http://www.f3aunlimited.com/

JLK

 		 	   		  
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From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 28 09:28:42 2009
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 17:28:42 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
In-Reply-To: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPIECLENAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <153151.40465.qm@web51011.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

 I hate that manuever! Mike

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, J N Hiller <jnhiller at earthlink.net> wrote:

> From: J N Hiller <jnhiller at earthlink.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule Judging Question
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 11:19 AM
> 
> 
> 
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> That
> maneuver is even more difficult to
> judge. 
> 
> Jim
> Hiller 
> 
> ?
> 
> 
> -----Original
> Message-----
> 
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Joe Lachowski
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September 28, 2009
> 5:15 AM
> 
> To: NSRCA
> Discussion List
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion]
> Interesting Masters schedule Judging
> Question
> 
> ? 
> 
> Yes,
> but shouldn't the top line appear a little
> smaller/shorter since it is further
> away/higher?<g>
> 
> ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Date:
> Sun, 27 Sep 2009
> 21:19:45 -0700
> 
> From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com
> 
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters
> schedule Judging Question
> 
> 
> 
>  
>   
>   I don't
>   think it would be considered a half square if the lines
> weren't equal length.
>   That would make it a half rectangle.  
>   Chris  
>   ? 
>   ? 
>   ? 
>   
> 
>   
> 
>   --- On Sun, 9/27/09,
> Joe Dunnaway <dunnaway at hbcomm.net>
>   wrote: 
>   
> 
>   From: Joe Dunnaway <dunnaway at hbcomm.net>
> 
>   Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Masters schedule
> Judging Question
> 
>   To: "General pattern discussion"
>   <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> 
>   Date: Sunday, September 27, 2009, 6:05
> PM 
>   ???Can
>   the "Half Square on Corners /w half rolls" vary
> in length on the
>   legs as long as the rolls are centered in the
> lines????It is a
>   turn around maneuver and most turn around maneuvers can
> be used to adjust
>   height. My view would be that both legs should be equal
> but I can see where
>   it could be argued that since you are adjusting your exit
> height, you should
>   be able to vary the length.
> 
>   
> 
>   Jeff Buchner asked me this at the Ft. Scott contest and
> I'm not sure of the
>   answer.
> 
>   
> 
>   
> 
>   Joe D.
> 
>   
> 
>   
> 
>   _______________________________________________
> 
>   NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 
>   NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
>   http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
>   
>  
> 
> 
> ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Microsoft
> brings you a new way to search the web. Try Bing? now
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      

From cchariandy at yahoo.ca  Mon Sep 28 10:14:45 2009
From: cchariandy at yahoo.ca (colin chariandy)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 18:14:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Herbert's Trimming
Message-ID: <992293.14700.qm@web112614.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

Does anyone have a link to Brians trimming...I can't find it anywhere.
?
Colin.


      __________________________________________________________________
Ask a question on any topic and get answers from real people. Go to Yahoo! Answers and share what you know at http://ca.answers.yahoo.com
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From schale at optonline.net  Mon Sep 28 10:21:29 2009
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 18:21:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Herbert's Trimming
In-Reply-To: <992293.14700.qm@web112614.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
References: <992293.14700.qm@web112614.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4AC0FE9C.3070001@optonline.net>

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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Mon Sep 28 10:30:37 2009
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 18:30:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <992293.14700.qm@web112614.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
References: <992293.14700.qm@web112614.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <833418.98479.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>


I am?making?plans to get geared up for next season and have a few questions about power supplies and such. I am looking to run two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55 amp power supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that feasable? Is there any reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000 packs at 5 amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to buy an Iota power supply? Are their different models of that power supply that should be considered?

Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the right stuff the first time.

Thanks in advance
Anthony
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From chadnortheast at shaw.ca  Mon Sep 28 10:40:27 2009
From: chadnortheast at shaw.ca (Chad Northeast)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 18:40:27 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <833418.98479.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <992293.14700.qm@web112614.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<833418.98479.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <d17ec7ca399.4ac0aeb9@shaw.ca>

Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will handle two 1010's at full rate and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a household circuit.

Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more than around 2.5A before you trip it.? If you want to run the Honda to the max make sure the Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.

I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its max power, and the Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or something.

Chad


----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>

> 
> I am?making?plans to get geared up for next season and have a 
> few questions about power supplies and such. I am looking to run 
> two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55 amp power 
> supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that feasable? Is there any 
> reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000 packs at 5 
> amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to buy an 
> Iota power supply? Are their different models of that power 
> supply that should be considered?
> 
> Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the right 
> stuff the first time.
> 
> Thanks in advance
> Anthony
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From pcosky at comcast.net  Mon Sep 28 10:40:49 2009
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 18:40:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] If you need a digital throw meter
Message-ID: <9780F1E46FA24902A71185B9622CE027@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>

And have thought about buying a Wixey..they are on sale right now at Rockler

http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=17206
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From ejhaury at comcast.net  Mon Sep 28 11:20:31 2009
From: ejhaury at comcast.net (Earl Haury)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 19:20:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <d17ec7ca399.4ac0aeb9@shaw.ca>
References: <992293.14700.qm@web112614.mail.gq1.yahoo.com><833418.98479.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<d17ec7ca399.4ac0aeb9@shaw.ca>
Message-ID: <AB914199D0644103B530A6BA4D7CC89A@EarlPC>

I agree with Chad - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda for a little more $ & weight. It will handle (at least)  two Iota 55's & 4 1010's as well as a couple of TX battery chargers with no problem. (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power outages the 2 kW Honda will handle a lot of household items also.)

Earl
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Chad Northeast 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 1:40 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions


  Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will handle two 1010's at full rate and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a household circuit.

  Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more than around 2.5A before you trip it.  If you want to run the Honda to the max make sure the Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.

  I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its max power, and the Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or something.

  Chad


  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
  Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
  To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>

  > 
  > I am making plans to get geared up for next season and have a 
  > few questions about power supplies and such. I am looking to run 
  > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55 amp power 
  > supply from a Honda generator. Is that feasable? Is there any 
  > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000 packs at 5 
  > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to buy an 
  > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that power 
  > supply that should be considered?
  > 
  > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the right 
  > stuff the first time.
  > 
  > Thanks in advance
  > Anthony 


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From DaveL322 at comcast.net  Mon Sep 28 11:41:00 2009
From: DaveL322 at comcast.net (Dave)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 19:41:00 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <AB914199D0644103B530A6BA4D7CC89A@EarlPC>
References: <992293.14700.qm@web112614.mail.gq1.yahoo.com><833418.98479.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com><d17ec7ca399.4ac0aeb9@shaw.ca>
	<AB914199D0644103B530A6BA4D7CC89A@EarlPC>
Message-ID: <6A11212DC382435AA06F71F5E9DE6B0E@davedesktop>

Yes, 4 1010s at 10s 5amps each running from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with
the 2kw Honda.  You could add 1 more 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps
at 10s left for each.  No, I don't have 6 1010s...but the 2kw generator is
popular at the field <G>.

 

I leave the small voltage jumper plug in my Iotas all the time - bumps
output voltage from something like 13.4 to 14.2V, which should make the
1010s run a little more efficiently.

 

Dave

 

 

 

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 3:20 PM
To: chad at f3acanada.org; General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

 

I agree with Chad - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda for a
little more $ & weight. It will handle (at least)  two Iota 55's & 4 1010's
as well as a couple of TX battery chargers with no problem. (If you live in
an area that experiences occasional power outages the 2 kW Honda will handle
a lot of household items also.)

 

Earl

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Chad <mailto:chadnortheast at shaw.ca>  Northeast 

To: General pattern discussion <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 1:40 PM

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

 

Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will handle two 1010's at full rate and a
third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a household circuit.

Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more than around 2.5A
before you trip it.  If you want to run the Honda to the max make sure the
Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.

I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its max power, and the
Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or something.

Chad


----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>

> 
> I am making plans to get geared up for next season and have a 
> few questions about power supplies and such. I am looking to run 
> two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55 amp power 
> supply from a Honda generator. Is that feasable? Is there any 
> reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000 packs at 5 
> amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to buy an 
> Iota power supply? Are their different models of that power 
> supply that should be considered?
> 
> Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the right 
> stuff the first time.
> 
> Thanks in advance
> Anthony 


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 28 12:23:20 2009
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 20:23:20 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <6A11212DC382435AA06F71F5E9DE6B0E@davedesktop>
Message-ID: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Charger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
 Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:

> From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> 
> 
> 
>  
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, 4
> 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.? You
> could add 1 more
> 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> each. ?No, I don?t
> have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> the field <G>. 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> I leave the
> small voltage jumper plug in
> my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> something like 13.4 to
> 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> efficiently. 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September 28, 2009
> 3:20 PM
> 
> To:
> chad at f3acanada.org;
>  General pattern discussion
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion]
> Iota 55 power supply questions 
> 
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with
> Chad 
> - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda?for
> a little more $
> & weight. It will handle (at least)? two Iota
> 55's & 4
> 1010's?as well as a couple of TX battery
> chargers?with no problem.
> (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> outages the 2 kW
> Honda will handle a lot of household items
> also.) 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Earl
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original
> Message -----  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: Chad
> Northeast  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To: General pattern
> discussion  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September
> 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> questions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> 
> 
> Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> handle two 1010's at full rate
> and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> household circuit.
> 
> 
> 
> Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> than around 2.5A
> before you trip it.? If you want to run the Honda to
> the max make sure the
> Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> 
> 
> 
> I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> max power, and the
> Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> something.
> 
> 
> 
>  Chad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> 
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> 
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> To: General pattern discussion 
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> 
> > I am?making?plans to get geared up for next
> season and have a 
> 
> > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> looking to run 
> 
> > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> amp power 
> 
> > supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that
> feasable? Is there any 
> 
> > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> packs at 5 
> 
> > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> buy an 
> 
> > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> power 
> 
> > supply that should be considered?
> 
> > 
> 
> > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> right 
> 
> > stuff the first time.
> 
> > 
> 
> > Thanks in advance
> 
> > Anthony  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      

From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Mon Sep 28 12:30:40 2009
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 20:30:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1D8C9F2664EC44058E774E537856D6F3@jaysdesktop>

A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda will put out
12 V, why the Iota?

Jay Marshall

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Ch
arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
 Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:

> From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> 
> 
> 
>  
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, 4
> 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.? You
> could add 1 more
> 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> each. ?No, I don?t
> have 6 1010s
..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> the field <G>. 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> I leave the
> small voltage jumper plug in
> my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> something like 13.4 to
> 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> efficiently. 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September 28, 2009
> 3:20 PM
> 
> To:
> chad at f3acanada.org;
>  General pattern discussion
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion]
> Iota 55 power supply questions 
> 
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with
> Chad 
> - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda?for
> a little more $
> & weight. It will handle (at least)? two Iota
> 55's & 4
> 1010's?as well as a couple of TX battery
> chargers?with no problem.
> (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> outages the 2 kW
> Honda will handle a lot of household items
> also.) 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Earl
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original
> Message -----  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: Chad
> Northeast  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To: General pattern
> discussion  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September
> 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> questions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> 
> 
> Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> handle two 1010's at full rate
> and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> household circuit.
> 
> 
> 
> Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> than around 2.5A
> before you trip it.? If you want to run the Honda to
> the max make sure the
> Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> 
> 
> 
> I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> max power, and the
> Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> something.
> 
> 
> 
>  Chad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> 
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> 
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> To: General pattern discussion 
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> 
> > I am?making?plans to get geared up for next
> season and have a 
> 
> > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> looking to run 
> 
> > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> amp power 
> 
> > supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that
> feasable? Is there any 
> 
> > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> packs at 5 
> 
> > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> buy an 
> 
> > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> power 
> 
> > supply that should be considered?
> 
> > 
> 
> > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> right 
> 
> > stuff the first time.
> 
> > 
> 
> > Thanks in advance
> 
> > Anthony  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From chadnortheast at shaw.ca  Mon Sep 28 12:33:18 2009
From: chadnortheast at shaw.ca (Chad Northeast)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 20:33:18 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <1D8C9F2664EC44058E774E537856D6F3@jaysdesktop>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<1D8C9F2664EC44058E774E537856D6F3@jaysdesktop>
Message-ID: <cf1a89f85a52.4ac0c92d@shaw.ca>

Its amp limited on the 12V I think around 8A maybe....a single 10s @ 5A requires around 20A @ 12V

Chad

----- Original Message -----
From: Jay Marshall <lightfoot at sc.rr.com>
Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 2:31 pm
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
To: 'General pattern discussion' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>

> A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda 
> will put out
> 12 V, why the Iota?
> 
> Jay Marshall
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of 
> mike mueller
> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-
> Converter-Battery-Ch
> arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
> 190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
> ?Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike
> 
> --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-
> discussion at lists.nsrca.org>> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 
> 2:40 PM
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? 
> >? 
> > 
> >? 
> > 
> >? 
> > 
> >? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Yes, 4
> > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.? You
> > could add 1 more
> > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> > each. ?No, I don?t
> > have 6 1010s
..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> > the field <G>. 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > I leave the
> > small voltage jumper plug in
> > my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> > something like 13.4 to
> > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> > efficiently. 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > Dave
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From:
> > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of 
> Earl Haury
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September 28, 2009
> > 3:20 PM
> > 
> > To:
> > chad at f3acanada.org;
> >? General pattern discussion
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion]
> > Iota 55 power supply questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I agree with
> > Chad 
> > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda?for
> > a little more $
> > & weight. It will handle (at least)? two Iota
> > 55's & 4
> > 1010's?as well as a couple of TX battery
> > chargers?with no problem.
> > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> > outages the 2 kW
> > Honda will handle a lot of household items
> > also.) 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Earl
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original
> > Message -----? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From: Chad
> > Northeast? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > To: General pattern
> > discussion? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September
> > 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> > questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> > handle two 1010's at full rate
> > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> > household circuit.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> > than around 2.5A
> > before you trip it.? If you want to run the Honda to
> > the max make sure the
> > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> > max power, and the
> > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> > something.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? Chad
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > 
> > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> > 
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> > 
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > 
> > To: General pattern discussion 
> > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > I am?making?plans to get geared up for next
> > season and have a 
> > 
> > > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> > looking to run 
> > 
> > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> > amp power 
> > 
> > > supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that
> > feasable? Is there any 
> > 
> > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> > packs at 5 
> > 
> > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> > buy an 
> > 
> > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> > power 
> > 
> > > supply that should be considered?
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> > right 
> > 
> > > stuff the first time.
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Thanks in advance
> > 
> > > Anthony? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> ????? 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
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From brian_w_young at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 28 12:35:06 2009
From: brian_w_young at yahoo.com (brian young)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 20:35:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <6A11212DC382435AA06F71F5E9DE6B0E@davedesktop>
References: <992293.14700.qm@web112614.mail.gq1.yahoo.com><833418.98479.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com><d17ec7ca399.4ac0aeb9@shaw.ca>
	<AB914199D0644103B530A6BA4D7CC89A@EarlPC>
	<6A11212DC382435AA06F71F5E9DE6B0E@davedesktop>
Message-ID: <453291.28627.qm@web112110.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

I use the plug to bump the output voltage up to 14.2V and periodically?my Cellpro10S chargers will give an overvoltage error, not sure this is entirely related to the input voltage to the charger but when I removed the plug the error?didnt repeat. This was tested between the two chargers I used and the same battery. But the other battery didnt do it.

Anyway just a point of information.



________________________________
From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 2:40:50 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions


Yes, 4 1010s at 10s 5amps each running from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.? You could add 1 more 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for each. ?No, I don?t have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at the field <G>.
?
I leave the small voltage jumper plug in my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from something like 13.4 to 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more efficiently.
?
Dave
?
?
?
?

________________________________

From:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 3:20 PM
To: chad at f3acanada.org; General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
?
I agree with Chad - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda?for a little more $ & weight. It will handle (at least)? two Iota 55's & 4 1010's?as well as a couple of TX battery chargers?with no problem. (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power outages the 2 kW Honda will handle a lot of household items also.)
?
Earl
----- Original Message ----- 
>From:Chad Northeast 
>To:General pattern discussion 
>Sent:Monday, September 28, 2009 1:40 PM
>Subject:Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
>?
>Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will handle two 1010's at full rate and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a household circuit.
>
>Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more than around 2.5A before you trip it.? If you want to run the Honda to the max make sure the Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
>
>I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its max power, and the Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or something.
>
>Chad
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
>Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
>Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
>To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>
>> 
>> I am?making?plans to get geared up for next season and have a 
>> few questions about power supplies and such. I am looking to run 
>> two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55 amp power 
>> supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that feasable? Is there any 
>> reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000 packs at 5 
>> amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to buy an 
>> Iota power supply? Are their different models of that power 
>> supply that should be considered?
>> 
>> Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the right 
>> stuff the first time.
>> 
>> Thanks in advance
>> Anthony 
>
________________________________

>_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Mon Sep 28 12:39:03 2009
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 20:39:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <cf1a89f85a52.4ac0c92d@shaw.ca>
Message-ID: <2A9A55FA7CFF42F0A4202065B53FDA18@jaysdesktop>

Got an old 100cc 4S?  Hook it up to an alternator with in/out silencers and
you might have a inexpensive system.

 

Jay Marshall 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Chad
Northeast
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:33 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

 

Its amp limited on the 12V I think around 8A maybe....a single 10s @ 5A
requires around 20A @ 12V

Chad

----- Original Message -----
From: Jay Marshall <lightfoot at sc.rr.com>
Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 2:31 pm
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
To: 'General pattern discussion' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>

> A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda 
> will put out
> 12 V, why the Iota?
> 
> Jay Marshall
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of 
> mike mueller
> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-
> Converter-Battery-Ch
>
arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
> 190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
>  Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike
> 
> --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-
> discussion at lists.nsrca.org>> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 
> 2:40 PM
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >  
> >  
> > 
> >  
> > 
> >  
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Yes, 4
> > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.  You
> > could add 1 more
> > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> > each.  No, I don't
> > have 6 1010s...but the 2kw generator is popular at
> > the field <G>. 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > I leave the
> > small voltage jumper plug in
> > my Iotas all the time - bumps output voltage from
> > something like 13.4 to
> > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> > efficiently. 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > Dave
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From:
> > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of 
> Earl Haury
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September 28, 2009
> > 3:20 PM
> > 
> > To:
> > chad at f3acanada.org;
> >  General pattern discussion
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion]
> > Iota 55 power supply questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >    
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I agree with
> > Chad 
> > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda for
> > a little more $
> > & weight. It will handle (at least)  two Iota
> > 55's & 4
> > 1010's as well as a couple of TX battery
> > chargers with no problem.
> > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> > outages the 2 kW
> > Honda will handle a lot of household items
> > also.) 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Earl
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original
> > Message -----  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From: Chad
> > Northeast  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > To: General pattern
> > discussion  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September
> > 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> > questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >    
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> > handle two 1010's at full rate
> > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> > household circuit.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> > than around 2.5A
> > before you trip it.  If you want to run the Honda to
> > the max make sure the
> > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> > max power, and the
> > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> > something.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >  Chad
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > 
> > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> > 
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> > 
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > 
> > To: General pattern discussion 
> > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > I am making plans to get geared up for next
> > season and have a 
> > 
> > > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> > looking to run 
> > 
> > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> > amp power 
> > 
> > > supply from a Honda generator. Is that
> > feasable? Is there any 
> > 
> > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> > packs at 5 
> > 
> > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> > buy an 
> > 
> > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> > power 
> > 
> > > supply that should be considered?
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> > right 
> > 
> > > stuff the first time.
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Thanks in advance
> > 
> > > Anthony  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
>       
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 

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From jpavlick at idseng.com  Mon Sep 28 12:39:11 2009
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 20:39:11 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <1D8C9F2664EC44058E774E537856D6F3@jaysdesktop>
Message-ID: <150433.29049.qm@web80503.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Because the 12v output on the Honda does not supply enough current.
?
john Pavlick

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, Jay Marshall <lightfoot at sc.rr.com> wrote:


From: Jay Marshall <lightfoot at sc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 4:30 PM


A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda will put out
12 V, why the Iota?

Jay Marshall

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Ch
arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:

> From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> 
> 
> 
>? 
>? 
> 
>? 
> 
>? 
> 
>? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>? 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, 4
> 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.? You
> could add 1 more
> 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> each. ?No, I don?t
> have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> the field <G>. 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> I leave the
> small voltage jumper plug in
> my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> something like 13.4 to
> 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> efficiently. 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September 28, 2009
> 3:20 PM
> 
> To:
> chad at f3acanada.org;
>? General pattern discussion
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion]
> Iota 55 power supply questions 
> 
> 
> 
>? ? 
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with
> Chad 
> - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda?for
> a little more $
> & weight. It will handle (at least)? two Iota
> 55's & 4
> 1010's?as well as a couple of TX battery
> chargers?with no problem.
> (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> outages the 2 kW
> Honda will handle a lot of household items
> also.) 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Earl
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original
> Message -----? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: Chad
> Northeast? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To: General pattern
> discussion? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September
> 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> questions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>? ? 
> 
> 
> 
> Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> handle two 1010's at full rate
> and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> household circuit.
> 
> 
> 
> Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> than around 2.5A
> before you trip it.? If you want to run the Honda to
> the max make sure the
> Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> 
> 
> 
> I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> max power, and the
> Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> something.
> 
> 
> 
>? Chad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> 
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> 
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> To: General pattern discussion 
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> 
> > I am?making?plans to get geared up for next
> season and have a 
> 
> > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> looking to run 
> 
> > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> amp power 
> 
> > supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that
> feasable? Is there any 
> 
> > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> packs at 5 
> 
> > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> buy an 
> 
> > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> power 
> 
> > supply that should be considered?
> 
> > 
> 
> > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> right 
> 
> > stuff the first time.
> 
> > 
> 
> > Thanks in advance
> 
> > Anthony? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>? 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


? ? ? 
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jpavlick at idseng.com  Mon Sep 28 12:44:57 2009
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 20:44:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <2A9A55FA7CFF42F0A4202065B53FDA18@jaysdesktop>
Message-ID: <786252.67999.qm@web80502.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I was going to rig up an 80" Shovel-Head Harley engine with 32" goose-neck drag pipes?and an old Ford Mustang alternator to charge my batteries when?I finally give in to the electric hype. Now that would be cool! Might be a little heavy to lug around though. And I'm sure it would be quite a bit louder than the rice-burner generators that most people use. LOL
?
John Pavlick

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, Jay Marshall <lightfoot at sc.rr.com> wrote:


From: Jay Marshall <lightfoot at sc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
To: chad at f3acanada.org, "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 4:38 PM








Got an old 100cc 4S? ?Hook it up to an alternator with in/out silencers and you might have a inexpensive system.
?

Jay Marshall 
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Chad Northeast
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:33 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
?
Its amp limited on the 12V I think around 8A maybe....a single 10s @ 5A requires around 20A @ 12V

Chad

----- Original Message -----
From: Jay Marshall <lightfoot at sc.rr.com>
Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 2:31 pm
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
To: 'General pattern discussion' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>

> A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda 
> will put out
> 12 V, why the Iota?
> 
> Jay Marshall
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of 
> mike mueller
> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-
> Converter-Battery-Ch
> arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
> 190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
> ?Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike
> 
> --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-
> discussion at lists.nsrca.org>> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 
> 2:40 PM
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? 
> >? 
> > 
> >? 
> > 
> >? 
> > 
> >? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Yes, 4
> > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.? You
> > could add 1 more
> > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> > each. ?No, I don?t
> > have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> > the field <G>. 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > I leave the
> > small voltage jumper plug in
> > my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> > something like 13.4 to
> > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> > efficiently. 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > Dave
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From:
> > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of 
> Earl Haury
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September 28, 2009
> > 3:20 PM
> > 
> > To:
> > chad at f3acanada.org;
> >? General pattern discussion
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion]
> > Iota 55 power supply questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I agree with
> > Chad 
> > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda?for
> > a little more $
> > & weight. It will handle (at least)? two Iota
> > 55's & 4
> > 1010's?as well as a couple of TX battery
> > chargers?with no problem.
> > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> > outages the 2 kW
> > Honda will handle a lot of household items
> > also.) 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Earl
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original
> > Message -----? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From: Chad
> > Northeast? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > To: General pattern
> > discussion? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September
> > 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> > questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> > handle two 1010's at full rate
> > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> > household circuit.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> > than around 2.5A
> > before you trip it.? If you want to run the Honda to
> > the max make sure the
> > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> > max power, and the
> > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> > something.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? Chad
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > 
> > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> > 
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> > 
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > 
> > To: General pattern discussion 
> > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > I am?making?plans to get geared up for next
> > season and have a 
> > 
> > > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> > looking to run 
> > 
> > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> > amp power 
> > 
> > > supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that
> > feasable? Is there any 
> > 
> > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> > packs at 5 
> > 
> > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> > buy an 
> > 
> > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> > power 
> > 
> > > supply that should be considered?
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> > right 
> > 
> > > stuff the first time.
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Thanks in advance
> > 
> > > Anthony? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> ????? 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From pamrich47 at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 28 12:45:58 2009
From: pamrich47 at hotmail.com (Richard Strickland)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 20:45:58 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <1D8C9F2664EC44058E774E537856D6F3@jaysdesktop>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BAY128-W2672CE7D5444E8DB87E734A0D60@phx.gbl>


What are you going to use at home?  The 110V is cleaner and regulated--there's a better explaination--just don't know it off the top of my head.  Go a few more bucks and get the 75 and you can run 3 Cell pros full blast--and a fan....
RS 
> From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:30:34 -0400
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda will put out
> 12 V, why the Iota?
> 
> Jay Marshall
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Ch
> arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
> 190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
> Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike
> 
> --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Yes, 4
> > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.  You
> > could add 1 more
> > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> > each.  No, I don?t
> > have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> > the field <G>. 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > I leave the
> > small voltage jumper plug in
> > my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> > something like 13.4 to
> > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> > efficiently. 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > Dave
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From:
> > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September 28, 2009
> > 3:20 PM
> > 
> > To:
> > chad at f3acanada.org;
> > General pattern discussion
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion]
> > Iota 55 power supply questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I agree with
> > Chad 
> > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda for
> > a little more $
> > & weight. It will handle (at least)  two Iota
> > 55's & 4
> > 1010's as well as a couple of TX battery
> > chargers with no problem.
> > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> > outages the 2 kW
> > Honda will handle a lot of household items
> > also.) 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Earl
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original
> > Message ----- 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From: Chad
> > Northeast 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > To: General pattern
> > discussion 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September
> > 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> > questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> > handle two 1010's at full rate
> > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> > household circuit.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> > than around 2.5A
> > before you trip it.  If you want to run the Honda to
> > the max make sure the
> > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> > max power, and the
> > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> > something.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Chad
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > 
> > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> > 
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> > 
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > 
> > To: General pattern discussion 
> > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > I am making plans to get geared up for next
> > season and have a 
> > 
> > > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> > looking to run 
> > 
> > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> > amp power 
> > 
> > > supply from a Honda generator. Is that
> > feasable? Is there any 
> > 
> > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> > packs at 5 
> > 
> > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> > buy an 
> > 
> > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> > power 
> > 
> > > supply that should be considered?
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> > right 
> > 
> > > stuff the first time.
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Thanks in advance
> > 
> > > Anthony 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
 		 	   		  
_________________________________________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/choosepc/?ocid=ftp_val_wl_290
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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Mon Sep 28 12:48:37 2009
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 20:48:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <861194.35455.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Thank you Mr. Mueller!

Question, does that power supply have the dual outputs on it to allow me to hook two chargers to it? It is really convenient to be able to plug banana plugs right into the power supply as I currently do with my Pro Peak. From the looks of it, that is not necessarily designed for "civilized" hobby use. I am looking for something that can power two 1010C chargers with reliable clean power that I can just plug right into, or "Idiot Resistant"?as my momma would say.


________________________________
From: mike mueller <mups1953 at yahoo.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23:19 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Charger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:

> From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> 
> 
> 
>? 
>? 
> 
>? 
> 
>? 
> 
>? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>? 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, 4
> 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.? You
> could add 1 more
> 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> each. ?No, I don?t
> have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> the field <G>. 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> I leave the
> small voltage jumper plug in
> my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> something like 13.4 to
> 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> efficiently. 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September 28, 2009
> 3:20 PM
> 
> To:
> chad at f3acanada.org;
>? General pattern discussion
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion]
> Iota 55 power supply questions 
> 
> 
> 
>? ? 
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with
> Chad 
> - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda?for
> a little more $
> & weight. It will handle (at least)? two Iota
> 55's & 4
> 1010's?as well as a couple of TX battery
> chargers?with no problem.
> (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> outages the 2 kW
> Honda will handle a lot of household items
> also.) 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Earl
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original
> Message -----? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: Chad
> Northeast? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To: General pattern
> discussion? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September
> 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> questions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>? ? 
> 
> 
> 
> Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> handle two 1010's at full rate
> and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> household circuit.
> 
> 
> 
> Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> than around 2.5A
> before you trip it.? If you want to run the Honda to
> the max make sure the
> Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> 
> 
> 
> I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> max power, and the
> Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> something.
> 
> 
> 
>? Chad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> 
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> 
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> To: General pattern discussion 
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> 
> > I am?making?plans to get geared up for next
> season and have a 
> 
> > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> looking to run 
> 
> > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> amp power 
> 
> > supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that
> feasable? Is there any 
> 
> > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> packs at 5 
> 
> > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> buy an 
> 
> > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> power 
> 
> > supply that should be considered?
> 
> > 
> 
> > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> right 
> 
> > stuff the first time.
> 
> > 
> 
> > Thanks in advance
> 
> > Anthony? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>? 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


? ? ? 
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From chadnortheast at shaw.ca  Mon Sep 28 12:51:09 2009
From: chadnortheast at shaw.ca (Chad Northeast)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 20:51:09 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
Message-ID: <d13daa9a1d55.4ac0cd5b@shaw.ca>

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An embedded message was scrubbed...
From: Chad Northeast <chadnortheast at shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: RE: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:50:08 -0600
Size: 31094
URL: <http://lists.nsrca.org/pipermail/nsrca-discussion/attachments/20090928/9b55b061/attachment.mht>

From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Mon Sep 28 12:51:26 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 20:51:26 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <1D8C9F2664EC44058E774E537856D6F3@jaysdesktop>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<1D8C9F2664EC44058E774E537856D6F3@jaysdesktop>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7D6D@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

Primarily because it's unregulated.  Too much draw will pull down the voltage on it.  

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Jay Marshall
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:31 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda will put out
12 V, why the Iota?

Jay Marshall

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Ch
arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
 Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:

> From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> 
> 
> 
>  
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, 4
> 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.? You
> could add 1 more
> 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> each. ?No, I don't
> have 6 1010s...but the 2kw generator is popular at
> the field <G>. 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> I leave the
> small voltage jumper plug in
> my Iotas all the time - bumps output voltage from
> something like 13.4 to
> 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> efficiently. 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September 28, 2009
> 3:20 PM
> 
> To:
> chad at f3acanada.org;
>  General pattern discussion
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion]
> Iota 55 power supply questions 
> 
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with
> Chad 
> - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda?for
> a little more $
> & weight. It will handle (at least)? two Iota
> 55's & 4
> 1010's?as well as a couple of TX battery
> chargers?with no problem.
> (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> outages the 2 kW
> Honda will handle a lot of household items
> also.) 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Earl
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original
> Message -----  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: Chad
> Northeast  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To: General pattern
> discussion  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September
> 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> questions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> 
> 
> Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> handle two 1010's at full rate
> and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> household circuit.
> 
> 
> 
> Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> than around 2.5A
> before you trip it.? If you want to run the Honda to
> the max make sure the
> Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> 
> 
> 
> I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> max power, and the
> Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> something.
> 
> 
> 
>  Chad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> 
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> 
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> To: General pattern discussion 
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> 
> > I am?making?plans to get geared up for next
> season and have a 
> 
> > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> looking to run 
> 
> > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> amp power 
> 
> > supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that
> feasable? Is there any 
> 
> > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> packs at 5 
> 
> > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> buy an 
> 
> > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> power 
> 
> > supply that should be considered?
> 
> > 
> 
> > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> right 
> 
> > stuff the first time.
> 
> > 
> 
> > Thanks in advance
> 
> > Anthony  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.113/2400 - Release Date: 09/28/09 05:51:00

From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Mon Sep 28 13:03:10 2009
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 21:03:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <BAY128-W2672CE7D5444E8DB87E734A0D60@phx.gbl>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<BAY128-W2672CE7D5444E8DB87E734A0D60@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <328230.45569.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I was looking at the 75A model with the built in battery charger but was not sure if the Generator would put out enough juice? I am having the internal debate between the Honda I-2000 and Iota 75A or the Honda I1000 and Iota 55A. It is nice to have the excess capacity and the whole use it at home thing if the lights go out, but the reality is I will rarely use it at home and rarely charge more than two packs at a time. My tendency is to travel light and try to keep the expense down a bit. It's hard when the upgrades are only a little bit more expensive and a little heavier.



________________________________
From: Richard Strickland <pamrich47 at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:45:56 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

What are you going to use at home?? The 110V is cleaner and regulated--there's a better explaination--just don't know it off the top of my head.? Go a few more bucks and get the 75 and?you can run 3 Cell pros full blast--and a fan....
RS?
> From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:30:34 -0400
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda will put out
> 12 V, why the Iota?
> 
> Jay Marshall
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Ch
> arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
> 190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
> Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike
> 
> --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Yes, 4
> > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.? You
> > could add 1 more
> > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> > each. ?No, I don?t
> > have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> > the field <G>. 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > I leave the
> > small voltage jumper plug in
> > my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> > something like 13.4 to
> > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> > efficiently. 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > Dave
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From:
> > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September 28, 2009
> > 3:20 PM
> > 
> > To:
> > chad at f3acanada.org;
> > General pattern discussion
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion]
> > Iota 55 power supply questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I agree with
> > Chad 
> > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda?for
> > a little more $
> > & weight. It will handle (at least)? two Iota
> > 55's & 4
> > 1010's?as well as a couple of TX battery
> > chargers?with no problem.
> > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> > outages the 2 kW
> > Honda will handle a lot of household items
> > also.) 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Earl
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original
> > Message ----- 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From: Chad
> > Northeast 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > To: General pattern
> > discussion 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September
> > 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> > questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> > handle two 1010's at full rate
> > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> > household circuit.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> > than around 2.5A
> > before you trip it.? If you want to run the Honda to
> > the max make sure the
> > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> > max power, and the
> > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> > something.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Chad
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > 
> > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> > 
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> > 
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > 
> > To: General pattern discussion 
> > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > I am?making?plans to get geared up for next
> > season and have a 
> > 
> > > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> > looking to run 
> > 
> > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> > amp power 
> > 
> > > supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that
> > feasable? Is there any 
> > 
> > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> > packs at 5 
> > 
> > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> > buy an 
> > 
> > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> > power 
> > 
> > > supply that should be considered?
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> > right 
> > 
> > > stuff the first time.
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Thanks in advance
> > 
> > > Anthony 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you. 
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From pamrich47 at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 28 13:06:47 2009
From: pamrich47 at hotmail.com (Richard Strickland)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 21:06:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <861194.35455.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BAY128-W2896A1696A3395D3BE7C58A0D60@phx.gbl>


I mounted it on a piece of 1/2" UHMWP with (2)
 1/4 X 20 X 3" flat head screws counter-sunk from the back-side, run permanent wiring to the screws about 5" out, 4-5 " apart--and then you can use your clips for any number/type of chargers. Not particularly sanitary looking, however...

RS 


Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 13:48:35 -0700
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions





Thank you Mr. Mueller!

Question, does that power supply have the dual outputs on it to allow me to hook two chargers to it? It is really convenient to be able to plug banana plugs right into the power supply as I currently do with my Pro Peak. From the looks of it, that is not necessarily designed for "civilized" hobby use. I am looking for something that can power two 1010C chargers with reliable clean power that I can just plug right into, or "Idiot Resistant" as my momma would say.



From: mike mueller <mups1953 at yahoo.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23:19 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Charger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:

> From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> 
> 
> 
>  
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, 4
> 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.  You
> could add 1 more
> 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> each.  No, I don?t
> have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> the field <G>. 
> 
> 
>   
> 
> I leave the
> small voltage jumper plug in
> my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> something like 13.4 to
> 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> efficiently. 
> 
> 
>   
> 
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September 28, 2009
> 3:20 PM
> 
> To:
> chad at f3acanada.org;
>  General pattern discussion
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion]
> Iota 55 power supply questions 
> 
> 
> 
>    
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with
> Chad 
> - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda for
> a little more $
> & weight. It will handle (at least)  two Iota
> 55's & 4
> 1010's as well as a couple of TX battery
> chargers with no problem.
> (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> outages the 2 kW
> Honda will handle a lot of household items
> also.) 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Earl
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original
> Message -----  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: Chad
> Northeast  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To: General pattern
> discussion  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September
> 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> questions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>    
> 
> 
> 
> Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> handle two 1010's at full rate
> and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> household circuit.
> 
> 
> 
> Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> than around 2.5A
> before you trip it.  If you want to run the Honda to
> the max make sure the
> Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> 
> 
> 
> I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> max power, and the
> Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> something.
> 
> 
> 
>  Chad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> 
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> 
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> To: General pattern discussion 
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> 
> > I am making plans to get geared up for next
> season and have a 
> 
> > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> looking to run 
> 
> > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> amp power 
> 
> > supply from a Honda generator. Is that
> feasable? Is there any 
> 
> > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> packs at 5 
> 
> > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> buy an 
> 
> > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> power 
> 
> > supply that should be considered?
> 
> > 
> 
> > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> right 
> 
> > stuff the first time.
> 
> > 
> 
> > Thanks in advance
> 
> > Anthony  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 		 	   		  
_________________________________________________________________
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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Mon Sep 28 13:11:12 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 21:11:12 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <328230.45569.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<BAY128-W2672CE7D5444E8DB87E734A0D60@phx.gbl>
	<328230.45569.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7D72@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

I think if you go look at both units (locally Chagrin Pet and Garden carries them BTW) you?ll see that the 2000 is substantially larger and heavier than the 1000.  Of course since you bench press about 400lbs?you probably have a different definition of ?substantially?.  But for me, the added size and weight was enough to steer me back to the 1000.

-M

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Abdullah
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 5:03 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

I was looking at the 75A model with the built in battery charger but was not sure if the Generator would put out enough juice? I am having the internal debate between the Honda I-2000 and Iota 75A or the Honda I1000 and Iota 55A. It is nice to have the excess capacity and the whole use it at home thing if the lights go out, but the reality is I will rarely use it at home and rarely charge more than two packs at a time. My tendency is to travel light and try to keep the expense down a bit. It's hard when the upgrades are only a little bit more expensive and a little heavier.

________________________________
From: Richard Strickland <pamrich47 at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:45:56 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

What are you going to use at home?  The 110V is cleaner and regulated--there's a better explaination--just don't know it off the top of my head.  Go a few more bucks and get the 75 and you can run 3 Cell pros full blast--and a fan....
RS
> From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:30:34 -0400
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
>
> A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda will put out
> 12 V, why the Iota?
>
> Jay Marshall
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Ch
> arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
> 190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
> Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike
>
> --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yes, 4
> > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.  You
> > could add 1 more
> > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> > each.  No, I don?t
> > have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> > the field <G>.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I leave the
> > small voltage jumper plug in
> > my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> > something like 13.4 to
> > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> > efficiently.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Dave
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > From:
> > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> >
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September 28, 2009
> > 3:20 PM
> >
> > To:
> > chad at f3acanada.org;
> > General pattern discussion
> >
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion]
> > Iota 55 power supply questions
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I agree with
> > Chad
> > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda for
> > a little more $
> > & weight. It will handle (at least)  two Iota
> > 55's & 4
> > 1010's as well as a couple of TX battery
> > chargers with no problem.
> > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> > outages the 2 kW
> > Honda will handle a lot of household items
> > also.)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Earl
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original
> > Message -----
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: Chad
> > Northeast
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > To: General pattern
> > discussion
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September
> > 28, 2009 1:40 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> > questions
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> > handle two 1010's at full rate
> > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> > household circuit.
> >
> >
> >
> > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> > than around 2.5A
> > before you trip it.  If you want to run the Honda to
> > the max make sure the
> > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> >
> >
> >
> > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> > max power, and the
> > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> > something.
> >
> >
> >
> > Chad
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> >
> > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> >
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> >
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> >
> > To: General pattern discussion
> > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> > > I am making plans to get geared up for next
> > season and have a
> >
> > > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> > looking to run
> >
> > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> > amp power
> >
> > > supply from a Honda generator. Is that
> > feasable? Is there any
> >
> > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> > packs at 5
> >
> > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> > buy an
> >
> > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> > power
> >
> > > supply that should be considered?
> >
> > >
> >
> > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> > right
> >
> > > stuff the first time.
> >
> > >
> >
> > > Thanks in advance
> >
> > > Anthony
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> >
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> >
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you.<http://www.microsoft.com/windows/choosepc/?ocid=ftp_val_wl_290>

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From pamrich47 at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 28 13:17:07 2009
From: pamrich47 at hotmail.com (Richard Strickland)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 21:17:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <328230.45569.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<BAY128-W2672CE7D5444E8DB87E734A0D60@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY128-W9FE8D778D3B813C70D89AA0D60@phx.gbl>


I run the 75 with 3 chargers at the home--don't recall for sure if I have tried three at the field.  Maybe once--but I'm only running 4.2 amps per charger. If I were able to fly more, I would charge at the field--but my schedule is so screwed up these days--I don't feel comfortable having charged batts for more than a day or two..  I may think I'm going out the next day--but it might end up several.

RS
 


Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:03:08 -0700
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions





I was looking at the 75A model with the built in battery charger but was not sure if the Generator would put out enough juice? I am having the internal debate between the Honda I-2000 and Iota 75A or the Honda I1000 and Iota 55A. It is nice to have the excess capacity and the whole use it at home thing if the lights go out, but the reality is I will rarely use it at home and rarely charge more than two packs at a time. My tendency is to travel light and try to keep the expense down a bit. It's hard when the upgrades are only a little bit more expensive and a little heavier.




From: Richard Strickland <pamrich47 at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:45:56 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions



What are you going to use at home?  The 110V is cleaner and regulated--there's a better explaination--just don't know it off the top of my head.  Go a few more bucks and get the 75 and you can run 3 Cell pros full blast--and a fan....
RS 
> From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:30:34 -0400
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda will put out
> 12 V, why the Iota?
> 
> Jay Marshall
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Ch
> arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
> 190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
> Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike
> 
> --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Yes, 4
> > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.  You
> > could add 1 more
> > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> > each.  No, I don?t
> > have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> > the field <G>. 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > I leave the
> > small voltage jumper plug in
> > my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> > something like 13.4 to
> > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> > efficiently. 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > Dave
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From:
> > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September 28, 2009
> > 3:20 PM
> > 
> > To:
> > chad at f3acanada.org;
> > General pattern discussion
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion]
> > Iota 55 power supply questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I agree with
> > Chad 
> > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda for
> > a little more $
> > & weight. It will handle (at least)  two Iota
> > 55's & 4
> > 1010's as well as a couple of TX battery
> > chargers with no problem.
> > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> > outages the 2 kW
> > Honda will handle a lot of household items
> > also.) 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Earl
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original
> > Message ----- 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From: Chad
> > Northeast 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > To: General pattern
> > discussion 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September
> > 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> > questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> > handle two 1010's at full rate
> > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> > household circuit.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> > than around 2.5A
> > before you trip it.  If you want to run the Honda to
> > the max make sure the
> > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> > max power, and the
> > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> > something.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Chad
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > 
> > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> > 
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> > 
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > 
> > To: General pattern discussion 
> > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > I am making plans to get geared up for next
> > season and have a 
> > 
> > > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> > looking to run 
> > 
> > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> > amp power 
> > 
> > > supply from a Honda generator. Is that
> > feasable? Is there any 
> > 
> > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> > packs at 5 
> > 
> > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> > buy an 
> > 
> > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> > power 
> > 
> > > supply that should be considered?
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> > right 
> > 
> > > stuff the first time.
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Thanks in advance
> > 
> > > Anthony 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you.  		 	   		  
_________________________________________________________________
Microsoft brings you a new way to search the web.  Try  Bing? now
http://www.bing.com?form=MFEHPG&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MFEHPG_Core_tagline_try bing_1x1
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From BUDDYonRC at aol.com  Mon Sep 28 14:36:28 2009
From: BUDDYonRC at aol.com (BUDDYonRC at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 22:36:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
Message-ID: <c9b.386ce1d9.37f2945f@aol.com>

Brian 
The Cel Pro 10 input is adjustable mainly for charging with a 12  volt 
battery for supply or a low amperage power supply the one that gave  the over 
voltage error signal may be set with a lower input limit. If you  have the PC 
interface you can change a lot of things to suit your fancy as  well as up 
date the system on line.
Buddy
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From jlachow at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 28 15:43:02 2009
From: jlachow at hotmail.com (Joe Lachowski)
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 23:43:02 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <328230.45569.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<BAY128-W2672CE7D5444E8DB87E734A0D60@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <SNT104-W350A6D48B01641E7803DA8BBD60@phx.gbl>


Anthony,

 

If you plan on using 3 or 4 flight packs, one Honda 1000 and Iota 55A is all you need. I take 4 flight packs to the field and only charge one flight pack at a time. I usually don't fly more than 6 flights in a session anyway. So I only charge 2 packs at the field most of the time with 4 sets of batteries. Now with the price of Rhinos and Zippys as they are, you could even go with 6 flight packs and not need a generator at all<g>. You definitely need a minimum of two charger setups though.
 


Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:03:08 -0700
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions





I was looking at the 75A model with the built in battery charger but was not sure if the Generator would put out enough juice? I am having the internal debate between the Honda I-2000 and Iota 75A or the Honda I1000 and Iota 55A. It is nice to have the excess capacity and the whole use it at home thing if the lights go out, but the reality is I will rarely use it at home and rarely charge more than two packs at a time. My tendency is to travel light and try to keep the expense down a bit. It's hard when the upgrades are only a little bit more expensive and a little heavier.




From: Richard Strickland <pamrich47 at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:45:56 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions



What are you going to use at home?  The 110V is cleaner and regulated--there's a better explaination--just don't know it off the top of my head.  Go a few more bucks and get the 75 and you can run 3 Cell pros full blast--and a fan....
RS 
> From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:30:34 -0400
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda will put out
> 12 V, why the Iota?
> 
> Jay Marshall
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Ch
> arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
> 190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
> Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike
> 
> --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Yes, 4
> > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.  You
> > could add 1 more
> > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> > each.  No, I don?t
> > have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> > the field <G>. 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > I leave the
> > small voltage jumper plug in
> > my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> > something like 13.4 to
> > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> > efficiently. 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > Dave
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From:
> > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September 28, 2009
> > 3:20 PM
> > 
> > To:
> > chad at f3acanada.org;
> > General pattern discussion
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion]
> > Iota 55 power supply questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I agree with
> > Chad 
> > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda for
> > a little more $
> > & weight. It will handle (at least)  two Iota
> > 55's & 4
> > 1010's as well as a couple of TX battery
> > chargers with no problem.
> > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> > outages the 2 kW
> > Honda will handle a lot of household items
> > also.) 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Earl
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original
> > Message ----- 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From: Chad
> > Northeast 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > To: General pattern
> > discussion 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September
> > 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> > questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> > handle two 1010's at full rate
> > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> > household circuit.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> > than around 2.5A
> > before you trip it.  If you want to run the Honda to
> > the max make sure the
> > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> > max power, and the
> > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> > something.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Chad
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > 
> > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> > 
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> > 
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > 
> > To: General pattern discussion 
> > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > I am making plans to get geared up for next
> > season and have a 
> > 
> > > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> > looking to run 
> > 
> > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> > amp power 
> > 
> > > supply from a Honda generator. Is that
> > feasable? Is there any 
> > 
> > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> > packs at 5 
> > 
> > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> > buy an 
> > 
> > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> > power 
> > 
> > > supply that should be considered?
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> > right 
> > 
> > > stuff the first time.
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Thanks in advance
> > 
> > > Anthony 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you.  		 	   		  
_________________________________________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/choosepc/?ocid=ftp_val_wl_290
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From tschmidt at classicnet.net  Mon Sep 28 16:18:06 2009
From: tschmidt at classicnet.net (Todd Schmidt)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 00:18:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon
In-Reply-To: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>
References: <007501ca3fd4$32cad250$6a00a8c0@warrior>
Message-ID: <010C390E5445491A94FD6F4B9604BB56@OwnerPC>

Thanks everyone, it was great to have you all here in good ole Bourbon Co. (Fort Scott Ks.) I really appreciate all of you for coming and our club enjoyed having you here too. 

Thanks again!!
Todd
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Dan 
  To: NSRCA Mailing List 
  Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2009 5:39 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bourbon


  Just a shout out to Todd Schmidt (CD) and the Bourbon County (gotta love that name) RC Club, in Ft. Scott, KS.  Their contest was held this weekend and it was just as much fun this year as all the years in the past.  A small club with a huge amount of hospitality.  It is great to fly at a club that seems to really enjoy all of us being there.  Great job BBRC and great work Todd.

  Try to put this event on your calenders for next season, I am betting you won't regret it one bit.

  Dan Curtis


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From wemodels at cox.net  Mon Sep 28 16:42:20 2009
From: wemodels at cox.net (Bill's Email)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 00:42:20 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <SNT104-W350A6D48B01641E7803DA8BBD60@phx.gbl>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>	<BAY128-W2672CE7D5444E8DB87E734A0D60@phx.gbl>
	<SNT104-W350A6D48B01641E7803DA8BBD60@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <4AC157EA.7090505@cox.net>

I run two Hyperion DUO chargers each charging two 5S 5300 packs at 5.3 
amps with a single Iota 55. Works great. I like the DUOs since they do 
two packs at a time, have 20 memory positions, and the new ones can do 
up to 15 amps per side.


 




From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 28 17:27:49 2009
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 01:27:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <861194.35455.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <598735.47902.qm@web51004.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

 You need to use a y connector that you make up for 2 chargers. It's as simple as you'll look at it and know what to do. They are always sold on Ebay at the best prices. Mike

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net> wrote:

> From: Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 3:48 PM
> Thank you Mr. Mueller!
> 
> Question, does that power supply have
> the dual outputs on it to allow me to hook two chargers to
> it? It is really convenient to be able to plug banana plugs
> right into the power supply as I currently do with my Pro
> Peak. From the looks of it, that is not necessarily designed
> for "civilized" hobby use. I am looking for
> something that can power two 1010C chargers with reliable
> clean power that I can just plug right into, or "Idiot
> Resistant"?as my momma would say.
> 
> 
> 
> From: mike
> mueller <mups1953 at yahoo.com>
> To: General
> pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Monday,
> September 28, 2009 4:23:19 PM
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Charger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
> Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge
> Bob, Mike
> 
> --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> wrote:
> 
> > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> questions
> > To: "'General pattern discussion'"
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? 
> >? 
> > 
> >? 
> > 
> >? 
> > 
> >? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Yes, 4
> > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw
> Honda.? You
> > could add 1 more
> > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left
> for
> > each. ?No, I don?t
> > have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> > the field <G>. 
> > 
> >
>  
> > ? 
> > 
> > I leave the
> > small voltage jumper plug in
> > my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> > something like 13.4 to
> > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> > efficiently. 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > Dave
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From:
> > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]
> On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> >
>  September 28, 2009
> > 3:20 PM
> > 
> > To:
> > chad at f3acanada.org;
> >? General pattern discussion
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion]
> > Iota 55 power supply questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I agree with
> > Chad 
> > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW
> Honda?for
> > a little more $
> > & weight. It will handle (at least)? two
> Iota
> > 55's & 4
> > 1010's?as well as a couple of TX battery
> > chargers?with no problem.
> > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional
> power
> > outages the 2 kW
> > Honda will handle a lot of household items
> > also.) 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Earl
> >
>  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original
> > Message -----? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From: Chad
> > Northeast? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > To: General pattern
> > discussion? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September
> > 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> > questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> > handle two 1010's at full rate
> > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into
> a
> > household circuit.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to
> more
> > than around 2.5A
> > before you trip
>  it.? If you want to run the Honda to
> > the max make sure the
> > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of
> it.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get
> its
> > max power, and the
> > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> > something.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? Chad
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > 
> > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net
> >
> > 
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> > 
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> questions
> > 
> > To: General pattern discussion 
> > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > 
> >
>  
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > I am?making?plans to get geared up for
> next
> > season and have a 
> > 
> > > few questions about power supplies and such. I
> am
> > looking to run 
> > 
> > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota
> 55
> > amp power 
> > 
> > > supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that
> > feasable? Is there any 
> > 
> > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S
> 5000
> > packs at 5 
> > 
> > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best
> place to
> > buy an 
> > 
> > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of
> that
> > power 
> > 
> > > supply that should be considered?
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to
> get the
> > right 
> > 
> > > stuff the first time.
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Thanks in
>  advance
> > 
> > > Anthony? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> >
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> ? ? ? 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      

From ahrensw at charter.net  Mon Sep 28 17:57:28 2009
From: ahrensw at charter.net (Bill Ahrens)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 01:57:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] New in sealed box AXI 5330 F3A motor for Sale
In-Reply-To: <BLU106-W4A888878F90045D4DC2D6CDD60@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU106-W4A888878F90045D4DC2D6CDD60@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <00e401ca40a8$26570140$730503c0$@net>

For Sale new in sealed box AXI 5330 F3A motor.  200.00 plus shipping.

 

Please contact me if interested.

 

Thanks,

Bill Ahrens 

NSRCA 619

 

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From verne at twmi.rr.com  Mon Sep 28 18:29:00 2009
From: verne at twmi.rr.com (Verne Koester)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 02:29:00 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <833418.98479.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <992293.14700.qm@web112614.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<833418.98479.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <00b701ca40ac$a38efc90$eaacf5b0$@rr.com>

That is the exact setup I ran two seasons ago. No problems, it'll do what
you want to do. I got both the Iota and the Honda off of E-Bay.

 

Verne

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony
Abdullah
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 2:31 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

 


I am making plans to get geared up for next season and have a few questions
about power supplies and such. I am looking to run two Thunder Power 1010C
chargers off of one Iota 55 amp power supply from a Honda generator. Is that
feasable? Is there any reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
packs at 5 amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to buy an
Iota power supply? Are their different models of that power supply that
should be considered?

 

Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the right stuff the first
time.

 

Thanks in advance

Anthony

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From verne at twmi.rr.com  Mon Sep 28 18:50:38 2009
From: verne at twmi.rr.com (Verne Koester)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 02:50:38 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <861194.35455.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<861194.35455.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <00bc01ca40af$acfd3410$06f79c30$@rr.com>

The Iota only has one positive and one negative post. I cut two strips of K&S brass about ? wide, .090 thick, and two inches long to make two lugs (one positive and one negative) similar to what you plug into a typical 110v wall outlet. On one end of each of those lugs, I soldered the wires directly from my chargers, pos to pos and neg to neg plus an additional wire for an auxiliary banana plug outlet. Then I put heat shrink over the wires and solder joint so there was just enough bare brass showing to insert into each of the outputs from the Iota. The Iota has set screws that clamp down onto the brass strips. Works fine. When you get your Iota, this explanation will make sense. If you want a more ?flexible? setup, you could go with all banana jacks to facilitate plugging and unplugging your chargers as you choose. If I had to remove mine for repairs or whatever, I?d have to unsolder the connections. Haven?t had the need so far with either the 1010?s or the CellPros.

 

Verne

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Abdullah
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:49 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

 

Thank you Mr. Mueller!

Question, does that power supply have the dual outputs on it to allow me to hook two chargers to it? It is really convenient to be able to plug banana plugs right into the power supply as I currently do with my Pro Peak. From the looks of it, that is not necessarily designed for "civilized" hobby use. I am looking for something that can power two 1010C chargers with reliable clean power that I can just plug right into, or "Idiot Resistant" as my momma would say.

  _____  

From: mike mueller <mups1953 at yahoo.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23:19 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Charger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:

> From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> 
> 
> 
>  
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, 4
> 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.  You
> could add 1 more
> 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> each.  No, I don?t
> have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> the field <G>. 
> 
> 
>   
> 
> I leave the
> small voltage jumper plug in
> my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> something like 13.4 to
> 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> efficiently. 
> 
> 
>   
> 
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September 28, 2009
> 3:20 PM
> 
> To:
> chad at f3acanada.org;
>  General pattern discussion
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion]
> Iota 55 power supply questions 
> 
> 
> 
>    
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with
> Chad 
> - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda for
> a little more $
> & weight. It will handle (at least)  two Iota
> 55's & 4
> 1010's as well as a couple of TX battery
> chargers with no problem.
> (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> outages the 2 kW
> Honda will handle a lot of household items
> also.) 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Earl
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original
> Message -----  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: Chad
> Northeast  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To: General pattern
> discussion  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September
> 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> questions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>    
> 
> 
> 
> Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> handle two 1010's at full rate
> and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> household circuit.
> 
> 
> 
> Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> than around 2.5A
> before you trip it.  If you want to run the Honda to
> the max make sure the
> Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> 
> 
> 
> I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> max power, and the
> Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> something.
> 
> 
> 
>  Chad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> 
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> 
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> To: General pattern discussion 
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> 
> > I am making plans to get geared up for next
> season and have a 
> 
> > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> looking to run 
> 
> > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> amp power 
> 
> > supply from a Honda generator. Is that
> feasable? Is there any 
> 
> > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> packs at 5 
> 
> > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> buy an 
> 
> > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> power 
> 
> > supply that should be considered?
> 
> > 
> 
> > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> right 
> 
> > stuff the first time.
> 
> > 
> 
> > Thanks in advance
> 
> > Anthony  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From cjm767driver at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 28 19:01:48 2009
From: cjm767driver at hotmail.com (Chris Moon)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 03:01:48 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <00bc01ca40af$acfd3410$06f79c30$@rr.com>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>	<861194.35455.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<00bc01ca40af$acfd3410$06f79c30$@rr.com>
Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP2752B70B20B69FDC80457383D50@phx.gbl>

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From perkinsrx at centurytel.net  Mon Sep 28 21:04:21 2009
From: perkinsrx at centurytel.net (Eddie Batchelor P.D.)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 05:04:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <BLU0-SMTP2752B70B20B69FDC80457383D50@phx.gbl>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>	<861194.35455.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com><00bc01ca40af$acfd3410$06f79c30$@rr.com>
	<BLU0-SMTP2752B70B20B69FDC80457383D50@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <D0C75895F1224472B392416F0679D3C1@EddieLapTopPC>

On that note about banana plugs. I use Power Pole plugs on all my chargers. I have 3 sets coming off the brass posts on the Iota55.

If I was doing it over I would come directly off the Iota to a RigRunner with power pole connectors.

Eddie
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Chris Moon 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 10:01 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions


  Just to add something here, most banana jacks from Radio Shack are rated at 10 amps and that is light considering the charger running at 5amps output into a 10S pack will be drawing 22-25 amps from the power supply. And if you use the Iota as a battery charger for a deep cycle some time (it's other designed purpose), it will output up to it's rated current (55amps) if needed, which will make your banana jacks into a melted blob.  Don't ask me how I found out....
  I do use banana jacks and found some rated at 15amps which work for the 22amp charger current ok.

  Chris

  Verne Koester wrote: 
    The Iota only has one positive and one negative post. I cut two strips of K&S brass about ? wide, .090 thick, and two inches long to make two lugs (one positive and one negative) similar to what you plug into a typical 110v wall outlet. On one end of each of those lugs, I soldered the wires directly from my chargers, pos to pos and neg to neg plus an additional wire for an auxiliary banana plug outlet. Then I put heat shrink over the wires and solder joint so there was just enough bare brass showing to insert into each of the outputs from the Iota. The Iota has set screws that clamp down onto the brass strips. Works fine. When you get your Iota, this explanation will make sense. If you want a more ?flexible? setup, you could go with all banana jacks to facilitate plugging and unplugging your chargers as you choose. If I had to remove mine for repairs or whatever, I?d have to unsolder the connections. Haven?t had the need so far with either the 1010?s or the CellPros.



    Verne



    From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Abdullah
    Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:49 PM
    To: General pattern discussion
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions



    Thank you Mr. Mueller!

    Question, does that power supply have the dual outputs on it to allow me to hook two chargers to it? It is really convenient to be able to plug banana plugs right into the power supply as I currently do with my Pro Peak. From the looks of it, that is not necessarily designed for "civilized" hobby use. I am looking for something that can power two 1010C chargers with reliable clean power that I can just plug right into, or "Idiot Resistant" as my momma would say.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    From: mike mueller <mups1953 at yahoo.com>
    To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
    Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23:19 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Charger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
    Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike

    --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:

    > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
    > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
    > To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
    > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
    > 
    > 
    > 
    >  
    >  
    > 
    >  
    > 
    >  
    > 
    >  
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    >  
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > Yes, 4
    > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
    > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.  You
    > could add 1 more
    > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
    > each.  No, I don?t
    > have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
    > the field <G>. 
    > 
    > 
    >   
    > 
    > I leave the
    > small voltage jumper plug in
    > my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
    > something like 13.4 to
    > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
    > efficiently. 
    > 
    > 
    >   
    > 
    > Dave
    > 
    > 
    > 
    >   
    > 
    > 
    >   
    > 
    > 
    >   
    > 
    > 
    >   
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > From:
    > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
    > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
    > 
    > Sent: Monday,
    > September 28, 2009
    > 3:20 PM
    > 
    > To:
    > chad at f3acanada.org;
    >  General pattern discussion
    > 
    > Subject: Re:
    > [NSRCA-discussion]
    > Iota 55 power supply questions 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    >    
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > I agree with
    > Chad 
    > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda for
    > a little more $
    > & weight. It will handle (at least)  two Iota
    > 55's & 4
    > 1010's as well as a couple of TX battery
    > chargers with no problem.
    > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
    > outages the 2 kW
    > Honda will handle a lot of household items
    > also.) 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    >   
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > Earl
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > ----- Original
    > Message -----  
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > From: Chad
    > Northeast  
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > To: General pattern
    > discussion  
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > Sent: Monday,
    > September
    > 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > Subject: Re:
    > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
    > questions 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    >    
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
    > handle two 1010's at full rate
    > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
    > household circuit.
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
    > than around 2.5A
    > before you trip it.  If you want to run the Honda to
    > the max make sure the
    > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
    > max power, and the
    > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
    > something.
    > 
    > 
    > 
    >  Chad
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > ----- Original Message -----
    > 
    > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
    > 
    > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
    > 
    > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
    > 
    > To: General pattern discussion 
    > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > > 
    > 
    > > I am making plans to get geared up for next
    > season and have a 
    > 
    > > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
    > looking to run 
    > 
    > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
    > amp power 
    > 
    > > supply from a Honda generator. Is that
    > feasable? Is there any 
    > 
    > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
    > packs at 5 
    > 
    > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
    > buy an 
    > 
    > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
    > power 
    > 
    > > supply that should be considered?
    > 
    > > 
    > 
    > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
    > right 
    > 
    > > stuff the first time.
    > 
    > > 
    > 
    > > Thanks in advance
    > 
    > > Anthony  
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > _______________________________________________
    > 
    > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    > 
    > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    > 
    > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    >  
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
    > 
    > _______________________________________________
    > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


          
    _______________________________________________
    NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net  Mon Sep 28 21:09:45 2009
From: pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net (Ihncheol Park)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 05:09:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR long gimbal stick
In-Reply-To: <SNT104-W350A6D48B01641E7803DA8BBD60@phx.gbl>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>	<BAY128-W2672CE7D5444E8DB87E734A0D60@phx.gbl>
	<SNT104-W350A6D48B01641E7803DA8BBD60@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <000601ca40c3$0e1136d0$2a33a470$@net>

Does anyone know how long is the JRPA146 long gimbal stick for JR 12X?

Does 12X has different diameter for gimbal stick?

Trying to figure out if it fits on 9303.  

 

Thanks,

 

Ihncheol

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From bob at toprudder.com  Tue Sep 29 03:15:21 2009
From: bob at toprudder.com (Bob Richards)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 11:15:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <BLU0-SMTP2752B70B20B69FDC80457383D50@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <225024.61677.qm@web1115.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>

I have seen banana jacks rated for > 20A. I will try to find a link when I get a chance.
?
Of course, you could wire them with Deans connectors as well.


--- On Tue, 9/29/09, Chris Moon <cjm767driver at hotmail.com> wrote:


From: Chris Moon <cjm767driver at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 29, 2009, 12:01 AM


Just to add something here, most banana jacks from Radio Shack are rated at 10 amps and that is light considering the charger running at 5amps output into a 10S pack will be drawing 22-25 amps from the power supply. And if you use the Iota as a battery charger for a deep cycle some time (it's other designed purpose), it will output up to it's rated current (55amps) if needed, which will make your banana jacks into a melted blob.? Don't ask me how I found out....
I do use banana jacks and found some rated at 15amps which work for the 22amp charger current ok.

Chris

Verne Koester wrote: 






The Iota only has one positive and one negative post. I cut two strips of K&S brass about ? wide, .090 thick, and two inches long to make two lugs (one positive and one negative) similar to what you plug into a typical 110v wall outlet. On one end of each of those lugs, I soldered the wires directly from my chargers, pos to pos and neg to neg plus an additional wire for an auxiliary banana plug outlet. Then I put heat shrink over the wires and solder joint so there was just enough bare brass showing to insert into each of the outputs from the Iota. The Iota has set screws that clamp down onto the brass strips. Works fine. When you get your Iota, this explanation will make sense. If you want a more ?flexible? setup, you could go with all banana jacks to facilitate plugging and unplugging your chargers as you choose. If I had to remove mine for repairs or whatever, I?d have to unsolder the connections. Haven?t had the need so far with either the
 1010?s or the CellPros.
?
Verne
?


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Abdullah
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:49 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
?


Thank you Mr. Mueller!

Question, does that power supply have the dual outputs on it to allow me to hook two chargers to it? It is really convenient to be able to plug banana plugs right into the power supply as I currently do with my Pro Peak. From the looks of it, that is not necessarily designed for "civilized" hobby use. I am looking for something that can power two 1010C chargers with reliable clean power that I can just plug right into, or "Idiot Resistant"?as my momma would say.




From: mike mueller <mups1953 at yahoo.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23:19 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Charger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:

> From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> 
> 
> 
>? 
>? 
> 
>? 
> 
>? 
> 
>? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>? 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, 4
> 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.? You
> could add 1 more
> 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> each. ?No, I don?t
> have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> the field <G>. 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> I leave the
> small voltage jumper plug in
> my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> something like 13.4 to
> 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> efficiently. 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September 28, 2009
> 3:20 PM
> 
> To:
> chad at f3acanada.org;
>? General pattern discussion
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion]
> Iota 55 power supply questions 
> 
> 
> 
>? ? 
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with
> Chad 
> - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda?for
> a little more $
> & weight. It will handle (at least)? two Iota
> 55's & 4
> 1010's?as well as a couple of TX battery
> chargers?with no problem.
> (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> outages the 2 kW
> Honda will handle a lot of household items
> also.) 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Earl
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original
> Message -----? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: Chad
> Northeast? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To: General pattern
> discussion? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent: Monday,
> September
> 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> questions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>? ? 
> 
> 
> 
> Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> handle two 1010's at full rate
> and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> household circuit.
> 
> 
> 
> Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> than around 2.5A
> before you trip it.? If you want to run the Honda to
> the max make sure the
> Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> 
> 
> 
> I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> max power, and the
> Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> something.
> 
> 
> 
>? Chad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> 
> Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> 
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> To: General pattern discussion 
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> 
> > I am?making?plans to get geared up for next
> season and have a 
> 
> > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> looking to run 
> 
> > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> amp power 
> 
> > supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that
> feasable? Is there any 
> 
> > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> packs at 5 
> 
> > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> buy an 
> 
> > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> power 
> 
> > supply that should be considered?
> 
> > 
> 
> > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> right 
> 
> > stuff the first time.
> 
> > 
> 
> > Thanks in advance
> 
> > Anthony? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>? 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


? ? ? 
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jzeigenfus at comcast.net  Tue Sep 29 04:17:31 2009
From: jzeigenfus at comcast.net (jzeigenfus at comcast.net)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 12:17:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR long gimbal stick
In-Reply-To: <000601ca40c3$0e1136d0$2a33a470$@net>
Message-ID: <980675221.8372341254226648519.JavaMail.root@sz0093a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>

I am using the long gimbals for the 12x. they are the same length as the ones for a 9303 but are a different diameter for connecting to the TX. You cannot mix a match the two types of gimbals for the TX's. JEZ 


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ihncheol Park" <pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 1:09:41 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern 
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR long gimbal stick 




Does anyone know how long is the JRPA146 long gimbal stick for JR 12X? 

Does 12X has different diameter for gimbal stick? 

Trying to figure out if it fits on 9303. 



Thanks, 



Ihncheol 
_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Tue Sep 29 05:21:19 2009
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 13:21:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <SNT104-W350A6D48B01641E7803DA8BBD60@phx.gbl>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<BAY128-W2672CE7D5444E8DB87E734A0D60@phx.gbl>
	<SNT104-W350A6D48B01641E7803DA8BBD60@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <182102.91649.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

That is kind of the plan. I plan to have 5 packs and two charger set ups. If I show up at the field with 5 charged packs and two full charger setups I might be able to get in enough practice flights to move from the bottom to near the bottom in advanced ;o) Now all I have to do is find a way to work only 4 hours a day so I can fly every afternoon! Not bloody likely.

Fly, Charge, Repeat!



________________________________
From: Joe Lachowski <jlachow at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA Discussion List <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 7:43:01 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

Anthony,
?
If you?plan on using?3 or 4 flight packs,?one Honda 1000 and Iota 55A is all you need. I take 4 flight packs to the field and only charge one?flight pack at a time.?I usually don't fly more than 6 flights in a session anyway. So I only charge?2 packs at the field most of the time with 4 sets of batteries. Now with the price of Rhinos and Zippys as they are, you could even go with 6 flight packs and not need a generator at all<g>. You definitely need?a minimum of two charger setups though.
?
________________________________
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:03:08 -0700
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions


I was looking at the 75A model with the built in battery charger but was not sure if the Generator would put out enough juice? I am having the internal debate between the Honda I-2000 and Iota 75A or the Honda I1000 and Iota 55A. It is nice to have the excess capacity and the whole use it at home thing if the lights go out, but the reality is I will rarely use it at home and rarely charge more than two packs at a time. My tendency is to travel light and try to keep the expense down a bit. It's hard when the upgrades are only a little bit more expensive and a little heavier.



________________________________
From: Richard Strickland <pamrich47 at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:45:56 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

What are you going to use at home?? The 110V is cleaner and regulated--there's a better explaination--just don't know it off the top of my head.? Go a few more bucks and get the 75 and?you can run 3 Cell pros full blast--and a fan....
RS?
> From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:30:34 -0400
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda will put out
> 12 V, why the Iota?
> 
> Jay Marshall
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Ch
> arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
> 190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
> Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike
> 
> --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Yes, 4
> > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.? You
> > could add 1 more
> > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> > each. ?No, I don?t
> > have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> > the field <G>. 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > I leave the
> > small voltage jumper plug in
> > my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> > something like 13.4 to
> > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> > efficiently. 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > Dave
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From:
> > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September 28, 2009
> > 3:20 PM
> > 
> > To:
> > chad at f3acanada.org;
> > General pattern discussion
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion]
> > Iota 55 power supply questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I agree with
> > Chad 
> > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda?for
> > a little more $
> > & weight. It will handle (at least)? two Iota
> > 55's & 4
> > 1010's?as well as a couple of TX battery
> > chargers?with no problem.
> > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> > outages the 2 kW
> > Honda will handle a lot of household items
> > also.) 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Earl
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original
> > Message ----- 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From: Chad
> > Northeast 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > To: General pattern
> > discussion 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September
> > 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> > questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> > handle two 1010's at full rate
> > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> > household circuit.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> > than around 2.5A
> > before you trip it.? If you want to run the Honda to
> > the max make sure the
> > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> > max power, and the
> > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> > something.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Chad
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > 
> > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> > 
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> > 
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > 
> > To: General pattern discussion 
> > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > I am?making?plans to get geared up for next
> > season and have a 
> > 
> > > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> > looking to run 
> > 
> > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> > amp power 
> > 
> > > supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that
> > feasable? Is there any 
> > 
> > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> > packs at 5 
> > 
> > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> > buy an 
> > 
> > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> > power 
> > 
> > > supply that should be considered?
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> > right 
> > 
> > > stuff the first time.
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Thanks in advance
> > 
> > > Anthony 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you. 
________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you. 
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From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Tue Sep 29 05:57:24 2009
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 13:57:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D6 Contest this Weekend!
Message-ID: <20090929085722.9B4SE.777817.root@Web03>

Hello D6!

I hope that everyone is planning to come to the Gulf coast Pattern Championship this weekend in Sulphur, LA.    It looks like the weather is going to cooperate with temps from 70 to low 80s and a low chance of rain showers.  Winds are predicted to be light.


The field is open all week if you want to come early and practice.  

If you haven't responded to my RC Universe thread and are planning to come, drop me a note so I can pre enter you in the Scoring program.

glmiller3 at suddenlink.net

directions and local info are on our web site at:

www.larksrc.org

See you all there!

George



From ejhaury at comcast.net  Tue Sep 29 06:01:57 2009
From: ejhaury at comcast.net (Earl Haury)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 14:01:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <182102.91649.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com><BAY128-W2672CE7D5444E8DB87E734A0D60@phx.gbl><SNT104-W350A6D48B01641E7803DA8BBD60@phx.gbl>
	<182102.91649.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <E489C349C80C4EC9A2FBE4A05245C49E@EarlPC>

Anthony

An approach to practice worth considering is quality vs. quantity - fewer flights with more focus.

Earl
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Anthony Abdullah 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:21 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions


  That is kind of the plan. I plan to have 5 packs and two charger set ups. If I show up at the field with 5 charged packs and two full charger setups I might be able to get in enough practice flights to move from the bottom to near the bottom in advanced ;o) Now all I have to do is find a way to work only 4 hours a day so I can fly every afternoon! Not bloody likely.

  Fly, Charge, Repeat!



------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: Joe Lachowski <jlachow at hotmail.com>
  To: NSRCA Discussion List <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 7:43:01 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

  Anthony,
   
  If you plan on using 3 or 4 flight packs, one Honda 1000 and Iota 55A is all you need. I take 4 flight packs to the field and only charge one flight pack at a time. I usually don't fly more than 6 flights in a session anyway. So I only charge 2 packs at the field most of the time with 4 sets of batteries. Now with the price of Rhinos and Zippys as they are, you could even go with 6 flight packs and not need a generator at all<g>. You definitely need a minimum of two charger setups though.
   

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:03:08 -0700
  From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net
  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions


  I was looking at the 75A model with the built in battery charger but was not sure if the Generator would put out enough juice? I am having the internal debate between the Honda I-2000 and Iota 75A or the Honda I1000 and Iota 55A. It is nice to have the excess capacity and the whole use it at home thing if the lights go out, but the reality is I will rarely use it at home and rarely charge more than two packs at a time. My tendency is to travel light and try to keep the expense down a bit. It's hard when the upgrades are only a little bit more expensive and a little heavier.



------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: Richard Strickland <pamrich47 at hotmail.com>
  To: NSRCA <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:45:56 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

  What are you going to use at home?  The 110V is cleaner and regulated--there's a better explaination--just don't know it off the top of my head.  Go a few more bucks and get the 75 and you can run 3 Cell pros full blast--and a fan....
  RS 
  > From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com
  > To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  > Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:30:34 -0400
  > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
  > 
  > A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda will put out
  > 12 V, why the Iota?
  > 
  > Jay Marshall
  > 
  > -----Original Message-----
  > From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
  > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
  > Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
  > To: General pattern discussion
  > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
  > 
  > http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Ch
  > arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
  > 190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
  > Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike
  > 
  > --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:
  > 
  > > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
  > > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
  > > To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  > > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > Yes, 4
  > > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
  > > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.  You
  > > could add 1 more
  > > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
  > > each.  No, I don?t
  > > have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
  > > the field <G>. 
  > > 
  > > 
  > >   
  > > 
  > > I leave the
  > > small voltage jumper plug in
  > > my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
  > > something like 13.4 to
  > > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
  > > efficiently. 
  > > 
  > > 
  > >   
  > > 
  > > Dave
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > >   
  > > 
  > > 
  > >   
  > > 
  > > 
  > >   
  > > 
  > > 
  > >   
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > From:
  > > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
  > > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
  > > 
  > > Sent: Monday,
  > > September 28, 2009
  > > 3:20 PM
  > > 
  > > To:
  > > chad at f3acanada.org;
  > > General pattern discussion
  > > 
  > > Subject: Re:
  > > [NSRCA-discussion]
  > > Iota 55 power supply questions 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > >   
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > I agree with
  > > Chad 
  > > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda for
  > > a little more $
  > > & weight. It will handle (at least)  two Iota
  > > 55's & 4
  > > 1010's as well as a couple of TX battery
  > > chargers with no problem.
  > > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
  > > outages the 2 kW
  > > Honda will handle a lot of household items
  > > also.) 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > >   
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > Earl
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > ----- Original
  > > Message ----- 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > From: Chad
  > > Northeast 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > To: General pattern
  > > discussion 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > Sent: Monday,
  > > September
  > > 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > Subject: Re:
  > > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
  > > questions 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > >   
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
  > > handle two 1010's at full rate
  > > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
  > > household circuit.
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
  > > than around 2.5A
  > > before you trip it.  If you want to run the Honda to
  > > the max make sure the
  > > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
  > > max power, and the
  > > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
  > > something.
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > Chad
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > ----- Original Message -----
  > > 
  > > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
  > > 
  > > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
  > > 
  > > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
  > > 
  > > To: General pattern discussion 
  > > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > > 
  > > 
  > > > I am making plans to get geared up for next
  > > season and have a 
  > > 
  > > > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
  > > looking to run 
  > > 
  > > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
  > > amp power 
  > > 
  > > > supply from a Honda generator. Is that
  > > feasable? Is there any 
  > > 
  > > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
  > > packs at 5 
  > > 
  > > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
  > > buy an 
  > > 
  > > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
  > > power 
  > > 
  > > > supply that should be considered?
  > > 
  > > > 
  > > 
  > > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
  > > right 
  > > 
  > > > stuff the first time.
  > > 
  > > > 
  > > 
  > > > Thanks in advance
  > > 
  > > > Anthony 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > _______________________________________________
  > > 
  > > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  > > 
  > > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  > > 
  > > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > 
  > > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
  > > 
  > > _______________________________________________
  > > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  > > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  > > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  > 
  > 
  > 
  > _______________________________________________
  > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  > 
  > _______________________________________________
  > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you. 


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you. 


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
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  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From tony at radiosouthrc.com  Tue Sep 29 07:28:49 2009
From: tony at radiosouthrc.com (Tony)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 15:28:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman/District 3 champs
Message-ID: <3F0D839C0E584814BCD0146F9C3DEB53@Tony>

I want to thank all the pilots and helpers that came out for the District
Champs last weekend in Jacksonville, FL.  While we only had 22 contestants,
we still had a great time.  The weather cooperated (just a short rain shower
late Saturday) and we got in lots of good flying.  

It was great seeing everyone again, and I sure hope to get back to some
pattern flying in 2010.  If I can just get our local club to do some work on
the runway so I don't rip out the gear in my Brio every time!!!!

 

 

 

Tony Stillman, President

Radio South, Inc.

139 Altama Connector, Box 322

Brunswick, GA  31525

1-800-962-7802

www.radiosouthrc.com

 

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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Tue Sep 29 09:43:03 2009
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 17:43:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <E489C349C80C4EC9A2FBE4A05245C49E@EarlPC>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com><BAY128-W2672CE7D5444E8DB87E734A0D60@phx.gbl><SNT104-W350A6D48B01641E7803DA8BBD60@phx.gbl>
	<182102.91649.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<E489C349C80C4EC9A2FBE4A05245C49E@EarlPC>
Message-ID: <856729.48733.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Earl,
That is a very good point. I can only focus for so many flights during a practice session. Unfortunately with the shorter E flight times I still have to get in almost twice as many flights as I normally would with glow to get through the sequence the same number of times. I can get through the sequence twice with a little time left over flying glow, with my electric set up I can get through once plus a couple of extra maneuvers. So air time will be similar doing 5 glow flights or 10 electric flights. For those flights I need to show up with charged?packs then get?at least a couple of them back on the charger once they are used.?

The great thing about the pattern group we have growing in our area is that we get a great rotation going so it never feels like I am just flying back to back to back. When my turn to fly comes up I am excited about it and have had enough time to think about what I did poorly the last flight. I take off focused with two to three experienced pattern pilots watching to critique my performance.


________________________________
From: Earl Haury <ejhaury at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:01:27 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

? 
Anthony
?
An approach to practice worth considering is quality vs. quantity - fewer flights with?more focus.
?
Earl
----- Original Message ----- 
>From: Anthony Abdullah 
>To: General pattern discussion 
>Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:21 AM
>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
>
>
>That is kind of the plan. I plan to have 5 packs and two charger set ups. If I show up at the field with 5 charged packs and two full charger setups I might be able to get in enough practice flights to move from the bottom to near the bottom in advanced ;o) Now all I have to do is find a way to work only 4 hours a day so I can fly every afternoon! Not bloody likely.
>
>Fly, Charge, Repeat!
>
>
>
________________________________
From: Joe Lachowski <jlachow at hotmail.com>
>To: NSRCA Discussion List <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 7:43:01 PM
>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
>
>Anthony,
>?
>If you?plan on using?3 or 4 flight packs,?one Honda 1000 and Iota 55A is all you need. I take 4 flight packs to the field and only charge one?flight pack at a time.?I usually don't fly more than 6 flights in a session anyway. So I only charge?2 packs at the field most of the time with 4 sets of batteries. Now with the price of Rhinos and Zippys as they are, you could even go with 6 flight packs and not need a generator at all<g>. You definitely need?a minimum of two charger setups though.
>?
>________________________________
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:03:08 -0700
>From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net
>To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
>
>
>I was looking at the 75A model with the built in battery charger but was not sure if the Generator would put out enough juice? I am having the internal debate between the Honda I-2000 and Iota 75A or the Honda I1000 and Iota 55A. It is nice to have the excess capacity and the whole use it at home thing if the lights go out, but the reality is I will rarely use it at home and rarely charge more than two packs at a time. My tendency is to travel light and try to keep the expense down a bit. It's hard when the upgrades are only a little bit more expensive and a little heavier.
>
>
>
________________________________
From: Richard Strickland <pamrich47 at hotmail.com>
>To: NSRCA <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:45:56 PM
>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
>
>What are you going to use at home?? The 110V is cleaner and regulated--there's a better explaination--just don't know it off the top of my head.? Go a few more bucks and get the 75 and?you can run 3 Cell pros full blast--and a fan....
>RS?
>> From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com
>> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:30:34 -0400
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
>> 
>> A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda will put out
>> 12 V, why the Iota?
>> 
>> Jay Marshall
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
>> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
>> To: General pattern discussion
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
>> 
>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Ch
>> arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
>> 190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
>> Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike
>> 
>> --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:
>> 
>> > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
>> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
>> > To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > Yes, 4
>> > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
>> > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.? You
>> > could add 1 more
>> > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
>> > each. ?No, I don?t
>> > have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
>> > the field <G>. 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > ? 
>> > 
>> > I leave the
>> > small voltage jumper plug in
>> > my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
>> > something like 13.4 to
>> > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
>> > efficiently. 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > ? 
>> > 
>> > Dave
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > ? 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > ? 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > ? 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > ? 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > From:
>> > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
>> > 
>> > Sent: Monday,
>> > September 28, 2009
>> > 3:20 PM
>> > 
>> > To:
>> > chad at f3acanada.org;
>> > General pattern discussion
>> > 
>> > Subject: Re:
>> > [NSRCA-discussion]
>> > Iota 55 power supply questions 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > ? 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > I agree with
>> > Chad 
>> > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda?for
>> > a little more $
>> > & weight. It will handle (at least)? two Iota
>> > 55's & 4
>> > 1010's?as well as a couple of TX battery
>> > chargers?with no problem.
>> > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
>> > outages the 2 kW
>> > Honda will handle a lot of household items
>> > also.) 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > ? 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > Earl
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > ----- Original
>> > Message ----- 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > From: Chad
>> > Northeast 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > To: General pattern
>> > discussion 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > Sent: Monday,
>> > September
>> > 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > Subject: Re:
>> > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
>> > questions 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > ? 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
>> > handle two 1010's at full rate
>> > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
>> > household circuit.
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
>> > than around 2.5A
>> > before you trip it.? If you want to run the Honda to
>> > the max make sure the
>> > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
>> > max power, and the
>> > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
>> > something.
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > Chad
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > 
>> > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
>> > 
>> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
>> > 
>> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
>> > 
>> > To: General pattern discussion 
>> > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > > 
>> > 
>> > > I am?making?plans to get geared up for next
>> > season and have a 
>> > 
>> > > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
>> > looking to run 
>> > 
>> > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
>> > amp power 
>> > 
>> > > supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that
>> > feasable? Is there any 
>> > 
>> > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
>> > packs at 5 
>> > 
>> > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
>> > buy an 
>> > 
>> > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
>> > power 
>> > 
>> > > supply that should be considered?
>> > 
>> > > 
>> > 
>> > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
>> > right 
>> > 
>> > > stuff the first time.
>> > 
>> > > 
>> > 
>> > > Thanks in advance
>> > 
>> > > Anthony 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > 
>> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> > 
>> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> > 
>> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>> > 
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you. 
>________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you. 
________________________________
_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From troy at troynewman.net  Tue Sep 29 10:02:22 2009
From: troy at troynewman.net (Troy Newman)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 18:02:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR long gimbal stick
In-Reply-To: <980675221.8372341254226648519.JavaMail.root@sz0093a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>
References: <000601ca40c3$0e1136d0$2a33a470$@net>
	<980675221.8372341254226648519.JavaMail.root@sz0093a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB20193A283@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>

Actually the thread in the sticks is identical on the 12X as the 9303 and 10X they are the same internal diameter.

 

The problem is the 12X gimbal  was changed and the threaded length is not as long as the older style gimbal. On the 12X the stick have threads the entire length. The older style sticks have about 3/8? of non threaded portion then the threads start inside the stick.  If you try and use the Long Red JR sticks the 34mm ones they will not screw on the 12X gimbal because the threads do not contact.

 

What you can do and I have done it on my 12X is cut about 1/8? off the bottom of the aluminum stick. Then it will thread on and work just fine. The length is then about the same as when used on the 9303 or 10X. The only problem is they will not thread go shorted as they will bottom out on the gimbal.

 

The newer octagon shaped 12X stick both the ones that comes on the TX stock and the newer long and short versions will work just fine on all the 9303?s and 10X?s out there. These have the threads all the way down on the inside of the stick. It?s the same thread and will work. You can actually make them longer than the older style because the threads go all the way down.

 

I have been flying the older style red 34mm sticks since the 12X came out. Just a little modification and they work great. There is a short straight diameter section right at the bottom of the aluminum stick?Remove this constant diameter part and the older style sticks will thread right on. The other versions of the JR sticks that are colored and all will work also on the 12X they are the same thread. 

 

The only ones that are a problem are the super long ones that have the larger diameter.

 

Hope this answers the confusion.

I can post up a photo if needed.

 

 

Troy Newman

Team JR/Horizon Hobby

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of jzeigenfus at comcast.net
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 5:17 AM
To: pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net; General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR long gimbal stick

 

I am using the long gimbals for the 12x. they are the same length as the ones for a 9303 but are a different diameter for connecting to the TX. You cannot mix a match the two types of gimbals for the TX's. JEZ


----- Original Message -----
From: "Ihncheol Park" <pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 1:09:41 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR long gimbal stick




Does anyone know how long is the JRPA146 long gimbal stick for JR 12X?

Does 12X has different diameter for gimbal stick?

Trying to figure out if it fits on 9303.  

 

Thanks,

 

Ihncheol


_______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Tue Sep 29 10:04:20 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 18:04:20 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <856729.48733.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com><BAY128-W2672CE7D5444E8DB87E734A0D60@phx.gbl><SNT104-W350A6D48B01641E7803DA8BBD60@phx.gbl>
	<182102.91649.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<E489C349C80C4EC9A2FBE4A05245C49E@EarlPC>
	<856729.48733.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7DB3@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

?with two to three experienced pattern pilots watching to critique my performance.?

And don?t forget that I?m there too, just to piss on your parade! ?



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Abdullah
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 1:43 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

Earl,
That is a very good point. I can only focus for so many flights during a practice session. Unfortunately with the shorter E flight times I still have to get in almost twice as many flights as I normally would with glow to get through the sequence the same number of times. I can get through the sequence twice with a little time left over flying glow, with my electric set up I can get through once plus a couple of extra maneuvers. So air time will be similar doing 5 glow flights or 10 electric flights. For those flights I need to show up with charged packs then get at least a couple of them back on the charger once they are used.
The great thing about the pattern group we have growing in our area is that we get a great rotation going so it never feels like I am just flying back to back to back. When my turn to fly comes up I am excited about it and have had enough time to think about what I did poorly the last flight. I take off focused with two to three experienced pattern pilots watching to critique my performance.
________________________________
From: Earl Haury <ejhaury at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:01:27 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

?
Anthony

An approach to practice worth considering is quality vs. quantity - fewer flights with more focus.

Earl
----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Abdullah<mailto:aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
To: General pattern discussion<mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:21 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

That is kind of the plan. I plan to have 5 packs and two charger set ups. If I show up at the field with 5 charged packs and two full charger setups I might be able to get in enough practice flights to move from the bottom to near the bottom in advanced ;o) Now all I have to do is find a way to work only 4 hours a day so I can fly every afternoon! Not bloody likely.
Fly, Charge, Repeat!

________________________________
From: Joe Lachowski <jlachow at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA Discussion List <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 7:43:01 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

Anthony,

If you plan on using 3 or 4 flight packs, one Honda 1000 and Iota 55A is all you need. I take 4 flight packs to the field and only charge one flight pack at a time. I usually don't fly more than 6 flights in a session anyway. So I only charge 2 packs at the field most of the time with 4 sets of batteries. Now with the price of Rhinos and Zippys as they are, you could even go with 6 flight packs and not need a generator at all<g>. You definitely need a minimum of two charger setups though.

________________________________
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:03:08 -0700
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
I was looking at the 75A model with the built in battery charger but was not sure if the Generator would put out enough juice? I am having the internal debate between the Honda I-2000 and Iota 75A or the Honda I1000 and Iota 55A. It is nice to have the excess capacity and the whole use it at home thing if the lights go out, but the reality is I will rarely use it at home and rarely charge more than two packs at a time. My tendency is to travel light and try to keep the expense down a bit. It's hard when the upgrades are only a little bit more expensive and a little heavier.

________________________________
From: Richard Strickland <pamrich47 at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:45:56 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

What are you going to use at home?  The 110V is cleaner and regulated--there's a better explaination--just don't know it off the top of my head.  Go a few more bucks and get the 75 and you can run 3 Cell pros full blast--and a fan....
RS
> From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:30:34 -0400
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
>
> A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda will put out
> 12 V, why the Iota?
>
> Jay Marshall
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Ch
> arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
> 190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
> Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike
>
> --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yes, 4
> > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.  You
> > could add 1 more
> > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> > each.  No, I don?t
> > have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> > the field <G>.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I leave the
> > small voltage jumper plug in
> > my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> > something like 13.4 to
> > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> > efficiently.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Dave
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > From:
> > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> >
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September 28, 2009
> > 3:20 PM
> >
> > To:
> > chad at f3acanada.org;
> > General pattern discussion
> >
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion]
> > Iota 55 power supply questions
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I agree with
> > Chad
> > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda for
> > a little more $
> > & weight. It will handle (at least)  two Iota
> > 55's & 4
> > 1010's as well as a couple of TX battery
> > chargers with no problem.
> > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> > outages the 2 kW
> > Honda will handle a lot of household items
> > also.)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Earl
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original
> > Message -----
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: Chad
> > Northeast
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > To: General pattern
> > discussion
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September
> > 28, 2009 1:40 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> > questions
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> > handle two 1010's at full rate
> > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> > household circuit.
> >
> >
> >
> > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> > than around 2.5A
> > before you trip it.  If you want to run the Honda to
> > the max make sure the
> > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> >
> >
> >
> > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> > max power, and the
> > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> > something.
> >
> >
> >
> > Chad
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> >
> > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> >
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> >
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> >
> > To: General pattern discussion
> > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> > > I am making plans to get geared up for next
> > season and have a
> >
> > > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> > looking to run
> >
> > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> > amp power
> >
> > > supply from a Honda generator. Is that
> > feasable? Is there any
> >
> > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> > packs at 5
> >
> > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> > buy an
> >
> > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> > power
> >
> > > supply that should be considered?
> >
> > >
> >
> > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> > right
> >
> > > stuff the first time.
> >
> > >
> >
> > > Thanks in advance
> >
> > > Anthony
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> >
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> >
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you.<http://www.microsoft.com/windows/choosepc/?ocid=ftp_val_wl_290>

________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you.<http://www.microsoft.com/windows/choosepc/?ocid=ftp_val_wl_290>
________________________________
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From jlachow at hotmail.com  Tue Sep 29 11:12:19 2009
From: jlachow at hotmail.com (Joe Lachowski)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 19:12:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <856729.48733.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <212073.79319.qm@web51012.mail.re2.yahoo.com><BAY128-W2672CE7D5444E8DB87E734A0D60@phx.gbl><SNT104-W350A6D48B01641E7803DA8BBD60@phx.gbl>
	<182102.91649.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <SNT104-W13B5CC1A71688A913DF1E1BBD50@phx.gbl>


Anthony, when I transitioned from glow to electric, I found that 5 glow flights do not equate to 10 electric flights of practice. I found that I really only needed 6 electric flights for the equivalent of 4 glow flights with 2 sequences which was a typical practice session for me.  Six and maybe 7 tops before diminishing returns were realized. Flying one sequence with the electric really contest hardens you. You know you only have one chance to do it right in a flight and you focus more on the task at hand. I also found that the work load is less with electric at least when I compared it to flying my previous planes with a 140RX and Webra 160. 
 


Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 10:43:01 -0700
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions





Earl,
That is a very good point. I can only focus for so many flights during a practice session. Unfortunately with the shorter E flight times I still have to get in almost twice as many flights as I normally would with glow to get through the sequence the same number of times. I can get through the sequence twice with a little time left over flying glow, with my electric set up I can get through once plus a couple of extra maneuvers. So air time will be similar doing 5 glow flights or 10 electric flights. For those flights I need to show up with charged packs then get at least a couple of them back on the charger once they are used. 

The great thing about the pattern group we have growing in our area is that we get a great rotation going so it never feels like I am just flying back to back to back. When my turn to fly comes up I am excited about it and have had enough time to think about what I did poorly the last flight. I take off focused with two to three experienced pattern pilots watching to critique my performance.



From: Earl Haury <ejhaury at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:01:27 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

? 


Anthony
 
An approach to practice worth considering is quality vs. quantity - fewer flights with more focus.
 
Earl

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Anthony Abdullah 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:21 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions



That is kind of the plan. I plan to have 5 packs and two charger set ups. If I show up at the field with 5 charged packs and two full charger setups I might be able to get in enough practice flights to move from the bottom to near the bottom in advanced ;o) Now all I have to do is find a way to work only 4 hours a day so I can fly every afternoon! Not bloody likely.

Fly, Charge, Repeat!




From: Joe Lachowski <jlachow at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA Discussion List <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 7:43:01 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions



Anthony,
 
If you plan on using 3 or 4 flight packs, one Honda 1000 and Iota 55A is all you need. I take 4 flight packs to the field and only charge one flight pack at a time. I usually don't fly more than 6 flights in a session anyway. So I only charge 2 packs at the field most of the time with 4 sets of batteries. Now with the price of Rhinos and Zippys as they are, you could even go with 6 flight packs and not need a generator at all<g>. You definitely need a minimum of two charger setups though.
 


Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:03:08 -0700
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions





I was looking at the 75A model with the built in battery charger but was not sure if the Generator would put out enough juice? I am having the internal debate between the Honda I-2000 and Iota 75A or the Honda I1000 and Iota 55A. It is nice to have the excess capacity and the whole use it at home thing if the lights go out, but the reality is I will rarely use it at home and rarely charge more than two packs at a time. My tendency is to travel light and try to keep the expense down a bit. It's hard when the upgrades are only a little bit more expensive and a little heavier.




From: Richard Strickland <pamrich47 at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:45:56 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions



What are you going to use at home?  The 110V is cleaner and regulated--there's a better explaination--just don't know it off the top of my head.  Go a few more bucks and get the 75 and you can run 3 Cell pros full blast--and a fan....
RS 
> From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:30:34 -0400
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda will put out
> 12 V, why the Iota?
> 
> Jay Marshall
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Ch
> arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
> 190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
> Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike
> 
> --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Yes, 4
> > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.  You
> > could add 1 more
> > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> > each.  No, I don?t
> > have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> > the field <G>. 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > I leave the
> > small voltage jumper plug in
> > my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> > something like 13.4 to
> > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> > efficiently. 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > Dave
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From:
> > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September 28, 2009
> > 3:20 PM
> > 
> > To:
> > chad at f3acanada.org;
> > General pattern discussion
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion]
> > Iota 55 power supply questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I agree with
> > Chad 
> > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda for
> > a little more $
> > & weight. It will handle (at least)  two Iota
> > 55's & 4
> > 1010's as well as a couple of TX battery
> > chargers with no problem.
> > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> > outages the 2 kW
> > Honda will handle a lot of household items
> > also.) 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Earl
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original
> > Message ----- 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From: Chad
> > Northeast 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > To: General pattern
> > discussion 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September
> > 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> > questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> > handle two 1010's at full rate
> > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> > household circuit.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> > than around 2.5A
> > before you trip it.  If you want to run the Honda to
> > the max make sure the
> > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> > max power, and the
> > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> > something.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Chad
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > 
> > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> > 
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> > 
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > 
> > To: General pattern discussion 
> > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > I am making plans to get geared up for next
> > season and have a 
> > 
> > > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> > looking to run 
> > 
> > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> > amp power 
> > 
> > > supply from a Honda generator. Is that
> > feasable? Is there any 
> > 
> > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> > packs at 5 
> > 
> > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> > buy an 
> > 
> > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> > power 
> > 
> > > supply that should be considered?
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> > right 
> > 
> > > stuff the first time.
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Thanks in advance
> > 
> > > Anthony 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you. 


Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you. 




_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 		 	   		  
_________________________________________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/choosepc/?ocid=ftp_val_wl_290
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From jpavlick at idseng.com  Tue Sep 29 11:15:46 2009
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 19:15:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
In-Reply-To: <SNT104-W13B5CC1A71688A913DF1E1BBD50@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <638451.57990.qm@web80501.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Just don't forget to remove the batteries from your plane before you turn your transmitter off! LOL
?
John Pavlick

--- On Tue, 9/29/09, Joe Lachowski <jlachow at hotmail.com> wrote:


From: Joe Lachowski <jlachow at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
To: "NSRCA Discussion List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 29, 2009, 3:12 PM




Anthony,?when I transitioned from glow to electric, I found that 5 glow flights do not equate to 10 electric flights of practice. I found that I really only needed 6 electric flights for?the equivalent of?4 glow flights with 2 sequences which was a typical practice session for me.? Six and maybe?7 tops before diminishing returns were realized. Flying one sequence?with the electric really contest hardens you. You know you only have one chance to?do it right in a flight and you focus more?on the task at hand. I also found that the work load is less with electric at least when I compared it to flying?my previous?planes with a 140RX and Webra 160.?
?


Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 10:43:01 -0700
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions



#yiv1130583160 .ExternalClass DIV
{}



Earl,
That is a very good point. I can only focus for so many flights during a practice session. Unfortunately with the shorter E flight times I still have to get in almost twice as many flights as I normally would with glow to get through the sequence the same number of times. I can get through the sequence twice with a little time left over flying glow, with my electric set up I can get through once plus a couple of extra maneuvers. So air time will be similar doing 5 glow flights or 10 electric flights. For those flights I need to show up with charged?packs then get?at least a couple of them back on the charger once they are used.?

The great thing about the pattern group we have growing in our area is that we get a great rotation going so it never feels like I am just flying back to back to back. When my turn to fly comes up I am excited about it and have had enough time to think about what I did poorly the last flight. I take off focused with two to three experienced pattern pilots watching to critique my performance.



From: Earl Haury <ejhaury at comcast.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:01:27 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions

? 

#yiv1130583160 .ExternalClass DIV
{}


Anthony
?
An approach to practice worth considering is quality vs. quantity - fewer flights with?more focus.
?
Earl

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Anthony Abdullah 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:21 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions



That is kind of the plan. I plan to have 5 packs and two charger set ups. If I show up at the field with 5 charged packs and two full charger setups I might be able to get in enough practice flights to move from the bottom to near the bottom in advanced ;o) Now all I have to do is find a way to work only 4 hours a day so I can fly every afternoon! Not bloody likely.

Fly, Charge, Repeat!




From: Joe Lachowski <jlachow at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA Discussion List <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 7:43:01 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions



#yiv1130583160 .ExternalClass .ecxhmmessage P
{padding:0px;}
#yiv1130583160 .ExternalClass body.ecxhmmessage
{font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana;}

Anthony,
?
If you?plan on using?3 or 4 flight packs,?one Honda 1000 and Iota 55A is all you need. I take 4 flight packs to the field and only charge one?flight pack at a time.?I usually don't fly more than 6 flights in a session anyway. So I only charge?2 packs at the field most of the time with 4 sets of batteries. Now with the price of Rhinos and Zippys as they are, you could even go with 6 flight packs and not need a generator at all<g>. You definitely need?a minimum of two charger setups though.
?


Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 14:03:08 -0700
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions



#yiv1130583160 .ExternalClass DIV
{}



I was looking at the 75A model with the built in battery charger but was not sure if the Generator would put out enough juice? I am having the internal debate between the Honda I-2000 and Iota 75A or the Honda I1000 and Iota 55A. It is nice to have the excess capacity and the whole use it at home thing if the lights go out, but the reality is I will rarely use it at home and rarely charge more than two packs at a time. My tendency is to travel light and try to keep the expense down a bit. It's hard when the upgrades are only a little bit more expensive and a little heavier.




From: Richard Strickland <pamrich47 at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:45:56 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions



#yiv1130583160 .ExternalClass .ecxhmmessage P
{padding:0px;}
#yiv1130583160 .ExternalClass body.ecxhmmessage
{font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana;}

What are you going to use at home?? The 110V is cleaner and regulated--there's a better explaination--just don't know it off the top of my head.? Go a few more bucks and get the 75 and?you can run 3 Cell pros full blast--and a fan....
RS?
> From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:30:34 -0400
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> A question? If the TP1010 requires a 12V source, and the Honda will put out
> 12 V, why the Iota?
> 
> Jay Marshall
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 4:23 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Iota-DLS-55-amp-RV-Power-Converter-Battery-Ch
> arger_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem2c50ff1fbfQQitemZ
> 190337458111QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
> Here's where I bought my last one. Good luck Sponge Bob, Mike
> 
> --- On Mon, 9/28/09, Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> > From: Dave <DaveL322 at comcast.net>
> > Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:40 PM
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Yes, 4
> > 1010s at 10s 5amps each running
> > from 2 Iota 55s is no problem with the 2kw Honda.? You
> > could add 1 more
> > 1010 on each Iota and have about 3 amps at 10s left for
> > each. ?No, I don?t
> > have 6 1010s?..but the 2kw generator is popular at
> > the field <G>. 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > I leave the
> > small voltage jumper plug in
> > my Iotas all the time ? bumps output voltage from
> > something like 13.4 to
> > 14.2V, which should make the 1010s run a little more
> > efficiently. 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > Dave
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From:
> > nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> > [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Earl Haury
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September 28, 2009
> > 3:20 PM
> > 
> > To:
> > chad at f3acanada.org;
> > General pattern discussion
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion]
> > Iota 55 power supply questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I agree with
> > Chad 
> > - for a 1 kW Honda. You might consider 2 kW Honda?for
> > a little more $
> > & weight. It will handle (at least)? two Iota
> > 55's & 4
> > 1010's?as well as a couple of TX battery
> > chargers?with no problem.
> > (If you live in an area that experiences occasional power
> > outages the 2 kW
> > Honda will handle a lot of household items
> > also.) 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Earl
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original
> > Message ----- 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From: Chad
> > Northeast 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > To: General pattern
> > discussion 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Sent: Monday,
> > September
> > 28, 2009 1:40 PM 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Subject: Re:
> > [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply
> > questions 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Two is not a problem, the Iota 55 will
> > handle two 1010's at full rate
> > and a third set to about 4A (on 10s) when plugged into a
> > household circuit.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Hooked up to the Honda you wont get the third up to more
> > than around 2.5A
> > before you trip it.? If you want to run the Honda to
> > the max make sure the
> > Eco switch is off and you can get a little more out of it.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I think the Iota has a 950W input requirement to get its
> > max power, and the
> > Honda is only rated to around 900W continuously or
> > something.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Chad
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > 
> > From: Anthony Abdullah < aabdu at sbcglobal.net >
> > 
> > Date: Monday, September 28, 2009 12:31 pm
> > 
> > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Iota 55 power supply questions
> > 
> > To: General pattern discussion 
> > <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > I am?making?plans to get geared up for next
> > season and have a 
> > 
> > > few questions about power supplies and such. I am
> > looking to run 
> > 
> > > two Thunder Power 1010C chargers off of one Iota 55
> > amp power 
> > 
> > > supply from a Honda?generator.?Is that
> > feasable? Is there any 
> > 
> > > reason I would not be able to charge two 10S 5000
> > packs at 5 
> > 
> > > amps each with that set up? Where is the best place to
> > buy an 
> > 
> > > Iota power supply? Are their different models of that
> > power 
> > 
> > > supply that should be considered?
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to get the
> > right 
> > 
> > > stuff the first time.
> > 
> > > 
> > 
> > > Thanks in advance
> > 
> > > Anthony 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you. 


Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you. 



_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you. 
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----


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From pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net  Tue Sep 29 13:19:50 2009
From: pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net (Ihncheol Park)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 21:19:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR long gimbal stick
In-Reply-To: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB20193A283@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>
Message-ID: <8315.36065.qm@web83910.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

Troy,

Thank you for the explanation.  By super long, which one are you talking about?

I was trying to see if the JRPA146 (gimbal stick ends: 12x Long) fits on the 9303 so that I can start using the dubro tray this winter.

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=JRPA146


I do have JRPA047 which is also a long one (about 10mm longer than JRPA045 34mm/red and comes with longer thraded stick), but don't want to pull the threaded stick out of the gimbals to make it long enough.  I also have no idea how to put in the threaded stick to the gimbal.

Ihncheol
--- On Tue, 9/29/09, Troy Newman <troy at troynewman.net> wrote:

> From: Troy Newman <troy at troynewman.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR long gimbal stick
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Tuesday, September 29, 2009, 1:02 PM
>
> 
> Actually the thread in the sticks is
> identical on the 12X as the
> 9303 and 10X they are the same internal
> diameter. 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> The problem is the 12X gimbal ?was changed
> and the threaded
> length is not as long as the older style gimbal. On the 12X
> the stick have
> threads the entire length. The older style sticks have
> about 3/8? of non
> threaded portion then the threads start inside the stick.?
> If you try and use
> the Long Red JR sticks the 34mm ones they will not screw on
> the 12X gimbal
> because the threads do not contact. 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> What you can do and I have done it on my
> 12X is cut about 1/8?
> off the bottom of the aluminum stick. Then it will thread
> on and work just
> fine. The length is then about the same as when used on the
> 9303 or 10X. The
> only problem is they will not thread go shorted as they
> will bottom out on the
> gimbal. 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> The newer octagon shaped 12X stick both the
> ones that comes on
> the TX stock and the newer long and short versions will
> work just fine on all
> the 9303?s and 10X?s out there. These have the threads
> all the way down on the
> inside of the stick. It?s the same thread and will work.
> You can actually make them
> longer than the older style because the threads go all the
> way down. 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> I have been flying the older style red 34mm
> sticks since the 12X
> came out. Just a little modification and they work great.
> There is a short straight
> diameter section right at the bottom of the aluminum
> stick?Remove this constant
> diameter part and the older style sticks will thread right
> on. The other
> versions of the JR sticks that are colored and all will
> work also on the 12X
> they are the same thread.  
> 
>  ? 
> 
> The only ones that are a problem are the
> super long ones that
> have the larger diameter. 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> Hope this answers the confusion.
> 
> 
> I can post up a photo if needed.
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> Troy Newman 
> 
> Team JR/Horizon Hobby 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On
> Behalf Of jzeigenfus at comcast.net
> 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 5:17 AM
> 
> To: pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net; General pattern
> discussion
> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR long gimbal
> stick 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> 
> 
> I
> am using the long gimbals for the 12x. they are the same
> length as the ones for
> a 9303 but are a different diameter for connecting to the
> TX. You cannot mix a
> match the two types of gimbals for the TX's. JEZ
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> From: "Ihncheol Park"
> <pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net>
> 
> To: "General pattern discussion"
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 1:09:41 AM GMT -05:00
> US/Canada Eastern
> 
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR long gimbal stick
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Does anyone know how long is the JRPA146
> long gimbal stick for
> JR 12X? 
> 
> Does 12X has different diameter for gimbal
> stick? 
> 
> Trying to figure out if it fits on
> 9303.?  
> 
> ? 
> 
> Thanks, 
> 
> ? 
> 
> Ihncheol 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From tony at radiosouthrc.com  Tue Sep 29 13:54:10 2009
From: tony at radiosouthrc.com (Tony)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 21:54:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] manual needed
Message-ID: <30DAA0D6E26B43458FC6238461A81245@Tony>

Does anyone have an old Airtronics ATRCS manual laying around?

 

Tony Stillman, President

Radio South, Inc.

139 Altama Connector, Box 322

Brunswick, GA  31525

1-800-962-7802

www.radiosouthrc.com

 

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From tony at radiosouthrc.com  Tue Sep 29 13:56:12 2009
From: tony at radiosouthrc.com (Tony)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 21:56:12 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Mike Harrison
Message-ID: <498180D4992B4FC1B85EA0F2E09E9990@Tony>

Mike:
Please e-mail me off-list.

tony at radiosouthrc.com

 

 

Tony Stillman, President

Radio South, Inc.

139 Altama Connector, Box 322

Brunswick, GA  31525

1-800-962-7802

www.radiosouthrc.com

 

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From troy at troynewman.net  Tue Sep 29 14:00:31 2009
From: troy at troynewman.net (Troy Newman)
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 22:00:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR long gimbal stick
In-Reply-To: <8315.36065.qm@web83910.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
References: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB20193A283@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>
	<8315.36065.qm@web83910.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB20193A289@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>

Ihncheol,

As I stated if the stick says its fits the 12X it will fit all the others , the 9303 or 10X or 8103 and so on

This one fits the 12X, 9303, 10X, 8103, and so on all the way back to much older radios.

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=JRPA146



It?s the same thread as the other radios.........



By contrast

This one will work on all the others and if slightly modified will also fit the 12X

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=JRPA045

This is the stick I and using on my 12X right now.


I don't think the really long and fat ones here
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=JRPA047

I don't know if these work on the 12x but they do on the older radios. I don't use them because they are too large of diameter and length for me. So I can't tell you how to change them......



Bottom line if you are using on a 9303 ANY of the sticks you buy from JR will work. That means all of the JR stick options will work on the 9303

I hope this clears the confusion for you.....



Troy Newman


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ihncheol Park
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 2:20 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR long gimbal stick

Troy,

Thank you for the explanation.  By super long, which one are you talking about?

I was trying to see if the JRPA146 (gimbal stick ends: 12x Long) fits on the 9303 so that I can start using the dubro tray this winter.

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=JRPA146


I do have JRPA047 which is also a long one (about 10mm longer than JRPA045 34mm/red and comes with longer thraded stick), but don't want to pull the threaded stick out of the gimbals to make it long enough.  I also have no idea how to put in the threaded stick to the gimbal.

Ihncheol
--- On Tue, 9/29/09, Troy Newman <troy at troynewman.net> wrote:

> From: Troy Newman <troy at troynewman.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR long gimbal stick
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Tuesday, September 29, 2009, 1:02 PM
>
> 
> Actually the thread in the sticks is
> identical on the 12X as the
> 9303 and 10X they are the same internal
> diameter. 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> The problem is the 12X gimbal ?was changed
> and the threaded
> length is not as long as the older style gimbal. On the 12X
> the stick have
> threads the entire length. The older style sticks have
> about 3/8? of non
> threaded portion then the threads start inside the stick.?
> If you try and use
> the Long Red JR sticks the 34mm ones they will not screw on
> the 12X gimbal
> because the threads do not contact. 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> What you can do and I have done it on my
> 12X is cut about 1/8?
> off the bottom of the aluminum stick. Then it will thread
> on and work just
> fine. The length is then about the same as when used on the
> 9303 or 10X. The
> only problem is they will not thread go shorted as they
> will bottom out on the
> gimbal. 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> The newer octagon shaped 12X stick both the
> ones that comes on
> the TX stock and the newer long and short versions will
> work just fine on all
> the 9303?s and 10X?s out there. These have the threads
> all the way down on the
> inside of the stick. It?s the same thread and will work.
> You can actually make them
> longer than the older style because the threads go all the
> way down. 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> I have been flying the older style red 34mm
> sticks since the 12X
> came out. Just a little modification and they work great.
> There is a short straight
> diameter section right at the bottom of the aluminum
> stick?Remove this constant
> diameter part and the older style sticks will thread right
> on. The other
> versions of the JR sticks that are colored and all will
> work also on the 12X
> they are the same thread.  
> 
>  ? 
> 
> The only ones that are a problem are the
> super long ones that
> have the larger diameter. 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> Hope this answers the confusion.
> 
> 
> I can post up a photo if needed.
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> Troy Newman 
> 
> Team JR/Horizon Hobby 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On
> Behalf Of jzeigenfus at comcast.net
> 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 5:17 AM
> 
> To: pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net; General pattern
> discussion
> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR long gimbal
> stick 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  ? 
> 
> 
> 
> I
> am using the long gimbals for the 12x. they are the same
> length as the ones for
> a 9303 but are a different diameter for connecting to the
> TX. You cannot mix a
> match the two types of gimbals for the TX's. JEZ
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> From: "Ihncheol Park"
> <pnahobbies at sbcglobal.net>
> 
> To: "General pattern discussion"
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 1:09:41 AM GMT -05:00
> US/Canada Eastern
> 
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR long gimbal stick
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Does anyone know how long is the JRPA146
> long gimbal stick for
> JR 12X? 
> 
> Does 12X has different diameter for gimbal
> stick? 
> 
> Trying to figure out if it fits on
> 9303.?  
> 
> ? 
> 
> Thanks, 
> 
> ? 
> 
> Ihncheol 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From vanputte at cox.net  Tue Sep 29 16:54:14 2009
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ronald Van Putte)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 00:54:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman/District 3 champs
In-Reply-To: <3F0D839C0E584814BCD0146F9C3DEB53@Tony>
References: <3F0D839C0E584814BCD0146F9C3DEB53@Tony>
Message-ID: <1612837B-5F8C-49D8-AB15-F475F280DB91@cox.net>

I had a great time and took home an intact airplane, something that  
almost didn't happen, when I had a bout of "cranial flatulence  
halfway through the 2/2 Rolls in the fourth round.

Thanks Tony.

Ron VP

On Sep 29, 2009, at 10:28 AM, Tony wrote:

> I want to thank all the pilots and helpers that came out for the  
> District Champs last weekend in Jacksonville, FL.  While we only  
> had 22 contestants, we still had a great time.  The weather  
> cooperated (just a short rain shower late Saturday) and we got in  
> lots of good flying.
>
> It was great seeing everyone again, and I sure hope to get back to  
> some pattern flying in 2010.  If I can just get our local club to  
> do some work on the runway so I don?t rip out the gear in my Brio  
> every time!!!!
>
>
>
> Tony Stillman, President
> Radio South, Inc.
> 139 Altama Connector, Box 322
> Brunswick, GA  31525
> 1-800-962-7802
> www.radiosouthrc.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From tony at radiosouthrc.com  Tue Sep 29 17:27:59 2009
From: tony at radiosouthrc.com (Tony)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 01:27:59 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Mike Harrison
Message-ID: <8349F8E3E78D4EF0AAA5B59D93347543@Tony>

Mike:
Please e-mail me privately

 

tony at radiosouthrc.com

 

Tony Stillman, President

Radio South, Inc.

139 Altama Connector, Box 322

Brunswick, GA  31525

1-800-962-7802

www.radiosouthrc.com

 

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From johnfuqua at embarqmail.com  Tue Sep 29 17:46:03 2009
From: johnfuqua at embarqmail.com (John Fuqua)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 01:46:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
Message-ID: <01e601ca416f$b92ed570$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>

OK folks.   I know we have been having fun discussing potential rules
proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of today.   Please take the
time to submit your proposals as soon as possible.  It would be nice to
allow folks time to review and discuss them with each other and their
Contest Board Representatives.   I know we have a few months to the deadline
but the whole idea was to post them as early as possible on the AMA Website
during the year so they could be reviewed and discussed (cussed?).  There
will also be a Cross Proposal phase to make further changes.

 

The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here:

http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals.aspx

 

Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle at modelaircraft.org

and Greg Hahn gregh at modelaircraft.org

 

 

Thanks

 

John Fuqua

RCA Contest Board Chairman

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From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Tue Sep 29 17:49:49 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 01:49:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
In-Reply-To: <01e601ca416f$b92ed570$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
References: <01e601ca416f$b92ed570$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
Message-ID: <6F3AABEF-C47C-456E-887D-6F66CDBED1DE@sbcglobal.net>

I submitted three to the AMA and never got a response. I think they're  
dead over there.

Tony

On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:45 PM, John Fuqua wrote:

> OK folks.   I know we have been having fun discussing potential  
> rules proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of today.    
> Please take the time to submit your proposals as soon as possible.   
> It would be nice to allow folks time to review and discuss them with  
> each other and their Contest Board Representatives.   I know we have  
> a few months to the deadline but the whole idea was to post them as  
> early as possible on the AMA Website during the year so they could  
> be reviewed and discussed (cussed?).  There will also be a Cross  
> Proposal phase to make further changes.
>
> The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here:
> http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals.aspx
>
> Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle at modelaircraft.org
> and Greg Hahn gregh at modelaircraft.org
>
>
> Thanks
>
> John Fuqua
> RCA Contest Board Chairman
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From burtona at atmc.net  Tue Sep 29 17:56:48 2009
From: burtona at atmc.net (Dave Burton)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 01:56:48 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
In-Reply-To: <6F3AABEF-C47C-456E-887D-6F66CDBED1DE@sbcglobal.net>
References: <01e601ca416f$b92ed570$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
	<6F3AABEF-C47C-456E-887D-6F66CDBED1DE@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <002f01ca4171$543fd5e0$fcbf81a0$@net>

Me too. I submitted one and they apparently lost it as they don't have it
now.

Dave

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony
Frackowiak
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:50 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

 

I submitted three to the AMA and never got a response. I think they're dead
over there.

 

Tony

 

On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:45 PM, John Fuqua wrote:





OK folks.   I know we have been having fun discussing potential rules
proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of today.   Please take the
time to submit your proposals as soon as possible.  It would be nice to
allow folks time to review and discuss them with each other and their
Contest Board Representatives.   I know we have a few months to the deadline
but the whole idea was to post them as early as possible on the AMA Website
during the year so they could be reviewed and discussed (cussed?).  There
will also be a Cross Proposal phase to make further changes.

 

The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here:

http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals.aspx

 

Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle at modelaircraft.org

and Greg Hahn gregh at modelaircraft.org

 

 

Thanks

 

John Fuqua

RCA Contest Board Chairman

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Tue Sep 29 17:57:20 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 01:57:20 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D57EB931@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

And I know lance submitted at least one if not two the we drafted. Something is amiss. 

-mark
--------------------------
Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld


----- Original Message -----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org <nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue Sep 29 21:49:46 2009
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

I submitted three to the AMA and never got a response. I think they're dead over there.

Tony

On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:45 PM, John Fuqua wrote:


		OK folks.   I know we have been having fun discussing potential rules proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of today.   Please take the time to submit your proposals as soon as possible.  It would be nice to allow folks time to review and discuss them with each other and their Contest Board Representatives.   I know we have a few months to the deadline but the whole idea was to post them as early as possible on the AMA Website during the year so they could be reviewed and discussed (cussed?).  There will also be a Cross Proposal phase to make further changes.
	 
	The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here:
	http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals.aspx
	 
	Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle at modelaircraft.org
	and Greg Hahn gregh at modelaircraft.org
	 
	 
	Thanks
	 
	John Fuqua
	RCA Contest Board Chairman
	_______________________________________________
	NSRCA-discussion mailing list
	NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
	http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
	


From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep 29 18:03:48 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 02:03:48 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D57EB931@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <549250409.7133881254276228548.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

I submitted one and never got a respond.? Looks like is standard procedure since everybody is having the same experience.? Should we check with AMA? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mark Atwood" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com> 
To: "nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:47:53 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals 

And I know lance submitted at least one if not two the we drafted. Something is amiss. 

-mark 
-------------------------- 
Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld 


----- Original Message ----- 
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org <nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org> 
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
Sent: Tue Sep 29 21:49:46 2009 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals 

I submitted three to the AMA and never got a response. I think they're dead over there. 

Tony 

On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:45 PM, John Fuqua wrote: 


????????????????OK folks. ? I know we have been having fun discussing potential rules proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of today. ? Please take the time to submit your proposals as soon as possible. ?It would be nice to allow folks time to review and discuss them with each other and their Contest Board Representatives. ? I know we have a few months to the deadline but the whole idea was to post them as early as possible on the AMA Website during the year so they could be reviewed and discussed (cussed?). ?There will also be a Cross Proposal phase to make further changes. 
???????? 
????????The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here: 
????????http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals.aspx 
???????? 
????????Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle at modelaircraft.org 
????????and Greg Hahn gregh at modelaircraft.org 
???????? 
???????? 
????????Thanks 
???????? 
????????John Fuqua 
????????RCA Contest Board Chairman 
????????_______________________________________________ 
????????NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
????????NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
????????http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
???????? 

_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From johnfuqua at embarqmail.com  Tue Sep 29 18:08:13 2009
From: johnfuqua at embarqmail.com (John Fuqua)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 02:08:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
In-Reply-To: <549250409.7133881254276228548.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D57EB931@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
	<549250409.7133881254276228548.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <021e01ca4172$d2a471b0$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>

Is everyone submitting them via email to Michelle and Greg???

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Vicente
"Vince" Bortone
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:04 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

I submitted one and never got a respond.  Looks like is standard procedure
since everybody is having the same experience.  Should we check with AMA?

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Atwood" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
To: "nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:47:53 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

And I know lance submitted at least one if not two the we drafted. Something
is amiss. 

-mark
--------------------------
Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld


----- Original Message -----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
<nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue Sep 29 21:49:46 2009
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

I submitted three to the AMA and never got a response. I think they're dead
over there.

Tony

On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:45 PM, John Fuqua wrote:


                OK folks.   I know we have been having fun discussing
potential rules proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of today.
Please take the time to submit your proposals as soon as possible.  It would
be nice to allow folks time to review and discuss them with each other and
their Contest Board Representatives.   I know we have a few months to the
deadline but the whole idea was to post them as early as possible on the AMA
Website during the year so they could be reviewed and discussed (cussed?).
There will also be a Cross Proposal phase to make further changes.
         
        The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here:
        http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals.aspx
         
        Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle at modelaircraft.org
        and Greg Hahn gregh at modelaircraft.org
         
         
        Thanks
         
        John Fuqua
        RCA Contest Board Chairman
        _______________________________________________
        NSRCA-discussion mailing list
        NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
        http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
        

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



From frackowiak at sbcglobal.net  Tue Sep 29 18:09:37 2009
From: frackowiak at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Frackowiak)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 02:09:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
In-Reply-To: <021e01ca4172$d2a471b0$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
References: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D57EB931@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
	<549250409.7133881254276228548.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<021e01ca4172$d2a471b0$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
Message-ID: <B10989B9-F602-46B1-B60D-020AAF61C966@sbcglobal.net>

I submitted mine to Michelle.

Tony

On Sep 29, 2009, at 7:07 PM, John Fuqua wrote:

> Is everyone submitting them via email to Michelle and Greg???
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Vicente
> "Vince" Bortone
> Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:04 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
>
> I submitted one and never got a respond.  Looks like is standard  
> procedure
> since everybody is having the same experience.  Should we check with  
> AMA?
>
> Vicente "Vince" Bortone
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mark Atwood" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
> To: "nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> >
> Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:47:53 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada  
> Central
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
>
> And I know lance submitted at least one if not two the we drafted.  
> Something
> is amiss.
>
> -mark
> --------------------------
> Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> <nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Tue Sep 29 21:49:46 2009
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
>
> I submitted three to the AMA and never got a response. I think  
> they're dead
> over there.
>
> Tony
>
> On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:45 PM, John Fuqua wrote:
>
>
>                OK folks.   I know we have been having fun discussing
> potential rules proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of  
> today.
> Please take the time to submit your proposals as soon as possible.   
> It would
> be nice to allow folks time to review and discuss them with each  
> other and
> their Contest Board Representatives.   I know we have a few months  
> to the
> deadline but the whole idea was to post them as early as possible on  
> the AMA
> Website during the year so they could be reviewed and discussed  
> (cussed?).
> There will also be a Cross Proposal phase to make further changes.
>
>        The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here:
>        http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals.aspx
>
>        Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle at modelaircraft.org
>        and Greg Hahn gregh at modelaircraft.org
>
>
>        Thanks
>
>        John Fuqua
>        RCA Contest Board Chairman
>        _______________________________________________
>        NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>        NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>        http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



From burtona at atmc.net  Tue Sep 29 18:11:35 2009
From: burtona at atmc.net (Dave Burton)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 02:11:35 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
In-Reply-To: <021e01ca4172$d2a471b0$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
References: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D57EB931@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>	<549250409.7133881254276228548.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<021e01ca4172$d2a471b0$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
Message-ID: <004601ca4173$6512b610$2f382230$@net>

Yes, and I just re-sent it tonight.
Dave

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of John Fuqua
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:08 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

Is everyone submitting them via email to Michelle and Greg???

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Vicente
"Vince" Bortone
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:04 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

I submitted one and never got a respond.  Looks like is standard procedure
since everybody is having the same experience.  Should we check with AMA?

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Atwood" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
To: "nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:47:53 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

And I know lance submitted at least one if not two the we drafted. Something
is amiss. 

-mark
--------------------------
Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld


----- Original Message -----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
<nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue Sep 29 21:49:46 2009
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

I submitted three to the AMA and never got a response. I think they're dead
over there.

Tony

On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:45 PM, John Fuqua wrote:


                OK folks.   I know we have been having fun discussing
potential rules proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of today.
Please take the time to submit your proposals as soon as possible.  It would
be nice to allow folks time to review and discuss them with each other and
their Contest Board Representatives.   I know we have a few months to the
deadline but the whole idea was to post them as early as possible on the AMA
Website during the year so they could be reviewed and discussed (cussed?).
There will also be a Cross Proposal phase to make further changes.
         
        The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here:
        http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals.aspx
         
        Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle at modelaircraft.org
        and Greg Hahn gregh at modelaircraft.org
         
         
        Thanks
         
        John Fuqua
        RCA Contest Board Chairman
        _______________________________________________
        NSRCA-discussion mailing list
        NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
        http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
        

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep 29 18:21:29 2009
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (Vicente "Vince" Bortone)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 02:21:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
In-Reply-To: <004601ca4173$6512b610$2f382230$@net>
Message-ID: <1389920382.7140431254277288286.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

I will do the same. 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dave Burton" < burtona @ atmc .net> 
To: "General pattern discussion" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:11:59 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals 

Yes, and I just re-sent it tonight. 
Dave 

-----Original Message----- 
From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org 
[ mailto : nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of John Fuqua 
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:08 PM 
To: 'General pattern discussion' 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals 

Is everyone submitting them via email to Michelle and Greg??? 

-----Original Message----- 
From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org 
[ mailto : nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org] On Behalf Of Vicente 
"Vince" Bortone 
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:04 PM 
To: General pattern discussion 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals 

I submitted one and never got a respond. ?Looks like is standard procedure 
since everybody is having the same experience. ?Should we check with AMA? 

Vicente "Vince" Bortone 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mark Atwood" < atwoodm @paragon-inc.com> 
To: " nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org" < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:47:53 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals 

And I know lance submitted at least one if not two the we drafted. Something 
is amiss. 

-mark 
-------------------------- 
Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld 


----- Original Message ----- 
From: nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org 
< nsrca -discussion-bounces at lists. nsrca .org> 
To: General pattern discussion < nsrca -discussion at lists. nsrca .org> 
Sent: Tue Sep 29 21:49:46 2009 
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals 

I submitted three to the AMA and never got a response. I think they're dead 
over there. 

Tony 

On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:45 PM, John Fuqua wrote: 


?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?OK folks. ? I know we have been having fun discussing 
potential rules proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of today. 
Please take the time to submit your proposals as soon as possible. ?It would 
be nice to allow folks time to review and discuss them with each other and 
their Contest Board Representatives. ? I know we have a few months to the 
deadline but the whole idea was to post them as early as possible on the AMA 
Website during the year so they could be reviewed and discussed (cussed?). 
There will also be a Cross Proposal phase to make further changes. 
?? ? ? ? 
?? ? ? ?The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here: 
?? ? ? ? http :// www . modelaircraft .org/events/ ruleproposals . aspx 
?? ? ? ? 
?? ? ? ?Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle @ modelaircraft .org 
?? ? ? ?and Greg Hahn gregh @ modelaircraft .org 
?? ? ? ? 
?? ? ? ? 
?? ? ? ?Thanks 
?? ? ? ? 
?? ? ? ?John Fuqua 
?? ? ? ?RCA Contest Board Chairman 
?? ? ? ? _______________________________________________ 
?? ? ? ?NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
?? ? ? ?NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
?? ? ? ? http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
?? ? ? ? 

_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 


_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 


_______________________________________________ 
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NSRCA-discussion at lists. nsrca .org 
http ://lists. nsrca .org/mailman/ listinfo / nsrca -discussion 
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Tue Sep 29 18:25:30 2009
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (J Shu)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 02:25:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
In-Reply-To: <1389920382.7140431254277288286.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <1389920382.7140431254277288286.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <6A28D4F2538242DDBB2A20457EC43B85@UncleJasPC>

Would everyone care to post them here as well?

Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:21 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals


  I will do the same.

  Vicente "Vince" Bortone

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: "Dave Burton" <burtona at atmc.net>
  To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:11:59 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

  Yes, and I just re-sent it tonight.
  Dave

  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
  [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of John Fuqua
  Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:08 PM
  To: 'General pattern discussion'
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

  Is everyone submitting them via email to Michelle and Greg???

  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
  [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Vicente
  "Vince" Bortone
  Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:04 PM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

  I submitted one and never got a respond.  Looks like is standard procedure
  since everybody is having the same experience.  Should we check with AMA?

  Vicente "Vince" Bortone

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: "Mark Atwood" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
  To: "nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:47:53 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

  And I know lance submitted at least one if not two the we drafted. Something
  is amiss. 

  -mark
  --------------------------
  Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld


  ----- Original Message -----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
  <nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
  To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  Sent: Tue Sep 29 21:49:46 2009
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

  I submitted three to the AMA and never got a response. I think they're dead
  over there.

  Tony

  On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:45 PM, John Fuqua wrote:


                  OK folks.   I know we have been having fun discussing
  potential rules proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of today.
  Please take the time to submit your proposals as soon as possible.  It would
  be nice to allow folks time to review and discuss them with each other and
  their Contest Board Representatives.   I know we have a few months to the
  deadline but the whole idea was to post them as early as possible on the AMA
  Website during the year so they could be reviewed and discussed (cussed?).
  There will also be a Cross Proposal phase to make further changes.
           
          The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here:
          http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals.aspx
           
          Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle at modelaircraft.org
          and Greg Hahn gregh at modelaircraft.org
           
           
          Thanks
           
          John Fuqua
          RCA Contest Board Chairman
          _______________________________________________
          NSRCA-discussion mailing list
          NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
          http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
          

  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From patterndude at tx.rr.com  Tue Sep 29 18:42:30 2009
From: patterndude at tx.rr.com (Lance Van Nostrand)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 02:42:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
References: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D57EB931@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com><549250409.7133881254276228548.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<021e01ca4172$d2a471b0$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
Message-ID: <AB01D3196FB340E89C751143B2B6E5D9@homer>

Mine went to Michelle as it says on the form.
--Lance

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John Fuqua" <johnfuqua at embarqmail.com>
To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:07 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals


> Is everyone submitting them via email to Michelle and Greg???
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Vicente
> "Vince" Bortone
> Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:04 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
>
> I submitted one and never got a respond.  Looks like is standard procedure
> since everybody is having the same experience.  Should we check with AMA?
>
> Vicente "Vince" Bortone
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mark Atwood" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
> To: "nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:47:53 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
>
> And I know lance submitted at least one if not two the we drafted. 
> Something
> is amiss.
>
> -mark
> --------------------------
> Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> <nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Tue Sep 29 21:49:46 2009
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
>
> I submitted three to the AMA and never got a response. I think they're 
> dead
> over there.
>
> Tony
>
> On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:45 PM, John Fuqua wrote:
>
>
>                OK folks.   I know we have been having fun discussing
> potential rules proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of today.
> Please take the time to submit your proposals as soon as possible.  It 
> would
> be nice to allow folks time to review and discuss them with each other and
> their Contest Board Representatives.   I know we have a few months to the
> deadline but the whole idea was to post them as early as possible on the 
> AMA
> Website during the year so they could be reviewed and discussed (cussed?).
> There will also be a Cross Proposal phase to make further changes.
>
>        The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here:
>        http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals.aspx
>
>        Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle at modelaircraft.org
>        and Greg Hahn gregh at modelaircraft.org
>
>
>        Thanks
>
>        John Fuqua
>        RCA Contest Board Chairman
>        _______________________________________________
>        NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>        NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>        http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.115/2403 - Release Date: 09/29/09 
17:56:00


From burtona at atmc.net  Tue Sep 29 18:43:29 2009
From: burtona at atmc.net (Dave Burton)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 02:43:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
In-Reply-To: <6A28D4F2538242DDBB2A20457EC43B85@UncleJasPC>
References: <1389920382.7140431254277288286.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<6A28D4F2538242DDBB2A20457EC43B85@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <005c01ca4177$d93037d0$8b90a770$@net>

Mine is a proposal to eliminate mandatory class advancement, the points system, and any restrictions on which class a contestant may enter.

Dave Burton

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of J Shu
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:25 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

 

Would everyone care to post them here as well?


Regards,
Jason
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Vicente  <mailto:vicenterc at comcast.net> "Vince" Bortone 

To: General pattern discussion <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:21 PM

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

 

I will do the same.

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Burton" <burtona at atmc.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:11:59 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

Yes, and I just re-sent it tonight.
Dave

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of John Fuqua
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:08 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

Is everyone submitting them via email to Michelle and Greg???

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Vicente
"Vince" Bortone
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:04 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

I submitted one and never got a respond.  Looks like is standard procedure
since everybody is having the same experience.  Should we check with AMA?

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Atwood" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
To: "nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:47:53 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

And I know lance submitted at least one if not two the we drafted. Something
is amiss. 

-mark
--------------------------
Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld


----- Original Message -----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
<nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue Sep 29 21:49:46 2009
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

I submitted three to the AMA and never got a response. I think they're dead
over there.

Tony

On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:45 PM, John Fuqua wrote:


                OK folks.   I know we have been having fun discussing
potential rules proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of today.
Please take the time to submit your proposals as soon as possible.  It would
be nice to allow folks time to review and discuss them with each other and
their Contest Board Representatives.   I know we have a few months to the
deadline but the whole idea was to post them as early as possible on the AMA
Website during the year so they could be reviewed and discussed (cussed?).
There will also be a Cross Proposal phase to make further changes.
         
        The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here:
        http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals.aspx
         
        Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle at modelaircraft.org
        and Greg Hahn gregh at modelaircraft.org
         
         
        Thanks
         
        John Fuqua
        RCA Contest Board Chairman
        _______________________________________________
        NSRCA-discussion mailing list
        NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
        http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
        

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

  _____  

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From patterndude at tx.rr.com  Tue Sep 29 18:51:39 2009
From: patterndude at tx.rr.com (Lance Van Nostrand)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 02:51:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
References: <1389920382.7140431254277288286.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<6A28D4F2538242DDBB2A20457EC43B85@UncleJasPC>
Message-ID: <5835D0C2544E4F6289263155D440AD2D@homer>

Posting them on the AMA site allows for a consistent presentation of the change, the logic behind the change, and the impact.  I see no problem in posting them here too, but I think the entire proposal should be posted so the full story is told.  Also, constructive criticism can be more specific as to the wording to change.  Of course we need some way to limit comments to those that actually follow the written rules to begin with :)

--Lance
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: J Shu 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:25 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals


  Would everyone care to post them here as well?

  Regards,
  Jason
  www.shulmanaviation.com
  www.composite-arf.com

    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:21 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals


    I will do the same.

    Vicente "Vince" Bortone

    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Dave Burton" <burtona at atmc.net>
    To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
    Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:11:59 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

    Yes, and I just re-sent it tonight.
    Dave

    -----Original Message-----
    From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
    [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of John Fuqua
    Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:08 PM
    To: 'General pattern discussion'
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

    Is everyone submitting them via email to Michelle and Greg???

    -----Original Message-----
    From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
    [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Vicente
    "Vince" Bortone
    Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:04 PM
    To: General pattern discussion
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

    I submitted one and never got a respond.  Looks like is standard procedure
    since everybody is having the same experience.  Should we check with AMA?

    Vicente "Vince" Bortone

    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Mark Atwood" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
    To: "nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
    Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:47:53 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

    And I know lance submitted at least one if not two the we drafted. Something
    is amiss. 

    -mark
    --------------------------
    Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld


    ----- Original Message -----
    From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
    <nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
    To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
    Sent: Tue Sep 29 21:49:46 2009
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

    I submitted three to the AMA and never got a response. I think they're dead
    over there.

    Tony

    On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:45 PM, John Fuqua wrote:


                    OK folks.   I know we have been having fun discussing
    potential rules proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of today.
    Please take the time to submit your proposals as soon as possible.  It would
    be nice to allow folks time to review and discuss them with each other and
    their Contest Board Representatives.   I know we have a few months to the
    deadline but the whole idea was to post them as early as possible on the AMA
    Website during the year so they could be reviewed and discussed (cussed?).
    There will also be a Cross Proposal phase to make further changes.
             
            The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here:
            http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals.aspx
             
            Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle at modelaircraft.org
            and Greg Hahn gregh at modelaircraft.org
             
             
            Thanks
             
            John Fuqua
            RCA Contest Board Chairman
            _______________________________________________
            NSRCA-discussion mailing list
            NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
            http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
            

    _______________________________________________
    NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


    _______________________________________________
    NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


    _______________________________________________
    NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



----------------------------------------------------------------------------


    _______________________________________________
    NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


------------------------------------------------------------------------------



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From verne at twmi.rr.com  Tue Sep 29 19:34:04 2009
From: verne at twmi.rr.com (Verne Koester)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 03:34:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
In-Reply-To: <01eb01ca416f$b9de7660$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
References: <01eb01ca416f$b9de7660$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
Message-ID: <003301ca417e$d85d7a50$89186ef0$@rr.com>

I sent mine in right after the Nats.

 

Verne

 

From: John Fuqua [mailto:johnfuqua at embarqmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:46 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Cc: Michelle Lamb; Greg Hahn; Chris Lakin; Derek Koopowitz; 'Gary McCellan';
Joe Dunnaway; 'Lance Van Nostrand'; 'Mark Atwood'; 'Ron Lockhart'; Scott
Smith, Dist I; 'Tom Miller'; 'Verne Koester'
Subject: Rules Proposals

 

OK folks.   I know we have been having fun discussing potential rules
proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of today.   Please take the
time to submit your proposals as soon as possible.  It would be nice to
allow folks time to review and discuss them with each other and their
Contest Board Representatives.   I know we have a few months to the deadline
but the whole idea was to post them as early as possible on the AMA Website
during the year so they could be reviewed and discussed (cussed?).  There
will also be a Cross Proposal phase to make further changes.

 

The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here:

http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals.aspx

 

Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle at modelaircraft.org

and Greg Hahn gregh at modelaircraft.org

 

 

Thanks

 

John Fuqua

RCA Contest Board Chairman

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From verne at twmi.rr.com  Tue Sep 29 19:43:54 2009
From: verne at twmi.rr.com (Verne Koester)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 03:43:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
In-Reply-To: <021e01ca4172$d2a471b0$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
References: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D57EB931@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>	<549250409.7133881254276228548.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<021e01ca4172$d2a471b0$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
Message-ID: <003b01ca4180$38f94500$aaebcf00$@rr.com>

I originally sent mine to michelle as instructed on the top of the proposal
form. I just re-sent it and included a copy to you and Greg Hahn. I've
requested that they confirm that they got it.

Verne

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of John Fuqua
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:08 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

Is everyone submitting them via email to Michelle and Greg???

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Vicente
"Vince" Bortone
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:04 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

I submitted one and never got a respond.  Looks like is standard procedure
since everybody is having the same experience.  Should we check with AMA?

Vicente "Vince" Bortone

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Atwood" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
To: "nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:47:53 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

And I know lance submitted at least one if not two the we drafted. Something
is amiss. 

-mark
--------------------------
Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld


----- Original Message -----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
<nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue Sep 29 21:49:46 2009
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

I submitted three to the AMA and never got a response. I think they're dead
over there.

Tony

On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:45 PM, John Fuqua wrote:


                OK folks.   I know we have been having fun discussing
potential rules proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of today.
Please take the time to submit your proposals as soon as possible.  It would
be nice to allow folks time to review and discuss them with each other and
their Contest Board Representatives.   I know we have a few months to the
deadline but the whole idea was to post them as early as possible on the AMA
Website during the year so they could be reviewed and discussed (cussed?).
There will also be a Cross Proposal phase to make further changes.
         
        The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here:
        http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals.aspx
         
        Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle at modelaircraft.org
        and Greg Hahn gregh at modelaircraft.org
         
         
        Thanks
         
        John Fuqua
        RCA Contest Board Chairman
        _______________________________________________
        NSRCA-discussion mailing list
        NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
        http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
        

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Wed Sep 30 11:43:30 2009
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 19:43:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Planning team for the world championships in 2011
Message-ID: <3454543c0909301243j59e0779dnee878dfbeb43f784@mail.gmail.com>

The NSRCA needs a number of people to help out with the planning for the WCs
in 2011... I'm attaching a short description of each area that we need help
with - I'm sure that several of these can be combined into one position.  If
you are interested in helping out it would be greatly appreciated.  Each
bullet point is a coordinator position and can form their own committee with
helpers to help with the item.

   1. Judges Coordinator - the majority of the judges will be
   arriving/departing around the same day/time and we should arrange a mini-van
   or mini-bus to pick them up and transport them to their hotel in Muncie and
   then to drop them off at the airport in Indianapolis.  All the judges are
   given "goodie" (gift) tote bags as a souvenir - this person is responsible
   for procuring the bags (working with the AMA on this perhaps) and then
   filling them with stuff such as a t-shirt/cap/jacket along with some other
   local Indiana or USA souvenir items.  We also need to ensure that the judges
   are picked up at their hotel in the morning and taken to the AMA flying site
   - 2 trips a day (morning judging session and afternoon judging session).
   This will probably entail renting a van/mini-bus large enough to transport
   about 42 people maximum (judge plus their caller/scribe).
   2. Jury Member Coordinator - very similar to the judges coordinator
   except that there will only be 3 jury members and I'm sure that only 1 or 2
   of them will need transportation.  I think this position can be combined
   with #1.
   3. Practice Field Coordinator - probably should be located in the Muncie
   area (or close to it) to help solicit flying fields for practice sites for
   prior to the event and during as well.  We'll need to get the GPS
   coordinates and detailed directions on how to get to the clubs so that we
   can publish this in one of the bulletins.
   4. Opening Ceremony Coordinator - arranges for the Master of Ceremony for
   the opening ceremony.  Works with the AMA to have flag poles for all the
   country flags to be displayed along with the FAI flag, AMA flag and US
   flag.  Arranges for escorts for each country when they are marching in to
   their positions under their country flag (could be cub scouts).  Arranges
   for each countries national anthem to be played during the entry by that
   country at the opening ceremony march.  Arranges for any special
   activities that will take place during the opening ceremony such as
   skydivers, full size plane fly-bys etc.  Arranges for speakers at the
   opening ceremony - such as Jim Cherry, CIAM President (if present), local
   Muncie mayor (perhaps).
   5. Closing Ceremony Coordinator (could be combined with #4) - arranges
   for the Master of Ceremony for the closing ceremony.  Works with the AMA to
   have the country flags of the top 3 pilots to be available for raising
   during the prize giving ceremony.  Arranges for the national anthems to
   be played for the top 3 pilots during the prize giving and flag
raising.  Arranges
   for the flags of the top 3 country teams to be available for raising during
   the prize giving.  Arranges for the national anthems to be played for the
   top 3 country teams during the prize giving and flag raising.  Arranges
   for speakers at the closing ceremony such as Jim Cherry and the CIAM
   president.  Arranges for the FAI flag to be handed over to the next
   country hosting the World Championship.
   6. Banquet Coordinator - the AMA will help with procuring the facility
   (more than likely the Horizon Convention Center) and perhaps the menu as
   well.  Arranges for the Master of Ceremony for the banquet.  Arranges for
   any special activities to take place during the banquet such as any local
   Muncie area entertainment.  Arranges sale of banquet tickets during the
   event - AMA can handle the ticket sales but we'll need to ensure that
   tickets are available and collected at the banquet facility.  Supplies
   detailed directions on how to get to the banquet facility.
   7. Off-Day Tour Coordinator - on the rain day the judges/jury are usually
   taken on a site-seeing tour.  Arranges tour for the judges/jury members
   during the off-day - perhaps the Dayton Air Museum or Indianapolis Raceway.
   Arranges transportation from the hotels of the judges/jury members to the
   tour site.  Arranges meals for the judges/jury members during the day
   tour.  Publishes detailed directions from the AMA HQ to the tour site for
   those that wish to drive there themselves.
   8. Catering Coordinator - works with the AMA to procure a caterer that
   can feed the judges/jury a breakfast at their hotel (or another facility)
   each morning.  The standard continental breakfast that is usually served at
   local hotels will not work to feed judges from other countries.  Arranges
   lunch (work with the AMA) for the judges/jury members during the event -
   this is usually in a central location (tent) where they can be served a
   buffet type lunch.  Arranges dinner for the judges/jury members at their
   hotel each night (or at a central location).  Arranges
   snacks/coffee/water to be delivered to each flying site daily for the judges
   and workers - work with the AMA on this.  Arranges food at the flying
   site (work with the AMA and their local food vendors) to be available for
   purchase on a daily basis for the competitors and spectators.
   9. Team Registration Coordinator - work with the AMA on this.  Arranges
   all the team packets to be picked up by the team manager - Packets to
   contain badges and parking passes ? badges will have pictures and names of
   all team members, managers, helpers and supporters.  Arranges team
   ?goodie? bags much like the judges goodie bags.
   10. Team Manager Meeting Coordinator - work with the AMA on a meeting
   room.  The event director will hold team manager meetings prior to the
   event, prior to the semi-finals and prior to the finals.  Arranges flight
   orders are available for handout at each of the meetings after the flight
   order selections have been made - work with the AMA to have enough copies
   made.
   11. Judges Training Coordinator (probably can combine with #10) - work
   with the AMA on a meeting room.  Arranges meeting room for the judges
   training.  Ensure meeting room has a screen to show presentations.
   12. Scoring Coordinator - works with the event director to ensure
that scoring
   computers are available along with printers and a copier and any necessary
   tables etc.  Arrange for different color printer paper to be used to
   print the raw score sheets for each day - in other words, yellow for day 1,
   blue for day 2, green for day 3, etc.  Arrange to have internet access in
   the scoring facility for the webmaster to update the website.
   13. Unknown Selection Meeting Coordinator (probably can combine with #10)
   - work with the AMA on a meeting room.  Arrange a meeting room for the
   unknown selection meeting.  Ensure meeting room has a screen to show
   presentations and unknowns.  Ensure computer and color printer is
   available to print out unknowns.  Ensure copier is available to make
   copies of the selected unknowns.
   14. Vendor Coordinator - ideally we'd like to have a vendor tent on site
   that can be used for vendors to display items for sale etc.  Work with the
   AMA to get the tent.  Arranges for vendors to display their items for
   sale in the vendor tent.
   15. Sponsorship Coordinator (same person as #14 perhaps) - Contacts all
   pattern related vendors and solicits sponsorships from them or advertising
   in the event program - Sponsorships available are for pilot/TM bibs, BBQ
   after the preliminary rounds are completed, banners for display at each
   flying site, banquet sponsorship.  I have several vendors that are very
   interested in sponsorship already.
   16. Program/Merchandise Coordinator - works with the AMA to ensure
   adequate supplies of t-shirts, polo shirts, sweatshirts, caps and other
   merchandise is available for purchase by attendees.  Assembles the event
   program which will list each team member/photos, sponsors, letters from
   dignitaries, maps, etc.  Arranges to have the event program printed and
   available for each team/attendee (perhaps a sponsor can be arranged for this
   printing).
   17.  AMA Coordinator - works with the AMA to ensure that the flying sites
   are set up correctly.  This will include all center poles, box poles,
   pilot boxes, noise testing circles and ready boxes (2 at each
site).  Ensures
   that tents/canopies are available for the judges/scribes at each flying site
   and that there are enough chairs for the judges/scribes.  Works with the
   AMA to ensure that the equipment needed at each flying site is available
   such as PA system, weight measuring scales, noise measuring equipment and
   digital volt meters to measure battery voltage.  Works with the AMA to
   ensure that competitor fuel is stored in a secured area along with any
   batteries/equipment that is shipped to the AMA facility and is released to
   the appropriate people at the right time.

Seems like a lot of committees/people but I think several of them can be
combined into 1 person coordinating the effort.  The bulk of this effort
will be done prior to the WC's and the sooner we can get started (and
finished) with these areas the better.

The contest director will post his own list of resources that will be needed
for flight lines, processing, etc.

We really appreciate the offers of help and if you'd like to voluntee some
time for this effort it would be very much appreciated!

-Derek
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From shannah1806 at gmail.com  Wed Sep 30 12:17:10 2009
From: shannah1806 at gmail.com (steve hannah)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 20:17:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] iPhone as judging aid
Message-ID: <c3f99b710909301317mfb6294clb2eedfcd18c55cc7@mail.gmail.com>

What do you guys think about using the iphone as a judge aid?  What if I
pulled my iPhone out and used the inclinometer app (i like "clinometer",
very easy to see the numbers in the daylight) to aid in judging 45's and
lines in general?  Would the fliers I am judging revolt?

I also plan on having the rulebook accessible as well.

There was talk a while back about using it as a scoring tool, that would be
great but someone needs to write the app....

You won't see me doing this till next year, looks like my season is over due
to my son's wedding in a couple weeks and then work travel on top of the PHX
contest.

Anyway, food for thought.
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From rickwallace45 at gmail.com  Wed Sep 30 12:35:09 2009
From: rickwallace45 at gmail.com (richard wallace)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 20:35:09 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] iPhone as judging aid
In-Reply-To: <c3f99b710909301317mfb6294clb2eedfcd18c55cc7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c3f99b710909301317mfb6294clb2eedfcd18c55cc7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <c8a7c8ec0909301335y31181dbco76a0d6e1317fb429@mail.gmail.com>

wow... folks go crazy when a judge holds up a pencil as a reference for a
straight or vertical line-- Can't wait to hear the response to this!
to my way of thinking, anything that helps the judge be CORRECT has to be
better than judging the pilot's errors in geometry through the filter of the
judge's misconceptions about geometry... there IS an absolute standard here
-
go for it!


On Wed, Sep 30, 2009 at 4:17 PM, steve hannah <shannah1806 at gmail.com> wrote:

> What do you guys think about using the iphone as a judge aid?  What if I
> pulled my iPhone out and used the inclinometer app (i like "clinometer",
> very easy to see the numbers in the daylight) to aid in judging 45's and
> lines in general?  Would the fliers I am judging revolt?
>
> I also plan on having the rulebook accessible as well.
>
> There was talk a while back about using it as a scoring tool, that would be
> great but someone needs to write the app....
>
> You won't see me doing this till next year, looks like my season is over
> due to my son's wedding in a couple weeks and then work travel on top of the
> PHX contest.
>
> Anyway, food for thought.
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Wed Sep 30 12:37:13 2009
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Atwood, Mark)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 20:37:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] iPhone as judging aid
In-Reply-To: <c3f99b710909301317mfb6294clb2eedfcd18c55cc7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c3f99b710909301317mfb6294clb2eedfcd18c55cc7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7E4D@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>

Judges are not allowed to use reference materials per the rulebook.    But as a scoring device...we've talk a lot over the years about how that could be done.  It would certainly be nice if there was a way to avoid all the double entry of scores.

-M

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of steve hannah
Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 4:17 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] iPhone as judging aid

What do you guys think about using the iphone as a judge aid?  What if I pulled my iPhone out and used the inclinometer app (i like "clinometer", very easy to see the numbers in the daylight) to aid in judging 45's and lines in general?  Would the fliers I am judging revolt?

I also plan on having the rulebook accessible as well.

There was talk a while back about using it as a scoring tool, that would be great but someone needs to write the app....

You won't see me doing this till next year, looks like my season is over due to my son's wedding in a couple weeks and then work travel on top of the PHX contest.

Anyway, food for thought.

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.114/2402 - Release Date: 09/30/09 10:35:00
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From robcase1 at cox.net  Wed Sep 30 13:17:01 2009
From: robcase1 at cox.net (Robert & Casey Green)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 21:17:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] test
Message-ID: <001a01ca4213$5896a540$6701a8c0@BEDROOM>

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From shannah1806 at gmail.com  Wed Sep 30 13:36:28 2009
From: shannah1806 at gmail.com (steve hannah)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 21:36:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] iPhone as judging aid
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7E4D@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
References: <c3f99b710909301317mfb6294clb2eedfcd18c55cc7@mail.gmail.com>
	<99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7E4D@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <c3f99b710909301436w6603dc12w12708dfc034239e1@mail.gmail.com>

What is defined as reference materials, per the rulebook?  I couldn't find
that in the AMA or FAI rules.

On Wed, Sep 30, 2009 at 1:27 PM, Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>wrote:

>  Judges are not allowed to use reference materials per the rulebook.
> But as a scoring device?we?ve talk a lot over the years about how that could
> be done.  It would certainly be nice if there was a way to avoid all the
> double entry of scores.
>
>
>
> -M
>
>
>
> *From:* nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] *On Behalf Of *steve hannah
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 30, 2009 4:17 PM
> *To:* General pattern discussion
> *Subject:* [NSRCA-discussion] iPhone as judging aid
>
>
>
> What do you guys think about using the iphone as a judge aid?  What if I
> pulled my iPhone out and used the inclinometer app (i like "clinometer",
> very easy to see the numbers in the daylight) to aid in judging 45's and
> lines in general?  Would the fliers I am judging revolt?
>
> I also plan on having the rulebook accessible as well.
>
> There was talk a while back about using it as a scoring tool, that would be
> great but someone needs to write the app....
>
> You won't see me doing this till next year, looks like my season is over
> due to my son's wedding in a couple weeks and then work travel on top of the
> PHX contest.
>
> Anyway, food for thought.
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.114/2402 - Release Date: 09/30/09
> 10:35:00
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From johnfuqua at embarqmail.com  Wed Sep 30 13:44:00 2009
From: johnfuqua at embarqmail.com (John Fuqua)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 21:44:00 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals
In-Reply-To: <021e01ca4172$d2a471b0$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
References: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D57EB931@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com><549250409.7133881254276228548.JavaMail.root@sz0152a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<021e01ca4172$d2a471b0$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>
Message-ID: <029201ca4217$0f35de30$7101a8c0@ltm733c31251f5>

AS of today proposals by Vince Bartone, Dave Burton, Verne Koester and Tony
Frakowiak are posted to the AMA website.  

If you submitted a proposal and it is still not posted please send to AMA
info me at johnfuqua at embarqmail.com

Thanks

John



----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Atwood" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
To: "nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:47:53 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

And I know lance submitted at least one if not two the we drafted. Something
is amiss. 

-mark
--------------------------
Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld


----- Original Message -----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
<nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue Sep 29 21:49:46 2009
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rules Proposals

I submitted three to the AMA and never got a response. I think they're dead
over there.

Tony

On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:45 PM, John Fuqua wrote:


                OK folks.   I know we have been having fun discussing
potential rules proposals but nobody has submitted any to AMA as of today.
Please take the time to submit your proposals as soon as possible.  It would
be nice to allow folks time to review and discuss them with each other and
their Contest Board Representatives.   I know we have a few months to the
deadline but the whole idea was to post them as early as possible on the AMA
Website during the year so they could be reviewed and discussed (cussed?).
There will also be a Cross Proposal phase to make further changes.
         
        The Rules Proposal form is on the AMA website here:
        http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals.aspx
         
        Please email them to Michelle Lamb michelle at modelaircraft.org
        and Greg Hahn gregh at modelaircraft.org
         
         
        Thanks
         
        John Fuqua
        RCA Contest Board Chairman
        _______________________________________________
        NSRCA-discussion mailing list
        NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
        http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
        

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From perkinsrx at centurytel.net  Wed Sep 30 14:31:54 2009
From: perkinsrx at centurytel.net (W. Eddie Batchelor)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 22:31:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] iPhone as judging aid
In-Reply-To: <c3f99b710909301436w6603dc12w12708dfc034239e1@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200909302231.n8UMVnYj005490@mail938c35.nsolutionszone.com>

Well I was told a pencil for reference to line length, as mentioned earlier,
is definitely a reference material.

Ed

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of steve hannah
Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 4:36 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] iPhone as judging aid

 

What is defined as reference materials, per the rulebook?  I couldn't find
that in the AMA or FAI rules.

On Wed, Sep 30, 2009 at 1:27 PM, Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
wrote:

Judges are not allowed to use reference materials per the rulebook.    But
as a scoring device.we've talk a lot over the years about how that could be
done.  It would certainly be nice if there was a way to avoid all the double
entry of scores.

 

-M

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of steve hannah
Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 4:17 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] iPhone as judging aid

 

What do you guys think about using the iphone as a judge aid?  What if I
pulled my iPhone out and used the inclinometer app (i like "clinometer",
very easy to see the numbers in the daylight) to aid in judging 45's and
lines in general?  Would the fliers I am judging revolt?

I also plan on having the rulebook accessible as well.

There was talk a while back about using it as a scoring tool, that would be
great but someone needs to write the app....

You won't see me doing this till next year, looks like my season is over due
to my son's wedding in a couple weeks and then work travel on top of the PHX
contest.  

Anyway, food for thought.

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.114/2402 - Release Date: 09/30/09
10:35:00


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

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From tkeithblack at gmail.com  Wed Sep 30 14:46:28 2009
From: tkeithblack at gmail.com (Keith Black)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 22:46:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D6 Contest this Weekend!
In-Reply-To: <20090929085722.9B4SE.777817.root@Web03>
References: <20090929085722.9B4SE.777817.root@Web03>
Message-ID: <77f26e410909301546ra2f4a73qedffc51f2232a86b@mail.gmail.com>

George, I was planning on coming but I ended up having to take a
business trip to Germany. You guys have fun, I'll be thinking about
you.

On Tuesday, September 29, 2009,  <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> wrote:
> Hello D6!
>
> I hope that everyone is planning to come to the Gulf coast Pattern Championship this weekend in Sulphur, LA. ? ?It looks like the weather is going to cooperate with temps from 70 to low 80s and a low chance of rain showers. ?Winds are predicted to be light.
>
>
> The field is open all week if you want to come early and practice.
>
> If you haven't responded to my RC Universe thread and are planning to come, drop me a note so I can pre enter you in the Scoring program.
>
> glmiller3 at http://suddenlink.net
>
> directions and local info are on our web site at:
>
> http://www.larksrc.org
>
> See you all there!
>
> George
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>

From ahrensw at charter.net  Wed Sep 30 15:17:58 2009
From: ahrensw at charter.net (Bill Ahrens)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 23:17:58 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] New,
	never used Thunder Power Smart Balancer THP-210V
In-Reply-To: <00e401ca40a8$26570140$730503c0$@net>
References: <BLU106-W4A888878F90045D4DC2D6CDD60@phx.gbl>
	<00e401ca40a8$26570140$730503c0$@net>
Message-ID: <004b01ca4224$35d57d40$a18077c0$@net>

For Sale new box Thunder Power Smart Balancer THP-210V  $80.00 with free
shipping to lower 48.  

 

Please contact me if interested,  

ahrensw at charter.net

 

Thanks,

Bill Ahrens 

NSRCA 619

 

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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Wed Sep 30 15:27:44 2009
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 23:27:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] iPhone as judging aid
In-Reply-To: <c8a7c8ec0909301335y31181dbco76a0d6e1317fb429@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c3f99b710909301317mfb6294clb2eedfcd18c55cc7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BLU121-W179EB06526A01309324814E8D40@phx.gbl>


Now all that is needed is a laser range finder and an iPhone app that integrates distance of the model to adjust for parallax, and we've really got something.  
 


Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 16:35:07 -0400
From: rickwallace45 at gmail.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] iPhone as judging aid


wow... folks go crazy when a judge holds up a pencil as a reference for a straight or vertical line-- Can't wait to hear the response to this! 
to my way of thinking, anything that helps the judge be CORRECT has to be better than judging the pilot's errors in geometry through the filter of the judge's misconceptions about geometry... there IS an absolute standard here - 
go for it! 

 
On Wed, Sep 30, 2009 at 4:17 PM, steve hannah <shannah1806 at gmail.com> wrote:

What do you guys think about using the iphone as a judge aid?  What if I pulled my iPhone out and used the inclinometer app (i like "clinometer", very easy to see the numbers in the daylight) to aid in judging 45's and lines in general?  Would the fliers I am judging revolt?

I also plan on having the rulebook accessible as well.

There was talk a while back about using it as a scoring tool, that would be great but someone needs to write the app....

You won't see me doing this till next year, looks like my season is over due to my son's wedding in a couple weeks and then work travel on top of the PHX contest.  

Anyway, food for thought.

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 		 	   		  
_________________________________________________________________
Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail?.
http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_QuickAdd_062009
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From tony at radiosouthrc.com  Wed Sep 30 15:41:02 2009
From: tony at radiosouthrc.com (Tony)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 23:41:02 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Planning team for the world championships in
	2011
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0909301243j59e0779dnee878dfbeb43f784@mail.gmail.com>
References: <3454543c0909301243j59e0779dnee878dfbeb43f784@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <ECEDCEC6C92E44AC82D25FF973A5DED8@Tony>

Derek has put a lot of thought and work into this.  Now is the time for us
as NSRCA members to step up and get the work done.  If you cannot attend the
event, you may be able to fill one of these positions and get all the work
done prior to the WC.  Or, perhaps you want to serve as a worker on the
flight line.  Well, you can do that, but you can also work on one or more of
these committees!  

 

This course of action is exactly what Ron Van Putte and I used to setup and
plan the 1999 WC in Pensacola/Navarre, FL.  



Derek knows that I will help in what ever area he needs.  How about you?
Are you willing to step up to the plate for NSRCA and AMA and the USA?

 

Tony Stillman, President

Radio South, Inc.

139 Altama Connector, Box 322

Brunswick, GA  31525

1-800-962-7802

www.radiosouthrc.com

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Derek
Koopowitz
Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 3:43 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Planning team for the world championships in
2011

 

The NSRCA needs a number of people to help out with the planning for the WCs
in 2011... I'm attaching a short description of each area that we need help
with - I'm sure that several of these can be combined into one position.  If
you are interested in helping out it would be greatly appreciated.  Each
bullet point is a coordinator position and can form their own committee with
helpers to help with the item.

1.	Judges Coordinator - the majority of the judges will be
arriving/departing around the same day/time and we should arrange a mini-van
or mini-bus to pick them up and transport them to their hotel in Muncie and
then to drop them off at the airport in Indianapolis.  All the judges are
given "goodie" (gift) tote bags as a souvenir - this person is responsible
for procuring the bags (working with the AMA on this perhaps) and then
filling them with stuff such as a t-shirt/cap/jacket along with some other
local Indiana or USA souvenir items.  We also need to ensure that the judges
are picked up at their hotel in the morning and taken to the AMA flying site
- 2 trips a day (morning judging session and afternoon judging session).
This will probably entail renting a van/mini-bus large enough to transport
about 42 people maximum (judge plus their caller/scribe).
2.	Jury Member Coordinator - very similar to the judges coordinator
except that there will only be 3 jury members and I'm sure that only 1 or 2
of them will need transportation.  I think this position can be combined
with #1.
3.	Practice Field Coordinator - probably should be located in the
Muncie area (or close to it) to help solicit flying fields for practice
sites for prior to the event and during as well.  We'll need to get the GPS
coordinates and detailed directions on how to get to the clubs so that we
can publish this in one of the bulletins.
4.	Opening Ceremony Coordinator - arranges for the Master of Ceremony
for the opening ceremony.  Works with the AMA to have flag poles for all the
country flags to be displayed along with the FAI flag, AMA flag and US flag.
Arranges for escorts for each country when they are marching in to their
positions under their country flag (could be cub scouts).  Arranges for each
countries national anthem to be played during the entry by that country at
the opening ceremony march.  Arranges for any special activities that will
take place during the opening ceremony such as skydivers, full size plane
fly-bys etc.  Arranges for speakers at the opening ceremony - such as Jim
Cherry, CIAM President (if present), local Muncie mayor (perhaps).
5.	Closing Ceremony Coordinator (could be combined with #4) - arranges
for the Master of Ceremony for the closing ceremony.  Works with the AMA to
have the country flags of the top 3 pilots to be available for raising
during the prize giving ceremony.  Arranges for the national anthems to be
played for the top 3 pilots during the prize giving and flag raising.
Arranges for the flags of the top 3 country teams to be available for
raising during the prize giving.  Arranges for the national anthems to be
played for the top 3 country teams during the prize giving and flag raising.
Arranges for speakers at the closing ceremony such as Jim Cherry and the
CIAM president.  Arranges for the FAI flag to be handed over to the next
country hosting the World Championship.
6.	Banquet Coordinator - the AMA will help with procuring the facility
(more than likely the Horizon Convention Center) and perhaps the menu as
well.  Arranges for the Master of Ceremony for the banquet.  Arranges for
any special activities to take place during the banquet such as any local
Muncie area entertainment.  Arranges sale of banquet tickets during the
event - AMA can handle the ticket sales but we'll need to ensure that
tickets are available and collected at the banquet facility.  Supplies
detailed directions on how to get to the banquet facility.
7.	Off-Day Tour Coordinator - on the rain day the judges/jury are
usually taken on a site-seeing tour.  Arranges tour for the judges/jury
members during the off-day - perhaps the Dayton Air Museum or Indianapolis
Raceway.  Arranges transportation from the hotels of the judges/jury members
to the tour site.  Arranges meals for the judges/jury members during the day
tour.  Publishes detailed directions from the AMA HQ to the tour site for
those that wish to drive there themselves.
8.	Catering Coordinator - works with the AMA to procure a caterer that
can feed the judges/jury a breakfast at their hotel (or another facility)
each morning.  The standard continental breakfast that is usually served at
local hotels will not work to feed judges from other countries.  Arranges
lunch (work with the AMA) for the judges/jury members during the event -
this is usually in a central location (tent) where they can be served a
buffet type lunch.  Arranges dinner for the judges/jury members at their
hotel each night (or at a central location).  Arranges snacks/coffee/water
to be delivered to each flying site daily for the judges and workers - work
with the AMA on this.  Arranges food at the flying site (work with the AMA
and their local food vendors) to be available for purchase on a daily basis
for the competitors and spectators.
9.	Team Registration Coordinator - work with the AMA on this.  Arranges
all the team packets to be picked up by the team manager - Packets to
contain badges and parking passes - badges will have pictures and names of
all team members, managers, helpers and supporters.  Arranges team "goodie"
bags much like the judges goodie bags.
10.	Team Manager Meeting Coordinator - work with the AMA on a meeting
room.  The event director will hold team manager meetings prior to the
event, prior to the semi-finals and prior to the finals.  Arranges flight
orders are available for handout at each of the meetings after the flight
order selections have been made - work with the AMA to have enough copies
made.
11.	Judges Training Coordinator (probably can combine with #10) - work
with the AMA on a meeting room.  Arranges meeting room for the judges
training.  Ensure meeting room has a screen to show presentations.
12.	Scoring Coordinator - works with the event director to ensure that
scoring computers are available along with printers and a copier and any
necessary tables etc.  Arrange for different color printer paper to be used
to print the raw score sheets for each day - in other words, yellow for day
1, blue for day 2, green for day 3, etc.  Arrange to have internet access in
the scoring facility for the webmaster to update the website.
13.	Unknown Selection Meeting Coordinator (probably can combine with
#10) - work with the AMA on a meeting room.  Arrange a meeting room for the
unknown selection meeting.  Ensure meeting room has a screen to show
presentations and unknowns.  Ensure computer and color printer is available
to print out unknowns.  Ensure copier is available to make copies of the
selected unknowns.
14.	Vendor Coordinator - ideally we'd like to have a vendor tent on site
that can be used for vendors to display items for sale etc.  Work with the
AMA to get the tent.  Arranges for vendors to display their items for sale
in the vendor tent.
15.	Sponsorship Coordinator (same person as #14 perhaps) - Contacts all
pattern related vendors and solicits sponsorships from them or advertising
in the event program - Sponsorships available are for pilot/TM bibs, BBQ
after the preliminary rounds are completed, banners for display at each
flying site, banquet sponsorship.  I have several vendors that are very
interested in sponsorship already.
16.	Program/Merchandise Coordinator - works with the AMA to ensure
adequate supplies of t-shirts, polo shirts, sweatshirts, caps and other
merchandise is available for purchase by attendees.  Assembles the event
program which will list each team member/photos, sponsors, letters from
dignitaries, maps, etc.  Arranges to have the event program printed and
available for each team/attendee (perhaps a sponsor can be arranged for this
printing).
17.	 AMA Coordinator - works with the AMA to ensure that the flying
sites are set up correctly.  This will include all center poles, box poles,
pilot boxes, noise testing circles and ready boxes (2 at each site).
Ensures that tents/canopies are available for the judges/scribes at each
flying site and that there are enough chairs for the judges/scribes.  Works
with the AMA to ensure that the equipment needed at each flying site is
available such as PA system, weight measuring scales, noise measuring
equipment and digital volt meters to measure battery voltage.  Works with
the AMA to ensure that competitor fuel is stored in a secured area along
with any batteries/equipment that is shipped to the AMA facility and is
released to the appropriate people at the right time.

Seems like a lot of committees/people but I think several of them can be
combined into 1 person coordinating the effort.  The bulk of this effort
will be done prior to the WC's and the sooner we can get started (and
finished) with these areas the better.

 

The contest director will post his own list of resources that will be needed
for flight lines, processing, etc.

 

We really appreciate the offers of help and if you'd like to voluntee some
time for this effort it would be very much appreciated!

 

-Derek

 

 

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From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Wed Sep 30 15:43:21 2009
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2009 23:43:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D6 Contest this Weekend!
In-Reply-To: <77f26e410909301546ra2f4a73qedffc51f2232a86b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090930184320.CJC20.485315.root@Web01>

HI Keith!

Sorry that you can't make it.  I haven't seen all year.  

Have a safe trip to Germany! Come down to Crowley if you get a chance at the end of October.

George

---- Keith Black <tkeithblack at gmail.com> wrote: 

=============
George, I was planning on coming but I ended up having to take a
business trip to Germany. You guys have fun, I'll be thinking about
you.

On Tuesday, September 29, 2009,  <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> wrote:
> Hello D6!
>
> I hope that everyone is planning to come to the Gulf coast Pattern Championship this weekend in Sulphur, LA. ? ?It looks like the weather is going to cooperate with temps from 70 to low 80s and a low chance of rain showers. ?Winds are predicted to be light.
>
>
> The field is open all week if you want to come early and practice.
>
> If you haven't responded to my RC Universe thread and are planning to come, drop me a note so I can pre enter you in the Scoring program.
>
> glmiller3 at http://suddenlink.net
>
> directions and local info are on our web site at:
>
> http://www.larksrc.org
>
> See you all there!
>
> George
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From rjo626 at aol.com  Wed Sep 30 16:00:38 2009
From: rjo626 at aol.com (rjo626 at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 01 Oct 2009 00:00:38 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] iPhone as judging aid
Message-ID: <8CC10414E71E6C6-3F2C-1775C@webmail-d013.sysops.aol.com>


???? May be useful in some ways, recording scores without looking down, but a true 45 in the air won't

match a 45 referenced from the ground.



???? Later!

???????????? RJO
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From flyinbill1 at bellsouth.net  Wed Sep 30 16:08:13 2009
From: flyinbill1 at bellsouth.net (William C. Harden)
Date: Thu, 01 Oct 2009 00:08:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] another test
In-Reply-To: <001a01ca4213$5896a540$6701a8c0@BEDROOM>
References: <001a01ca4213$5896a540$6701a8c0@BEDROOM>
Message-ID: <11F18AA0563F498F9A233B73B0804BA2@bill>

It works.

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Robert &
Casey Green
Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 4:17 PM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] test

 

 

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From rickwallace45 at gmail.com  Wed Sep 30 17:03:39 2009
From: rickwallace45 at gmail.com (richard wallace)
Date: Thu, 01 Oct 2009 01:03:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] iPhone as judging aid
In-Reply-To: <99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7E4D@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
References: <c3f99b710909301317mfb6294clb2eedfcd18c55cc7@mail.gmail.com>
	<99B8EFCA36A5724F87FF3C71B431D87216D59B7E4D@PEVM01.paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <c8a7c8ec0909301803r68490906m888c9ee0335d7b2e@mail.gmail.com>

It's completely possible - I work on a software project, and a few years ago
as part of his masters degree work one of my developers wrote a program to
go on a PDA that would allow the judges to enter scores using the touch
screen; as soon as the flight was finished the judge could review the
scores, and then send them back wirelessly to the scoring computer.

It got him and his grad school team an 'A'; they got through the prototype
stage, but never turned it into a real product. No reason it couldn't
though... if you could beat the logistics and training issues.

On Wed, Sep 30, 2009 at 4:27 PM, Atwood, Mark <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>wrote:

>  Judges are not allowed to use reference materials per the rulebook.
> But as a scoring device?we?ve talk a lot over the years about how that could
> be done.  It would certainly be nice if there was a way to avoid all the
> double entry of scores.
>
>
>
> -M
>
>
>
> *From:* nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] *On Behalf Of *steve hannah
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 30, 2009 4:17 PM
> *To:* General pattern discussion
> *Subject:* [NSRCA-discussion] iPhone as judging aid
>
>
>
> What do you guys think about using the iphone as a judge aid?  What if I
> pulled my iPhone out and used the inclinometer app (i like "clinometer",
> very easy to see the numbers in the daylight) to aid in judging 45's and
> lines in general?  Would the fliers I am judging revolt?
>
> I also plan on having the rulebook accessible as well.
>
> There was talk a while back about using it as a scoring tool, that would be
> great but someone needs to write the app....
>
> You won't see me doing this till next year, looks like my season is over
> due to my son's wedding in a couple weeks and then work travel on top of the
> PHX contest.
>
> Anyway, food for thought.
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.114/2402 - Release Date: 09/30/09
> 10:35:00
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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