From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Mon Sep  1 00:19:37 2008
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Mon, 01 Sep 2008 08:19:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Need header for OS 140
In-Reply-To: <004101c90bb5$75301000$6401a8c0@YOUR5FD3828D21>
Message-ID: <596682.66107.qm@web33007.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I have an extra that I won't use. Not sure on the rise. I am working tomorrow. If interested, I can contact you tomorrow night. 


Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Sun, 8/31/08, Dave Michael <davidmichael1 at comcast.net> wrote:
From: Dave Michael <davidmichael1 at comcast.net>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Need header for OS 140
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Sunday, August 31, 2008, 3:03 PM



 
#yiv1117504406 .hmmessage P {
PADDING-RIGHT:0px;PADDING-LEFT:0px;PADDING-BOTTOM:0px;MARGIN:0px;PADDING-TOP:0px;}
#yiv1117504406 {
FONT-SIZE:10pt;FONT-FAMILY:Tahoma;}


Does anyone have a header for an OS 140 that they want to 
sell?? Mine broke this weekend and I am just getting going on a new to me 
pattern plane to fly in a contest later this month (it was a used flexible 
type).
?
Pipe is an Aeroslave-? 20mm inlet, I believe.? 
Not sure of the drop- quite frankly I'm not sure how it is measured-? I 
assume it's the drop measured from center of exhaust to center of pipe.? 
Any directions/assistance would be appreciated.
?
Thanks,
?
Dave_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From paul.horan at sbcglobal.net  Mon Sep  1 08:04:43 2008
From: paul.horan at sbcglobal.net (Paul Horan)
Date: Mon, 01 Sep 2008 16:04:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] need tuned pipe reccomendation for Webra 145
Message-ID: <372202.20182.qm@web83605.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>



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? I'm looking for reccomdations for a tuned pipe for a Webra 145, and ideally I would like to pick up one used
Thanks
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From ronlock at comcast.net  Mon Sep  1 09:22:39 2008
From: ronlock at comcast.net (ronlock at comcast.net)
Date: Mon, 01 Sep 2008 17:22:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] need tuned pipe reccomendation for Webra 145
Message-ID: <090120081722.25243.48BC24DC0000297B0000629B2205886014050C010402019D@comcast.net>

I been pleased with an Aeroslave on an OS 1.40.

Ron Lockhart
 -------------- Original message ----------------------
From: Paul Horan <paul.horan at sbcglobal.net>

>   I'm looking for reccomdations for a tuned pipe for a Webra 145, and ideally I 
> would like to pick up one used
> Thanks


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Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] need tuned pipe reccomendation for Webra 145
Date: Mon, 1 Sep 2008 16:04:49 +0000
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From kennedybryan at bellsouth.net  Mon Sep  1 16:32:32 2008
From: kennedybryan at bellsouth.net (Bryan Kennedy)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 00:32:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 40th Annual Rocket City Pattern Contest
	Huntsville, Alabama September 13-14th 2008
Message-ID: <3A339AC519F14128981B7D243D18769D@BryanKennedyPC>

Just wanted to drop a note reminding everyone that the 40th Annual RCRC
pattern contest is coming up very quickly. Hope everyone can join us?
Wanted to let everyone know we plan on running 4 rounds of FAI P-09 on
Saturday and 2 rounds of F-09 on Sunday.
 
Look forward to seeing everyone.  We have some great give away gifts
sponsored by R/C Hobbies Huntsville, AL and Extreme Flight RC Cumming,
GA.
 
Pre register at the following link:
 
http://www.rocketcityrc.com/events/2008-Pattern/reg_form.php
 
 
Thanks
 
Bryan
 
AMA L1744
NSRCA 1744
Contest Director
 
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From glen59shep at yahoo.com  Mon Sep  1 16:53:33 2008
From: glen59shep at yahoo.com (Glen)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 00:53:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size
Message-ID: <829386.75201.qm@web34308.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Does anyone know the thread size of OS glow plugs (Type F, 8 or A5). Looks like I stripped out the head of my engine (OS160) and I'd like to re-tap it.
?
Thanks,
Mr. Shepherd
NSRCA 3017


      
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From vanputte at cox.net  Mon Sep  1 17:04:01 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 01:04:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size
In-Reply-To: <829386.75201.qm@web34308.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <829386.75201.qm@web34308.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <EB27FE03-4F4D-491F-AAE7-AD74CF1974FC@cox.net>

1/4-32

Ron VP

On Sep 1, 2008, at 7:53 PM, Glen wrote:

> Does anyone know the thread size of OS glow plugs (Type F, 8 or  
> A5). Looks like I stripped out the head of my engine (OS160) and  
> I'd like to re-tap it.
>
> Thanks,
> Mr. Shepherd
> NSRCA 3017
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From kennedybryan at bellsouth.net  Mon Sep  1 17:10:54 2008
From: kennedybryan at bellsouth.net (Bryan Kennedy)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 01:10:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 40th Annual RCRC Pattern Contest
Message-ID: <4C9D9923C19349B78D82C54298B914AB@BryanKennedyPC>

RVP
 
Do you know if John is going to be able to make it?  Have not seen him
pre-register.
 
Bryan K
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From pcosky at comcast.net  Mon Sep  1 17:15:26 2008
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 01:15:26 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size
References: <829386.75201.qm@web34308.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <037a01c90c99$5f6194d0$bd440a0a@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>

1/4-32 if my memory serves me correctly.....if I'm wrong someone will surely correct me.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Glen 
  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
  Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 8:53 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size


        Does anyone know the thread size of OS glow plugs (Type F, 8 or A5). Looks like I stripped out the head of my engine (OS160) and I'd like to re-tap it.

        Thanks,
        Mr. Shepherd
        NSRCA 3017 




------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From rcmaster199 at aol.com  Mon Sep  1 17:29:17 2008
From: rcmaster199 at aol.com (rcmaster199 at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 01:29:17 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] need tuned pipe reccomendation for Webra 145
In-Reply-To: <372202.20182.qm@web83605.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
References: <372202.20182.qm@web83605.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <8CADAB266F70261-1528-2420@FWM-M30.sysops.aol.com>

Just sold a Grieve which was originally designed for the W145 and 
performed well. At 4 1/2 ozs it was closer to the carbon types in 
weight. This is probably the better value if you can find one

You can't go wrong with the Hatori aluminum but at 5 1/2 ozs, it's 
heavier than the carbon but I've got about 2000 flights on mine in the 
past 8 years or so, and it performs the same as when new. It's similar 
in price to the ES carbon pipe at over 200$. ES perform well but don't 
know anyone who has 2000 flights on any ES carbon. The aeroslaves pipe 
is about as light as the ES and slightly less in cost. I have no 
personal experience with the AS pipe but.... the guys who have flown it 
tell me it has good performance but maybe it's longevity is a bit low 
at around 300-500 flights.

Macs also offered an ally "muffled" pipe (I have one that isn't for 
sale) which is lighter than the Hatori, was reasonably priced and 
performed well, but tended to be louder than the others.

If weight isn't an issue, go for an ally pipe. If it is, then a carbon 
type maybe a better choice since you will save around 2 ozs on pipe 
alone.

MattK



-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Horan <paul.horan at sbcglobal.net>
To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Mon, 1 Sep 2008 11:04 am
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] need tuned pipe reccomendation for Webra 145

? I'm looking for reccomdations for a t
uned pipe for a Webra 145, and 
ideally I would like to pick up one used
Thanks_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



From vanputte at cox.net  Mon Sep  1 17:33:02 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 01:33:02 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 40th Annual RCRC Pattern Contest
In-Reply-To: <4C9D9923C19349B78D82C54298B914AB@BryanKennedyPC>
References: <4C9D9923C19349B78D82C54298B914AB@BryanKennedyPC>
Message-ID: <52466C70-5AAD-4748-8BA0-5194A4776E4D@cox.net>

I don't know.  He will probably be there, but he hasn't told me that  
he will.  We often don't keep in touch about that contest because he  
usually stays with an old USAF buddy and I stay elsewhere with  
someone else (or alone).  Maybe I can get my wife to go.

Ron

On Sep 1, 2008, at 8:10 PM, Bryan Kennedy wrote:

> RVP
>
>
>
> Do you know if John is going to be able to make it?  Have not seen  
> him pre-register.
>
>
>
> Bryan K
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From vanputte at cox.net  Mon Sep  1 17:44:34 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 01:44:34 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 40th Annual RCRC Pattern Contest
In-Reply-To: <52466C70-5AAD-4748-8BA0-5194A4776E4D@cox.net>
References: <4C9D9923C19349B78D82C54298B914AB@BryanKennedyPC>
	<52466C70-5AAD-4748-8BA0-5194A4776E4D@cox.net>
Message-ID: <A0198540-B560-421D-BFD5-C8EC524BE7C8@cox.net>

Oops!  Sorry, that was supposed to go to Bryan.

Ron VP

On Sep 1, 2008, at 8:34 PM, Ron Van Putte wrote:

> I don't know.  He will probably be there, but he hasn't told me  
> that he will.  We often don't keep in touch about that contest  
> because he usually stays with an old USAF buddy and I stay  
> elsewhere with someone else (or alone).  Maybe I can get my wife to  
> go.
>
> Ron
>
> On Sep 1, 2008, at 8:10 PM, Bryan Kennedy wrote:
>
>> RVP
>>
>>
>>
>> Do you know if John is going to be able to make it?  Have not seen  
>> him pre-register.
>>
>>
>>
>> Bryan K
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From d_bodary at yahoo.com  Mon Sep  1 17:53:59 2008
From: d_bodary at yahoo.com (Dennis Bodary)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 01:53:59 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size
In-Reply-To: <037a01c90c99$5f6194d0$bd440a0a@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
Message-ID: <34070.27952.qm@web51706.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

It is guaranteed 1/4x32 nothing else. so Pete you got it correct. 

--- On Mon, 9/1/08, Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net> wrote:

From: Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size
To: glen59shep at yahoo.com, "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Monday, September 1, 2008, 9:15 PM





1/4-32 if my memory serves me correctly.....if I'm wrong someone will surely correct me.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Glen 
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 8:53 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size






Does anyone know the thread size of OS glow plugs (Type F, 8 or A5). Looks like I stripped out the head of my engine (OS160) and I'd like to re-tap it.
?
Thanks,
Mr. Shepherd
NSRCA 3017




_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From pcosky at comcast.net  Mon Sep  1 18:00:09 2008
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 02:00:09 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size
References: <34070.27952.qm@web51706.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <03c201c90c9f$9e204c60$bd440a0a@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>

that's one in a row...woo hoo
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Dennis Bodary 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 9:53 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size


        It is guaranteed 1/4x32 nothing else. so Pete you got it correct. 

        --- On Mon, 9/1/08, Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net> wrote:

          From: Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net>
          Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size
          To: glen59shep at yahoo.com, "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
          Date: Monday, September 1, 2008, 9:15 PM


          1/4-32 if my memory serves me correctly.....if I'm wrong someone will surely correct me.
            ----- Original Message ----- 
            From: Glen 
            To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
            Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 8:53 PM
            Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size


                  Does anyone know the thread size of OS glow plugs (Type F, 8 or A5). Looks like I stripped out the head of my engine (OS160) and I'd like to re-tap it.

                  Thanks,
                  Mr. Shepherd
                  NSRCA 3017 



--------------------------------------------------------------------

            _______________________________________________
            NSRCA-discussion mailing list
            NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
            http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 




------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From wilsorc at gmail.com  Mon Sep  1 19:19:39 2008
From: wilsorc at gmail.com (Bob Wilson)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 03:19:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] O.S. 120AX Bearing
Message-ID: <888fdd980809012019o5e0aea76o907bb148c75f7230@mail.gmail.com>

Seems to me I've read some threads about the O.S.120AX rear bearing being
junk.

We'll I can verify it.  The 120AX on my Venus II practice/backup
airplane has been sounding real funky and today it was really bad.  I tore
it apart, and sure enough, the bearing is trashed.  Looks like O.S. didn't
harden it correctly.

I will try to replace with a bearing from local supplier, but did I read
somewhere that a bearing to a larger O.S. engine  will also fit?

bw
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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Mon Sep  1 19:26:22 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 03:26:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] O.S. 120AX Bearing
References: <888fdd980809012019o5e0aea76o907bb148c75f7230@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV6925D2A5A27A6CE991049E85F0@phx.gbl>

Same as the 140RX
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Bob Wilson 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 10:19 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] O.S. 120AX Bearing


  Seems to me I've read some threads about the O.S.120AX rear bearing being junk.

  We'll I can verify it.  The 120AX on my Venus II practice/backup airplane has been sounding real funky and today it was really bad.  I tore it apart, and sure enough, the bearing is trashed.  Looks like O.S. didn't harden it correctly.

  I will try to replace with a bearing from local supplier, but did I read somewhere that a bearing to a larger O.S. engine  will also fit?

  bw


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jonlowe at aol.com  Mon Sep  1 19:57:57 2008
From: jonlowe at aol.com (Jon Lowe)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 03:57:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] O.S. 120AX Bearing
In-Reply-To: <888fdd980809012019o5e0aea76o907bb148c75f7230@mail.gmail.com>
References: <888fdd980809012019o5e0aea76o907bb148c75f7230@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8CADAC7304A58DE-13F4-3AD3@WEBMAIL-MB16.sysops.aol.com>


 Order the bearing for the 1.40RX with Fuel injection.?? Tee one for the standard 1.40 is the same junk as the 1.20AX bearing.? Sealed bearing, cheaper than Boca on the FI version.? I got mine from Tower Hobbies.


 


Jon Lowe

 


 

-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Wilson <wilsorc at gmail.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Mon, 1 Sep 2008 10:19 pm
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] O.S. 120AX Bearing











Seems to me I've read some threads about the O.S.120AX rear bearing being junk.


?


We'll I can verify it.? The 120AX on my Venus II practice/backup airplane?has been?sounding real funky and today?it was really bad.? I tore it apart, and sure enough, the bearing is trashed.? Looks like O.S. didn't harden it correctly.



?


I will try to replace with a bearing from local supplier, but did I read somewhere that a bearing to a larger O.S. engine? will also fit?


?


bw




 





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



 

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From jpavlick at idseng.com  Mon Sep  1 20:07:38 2008
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 04:07:38 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] O.S. 120AX Bearing
References: <888fdd980809012019o5e0aea76o907bb148c75f7230@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <009201c90cb1$65ccb8f0$9501a8c0@GW7422>

The OS 140Rx has the same rear bearing as the 120Ax. Buy the one for the Fuel Injected 140Rx or just use one that has 2 seals (not "shields") like the 140 Rx F.I. bearing. This should last a long time.

John Pavlick
http://www.idseng.com
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Bob Wilson 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 11:19 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] O.S. 120AX Bearing


  Seems to me I've read some threads about the O.S.120AX rear bearing being junk.

  We'll I can verify it.  The 120AX on my Venus II practice/backup airplane has been sounding real funky and today it was really bad.  I tore it apart, and sure enough, the bearing is trashed.  Looks like O.S. didn't harden it correctly.

  I will try to replace with a bearing from local supplier, but did I read somewhere that a bearing to a larger O.S. engine  will also fit?

  bw


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From d_bodary at yahoo.com  Mon Sep  1 21:46:12 2008
From: d_bodary at yahoo.com (Dennis Bodary)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 05:46:12 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] O.S. 120AX Bearing
In-Reply-To: <888fdd980809012019o5e0aea76o907bb148c75f7230@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <628464.63854.qm@web51709.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

If your going to buy more than one. Try Toolbarn.com
The bearings are 14.39 each. And are the "EXACT" bearing as the 140RX EFI 
?
Type in either 211323-3 or 6904LLU on the search link
?
It will give you a Makita tool # just press on the link and scroll down it until you find 211323-3 and order that. as of five minutes ago they had three in stock.

--- On Mon, 9/1/08, Bob Wilson <wilsorc at gmail.com> wrote:

From: Bob Wilson <wilsorc at gmail.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] O.S. 120AX Bearing
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Monday, September 1, 2008, 11:19 PM




Seems to me I've read some threads about the O.S.120AX rear bearing being junk.
?
We'll I can verify it.? The 120AX on my Venus II practice/backup airplane?has been?sounding real funky and today?it was really bad.? I tore it apart, and sure enough, the bearing is trashed.? Looks like O.S. didn't harden it correctly.
?
I will try to replace with a bearing from local supplier, but did I read somewhere that a bearing to a larger O.S. engine? will also fit?
?
bw_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From johnferrell at earthlink.net  Tue Sep  2 05:07:02 2008
From: johnferrell at earthlink.net (John Ferrell)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 13:07:02 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size
References: <829386.75201.qm@web34308.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <00ee01c90cfd$0b7cd780$0201a8c0@xppro>

1/4-32 is not a common size. Clarence Lee advertises in RC Report and other magazines (less than $15) to install helicoil threads. Just send him the head & the check and it will come back fast. 
John Ferrell    W8CCW
 
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -- Edmund Burke
http://DixieNC.US

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Glen 
  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
  Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 8:53 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size


        Does anyone know the thread size of OS glow plugs (Type F, 8 or A5). Looks like I stripped out the head of my engine (OS160) and I'd like to re-tap it.

        Thanks,
        Mr. Shepherd
        NSRCA 3017 




------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From gfowler at raytheon.com  Tue Sep  2 05:31:42 2008
From: gfowler at raytheon.com (Gray E Fowler)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 13:31:42 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
Message-ID: <OF17CC3CF2.5FD2C8EE-ON862574B8.00483BE5-862574B8.004A2FA0@mck.us.ray.com>

Guys

Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program 
was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up 
elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by 
turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could 
not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to 
high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I 
cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down 
bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to 
center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator 
seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and 
more control. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at 
about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane 
upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode 
last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gustav are 
headed my way.


Plane was new had about 10 flights on it.

New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, 
no regulator) 
Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam
New switch
Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems

What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and 
intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two 
throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter). I 
am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked.

Thanks guys....


Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep  2 05:41:49 2008
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (vicenterc at comcast.net)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 13:41:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
Message-ID: <090220081341.10221.48BD4295000EFDAC000027ED22155612640C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>

Gray,

Sorry about your lost.  It think the biggest chance of failure were those parts that were new.  I think there is a good chance that you have infant battery failure.  I know that the chances are low but it could happen.  I assume tha you checked the TX battery and it is OK.   

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Guys 

Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and more control. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gu
 stav a
re headed my way. 


Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) 
Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
New switch 
Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter).  I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

Thanks guys....


Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon 
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From pamrich47 at hotmail.com  Tue Sep  2 05:48:56 2008
From: pamrich47 at hotmail.com (Richard Strickland)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 13:48:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <OF17CC3CF2.5FD2C8EE-ON862574B8.00483BE5-862574B8.004A2FA0@mck.us.ray.com>
References: <OF17CC3CF2.5FD2C8EE-ON862574B8.00483BE5-862574B8.004A2FA0@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <BAY128-W26B2AB899B3BF82CBA483AA05F0@phx.gbl>


Sounds like a low battery--enough voltage to keep the rec. operating--but not enough to run the servos.  Not a complete de-coupling of the radio link--so fail-safe wouldn't kick in.  Just an opinion.
Was having prioblems that ended up being a bad cell in a 4 cell nicad pack--and with some glitches on a couple flights and trying different things. The third flight one eve,, I started losing elevator trim and the airplane was sluggish--was able to land and the rec. pack was very low.  No 'hold'--the sevos just started going away.
 
RS



To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgFrom: gfowler at raytheon.comDate: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 08:30:17 -0500Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??Guys Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and more control. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gustav are headed my way. Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam New switch Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter).  I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. Thanks guys....Gray FowlerSenior Principal Chemical EngineerRadomes and Specialty AperturesTechnical Staff Composites EngineeringRaytheon
_________________________________________________________________
Be the filmmaker you always wanted to be?learn how to burn a DVD with Windows?.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/108588797/direct/01/
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From gfowler at raytheon.com  Tue Sep  2 06:03:29 2008
From: gfowler at raytheon.com (Gray E Fowler)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 14:03:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <090220081341.10221.48BD4295000EFDAC000027ED22155612640C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <OF3FC1AADC.AC682D87-ON862574B8.004CCD7A-862574B8.004D075D@mck.us.ray.com>

Tx battery totally fine 10.3 volts at crash...new pack was cycled and 
tested. I do not understand a low battery failure...From what I have seen 
with batteries either you got it or you do not. 




Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon



vicenterc at comcast.net 
Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
09/02/2008 08:44 AM
Please respond to
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>


To
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
cc

Subject
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??






Gray,
 
Sorry about your lost.  It think the biggest chance of failure were those 
parts that were new.  I think there is a good chance that you have infant 
battery failure.  I know that the chances are low but it could happen.  I 
assume tha you checked the TX battery and it is OK. 
 
--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone
 
-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Guys 

Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program 
was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up 
elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by 
turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could 
not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to 
high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I 
cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down 
bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to 
center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator 
seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and mo 
re con trol. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at 
about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane 
upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode 
last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gustav are 
headed my way. 


Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, 
no regulator) 
Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
New switch 
Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and 
intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two 
throttle signals should have been i dle (P CM hold) and off (transmitter). 
 I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

Thanks guys....


Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep  2 06:09:12 2008
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (vicenterc at comcast.net)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 14:09:12 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
Message-ID: <090220081409.7828.48BD4903000ACAF000001E9422155612640C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>

I meant RX battery.  I think you have similar problem as RS just explained.  Just back luck.  .  This is one reason I am using two RX batteries in all my planes.  Well, you need to find the plane so we can figure this out.  Good luck,

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Tx battery totally fine 10.3 volts at crash...new pack was cycled and tested. I do not understand a low battery failure...From what I have seen with batteries either you got it or you do not. 




Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon 


vicenterc at comcast.net 
Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
09/02/2008 08:44 AM Please respond to
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>

ToGeneral pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
cc
SubjectRe: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??







Gray, 
  
Sorry about your lost.  It think the biggest chance of failure were those parts that were new.  I think there is a good chance that you have infant battery failure.  I know that the chances are low but it could happen.  I assume tha you checked the TX battery and it is OK.   
  
--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
  
-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Guys 

Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and mo re con trol. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of 
 Gustav
 are headed my way. 


Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) 
Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
New switch 
Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been i dle (P CM hold) and off (transmitter).  I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

Thanks guys....


Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 14:05:01 +0000
Size: 735
URL: <http://lists.nsrca.org/pipermail/nsrca-discussion/attachments/20080902/69b1d046/attachment-0001.mht>

From anthonyr105 at hotmail.com  Tue Sep  2 06:14:13 2008
From: anthonyr105 at hotmail.com (Anthony Romano)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 14:14:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <OF17CC3CF2.5FD2C8EE-ON862574B8.00483BE5-862574B8.004A2FA0@mck.us.ray.com>
References: <OF17CC3CF2.5FD2C8EE-ON862574B8.00483BE5-862574B8.004A2FA0@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <BLU124-W384EFCE48BBC377BE479B8E25F0@phx.gbl>

Hi Gray, What a huge bummer. Did you have the low rx alarm function turned on? On the Stylus that is a switchable function that will drop the throttle to alert you to a low rx voltage. Now I am paranoid and have to go check mine. Have heard of similiar "brown out" type of behavior with a Nimh rx battery failure. Hope you can recover the aircraft. This time of year the growth in most places can swallow anything. Many solid flights for almost ten years on my Stylus but it is serviced every winter. Anthony

To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgFrom: gfowler at raytheon.comDate: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 08:30:17 -0500Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??Guys Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and more control. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gustav are headed my way. Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam New switch Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter).  I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. Thanks guys....Gray FowlerSenior Principal Chemical EngineerRadomes and Specialty AperturesTechnical Staff Composites EngineeringRaytheon
_________________________________________________________________
Get ideas on sharing photos from people like you.  Find new ways to share.
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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  2 06:15:43 2008
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 14:15:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <OF3FC1AADC.AC682D87-ON862574B8.004CCD7A-862574B8.004D075D@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <593567.82405.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Gray, 

I also fly Stylus's and I haven't seen this problem. But, I also keep my radio's in good health with checkups at Airtronics. I recently sent one in before the nats and they found lots of little things that needed repair. It is of great importance with any radio and receiver that they are checked out no more than every 3 years or so (imo) to make sure the module and receiver are tuned and also to look everything else over. 
BTW, your radio should get a new 3 volt battery every two years. 
?
The problem you are describing could be a bad crystal,?or possibly a low battery. I had one ship go in a few years ago that I decided to fly 8 1/2 (was shooting for 9, lol) flights on. The Tp 730 pack didn't last into that last flight. The voltage would get a little to low, and I would have no control for a second, then I would let off the controls, and the voltage would go up a little, and then I would have a small amount of control for a second. Did this several times. Sounds kinda like what you may have gone through. Needless to say, I lost my plane also. 
My battery checked out ok though, but not under load. It was under by far then. 
?
Chris


Chris 
?
?
?

--- On Tue, 9/2/08, Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> wrote:

From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 2, 2008, 7:01 AM



Tx battery totally fine 10.3 volts at crash...new pack was cycled and tested. I do not understand a low battery failure...From what I have seen with batteries either you got it or you do not. 




Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon 






vicenterc at comcast.net 
Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
09/02/2008 08:44 AM 




Please respond to
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>






To
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 


cc



Subject
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??









Gray, 
? 
Sorry about your lost. ?It think the biggest chance of failure were those parts that were new. ?I think there is a good chance that you have infant battery failure. ?I know that the chances are low but it could happen. ?I assume tha you checked the TX battery and it is OK. ? 
? 
--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
? 
-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Guys 

Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter. ?As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and mo re con trol. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the
 plane, and remnants of Gustav are headed my way. 


Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) 
Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
New switch 
Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been i dle (P CM hold) and off (transmitter). ?I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

Thanks guys....


Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From drykert2 at rochester.rr.com  Tue Sep  2 06:21:49 2008
From: drykert2 at rochester.rr.com (Del)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 14:21:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
References: <OF17CC3CF2.5FD2C8EE-ON862574B8.00483BE5-862574B8.004A2FA0@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <004801c90d07$420e37d0$ae9be648@ownerayn17ov1d>

Gray `~ would try posting your query here .. 
 
AirtronicsUsersGroup at yahoogr...
E-mail Address(es):
  AirtronicsUsersGroup at yahoogroups.com

Del
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Gray E Fowler 
  To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 9:30 AM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??



  Guys 

  Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and more control. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gustav are headed my way. 


  Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

  New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) 
  Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
  New switch 
  Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

  What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter).  I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

  Thanks guys....


  Gray Fowler
  Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
  Radomes and Specialty Apertures
  Technical Staff Composites Engineering
  Raytheon


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From gfowler at raytheon.com  Tue Sep  2 06:26:32 2008
From: gfowler at raytheon.com (Gray E Fowler)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 14:26:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <BLU124-W384EFCE48BBC377BE479B8E25F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <OFCE7C3442.BC6FD016-ON862574B8.004EB68D-862574B8.004F2FC8@mck.us.ray.com>

Hey Anthony

Never set up that warning function. Several people have indicated a low 
battery. Lance thinks fractured crystal...10 years old, stored in my 
garage at 105F to 25F or so. Every battery failure I have seen (none were 
mine) the radio flat out quit. Lance and I are going back out today, 
better equipped (long pants-machetes!!!) If I find it I can re-test the 
battery..It tested about 150 MAH of its rated capacity, but I do not have 
the tester drain the crap out of the volatge.
Man that plane flew good....9 lbs 15 oz...My skills are so deteriorated.






Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon



Anthony Romano <anthonyr105 at hotmail.com> 
Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
09/02/2008 09:18 AM
Please respond to
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>


To
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
cc

Subject
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??






Hi Gray,
 What a huge bummer. Did you have the low rx alarm function turned on? On 
the Stylus that is a switchable function that will drop the throttle to 
alert you to a low rx voltage. Now I am paranoid and have to go check 
mine.
 Have heard of similiar "brown out" type of behavior with a Nimh rx 
battery failure. Hope you can recover the aircraft. This time of year the 
growth in most places can swallow anything.
 Many solid flights for almost ten years on my Stylus but it is serviced 
every winter.
 
Anthony





To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
From: gfowler at raytheon.com
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 08:30:17 -0500
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??


Guys 

Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program 
was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up 
elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by 
turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could 
not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to 
high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I 
cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down 
bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to 
center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator 
seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and 
more control. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at 
about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane 
upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode 
last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gustav are 
headed my way. 


Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, 
no regulator) 
Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
New switch 
Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and 
intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two 
throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter). I 
am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

Thanks guys....


Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon

Get ideas on sharing photos from people like you. Find new ways to share. 
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From d_bodary at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  2 06:28:44 2008
From: d_bodary at yahoo.com (Dennis Bodary)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 14:28:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size
In-Reply-To: <00ee01c90cfd$0b7cd780$0201a8c0@xppro>
Message-ID: <47276.32806.qm@web51709.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Tower Hobbies sells a Tap 1/4x32 from higley. part # LXL774 6.69 and also a die LXL776 15.59
Depending on how bad your cylinder head is it may need to be helicoiled. But maybe the tap will save it. 

--- On Tue, 9/2/08, John Ferrell <johnferrell at earthlink.net> wrote:

From: John Ferrell <johnferrell at earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size
To: glen59shep at yahoo.com, "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 2, 2008, 9:08 AM





1/4-32 is not a common size. Clarence Lee advertises in RC Report and other magazines (less than $15) to install helicoil threads. Just send him the head & the check and it will come back fast. 
John Ferrell??? W8CCW
?
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -- Edmund Burke
http://DixieNC.US


----- Original Message ----- 
From: Glen 
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 8:53 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size






Does anyone know the thread size of OS glow plugs (Type F, 8 or A5). Looks like I stripped out the head of my engine (OS160) and I'd like to re-tap it.
?
Thanks,
Mr. Shepherd
NSRCA 3017




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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________
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From jpavlick at idseng.com  Tue Sep  2 06:30:57 2008
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 14:30:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <OF3FC1AADC.AC682D87-ON862574B8.004CCD7A-862574B8.004D075D@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <398251.35433.qm@web80506.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Gray,
?That sucks! That's one of the worst ways to lose a plane. :(
?
Since you can't find the airplane you can't look at the battery but that IS the most likely cause. If you lost one of the cells in a 5-cell pack?I could see something like this happening. I've had some close calls with NiMHs lately so I've stopped using them in Rx packs. 
?
Now?I run dual LiPOs + regulators with a fail-safe switch arrangement. The chance of 2 batteries or regulators failing simultaneously is much less than losing a single battery + switch AND you end up saving weight if you use?the right?batteries.
?
John Pavlick

--- On Tue, 9/2/08, Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> wrote:

From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 2, 2008, 2:01 PM



Tx battery totally fine 10.3 volts at crash...new pack was cycled and tested. I do not understand a low battery failure...From what I have seen with batteries either you got it or you do not. 




Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon 






vicenterc at comcast.net 
Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
09/02/2008 08:44 AM 




Please respond to
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>






To
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 


cc



Subject
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??









Gray, 
? 
Sorry about your lost. ?It think the biggest chance of failure were those parts that were new. ?I think there is a good chance that you have infant battery failure. ?I know that the chances are low but it could happen. ?I assume tha you checked the TX battery and it is OK. ? 
? 
--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
? 
-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Guys 

Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter. ?As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and mo re con trol. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the
 plane, and remnants of Gustav are headed my way. 


Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) 
Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
New switch 
Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been i dle (P CM hold) and off (transmitter). ?I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

Thanks guys....


Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


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From pamrich47 at hotmail.com  Tue Sep  2 06:35:42 2008
From: pamrich47 at hotmail.com (Richard Strickland)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 14:35:42 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <OF3FC1AADC.AC682D87-ON862574B8.004CCD7A-862574B8.004D075D@mck.us.ray.com>
References: <090220081341.10221.48BD4295000EFDAC000027ED22155612640C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
	<OF3FC1AADC.AC682D87-ON862574B8.004CCD7A-862574B8.004D075D@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <BAY128-W4A77EAC6849A47C4EC0C9A05F0@phx.gbl>


Yes, it was the Rx batt. and it almost pegged the meter b/4 that flight--and I check them each flight--cell was good...up to a point.  It was in the airplane when I bought it and was relatively new--from a name brand.  On closer inspection, one cell looked like it had a pin-hole and there was corrosion throughout.  Weird--but then again, Murphy follows me around...  
I switched to a 780 lipo with regulator, built a cheap tester with load, invested in a Cellpro 4 (FMA) so I could see what I was actually putting back in--202ma in (5) P09s with a couple extra manuevers (overs) ea. flight.  The advantages of this are a little less weight, consistent power, and more than adequate capacity.  As the power was used from flight to flight; the drop seemed pretty linear.  Do I trust it yet?  No--but it looks like I will with more experience.
RS



To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgFrom: gfowler at raytheon.comDate: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 09:01:20 -0500Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??Tx battery totally fine 10.3 volts at crash...new pack was cycled and tested. I do not understand a low battery failure...From what I have seen with batteries either you got it or you do not. Gray FowlerSenior Principal Chemical EngineerRadomes and Specialty AperturesTechnical Staff Composites EngineeringRaytheon 



vicenterc at comcast.net Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
09/02/2008 08:44 AM 




Please respond toGeneral pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>





To
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 


cc



Subject
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??




Gray,   Sorry about your lost.  It think the biggest chance of failure were those parts that were new.  I think there is a good chance that you have infant battery failure.  I know that the chances are low but it could happen.  I assume tha you checked the TX battery and it is OK.     --Vicente "Vince" Bortone   -------------- Original message -------------- From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> Guys Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and mo re con trol. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gustav are headed my way. Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam New switch Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been i dle (P CM hold) and off (transmitter).  I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. Thanks guys....Gray FowlerSenior Principal Chemical EngineerRadomes and Specialty AperturesTechnical Staff Composites EngineeringRaytheon _______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From drykert2 at rochester.rr.com  Tue Sep  2 06:49:22 2008
From: drykert2 at rochester.rr.com (Del)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 14:49:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
References: <OF3FC1AADC.AC682D87-ON862574B8.004CCD7A-862574B8.004D075D@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <007b01c90d0b$1ba0bc90$ae9be648@ownerayn17ov1d>

Hi Gray. 
 
I now fly Stylus and when I used to Fly Kraft had a similar case where elevator functioned was weak or none and ailerons and throttle did work but very sluggish. Plane kinda controlled crashed as I had enough juice after no other input as it crossed threshold to effect a slight flair. Airborne had 1 dead and 1 weak cell of 4 cell pack. Granted was FM modulation. Was told the assignment in receiver was elevator was after other servos thus why it appeared other servos were working when elev only barely worked at threshold.  So I would have to guess batteries from what I have experienced. 
 
    Del 
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Gray E Fowler 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 10:01 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??



  Tx battery totally fine 10.3 volts at crash...new pack was cycled and tested. I do not understand a low battery failure...From what I have seen with batteries either you got it or you do not. 




  Gray Fowler
  Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
  Radomes and Specialty Apertures
  Technical Staff Composites Engineering
  Raytheon 


        vicenterc at comcast.net 
        Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
        09/02/2008 08:44 AM Please respond to
              General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 


       To General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  
              cc  
              Subject Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash?? 

              

       



  Gray, 
    
  Sorry about your lost.  It think the biggest chance of failure were those parts that were new.  I think there is a good chance that you have infant battery failure.  I know that the chances are low but it could happen.  I assume tha you checked the TX battery and it is OK.   
    
  --
  Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
    
  -------------- Original message -------------- 
  From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

  Guys 

  Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and mo re con trol. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gustav are headed my way. 


  Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

  New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) 
  Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
  New switch 
  Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

  What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been i dle (P CM hold) and off (transmitter).  I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

  Thanks guys....


  Gray Fowler
  Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
  Radomes and Specialty Apertures
  Technical Staff Composites Engineering
  Raytheon _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 





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From tkeithblack at gmail.com  Tue Sep  2 08:24:30 2008
From: tkeithblack at gmail.com (Keith Black)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 16:24:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <OFCE7C3442.BC6FD016-ON862574B8.004EB68D-862574B8.004F2FC8@mck.us.ray.com>
References: <OFCE7C3442.BC6FD016-ON862574B8.004EB68D-862574B8.004F2FC8@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <3EACC2DFBCD44B209FDB4A9E7C0C8B2F@OfficePC>

I was standing next to Gray when this occurred. What I observed didn't look like a battery failure because the plane began violently oscillating in what appeared to me to be in pitch. This oscillation was so severe that I thought the plane was experiencing flutter. I told Gray to cut the throttle, at which point he said he already had. I looked at his transmitter and the throttle stick was indeed all the way down, however, the engine continued oscillating from high to low. I also looked at his battery meter on his TX and it was well into the black. A couple of times I thought the plane was going to fly off into the distance in this out of control manner but thankfully Gray was able to keep it close to the field.

What's puzzling are the following:

1. If it were interference the PCM would have gone into lockout.

2. A combination of in and out of lockout fluctuations would not cause the throttle to go up and down since the throttle stick was down and the lockout was set to idle.

3. If it were RX battery related I would not expect it to oscillate the control surfaces and the throttle, unless the RX freaks out at low voltage.

Therefore, I believe this was some type of radio related failure either on the TX or RX side, most likely the RX. 

One last thought, I have heard people report a bad servos in the system making all the other servos behave badly. Maybe someone has some feedback on this.

Keith Black

----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Gray E Fowler 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 9:24 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??



  Hey Anthony 

  Never set up that warning function. Several people have indicated a low battery. Lance thinks fractured crystal...10 years old, stored in my garage at 105F to 25F or so. Every battery failure I have seen (none were mine) the radio flat out quit. Lance and I are going back out today, better equipped (long pants-machetes!!!) If I find it I can re-test the battery..It tested about 150 MAH of its rated capacity, but I do not have the tester drain the crap out of the volatge. 
  Man that plane flew good....9 lbs 15 oz...My skills are so deteriorated. 






  Gray Fowler
  Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
  Radomes and Specialty Apertures
  Technical Staff Composites Engineering
  Raytheon 


        Anthony Romano <anthonyr105 at hotmail.com> 
        Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
        09/02/2008 09:18 AM Please respond to
              General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 


       To General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  
              cc  
              Subject Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash?? 

              

       



  Hi Gray,
  What a huge bummer. Did you have the low rx alarm function turned on? On the Stylus that is a switchable function that will drop the throttle to alert you to a low rx voltage. Now I am paranoid and have to go check mine.
  Have heard of similiar "brown out" type of behavior with a Nimh rx battery failure. Hope you can recover the aircraft. This time of year the growth in most places can swallow anything.
  Many solid flights for almost ten years on my Stylus but it is serviced every winter.

  Anthony





------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  From: gfowler at raytheon.com
  Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 08:30:17 -0500
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??


  Guys 

  Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and more control. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gustav are headed my way. 


  Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

  New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) 
  Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
  New switch 
  Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

  What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter).  I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

  Thanks guys....


  Gray Fowler
  Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
  Radomes and Specialty Apertures
  Technical Staff Composites Engineering
  Raytheon


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From wgalligan at att.net  Tue Sep  2 08:35:02 2008
From: wgalligan at att.net (Wayne Galligan)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 16:35:02 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <3EACC2DFBCD44B209FDB4A9E7C0C8B2F@OfficePC>
References: <OFCE7C3442.BC6FD016-ON862574B8.004EB68D-862574B8.004F2FC8@mck.us.ray.com>
	<3EACC2DFBCD44B209FDB4A9E7C0C8B2F@OfficePC>
Message-ID: <F735094B9C224D68BD3B497E8393D1D1@WaynePC>

That sounds just like what happened when my Aries went in at Nederland.  Elevator and throttle oscillated and there was very slow response on controls just like a weak battery.  Post crash indicated a good charge on battery but I still think it may have had a bad cell. Only had one flight on it at that time.

Wayne Galligan
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Keith Black 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:24 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??


  I was standing next to Gray when this occurred. What I observed didn't look like a battery failure because the plane began violently oscillating in what appeared to me to be in pitch. This oscillation was so severe that I thought the plane was experiencing flutter. I told Gray to cut the throttle, at which point he said he already had. I looked at his transmitter and the throttle stick was indeed all the way down, however, the engine continued oscillating from high to low. I also looked at his battery meter on his TX and it was well into the black. A couple of times I thought the plane was going to fly off into the distance in this out of control manner but thankfully Gray was able to keep it close to the field.

  What's puzzling are the following:

  1. If it were interference the PCM would have gone into lockout.

  2. A combination of in and out of lockout fluctuations would not cause the throttle to go up and down since the throttle stick was down and the lockout was set to idle.

  3. If it were RX battery related I would not expect it to oscillate the control surfaces and the throttle, unless the RX freaks out at low voltage.

  Therefore, I believe this was some type of radio related failure either on the TX or RX side, most likely the RX. 

  One last thought, I have heard people report a bad servos in the system making all the other servos behave badly. Maybe someone has some feedback on this.

  Keith Black

  ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Gray E Fowler 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 9:24 AM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??



    Hey Anthony 

    Never set up that warning function. Several people have indicated a low battery. Lance thinks fractured crystal...10 years old, stored in my garage at 105F to 25F or so. Every battery failure I have seen (none were mine) the radio flat out quit. Lance and I are going back out today, better equipped (long pants-machetes!!!) If I find it I can re-test the battery..It tested about 150 MAH of its rated capacity, but I do not have the tester drain the crap out of the volatge. 
    Man that plane flew good....9 lbs 15 oz...My skills are so deteriorated. 






    Gray Fowler
    Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
    Radomes and Specialty Apertures
    Technical Staff Composites Engineering
    Raytheon 


          Anthony Romano <anthonyr105 at hotmail.com> 
          Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
          09/02/2008 09:18 AM Please respond to
                General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 


         To General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  
                cc  
                Subject Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash?? 

                

         



    Hi Gray,
    What a huge bummer. Did you have the low rx alarm function turned on? On the Stylus that is a switchable function that will drop the throttle to alert you to a low rx voltage. Now I am paranoid and have to go check mine.
    Have heard of similiar "brown out" type of behavior with a Nimh rx battery failure. Hope you can recover the aircraft. This time of year the growth in most places can swallow anything.
    Many solid flights for almost ten years on my Stylus but it is serviced every winter.

    Anthony





----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    From: gfowler at raytheon.com
    Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 08:30:17 -0500
    Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??


    Guys 

    Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and more control. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gustav are headed my way. 


    Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

    New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) 
    Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
    New switch 
    Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

    What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter).  I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

    Thanks guys....


    Gray Fowler
    Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
    Radomes and Specialty Apertures
    Technical Staff Composites Engineering
    Raytheon


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Get ideas on sharing photos from people like you. Find new ways to share. Get Ideas Here!_______________________________________________
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    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 





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From vanputte at cox.net  Tue Sep  2 08:47:10 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 16:47:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <3EACC2DFBCD44B209FDB4A9E7C0C8B2F@OfficePC>
References: <OFCE7C3442.BC6FD016-ON862574B8.004EB68D-862574B8.004F2FC8@mck.us.ray.com>
	<3EACC2DFBCD44B209FDB4A9E7C0C8B2F@OfficePC>
Message-ID: <B94D6EDD-301D-4F64-8FE6-AF852F5F2167@cox.net>

Regarding the "last thought", this happened to me many years ago.  I  
was performing a 4-Point Roll when the airplane stopped rolling at  
the third point and crashed.  After having the transmitter and  
receiver serviced, I was installing the same servos into a new  
airplane and was doing a bench check.  As I was slowly putting in  
aileron,  the whole system locked up.  After I shut off the receiver  
and turned it back on, the system behaved normally.  However, I could  
repeat the failure by slowly approaching the same aileron  
deflection.  Each time I got to "that spot", the whole system would  
lock up.  Now, Gray's symptoms were not the same, but it demonstrates  
that a servo can take down the whole system.  I'll leave it for you  
electronics experts to explain why.

BTW, the system was not a PCM system, it was an FM system, a Kraft  
KP-7Z, the "top of the line"  back in the 1970s.  I still have that  
old servo as a reminder to check the servos too.

Ron VP

On Sep 2, 2008, at 11:24 AM, Keith Black wrote:

> I was standing next to Gray when this occurred. What I observed  
> didn't look like a battery failure because the plane began  
> violently oscillating in what appeared to me to be in pitch. This  
> oscillation was so severe that I thought the plane was experiencing  
> flutter. I told Gray to cut the throttle, at which point he said he  
> already had. I looked at his transmitter and the throttle stick was  
> indeed all the way down, however, the engine continued oscillating  
> from high to low. I also looked at his battery meter on his TX and  
> it was well into the black. A couple of times I thought the plane  
> was going to fly off into the distance in this out of control  
> manner but thankfully Gray was able to keep it close to the field.
>
> What's puzzling are the following:
>
> 1. If it were interference the PCM would have gone into lockout.
>
> 2. A combination of in and out of lockout fluctuations would not  
> cause the throttle to go up and down since the throttle stick was  
> down and the lockout was set to idle.
>
> 3. If it were RX battery related I would not expect it to oscillate  
> the control surfaces and the throttle, unless the RX freaks out at  
> low voltage.
>
> Therefore, I believe this was some type of radio related failure  
> either on the TX or RX side, most likely the RX.
>
> One last thought, I have heard people report a bad servos in the  
> system making all the other servos behave badly. Maybe someone has  
> some feedback on this.
>
> Keith Black
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Gray E Fowler
> To: General pattern discussion
> Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 9:24 AM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of  
> crash??
>
>
> Hey Anthony
>
> Never set up that warning function. Several people have indicated a  
> low battery. Lance thinks fractured crystal...10 years old, stored  
> in my garage at 105F to 25F or so. Every battery failure I have  
> seen (none were mine) the radio flat out quit. Lance and I are  
> going back out today, better equipped (long pants-machetes!!!) If I  
> find it I can re-test the battery..It tested about 150 MAH of its  
> rated capacity, but I do not have the tester drain the crap out of  
> the volatge.
> Man that plane flew good....9 lbs 15 oz...My skills are so  
> deteriorated.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Gray Fowler
> Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
> Radomes and Specialty Apertures
> Technical Staff Composites Engineering
> Raytheon
>
>
> Anthony Romano <anthonyr105 at hotmail.com>
> Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> 09/02/2008 09:18 AM
> Please respond to
> General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>
>
> To
> General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> cc
> Subject
> Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Gray,
> What a huge bummer. Did you have the low rx alarm function turned  
> on? On the Stylus that is a switchable function that will drop the  
> throttle to alert you to a low rx voltage. Now I am paranoid and  
> have to go check mine.
> Have heard of similiar "brown out" type of behavior with a Nimh rx  
> battery failure. Hope you can recover the aircraft. This time of  
> year the growth in most places can swallow anything.
> Many solid flights for almost ten years on my Stylus but it is  
> serviced every winter.
>
> Anthony
>
>
>
>
>
> To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> From: gfowler at raytheon.com
> Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 08:30:17 -0500
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
>
>
> Guys
>
> Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM  
> program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise)  
> of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as  
> such by turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I  
> noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started  
> going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small  
> left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but  
> the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree  
> turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude,  
> but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As  
> I passed by center again I was losing more and more control. The  
> plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200  
> feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane  
> upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole  
> episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants  
> of Gustav are headed my way.
>
>
> Plane was new had about 10 flights on it.
>
> New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for  
> years, no regulator)
> Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam
> New switch
> Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems
>
> What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and  
> intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only  
> two throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off  
> (transmitter).  I am going to send the transmitter in just to get  
> checked.
>
> Thanks guys....
>
>
> Gray Fowler
> Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
> Radomes and Specialty Apertures
> Technical Staff Composites Engineering
> Raytheon
>
> Get ideas on sharing photos from people like you. Find new ways to  
> share. Get Ideas Here!_______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From JAStebbins at worldnet.att.net  Tue Sep  2 08:54:47 2008
From: JAStebbins at worldnet.att.net (Jerry Stebbins)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 16:54:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
References: <OF17CC3CF2.5FD2C8EE-ON862574B8.00483BE5-862574B8.004A2FA0@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <002e01c90d1c$a1564240$4f01a8c0@jerryscomputer>

Gray, hope you can find all the parts, especially if Ike is also coming along behind Gustav.  Sounds like a flight pack problem--bad cell.
I just purchased several NiMH  (1200mah) batteries to replace old stuff as am getting back to flying. My past experience with them is they need 3 or more cycles of slow charge to come up to capacity. Here's what I found:
#1set-slow charge-Airtronics Rx. charger-(36 hours)667mah, again 721mah, again 750mah, again 850mah, I have since put 6 cycles using a Sirius charger and now am at 906mah.
#2-same approach 969mah, again 975 mah, again 1030mah, again 1085mah. after four cycles on the Sirius charger it is 1115mah.
#3 same approach 1064mah,again 1167mah,again1235mah. Then three cycles with the Sirius charger and holding from 1215mah to 1238mah.
I stll have 2 to go.
I am discharging using a Sirius discharger-set to 4 cells, and discharge at 250ma. I tried set1 at 500ma rate and got a drop back to 724 (@ 200 mah). I found little difference between the 125ma and the 250ma rate.
This is also consistent with past experience (6 years ago) with 4 sets (different mfg.)where I never got 1 out of the 4 over 3/4  capacity.
Makes me think seriously about going back to nicads where weight doesn't matter.
By the way these are not el-cheapo brand cells.
Jerry
----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Gray E Fowler 
  To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 8:30 AM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??



  Guys 

  Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and more control. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gustav are headed my way. 


  Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

  New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) 
  Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
  New switch 
  Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

  What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter).  I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

  Thanks guys....


  Gray Fowler
  Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
  Radomes and Specialty Apertures
  Technical Staff Composites Engineering
  Raytheon


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From tkeithblack at gmail.com  Tue Sep  2 09:00:22 2008
From: tkeithblack at gmail.com (Keith Black)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 17:00:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <F735094B9C224D68BD3B497E8393D1D1@WaynePC>
References: <OFCE7C3442.BC6FD016-ON862574B8.004EB68D-862574B8.004F2FC8@mck.us.ray.com><3EACC2DFBCD44B209FDB4A9E7C0C8B2F@OfficePC>
	<F735094B9C224D68BD3B497E8393D1D1@WaynePC>
Message-ID: <38468C7719D344F2AF747A3B184D329A@OfficePC>

Wayne, as I recall in your case the post mortem thinking was it may have been a regulator failure. I also recall you were flying PPM not PCM. In addition the same day Art had interference issues (also on PPM) in the general location that you lost control.

Keith
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Wayne Galligan 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:34 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??


  That sounds just like what happened when my Aries went in at Nederland.  Elevator and throttle oscillated and there was very slow response on controls just like a weak battery.  Post crash indicated a good charge on battery but I still think it may have had a bad cell. Only had one flight on it at that time.

  Wayne Galligan
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Keith Black 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:24 AM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??


    I was standing next to Gray when this occurred. What I observed didn't look like a battery failure because the plane began violently oscillating in what appeared to me to be in pitch. This oscillation was so severe that I thought the plane was experiencing flutter. I told Gray to cut the throttle, at which point he said he already had. I looked at his transmitter and the throttle stick was indeed all the way down, however, the engine continued oscillating from high to low. I also looked at his battery meter on his TX and it was well into the black. A couple of times I thought the plane was going to fly off into the distance in this out of control manner but thankfully Gray was able to keep it close to the field.

    What's puzzling are the following:

    1. If it were interference the PCM would have gone into lockout.

    2. A combination of in and out of lockout fluctuations would not cause the throttle to go up and down since the throttle stick was down and the lockout was set to idle.

    3. If it were RX battery related I would not expect it to oscillate the control surfaces and the throttle, unless the RX freaks out at low voltage.

    Therefore, I believe this was some type of radio related failure either on the TX or RX side, most likely the RX. 

    One last thought, I have heard people report a bad servos in the system making all the other servos behave badly. Maybe someone has some feedback on this.

    Keith Black

    ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: Gray E Fowler 
      To: General pattern discussion 
      Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 9:24 AM
      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??



      Hey Anthony 

      Never set up that warning function. Several people have indicated a low battery. Lance thinks fractured crystal...10 years old, stored in my garage at 105F to 25F or so. Every battery failure I have seen (none were mine) the radio flat out quit. Lance and I are going back out today, better equipped (long pants-machetes!!!) If I find it I can re-test the battery..It tested about 150 MAH of its rated capacity, but I do not have the tester drain the crap out of the volatge. 
      Man that plane flew good....9 lbs 15 oz...My skills are so deteriorated. 






      Gray Fowler
      Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
      Radomes and Specialty Apertures
      Technical Staff Composites Engineering
      Raytheon 


            Anthony Romano <anthonyr105 at hotmail.com> 
            Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
            09/02/2008 09:18 AM Please respond to
                  General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 


           To General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  
                  cc  
                  Subject Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash?? 

                  

           



      Hi Gray,
      What a huge bummer. Did you have the low rx alarm function turned on? On the Stylus that is a switchable function that will drop the throttle to alert you to a low rx voltage. Now I am paranoid and have to go check mine.
      Have heard of similiar "brown out" type of behavior with a Nimh rx battery failure. Hope you can recover the aircraft. This time of year the growth in most places can swallow anything.
      Many solid flights for almost ten years on my Stylus but it is serviced every winter.

      Anthony





--------------------------------------------------------------------------

      To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
      From: gfowler at raytheon.com
      Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 08:30:17 -0500
      Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??


      Guys 

      Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and more control. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gustav are headed my way. 


      Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

      New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) 
      Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
      New switch 
      Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

      What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter).  I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

      Thanks guys....


      Gray Fowler
      Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
      Radomes and Specialty Apertures
      Technical Staff Composites Engineering
      Raytheon


--------------------------------------------------------------------------
      Get ideas on sharing photos from people like you. Find new ways to share. Get Ideas Here!_______________________________________________
      NSRCA-discussion mailing list
      NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
      http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 





--------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From glen59shep at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  2 09:24:09 2008
From: glen59shep at yahoo.com (Glen)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 17:24:09 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Help - Glow Plug Thread Size
Message-ID: <29808.23653.qm@web34306.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

All, thanks for the responses. I have contacted Tower and ordered a 1/4 -32 tap. In the mean time I have a backup engine I can use.? Gotta get ready for that North Dallas Competition Sept 20-21
?
Mr Shepherd
NSRCA 3017


      
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From k6xyz at sbcglobal.net  Tue Sep  2 10:04:51 2008
From: k6xyz at sbcglobal.net (Dave Harmon)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 18:04:51 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <OF17CC3CF2.5FD2C8EE-ON862574B8.00483BE5-862574B8.004A2FA0@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <01c901c90d26$5ce01f00$63dee204@skunkputer>

Here is what caused me a lot of trouble. I didn't crash but I should have.
The wire broke inside of the insulation so I couldn't see the break.

I pulled on the wires and the insulation came away exposing the break.

My airplane was doing the same thing as Grey's because the receiver was
losing power and then regaining it causing the servos to freewheel and then
jerk back to follow the sticks.

Of course the failsafe didn't work without power...

Not good.

 



 

Regards

Dave Harmon
NSRCA 586
K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
Sperry, Ok. 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Gray E Fowler
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 8:30 AM
To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??

 


Guys 

Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program
was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all
other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the
transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude
and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started
oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill
position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180
degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but
unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by
center again I was losing more and more control. The plane flew over the
wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and
the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the
trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and
remnants of Gustav are headed my way. 


Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no
regulator) 
Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
New switch 
Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and
intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two
throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter).  I
am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

Thanks guys....


Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon 

 

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 3407 (20080902) __________

 

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

 

http://www.eset.com

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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep  2 10:12:13 2008
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (vicenterc at comcast.net)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 18:12:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
Message-ID: <090220081812.18679.48BD81F800079FDF000048F722165662760C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>

Hi Dave,

Did you play lotto that day?

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: "Dave Harmon" <k6xyz at sbcglobal.net> 

Here is what caused me a lot of trouble. I didn?t crash but I should have. The wire broke inside of the insulation so I couldn?t see the break.
I pulled on the wires and the insulation came away exposing the break.
My airplane was doing the same thing as Grey?s because the receiver was losing power and then regaining it causing the servos to freewheel and then jerk back to follow the sticks.
Of course the failsafe didn?t work without power?..
Not good.



Regards

Dave Harmon
NSRCA 586
K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
Sperry, Ok. 
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Gray E Fowler
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 8:30 AM
To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??


Guys 

Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and more control. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gu
 stav a
re headed my way. 


Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) 
Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
New switch 
Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter).  I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

Thanks guys....


Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon 

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3407 (20080902) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com


__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3408 (20080902) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com
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Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 18:08:31 +0000
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From k6xyz at sbcglobal.net  Tue Sep  2 10:16:01 2008
From: k6xyz at sbcglobal.net (Dave Harmon)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 18:16:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <090220081812.18679.48BD81F800079FDF000048F722165662760C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <01df01c90d27$e9c669f0$63dee204@skunkputer>

Hi Vince...hahaha no, not that day but I should have!!!!

 

Regards

Dave Harmon
NSRCA 586
K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
Sperry, Ok. 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
vicenterc at comcast.net
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 1:12 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??

 

Hi Dave,

 

Did you play lotto that day?

 

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

 

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: "Dave Harmon" <k6xyz at sbcglobal.net> 

Here is what caused me a lot of trouble. I didn't crash but I should have.
The wire broke inside of the insulation so I couldn't see the break.

I pulled on the wires and the insulation came away exposing the break.

My airplane was doing the same thing as Grey's because the receiver was
losing power and then regaining it causing the servos to freewheel and then
jerk back to follow the sticks.

Of course the failsafe didn't work without power...

Not good.

 



 

Regards

Dave Harmon
NSRCA 586
K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
Sperry, Ok. 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Gray E Fowler
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 8:30 AM
To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??

 


Guys 

Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program
was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all
other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the
transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude
and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started
oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill
position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180
degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but
unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. A s I pa ssed by
center again I was losing more and more control. The plane flew over the
wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and
the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the
trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and
remnants of Gustav are headed my way. 


Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no
regulator) 
Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
New switch 
Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and
intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two
throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter).  I
am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

Thanks guys....


Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon 

 

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 3407 (20080902) __________

 

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

 

http://www.eset.com



__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 3408 (20080902) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com <http://www.eset.com/> 



__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 3408 (20080902) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com

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From drykert2 at rochester.rr.com  Tue Sep  2 11:08:44 2008
From: drykert2 at rochester.rr.com (Del)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 19:08:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
References: <01c901c90d26$5ce01f00$63dee204@skunkputer>
Message-ID: <013d01c90d2f$567baea0$ae9be648@ownerayn17ov1d>

Phew `~ glad u got her down safely Dave.. Think that call that a freebee plane now.. 
 
    Del

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Dave Harmon 
  To: 'General pattern discussion' 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 2:04 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??


  Here is what caused me a lot of trouble. I didn't crash but I should have. The wire broke inside of the insulation so I couldn't see the break.

  I pulled on the wires and the insulation came away exposing the break.

  My airplane was doing the same thing as Grey's because the receiver was losing power and then regaining it causing the servos to freewheel and then jerk back to follow the sticks.

  Of course the failsafe didn't work without power...

  Not good.







  Regards

  Dave Harmon
  NSRCA 586
  K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
  Sperry, Ok. 

  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Gray E Fowler
  Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 8:30 AM
  To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??




  Guys 

  Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and more control. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gustav are headed my way. 


  Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

  New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) 
  Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
  New switch 
  Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

  What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter).  I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

  Thanks guys....


  Gray Fowler
  Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
  Radomes and Specialty Apertures
  Technical Staff Composites Engineering
  Raytheon 



  __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3407 (20080902) __________



  The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.



  http://www.eset.com



  __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3408 (20080902) __________

  The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

  http://www.eset.com



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


------------------------------------------------------------------------------



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From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Tue Sep  2 11:26:45 2008
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 19:26:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <OF17CC3CF2.5FD2C8EE-ON862574B8.00483BE5-862574B8.004A2FA0@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <E0E26D7473F94DA69C47A6F98DB5A150@jaysdesktop>

A little advertised problem is interference from cheap walky-talkies such as
those used by hunters. This may or not be a problem in your area - I have
lost two planes directly over a deer stand. We have established that this is
a problem by placing a model in the middle of our field and keying the
walky-talky on and off. There was no doubt that it caused a problem. This is
why I scraped all of my 72 MHz gear and went to 2.4 GHz.

 

Jay Marshall 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Gray E Fowler
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 9:30 AM
To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??

 


Guys 

Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program
was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all
other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the
transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude
and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started
oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill
position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180
degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but
unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by
center again I was losing more and more control. The plane flew over the
wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and
the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the
trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and
remnants of Gustav are headed my way. 


Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no
regulator) 
Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
New switch 
Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and
intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two
throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter).  I
am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

Thanks guys....


Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon

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From bob at toprudder.com  Tue Sep  2 14:42:13 2008
From: bob at toprudder.com (Robert Richards)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 22:42:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <F735094B9C224D68BD3B497E8393D1D1@WaynePC>
Message-ID: <350841.84198.qm@web1102.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>

Instead of thinking of a battery failure mode as only being low or dead cells, you should also think of the case when a wire or welded strap breaks but continues to make intermittent connection aggravated by vibrations. I have not had this happen with a battery myself, but I have had this happen inside a servo and it caused the exact symptoms described here, but only for that servo.
   
  Sounds like everything in the plane was well proven, except for the battery and the switch. I would look very closely at both of those. (provided you find them!).
   
  Bob R.
  

Wayne Galligan <wgalligan at att.net> wrote:
          That sounds just like what happened when my Aries went in at Nederland.  Elevator and throttle oscillated and there was very slow response on controls just like a weak battery.  Post crash indicated a good charge on battery but I still think it may have had a bad cell. Only had one flight on it at that time.
   
  Wayne Galligan
    ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Keith Black 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:24 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
  

  I was standing next to Gray when this occurred. What I observed didn't look like a battery failure because the plane began violently oscillating in what appeared to me to be in pitch. This oscillation was so severe that I thought the plane was experiencing flutter. I told Gray to cut the throttle, at which point he said he already had. I looked at his transmitter and the throttle stick was indeed all the way down, however, the engine continued oscillating from high to low. I also looked at his battery meter on his TX and it was well into the black. A couple of times I thought the plane was going to fly off into the distance in this out of control manner but thankfully Gray was able to keep it close to the field.
   
  What's puzzling are the following:
   
  1. If it were interference the PCM would have gone into lockout.
   
  2. A combination of in and out of lockout fluctuations would not cause the throttle to go up and down since the throttle stick was down and the lockout was set to idle.
   
  3. If it were RX battery related I would not expect it to oscillate the control surfaces and the throttle, unless the RX freaks out at low voltage.
   
  Therefore, I believe this was some type of radio related failure either on the TX or RX side, most likely the RX. 
   
  One last thought, I have heard people report a bad servos in the system making all the other servos behave badly. Maybe someone has some feedback on this.
   
  Keith Black
   
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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Tue Sep  2 15:11:23 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2008 23:11:23 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
References: <OFCE7C3442.BC6FD016-ON862574B8.004EB68D-862574B8.004F2FC8@mck.us.ray.com>
	<3EACC2DFBCD44B209FDB4A9E7C0C8B2F@OfficePC>
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV13D809D7F9A4E142DAB7A9E85F0@phx.gbl>

Possibly everything just started with elevator flutter, possibly from a broken hinge.  If it was violent enough, and it there was some common mounting platform to the throttle servo, maybe that tray broke loose and started thrashing the throttle.  Last failure on the ailerons, maybe a stressed elevator/rudderthrottle servo overloaded the power bus enough to cause the receiver decoder to not be able to send a decent quality signal, or maybe the voltage was just pulled too low to allow the aileron servos to process a good signal properly. All speculation, but it's a possibility. Tough loss no matter what happened.

Ed

----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Keith Black 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:24 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??


  I was standing next to Gray when this occurred. What I observed didn't look like a battery failure because the plane began violently oscillating in what appeared to me to be in pitch. This oscillation was so severe that I thought the plane was experiencing flutter. I told Gray to cut the throttle, at which point he said he already had. I looked at his transmitter and the throttle stick was indeed all the way down, however, the engine continued oscillating from high to low. I also looked at his battery meter on his TX and it was well into the black. A couple of times I thought the plane was going to fly off into the distance in this out of control manner but thankfully Gray was able to keep it close to the field.

  What's puzzling are the following:

  1. If it were interference the PCM would have gone into lockout.

  2. A combination of in and out of lockout fluctuations would not cause the throttle to go up and down since the throttle stick was down and the lockout was set to idle.

  3. If it were RX battery related I would not expect it to oscillate the control surfaces and the throttle, unless the RX freaks out at low voltage.

  Therefore, I believe this was some type of radio related failure either on the TX or RX side, most likely the RX. 

  One last thought, I have heard people report a bad servos in the system making all the other servos behave badly. Maybe someone has some feedback on this.

  Keith Black

  ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Gray E Fowler 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 9:24 AM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??



    Hey Anthony 

    Never set up that warning function. Several people have indicated a low battery. Lance thinks fractured crystal...10 years old, stored in my garage at 105F to 25F or so. Every battery failure I have seen (none were mine) the radio flat out quit. Lance and I are going back out today, better equipped (long pants-machetes!!!) If I find it I can re-test the battery..It tested about 150 MAH of its rated capacity, but I do not have the tester drain the crap out of the volatge. 
    Man that plane flew good....9 lbs 15 oz...My skills are so deteriorated. 






    Gray Fowler
    Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
    Radomes and Specialty Apertures
    Technical Staff Composites Engineering
    Raytheon 


          Anthony Romano <anthonyr105 at hotmail.com> 
          Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
          09/02/2008 09:18 AM Please respond to
                General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 


         To General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  
                cc  
                Subject Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash?? 

                

         



    Hi Gray,
    What a huge bummer. Did you have the low rx alarm function turned on? On the Stylus that is a switchable function that will drop the throttle to alert you to a low rx voltage. Now I am paranoid and have to go check mine.
    Have heard of similiar "brown out" type of behavior with a Nimh rx battery failure. Hope you can recover the aircraft. This time of year the growth in most places can swallow anything.
    Many solid flights for almost ten years on my Stylus but it is serviced every winter.

    Anthony





----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    From: gfowler at raytheon.com
    Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 08:30:17 -0500
    Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??


    Guys 

    Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180 degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by center again I was losing more and more control. The plane flew over the wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and remnants of Gustav are headed my way. 


    Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

    New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no regulator) 
    Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
    New switch 
    Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

    What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter).  I am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

    Thanks guys....


    Gray Fowler
    Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
    Radomes and Specialty Apertures
    Technical Staff Composites Engineering
    Raytheon


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    Get ideas on sharing photos from people like you. Find new ways to share. Get Ideas Here!_______________________________________________
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    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 





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From lld613 at psci.net  Tue Sep  2 18:00:37 2008
From: lld613 at psci.net (Lisa & Larry)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 02:00:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??
In-Reply-To: <OFCE7C3442.BC6FD016-ON862574B8.004EB68D-862574B8.004F2FC8@mck.us.ray.com>
References: <BLU124-W384EFCE48BBC377BE479B8E25F0@phx.gbl>
	<OFCE7C3442.BC6FD016-ON862574B8.004EB68D-862574B8.004F2FC8@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <1122894884FD456B95668BC1C24DDC48@larrynlisa>

Gray,

 

What type and brand of servos were you using? I've had oscillation problems
when using JR digital servos and noted it on range checking. I swapped out
the JR servos with Airtronics digitals and the problem went away.

 

Did you by chance check the battery performance on the Rx pack with a
similar load that was being placed by the servos? I would be curious what
the discharge curve looked like after the crash if the Rx pack survived,
assuming there is data with a higher discharge rate closer to the servo
load.Looks like your planning on testing this.

 

I had an instance with a FM Rx where the plane just shot down to a 45 degree
during a level flight path. I was told by folks watching that I couldn't
have put that much stick in to make the plane react like that. When I landed
I found the antenna coiled up. After I fixed that it did it again. I then
switched to a PCM Rx with all Futaba digital servo's and never had another
problem in that plane.

 

It was also suggested that my crystal was cracked or bad on that Rx. When
Airtronics looked at it they could find anything wrong with the Tx or Rx and
replaced the crystal in the FM Rx anyway. I've used that Rx in sport planes
with no problems since.

 

Perhaps Mark Atwood may chime in.

 

I'm not sponsored and I'm not a Stylus expert, just curious. I fly the
Stylus Tx and the PCM Rx.

 

Larry Diamond

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Gray E Fowler
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 9:25 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??

 


Hey Anthony 

Never set up that warning function. Several people have indicated a low
battery. Lance thinks fractured crystal...10 years old, stored in my garage
at 105F to 25F or so. Every battery failure I have seen (none were mine) the
radio flat out quit. Lance and I are going back out today, better equipped
(long pants-machetes!!!) If I find it I can re-test the battery..It tested
about 150 MAH of its rated capacity, but I do not have the tester drain the
crap out of the volatge. 
Man that plane flew good....9 lbs 15 oz...My skills are so deteriorated. 






Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon 




Anthony Romano <anthonyr105 at hotmail.com> 
Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 

09/02/2008 09:18 AM 


Please respond to
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>


To

General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 


cc

 


Subject

Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??

 


 

 




Hi Gray,
What a huge bummer. Did you have the low rx alarm function turned on? On the
Stylus that is a switchable function that will drop the throttle to alert
you to a low rx voltage. Now I am paranoid and have to go check mine.
Have heard of similiar "brown out" type of behavior with a Nimh rx battery
failure. Hope you can recover the aircraft. This time of year the growth in
most places can swallow anything.
Many solid flights for almost ten years on my Stylus but it is serviced
every winter.

Anthony





  _____  


To: NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
From: gfowler at raytheon.com
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2008 08:30:17 -0500
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ideas on radio beserkness-cause of crash??


Guys 

Yesterday on my 4th flight of the day my PCM Stylus went nuts. PCM program
was set for idle throttle and about 5-6 clicks(trim wise) of up elevator-all
other surfaces neutral, and this was tested as such by turning off the
transmitter.  As I passed by center I noticed that I could not gain altitude
and the the throttle started going from idle to high...then ailerons started
oscillating small left-right deflections. I cut the throttle to the kill
position but the engine persisted up-down bursts. I was able to do a 180
degree turn with aileron coming back to center...never losing altitude, but
unable to change the altitude,elevator seemed unresponsive. As I passed by
center again I was losing more and more control. The plane flew over the
wooded area south of the field at about 200 feet high, I could not turn and
the ailerons rolled the plane upside down and it went straight down into the
trees. This whole episode last about 45 seconds. Cannot find the plane, and
remnants of Gustav are headed my way. 


Plane was new had about 10 flights on it. 

New battery..NiMH 5 cell pack -no regulator (ran 5 cell packs for years, no
regulator) 
Reciever-1999 Stylus PCM-never crashed, wrapped in foam 
New switch 
Transmitter-1999 Stylus, never been serviced, never had problems 

What would cause a PCM receiver to do such a thing? If I had and
intermittent signal, once the receiver did get a signal the only two
throttle signals should have been idle (PCM hold) and off (transmitter).  I
am going to send the transmitter in just to get checked. 

Thanks guys....


Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon

  _____  

Get ideas on sharing photos from people like you. Find new ways to share.
<http://www.windowslive.com/explore/photogallery/posts?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Pho
to_Gallery_082008> Get Ideas
Here!_______________________________________________
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From gfowler at raytheon.com  Wed Sep  3 06:26:49 2008
From: gfowler at raytheon.com (Gray E Fowler)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 14:26:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
In-Reply-To: <1122894884FD456B95668BC1C24DDC48@larrynlisa>
Message-ID: <OFA3E54B1A.5C99B641-ON862574B9.004BD84D-862574B9.004E2C88@mck.us.ray.com>

Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to 
be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that 
someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it .

What  is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went 
straight in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed 
cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. 
Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size 
divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) 
behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all.

The battery pack had broken the 3/8 balsa sticks on impact that were 
bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the 
battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was 
standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree 
branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all 
worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge 
as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for 
diagnostics.  Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah  pack 
down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony 
described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense. 6 
volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an 
important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. 
When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut 
to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the pulsing of the 
throttle that I experienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a 
testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds 
before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even 
been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for 
the grass instead of the runway).

Anyway I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why 
the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring.

Thanks for the ideas

 




Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Wed Sep  3 06:41:15 2008
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (vicenterc at comcast.net)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 14:41:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
Message-ID: <090320081441.18811.48BEA2050005F9BC0000497B22155934140C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>

Gray,

Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I had heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging when the battery is not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was the problem.

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it . 

What  is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went straight in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 

The battery pack had broken the 3/8 balsa sticks on impact that were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.  Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah  pack down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the pulsing o
 f the 
throttle that I experienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the runway). 

Anyway I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 

Thanks for the ideas 

 




Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon 
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From vanputte at cox.net  Wed Sep  3 06:55:45 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 14:55:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
In-Reply-To: <090320081441.18811.48BEA2050005F9BC0000497B22155934140C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
References: <090320081441.18811.48BEA2050005F9BC0000497B22155934140C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <AFC3B0A2-4626-427C-BA8E-28299621C015@cox.net>

Since I have a small hobby shop, I sell a lot of battery packs.  I  
try to remember to remind customers that a peak detection charger is  
just that; it looks for a peak and ramps back to a trickle charge.  A  
new four-cell or five-cell receiver pack will normally achieve four  
or five peaks, respectively.  If the customer thinks that his new  
battery pack is charged after the first peak, he will be lucky to get  
through a flight or two.  I recommend that customers use a 'wall  
wart' to charge their new battery packs overnight for the first few  
times.  That way, all cells come up to full charge before the pack is  
used.  However, to be fair, I doubt Gray had a new pack in his  
airplane that he'd just taken off his peak detector charger, but his  
crash gives me an opportunity to get on my 'how to charge new battery  
packs' soapbox.

Ron VP

On Sep 3, 2008, at 9:41 AM, vicenterc at comcast.net wrote:

> Gray,
>
> Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I  
> had heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging  
> when the battery is not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was  
> the problem.
>
> --
> Vicente "Vince" Bortone
>
> -------------- Original message --------------
> From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com>
>
> Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was  
> supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am  
> going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and  
> moved it .
>
> What  is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it  
> went straight in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The  
> horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon  
> fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge  
> damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to  
> repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a  
> little nose ring area damage. That is all.
>
> The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that  
> were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per  
> say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the  
> plane. The plane was standing vertical  on the undamage spinner  
> being held up by the tree branches.  Once we got home we hooked  
> eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the  
> battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went  
> in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.  Using the  
> Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah  pack down....it read 80 mah.  
> He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH  
> "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt  
> packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an  
> important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM  
> lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low  
> idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the  
> pulsing of the throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is  
> correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly  
> the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the  
> problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI  
> landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the  
> runway).
>
> Anyway I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to  
> see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring.
>
> Thanks for the ideas
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Gray Fowler
> Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
> Radomes and Specialty Apertures
> Technical Staff Composites Engineering
> Raytheon
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From schale at optonline.net  Wed Sep  3 06:59:17 2008
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 14:59:17 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
In-Reply-To: <OFA3E54B1A.5C99B641-ON862574B9.004BD84D-862574B9.004E2C88@mck.us.ray.com>
References: <OFA3E54B1A.5C99B641-ON862574B9.004BD84D-862574B9.004E2C88@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <48BEA628.5000406@optonline.net>

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From gfowler at raytheon.com  Wed Sep  3 07:02:01 2008
From: gfowler at raytheon.com (Gray E Fowler)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 15:02:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
In-Reply-To: <AFC3B0A2-4626-427C-BA8E-28299621C015@cox.net>
Message-ID: <OFF1A4A9FF.3649FE16-ON862574B9.005241BE-862574B9.0052737A@mck.us.ray.com>

Ron

See the reply to Vicente...new pack cycled on Robbe with NiMh soft peak 
detector...The Robbe also has a continuous 250Mah rate charger...sounds 
like I need to use that first. In all my years of flying...I have never 
had a battery failure.




Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon



Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net> 
Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
09/03/2008 09:57 AM
Please respond to
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>


To
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
cc

Subject
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!






Since I have a small hobby shop, I sell a lot of battery packs.  I 
try to remember to remind customers that a peak detection charger is 
just that; it looks for a peak and ramps back to a trickle charge.  A 
new four-cell or five-cell receiver pack will normally achieve four 
or five peaks, respectively.  If the customer thinks that his new 
battery pack is charged after the first peak, he will be lucky to get 
through a flight or two.  I recommend that customers use a 'wall 
wart' to charge their new battery packs overnight for the first few 
times.  That way, all cells come up to full charge before the pack is 
used.  However, to be fair, I doubt Gray had a new pack in his 
airplane that he'd just taken off his peak detector charger, but his 
crash gives me an opportunity to get on my 'how to charge new battery 
packs' soapbox.

Ron VP

On Sep 3, 2008, at 9:41 AM, vicenterc at comcast.net wrote:

> Gray,
>
> Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I 
> had heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging 
> when the battery is not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was 
> the problem.
>
> --
> Vicente "Vince" Bortone
>
> -------------- Original message --------------
> From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com>
>
> Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was 
> supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am 
> going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and 
> moved it .
>
> What  is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it 
> went straight in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The 
> horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon 
> fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge 
> damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to 
> repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a 
> little nose ring area damage. That is all.
>
> The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that 
> were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per 
> say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the 
> plane. The plane was standing vertical  on the undamage spinner 
> being held up by the tree branches.  Once we got home we hooked 
> eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the 
> battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went 
> in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.  Using the 
> Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah  pack down....it read 80 mah. 
> He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH 
> "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt 
> packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an 
> important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM 
> lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low 
> idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the 
> pulsing of the throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is 
> correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly 
> the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the 
> problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI 
> landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the 
> runway).
>
> Anyway I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to 
> see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring.
>
> Thanks for the ideas
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Gray Fowler
> Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
> Radomes and Specialty Apertures
> Technical Staff Composites Engineering
> Raytheon
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



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From jpavlick at idseng.com  Wed Sep  3 07:03:21 2008
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 15:03:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
In-Reply-To: <OFA3E54B1A.5C99B641-ON862574B9.004BD84D-862574B9.004E2C88@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <558676.62260.qm@web80504.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Gray,
?That's good news. At least the plane will live to fly again AND maybe a lesson was learned here somewhere. Like?I said, I'm not using NiMH airborne packs anymore. I haven't had any major catastrophes but I've had a couple of close calls. The latest was with a good quality 4-cell pack.?I had one season on it. It sat idle for a while then i decided to fly the plane again.?I cycled it 3 times before attempting to fly. It discharged (@ 250mA rate) at greater than rated capacity. I checked it at the field on my ESV and it was in the green so?I assumed I was OK. When running up the plane, after a few minutes of playing with the needle etc, I lost all control. The throttle wouldn't return to idle, no aileron, elevator or rudder. I pulled the fuel line and shut off the engine and then checked the battery. About 2.5V. That's it. Obviously a few dead cells. Luckily this happened on the ground. Like?I said, all my new stuff has 2 LiPOs and 2 regulators with
 a fail-safe switch. I only use batteries for 1 year, then they go into the foamy pool.?
?
John Pavlick

--- On Wed, 9/3/08, Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> wrote:

From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Wednesday, September 3, 2008, 2:13 PM



Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it . 

What ?is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went straight in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 

The battery pack had broken the 3/8 balsa sticks on impact that were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was standing vertical ?on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree branches. ?Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics. ?Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah ?pack down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense. ?6 volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming
 error), hence the pulsing of the throttle that I experienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the runway). 

Anyway I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 

Thanks for the ideas 

?




Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Wed Sep  3 07:22:13 2008
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (vicenterc at comcast.net)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 15:22:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
Message-ID: <090320081522.28218.48BEAB9A0004660400006E3A22165579960C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>

John,

I am using the exact same approach in the last two season.  Very good results.  Having a back up battery is good insurance.

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com> 
Gray,
 That's good news. At least the plane will live to fly again AND maybe a lesson was learned here somewhere. Like I said, I'm not using NiMH airborne packs anymore. I haven't had any major catastrophes but I've had a couple of close calls. The latest was with a good quality 4-cell pack. I had one season on it. It sat idle for a while then i decided to fly the plane again. I cycled it 3 times before attempting to fly. It discharged (@ 250mA rate) at greater than rated capacity. I checked it at the field on my ESV and it was in the green so I assumed I was OK. When running up the plane, after a few minutes of playing with the needle etc, I lost all control. The throttle wouldn't return to idle, no aileron, elevator or rudder. I pulled the fuel line and shut off the engine and then checked the battery. About 2.5V. That's it. Obviously a few dead cells. Luckily this happened on the ground. Like I said, all my new stuff has 2 LiPOs and 2 regulators with a fail-safe switch. I only u
 se bat
teries for 1 year, then they go into the foamy pool. 

John Pavlick

--- On Wed, 9/3/08, Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> wrote:

From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Wednesday, September 3, 2008, 2:13 PM



Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it . 

What  is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went straight in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 

The battery pack had broken the 3/8 balsa sticks on impact that were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.  Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah  pack down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the pulsing o
 f the 
throttle that I experienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the runway). 

Anyway I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 

Thanks for the ideas 

 




Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From: John Pavlick <jpavlick at idseng.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 15:04:49 +0000
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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Wed Sep  3 07:24:16 2008
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 15:24:16 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
In-Reply-To: <OFF1A4A9FF.3649FE16-ON862574B9.005241BE-862574B9.0052737A@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <794221.41344.qm@web33008.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Gray, 

New pack or not (as you probably know) doesn't matter. I lost a plane that had a brand new NMP Lithium Ion pack in it. I charged it the night before with the NMP charger, checked it under load before I took off. Then I took off and came back downwind and had nothing. My PCM was set to hold the last position. The wind pushed the tail around and it flew back past us and way off into the Nevada desert. Took five hours to find. We took the wrapper off the pack and tested the cells individually. One was fully dead, the other was fine. 

Brand new pack.. There's a lot of validity to running a dual pack setup. I still don't, but I can see how it would save a lot of planes. 

Glad you got it back!!

Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Wed, 9/3/08, Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> wrote:
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Wednesday, September 3, 2008, 8:00 AM



Ron



See the reply to Vicente...new pack
cycled on Robbe with NiMh soft peak detector...The Robbe also has a continuous
250Mah rate charger...sounds like I need to use that first. In all my years
of flying...I have never had a battery failure.









Gray Fowler

Senior Principal Chemical Engineer

Radomes and Specialty Apertures

Technical Staff Composites Engineering

Raytheon








Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net>


Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
09/03/2008 09:57 AM



Please respond to

General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>






To
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>


cc




Subject
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a
miracle!!!















Since I have a small hobby shop, I sell a lot of battery
packs. ?I ?

try to remember to remind customers that a peak detection charger is ?

just that; it looks for a peak and ramps back to a trickle charge. ?A
?

new four-cell or five-cell receiver pack will normally achieve four ?

or five peaks, respectively. ?If the customer thinks that his new
?

battery pack is charged after the first peak, he will be lucky to get ?

through a flight or two. ?I recommend that customers use a 'wall ?

wart' to charge their new battery packs overnight for the first few ?

times. ?That way, all cells come up to full charge before the pack
is ?

used. ?However, to be fair, I doubt Gray had a new pack in his ?

airplane that he'd just taken off his peak detector charger, but his ?

crash gives me an opportunity to get on my 'how to charge new battery ?

packs' soapbox.



Ron VP



On Sep 3, 2008, at 9:41 AM, vicenterc at comcast.net wrote:



> Gray,

>

> Yes, that is good news. ?Clearly the battery was the problem.
?I ?

> had heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop
charging ?

> when the battery is not really fully charged. ?I wonder if this
was ?

> the problem.

>

> --

> Vicente "Vince" Bortone

>

> -------------- Original message --------------

> From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com>

>

> Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was ?

> supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am
?

> going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and ?

> moved it .

>

> What ?is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering
it ?

> went straight in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The ?

> horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon
?

> fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge ?

> damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to
?

> repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a ?

> little nose ring area damage. That is all.

>

> The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that
?

> were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable"
per ?

> say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the ?

> plane. The plane was standing vertical ?on the undamage spinner
?

> being held up by the tree branches. ?Once we got home we hooked
?

> eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the ?

> battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went
?

> in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics. ?Using
the ?

> Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah ?pack down....it read 80
mah. ?

> He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH
?

> "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.
?6 volt ?

> packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an
?

> important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM
?

> lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low
?

> idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the
?

> pulsing of the throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is
?

> correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly ?

> the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the
?

> problem started I may have even been able to score a "10"
FAI ?

> landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the
?

> runway).

>

> Anyway I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to ?

> see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring.

>

> Thanks for the ideas

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Gray Fowler

> Senior Principal Chemical Engineer

> Radomes and Specialty Apertures

> Technical Staff Composites Engineering

> Raytheon

> _______________________________________________

> NSRCA-discussion mailing list

> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



_______________________________________________

NSRCA-discussion mailing list

NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion







_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From gfowler at raytheon.com  Wed Sep  3 07:26:46 2008
From: gfowler at raytheon.com (Gray E Fowler)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 15:26:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
In-Reply-To: <090320081441.18811.48BEA2050005F9BC0000497B22155934140C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <OFE09331DD.84082832-ON862574B9.0051D620-862574B9.00521619@mck.us.ray.com>

Vicente

The Robbe charger has a setting for soft peak, which is to be used for 
NiMH. This is what I had. I cycled twice before using this new 
battery..what I remember was getting about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah 
pack. I think there may be a "high drain" problem on the plane in 
addition.



Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon



vicenterc at comcast.net 
Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
09/03/2008 09:42 AM
Please respond to
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>


To
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
cc

Subject
Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!






Gray,
 
Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I had heard 
that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging when the battery 
is not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was the problem.
 
--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone
 
-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to 
be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that 
someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it . 

What  is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went 
straight in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed 
cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. 
Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size 
divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) 
behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 

The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were 
bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the 
battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was 
standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree 
branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all 
worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge 
as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for 
diagnostics.  Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah  pack 
down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony 
described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense. 6 
volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an 
important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. 
When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut 
to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the pulsing of the 
throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a 
testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds 
before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even 
been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for 
the grass instead of the runway). 

Anyway I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why 
the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 

Thanks for the ideas 

 




Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Wed Sep  3 07:43:53 2008
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (vicenterc at comcast.net)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 15:43:53 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
Message-ID: <090320081543.10097.48BEB0B5000E16870000277122165579960C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>

Gray,

Yes, high drain could have been the problem.  Since the plane is in good condition probably you can check.  I think you should consider using two batteries of your preference.  I starting to use the 9100 receiver that already has two power inputs.  Check details here:

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100


--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Vicente 

The Robbe charger has a setting for soft peak, which is to be used for NiMH. This is what I had. I cycled twice before using this new battery..what I remember was getting about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah pack. I think there may be a "high drain" problem on the plane in addition. 



Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon 


vicenterc at comcast.net 
Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
09/03/2008 09:42 AM Please respond to
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>

ToGeneral pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
cc
SubjectRe: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!







Gray, 
  
Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I had heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging when the battery is not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was the problem. 
  
--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
  
-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it . 

What  is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went straight in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 

The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.  Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah  pack down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the pulsing
  of th
e throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the runway). 

Anyway I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 

Thanks for the ideas 






Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 15:28:53 +0000
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From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Wed Sep  3 07:53:43 2008
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 15:53:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
In-Reply-To: <090320081543.10097.48BEB0B5000E16870000277122165579960C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <F61A9253622745B5A83B599C2D7A4DB7@jaysdesktop>

As I read the literature, the dual battery setup is designed to provide a
heavier buss for more current. It does not solve the problem of a failed
battery(s). This could effectively add even more drain. The ideal setup
still seems to be dual battery packs with dual regulators, or some other
means to isolate a failed pack.

 

Jay Marshall 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
vicenterc at comcast.net
Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:44 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!

 

Gray,

 

Yes, high drain could have been the problem.  Since the plane is in good
condition probably you can check.  I think you should consider using two
batteries of your preference.  I starting to use the 9100 receiver that
already has two power inputs.  Check details here:

 

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100

 

 

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

 

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Vicente 

The Robbe charger has a setting for soft peak, which is to be used for NiMH.
This is what I had. I cycled twice before using this new battery..what I
remember was getting about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah pack. I think there
may be a "high drain" problem on the plane in addition. 



Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon 




vicenterc at comcast.net 
Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 

09/03/2008 09:42 AM 


Please respond to
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>


To

General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 


cc

 


Subject

Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!

 


 

 




Gray, 
  
Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I had heard
that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging when the battery is
not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was the problem. 
  
--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
  
-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be.
Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone
went into the woods Monday night and moved it . 

What  is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went
straig ht in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed
cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking.
Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size
divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure)
behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 

The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were
bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the
battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was
standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree
branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all
worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge
as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.
Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah &nbs p;pack down....it read 80
mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH
"brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt packNiMH ,
drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an important note is I
now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock
the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle
(programming error), hence the pulsing of the throttle that I exper ienced.
If this diagnosis is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was
able to fly the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when
the problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI landing
(not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the runway). 

Anyway I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the
battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 

Thanks for the ideas 






Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 



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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Wed Sep  3 08:23:16 2008
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (vicenterc at comcast.net)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 16:23:16 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
Message-ID: <090320081623.17812.48BEB9EB000C4E700000459422165579960C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>

Correct,  I still use separate regulators for each battery.  This system is smart that isolates the bad battery if something goes wrong.  In this way,  the bad battery won't drain the good one.  The LED in the receiver tells you if the battery has been isolated.  

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: "Jay Marshall" <lightfoot at sc.rr.com> 

As I read the literature, the dual battery setup is designed to provide a heavier buss for more current. It does not solve the problem of a failed battery(s). This could effectively add even more drain. The ideal setup still seems to be dual battery packs with dual regulators, or some other means to isolate a failed pack.

Jay Marshall 
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of vicenterc at comcast.net
Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:44 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!

Gray,

Yes, high drain could have been the problem.  Since the plane is in good condition probably you can check.  I think you should consider using two batteries of your preference.  I starting to use the 9100 receiver that already has two power inputs.  Check details here:

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100


--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Vicente 

The Robbe charger has a setting for soft peak, which is to be used for NiMH. This is what I had. I cycled twice before using this new battery..what I remember was getting about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah pack. I think there may be a "high drain" problem on the plane in addition. 



Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon 


vicenterc at comcast.net 
Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
09/03/2008 09:42 AM 
Please respond to
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
ToGeneral pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
cc
SubjectRe: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!








Gray, 
  
Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I had heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging when the battery is not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was the problem. 
  
--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
  
-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it . 

What  is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went straig ht in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 

The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.  Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah &nbs p;pack down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the p
 ulsing
 of the throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the runway). 

Anyway I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 

Thanks for the ideas 






Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Wed Sep  3 08:23:16 2008
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (vicenterc at comcast.net)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 16:23:16 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
Message-ID: <090320081623.17812.48BEB9EB000C4E700000459422165579960C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>

Correct,  I still use separate regulators for each battery.  This system is smart that isolates the bad battery if something goes wrong.  In this way,  the bad battery won't drain the good one.  The LED in the receiver tells you if the battery has been isolated.  

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: "Jay Marshall" <lightfoot at sc.rr.com> 

As I read the literature, the dual battery setup is designed to provide a heavier buss for more current. It does not solve the problem of a failed battery(s). This could effectively add even more drain. The ideal setup still seems to be dual battery packs with dual regulators, or some other means to isolate a failed pack.

Jay Marshall 
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of vicenterc at comcast.net
Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:44 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!

Gray,

Yes, high drain could have been the problem.  Since the plane is in good condition probably you can check.  I think you should consider using two batteries of your preference.  I starting to use the 9100 receiver that already has two power inputs.  Check details here:

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100


--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Vicente 

The Robbe charger has a setting for soft peak, which is to be used for NiMH. This is what I had. I cycled twice before using this new battery..what I remember was getting about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah pack. I think there may be a "high drain" problem on the plane in addition. 



Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon 


vicenterc at comcast.net 
Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
09/03/2008 09:42 AM 
Please respond to
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
ToGeneral pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
cc
SubjectRe: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!








Gray, 
  
Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I had heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging when the battery is not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was the problem. 
  
--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
  
-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it . 

What  is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went straig ht in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 

The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.  Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah &nbs p;pack down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the p
 ulsing
 of the throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the runway). 

Anyway I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 

Thanks for the ideas 






Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From: "Jay Marshall" <lightfoot at sc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 16:06:20 +0000
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Wed Sep  3 11:15:06 2008
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (vicenterc at comcast.net)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 19:15:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
Message-ID: <090320081915.16152.48BEE2340007442B00003F1822165384960C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>

I found the manual here:  

http://www.horizonhobby.com/ProdInfo/Files/AR9100_Manual_LR.pdf

Check page 4 under "Using Two Batteries"  section.  

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: "Jay Marshall" <lightfoot at sc.rr.com> 

As I read the literature, the dual battery setup is designed to provide a heavier buss for more current. It does not solve the problem of a failed battery(s). This could effectively add even more drain. The ideal setup still seems to be dual battery packs with dual regulators, or some other means to isolate a failed pack.

Jay Marshall 
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of vicenterc at comcast.net
Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:44 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!

Gray,

Yes, high drain could have been the problem.  Since the plane is in good condition probably you can check.  I think you should consider using two batteries of your preference.  I starting to use the 9100 receiver that already has two power inputs.  Check details here:

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100


--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Vicente 

The Robbe charger has a setting for soft peak, which is to be used for NiMH. This is what I had. I cycled twice before using this new battery..what I remember was getting about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah pack. I think there may be a "high drain" problem on the plane in addition. 



Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon 


vicenterc at comcast.net 
Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
09/03/2008 09:42 AM 
Please respond to
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
ToGeneral pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
cc
SubjectRe: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!








Gray, 
  
Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I had heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging when the battery is not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was the problem. 
  
--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
  
-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it . 

What  is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went straig ht in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 

The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.  Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah &nbs p;pack down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the p
 ulsing
 of the throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the runway). 

Anyway I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 

Thanks for the ideas 






Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From: "Jay Marshall" <lightfoot at sc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2008 16:06:20 +0000
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From cjm767driver at hotmail.com  Wed Sep  3 15:07:44 2008
From: cjm767driver at hotmail.com (chris moon)
Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2008 23:07:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric website update
Message-ID: <BLU137-W15C83D4441F6D38BDE1DAE835E0@phx.gbl>


Thanks to everyone who has send me data and pics too for the new 
electric web site www.electric-f3a.com   It has been up just over a week 
and has been averaging over 1000 page hits a day from all over the 
world.  I would like to ask those who have not "shared" so far if you 
could please help out your fellow modeler and do so.  Someone asked if 
they should send their data even if it matches someone else's.  Yes, 
please do.  It would be good to know how many people are using a certain 
battery or motor along with the performance numbers.  I don't need 
complete data if you don't have it, just send what you have.  It can be 
as simple as "battery XYZ 50 cycles - no problems"  or "motor ABC and 
20-13 prop - good performance".  The data input forms are on the site - 
just fill in what data you have and submit. 

I have also added a site feedback form link on the front page.  Your 
comments and ideas are welcome.

Thanks again for helping...and viewing


Chris


_________________________________________________________________
Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows Live.
http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008
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From tkeithblack at gmail.com  Wed Sep  3 19:33:45 2008
From: tkeithblack at gmail.com (Keith Black)
Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 03:33:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
In-Reply-To: <090320081623.17812.48BEB9EB000C4E700000459422165579960C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
References: <090320081623.17812.48BEB9EB000C4E700000459422165579960C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <D47D895200CC4A19A9FC8CD8F3AD2D6E@OfficePC>

What I've done is have two batteries and two regulators, one regulator at 5.7 volts and one at 5.3 volts (or any voltage lower). On the higher voltage regulator I connect my primary battery, say a 2000 mah five cell or Lithium. On the lower voltage regulator I connect the smallest battery I can buy, say a 750 Lipo that weighs less than an ounce. 

Since the larger battery is hooked to a regulator that outputs a higher voltage all drain comes from the primary battery and nothing is sucked from the smaller battery unless the main battery drops below 5.3 volts (or fails). 

This works great and when recharging the smaller battery seldom needs any recharge at all.

I spoke to Jim Oddino before doing this and confirmed that the lower voltage battery would not suck voltage from the larger battery since it was going through his regulator (Jaccio regulator).

This setup has worked great for me and even saved a plane when my primary battery came loose and disconnected once!

Keith Black

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: vicenterc at comcast.net 
  To: General pattern discussion ; 'General pattern discussion' 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:23 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


  Correct,  I still use separate regulators for each battery.  This system is smart that isolates the bad battery if something goes wrong.  In this way,  the bad battery won't drain the good one.  The LED in the receiver tells you if the battery has been isolated.  

  --
  Vicente "Vince" Bortone

    -------------- Original message -------------- 
    From: "Jay Marshall" <lightfoot at sc.rr.com> 

    As I read the literature, the dual battery setup is designed to provide a heavier buss for more current. It does not solve the problem of a failed battery(s). This could effectively add even more drain. The ideal setup still seems to be dual battery packs with dual regulators, or some other means to isolate a failed pack.



    Jay Marshall 

    -----Original Message-----
    From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of vicenterc at comcast.net
    Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:44 AM
    To: General pattern d iscuss ion
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!



    Gray,



    Yes, high drain could have been the problem.  Since the plane is in good condition probably you can check.  I think you should consider using two batteries of your preference.  I starting to use the 9100 receiver that already has two power inputs.  Check details here:



    http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100





    --
    Vicente "Vince" Bortone



      -------------- Original message -------------- 
      From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

      Vicente 

      The Robbe charger has a setting for soft peak, which is to be used for NiMH. This is what I had. I cycled twice before using this new battery..what I remember was getting about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah pack. I think there may be a "high drain" problem on the plane in addition. 



      Gray Fowler
      Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
      Radomes and Specialty Apertures
      Technical Staff Composites Engineer ing
      Raytheon 



            vicenterc at comcast.net 
            Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 

            09/03/2008 09:42 AM 

                  Please respond to
                  General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
                 

           To
                 General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
                 
                  cc
                 
                 
                  Subject
                 Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
                 




                 
                 

           




      Gray, 
        
      Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I had heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging when the battery is not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was the problem. 
        
      --
      Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
        
      -------------- Original message -------------- 
      From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

      Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it . 

      What   is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went straig ht in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 

      The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.  Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah &nbs p;pack down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the pulsing of the throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the runway). 
      Anyw ay I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 

      Thanks for the ideas 






      Gray Fowler
      Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
      Radomes and Specialty Apertures
      Technical Staff Composites Engineering
      Raytheon _______________________________________________
      NSRCA-discussion mailing list
      NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
      http://lists.nsrca.o rg/mai lman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 





------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Thu Sep  4 02:32:21 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 10:32:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
References: <090320081623.17812.48BEB9EB000C4E700000459422165579960C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
	<D47D895200CC4A19A9FC8CD8F3AD2D6E@OfficePC>
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV487E7D3DFD9BAA6788570E8590@phx.gbl>

Keith:
That setup works well.  I refer to it as a hot standby, with details covered in a tech tip on the Tech-Aero website.  I prefer a different approach, where you just split the battery capacity equally between two packs, each with its own regulator. The regulators must be precisely matched in output voltage setting to allow then to both actively share the load simultaneously.  You can make a very light setup with this and there are several advantages to it. First, you can check every flight to see that each battery is being used as expected, which is very important to know. Second, you double your peak load capacity under load.  A single 5A regulator such as the JAICCIO or the Tech-Aero can handle the load in a pattern airplane just fine, but it's also good to know that you can have two 5A regulators online at once, providing a 10A peak current capability.

The Tech-Tip on how this all works is at http://www.tech-aero.net/Tech-Tips.htm

Ed
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Keith Black 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 10:33 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


  What I've done is have two batteries and two regulators, one regulator at 5.7 volts and one at 5.3 volts (or any voltage lower). On the higher voltage regulator I connect my primary battery, say a 2000 mah five cell or Lithium. On the lower voltage regulator I connect the smallest battery I can buy, say a 750 Lipo that weighs less than an ounce. 

  Since the larger battery is hooked to a regulator that outputs a higher voltage all drain comes from the primary battery and nothing is sucked from the smaller battery unless the main battery drops below 5.3 volts (or fails). 

  This works great and when recharging the smaller battery seldom needs any recharge at all.

  I spoke to Jim Oddino before doing this and confirmed that the lower voltage battery would not suck voltage from the larger battery since it was going through his regulator (Jaccio regulator).

  This setup has worked great for me and even saved a plane when my primary battery came loose and disconnected once!

  Keith Black

    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: vicenterc at comcast.net 
    To: General pattern discussion ; 'General pattern discussion' 
    Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:23 AM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


    Correct,  I still use separate regulators for each battery.  This system is smart that isolates the bad battery if something goes wrong.  In this way,  the bad battery won't drain the good one.  The LED in the receiver tells you if the battery has been isolated.  

    --
    Vicente "Vince" Bortone

      -------------- Original message -------------- 
      From: "Jay Marshall" <lightfoot at sc.rr.com> 

      As I read the literature, the dual battery setup is designed to provide a heavier buss for more current. It does not solve the problem of a failed battery(s). This could effectively add even more drain. The ideal setup still seems to be dual battery packs with dual regulators, or some other means to isolate a failed pack.



      Jay Marshall 

      -----Original Message-----
      From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of vicenterc at comcast.net
      Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:44 AM
      To: General pattern d iscuss ion
      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!



      Gray,



      Yes, high drain could have been the problem.  Since the plane is in good condition probably you can check.  I think you should consider using two batteries of your preference.  I starting to use the 9100 receiver that already has two power inputs.  Check details here:



      http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100





      --
      Vicente "Vince" Bortone



        -------------- Original message -------------- 
        From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

        Vicente 

        The Robbe charger has a setting for soft peak, which is to be used for NiMH. This is what I had. I cycled twice before using this new battery..what I remember was getting about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah pack. I think there may be a "high drain" problem on the plane in addition. 



        Gray Fowler
        Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
        Radomes and Specialty Apertures
        Technical Staff Composites Engineer ing
        Raytheon 



              vicenterc at comcast.net 
              Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 

              09/03/2008 09:42 AM 

                    Please respond to
                    General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
                   

             To
                   General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
                   
                    cc
                   
                   
                    Subject
                   Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
                   




                   
                   

             




        Gray, 
          
        Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I had heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging when the battery is not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was the problem. 
          
        --
        Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
          
        -------------- Original message -------------- 
        From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

        Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it . 

        What   is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went straig ht in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 

        The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.  Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah &nbs p;pack down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the pulsing of the throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the runway). 
        Anyw ay I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 

        Thanks for the ideas 






        Gray Fowler
        Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
        Radomes and Specialty Apertures
        Technical Staff Composites Engineering
        Raytheon _______________________________________________
        NSRCA-discussion mailing list
        NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
        http://lists.nsrca.o rg/mai lman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 





----------------------------------------------------------------------------


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    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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From Tim.Pascoe at ec.gc.ca  Thu Sep  4 04:43:37 2008
From: Tim.Pascoe at ec.gc.ca (Pascoe,Tim [Burlington])
Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 12:43:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Redundant Power...... was RE: Part 2-Its a
	miracle!!!
In-Reply-To: <D47D895200CC4A19A9FC8CD8F3AD2D6E@OfficePC>
References: <090320081623.17812.48BEB9EB000C4E700000459422165579960C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
	<D47D895200CC4A19A9FC8CD8F3AD2D6E@OfficePC>
Message-ID: <2DC5CCA14756424BBBEE8B4B2E4A682F07268835@ecburexch1.ontario.int.ec.gc.ca>

The tech-aero site has a discussion paper which highlights the different ways to set up multiple battery configurations.

 

http://www.tech-aero.net/documents/Tech-Tip%200601.pdf

 

Timothy Pascoe 
Physical Sciences Specialist


Yak Shaving - Any seemingly pointless activity which is actually necessary to solve a problem which solves a problem which, several levels of recursion later, solves the real problem you're working on


Environment Canada / Environnement Canada
Canada Centre for Inland Waters / Centre Canadien des Eaux Int?rieures
867 Lakeshore Road / 867, chemin Lakeshore
Burlington, Ontario / Burlington (Ontario) 
L7R 4A6

Tel/T?l: (905) 336-6239
Fax/T?l?c: (905) 336-4609
E-mail/C. ?lec: tim.pascoe at ec.gc.ca <blocked::mailto:tim.pascoe at ec.gc.ca> 
Government of Canada/Gouvernement du Canada 
This e-mail represents the opinions and views solely held by its author and in no manner may be considered as representing those of his/her employer.

________________________________

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Keith Black
Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:34 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!

 

What I've done is have two batteries and two regulators, one regulator at 5.7 volts and one at 5.3 volts (or any voltage lower). On the higher voltage regulator I connect my primary battery, say a 2000 mah five cell or Lithium. On the lower voltage regulator I connect the smallest battery I can buy, say a 750 Lipo that weighs less than an ounce. 

 

Since the larger battery is hooked to a regulator that outputs a higher voltage all drain comes from the primary battery and nothing is sucked from the smaller battery unless the main battery drops below 5.3 volts (or fails). 

 

This works great and when recharging the smaller battery seldom needs any recharge at all.

 

I spoke to Jim Oddino before doing this and confirmed that the lower voltage battery would not suck voltage from the larger battery since it was going through his regulator (Jaccio regulator).

 

This setup has worked great for me and even saved a plane when my primary battery came loose and disconnected once!

 

Keith Black

 

	----- Original Message ----- 

	From: vicenterc at comcast.net 

	To: General pattern discussion <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  ; 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

	Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:23 AM

	Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!

	 

	Correct,  I still use separate regulators for each battery.  This system is smart that isolates the bad battery if something goes wrong.  In this way,  the bad battery won't drain the good one.  The LED in the receiver tells you if the battery has been isolated.  

	 

	--
	Vicente "Vince" Bortone

	 

		-------------- Original message -------------- 
		From: "Jay Marshall" <lightfoot at sc.rr.com> 

		As I read the literature, the dual battery setup is designed to provide a heavier buss for more current. It does not solve the problem of a failed battery(s). This could effectively add even more drain. The ideal setup still seems to be dual battery packs with dual regulators, or some other means to isolate a failed pack.

		 

		Jay Marshall 

		-----Original Message-----
		From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of vicenterc at comcast.net
		Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:44 AM
		To: General pattern d iscuss ion
		Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!

		 

		Gray,

		 

		Yes, high drain could have been the problem.  Since the plane is in good condition probably you can check.  I think you should consider using two batteries of your preference.  I starting to use the 9100 receiver that already has two power inputs.  Check details here:

		 

		http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100

		 

		 

		--
		Vicente "Vince" Bortone

		 

			-------------- Original message -------------- 
			From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 
			
			Vicente 
			
			The Robbe charger has a setting for soft peak, which is to be used for NiMH. This is what I had. I cycled twice before using this new battery..what I remember was getting about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah pack. I think there may be a "high drain" problem on the plane in addition. 
			
			
			
			Gray Fowler
			Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
			Radomes and Specialty Apertures
			Technical Staff Composites Engineer ing
			Raytheon 

vicenterc at comcast.net 
Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 

09/03/2008 09:42 AM 

Please respond to
General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>

To

General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 

cc

 

Subject

Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!

 

 

 

			
			
			
			Gray, 
			  
			Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I had heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging when the battery is not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was the problem. 
			  
			--
			Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
			  
			-------------- Original message -------------- 
			From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 
			
			Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it . 
			
			What   is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went straig ht in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 
			
			The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.  Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah &nbs p;pack down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the pulsing of the throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the runway). 
			Anyw ay I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 
			
			Thanks for the ideas 
			
			
			
			
			
			
			Gray Fowler
			Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
			Radomes and Specialty Apertures
			Technical Staff Composites Engineering
			Raytheon _______________________________________________
			NSRCA-discussion mailing list
			NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
			http://lists.nsrca.o rg/mai lman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 

	
________________________________


	_______________________________________________
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	NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
	http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From wgalligan at att.net  Thu Sep  4 06:09:17 2008
From: wgalligan at att.net (Wayne Galligan)
Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 14:09:17 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV487E7D3DFD9BAA6788570E8590@phx.gbl>
References: <090320081623.17812.48BEB9EB000C4E700000459422165579960C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net><D47D895200CC4A19A9FC8CD8F3AD2D6E@OfficePC>
	<BAY135-DAV487E7D3DFD9BAA6788570E8590@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <F225AD5EBA5A49BC8A4831506E4156CB@WaynePC>

Ed or Jim O.,

I am running dual 1500 mil 6v NiMh packs in my Ultimate.  I am using 2 of the 6v regulated Miracle switches by MPI. I find that one pack is consistently lower after two or three flights.  Could it be that the regulators are not matched and one draws more then the other one? Could be a bad battery I'll have to remove and test. They seem to use about the same amount of mil amps but one is lower in voltage then the other.  I use a 1amp load when testing after each flight and stop flying when the voltage drops to 5.8v loaded.

Thanks
Wayne
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Ed Alt 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 5:32 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


  Keith:
  That setup works well.  I refer to it as a hot standby, with details covered in a tech tip on the Tech-Aero website.  I prefer a different approach, where you just split the battery capacity equally between two packs, each with its own regulator. The regulators must be precisely matched in output voltage setting to allow then to both actively share the load simultaneously.  You can make a very light setup with this and there are several advantages to it. First, you can check every flight to see that each battery is being used as expected, which is very important to know. Second, you double your peak load capacity under load.  A single 5A regulator such as the JAICCIO or the Tech-Aero can handle the load in a pattern airplane just fine, but it's also good to know that you can have two 5A regulators online at once, providing a 10A peak current capability.

  The Tech-Tip on how this all works is at http://www.tech-aero.net/Tech-Tips.htm

  Ed
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Keith Black 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 10:33 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


    What I've done is have two batteries and two regulators, one regulator at 5.7 volts and one at 5.3 volts (or any voltage lower). On the higher voltage regulator I connect my primary battery, say a 2000 mah five cell or Lithium. On the lower voltage regulator I connect the smallest battery I can buy, say a 750 Lipo that weighs less than an ounce. 

    Since the larger battery is hooked to a regulator that outputs a higher voltage all drain comes from the primary battery and nothing is sucked from the smaller battery unless the main battery drops below 5.3 volts (or fails). 

    This works great and when recharging the smaller battery seldom needs any recharge at all.

    I spoke to Jim Oddino before doing this and confirmed that the lower voltage battery would not suck voltage from the larger battery since it was going through his regulator (Jaccio regulator).

    This setup has worked great for me and even saved a plane when my primary battery came loose and disconnected once!

    Keith Black

      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: vicenterc at comcast.net 
      To: General pattern discussion ; 'General pattern discussion' 
      Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:23 AM
      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


      Correct,  I still use separate regulators for each battery.  This system is smart that isolates the bad battery if something goes wrong.  In this way,  the bad battery won't drain the good one.  The LED in the receiver tells you if the battery has been isolated.  

      --
      Vicente "Vince" Bortone

        -------------- Original message -------------- 
        From: "Jay Marshall" <lightfoot at sc.rr.com> 

        As I read the literature, the dual battery setup is designed to provide a heavier buss for more current. It does not solve the problem of a failed battery(s). This could effectively add even more drain. The ideal setup still seems to be dual battery packs with dual regulators, or some other means to isolate a failed pack.



        Jay Marshall 

        -----Original Message-----
        From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of vicenterc at comcast.net
        Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:44 AM
        To: General pattern d iscuss ion
        Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!



        Gray,



        Yes, high drain could have been the problem.  Since the plane is in good condition probably you can check.  I think you should consider using two batteries of your preference.  I starting to use the 9100 receiver that already has two power inputs.  Check details here:



        http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100





        --
        Vicente "Vince" Bortone



          -------------- Original message -------------- 
          From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

          Vicente 

          The Robbe charger has a setting for soft peak, which is to be used for NiMH. This is what I had. I cycled twice before using this new battery..what I remember was getting about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah pack. I think there may be a "high drain" problem on the plane in addition. 



          Gray Fowler
          Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
          Radomes and Specialty Apertures
          Technical Staff Composites Engineer ing
          Raytheon 



                vicenterc at comcast.net 
                Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 

                09/03/2008 09:42 AM 

                      Please respond to
                      General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
                     

               To
                     General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
                     
                      cc
                     
                     
                      Subject
                     Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
                     




                     
                     

               




          Gray, 
            
          Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I had heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging when the battery is not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was the problem. 
            
          --
          Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
            
          -------------- Original message -------------- 
          From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

          Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it . 

          What   is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went straig ht in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 

          The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.  Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah &nbs p;pack down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the pulsing of the throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the runway). 
          Anyw ay I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 

          Thanks for the ideas 






          Gray Fowler
          Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
          Radomes and Specialty Apertures
          Technical Staff Composites Engineering
          Raytheon _______________________________________________
          NSRCA-discussion mailing list
          NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
          http://lists.nsrca.o rg/mai lman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 





--------------------------------------------------------------------------


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      NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
      http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Thu Sep  4 07:22:20 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 15:22:20 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
References: <090320081623.17812.48BEB9EB000C4E700000459422165579960C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net><D47D895200CC4A19A9FC8CD8F3AD2D6E@OfficePC><BAY135-DAV487E7D3DFD9BAA6788570E8590@phx.gbl>
	<F225AD5EBA5A49BC8A4831506E4156CB@WaynePC>
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV4E5C7DD2389C380DF9856E8590@phx.gbl>

Wayne:
The regulators not being matched is the cause, and it's the reason I began producing Tech-Aero regulators in the first place.  There was nothing on the market that you could consistently match output voltages precisely enough in order to balance the current draw from separate packs.

Ed
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Wayne Galligan 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 9:08 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


  Ed or Jim O.,

  I am running dual 1500 mil 6v NiMh packs in my Ultimate.  I am using 2 of the 6v regulated Miracle switches by MPI. I find that one pack is consistently lower after two or three flights.  Could it be that the regulators are not matched and one draws more then the other one? Could be a bad battery I'll have to remove and test. They seem to use about the same amount of mil amps but one is lower in voltage then the other.  I use a 1amp load when testing after each flight and stop flying when the voltage drops to 5.8v loaded.

  Thanks
  Wayne
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Ed Alt 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 5:32 AM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


    Keith:
    That setup works well.  I refer to it as a hot standby, with details covered in a tech tip on the Tech-Aero website.  I prefer a different approach, where you just split the battery capacity equally between two packs, each with its own regulator. The regulators must be precisely matched in output voltage setting to allow then to both actively share the load simultaneously.  You can make a very light setup with this and there are several advantages to it. First, you can check every flight to see that each battery is being used as expected, which is very important to know. Second, you double your peak load capacity under load.  A single 5A regulator such as the JAICCIO or the Tech-Aero can handle the load in a pattern airplane just fine, but it's also good to know that you can have two 5A regulators online at once, providing a 10A peak current capability.

    The Tech-Tip on how this all works is at http://www.tech-aero.net/Tech-Tips.htm

    Ed
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: Keith Black 
      To: General pattern discussion 
      Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 10:33 PM
      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


      What I've done is have two batteries and two regulators, one regulator at 5.7 volts and one at 5.3 volts (or any voltage lower). On the higher voltage regulator I connect my primary battery, say a 2000 mah five cell or Lithium. On the lower voltage regulator I connect the smallest battery I can buy, say a 750 Lipo that weighs less than an ounce. 

      Since the larger battery is hooked to a regulator that outputs a higher voltage all drain comes from the primary battery and nothing is sucked from the smaller battery unless the main battery drops below 5.3 volts (or fails). 

      This works great and when recharging the smaller battery seldom needs any recharge at all.

      I spoke to Jim Oddino before doing this and confirmed that the lower voltage battery would not suck voltage from the larger battery since it was going through his regulator (Jaccio regulator).

      This setup has worked great for me and even saved a plane when my primary battery came loose and disconnected once!

      Keith Black

        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: vicenterc at comcast.net 
        To: General pattern discussion ; 'General pattern discussion' 
        Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:23 AM
        Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


        Correct,  I still use separate regulators for each battery.  This system is smart that isolates the bad battery if something goes wrong.  In this way,  the bad battery won't drain the good one.  The LED in the receiver tells you if the battery has been isolated.  

        --
        Vicente "Vince" Bortone

          -------------- Original message -------------- 
          From: "Jay Marshall" <lightfoot at sc.rr.com> 

          As I read the literature, the dual battery setup is designed to provide a heavier buss for more current. It does not solve the problem of a failed battery(s). This could effectively add even more drain. The ideal setup still seems to be dual battery packs with dual regulators, or some other means to isolate a failed pack.



          Jay Marshall 

          -----Original Message-----
          From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of vicenterc at comcast.net
          Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:44 AM
          To: General pattern d iscuss ion
          Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!



          Gray,



          Yes, high drain could have been the problem.  Since the plane is in good condition probably you can check.  I think you should consider using two batteries of your preference.  I starting to use the 9100 receiver that already has two power inputs.  Check details here:



          http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100





          --
          Vicente "Vince" Bortone



            -------------- Original message -------------- 
            From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

            Vicente 

            The Robbe charger has a setting for soft peak, which is to be used for NiMH. This is what I had. I cycled twice before using this new battery..what I remember was getting about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah pack. I think there may be a "high drain" problem on the plane in addition. 



            Gray Fowler
            Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
            Radomes and Specialty Apertures
            Technical Staff Composites Engineer ing
            Raytheon 



                  vicenterc at comcast.net 
                  Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 

                  09/03/2008 09:42 AM 

                        Please respond to
                        General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
                       

                 To
                       General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
                       
                        cc
                       
                       
                        Subject
                       Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
                       




                       
                       

                 




            Gray, 
              
            Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I had heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging when the battery is not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was the problem. 
              
            --
            Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
              
            -------------- Original message -------------- 
            From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

            Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it . 

            What   is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went straig ht in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 

            The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.  Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah &nbs p;pack down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the pulsing of the throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the runway). 
            Anyw ay I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 

            Thanks for the ideas 






            Gray Fowler
            Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
            Radomes and Specialty Apertures
            Technical Staff Composites Engineering
            Raytheon _______________________________________________
            NSRCA-discussion mailing list
            NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
            http://lists.nsrca.o rg/mai lman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 





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From wgalligan at att.net  Thu Sep  4 07:55:16 2008
From: wgalligan at att.net (Wayne Galligan)
Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 15:55:16 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV4E5C7DD2389C380DF9856E8590@phx.gbl>
References: <090320081623.17812.48BEB9EB000C4E700000459422165579960C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net><D47D895200CC4A19A9FC8CD8F3AD2D6E@OfficePC><BAY135-DAV487E7D3DFD9BAA6788570E8590@phx.gbl><F225AD5EBA5A49BC8A4831506E4156CB@WaynePC>
	<BAY135-DAV4E5C7DD2389C380DF9856E8590@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <1150414E22854496BA768247691375B9@WaynePC>

So is this the case?  One battery is only being used (if the regulator is not matched) until there is sufficient voltage drop then the other regulator allows current draw.  I could switch the batteries and see if the reverse happens.

Wayne
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Ed Alt 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 10:22 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


  Wayne:
  The regulators not being matched is the cause, and it's the reason I began producing Tech-Aero regulators in the first place.  There was nothing on the market that you could consistently match output voltages precisely enough in order to balance the current draw from separate packs.

  Ed
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Wayne Galligan 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 9:08 AM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


    Ed or Jim O.,

    I am running dual 1500 mil 6v NiMh packs in my Ultimate.  I am using 2 of the 6v regulated Miracle switches by MPI. I find that one pack is consistently lower after two or three flights.  Could it be that the regulators are not matched and one draws more then the other one? Could be a bad battery I'll have to remove and test. They seem to use about the same amount of mil amps but one is lower in voltage then the other.  I use a 1amp load when testing after each flight and stop flying when the voltage drops to 5.8v loaded.

    Thanks
    Wayne
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: Ed Alt 
      To: General pattern discussion 
      Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 5:32 AM
      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


      Keith:
      That setup works well.  I refer to it as a hot standby, with details covered in a tech tip on the Tech-Aero website.  I prefer a different approach, where you just split the battery capacity equally between two packs, each with its own regulator. The regulators must be precisely matched in output voltage setting to allow then to both actively share the load simultaneously.  You can make a very light setup with this and there are several advantages to it. First, you can check every flight to see that each battery is being used as expected, which is very important to know. Second, you double your peak load capacity under load.  A single 5A regulator such as the JAICCIO or the Tech-Aero can handle the load in a pattern airplane just fine, but it's also good to know that you can have two 5A regulators online at once, providing a 10A peak current capability.

      The Tech-Tip on how this all works is at http://www.tech-aero.net/Tech-Tips.htm

      Ed
        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: Keith Black 
        To: General pattern discussion 
        Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 10:33 PM
        Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


        What I've done is have two batteries and two regulators, one regulator at 5.7 volts and one at 5.3 volts (or any voltage lower). On the higher voltage regulator I connect my primary battery, say a 2000 mah five cell or Lithium. On the lower voltage regulator I connect the smallest battery I can buy, say a 750 Lipo that weighs less than an ounce. 

        Since the larger battery is hooked to a regulator that outputs a higher voltage all drain comes from the primary battery and nothing is sucked from the smaller battery unless the main battery drops below 5.3 volts (or fails). 

        This works great and when recharging the smaller battery seldom needs any recharge at all.

        I spoke to Jim Oddino before doing this and confirmed that the lower voltage battery would not suck voltage from the larger battery since it was going through his regulator (Jaccio regulator).

        This setup has worked great for me and even saved a plane when my primary battery came loose and disconnected once!

        Keith Black

          ----- Original Message ----- 
          From: vicenterc at comcast.net 
          To: General pattern discussion ; 'General pattern discussion' 
          Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:23 AM
          Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


          Correct,  I still use separate regulators for each battery.  This system is smart that isolates the bad battery if something goes wrong.  In this way,  the bad battery won't drain the good one.  The LED in the receiver tells you if the battery has been isolated.  

          --
          Vicente "Vince" Bortone

            -------------- Original message -------------- 
            From: "Jay Marshall" <lightfoot at sc.rr.com> 

            As I read the literature, the dual battery setup is designed to provide a heavier buss for more current. It does not solve the problem of a failed battery(s). This could effectively add even more drain. The ideal setup still seems to be dual battery packs with dual regulators, or some other means to isolate a failed pack.



            Jay Marshall 

            -----Original Message-----
            From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of vicenterc at comcast.net
            Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:44 AM
            To: General pattern d iscuss ion
            Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!



            Gray,



            Yes, high drain could have been the problem.  Since the plane is in good condition probably you can check.  I think you should consider using two batteries of your preference.  I starting to use the 9100 receiver that already has two power inputs.  Check details here:



            http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100





            --
            Vicente "Vince" Bortone



              -------------- Original message -------------- 
              From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

              Vicente 

              The Robbe charger has a setting for soft peak, which is to be used for NiMH. This is what I had. I cycled twice before using this new battery..what I remember was getting about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah pack. I think there may be a "high drain" problem on the plane in addition. 



              Gray Fowler
              Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
              Radomes and Specialty Apertures
              Technical Staff Composites Engineer ing
              Raytheon 



                    vicenterc at comcast.net 
                    Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 

                    09/03/2008 09:42 AM 

                          Please respond to
                          General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
                         

                   To
                         General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
                         
                          cc
                         
                         
                          Subject
                         Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
                         




                         
                         

                   




              Gray, 
                
              Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I had heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging when the battery is not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was the problem. 
                
              --
              Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
                
              -------------- Original message -------------- 
              From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

              Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it . 

              What   is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went straig ht in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 

              The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.  Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah &nbs p;pack down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the pulsing of the throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the runway). 
              Anyw ay I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 

              Thanks for the ideas 






              Gray Fowler
              Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
              Radomes and Specialty Apertures
              Technical Staff Composites Engineering
              Raytheon _______________________________________________
              NSRCA-discussion mailing list
              NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
              http://lists.nsrca.o rg/mai lman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 





----------------------------------------------------------------------


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          NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
          http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


------------------------------------------------------------------------


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        NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
        http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


--------------------------------------------------------------------------


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      NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
      http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


----------------------------------------------------------------------------


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------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From rcmaster199 at aol.com  Thu Sep  4 08:07:54 2008
From: rcmaster199 at aol.com (rcmaster199 at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 16:07:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV4E5C7DD2389C380DF9856E8590@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY135-DAV4E5C7DD2389C380DF9856E8590@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <8CADCBF7432AE0D-1148-7B7@webmail-md05.sysops.aol.com>

Ed,

If I remember correctly, your regs output precision is 10 millivolts, 
right?

"Tuning" was just a matter of getting the outputs to read the same 
voltage to the second decimal place, during set-up. This was super 
simple to actually do. It's a fine product and a great value

Matt



-----Original Message-----
From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 11:22 am
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!

Wayne:
The regulators not being matched is the cause, and
it's the reason I began producing Tech-Aero regulators in the first 
place.?
There was nothing on the market that you could consistently match 
output
voltages precisely enough in order to balance the current draw from 
separate
packs.
?
Ed

  ----- Original Message -----
  From:
  Wayne Galligan

  To: General pattern discussion

  Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 9:08
  AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part
  2-Its a miracle!!!


  Ed or Jim O.,
  ?
  I am running dual 1500 mil 6v?NiMh packs in
   my Ultimate.? I am using 2 of the 6v regulated Miracle switches by 
MPI. I
  find that one pack is consistently lower after two or three flights.?
   Could it be that the regulators are not matched and one draws more 
then the
   other one? Could be a bad bat
tery I'll have to remove and test. They 
seem to
   use about the same amount of mil amps but one is lower in voltage 
then the
   other.? I use a 1amp load when testing after each flight and stop 
flying
  when the voltage drops to 5.8v loaded.
  ?
  Thanks
  Wayne

    ----- Original Message -----
    From:
    Ed Alt

    To: General pattern
    discussion
    Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 5:32
    AM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part
    2-Its a miracle!!!


    Keith:
    That setup works well.? I refer to it as a
    hot standby, with details covered in a tech tip on the Tech-Aero
    website.? I prefer a different approach, where you just split the
     battery capacity equally between two packs, each with its own 
regulator. The
     regulators must be precisely matched in output voltage setting to 
allow then
     to both actively share the load simultaneously.? You can make a 
very
     light setup with this and there are several advantages to it. 
First, you can
     check every flight to see that each battery is being used as 
expected, which
     is very important to know. Second, you double your peak load 
capacity under
     load.? A single 5A regulator such as the JAICCIO or the Tech-Aero 
can
     handle t
he load in a pattern airplane just fine, but it's also good 
to know
     that you can have two 5A regulators online at once, providing a 10A 
peak
    current capability.
    ?
     The Tech-Tip on how this all works is at 
http://www.tech-aero.net/Tech-Tips.htm
    ?
    Ed

      ----- Original Message -----
      From:
      Keith
      Black
      To: General pattern
      discussion
      Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008
      10:33 PM
      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part
      2-Its a miracle!!!


      What I've done is have two batteries and two
       regulators, one regulator at 5.7 volts and one at 5.3 volts (or 
any
       voltage lower). On the higher voltage regulator I connect my 
primary
       battery, say a 2000 mah five cell or Lithium.?On the lower 
voltage
      regulator I connect?the smallest?battery I can buy, say a
      750?Lipo that?weighs less than an ounce.
      ?
      Since the?larger?battery is hooked
       to a regulator?that outputs a higher voltage all drain comes from 
the
       primary battery and nothing is sucked from the smaller battery 
unless the
      main?battery drops below 5.3 volts (or fails).
      ?
 =2
0    This works great and when recharging the
      smaller battery seldom needs any recharge at all.
      ?
      I spoke to Jim Oddino before doing this and
       confirmed that the lower voltage battery would not suck voltage 
from the
      larger battery since it was going through his regulator (Jaccio
      regulator).
      ?
      This setup has worked great for me and even
      saved a plane when my primary battery came loose and disconnected
      once!
      ?
      Keith Black
      ?

        ----- Original Message -----
        From:
        vicenterc at comcast.net
        To: General pattern
        discussion ; 'General pattern
        discussion'
        Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008
        11:23 AM
        Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
        Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


        Correct,? I still use separate regulators for each
        battery.? This system is smart that isolates the bad battery if
        something goes wrong.? In this way,? the bad battery won't
        drain the good one.? The LED in the receiver tells you if the
        battery has been isolated.?
        ?
        --
Vicente20"Vince" Bortone
        ?
        --------------
          Original message --------------
From: "Jay Marshall" &lt;lightfoot at sc.rr.com&gt;





          As I read the
           literature, the dual battery setup is designed to provide a 
heavier
           buss for more current. It does not solve the problem of a 
failed
           battery(s). This could effectively add even more drain. The 
ideal
           setup still seems to be dual battery packs with dual 
regulators, or
          some other means to isolate a failed pack.
          ?


Jay
          Marshall
          -----Original
          Message-----
From:
          nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
           [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf 
Of
          vicenterc at comcast.net
Sent: Wednesday, September 03,
          2008 11:44 AM
To:
          General pattern d iscuss
          ion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
          Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
          ?

          Gray,

          ?

          Yes, high
           drain could have been the problem.? Since the plane is in 
good
  20        condition probably you can check.? I think you should 
consider
           using two batteries of your preference.? I starting to use 
the
           9100 receiver that already has two power inputs.? Check 
details
          here:

          ?

           
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100

          ?

          ?

          --
Vicente "Vince"
          Bortone

          ?

            -------------- Original message
            --------------
From: Gray E Fowler &lt;gfowler at raytheon.com&gt;


Vicente


The Robbe charger
             has a setting for soft peak, which is to be used for NiMH. 
This is
             what I had. I cycled twice before using this new 
battery..what I
             remember was getting about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah 
pack. I think
            there may be a "high drain" problem on the plane in
            addition.



Gray
            Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and
            Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineer
            ing
Raytheon






=0
A                  vicenterc at comcast.net

Sent by:
                  nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org

09/03/2008
                  09:42 AM




                        Please
                        respond to
General pattern discussion
                        &lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;







                        To

                        General
                        pattern discussion
                        &lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;



                        cc

                        ?


                        Subject

                        Re:
                        [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a
                        miracle!!!
                  ?




                        ?

                        ?




Gray,
?
Yes, that
            is good news. ?Clear
ly the battery was the problem. ?I had
             heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop 
charging when
             the battery is not really fully charged. ?I wonder if this 
was
            the problem.
?
--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone
?

-------------- Original message --------------
From: Gray E
            Fowler &lt;gfowler at raytheon.com&gt;

Lance and I
             went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to 
be. Do
             not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to 
say that
            someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it
            .

What ? is
             amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it 
went
             straig ht in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The 
horrible
             reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon 
fiber wing
             tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, 
the stab
             has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair 
crack in
             the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose 
ring
            area damage. That is all.

The
 battery
             pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were 
bonded
             into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) 
and the
             battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The 
plane
             was standing vertical ?on the undamage spinner being held 
up by
             the tree branches. ?Once we got home we hooked eveything up 
and
            of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack
             essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, 
Lance
             took the battery pack home for diagnostics. ?Using the 
Robbe
             charger he cycled the1450 mah &nbs p;pack down....it read 
80
             mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony 
described a
             NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of 
sense. ?6
             volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt 
NiCad.
             Also an important note is I now think the plane was going 
in and out
             of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, 
but not to
             low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle
 (programming error), 
hence
             the pulsing of the throttle that I exper ienced. If this 
diagnosis
             is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was 
able to fly
             the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer 
when the
             problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" 
FAI
             landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead 
of the
            runway).
Anyw ay I am
             sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see 
why the
            battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring.


Thanks for the ideas







Gray
            Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and
            Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites
            Engineering
Raytheon _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing
            list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.o rg/mai
            lman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion








_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion
        mailing
        list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion





________
_______________________________________
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      mailing
      list
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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Thu Sep  4 08:11:56 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 16:11:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
References: <090320081623.17812.48BEB9EB000C4E700000459422165579960C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net><D47D895200CC4A19A9FC8CD8F3AD2D6E@OfficePC><BAY135-DAV487E7D3DFD9BAA6788570E8590@phx.gbl><F225AD5EBA5A49BC8A4831506E4156CB@WaynePC><BAY135-DAV4E5C7DD2389C380DF9856E8590@phx.gbl>
	<1150414E22854496BA768247691375B9@WaynePC>
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV330363823640924FEBB32E8590@phx.gbl>

Wayne:
That's it. Try the test, I think you'll see that the draw stays with one regulator.

Ed
  ----- Original Message ----- 


  From: Wayne Galligan 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 10:54 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


  So is this the case?  One battery is only being used (if the regulator is not matched) until there is sufficient voltage drop then the other regulator allows current draw.  I could switch the batteries and see if the reverse happens.

  Wayne
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Ed Alt 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 10:22 AM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


    Wayne:
    The regulators not being matched is the cause, and it's the reason I began producing Tech-Aero regulators in the first place.  There was nothing on the market that you could consistently match output voltages precisely enough in order to balance the current draw from separate packs.

    Ed
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: Wayne Galligan 
      To: General pattern discussion 
      Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 9:08 AM
      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


      Ed or Jim O.,

      I am running dual 1500 mil 6v NiMh packs in my Ultimate.  I am using 2 of the 6v regulated Miracle switches by MPI. I find that one pack is consistently lower after two or three flights.  Could it be that the regulators are not matched and one draws more then the other one? Could be a bad battery I'll have to remove and test. They seem to use about the same amount of mil amps but one is lower in voltage then the other.  I use a 1amp load when testing after each flight and stop flying when the voltage drops to 5.8v loaded.

      Thanks
      Wayne
        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: Ed Alt 
        To: General pattern discussion 
        Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 5:32 AM
        Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


        Keith:
        That setup works well.  I refer to it as a hot standby, with details covered in a tech tip on the Tech-Aero website.  I prefer a different approach, where you just split the battery capacity equally between two packs, each with its own regulator. The regulators must be precisely matched in output voltage setting to allow then to both actively share the load simultaneously.  You can make a very light setup with this and there are several advantages to it. First, you can check every flight to see that each battery is being used as expected, which is very important to know. Second, you double your peak load capacity under load.  A single 5A regulator such as the JAICCIO or the Tech-Aero can handle the load in a pattern airplane just fine, but it's also good to know that you can have two 5A regulators online at once, providing a 10A peak current capability.

        The Tech-Tip on how this all works is at http://www.tech-aero.net/Tech-Tips.htm

        Ed
          ----- Original Message ----- 
          From: Keith Black 
          To: General pattern discussion 
          Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 10:33 PM
          Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


          What I've done is have two batteries and two regulators, one regulator at 5.7 volts and one at 5.3 volts (or any voltage lower). On the higher voltage regulator I connect my primary battery, say a 2000 mah five cell or Lithium. On the lower voltage regulator I connect the smallest battery I can buy, say a 750 Lipo that weighs less than an ounce. 

          Since the larger battery is hooked to a regulator that outputs a higher voltage all drain comes from the primary battery and nothing is sucked from the smaller battery unless the main battery drops below 5.3 volts (or fails). 

          This works great and when recharging the smaller battery seldom needs any recharge at all.

          I spoke to Jim Oddino before doing this and confirmed that the lower voltage battery would not suck voltage from the larger battery since it was going through his regulator (Jaccio regulator).

          This setup has worked great for me and even saved a plane when my primary battery came loose and disconnected once!

          Keith Black

            ----- Original Message ----- 
            From: vicenterc at comcast.net 
            To: General pattern discussion ; 'General pattern discussion' 
            Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:23 AM
            Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


            Correct,  I still use separate regulators for each battery.  This system is smart that isolates the bad battery if something goes wrong.  In this way,  the bad battery won't drain the good one.  The LED in the receiver tells you if the battery has been isolated.  

            --
            Vicente "Vince" Bortone

              -------------- Original message -------------- 
              From: "Jay Marshall" <lightfoot at sc.rr.com> 

              As I read the literature, the dual battery setup is designed to provide a heavier buss for more current. It does not solve the problem of a failed battery(s). This could effectively add even more drain. The ideal setup still seems to be dual battery packs with dual regulators, or some other means to isolate a failed pack.



              Jay Marshall 

              -----Original Message-----
              From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of vicenterc at comcast.net
              Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:44 AM
              To: General pattern d iscuss ion
              Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!



              Gray,



              Yes, high drain could have been the problem.  Since the plane is in good condition probably you can check.  I think you should consider using two batteries of your preference.  I starting to use the 9100 receiver that already has two power inputs.  Check details here:



              http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100





              --
              Vicente "Vince" Bortone



                -------------- Original message -------------- 
                From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

                Vicente 

                The Robbe charger has a setting for soft peak, which is to be used for NiMH. This is what I had. I cycled twice before using this new battery..what I remember was getting about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah pack. I think there may be a "high drain" problem on the plane in addition. 



                Gray Fowler
                Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
                Radomes and Specialty Apertures
                Technical Staff Composites Engineer ing
                Raytheon 



                      vicenterc at comcast.net 
                      Sent by: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 

                      09/03/2008 09:42 AM 

                            Please respond to
                            General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
                           

                     To
                           General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> 
                           
                            cc
                           
                           
                            Subject
                           Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
                           




                           
                           

                     




                Gray, 
                  
                Yes, that is good news.  Clearly the battery was the problem.  I had heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging when the battery is not really fully charged.  I wonder if this was the problem. 
                  
                --
                Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
                  
                -------------- Original message -------------- 
                From: Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> 

                Lance and I went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to be. Do not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say that someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it  

                What   is amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it went straig ht in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The horrible reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber wing tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, the stab has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack in the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose ring area damage. That is all. 

                The battery pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were bonded into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and the battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The plane was standing vertical  on the undamage spinner being held up by the tree branches.  Once we got home we hooked eveything up and of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, Lance took the battery pack home for diagnostics.  Using the Robbe charger he cycled the1450 mah &nbs p;pack down....it read 80 mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony described a NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense.  6 volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt NiCad. Also an important note is I now think the plane was going in and out of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but not to low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle (programming error), hence the pulsing of the throttle that I exper ienced. If this diagnosis is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able to fly the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer when the problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of the runway). 
                Anyw ay I am sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why the battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring. 

                Thanks for the ideas 






                Gray Fowler
                Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
                Radomes and Specialty Apertures
                Technical Staff Composites Engineering
                Raytheon _______________________________________________
                NSRCA-discussion mailing list
                NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
                http://lists.nsrca.o rg/mai lman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 





--------------------------------------------------------------------


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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Thu Sep  4 08:12:45 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 16:12:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
References: <BAY135-DAV4E5C7DD2389C380DF9856E8590@phx.gbl>
	<8CADCBF7432AE0D-1148-7B7@webmail-md05.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV139D0020A9CF59D593B3D6E8590@phx.gbl>

That's correct Matt, 10 mv.

Ed
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <rcmaster199 at aol.com>
To: <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 11:07 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!


> Ed,
>
> If I remember correctly, your regs output precision is 10 millivolts, 
> right?
>
> "Tuning" was just a matter of getting the outputs to read the same voltage 
> to the second decimal place, during set-up. This was super simple to 
> actually do. It's a fine product and a great value
>
> Matt
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 11:22 am
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
>
> Wayne:
> The regulators not being matched is the cause, and
> it's the reason I began producing Tech-Aero regulators in the first place. 
> There was nothing on the market that you could consistently match output
> voltages precisely enough in order to balance the current draw from 
> separate
> packs.
>
> Ed
>
>  ----- Original Message -----
>  From:
>  Wayne Galligan
>
>  To: General pattern discussion
>
>  Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 9:08
>  AM
>  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part
>  2-Its a miracle!!!
>
>
>  Ed or Jim O.,
>  I am running dual 1500 mil 6v NiMh packs in
>   my Ultimate. I am using 2 of the 6v regulated Miracle switches by MPI. I
>  find that one pack is consistently lower after two or three flights. 
> Could it be that the regulators are not matched and one draws more then 
> the
>   other one? Could be a bad bat
> tery I'll have to remove and test. They seem to
>   use about the same amount of mil amps but one is lower in voltage then 
> the
>   other. I use a 1amp load when testing after each flight and stop flying
>  when the voltage drops to 5.8v loaded.
>  Thanks
>  Wayne
>
>    ----- Original Message -----
>    From:
>    Ed Alt
>
>    To: General pattern
>    discussion
>    Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 5:32
>    AM
>    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part
>    2-Its a miracle!!!
>
>
>    Keith:
>    That setup works well. I refer to it as a
>    hot standby, with details covered in a tech tip on the Tech-Aero
>    website. I prefer a different approach, where you just split the
>     battery capacity equally between two packs, each with its own 
> regulator. The
>     regulators must be precisely matched in output voltage setting to 
> allow then
>     to both actively share the load simultaneously. You can make a very
>     light setup with this and there are several advantages to it. First, 
> you can
>     check every flight to see that each battery is being used as expected, 
> which
>     is very important to know. Second, you double your peak load capacity 
> under
>     load. A single 5A regulator such as the JAICCIO or the Tech-Aero can
>     handle t
> he load in a pattern airplane just fine, but it's also good to know
>     that you can have two 5A regulators online at once, providing a 10A 
> peak
>    current capability.
>    The Tech-Tip on how this all works is at 
> http://www.tech-aero.net/Tech-Tips.htm
>    Ed
>
>      ----- Original Message -----
>      From:
>      Keith
>      Black
>      To: General pattern
>      discussion
>      Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008
>      10:33 PM
>      Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Part
>      2-Its a miracle!!!
>
>
>      What I've done is have two batteries and two
>       regulators, one regulator at 5.7 volts and one at 5.3 volts (or any
>       voltage lower). On the higher voltage regulator I connect my primary
>       battery, say a 2000 mah five cell or Lithium. On the lower voltage
>      regulator I connect the smallest battery I can buy, say a
>      750 Lipo that weighs less than an ounce.
>      Since the larger battery is hooked
>       to a regulator that outputs a higher voltage all drain comes from 
> the
>       primary battery and nothing is sucked from the smaller battery 
> unless the
>      main battery drops below 5.3 volts (or fails).
>      =2
> 0    This works great and when recharging the
>      smaller battery seldom needs any recharge at all.
>      I spoke to Jim Oddino before doing this and
>       confirmed that the lower voltage battery would not suck voltage from 
> the
>      larger battery since it was going through his regulator (Jaccio
>      regulator).
>      This setup has worked great for me and even
>      saved a plane when my primary battery came loose and disconnected
>      once!
>      Keith Black
>
>        ----- Original Message -----
>        From:
>        vicenterc at comcast.net
>        To: General pattern
>        discussion ; 'General pattern
>        discussion'
>        Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2008
>        11:23 AM
>        Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
>        Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
>
>
>        Correct, I still use separate regulators for each
>        battery. This system is smart that isolates the bad battery if
>        something goes wrong. In this way, the bad battery won't
>        drain the good one. The LED in the receiver tells you if the
>        battery has been isolated. --
> Vicente20"Vince" Bortone
>        --------------
>          Original message --------------
> From: "Jay Marshall" &lt;lightfoot at sc.rr.com&gt;
>
>
>
>
>
>          As I read the
>           literature, the dual battery setup is designed to provide a 
> heavier
>           buss for more current. It does not solve the problem of a failed
>           battery(s). This could effectively add even more drain. The 
> ideal
>           setup still seems to be dual battery packs with dual regulators, 
> or
>          some other means to isolate a failed pack.
>
>
> Jay
>          Marshall
>          -----Original
>          Message-----
> From:
>          nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>           [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
>          vicenterc at comcast.net
> Sent: Wednesday, September 03,
>          2008 11:44 AM
> To:
>          General pattern d iscuss
>          ion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion]
>          Part 2-Its a miracle!!!
>
>          Gray,
>
>
>          Yes, high
>           drain could have been the problem. Since the plane is in good
>  20        condition probably you can check. I think you should consider
>           using two batteries of your preference. I starting to use the
>           9100 receiver that already has two power inputs. Check details
>          here:
>
>
> 
> http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMAR9100
>
>
>
>          --
> Vicente "Vince"
>          Bortone
>
>
>            -------------- Original message
>            --------------
> From: Gray E Fowler &lt;gfowler at raytheon.com&gt;
>
>
> Vicente
>
>
> The Robbe charger
>             has a setting for soft peak, which is to be used for NiMH. 
> This is
>             what I had. I cycled twice before using this new battery..what 
> I
>             remember was getting about 1300 Mah from this 1450 mah pack. I 
> think
>            there may be a "high drain" problem on the plane in
>            addition.
>
>
>
> Gray
>            Fowler
> Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
> Radomes and
>            Specialty Apertures
> Technical Staff Composites Engineer
>            ing
> Raytheon
>
>
>
>
>
>
> =0
> A                  vicenterc at comcast.net
>
> Sent by:
>                  nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>
> 09/03/2008
>                  09:42 AM
>
>
>
>
>                        Please
>                        respond to
> General pattern discussion
>                        &lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>                        To
>
>                        General
>                        pattern discussion
>                        &lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
>
>
>
>                        cc
>
>
>
>                        Subject
>
>                        Re:
>                        [NSRCA-discussion] Part 2-Its a
>                        miracle!!!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Gray,
>
> Yes, that
>            is good news. Clear
> ly the battery was the problem. I had
>             heard that some chargers get a "false peak" and stop charging 
> when
>             the battery is not really fully charged. I wonder if this was
>            the problem.
>
> --
> Vicente "Vince" Bortone
>
>
> -------------- Original message --------------
> From: Gray E
>            Fowler &lt;gfowler at raytheon.com&gt;
>
> Lance and I
>             went out and found the plane right where it was supposed to 
> be. Do
>             not know how I missed it the first day, so I am going to say 
> that
>            someone went into the woods Monday night and moved it
>            .
>
> What is
>             amazing in the minimal damage the plane has considering it 
> went
>             straig ht in from 200 feet, albeit at a slow speed. The 
> horrible
>             reverbed cracking sound Keith and I heard was the carbon fiber 
> wing
>             tube breaking. Both wings have limited leading edge damage, 
> the stab
>             has a golfball size divot on the R LE, an easy to repair crack 
> in
>             the fuse (buckle failure) behind one wing and a little nose 
> ring
>            area damage. That is all.
>
> The
> battery
>             pack had broken the 3/8 bals a stic ks on impact that were 
> bonded
>             into place (my battery packs are not "removeable" per say) and 
> the
>             battey pack was on the ground at the nose of the plane. The 
> plane
>             was standing vertical on the undamage spinner being held up by
>             the tree branches. Once we got home we hooked eveything up and
>            of course it all worked fine. Knowing that the battery pack
>             essentially had the same charge as when the plane went in, 
> Lance
>             took the battery pack home for diagnostics. Using the Robbe
>             charger he cycled the1450 mah &nbs p;pack down....it read 80
>             mah. He then charged it and it read 1000 mah. Anthony 
> described a
>             NiMH "brown out" and that is starting to make alot of sense. 6
>             volt packNiMH , drained does not just die like a 4.8 volt 
> NiCad.
>             Also an important note is I now think the plane was going in 
> and out
>             of PCM lock. When I tested PCM lock the throttle did cut, but 
> not to
>             low idle. It cut to about 20% throttle
> (programming error), hence
>             the pulsing of the throttle that I exper ienced. If this 
> diagnosis
>             is correct then it is a testament to using PCM as I was able 
> to fly
>             the plane for 45 seconds before impact...had I been closer 
> when the
>             problem started I may have even been able to score a "10" FAI
>             landing (not really-I would have gone for the grass instead of 
> the
>            runway).
> Anyw ay I am
>             sending the entire radio off for examination, try to see why 
> the
>            battery was so low, and fix the plane for spring.
>
>
> Thanks for the ideas
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Gray
>            Fowler
> Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
> Radomes and
>            Specialty Apertures
> Technical Staff Composites
>            Engineering
> Raytheon _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing
>            list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.o rg/mai
>            lman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion
>        mailing
>        list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
> ________
> _______________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion
>      mailing
>      list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion
>    mailing
>    list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion
>  mailing
>  list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Thu Sep  4 15:52:32 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 23:52:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Merle Hyde Contact Info?
Message-ID: <20080904185229.HDOCB.262905.root@Web02>

Does anyone know how to contact Mr Hyde?  I've tried googling him to no avail.  

Thanks,

George Miller

From wwnasse at figment.ca  Thu Sep  4 16:06:15 2008
From: wwnasse at figment.ca (Walter Nasse)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 00:06:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Merle Hyde Contact Info?
In-Reply-To: <20080904185229.HDOCB.262905.root@Web02>
Message-ID: <LEEEJBFJBIFCJKHAECMJKELMDNAA.wwnasse@figment.ca>

Here is his Email
hydesoftmounts at mymailstation.com



-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of
glmiller3 at suddenlink.net
Sent: September 04, 2008 5:52 PM
To: NSRCA List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Merle Hyde Contact Info?


Does anyone know how to contact Mr Hyde?  I've tried googling him to no
avail.

Thanks,

George Miller
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From simestd at netexpress.com  Thu Sep  4 16:24:47 2008
From: simestd at netexpress.com (Tom Simes)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 00:24:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Digest mode changes
Message-ID: <20080904162445.8ac07df7.simestd@netexpress.com>


Hi everyone,

This e-mail list has an option on your preferences page to receive the
posts in digest mode, meaning that rather than getting each message as
it's posted, the subscriber receives the posts in batches.  There are a
few folks who prefer that deliver method and one of them pointed out to
me that although set to digest mode, he was still getting several
batches of list mail a day on busy days instead of a single daily
message as he desired.  The list software used to be set to kick out a
digest either once a day, or when the batch hit a size of 30 KB,
whichever came first.  Now the threshold is 5 MB or once a day.  Since
our max message size is 80 KB and typical messages are < 10 KB, we
would need to go over 50 messages (and likely WELL over) before hitting
the 5 MB threshold.

The upshot is, if you have selected digest mode, you should now get one
digest per day - unless we're defining snaps or someone asks whether
they should go YS, OS or electric.

-- 
Tom
 
======================================================================
   "Z-80 system stack overflow.  Shut 'er down Scotty, the system's
         sucking mud" - Error message on TRS 80 Model-16B

Tom Simes                                       simestd at netexpress.com 
======================================================================

From tncbrown at cebridge.net  Thu Sep  4 16:32:46 2008
From: tncbrown at cebridge.net (T&C Brown)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 00:32:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] test
Message-ID: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC>

I keep receiving a "bounce" notification when I send emails to the list.

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From tncbrown at cebridge.net  Thu Sep  4 16:40:38 2008
From: tncbrown at cebridge.net (T&C Brown)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 00:40:38 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
In-Reply-To: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC>
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC>
Message-ID: <87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC>

Guys,

 

I'm in the market for a new wing bag.  It's a 74" one-piece wing.  Any
suggestions on brands?  I like the "Wing-Tote" brand, and they list a 74"
bag, but I don't know if that's an external dimension or an internal
dimension.  Do any of you own one?  Thanks in advance for the help.

 

T. Brown

 

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From moleski at canisius.edu  Thu Sep  4 16:51:15 2008
From: moleski at canisius.edu (Martin X. Moleski, SJ)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 00:51:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Merle Hyde Contact Info?
In-Reply-To: <20080904185229.HDOCB.262905.root@Web02>
References: <20080904185229.HDOCB.262905.root@Web02>
Message-ID: <48C0827A.4070707@canisius.edu>

glmiller3 at suddenlink.net wrote:

> Does anyone know how to contact Mr Hyde?  I've tried googling him to no avail.  

His ads have phone numbers.

He sometimes answers at this e-mail (or did last year):

Merle Hyde <HydeSoftMounts at mymailstation.com>

				Marty

From k6xyz at sbcglobal.net  Thu Sep  4 17:05:24 2008
From: k6xyz at sbcglobal.net (Dave Harmon)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 01:05:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Merle Hyde Contact Info?
In-Reply-To: <20080904185229.HDOCB.262905.root@Web02>
Message-ID: <02d101c90ef3$754e3030$63dee204@skunkputer>

Merle's telephone number is in the K-Factor.
This is the best way to contact him day or night.

702-269-7829

Regards

Dave Harmon
NSRCA 586
K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
Sperry, Ok.

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
glmiller3 at suddenlink.net
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 6:52 PM
To: NSRCA List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Merle Hyde Contact Info?

Does anyone know how to contact Mr Hyde?  I've tried googling him to no
avail.  

Thanks,

George Miller
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From mkmsg at cox.net  Thu Sep  4 17:31:41 2008
From: mkmsg at cox.net (MKMSG)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 01:31:41 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC>
	<87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC>
Message-ID: <86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031>

There are several sources.  I like the wing bags from Adrian Wong.  Here's the URL:

http://www.chingbergh.com/products.html

Mike
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: T&C Brown 
  To: 'General pattern discussion' 
  Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 7:40 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag


  Guys,

   

  I'm in the market for a new wing bag.  It's a 74" one-piece wing.  Any suggestions on brands?  I like the "Wing-Tote" brand, and they list a 74" bag, but I don't know if that's an external dimension or an internal dimension.  Do any of you own one?  Thanks in advance for the help.

   

  T. Brown

   



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From astafford at swtexas.net  Thu Sep  4 17:53:14 2008
From: astafford at swtexas.net (Archie Stafford)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 01:53:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
In-Reply-To: <86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031>
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC><87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC>
	<86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031>
Message-ID: <D92351B7D3954CA8BA5FDD293758C5BD@astafford>

T.

 

I personally use all Wingbags by Caroline stuff from Carden.  They are hard
to beat and have about every size known to man.and any they don't they will
make for you for the same price as the similarly sized bags.

 

Arch

 

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of MKMSG
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 4:31 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

There are several sources.  I like the wing bags from Adrian Wong.  Here's
the URL:

 

http://www.chingbergh.com/products.html

 

Mike

----- Original Message ----- 

From: T <mailto:tncbrown at cebridge.net> &C Brown 

To: 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 7:40 PM

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Guys,

 

I'm in the market for a new wing bag.  It's a 74" one-piece wing.  Any
suggestions on brands?  I like the "Wing-Tote" brand, and they list a 74"
bag, but I don't know if that's an external dimension or an internal
dimension.  Do any of you own one?  Thanks in advance for the help.

 

T. Brown

 


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From tncbrown at cebridge.net  Thu Sep  4 17:59:51 2008
From: tncbrown at cebridge.net (T&C Brown)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 01:59:51 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
In-Reply-To: <D92351B7D3954CA8BA5FDD293758C5BD@astafford>
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC><87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC><86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031>
	<D92351B7D3954CA8BA5FDD293758C5BD@astafford>
Message-ID: <27ED16C16F5C49EEA359219C4F3F9CB7@TPC>

Thx Arch.I have her on the list to consider as well.  I like her bags.
(insert joke here :-))  I have a set for my 40% Carden.

 

T-

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Archie
Stafford
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 8:53 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

T.

 

I personally use all Wingbags by Caroline stuff from Carden.  They are hard
to beat and have about every size known to man.and any they don't they will
make for you for the same price as the similarly sized bags.

 

Arch

 

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of MKMSG
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 4:31 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

There are several sources.  I like the wing bags from Adrian Wong.  Here's
the URL:

 

http://www.chingbergh.com/products.html

 

Mike

----- Original Message ----- 

From: T <mailto:tncbrown at cebridge.net> &C Brown 

To: 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 7:40 PM

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Guys,

 

I'm in the market for a new wing bag.  It's a 74" one-piece wing.  Any
suggestions on brands?  I like the "Wing-Tote" brand, and they list a 74"
bag, but I don't know if that's an external dimension or an internal
dimension.  Do any of you own one?  Thanks in advance for the help.

 

T. Brown

 


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From tncbrown at cebridge.net  Thu Sep  4 18:03:27 2008
From: tncbrown at cebridge.net (T&C Brown)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 02:03:27 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
In-Reply-To: <86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031>
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC><87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC>
	<86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031>
Message-ID: <C4D881AC897F46B6BD06B2E1BF7F7D1C@TPC>

Thanks Mike, I knew Adrian made bags, but I couldn't remember the website.

 

T-

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of MKMSG
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 8:31 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

There are several sources.  I like the wing bags from Adrian Wong.  Here's
the URL:

 

http://www.chingbergh.com/products.html

 

Mike

----- Original Message ----- 

From: T <mailto:tncbrown at cebridge.net> &C Brown 

To: 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 7:40 PM

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Guys,

 

I'm in the market for a new wing bag.  It's a 74" one-piece wing.  Any
suggestions on brands?  I like the "Wing-Tote" brand, and they list a 74"
bag, but I don't know if that's an external dimension or an internal
dimension.  Do any of you own one?  Thanks in advance for the help.

 

T. Brown

 


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From astafford at swtexas.net  Thu Sep  4 18:05:53 2008
From: astafford at swtexas.net (Archie Stafford)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 02:05:53 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
In-Reply-To: <27ED16C16F5C49EEA359219C4F3F9CB7@TPC>
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC><87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC><86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031><D92351B7D3954CA8BA5FDD293758C5BD@astafford>
	<27ED16C16F5C49EEA359219C4F3F9CB7@TPC>
Message-ID: <9CFEFAE356084103BC9BE1827E297904@astafford>

T-,

 

I just had her make up a whole set of wing and tail bags for my Black Magic.
The is in the process of making the tail bags right now and I should have
them next week.  She is so easy to work with.

 

Arch

 

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of T&C Brown
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 5:00 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Thx Arch.I have her on the list to consider as well.  I like her bags.
(insert joke here :-))  I have a set for my 40% Carden.

 

T-

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Archie
Stafford
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 8:53 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

T.

 

I personally use all Wingbags by Caroline stuff from Carden.  They are hard
to beat and have about every size known to man.and any they don't they will
make for you for the same price as the similarly sized bags.

 

Arch

 

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of MKMSG
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 4:31 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

There are several sources.  I like the wing bags from Adrian Wong.  Here's
the URL:

 

http://www.chingbergh.com/products.html

 

Mike

----- Original Message ----- 

From: T <mailto:tncbrown at cebridge.net> &C Brown 

To: 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 7:40 PM

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Guys,

 

I'm in the market for a new wing bag.  It's a 74" one-piece wing.  Any
suggestions on brands?  I like the "Wing-Tote" brand, and they list a 74"
bag, but I don't know if that's an external dimension or an internal
dimension.  Do any of you own one?  Thanks in advance for the help.

 

T. Brown

 


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Thu Sep  4 18:09:20 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 02:09:20 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Merle Hyde Contact Info?
In-Reply-To: <02d101c90ef3$754e3030$63dee204@skunkputer>
Message-ID: <20080904210918.SUNAK.261678.root@Web01>

Thanks, Dave.  I'll give him a call tomorrow.

G
---- Dave Harmon <k6xyz at sbcglobal.net> wrote: 

=============
Merle's telephone number is in the K-Factor.
This is the best way to contact him day or night.

702-269-7829

Regards

Dave Harmon
NSRCA 586
K6XYZ[at]sbcglobal[dot]net
Sperry, Ok.

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
glmiller3 at suddenlink.net
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 6:52 PM
To: NSRCA List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Merle Hyde Contact Info?

Does anyone know how to contact Mr Hyde?  I've tried googling him to no
avail.  

Thanks,

George Miller
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Thu Sep  4 18:18:11 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 02:18:11 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Merle Hyde Contact Info?
In-Reply-To: <LEEEJBFJBIFCJKHAECMJKELMDNAA.wwnasse@figment.ca>
Message-ID: <20080904211809.NBA2W.262065.root@Web01>

Thanks all for the info!

George
---- Walter Nasse <wwnasse at figment.ca> wrote: 

=============
Here is his Email
hydesoftmounts at mymailstation.com



-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of
glmiller3 at suddenlink.net
Sent: September 04, 2008 5:52 PM
To: NSRCA List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Merle Hyde Contact Info?


Does anyone know how to contact Mr Hyde?  I've tried googling him to no
avail.

Thanks,

George Miller
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.6.16/1651 - Release Date: 9/4/2008
6:57 AM

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.6.16/1651 - Release Date: 9/4/2008
6:57 AM


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From natpenton at centurytel.net  Thu Sep  4 18:54:47 2008
From: natpenton at centurytel.net (Nat Penton)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 02:54:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC><87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC><86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031><D92351B7D3954CA8BA5FDD293758C5BD@astafford><27ED16C16F5C49EEA359219C4F3F9CB7@TPC>
	<9CFEFAE356084103BC9BE1827E297904@astafford>
Message-ID: <F03255115DC14C2EB47E2C5B2787A9A1@GREENROOM>

Arch, you need to send a picture ( of Caroline )
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Archie Stafford 
  To: 'General pattern discussion' 
  Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 9:05 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag


  T-,

   

  I just had her make up a whole set of wing and tail bags for my Black Magic.  The is in the process of making the tail bags right now and I should have them next week.  She is so easy to work with.

   

  Arch

   

   


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of T&C Brown
  Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 5:00 AM
  To: 'General pattern discussion'
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

   

  Thx Arch.I have her on the list to consider as well.  I like her bags. (insert joke here J)  I have a set for my 40% Carden.

   

  T-

   


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Archie Stafford
  Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 8:53 PM
  To: 'General pattern discussion'
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

   

  T.

   

  I personally use all Wingbags by Caroline stuff from Carden.  They are hard to beat and have about every size known to man.and any they don't they will make for you for the same price as the similarly sized bags.

   

  Arch

   

   


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of MKMSG
  Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 4:31 AM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

   

  There are several sources.  I like the wing bags from Adrian Wong.  Here's the URL:

   

  http://www.chingbergh.com/products.html

   

  Mike

    ----- Original Message ----- 

    From: T&C Brown 

    To: 'General pattern discussion' 

    Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 7:40 PM

    Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

     

    Guys,

     

    I'm in the market for a new wing bag.  It's a 74" one-piece wing.  Any suggestions on brands?  I like the "Wing-Tote" brand, and they list a 74" bag, but I don't know if that's an external dimension or an internal dimension.  Do any of you own one?  Thanks in advance for the help.

     

    T. Brown

     


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    _______________________________________________
    NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From astafford at swtexas.net  Thu Sep  4 19:13:25 2008
From: astafford at swtexas.net (Archie Stafford)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 03:13:25 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
In-Reply-To: <F03255115DC14C2EB47E2C5B2787A9A1@GREENROOM>
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC><87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC><86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031><D92351B7D3954CA8BA5FDD293758C5BD@astafford><27ED16C16F5C49EEA359219C4F3F9CB7@TPC><9CFEFAE356084103BC9BE1827E297904@astafford>
	<F03255115DC14C2EB47E2C5B2787A9A1@GREENROOM>
Message-ID: <77D98D2ABF1D479C8C302A493BFAF94A@astafford>

Nat,

 

Caroline is all over Carden's website:-)  I'll send a pic of the stab bags
and such when I get them and after I get home from the sand box.1 more week
and I'm back stateside..

 

Arch

 

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Nat Penton
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 5:55 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Arch, you need to send a picture ( of Caroline )

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Archie <mailto:astafford at swtexas.net>  Stafford 

To: 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 9:05 PM

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

T-,

 

I just had her make up a whole set of wing and tail bags for my Black Magic.
The is in the process of making the tail bags right now and I should have
them next week.  She is so easy to work with.

 

Arch

 

 


  _____  


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of T&C Brown
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 5:00 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Thx Arch.I have her on the list to consider as well.  I like her bags.
(insert joke here :-))  I have a set for my 40% Carden.

 

T-

 


  _____  


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Archie
Stafford
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 8:53 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

T.

 

I personally use all Wingbags by Caroline stuff from Carden.  They are hard
to beat and have about every size known to man.and any they don't they will
make for you for the same price as the similarly sized bags.

 

Arch

 

 


  _____  


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of MKMSG
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 4:31 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

There are several sources.  I like the wing bags from Adrian Wong.  Here's
the URL:

 

http://www.chingbergh.com/products.html

 

Mike

----- Original Message ----- 

From: T <mailto:tncbrown at cebridge.net> &C Brown 

To: 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 7:40 PM

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Guys,

 

I'm in the market for a new wing bag.  It's a 74" one-piece wing.  Any
suggestions on brands?  I like the "Wing-Tote" brand, and they list a 74"
bag, but I don't know if that's an external dimension or an internal
dimension.  Do any of you own one?  Thanks in advance for the help.

 

T. Brown

 


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From tkeithblack at gmail.com  Thu Sep  4 19:34:37 2008
From: tkeithblack at gmail.com (Keith Black)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 03:34:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
In-Reply-To: <86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031>
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC><87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC>
	<86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031>
Message-ID: <2CCF36C069034BB88FA1477D94B82FF6@OfficePC>

I'd have to second the recommendation for Adrian's wing bags. I have two sets, one for six years one for five years, and they're still in great shape.

Keith Black
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: MKMSG 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 8:31 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag


  There are several sources.  I like the wing bags from Adrian Wong.  Here's the URL:

  http://www.chingbergh.com/products.html

  Mike
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: T&C Brown 
    To: 'General pattern discussion' 
    Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 7:40 PM
    Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag


    Guys,

     

    I'm in the market for a new wing bag.  It's a 74" one-piece wing.  Any suggestions on brands?  I like the "Wing-Tote" brand, and they list a 74" bag, but I don't know if that's an external dimension or an internal dimension.  Do any of you own one?  Thanks in advance for the help.

     

    T. Brown

     



----------------------------------------------------------------------------


    _______________________________________________
    NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From rickwallace45 at gmail.com  Fri Sep  5 02:28:00 2008
From: rickwallace45 at gmail.com (richard wallace)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 10:28:00 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D1 Oasis Season Finale and Hurrycane Hanna
Message-ID: <c8a7c8ec0809050327v1749c799m38193067469c561e@mail.gmail.com>

All -
Looks like Hanna may well win the first round this weekend.
Look for an email from Sal Piu here early today cancelling the Saturday
portion of the (Jackson) Oasis Season Finale. He's planning on reassessing
and making a weather call for Sunday based on updated forecasts, but
Saturday's not looking good at all.

Zipcode for Lakehurst, NJ  area is 08733 for those who want to follow along
on weather.com or other online weather services.


Informal flying at Hangar1 / Lakehurst is an option for those who are AMA
members (and ECIM members?  not sure about guest status for getting thru the
gate - some help here? ) ... though a HUGE question would be how to get a
foamy from the car into the hangar in one piece!

More to follow soon.

Rick
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From jlachow at hotmail.com  Fri Sep  5 04:27:47 2008
From: jlachow at hotmail.com (Joe Lachowski)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 12:27:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D1 Oasis Season Finale and Hurrycane Hanna
In-Reply-To: <c8a7c8ec0809050327v1749c799m38193067469c561e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c8a7c8ec0809050327v1749c799m38193067469c561e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAY101-W4141602BA177264E7AD713BB580@phx.gbl>

I have decided to stay home and wait to see how things are going to be Sunday. 
 
Rick I will not be there today and Joe I'll see you Sunday or we'll have to meet up another time and date on the plane.



Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 06:27:56 -0400From: rickwallace45 at gmail.comTo: DaveL322 at comcast.net; ronlock at comcast.net; jzeigenfus at comcast.net; anthonyr105 at hotmail.com; Ed_Alt at hotmail.com; jlachow at hotmail.com; jaqfly at prodigy.net; jlachow at optonline.net; jpavlick at idseng.com; dist1 at nsrca.org; spiurc at comcast.net; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgSubject: D1 Oasis Season Finale and Hurrycane Hanna

All - Looks like Hanna may well win the first round this weekend. 
Look for an email from Sal Piu here early today cancelling the Saturday portion of the (Jackson) Oasis Season Finale. He's planning on reassessing and making a weather call for Sunday based on updated forecasts, but Saturday's not looking good at all. 
 
Zipcode for Lakehurst, NJ  area is 08733 for those who want to follow along on weather.com or other online weather services. 
 
 
Informal flying at Hangar1 / Lakehurst is an option for those who are AMA members (and ECIM members?  not sure about guest status for getting thru the gate - some help here? ) ... though a HUGE question would be how to get a foamy from the car into the hangar in one piece! 
 
More to follow soon. 
 
Rick 
_________________________________________________________________
See how Windows connects the people, information, and fun that are part of your life.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093175mrt/direct/01/
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From jzeigenfus at comcast.net  Fri Sep  5 05:06:29 2008
From: jzeigenfus at comcast.net (jzeigenfus at comcast.net)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:06:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D1 Oasis Season Finale and Hurrycane Hanna
Message-ID: <090520081306.12946.48C12ECF000951E90000329222070215539C9A00020A09070A9606@comcast.net>

Yes I think I need shop time if there is Saturday is cancelled so I'll see everybody Sunday morning. Joe don't worry about it there is plenty of time and no one is going anywhere. I have two Focus one's for sale by the way if anyone knows of an interested party. They will be going for a song. Great intro plane for someone. JEZ

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Joe Lachowski <jlachow at hotmail.com> 
I have decided to stay home and wait to see how things are going to be Sunday. 
 
Rick I will not be there today and Joe I'll see you Sunday or we'll have to meet up another time and date on the plane.





Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 06:27:56 -0400
From: rickwallace45 at gmail.com
To: DaveL322 at comcast.net; ronlock at comcast.net; jzeigenfus at comcast.net; anthonyr105 at hotmail.com; Ed_Alt at hotmail.com; jlachow at hotmail.com; jaqfly at prodigy.net; jlachow at optonline.net; jpavlick at idseng.com; dist1 at nsrca.org; spiurc at comcast.net; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: D1 Oasis Season Finale and Hurrycane Hanna



All - 
Looks like Hanna may well win the first round this weekend. 

Look for an email from Sal Piu here early today cancelling the Saturday portion of the (Jackson) Oasis Season Finale. He's planning on reassessing and making a weather call for Sunday based on updated forecasts, but Saturday's not looking good at all. 

Zipcode for Lakehurst, NJ  area is 08733 for those who want to follow along on weather.com or other online weather services. 


Informal flying at Hangar1 / Lakehurst is an option for those who are AMA members (and ECIM members?  not sure about guest status for getting thru the gate - some help here? ) ... though a HUGE question would be how to get a foamy from the car into the hangar in one piece! 

More to follow soon. 

Rick 



See how Windows connects the people, information, and fun that are part of your life. See Now 
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From DaveL322 at comcast.net  Fri Sep  5 05:08:43 2008
From: DaveL322 at comcast.net (Dave)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:08:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D1 Oasis Season Finale and Hurrycane Hanna
In-Reply-To: <c8a7c8ec0809050327v1749c799m38193067469c561e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c8a7c8ec0809050327v1749c799m38193067469c561e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00b001c90f57$efa020f0$9300a8c0@davedesktop>

"Normal" requirements to fly in the Hangar -

 

AMA Card

ECIM Card

Drivers License

Car Insurance

 

The ECIM club does allow guest flying, but the ECIM card is still needed to
get in through the gate.  I'm not sure how it works if an ECIM member is
driving, and has a passenger with them?

 

Regards,

 

Dave Lockhart

 

 

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of richard
wallace
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 6:28 AM
To: Dave Lockhart; ROn Lockhart; Joe zeigenfus; Anthony Romano; Ed Alt; joe
lachowski; James Quinn; Joe Lachowski2; John Pavlick; nsrca d1 mailing list;
Sal Piu; Discussion 'NSRCA'
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D1 Oasis Season Finale and Hurrycane Hanna

 

All - 
Looks like Hanna may well win the first round this weekend. 

Look for an email from Sal Piu here early today cancelling the Saturday
portion of the (Jackson) Oasis Season Finale. He's planning on reassessing
and making a weather call for Sunday based on updated forecasts, but
Saturday's not looking good at all. 

 

Zipcode for Lakehurst, NJ  area is 08733 for those who want to follow along
on weather.com or other online weather services. 

 

 

Informal flying at Hangar1 / Lakehurst is an option for those who are AMA
members (and ECIM members?  not sure about guest status for getting thru the
gate - some help here? ) ... though a HUGE question would be how to get a
foamy from the car into the hangar in one piece! 

 

More to follow soon. 

 

Rick 

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From brian_w_young at yahoo.com  Fri Sep  5 05:12:10 2008
From: brian_w_young at yahoo.com (brian young)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:12:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Link I hadnt seen
Message-ID: <869846.1936.qm@web35203.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

http://www.codeonemagazine.com/test/archives/2007/articles/jan_07/cockpits/cockpits.html


      
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From jonlowe at aol.com  Fri Sep  5 05:35:47 2008
From: jonlowe at aol.com (Jon Lowe)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:35:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
In-Reply-To: <87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC>
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC>
	<87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC>
Message-ID: <8CADD7363366E1A-171C-9F3@MBLK-M15.sysops.aol.com>


 I've used these.? Good quality, inexpensive, and readily available.

http://www.hobbywarehouse.com/Products/Wing-Tote-Field-Storage/WGT106-Wing-Tote-Single-TOTEs-for-1Piece-Wings-WGT106


 


Jon Lowe

 


 

-----Original Message-----
From: T&C Brown <tncbrown at cebridge.net>
To: 'General pattern discussion' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 7:40 pm
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag






















Guys,



?



I?m in the market for a new wing bag.? It?s
a 74? one-piece wing.? Any suggestions on brands?? I
like the ?Wing-Tote? brand, and they list a 74? bag, but I
don?t know if that?s an external dimension or an internal
dimension.? Do any of you own one?? Thanks in advance for the help.



?



T. Brown



?






 





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



 

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From gfowler at raytheon.com  Fri Sep  5 10:16:07 2008
From: gfowler at raytheon.com (Gray E Fowler)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 18:16:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers
In-Reply-To: <8CADD7363366E1A-171C-9F3@MBLK-M15.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <OFD9D0E908.6EB5DD89-ON862574BB.00622C70-862574BB.00629648@mck.us.ray.com>

Since it appears my new plane crash was due to a "new" battery failure or 
some kind of high drain, it is time to get back into the habit of checking 
the stinkin' batteries before every flight. This is a habit I had early 
on, but 8 years in pattern and no battery problems made me lazy. I used to 
have that cheapo $19.95 hobbico Expanded Volatge reader or some such, but 
what is out there that I really should be using for my new $2000+ 
airplane?   Please let me know what you guys think! 




Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon
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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Fri Sep  5 10:23:32 2008
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 18:23:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers
In-Reply-To: <OFD9D0E908.6EB5DD89-ON862574BB.00622C70-862574BB.00629648@mck.us.ray.com>
References: <8CADD7363366E1A-171C-9F3@MBLK-M15.sysops.aol.com>
	<OFD9D0E908.6EB5DD89-ON862574BB.00622C70-862574BB.00629648@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <3454543c0809051123h34618f71t94a39ae216ffa0bb@mail.gmail.com>

I would go with Gordon Anderson's Maestro - I've been using it for a while
now and love it.  I check my batteries every flight but unfortunately that
isn't a guarantee against battery failure either.  :-(  I had my ProLine go
in after I checked the 4 cell Nicad (5.56v and under load of 5.01v).

Gordon's website is:

http://www.mstar2k.com/

On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 10:56 AM, Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> wrote:

>
> Since it appears my new plane crash was due to a "new" battery failure or
> some kind of high drain, it is time to get back into the habit of checking
> the stinkin' batteries before every flight. This is a habit I had early on,
> but 8 years in pattern and no battery problems made me lazy. I used to have
> that cheapo $19.95 hobbico Expanded Volatge reader or some such, but what is
> out there that I really should be using for my new $2000+ airplane?   Please
> let me know what you guys think!
>
>
>
>
> Gray Fowler
> Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
> Radomes and Specialty Apertures
> Technical Staff Composites Engineering
> Raytheon
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From pcosky at comcast.net  Fri Sep  5 10:33:21 2008
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 18:33:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers
References: <OFD9D0E908.6EB5DD89-ON862574BB.00622C70-862574BB.00629648@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <002c01c90f85$daa3e190$4658550a@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>

I bought a Duralite load tester a few years ago. It has a digital readout and does .5 and 1 amp loads. I use it on all my models no matter what batteries are used, NiCad, nimh, li-ion, or lipoly.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Gray E Fowler 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 1:56 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers



  Since it appears my new plane crash was due to a "new" battery failure or some kind of high drain, it is time to get back into the habit of checking the stinkin' batteries before every flight. This is a habit I had early on, but 8 years in pattern and no battery problems made me lazy. I used to have that cheapo $19.95 hobbico Expanded Volatge reader or some such, but what is out there that I really should be using for my new $2000+ airplane?   Please let me know what you guys think! 




  Gray Fowler
  Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
  Radomes and Specialty Apertures
  Technical Staff Composites Engineering
  Raytheon


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From pcosky at comcast.net  Fri Sep  5 10:51:03 2008
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 18:51:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers
References: <8CADD7363366E1A-171C-9F3@MBLK-M15.sysops.aol.com><OFD9D0E908.6EB5DD89-ON862574BB.00622C70-862574BB.00629648@mck.us.ray.com>
	<3454543c0809051123h34618f71t94a39ae216ffa0bb@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <005501c90f88$53282ac0$4658550a@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>

That really looks like a cool device. 

Do you have the serial interface as well? If so how easy is the configuration?
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Derek Koopowitz 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 2:23 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers


  I would go with Gordon Anderson's Maestro - I've been using it for a while now and love it.  I check my batteries every flight but unfortunately that isn't a guarantee against battery failure either.  :-(  I had my ProLine go in after I checked the 4 cell Nicad (5.56v and under load of 5.01v).  

  Gordon's website is:

  http://www.mstar2k.com/


  On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 10:56 AM, Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> wrote:


    Since it appears my new plane crash was due to a "new" battery failure or some kind of high drain, it is time to get back into the habit of checking the stinkin' batteries before every flight. This is a habit I had early on, but 8 years in pattern and no battery problems made me lazy. I used to have that cheapo $19.95 hobbico Expanded Volatge reader or some such, but what is out there that I really should be using for my new $2000+ airplane?   Please let me know what you guys think! 




    Gray Fowler
    Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
    Radomes and Specialty Apertures
    Technical Staff Composites Engineering
    Raytheon
    _______________________________________________
    NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion





------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From simestd at netexpress.com  Fri Sep  5 11:05:37 2008
From: simestd at netexpress.com (Tom Simes)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 19:05:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers
In-Reply-To: <OFD9D0E908.6EB5DD89-ON862574BB.00622C70-862574BB.00629648@mck.us.ray.com>
References: <8CADD7363366E1A-171C-9F3@MBLK-M15.sysops.aol.com>
	<OFD9D0E908.6EB5DD89-ON862574BB.00622C70-862574BB.00629648@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <20080905110533.69a6507e.simestd@netexpress.com>

On Fri, 5 Sep 2008 12:56:49 -0500
Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> wrote:

> Since it appears my new plane crash was due to a "new" battery failure
> or  some kind of high drain, it is time to get back into the habit of
> checking  the stinkin' batteries before every flight. This is a habit
> I had early  on, but 8 years in pattern and no battery problems made
> me lazy. I used to  have that cheapo $19.95 hobbico Expanded Volatge
> reader or some such, but  what is out there that I really should be
> using for my new $2000+  airplane?   Please let me know what you guys
> think! 

There was some discussion on this last month under this thread:

http://lists.nsrca.org/pipermail/nsrca-discussion/2008-August/062423.html

My contribution was:

I've had a Radio South digital ESV for years and I really like it.  It's
small, zero maintenance (no batteries) and dead simple to operate.

http://www.radiosouthrc.com/closeup.asp?cid=17&pid=458&offset=0

or

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXKLF5&P=0

I'll add that it does no load, .5A, 1.0A and 1.5A load testing depending
on the button combination pressed.

Tom
 
======================================================================
   "Z-80 system stack overflow.  Shut 'er down Scotty, the system's
         sucking mud" - Error message on TRS 80 Model-16B

Tom Simes                                       simestd at netexpress.com 
======================================================================

From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Fri Sep  5 11:23:27 2008
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 19:23:27 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers
In-Reply-To: <OFD9D0E908.6EB5DD89-ON862574BB.00622C70-862574BB.00629648@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <32A9E8EBE3694594B081AD23F7FDD293@jaysdesktop>

Whether you use a digital or analog, you should always check under a load.

A (good) digital meter will give accurate and repeatable readings while a
ESV will make it easier to "see" quick drops due to bad servos or heavy
loads when you move the controls (the digital meter will integrate the
samples). For these reasons I like the 'Voltwatch' but you have to have one
set to the correct voltage range. Techniques to do this are on the 'net.

 

Jay Marshall 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Gray E Fowler
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 1:57 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers

 


Since it appears my new plane crash was due to a "new" battery failure or
some kind of high drain, it is time to get back into the habit of checking
the stinkin' batteries before every flight. This is a habit I had early on,
but 8 years in pattern and no battery problems made me lazy. I used to have
that cheapo $19.95 hobbico Expanded Volatge reader or some such, but what is
out there that I really should be using for my new $2000+ airplane?   Please
let me know what you guys think! 




Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon

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From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Fri Sep  5 11:24:58 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 19:24:58 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers
In-Reply-To: <OFD9D0E908.6EB5DD89-ON862574BB.00622C70-862574BB.00629648@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <20080905142455.9NPV9.289856.root@Web02>

Gray,

I like the "Eight Ball" tester from Fromeco.  It reads voltage unloaded and then with a 1 amp load.  Nice aluminum case and readout with no switches or buttons to confuse the issue.  

G
---- Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> wrote: 

=============
Since it appears my new plane crash was due to a "new" battery failure or 
some kind of high drain, it is time to get back into the habit of checking 
the stinkin' batteries before every flight. This is a habit I had early 
on, but 8 years in pattern and no battery problems made me lazy. I used to 
have that cheapo $19.95 hobbico Expanded Volatge reader or some such, but 
what is out there that I really should be using for my new $2000+ 
airplane?   Please let me know what you guys think! 




Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon

From simestd at netexpress.com  Fri Sep  5 11:29:10 2008
From: simestd at netexpress.com (Tom Simes)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 19:29:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers
In-Reply-To: <OFD9D0E908.6EB5DD89-ON862574BB.00622C70-862574BB.00629648@mck.us.ray.com>
References: <8CADD7363366E1A-171C-9F3@MBLK-M15.sysops.aol.com>
	<OFD9D0E908.6EB5DD89-ON862574BB.00622C70-862574BB.00629648@mck.us.ray.com>
Message-ID: <20080905112907.11845276.simestd@netexpress.com>

On Fri, 5 Sep 2008 12:56:49 -0500
Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> wrote:

> Since it appears my new plane crash was due to a "new" battery failure
> or  some kind of high drain, it is time to get back into the habit of
> checking  the stinkin' batteries before every flight. This is a habit
> I had early  on, but 8 years in pattern and no battery problems made
> me lazy. I used to  have that cheapo $19.95 hobbico Expanded Volatge
> reader or some such, but  what is out there that I really should be
> using for my new $2000+  airplane?   Please let me know what you guys
> think! 

By the way, in addition to measuring the .5A loaded voltage before each
flight, I also record it in a small notebook that I keep in my field
box.  It's kind of like little diary and a typical day's entry goes
something like this:

------------------------------------------------------------
9/05/07
Elmendorf field, 0915
55 deg. F, wind var 3-5 from S-SE, 10/10 ovc @ ~5K

Sig S.E.
5.24V
5.12V - midrange a little rich, 2 ck lean
5.06V
4.91V - gradual rudder inputs on downlines!!
charge to 5.26v....
5.13V - tried APC 11x4, good breaking for !wind
5.10V - don't over flare
5.02V

Total ET 1h 8m
Ran out fuel, Mobil 1 5w30 after run
Need to replace left wheel, fix rudder ctl horn slop
------------------------------------------------------------

Its not for everyone, but I really get a lot out of it.  Writing down
the voltages, equipment changes and squawks helps me spot trends and
keep on top of PM items before they cause problems.  It's also just fun
to go back and read, and it's a good reminder of what I should be
working on in the sim.  By the way, pencil marks don't run when
sprinkled on and it still works at -5F - neither of which can be said of
most pens.

Tom
 
======================================================================
   "Z-80 system stack overflow.  Shut 'er down Scotty, the system's
         sucking mud" - Error message on TRS 80 Model-16B

Tom Simes                                       simestd at netexpress.com 
======================================================================

From wilsorc at gmail.com  Fri Sep  5 12:48:33 2008
From: wilsorc at gmail.com (Bob Wilson)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 20:48:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] O.S. 120AX
Message-ID: <888fdd980809051348o1803d24eq2dee2ae84d9c68a8@mail.gmail.com>

I can find the parts breakdown for this engine (O.S. 120AX), but nowhere can
I find an exploded print view.
Can anyone help?

bw
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From duane.e.beck at comcast.net  Fri Sep  5 13:08:46 2008
From: duane.e.beck at comcast.net (Duane Beck)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 21:08:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] O.S. 120AX
Message-ID: <090520082108.28965.48C19FDA00072E79000071252216554886050C0A0DD20AD20A020E9A0B@comcast.net>

http://manuals.hobbico.com/osm/120ax-manual.pdf

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: "Bob Wilson" <wilsorc at gmail.com> 

I can find the parts breakdown for this engine (O.S. 120AX), but nowhere can I find an exploded print view.
Can anyone help?

bw
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From: "Bob Wilson" <wilsorc at gmail.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] O.S. 120AX
Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 20:48:41 +0000
Size: 700
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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Fri Sep  5 13:38:04 2008
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 21:38:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers
In-Reply-To: <005501c90f88$53282ac0$4658550a@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
References: <8CADD7363366E1A-171C-9F3@MBLK-M15.sysops.aol.com>
	<OFD9D0E908.6EB5DD89-ON862574BB.00622C70-862574BB.00629648@mck.us.ray.com>
	<3454543c0809051123h34618f71t94a39ae216ffa0bb@mail.gmail.com>
	<005501c90f88$53282ac0$4658550a@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
Message-ID: <3454543c0809051437md6dbc1kd8ce1c5a8cd1a410@mail.gmail.com>

I do have the serial interface but haven't needed to use it since Gordon
programmed mine with what I needed at the time I purchased it.  Changing
parameters in the interface is very straightforward.

On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 11:50 AM, Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net> wrote:

>  That really looks like a cool device.
>
> Do you have the serial interface as well? If so how easy is the
> configuration?
>
>  ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Derek Koopowitz <derekkoopowitz at gmail.com>
> *To:* General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>   *Sent:* Friday, September 05, 2008 2:23 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers
>
>  I would go with Gordon Anderson's Maestro - I've been using it for a
> while now and love it.  I check my batteries every flight but unfortunately
> that isn't a guarantee against battery failure either.  :-(  I had my
> ProLine go in after I checked the 4 cell Nicad (5.56v and under load of
> 5.01v).
>
> Gordon's website is:
>
> http://www.mstar2k.com/
>
> On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 10:56 AM, Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com>wrote:
>
>>
>> Since it appears my new plane crash was due to a "new" battery failure or
>> some kind of high drain, it is time to get back into the habit of checking
>> the stinkin' batteries before every flight. This is a habit I had early on,
>> but 8 years in pattern and no battery problems made me lazy. I used to have
>> that cheapo $19.95 hobbico Expanded Volatge reader or some such, but what is
>> out there that I really should be using for my new $2000+ airplane?   Please
>> let me know what you guys think!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Gray Fowler
>> Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
>> Radomes and Specialty Apertures
>> Technical Staff Composites Engineering
>> Raytheon
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>
>  ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From trexlesh at msn.com  Fri Sep  5 14:33:46 2008
From: trexlesh at msn.com (Rex)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 22:33:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers
In-Reply-To: <3454543c0809051437md6dbc1kd8ce1c5a8cd1a410@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8CADD7363366E1A-171C-9F3@MBLK-M15.sysops.aol.com>
	<OFD9D0E908.6EB5DD89-ON862574BB.00622C70-862574BB.00629648@mck.us.ray.com>
	<3454543c0809051123h34618f71t94a39ae216ffa0bb@mail.gmail.com>
	<005501c90f88$53282ac0$4658550a@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com> 
	<3454543c0809051437md6dbc1kd8ce1c5a8cd1a410@mail.gmail.com> 
Message-ID: <BAY119-W255B9E368CCFCC3F1ABF5DCC580@phx.gbl>

I have the very first one ever made!   I'm Special!  lolI've been using it for about four years...  It is a very cool tool.
I urge anyone interested to browse through the manual.  It's a really
good "at the field" diagnostic tool!  I check my gimbals all the time by 
simply plugging into the appropriate channel in the receiver and moving the
stick...  Watch the reading on the screen and presto chango, I know if things 
are okay or not!  It is programmed for many different uses and simple to use...
Single button operation.  It doesn't get any easier than that!
 
 
Rex



il.comTo: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgSubject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers
I do have the serial interface but haven't needed to use it since Gordon programmed mine with what I needed at the time I purchased it.  Changing parameters in the interface is very straightforward.
On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 11:50 AM, Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net> wrote:


That really looks like a cool device. 
 
Do you have the serial interface as well? If so how easy is the configuration?


----- Original Message ----- 
From: Derek Koopowitz 
To: General pattern discussion 



Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 2:23 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers


I would go with Gordon Anderson's Maestro - I've been using it for a while now and love it.  I check my batteries every flight but unfortunately that isn't a guarantee against battery failure either.  :-(  I had my ProLine go in after I checked the 4 cell Nicad (5.56v and under load of 5.01v).  
 
Gordon's website is:
 
http://www.mstar2k.com/
On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 10:56 AM, Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> wrote:
Since it appears my new plane crash was due to a "new" battery failure or some kind of high drain, it is time to get back into the habit of checking the stinkin' batteries before every flight. This is a habit I had early on, but 8 years in pattern and no battery problems made me lazy. I used to have that cheapo $19.95 hobbico Expanded Volatge reader or some such, but what is out there that I really should be using for my new $2000+ airplane?   Please let me know what you guys think! Gray FowlerSenior Principal Chemical EngineerRadomes and Specialty AperturesTechnical Staff Composites EngineeringRaytheon_______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



_______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From trexlesh at msn.com  Fri Sep  5 14:40:22 2008
From: trexlesh at msn.com (Rex)
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2008 22:40:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX
In-Reply-To: <AAE4E02A89794E4DAE8C1F3BA7C0EB4D03D464E7@BRKEX-1.int.norpac.com>
References: <AAE4E02A89794E4DAE8C1F3BA7C0EB4D03C8A33A@BRKEX-1.int.norpac.com><BAY119-W10B5A2FFD422BE205E193CCC5F0@phx.gbl><AAE4E02A89794E4DAE8C1F3BA7C0EB4D03D463C3@BRKEX-1.int.norpac.com>
	<BAY119-W18A0EA383C15E800EDCF72CC580@phx.gbl> 
	<AAE4E02A89794E4DAE8C1F3BA7C0EB4D03D464E7@BRKEX-1.int.norpac.com>
Message-ID: <BAY119-W4640288417E86728C83CD1CC580@phx.gbl>

Guys
 
I have a fellow  wanting info on headers and pipes for this engine...  what is everyone using?
What length are you running that combo at?  What props are you using?  And, are you using
a pump?
 
Thanks
 
Rex 
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From CHV69 at aol.com  Fri Sep  5 16:16:40 2008
From: CHV69 at aol.com (CHV69 at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 00:16:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX
Message-ID: <c24.4524fb23.35f325db@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 9/5/2008 6:40:51 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
trexlesh at msn.com writes:

I have  a fellow  wanting info on headers and pipes for this engine...  what  
is everyone using?
What length are you running that combo at?  What  props are you using?  And, 
are you using
a  pump?



Header... Karl Mueller Makes it any way you need.
 
Pipe.... Aeroslave or ES  Length to the baffle 27"
 
Fuel... S&W 25% Nitro
 
Prop... 17 x 8 N 
 
Pump....Perry VP30
 
Plane... Focus Sport Unlimited vertical at 3/4  throttle



**************Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, 
plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com.      
(http://www.stylelist.com/trends?ncid=aolsty00050000000014)
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From trexlesh at msn.com  Fri Sep  5 16:22:35 2008
From: trexlesh at msn.com (Rex)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 00:22:35 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX
In-Reply-To: <c24.4524fb23.35f325db@aol.com>
References: <c24.4524fb23.35f325db@aol.com>
Message-ID: <BAY119-W551C4B4F6930862210902ECC5B0@phx.gbl>

That's what I'm talking about!!!!!  Thanks
 
Rex



From: CHV69 at aol.comDate: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 20:16:27 -0400To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgSubject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX


In a message dated 9/5/2008 6:40:51 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, trexlesh at msn.com writes:
I have a fellow  wanting info on headers and pipes for this engine...  what is everyone using?What length are you running that combo at?  What props are you using?  And, are you usinga pump? 

Header... Karl Mueller Makes it any way you need.
 
Pipe.... Aeroslave or ES  Length to the baffle 27"
 
Fuel... S&W 25% Nitro
 
Prop... 17 x 8 N 
 
Pump....Perry VP30
 
Plane... Focus Sport Unlimited vertical at 3/4 throttle


Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com.
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From KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com  Fri Sep  5 16:36:05 2008
From: KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com (Ken Thompson)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 00:36:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Link I hadnt seen
References: <869846.1936.qm@web35203.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <004901c90fb9$1c27b320$0200a8c0@kencopepere>

Thanks for that Brian, that's a great site, I've put a link to it on my desktop.

Ken
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: brian young 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 8:12 AM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting Link I hadnt seen


  http://www.codeonemagazine.com/test/archives/2007/articles/jan_07/cockpits/cockpits.html




------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Fri Sep  5 16:36:37 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 00:36:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX
References: <c24.4524fb23.35f325db@aol.com>
	<BAY119-W551C4B4F6930862210902ECC5B0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV4D029ECFB14AD2E738FB6E85B0@phx.gbl>

I've found that pipe pressure works well, allowing you to skip the VP30.  I use a check valve in line with the pressure line to the tank and plug off the fill line. I'll have some pictures up on RCU in the Aquila thread later tonight.  Yeah, I have one!  It's not from the boat that just docked in Boston, it was the production example that was sent in advance to NE Aerodynamics to verify final changes a couple of months ago.  I just got it here a few days ago and will be flying it on Sunday.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Rex 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 7:22 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX


  That's what I'm talking about!!!!!  Thanks
   
  Rex





------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: CHV69 at aol.com
  Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 20:16:27 -0400
  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX



  In a message dated 9/5/2008 6:40:51 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, trexlesh at msn.com writes:
    I have a fellow  wanting info on headers and pipes for this engine...  what is everyone using?
    What length are you running that combo at?  What props are you using?  And, are you using
    a pump?
     
  Header... Karl Mueller Makes it any way you need.

  Pipe.... Aeroslave or ES  Length to the baffle 27"

  Fuel... S&W 25% Nitro

  Prop... 17 x 8 N 

  Pump....Perry VP30

  Plane... Focus Sport Unlimited vertical at 3/4 throttle





------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From trexlesh at msn.com  Fri Sep  5 16:44:53 2008
From: trexlesh at msn.com (Rex)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 00:44:53 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV4D029ECFB14AD2E738FB6E85B0@phx.gbl>
References: <c24.4524fb23.35f325db@aol.com>
	<BAY119-W551C4B4F6930862210902ECC5B0@phx.gbl> 
	<BAY135-DAV4D029ECFB14AD2E738FB6E85B0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY119-W361883CB52DBB5DB5270D8CC5B0@phx.gbl>

Thanks Ed...  that's the plane he is going to be putting the 120 AX in....   I'll forward this to him!
 
Rex



From: ed_alt at hotmail.comTo: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgDate: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 19:36:42 -0500Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX



I've found that pipe pressure works well, allowing you to skip the VP30.  I use a check valve in line with the pressure line to the tank and plug off the fill line. I'll have some pictures up on RCU in the Aquila thread later tonight.  Yeah, I have one!  It's not from the boat that just docked in Boston, it was the production example that was sent in advance to NE Aerodynamics to verify final changes a couple of months ago.  I just got it here a few days ago and will be flying it on Sunday.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Rex 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 7:22 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX
That's what I'm talking about!!!!!  Thanks Rex

From: CHV69 at aol.comDate: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 20:16:27 -0400To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgSubject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX

In a message dated 9/5/2008 6:40:51 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, trexlesh at msn.com writes:
I have a fellow  wanting info on headers and pipes for this engine...  what is everyone using?What length are you running that combo at?  What props are you using?  And, are you usinga pump? 

Header... Karl Mueller Makes it any way you need.
 
Pipe.... Aeroslave or ES  Length to the baffle 27"
 
Fuel... S&W 25% Nitro
 
Prop... 17 x 8 N 
 
Pump....Perry VP30
 
Plane... Focus Sport Unlimited vertical at 3/4 throttle


Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com.



_______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Fri Sep  5 16:59:48 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 00:59:48 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX
References: <c24.4524fb23.35f325db@aol.com><BAY119-W551C4B4F6930862210902ECC5B0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY135-DAV4D029ECFB14AD2E738FB6E85B0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY119-W361883CB52DBB5DB5270D8CC5B0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV12166C7D78006E290C5BA1E85B0@phx.gbl>

BTW, today I received the Karl Mueller wrap-around header that is designed for the Aquila and OS 120AX combo.  It fits perfectly with a 2 1/8" drop. The header is a work of art, as always with a KM product.

Ed
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Rex 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 7:44 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX


  Thanks Ed...  that's the plane he is going to be putting the 120 AX in....   I'll forward this to him!
   
  Rex





------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: ed_alt at hotmail.com
  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 19:36:42 -0500
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX



  I've found that pipe pressure works well, allowing you to skip the VP30.  I use a check valve in line with the pressure line to the tank and plug off the fill line. I'll have some pictures up on RCU in the Aquila thread later tonight.  Yeah, I have one!  It's not from the boat that just docked in Boston, it was the production example that was sent in advance to NE Aerodynamics to verify final changes a couple of months ago.  I just got it here a few days ago and will be flying it on Sunday.
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Rex 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 7:22 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX


    That's what I'm talking about!!!!!  Thanks
     
    Rex





----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    From: CHV69 at aol.com
    Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 20:16:27 -0400
    To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX



    In a message dated 9/5/2008 6:40:51 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, trexlesh at msn.com writes:
      I have a fellow  wanting info on headers and pipes for this engine...  what is everyone using?
      What length are you running that combo at?  What props are you using?  And, are you using
      a pump?
       
    Header... Karl Mueller Makes it any way you need.

    Pipe.... Aeroslave or ES  Length to the baffle 27"

    Fuel... S&W 25% Nitro

    Prop... 17 x 8 N 

    Pump....Perry VP30

    Plane... Focus Sport Unlimited vertical at 3/4 throttle





----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From trexlesh at msn.com  Fri Sep  5 17:11:06 2008
From: trexlesh at msn.com (Rex)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 01:11:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV12166C7D78006E290C5BA1E85B0@phx.gbl>
References: <c24.4524fb23.35f325db@aol.com><BAY119-W551C4B4F6930862210902ECC5B0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY135-DAV4D029ECFB14AD2E738FB6E85B0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY119-W361883CB52DBB5DB5270D8CC5B0@phx.gbl> 
	<BAY135-DAV12166C7D78006E290C5BA1E85B0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY119-W45BAE3DC19B4C0CBBE37B4CC5B0@phx.gbl>

cool...  he's going to be sitting pretty with all this info!
 
Rex



From: ed_alt at hotmail.comTo: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgDate: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 19:59:52 -0500Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX



BTW, today I received the Karl Mueller wrap-around header that is designed for the Aquila and OS 120AX combo.  It fits perfectly with a 2 1/8" drop. The header is a work of art, as always with a KM product.
 
Ed

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Rex 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 7:44 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX
Thanks Ed...  that's the plane he is going to be putting the 120 AX in....   I'll forward this to him! Rex

From: ed_alt at hotmail.comTo: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgDate: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 19:36:42 -0500Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX


I've found that pipe pressure works well, allowing you to skip the VP30.  I use a check valve in line with the pressure line to the tank and plug off the fill line. I'll have some pictures up on RCU in the Aquila thread later tonight.  Yeah, I have one!  It's not from the boat that just docked in Boston, it was the production example that was sent in advance to NE Aerodynamics to verify final changes a couple of months ago.  I just got it here a few days ago and will be flying it on Sunday.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Rex 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 7:22 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX
That's what I'm talking about!!!!!  Thanks Rex

From: CHV69 at aol.comDate: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 20:16:27 -0400To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgSubject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 120 AX

In a message dated 9/5/2008 6:40:51 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, trexlesh at msn.com writes:
I have a fellow  wanting info on headers and pipes for this engine...  what is everyone using?What length are you running that combo at?  What props are you using?  And, are you usinga pump? 

Header... Karl Mueller Makes it any way you need.
 
Pipe.... Aeroslave or ES  Length to the baffle 27"
 
Fuel... S&W 25% Nitro
 
Prop... 17 x 8 N 
 
Pump....Perry VP30
 
Plane... Focus Sport Unlimited vertical at 3/4 throttle


Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com.


_______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



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From dunnaway at hbcomm.net  Fri Sep  5 17:13:25 2008
From: dunnaway at hbcomm.net (Joe Dunnaway)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 01:13:25 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] A123 Batteries?
Message-ID: <48C1D92D.4020302@hbcomm.net>

    Anyone using A123 cells for your receiver batteries?   Any 
problems,  advice or hints?  What chargers?  


Thanks
Joe Dunnaway

From phelps15 at comcast.net  Fri Sep  5 17:17:46 2008
From: phelps15 at comcast.net (Bill Pritchett)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 01:17:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC><87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC><86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031><D92351B7D3954CA8BA5FDD293758C5BD@astafford><27ED16C16F5C49EEA359219C4F3F9CB7@TPC>
	<9CFEFAE356084103BC9BE1827E297904@astafford>
Message-ID: <018801c90fbe$6570e470$6501a8c0@VALUEDCB7D4C82>

Arch - I'm sure she will keep templates for the BM...   I'll take two sets - One for me, and one for Mark.  Mine will keep the dust off in the workshop and Atwood's will protect it on the way to a contest!
Glad to hear you're on the way home - hope to see you soon.
Pritch
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Archie Stafford 
  To: 'General pattern discussion' 
  Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 10:05 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag


  T-,

   

  I just had her make up a whole set of wing and tail bags for my Black Magic.  The is in the process of making the tail bags right now and I should have them next week.  She is so easy to work with.

   

  Arch

   

   


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of T&C Brown
  Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 5:00 AM
  To: 'General pattern discussion'
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

   

  Thx Arch.I have her on the list to consider as well.  I like her bags. (insert joke here J)  I have a set for my 40% Carden.

   

  T-

   


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Archie Stafford
  Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 8:53 PM
  To: 'General pattern discussion'
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

   

  T.

   

  I personally use all Wingbags by Caroline stuff from Carden.  They are hard to beat and have about every size known to man.and any they don't they will make for you for the same price as the similarly sized bags.

   

  Arch

   

   


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of MKMSG
  Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 4:31 AM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

   

  There are several sources.  I like the wing bags from Adrian Wong.  Here's the URL:

   

  http://www.chingbergh.com/products.html

   

  Mike

    ----- Original Message ----- 

    From: T&C Brown 

    To: 'General pattern discussion' 

    Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 7:40 PM

    Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

     

    Guys,

     

    I'm in the market for a new wing bag.  It's a 74" one-piece wing.  Any suggestions on brands?  I like the "Wing-Tote" brand, and they list a 74" bag, but I don't know if that's an external dimension or an internal dimension.  Do any of you own one?  Thanks in advance for the help.

     

    T. Brown

     


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

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    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



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From cjm767driver at hotmail.com  Fri Sep  5 17:24:30 2008
From: cjm767driver at hotmail.com (chris moon)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 01:24:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] A123 Batteries?
Message-ID: <BLU137-W29CA05D8C39E210730873A835B0@phx.gbl>


Joe, the biggest problem is weight. A 2300mah cell weighs 70g (2.46oz) 
and you need 2 so you will be at or over 5oz with connectors and wiring.

Here is a technical paper from FMA that I found on the A123 batteries.

http://www.fmadirect.com/support_docs/item_1229.pdf

Chris


Joe Dunnaway wrote:
>    Anyone using A123 cells for your receiver batteries?   Any 
> problems,  advice or hints?  What chargers? 
>
> Thanks
> Joe Dunnaway
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>


_________________________________________________________________
Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows Live.
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From KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com  Fri Sep  5 17:33:59 2008
From: KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com (Ken Thompson)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 01:33:59 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC><87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC><86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031><D92351B7D3954CA8BA5FDD293758C5BD@astafford><27ED16C16F5C49EEA359219C4F3F9CB7@TPC><9CFEFAE356084103BC9BE1827E297904@astafford>
	<018801c90fbe$6570e470$6501a8c0@VALUEDCB7D4C82>
Message-ID: <001601c90fc1$170ea3f0$0200a8c0@kencopepere>

I agree Pritch...

Hopefully I can get a set, can't wait to get my finished bird and get to practicing!!!

See ya in a week or two Arch!!
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Bill Pritchett 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 8:17 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag


  Arch - I'm sure she will keep templates for the BM...   I'll take two sets - One for me, and one for Mark.  Mine will keep the dust off in the workshop and Atwood's will protect it on the way to a contest!
  Glad to hear you're on the way home - hope to see you soon.
  Pritch
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Archie Stafford 
    To: 'General pattern discussion' 
    Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 10:05 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag


    T-,

     

    I just had her make up a whole set of wing and tail bags for my Black Magic.  The is in the process of making the tail bags right now and I should have them next week.  She is so easy to work with.

     

    Arch

     

     


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of T&C Brown
    Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 5:00 AM
    To: 'General pattern discussion'
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

     

    Thx Arch.I have her on the list to consider as well.  I like her bags. (insert joke here J)  I have a set for my 40% Carden.

     

    T-

     


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Archie Stafford
    Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 8:53 PM
    To: 'General pattern discussion'
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

     

    T.

     

    I personally use all Wingbags by Caroline stuff from Carden.  They are hard to beat and have about every size known to man.and any they don't they will make for you for the same price as the similarly sized bags.

     

    Arch

     

     


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of MKMSG
    Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 4:31 AM
    To: General pattern discussion
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

     

    There are several sources.  I like the wing bags from Adrian Wong.  Here's the URL:

     

    http://www.chingbergh.com/products.html

     

    Mike

      ----- Original Message ----- 

      From: T&C Brown 

      To: 'General pattern discussion' 

      Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 7:40 PM

      Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

       

      Guys,

       

      I'm in the market for a new wing bag.  It's a 74" one-piece wing.  Any suggestions on brands?  I like the "Wing-Tote" brand, and they list a 74" bag, but I don't know if that's an external dimension or an internal dimension.  Do any of you own one?  Thanks in advance for the help.

       

      T. Brown

       


--------------------------------------------------------------------------

      _______________________________________________
      NSRCA-discussion mailing list
      NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
      http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



----------------------------------------------------------------------------


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    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From bob at toprudder.com  Fri Sep  5 17:43:28 2008
From: bob at toprudder.com (Robert Richards)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 01:43:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] A123 Batteries?
In-Reply-To: <BLU137-W29CA05D8C39E210730873A835B0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <343522.45746.qm@web1101.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>

Check out the 1100mah packs. I have two of those in my 50cc Extra.
   
  http://www.enerland.com/product/p11.php
   
  Bob R.
  

chris moon <cjm767driver at hotmail.com> wrote:
      .hmmessage P  {  margin:0px;  padding:0px  }  body.hmmessage  {  FONT-SIZE: 10pt;  FONT-FAMILY:Tahoma  }    Joe, the biggest problem is weight. A 2300mah cell weighs 70g (2.46oz) 
and you need 2 so you will be at or over 5oz with connectors and wiring.

Here is a technical paper from FMA that I found on the A123 batteries.

http://www.fmadirect.com/support_docs/item_1229.pdf

Chris


Joe Dunnaway wrote:
> Anyone using A123 cells for your receiver batteries? Any 
> problems, advice or hints? What chargers? 
>
> Thanks
> Joe Dunnaway
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>


  
---------------------------------
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From astafford at swtexas.net  Fri Sep  5 17:45:55 2008
From: astafford at swtexas.net (Archie Stafford)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 01:45:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
In-Reply-To: <018801c90fbe$6570e470$6501a8c0@VALUEDCB7D4C82>
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC><87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC><86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031><D92351B7D3954CA8BA5FDD293758C5BD@astafford><27ED16C16F5C49EEA359219C4F3F9CB7@TPC><9CFEFAE356084103BC9BE1827E297904@astafford>
	<018801c90fbe$6570e470$6501a8c0@VALUEDCB7D4C82>
Message-ID: <EAE9E193F1BC44A1A6005AB9CF062992@astafford>

Bill,

 

They should be 60.00 for the stab set, and 85.00 for the wing bags.145.00
for both.

 

Arch

 

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bill
Pritchett
Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2008 4:18 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Arch - I'm sure she will keep templates for the BM...   I'll take two sets -
One for me, and one for Mark.  Mine will keep the dust off in the workshop
and Atwood's will protect it on the way to a contest!

Glad to hear you're on the way home - hope to see you soon.

Pritch

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Archie <mailto:astafford at swtexas.net>  Stafford 

To: 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 10:05 PM

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

T-,

 

I just had her make up a whole set of wing and tail bags for my Black Magic.
The is in the process of making the tail bags right now and I should have
them next week.  She is so easy to work with.

 

Arch

 

 


  _____  


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of T&C Brown
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 5:00 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Thx Arch.I have her on the list to consider as well.  I like her bags.
(insert joke here :-))  I have a set for my 40% Carden.

 

T-

 


  _____  


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Archie
Stafford
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 8:53 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

T.

 

I personally use all Wingbags by Caroline stuff from Carden.  They are hard
to beat and have about every size known to man.and any they don't they will
make for you for the same price as the similarly sized bags.

 

Arch

 

 


  _____  


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of MKMSG
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 4:31 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

There are several sources.  I like the wing bags from Adrian Wong.  Here's
the URL:

 

http://www.chingbergh.com/products.html

 

Mike

----- Original Message ----- 

From: T <mailto:tncbrown at cebridge.net> &C Brown 

To: 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 7:40 PM

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Guys,

 

I'm in the market for a new wing bag.  It's a 74" one-piece wing.  Any
suggestions on brands?  I like the "Wing-Tote" brand, and they list a 74"
bag, but I don't know if that's an external dimension or an internal
dimension.  Do any of you own one?  Thanks in advance for the help.

 

T. Brown

 


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


  _____  


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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From tncbrown at cebridge.net  Fri Sep  5 17:54:10 2008
From: tncbrown at cebridge.net (T&C Brown)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 01:54:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
In-Reply-To: <EAE9E193F1BC44A1A6005AB9CF062992@astafford>
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC><87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC><86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031><D92351B7D3954CA8BA5FDD293758C5BD@astafford><27ED16C16F5C49EEA359219C4F3F9CB7@TPC><9CFEFAE356084103BC9BE1827E297904@astafford><018801c90fbe$6570e470$6501a8c0@VALUEDCB7D4C82>
	<EAE9E193F1BC44A1A6005AB9CF062992@astafford>
Message-ID: <CFC7CB06122F4BB39EA3380B17A189D6@TPC>

Arch,

 

Shoot me a pic of them when you can..or maybe Caroline could send a pic to
you / us.  Hint-hint.  :-)

 

T-

 

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Archie
Stafford
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 8:43 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Bill,

 

They should be 60.00 for the stab set, and 85.00 for the wing bags.145.00
for both.

 

Arch

 

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bill
Pritchett
Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2008 4:18 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Arch - I'm sure she will keep templates for the BM...   I'll take two sets -
One for me, and one for Mark.  Mine will keep the dust off in the workshop
and Atwood's will protect it on the way to a contest!

Glad to hear you're on the way home - hope to see you soon.

Pritch

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Archie <mailto:astafford at swtexas.net>  Stafford 

To: 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 10:05 PM

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

T-,

 

I just had her make up a whole set of wing and tail bags for my Black Magic.
The is in the process of making the tail bags right now and I should have
them next week.  She is so easy to work with.

 

Arch

 

 


  _____  


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of T&C Brown
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 5:00 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Thx Arch.I have her on the list to consider as well.  I like her bags.
(insert joke here :-))  I have a set for my 40% Carden.

 

T-

 


  _____  


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Archie
Stafford
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 8:53 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

T.

 

I personally use all Wingbags by Caroline stuff from Carden.  They are hard
to beat and have about every size known to man.and any they don't they will
make for you for the same price as the similarly sized bags.

 

Arch

 

 


  _____  


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of MKMSG
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 4:31 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

There are several sources.  I like the wing bags from Adrian Wong.  Here's
the URL:

 

http://www.chingbergh.com/products.html

 

Mike

----- Original Message ----- 

From: T <mailto:tncbrown at cebridge.net> &C Brown 

To: 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 7:40 PM

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Guys,

 

I'm in the market for a new wing bag.  It's a 74" one-piece wing.  Any
suggestions on brands?  I like the "Wing-Tote" brand, and they list a 74"
bag, but I don't know if that's an external dimension or an internal
dimension.  Do any of you own one?  Thanks in advance for the help.

 

T. Brown

 


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From tncbrown at cebridge.net  Fri Sep  5 17:58:22 2008
From: tncbrown at cebridge.net (T&C Brown)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 01:58:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
In-Reply-To: <8CADD7363366E1A-171C-9F3@MBLK-M15.sysops.aol.com>
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC><87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC>
	<8CADD7363366E1A-171C-9F3@MBLK-M15.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <622D948EB9644F419D7B26FB78CE0718@TPC>

Thx Jon.

 

T-

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Jon Lowe
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 8:35 AM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

I've used these.  Good quality, inexpensive, and readily available.

http://www.hobbywarehouse.com/Products/Wing-Tote-Field-Storage/WGT106-Wing-T
ote-Single-TOTEs-for-1Piece-Wings-WGT106

 

Jon Lowe

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: T&C Brown <tncbrown at cebridge.net>
To: 'General pattern discussion' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 7:40 pm
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

Guys,

 

I'm in the market for a new wing bag.  It's a 74" one-piece wing.  Any
suggestions on brands?  I like the "Wing-Tote" brand, and they list a 74"
bag, but I don't know if that's an external dimension or an internal
dimension.  Do any of you own one?  Thanks in advance for the help.

 

T. Brown

 

_______________________________________________






NSRCA-discussion mailing list






 <mailto:NSRCA-%20%20discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org






 <http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion>
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion






  _____  


 <http://mapquest.com/toolbar?ncid=mpqmap00050000000010> Get the MapQuest
Toolbar. Directions, Traffic, Gas Prices & More! 

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From astafford at swtexas.net  Fri Sep  5 18:05:50 2008
From: astafford at swtexas.net (Archie Stafford)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 02:05:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag
In-Reply-To: <CFC7CB06122F4BB39EA3380B17A189D6@TPC>
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC><87D1AEA845C94DBCA01E6A28780355B3@TPC><86EC8D1665E344F9B7C7FC5320422F1D@usera1262bf031><D92351B7D3954CA8BA5FDD293758C5BD@astafford><27ED16C16F5C49EEA359219C4F3F9CB7@TPC><9CFEFAE356084103BC9BE1827E297904@astafford><018801c90fbe$6570e470$6501a8c0@VALUEDCB7D4C82><EAE9E193F1BC44A1A6005AB9CF062992@astafford>
	<CFC7CB06122F4BB39EA3380B17A189D6@TPC>
Message-ID: <C733BA908F04497F8067E9B3677F37BE@astafford>

I can do that when I get home..Caroline is making them this week and said
she should have them next week.  She was packing kits early this week.  I
should have them sometime next week.  I don't get home til Saturday anyway.
The wing set looks exactly like the 40% size that I have on my Extra.  I
already have a wing set I've been using for over a year now.  The tail set
will fit just like the tail covers for their larger stuff.Made of the same
stuff, exactly the same only smaller.

 

 

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of T&C Brown
Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2008 4:54 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Arch,

 

Shoot me a pic of them when you can..or maybe Caroline could send a pic to
you / us.  Hint-hint.  :-)

 

T-

 

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Archie
Stafford
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 8:43 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Bill,

 

They should be 60.00 for the stab set, and 85.00 for the wing bags.145.00
for both.

 

Arch

 

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Bill
Pritchett
Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2008 4:18 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Arch - I'm sure she will keep templates for the BM...   I'll take two sets -
One for me, and one for Mark.  Mine will keep the dust off in the workshop
and Atwood's will protect it on the way to a contest!

Glad to hear you're on the way home - hope to see you soon.

Pritch

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Archie <mailto:astafford at swtexas.net>  Stafford 

To: 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 10:05 PM

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

T-,

 

I just had her make up a whole set of wing and tail bags for my Black Magic.
The is in the process of making the tail bags right now and I should have
them next week.  She is so easy to work with.

 

Arch

 

 


  _____  


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of T&C Brown
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 5:00 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Thx Arch.I have her on the list to consider as well.  I like her bags.
(insert joke here :-))  I have a set for my 40% Carden.

 

T-

 


  _____  


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Archie
Stafford
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 8:53 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

T.

 

I personally use all Wingbags by Caroline stuff from Carden.  They are hard
to beat and have about every size known to man.and any they don't they will
make for you for the same price as the similarly sized bags.

 

Arch

 

 


  _____  


From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of MKMSG
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 4:31 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

There are several sources.  I like the wing bags from Adrian Wong.  Here's
the URL:

 

http://www.chingbergh.com/products.html

 

Mike

----- Original Message ----- 

From: T <mailto:tncbrown at cebridge.net> &C Brown 

To: 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 7:40 PM

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Wing Bag

 

Guys,

 

I'm in the market for a new wing bag.  It's a 74" one-piece wing.  Any
suggestions on brands?  I like the "Wing-Tote" brand, and they list a 74"
bag, but I don't know if that's an external dimension or an internal
dimension.  Do any of you own one?  Thanks in advance for the help.

 

T. Brown

 


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From khoard at gmail.com  Fri Sep  5 18:22:17 2008
From: khoard at gmail.com (Keith Hoard)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 02:22:17 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] A123 Batteries?
In-Reply-To: <48C1D92D.4020302@hbcomm.net>
References: <48C1D92D.4020302@hbcomm.net>
Message-ID: <6792ef120809051922u3b9e7d7cr6e4d5867ff8a573c@mail.gmail.com>

I love 'em.  I buy the 2-cell 1100 Mah VPX packs from Wal-Mart and strip out
the cells.

Then I wire them up with 20-gauge Futaba connector, using the white wire for
the Node-1 tap.  I charge them after every flight with the FMA CellPro
charger.

On my 50cc airplane, I'm using two packs unregulated in parallel plugged
directly into the 6014 receiver, and another pack unregulated on the
igntion.

On my pattern plane, I'm using one pack unregulated - no problems
whatsoever.

On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 8:13 PM, Joe Dunnaway <dunnaway at hbcomm.net> wrote:

>   Anyone using A123 cells for your receiver batteries?   Any problems,
>  advice or hints?  What chargers?
>
> Thanks
> Joe Dunnaway
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>



-- 

Keith Hoard
Collierville, TN
khoard at gmail.com
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From GAA at owt.com  Fri Sep  5 18:27:06 2008
From: GAA at owt.com (Gordon Anderson)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 02:27:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers
In-Reply-To: <BAY119-W255B9E368CCFCC3F1ABF5DCC580@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <200809060226.m862Qscp009401@smtp.owt.com>

Thanks Rex and Derek for the comments on my Maestro.
 
The Maestro is more than a battery testing device but that is its main function
. It does test the battery with no load and with a user programmable load, it
then calculates and displays the packs internal resistance. It has programmable
alarms points and two difference voltage profiles you can configure.
The Maestro also measures the pulse width going to a servo from your receiver,
it will drive your servo and you can use it as a data logger.
There are lots of good options available for battery testing, I think the most
important thing is to pay attentions to your flight packs condition with some
kind of load applied to your pack when you test its voltage.
If your interested in the technical details its completely "open source", all
the technical details including a technical description,  schematics and source
code on on m web site. I designed and built this as my entry in a Circuit Cellar
design contest sponsored by Atmel. 
 
--Gordon, www.mstart2k.com

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Rex
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 3:34 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers


I have the very first one ever made!   I'm Special!  lol
I've been using it for about four years...  It is a very cool tool.
I urge anyone interested to browse through the manual.  It's a really
good "at the field" diagnostic tool!  I check my gimbals all the time by 
simply plugging into the appropriate channel in the receiver and moving the
stick...  Watch the reading on the screen and presto chango, I know if things 
are okay or not!  It is programmed for many different uses and simple to use...
Single button operation.  It doesn't get any easier than that!
 
 
Rex








  _____  




il.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers




I do have the serial interface but haven't needed to use it since Gordon
programmed mine with what I needed at the time I purchased it.  Changing
parameters in the interface is very straightforward.


On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 11:50 AM, Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net> wrote:


That really looks like a cool device. 
 
Do you have the serial interface as well? If so how easy is the configuration?

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Derek  <mailto:derekkoopowitz at gmail.com> Koopowitz 
To: General pattern  <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> discussion 
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 2:23 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Advice on battery checkers

I would go with Gordon Anderson's Maestro - I've been using it for a while now
and love it.  I check my batteries every flight but unfortunately that isn't a
guarantee against battery failure either.  :-(  I had my ProLine go in after I
checked the 4 cell Nicad (5.56v and under load of 5.01v).  
 
Gordon's website is:
 
http://www.mstar2k.com/


On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 10:56 AM, Gray E Fowler <gfowler at raytheon.com> wrote:



Since it appears my new plane crash was due to a "new" battery failure or some
kind of high drain, it is time to get back into the habit of checking the
stinkin' batteries before every flight. This is a habit I had early on, but 8
years in pattern and no battery problems made me lazy. I used to have that
cheapo $19.95 hobbico Expanded Volatge reader or some such, but what is out
there that I really should be using for my new $2000+ airplane?   Please let me
know what you guys think! 




Gray Fowler
Senior Principal Chemical Engineer
Radomes and Specialty Apertures
Technical Staff Composites Engineering
Raytheon
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



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From jlkonn at hotmail.com  Sat Sep  6 03:35:50 2008
From: jlkonn at hotmail.com (John Konneker)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 11:35:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] A123 Batteries?
In-Reply-To: <6792ef120809051922u3b9e7d7cr6e4d5867ff8a573c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <48C1D92D.4020302@hbcomm.net>
	<6792ef120809051922u3b9e7d7cr6e4d5867ff8a573c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BLU106-W51F91AC469BD5AB28346BECD5B0@phx.gbl>


Hi Keith,
I bought one of the WalMart VPX packs to experiment with.
I followed the instructions on Bob Pastorello's website for it's disassembly and adaptation.
It handled the high, 4C, charge and discharge rates as advertised but there were two things that made me hesitate to 
use the pack in a plane...might have been just my pack or how I originally handled it.
1- When discharging the pack in cycle mode on my BC-6 the two cells would go way out of balance.  The BC-6 and my CellPro 4s would 
always bring them back in to balance when balance charging, I had wired a balance plug in to it, but this concerned me.  Like I said it could have been my particular pack.
2- When they say the capacity is 1,000 or 1,100 mah, whatever, they aren't kidding.  As the BC-6 would near this value when cycling the
pack voltage would drop so fast you could hardly read the numbers.  It was like it hit the wall and fell off a cliff.  This also concerned me.
 
I would be interested if other folks have had similar experience with the VPX packs.  Like I said it could have been something I did or the 
individual pack I got.  I know the A123's offer great potential.  In fact there was a Sportsman pilot here in D5 at the St Louis contest that
flew an A123 powered Fliton plane.  I plane to write it up in my next column but you can see and read about him now on Chris Moon's new
electric webpage.
JLK



Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 21:22:15 -0500From: khoard at gmail.comTo: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgSubject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] A123 Batteries?
I love 'em.  I buy the 2-cell 1100 Mah VPX packs from Wal-Mart and strip out the cells.  Then I wire them up with 20-gauge Futaba connector, using the white wire for the Node-1 tap.  I charge them after every flight with the FMA CellPro charger.On my 50cc airplane, I'm using two packs unregulated in parallel plugged directly into the 6014 receiver, and another pack unregulated on the igntion.  On my pattern plane, I'm using one pack unregulated - no problems whatsoever.
On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 8:13 PM, Joe Dunnaway <dunnaway at hbcomm.net> wrote:
  Anyone using A123 cells for your receiver batteries?   Any problems,  advice or hints?  What chargers?  ThanksJoe Dunnaway_______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion-- Keith HoardCollierville, TNkhoard at gmail.com
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From khoard at gmail.com  Sat Sep  6 06:38:39 2008
From: khoard at gmail.com (Keith Hoard)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 14:38:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] A123 Batteries?
In-Reply-To: <BLU106-W51F91AC469BD5AB28346BECD5B0@phx.gbl>
References: <48C1D92D.4020302@hbcomm.net>
	<6792ef120809051922u3b9e7d7cr6e4d5867ff8a573c@mail.gmail.com>
	<BLU106-W51F91AC469BD5AB28346BECD5B0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <6792ef120809060738h5f6adcc1k5ccd445d0220f86e@mail.gmail.com>

John,

I have done ALOT of testing of the A123 batteries, both the 2300 and 1100
Mah versions.  The first thing you need to make sure is that they have the
"A123" label on the side.  The "LiFe" batteries (Iron-Corps) batteries are
NOT the same batteries and have a higher internal resistance.

When I tested the A123's, I charge them up and discharge them on my West
Mountain CBA.  I have discharged the 2300's at 0.5 Amps, then15 Amps, then
another dishcarge at 0.5 Amps and they showed no loss of capacity between
the two .5 Amp discharges - no rest in between.  Max temp during the 15A
discharge was 109F.  Try that with a 2300 Mah LiPo.  I can e-mail you copies
of the CBA discharges if you want. . . I also similarly abused the 1100 Mah
versions with the same results (except I used 4 Amps continuous, not sure
how long the 20 gauge wire or Futaba connector would last at 15Amps)

At what point did you measure the imbalance?  If it was at the end of the
discharge, then yes, they will go out of balance there.  But when you start
charging them, they will quickly come back into balance.  The great thing
about these batteries is that you can run them flat over and over and all
you have to do is hook up the juice to them and they will charge right up.
If you're still concerned I can record a few charge cycles on my 10S charger
and it will show you how the cells go out of balance at the end of their
discharge and then back into balance soon into the charge cycle.

Yes, the A123's drop right off a cliff if you run them all the way out to
their capacity.  This requires different handling than previous cell
chemistries.

First of all, you cannot "fuel gauge" these batteries the way we did with
the other chemistries.  The reason for this is also one of the great
strengths of these batteries.  The A123 cells hold their voltage under heavy
amperage, so getting a good number would require heavy gauge wire and a
Deans connector.  So obviously, the key with these batteries is to never get
close to the cliff.

One solution is what Fromeco did, sell you another switch that measures how
many Mah you have taken out of the battery since your last charge.  However,
I use a much simpler and cheaper method.  I plug in my FMA 4S charger at
soon as I park my plane and it is finished topping off the battery before
I'm done filling the fuel tank.  I then mentally note how much charge was
put back in - right at 120 Mah each flight, so I *could* go 4-5 flights
between charges, but why?  It is just as easy to top off the battery after
each flight.


On Sat, Sep 6, 2008 at 6:35 AM, John Konneker <jlkonn at hotmail.com> wrote:

>  Hi Keith,
> I bought one of the WalMart VPX packs to experiment with.
> I followed the instructions on Bob Pastorello's website for it's
> disassembly and adaptation.
> It handled the high, 4C, charge and discharge rates as advertised but there
> were two things that made me hesitate to
> use the pack in a plane...might have been just my pack or how I originally
> handled it.
> 1- When discharging the pack in cycle mode on my BC-6 the two cells would
> go way out of balance.  The BC-6 and my CellPro 4s would
> always bring them back in to balance when balance charging, I had wired a
> balance plug in to it, but this concerned me.  Like I said it could have
> been my particular pack.
> 2- When they say the capacity is 1,000 or 1,100 mah, whatever, they aren't
> kidding.  As the BC-6 would near this value when cycling the
> pack voltage would drop so fast you could hardly read the numbers.  It was
> like it hit the wall and fell off a cliff.  This also concerned me.
>
> I would be interested if other folks have had similar experience with the
> VPX packs.  Like I said it could have been something I did or the
> individual pack I got.  I know the A123's offer great potential.  In fact
> there was a Sportsman pilot here in D5 at the St Louis contest that
> flew an A123 powered Fliton plane.  I plane to write it up in my next
> column but you can see and read about him now on Chris Moon's new
> electric webpage.
> JLK
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 21:22:15 -0500
> From: khoard at gmail.com
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] A123 Batteries?
>
>
>
> I love 'em.  I buy the 2-cell 1100 Mah VPX packs from Wal-Mart and strip
> out the cells.
>
> Then I wire them up with 20-gauge Futaba connector, using the white wire
> for the Node-1 tap.  I charge them after every flight with the FMA CellPro
> charger.
>
> On my 50cc airplane, I'm using two packs unregulated in parallel plugged
> directly into the 6014 receiver, and another pack unregulated on the
> igntion.
>
> On my pattern plane, I'm using one pack unregulated - no problems
> whatsoever.
>
> On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 8:13 PM, Joe Dunnaway <dunnaway at hbcomm.net> wrote:
>
>   Anyone using A123 cells for your receiver batteries?   Any problems,
>  advice or hints?  What chargers?
>
> Thanks
> Joe Dunnaway
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Keith Hoard
> Collierville, TN
> khoard at gmail.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>



-- 

Keith Hoard
Collierville, TN
khoard at gmail.com
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From burtona at atmc.net  Sat Sep  6 08:27:09 2008
From: burtona at atmc.net (Dave Burton)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 16:27:09 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] A123 Batteries?
In-Reply-To: <6792ef120809060738h5f6adcc1k5ccd445d0220f86e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <48C1D92D.4020302@hbcomm.net>	<6792ef120809051922u3b9e7d7cr6e4d5867ff8a573c@mail.gmail.com>	<BLU106-W51F91AC469BD5AB28346BECD5B0@phx.gbl>
	<6792ef120809060738h5f6adcc1k5ccd445d0220f86e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <003601c9103d$69e11d20$3da35760$@net>

Have any tried A123 packs from ElectroDynamics?

https://electrodynam.com/rc/

Dave Burton

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Keith Hoard
Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2008 10:39 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] A123 Batteries?

 

John,

I have done ALOT of testing of the A123 batteries, both the 2300 and 1100 Mah versions.  The first thing you need to make sure is that they have the "A123" label on the side.  The "LiFe" batteries (Iron-Corps) batteries are NOT the same batteries and have a higher internal resistance.

When I tested the A123's, I charge them up and discharge them on my West Mountain CBA.  I have discharged the 2300's at 0.5 Amps, then15 Amps, then another dishcarge at 0.5 Amps and they showed no loss of capacity between the two .5 Amp discharges - no rest in between.  Max temp during the 15A discharge was 109F.  Try that with a 2300 Mah LiPo.  I can e-mail you copies of the CBA discharges if you want. . . I also similarly abused the 1100 Mah versions with the same results (except I used 4 Amps continuous, not sure how long the 20 gauge wire or Futaba connector would last at 15Amps)

At what point did you measure the imbalance?  If it was at the end of the discharge, then yes, they will go out of balance there.  But when you start charging them, they will quickly come back into balance.  The great thing about these batteries is that you can run them flat over and over and all you have to do is hook up the juice to them and they will charge right up.  If you're still concerned I can record a few charge cycles on my 10S charger and it will show you how the cells go out of balance at the end of their discharge and then back into balance soon into the charge cycle.

Yes, the A123's drop right off a cliff if you run them all the way out to their capacity.  This requires different handling than previous cell chemistries.  

First of all, you cannot "fuel gauge" these batteries the way we did with the other chemistries.  The reason for this is also one of the great strengths of these batteries.  The A123 cells hold their voltage under heavy amperage, so getting a good number would require heavy gauge wire and a Deans connector.  So obviously, the key with these batteries is to never get close to the cliff.

One solution is what Fromeco did, sell you another switch that measures how many Mah you have taken out of the battery since your last charge.  However, I use a much simpler and cheaper method.  I plug in my FMA 4S charger at soon as I park my plane and it is finished topping off the battery before I'm done filling the fuel tank.  I then mentally note how much charge was put back in - right at 120 Mah each flight, so I could go 4-5 flights between charges, but why?  It is just as easy to top off the battery after each flight.



On Sat, Sep 6, 2008 at 6:35 AM, John Konneker <jlkonn at hotmail.com> wrote:

Hi Keith,
I bought one of the WalMart VPX packs to experiment with.
I followed the instructions on Bob Pastorello's website for it's disassembly and adaptation.
It handled the high, 4C, charge and discharge rates as advertised but there were two things that made me hesitate to 
use the pack in a plane...might have been just my pack or how I originally handled it.
1- When discharging the pack in cycle mode on my BC-6 the two cells would go way out of balance.  The BC-6 and my CellPro 4s would 
always bring them back in to balance when balance charging, I had wired a balance plug in to it, but this concerned me.  Like I said it could have been my particular pack.
2- When they say the capacity is 1,000 or 1,100 mah, whatever, they aren't kidding.  As the BC-6 would near this value when cycling the
pack voltage would drop so fast you could hardly read the numbers.  It was like it hit the wall and fell off a cliff.  This also concerned me.
 
I would be interested if other folks have had similar experience with the VPX packs.  Like I said it could have been something I did or the 
individual pack I got.  I know the A123's offer great potential.  In fact there was a Sportsman pilot here in D5 at the St Louis contest that
flew an A123 powered Fliton plane.  I plane to write it up in my next column but you can see and read about him now on Chris Moon's new
electric webpage.
JLK



  _____  


Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2008 21:22:15 -0500
From: khoard at gmail.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] A123 Batteries?





I love 'em.  I buy the 2-cell 1100 Mah VPX packs from Wal-Mart and strip out the cells.  

Then I wire them up with 20-gauge Futaba connector, using the white wire for the Node-1 tap.  I charge them after every flight with the FMA CellPro charger.

On my 50cc airplane, I'm using two packs unregulated in parallel plugged directly into the 6014 receiver, and another pack unregulated on the igntion.  

On my pattern plane, I'm using one pack unregulated - no problems whatsoever.

On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 8:13 PM, Joe Dunnaway <dunnaway at hbcomm.net> wrote:

  Anyone using A123 cells for your receiver batteries?   Any problems,  advice or hints?  What chargers?  

Thanks
Joe Dunnaway
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion




-- 

Keith Hoard
Collierville, TN
khoard at gmail.com




_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion




-- 

Keith Hoard
Collierville, TN
khoard at gmail.com



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From jlkonn at hotmail.com  Sat Sep  6 14:24:29 2008
From: jlkonn at hotmail.com (John Konneker)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 22:24:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] PIC products
Message-ID: <BLU106-W16A610D7E4B4FBA8BE499DCD5B0@phx.gbl>


Does PIC, Penn International Chemicals, still exist?
I did a Google and nothing came up.
What I am looking for specifically is a product they made called "Slicker".  The purpose of it is to prevent sticking something together that one doesn't want stuck together when using CA glues. Not to be confused with the solvents that are intended to disolve the glue or a glue joint.
Anyone know of a such a product?
Thanks!
JLK
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From scott at rcfoamy.com  Sat Sep  6 14:56:07 2008
From: scott at rcfoamy.com (scott anderson)
Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2008 22:56:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] PIC products
In-Reply-To: <BLU106-W16A610D7E4B4FBA8BE499DCD5B0@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU106-W16A610D7E4B4FBA8BE499DCD5B0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <F336B2CDA6A7423FA5E1522EED0E32EE@ScottPC>

Here is a link for some of those products

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/cm/handprotectants.html

scott529
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: John Konneker 
  To: Discussion List 
  Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2008 6:24 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] PIC products


  Does PIC, Penn International Chemicals, still exist?
  I did a Google and nothing came up.
  What I am looking for specifically is a product they made called "Slicker".  The purpose of it is to prevent sticking something together that one doesn't want stuck together when using CA glues. Not to be confused with the solvents that are intended to disolve the glue or a glue joint.
  Anyone know of a such a product?
  Thanks!
  JLK




------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jlkonn at hotmail.com  Sat Sep  6 18:53:38 2008
From: jlkonn at hotmail.com (John Konneker)
Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2008 02:53:38 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] PIC products
In-Reply-To: <F336B2CDA6A7423FA5E1522EED0E32EE@ScottPC>
References: <BLU106-W16A610D7E4B4FBA8BE499DCD5B0@phx.gbl>
	<F336B2CDA6A7423FA5E1522EED0E32EE@ScottPC>
Message-ID: <BLU106-W55E6DE46EA154B0663D5F5CD5A0@phx.gbl>


Thanks Scott but that's not it.
This isn't meant to protect you hands but other areas of a component you are going to use CA on to prevent the CA from 
bonding to selected areas.
JLK



From: scott at rcfoamy.comTo: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgDate: Sat, 6 Sep 2008 18:55:30 -0400Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] PIC products



Here is a link for some of those products
 
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/cm/handprotectants.html
 
scott529

----- Original Message ----- 
From: John Konneker 
To: Discussion List 
Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2008 6:24 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] PIC products
Does PIC, Penn International Chemicals, still exist?I did a Google and nothing came up.What I am looking for specifically is a product they made called "Slicker".  The purpose of it is to prevent sticking something together that one doesn't want stuck together when using CA glues. Not to be confused with the solvents that are intended to disolve the glue or a glue joint.Anyone know of a such a product?Thanks!JLK



_______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Sat Sep  6 18:59:23 2008
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2008 02:59:23 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] PIC products
In-Reply-To: <BLU106-W16A610D7E4B4FBA8BE499DCD5B0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <0347470438A64CE8A32CDE509F92CF44@jaysdesktop>

Vaseline?

 

Jay Marshall 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of John Konneker
Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2008 6:24 PM
To: Discussion List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] PIC products

 

Does PIC, Penn International Chemicals, still exist?
I did a Google and nothing came up.
What I am looking for specifically is a product they made called "Slicker".
The purpose of it is to prevent sticking something together that one doesn't
want stuck together when using CA glues. Not to be confused with the
solvents that are intended to disolve the glue or a glue joint.
Anyone know of a such a product?
Thanks!
JLK

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From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Sun Sep  7 01:58:26 2008
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2008 09:58:26 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Charger for sale
Message-ID: <357897.52140.qm@web51005.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

?I'm selling this?TP 1010 charger?for Dave Snow. If intersested see this link on RCG
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=919828#post10492719
?Thanks, Mike Mueller
?


      
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From kennedybryan at bellsouth.net  Sun Sep  7 06:18:32 2008
From: kennedybryan at bellsouth.net (Bryan Kennedy)
Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2008 14:18:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 40th Annual Rocket City Pattern Contest
	(Huntsville, AL) D3
Message-ID: <2C1EB58E00014FC8BA387BF242DAE9EC@BryanKennedyPC>

One week away and looks like we will have a good turn out,
pre-registration is growing. Please make plans to attend. This is a
great facility and always a great contest. Looking forward to seeing
everyone.
 
Bryan
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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Sun Sep  7 14:06:00 2008
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2008 22:06:00 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
In-Reply-To: <2C1EB58E00014FC8BA387BF242DAE9EC@BryanKennedyPC>
Message-ID: <812486.27341.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Hello everyone,
I have decided that my next pattern plane / build will be electric and I am doing my preliminary research before starting to buy equipment (motor, ESC, batteries, prop, E-motor mount) and could really use some help. 

My goal for my first foray into electrics is to put together proven reliable equipment that works and performs well as complimentary components. I don't know as much about electrics as I will need to, but I am sure that I will be learning a lot as I go along. My expectations are that I will be using a Lipo 10S pack of at least 5000 mah (will this be enough?). I have often seen that people use the Hacker C50 motors but also see a lot of other engines by other manufacturers. 

Requirements:
1. I do not want to use a gear box so I will need a motor capable of direct drive
2. I want equipment where the components will all work well together  
3. weight is always an issue
4. price is a consideration but third behind reliability and performance

I will be flying advanced with the new airplane which will be purpose built as an electric. If there is a website or other source of useful information on electrics, I would like that as well. 

Thanks in advance
Anthony 


From adriancwong at earthlink.net  Sun Sep  7 14:26:38 2008
From: adriancwong at earthlink.net (adriancwong at earthlink.net)
Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2008 22:26:38 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
Message-ID: <28275447.1220826395414.JavaMail.root@elwamui-mouette.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Try Chris Moon's website - http://www.electric-f3a.com/

-----Original Message-----
>From: Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
>Sent: Sep 7, 2008 6:05 PM
>To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
>
>Hello everyone,
>I have decided that my next pattern plane / build will be electric and I am doing my preliminary research before starting to buy equipment (motor, ESC, batteries, prop, E-motor mount) and could really use some help. 
>
>My goal for my first foray into electrics is to put together proven reliable equipment that works and performs well as complimentary components. I don't know as much about electrics as I will need to, but I am sure that I will be learning a lot as I go along. My expectations are that I will be using a Lipo 10S pack of at least 5000 mah (will this be enough?). I have often seen that people use the Hacker C50 motors but also see a lot of other engines by other manufacturers. 
>
>Requirements:
>1. I do not want to use a gear box so I will need a motor capable of direct drive
>2. I want equipment where the components will all work well together  
>3. weight is always an issue
>4. price is a consideration but third behind reliability and performance
>
>I will be flying advanced with the new airplane which will be purpose built as an electric. If there is a website or other source of useful information on electrics, I would like that as well. 
>
>Thanks in advance
>Anthony 
>
>_______________________________________________
>NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Sun Sep  7 14:30:55 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2008 22:30:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
In-Reply-To: <812486.27341.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20080907173052.FT40V.338195.root@Web02>

Anthony,

I've used the Axi 5330 F3A and the Dualsky 11T  with very good results from both.  I think the AXI is a little stronger, but both are plenty powerful. I usually run them with a 20X15 APC prop. The CC85 and Jeti 99 spin controllers are both very good and reliable.  I prefer the Spin's myself, but I've used both.  

For batteries, I prefer the Flightpower 5350 F3A packs....these have more capacity for their weight than the higher discharge capacity packs -  You don't need the "C" rating, you need the "mah" rating- my perspective anyway.  The True battery 5000 ma packs are OK for practice, but their availablity is spotty and they seem to have differing dimensions between different "lots".  

There is a new website the has been started to collate various electric combo's-- I'm sure someone here will give the url shortly.

G
---- Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net> wrote: 

=============
Hello everyone,
I have decided that my next pattern plane / build will be electric and I am doing my preliminary research before starting to buy equipment (motor, ESC, batteries, prop, E-motor mount) and could really use some help. 

My goal for my first foray into electrics is to put together proven reliable equipment that works and performs well as complimentary components. I don't know as much about electrics as I will need to, but I am sure that I will be learning a lot as I go along. My expectations are that I will be using a Lipo 10S pack of at least 5000 mah (will this be enough?). I have often seen that people use the Hacker C50 motors but also see a lot of other engines by other manufacturers. 

Requirements:
1. I do not want to use a gear box so I will need a motor capable of direct drive
2. I want equipment where the components will all work well together  
3. weight is always an issue
4. price is a consideration but third behind reliability and performance

I will be flying advanced with the new airplane which will be purpose built as an electric. If there is a website or other source of useful information on electrics, I would like that as well. 

Thanks in advance
Anthony 

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From lagrue at hotmail.com  Sun Sep  7 14:55:39 2008
From: lagrue at hotmail.com (JEREMY CHINN)
Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2008 22:55:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
In-Reply-To: <20080907173052.FT40V.338195.root@Web02>
References: <812486.27341.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<20080907173052.FT40V.338195.root@Web02>
Message-ID: <BLU141-W328DA18492264462ACC4BAC75A0@phx.gbl>


Chris Moon took the time to put up the new site 
 
http://www.electric-f3a.com/
 
Lots of great information to be had there. > Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2008 17:30:52 -0500> From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment> > Anthony,> > I've used the Axi 5330 F3A and the Dualsky 11T with very good results from both. I think the AXI is a little stronger, but both are plenty powerful. I usually run them with a 20X15 APC prop. The CC85 and Jeti 99 spin controllers are both very good and reliable. I prefer the Spin's myself, but I've used both. > > For batteries, I prefer the Flightpower 5350 F3A packs....these have more capacity for their weight than the higher discharge capacity packs - You don't need the "C" rating, you need the "mah" rating- my perspective anyway. The True battery 5000 ma packs are OK for practice, but their availablity is spotty and they seem to have differing dimensions between different "lots". > > There is a new website the has been started to collate various electric combo's-- I'm sure someone here will give the url shortly.> > G> ---- Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net> wrote: > > =============> Hello everyone,> I have decided that my next pattern plane / build will be electric and I am doing my preliminary research before starting to buy equipment (motor, ESC, batteries, prop, E-motor mount) and could really use some help. > > My goal for my first foray into electrics is to put together proven reliable equipment that works and performs well as complimentary components. I don't know as much about electrics as I will need to, but I am sure that I will be learning a lot as I go along. My expectations are that I will be using a Lipo 10S pack of at least 5000 mah (will this be enough?). I have often seen that people use the Hacker C50 motors but also see a lot of other engines by other manufacturers. > > Requirements:> 1. I do not want to use a gear box so I will need a motor capable of direct drive> 2. I want equipment where the components will all work well together > 3. weight is always an issue> 4. price is a consideration but third behind reliability and performance> > I will be flying advanced with the new airplane which will be purpose built as an electric. If there is a website or other source of useful information on electrics, I would like that as well. > > Thanks in advance> Anthony > > _______________________________________________> NSRCA-discussion mailing list> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion> > _______________________________________________> NSRCA-discussion mailing list> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
_________________________________________________________________
Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows Live.
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From cjm767driver at hotmail.com  Sun Sep  7 15:37:47 2008
From: cjm767driver at hotmail.com (chris moon)
Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2008 23:37:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
Message-ID: <BLU137-W33C0BF04F2725D0E1ABDF8835A0@phx.gbl>


Anthony..

Here is the simple recipe for success.  Tried and well proven setup.

http://www.electric-f3a.com/Simple%20setup/Simple%20setup.htm

Chris

Anthony Abdullah wrote:
> Hello everyone,
> I have decided that my next pattern plane / build will be electric and I am doing my preliminary research before starting to buy equipment (motor, ESC, batteries, prop, E-motor mount) and could really use some help. 
>
> My goal for my first foray into electrics is to put together proven reliable equipment that works and performs well as complimentary components. I don't know as much about electrics as I will need to, but I am sure that I will be learning a lot as I go along. My expectations are that I will be using a Lipo 10S pack of at least 5000 mah (will this be enough?). I have often seen that people use the Hacker C50 motors but also see a lot of other engines by other manufacturers. 
>
> Requirements:
> 1. I do not want to use a gear box so I will need a motor capable of direct drive
> 2. I want equipment where the components will all work well together  
> 3. weight is always an issue
> 4. price is a consideration but third behind reliability and performance
>
> I will be flying advanced with the new airplane which will be purpose built as an electric. If there is a website or other source of useful information on electrics, I would like that as well. 
>
> Thanks in advance
> Anthony 
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>   


_________________________________________________________________
Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows Live.
http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008
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From kysung at comcast.net  Sun Sep  7 17:19:35 2008
From: kysung at comcast.net (Kevin Sung)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 01:19:35 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D7 Hollister Contest - Fuel for sale - CoolPower
	30% Heli
In-Reply-To: <BLU137-W33C0BF04F2725D0E1ABDF8835A0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BJEAJBECNFKIGONMBLJLGECDCAAA.kysung@comcast.net>

To anyone attending D7 Hollister contest,

I have 2 cases of CoolPower 30% heli fuel for sale @ $25.00 per gal.  If
interested, I can bring them to the contest.

Please contact me off list at:

kysung at comcast.net

Thank you,
Kevin
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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Sun Sep  7 18:03:59 2008
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 02:03:59 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
In-Reply-To: <BLU141-W328DA18492264462ACC4BAC75A0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <875584.27384.qm@web82107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I was looking at the site and noticed how quickly / few cycles it takes for lipo performance to start to degrade (20-30 cycles in some cases). Is the "premature" degradation on the site just a function of a small sample or does performance on average start to decrease in as few cycles?

What is the average number of cycles others are seeing with F3A lipo packs before they start to lose capacity?     


--- On Sun, 9/7/08, JEREMY CHINN <lagrue at hotmail.com> wrote:

> From: JEREMY CHINN <lagrue at hotmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Sunday, September 7, 2008, 6:55 PM
> Chris Moon took the time to put up the new site 
>  
> http://www.electric-f3a.com/
>  
> Lots of great information to be had there. > Date: Sun,
> 7 Sep 2008 17:30:52 -0500> From:
> glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net;
> nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> Subject: Re:
> [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended
> equipment> > Anthony,> > I've used the Axi
> 5330 F3A and the Dualsky 11T with very good results from
> both. I think the AXI is a little stronger, but both are
> plenty powerful. I usually run them with a 20X15 APC prop.
> The CC85 and Jeti 99 spin controllers are both very good and
> reliable. I prefer the Spin's myself, but I've used
> both. > > For batteries, I prefer the Flightpower 5350
> F3A packs....these have more capacity for their weight than
> the higher discharge capacity packs - You don't need the
> "C" rating, you need the "mah" rating-
> my perspective anyway. The True battery 5000 ma packs are OK
> for practice, but their availablity is spotty and they seem
> to have differing dimensions between different
> "lots". > > There is a new website the has
> been started to collate various electric combo's--
> I'm sure someone here will give the url shortly.>
> > G> ---- Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
> wrote: > > =============> Hello everyone,> I
> have decided that my next pattern plane / build will be
> electric and I am doing my preliminary research before
> starting to buy equipment (motor, ESC, batteries, prop,
> E-motor mount) and could really use some help. > > My
> goal for my first foray into electrics is to put together
> proven reliable equipment that works and performs well as
> complimentary components. I don't know as much about
> electrics as I will need to, but I am sure that I will be
> learning a lot as I go along. My expectations are that I
> will be using a Lipo 10S pack of at least 5000 mah (will
> this be enough?). I have often seen that people use the
> Hacker C50 motors but also see a lot of other engines by
> other manufacturers. > > Requirements:> 1. I do not
> want to use a gear box so I will need a motor capable of
> direct drive> 2. I want equipment where the components
> will all work well together > 3. weight is always an
> issue> 4. price is a consideration but third behind
> reliability and performance> > I will be flying
> advanced with the new airplane which will be purpose built
> as an electric. If there is a website or other source of
> useful information on electrics, I would like that as well.
> > > Thanks in advance> Anthony > >
> _______________________________________________>
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list>
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion>
> > _______________________________________________>
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list>
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows
> Live.
> http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008_______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From edvwhite at sbcglobal.net  Sun Sep  7 18:19:19 2008
From: edvwhite at sbcglobal.net (Ed White)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 02:19:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
In-Reply-To: <20080907173052.FT40V.338195.root@Web02>
Message-ID: <403032.36106.qm@web83315.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

So I've seen folks reference the Dualsky 11T and the 12T.? What are the pros/cons of each?

thanks,

Ed

--- On Sun, 9/7/08, glmiller3 at suddenlink.net <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> wrote:
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net, "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Sunday, September 7, 2008, 5:30 PM

Anthony,

I've used the Axi 5330 F3A and the Dualsky 11T  with very good results from
both.  I think the AXI is a little stronger, but both are plenty powerful. I
usually run them with a 20X15 APC prop. The CC85 and Jeti 99 spin controllers
are both very good and reliable.  I prefer the Spin's myself, but I've
used both.  

For batteries, I prefer the Flightpower 5350 F3A packs....these have more
capacity for their weight than the higher discharge capacity packs -  You
don't need the "C" rating, you need the "mah" rating- my
perspective anyway.  The True battery 5000 ma packs are OK for practice, but
their availablity is spotty and they seem to have differing dimensions between
different "lots".  

There is a new website the has been started to collate various electric
combo's-- I'm sure someone here will give the url shortly.

G
---- Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net> wrote: 

=============
Hello everyone,
I have decided that my next pattern plane / build will be electric and I am
doing my preliminary research before starting to buy equipment (motor, ESC,
batteries, prop, E-motor mount) and could really use some help. 

My goal for my first foray into electrics is to put together proven reliable
equipment that works and performs well as complimentary components. I don't
know as much about electrics as I will need to, but I am sure that I will be
learning a lot as I go along. My expectations are that I will be using a Lipo
10S pack of at least 5000 mah (will this be enough?). I have often seen that
people use the Hacker C50 motors but also see a lot of other engines by other
manufacturers. 

Requirements:
1. I do not want to use a gear box so I will need a motor capable of direct
drive
2. I want equipment where the components will all work well together  
3. weight is always an issue
4. price is a consideration but third behind reliability and performance

I will be flying advanced with the new airplane which will be purpose built as
an electric. If there is a website or other source of useful information on
electrics, I would like that as well. 

Thanks in advance
Anthony 

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From kysung at comcast.net  Sun Sep  7 20:25:37 2008
From: kysung at comcast.net (Kevin Sung)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 04:25:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D7 Hollister Contest - Fuel for sale -
	CoolPower30% Heli - Sold
In-Reply-To: <BJEAJBECNFKIGONMBLJLGECDCAAA.kysung@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <BJEAJBECNFKIGONMBLJLEECFCAAA.kysung@comcast.net>

Sold...

Thank you,
Kevin
  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Kevin Sung
  Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2008 6:19 PM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D7 Hollister Contest - Fuel for sale -
CoolPower30% Heli


  To anyone attending D7 Hollister contest,

  I have 2 cases of CoolPower 30% heli fuel for sale @ $25.00 per gal.  If
interested, I can bring them to the contest.

  Please contact me off list at:

  kysung at comcast.net

  Thank you,
  Kevin
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From cahochhalter at yahoo.com  Mon Sep  8 05:42:59 2008
From: cahochhalter at yahoo.com (Charles Hochhalter)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 13:42:59 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
In-Reply-To: <403032.36106.qm@web83315.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <444095.40665.qm@web83205.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

12T swings a larger dia lesser pitch. 21X13 or 22X12
11T swings the 20X15 well
?
It is the number of turns on the motor... KV is 210 vs 235 I believe.
?
Chuck

--- On Mon, 9/8/08, Ed White <edvwhite at sbcglobal.net> wrote:

From: Ed White <edvwhite at sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Monday, September 8, 2008, 2:19 AM






So I've seen folks reference the Dualsky 11T and the 12T.? What are the pros/cons of each?

thanks,

Ed

--- On Sun, 9/7/08, glmiller3 at suddenlink.net <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> wrote:

From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net, "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Sunday, September 7, 2008, 5:30 PM

Anthony,

I've used the Axi 5330 F3A and the Dualsky 11T  with very good results from
both.  I think the AXI is a little stronger, but both are plenty powerful. I
usually run them with a 20X15 APC prop. The CC85 and Jeti 99 spin
 controllers
are both very good and reliable.  I prefer the Spin's myself, but I've
used both.  

For batteries, I prefer the Flightpower 5350 F3A packs....these have more
capacity for their weight than the higher discharge capacity packs -  You
don't need the "C" rating, you need the "mah" rating- my
perspective anyway.  The True battery 5000 ma packs are OK for practice, but
their availablity is spotty and they seem to have differing dimensions between
different "lots".  

There is a new website the has been started to collate various electric
combo's-- I'm sure someone here will give the url shortly.

G
---- Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net> wrote: 

=============
Hello everyone,
I have decided that my next pattern plane / build will be electric and I am
doing my preliminary research before starting to buy equipment (motor, ESC,
batteries, prop, E-motor mount) and could really
 use some help. 

My goal for my first foray into electrics is to put together proven reliable
equipment that works and performs well as complimentary components. I don't
know as much about electrics as I will need to, but I am sure that I will be
learning a lot as I go along. My expectations are that I will be using a Lipo
10S pack of at least 5000 mah (will this be enough?). I have often seen that
people use the Hacker C50 motors but also see a lot of other engines by other
manufacturers. 

Requirements:
1. I do not want to use a gear box so I will need a motor capable of direct
drive
2. I want equipment where the components will all work well together  
3. weight is always an issue
4. price is a consideration but third behind reliability and performance

I will be flying advanced with the new airplane which will be purpose built as
an electric. If there is a website or other source of useful
 information on
electrics, I would like that as well. 

Thanks in advance
Anthony 

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Mon Sep  8 06:19:11 2008
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 14:19:11 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] YS 170 or Webra 160 for sale?
Message-ID: <73kku8$2ujp0@dmzms99901.na.baesystems.com>

Asking for a friend who has a 4C and 2C setup - does anyone have a YS
170 or Webra 160 they want to sell?

 

Thanks,

Jim

 

 

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From schale at optonline.net  Mon Sep  8 07:04:35 2008
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 15:04:35 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends
Message-ID: <48C53EFC.3090602@optonline.net>

Does anyone have a source for the 3 pin female data cable ends for the 
TP charger to balancer connection?
They have a habit of breaking usually right at the pin making it 
difficult to repair.  A prewired pigtail or double female extension that 
could be cut in half would allow easy repairs and hopefully cheaper than 
$10 to replace the cable each time it breaks.

Thanks,
Stuart C.


From love2flypattern at yahoo.com  Mon Sep  8 07:10:54 2008
From: love2flypattern at yahoo.com (Jarvis Johnson)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 15:10:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D7 Hollister Contest - Fuel for sale -
	CoolPower30% Heli - Sold
In-Reply-To: <BJEAJBECNFKIGONMBLJLEECFCAAA.kysung@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <514908.95305.qm@web52707.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Gone already

--- On Sun, 9/7/08, Kevin Sung <kysung at comcast.net> wrote:

From: Kevin Sung <kysung at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D7 Hollister Contest - Fuel for sale - CoolPower30% Heli - Sold
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Sunday, September 7, 2008, 9:25 PM



#yiv2021577493 .hmmessage P {
PADDING-RIGHT:0px;PADDING-LEFT:0px;PADDING-BOTTOM:0px;MARGIN:0px;PADDING-TOP:0px;}
#yiv2021577493 {
FONT-SIZE:10pt;FONT-FAMILY:Tahoma;}


Sold...
?
Thank you,
Kevin

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Kevin Sung
Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2008 6:19 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D7 Hollister Contest - Fuel for sale - CoolPower30% Heli


To anyone attending D7 Hollister contest,
?
I have 2 cases of CoolPower 30% heli fuel for sale @ $25.00 per gal.? If interested, I can bring them to the contest.
?
Please contact me off list at:
?
kysung at comcast.net
?
Thank you,
Kevin_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Mon Sep  8 07:15:25 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 15:15:25 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Motors 4-sale at NEAT
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNAENMCMAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

Just to let anyone know who might be going to the NEAT Fair my dad will have 2 Hacker motors (used) for sale there. 1-13XL (2007
Nats motor) and 1-14XL (approx 200 flights, last Worlds and this years motor) for sale. Look him up... From what I hear, he's
usually under the most colorful tent on the site...lol.

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.6.19/1659 - Release Date: 9/8/2008 7:01 AM



From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Mon Sep  8 07:25:23 2008
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Mark Atwood)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 15:25:23 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!
In-Reply-To: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNAENMCMAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <C4EABC0C.2E12C%atwoodm@paragon-inc.com>

Just wanted to extend a thank you to Rick Cillas and Wes Stafford (yeah,
that's Archie's Dad) for putting on a great contest in St. Clairsville, OH
(on the WV border) this weekend.  The weather was a challenge, but the event
was excellent, highlighted by great food both days!

This event location is fairly new, and is now on a brand new field that was
excellent for pattern flying.  We only had 13 people, which speaks to the
location relative to our district (eastern edge of D4).

It seems to me that there must be some flyers in the Western PA region, WV,
Western NY that would be pretty close to this contest and I would encourage
you to consider it for your 2009 calendar.  It would be nice to get some
cross district participation on our Eastern shores that rivals the D4-D5
participation we get on the western side of the district.

Anyhow, great event, and a job well done by Rick and Wes.  Thanks for all
the effort!!

-Mark


From cjm767driver at hotmail.com  Mon Sep  8 10:33:05 2008
From: cjm767driver at hotmail.com (chris moon)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 18:33:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
Message-ID: <BLU137-W5167F5E80CF69820E3EC2583550@phx.gbl>


Anthony.
Your question is exactly why I started the web site.  There is no single 
place to find the large amount of data that exists on battery and motor 
longevity and performance.  Everyone has their personal  data and 
experiences but unless you contact everyone flying electrics, you won't 
be able to get a large enough sample of data to draw valid conclusions.  
As far as batteries, I think you will find answers all over the board.  
I know of some who have only had good performance from a set of 
batteries for 20-30 cycles and others who have 200+ cycles on the same 
type of batteries.  What I am trying to do is see if the 20-30 cycles is 
the norm, or is the 200 correct, or is the average somewhere in the 
middle.  Only a large enough sample will tell, and hopefully that will 
happen. I know that many/most/ of the really low cycle life packs were 
caused by mfg defects and were subsequently replaced by the mfg. 
As far as the Flight Power F3A packs, the consensus is that they are 
really strong for maybe 50 flights, then degrade quickly and the average 
cycle life is probably 100 or less.  I consider a pack run out if it 
can't provide adequate power for  normal contest flight.  Not completely 
dead, just too weak for a contest flight.  For example, my Flight Power 
F3A pack has 110 cycles and I consider it too weak now for a contest 
flight.  On the other hand, I have 2 sets of TP 5300 ProLites with 150+ 
cycles each and fly them regularly with good performance still.
Remember that the user has ultimate control over how well things work 
over time.  We can all list people who could never get glow motor XYZ to 
run well while others have stellar performance over a long period of 
time.  Same for electrics.  Everyone will agree that there is a definite 
learning curve to electrics and the best way to ensure success at first 
is to copy a setup and charging regimen that has been used by others 
with success over time. 

Chris


Anthony Abdullah wrote:
> I was looking at the site and noticed how quickly / few cycles it takes for lipo performance to start to degrade (20-30 cycles in some cases). Is the "premature" degradation on the site just a function of a small sample or does performance on average start to decrease in as few cycles?
>
> What is the average number of cycles others are seeing with F3A lipo packs before they start to lose capacity?     
>
>
> --- On Sun, 9/7/08, JEREMY CHINN  wrote:
>
>   
>> From: JEREMY CHINN 
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
>> To: "General pattern discussion" 
>> Date: Sunday, September 7, 2008, 6:55 PM
>> Chris Moon took the time to put up the new site 
>>  
>> http://www.electric-f3a.com/
>>  
>> Lots of great information to be had there.> Date: Sun,
>> 7 Sep 2008 17:30:52 -0500> From:
>> glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net;
>> nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> Subject: Re:
>> [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended
>> equipment>> Anthony,>> I've used the Axi
>> 5330 F3A and the Dualsky 11T with very good results from
>> both. I think the AXI is a little stronger, but both are
>> plenty powerful. I usually run them with a 20X15 APC prop.
>> The CC85 and Jeti 99 spin controllers are both very good and
>> reliable. I prefer the Spin's myself, but I've used
>> both.>> For batteries, I prefer the Flightpower 5350
>> F3A packs....these have more capacity for their weight than
>> the higher discharge capacity packs - You don't need the
>> "C" rating, you need the "mah" rating-
>> my perspective anyway. The True battery 5000 ma packs are OK
>> for practice, but their availablity is spotty and they seem
>> to have differing dimensions between different
>> "lots".>> There is a new website the has
>> been started to collate various electric combo's--
>> I'm sure someone here will give the url shortly.>
>>     
>>> G> ---- Anthony Abdullah 
>>>       
>> wrote:>> =============> Hello everyone,> I
>> have decided that my next pattern plane / build will be
>> electric and I am doing my preliminary research before
>> starting to buy equipment (motor, ESC, batteries, prop,
>> E-motor mount) and could really use some help.>> My
>> goal for my first foray into electrics is to put together
>> proven reliable equipment that works and performs well as
>> complimentary components. I don't know as much about
>> electrics as I will need to, but I am sure that I will be
>> learning a lot as I go along. My expectations are that I
>> will be using a Lipo 10S pack of at least 5000 mah (will
>> this be enough?). I have often seen that people use the
>> Hacker C50 motors but also see a lot of other engines by
>> other manufacturers.>> Requirements:> 1. I do not
>> want to use a gear box so I will need a motor capable of
>> direct drive> 2. I want equipment where the components
>> will all work well together> 3. weight is always an
>> issue> 4. price is a consideration but third behind
>> reliability and performance>> I will be flying
>> advanced with the new airplane which will be purpose built
>> as an electric. If there is a website or other source of
>> useful information on electrics, I would like that as well.
>>     
>>>> Thanks in advance> Anthony>>
>>>>         
>> _______________________________________________>
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list>
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion>
>>     
>>> _______________________________________________>
>>>       
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list>
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows
>> Live.
>> http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008_______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>     
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>   


_________________________________________________________________
See how Windows Mobile brings your life together?at home, work, or on the go.
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From billglaze at bellsouth.net  Mon Sep  8 10:38:04 2008
From: billglaze at bellsouth.net (billglaze)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 18:38:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] test
References: <B61E79DD471C4613BAAC404E562B2FFD@TPC>
Message-ID: <017401c911df$6bcfced0$6101a8c0@glazep4xpcst>

Not this time, T-Bone.  Bill
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: T&C Brown 
  To: 'General pattern discussion' 
  Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 8:32 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] test


  I keep receiving a "bounce" notification when I send emails to the list.



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
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From vanputte at cox.net  Mon Sep  8 13:00:58 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 21:00:58 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
In-Reply-To: <BLU137-W5167F5E80CF69820E3EC2583550@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU137-W5167F5E80CF69820E3EC2583550@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <3A009E72-7810-4120-96BC-59C70F9E11F9@cox.net>

Chris - I submitted a description of my airplane, but I'm afraid that  
you might have three different versions parked on the website.  I  
kept finding changes I wanted to make after I submitted a version.   
Please delete all but the last one.  Thanks.

Ron

On Sep 8, 2008, at 1:06 PM, chris moon wrote:

> Anthony.
> Your question is exactly why I started the web site. There is no  
> single
> place to find the large amount of data that exists on battery and  
> motor
> longevity and performance. Everyone has their personal data and
> experiences but unless you contact everyone flying electrics, you  
> won't
> be able to get a large enough sample of data to draw valid  
> conclusions.
> As far as batteries, I think you will find answers all over the board.
> I know of some who have only had good performance from a set of
> batteries for 20-30 cycles and others who have 200+ cycles on the same
> type of batteries. What I am trying to do is see if the 20-30  
> cycles is
> the norm, or is the 200 correct, or is the average somewhere in the
> middle. Only a large enough sample will tell, and hopefully that will
> happen. I know that many/most/ of the really low cycle life packs were
> caused by mfg defects and were subsequently replaced by the mfg.
> As far as the Flight Power F3A packs, the consensus is that they are
> really strong for maybe 50 flights, then degrade quickly and the  
> average
> cycle life is probably 100 or less. I consider a pack run out if it
> can't provide adequate power for normal contest flight. Not completely
> dead, just too weak for a contest flight. For example, my Flight Power
> F3A pack has 110 cycles and I consider it too weak now for a contest
> flight. On the other hand, I have 2 sets of TP 5300 ProLites with 150+
> cycles each and fly them regularly with good performance still.
> Remember that the user has ultimate control over how well things work
> over time. We can all list people who could never get glow motor  
> XYZ to
> run well while others have stellar performance over a long period of
> time. Same for electrics. Everyone will agree that there is a definite
> learning curve to electrics and the best way to ensure success at  
> first
> is to copy a setup and charging regimen that has been used by others
> with success over time.
>
> Chris
>
>
> Anthony Abdullah wrote:
> > I was looking at the site and noticed how quickly / few cycles it  
> takes for lipo performance to start to degrade (20-30 cycles in  
> some cases). Is the "premature" degradation on the site just a  
> function of a small sample or does performance on average start to  
> decrease in as few cycles?
> >
> > What is the average number of cycles others are seeing with F3A  
> lipo packs before they start to lose capacity?
> >
> >
> > --- On Sun, 9/7/08, JEREMY CHINN wrote:
> >
> >
> >> From: JEREMY CHINN
> >> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended  
> equipment
> >> To: "General pattern discussion"
> >> Date: Sunday, September 7, 2008, 6:55 PM
> >> Chris Moon took the time to put up the new site
> >>
> >> http://www.electric-f3a.com/
> >>
> >> Lots of great information to be had there.> Date: Sun,
> >> 7 Sep 2008 17:30:52 -0500> From:
> >> glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net;
> >> nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> Subject: Re:
> >> [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended
> >> equipment>> Anthony,>> I've used the Axi
> >> 5330 F3A and the Dualsky 11T with very good results from
> >> both. I think the AXI is a little stronger, but both are
> >> plenty powerful. I usually run them with a 20X15 APC prop.
> >> The CC85 and Jeti 99 spin controllers are both very good and
> >> reliable. I prefer the Spin's myself, but I've used
> >> both.>> For batteries, I prefer the Flightpower 5350
> >> F3A packs....these have more capacity for their weight than
> >> the higher discharge capacity packs - You don't need the
> >> "C" rating, you need the "mah" rating-
> >> my perspective anyway. The True battery 5000 ma packs are OK
> >> for practice, but their availablity is spotty and they seem
> >> to have differing dimensions between different
> >> "lots".>> There is a new website the has
> >> been started to collate various electric combo's--
> >> I'm sure someone here will give the url shortly.>
> >>
> >>> G> ---- Anthony Abdullah
> >>>
> >> wrote:>> =============> Hello everyone,> I
> >> have decided that my next pattern plane / build will be
> >> electric and I am doing my preliminary research before
> >> starting to buy equipment (motor, ESC, batteries, prop,
> >> E-motor mount) and could really use some help.>> My
> >> goal for my first foray into electrics is to put together
> >> proven reliable equipment that works and performs well as
> >> complimentary components. I don't know as much about
> >> electrics as I will need to, but I am sure that I will be
> >> learning a lot as I go along. My expectations are that I
> >> will be using a Lipo 10S pack of at least 5000 mah (will
> >> this be enough?). I have often seen that people use the
> >> Hacker C50 motors but also see a lot of other engines by
> >> other manufacturers.>> Requirements:> 1. I do not
> >> want to use a gear box so I will need a motor capable of
> >> direct drive> 2. I want equipment where the components
> >> will all work well together> 3. weight is always an
> >> issue> 4. price is a consideration but third behind
> >> reliability and performance>> I will be flying
> >> advanced with the new airplane which will be purpose built
> >> as an electric. If there is a website or other source of
> >> useful information on electrics, I would like that as well.
> >>
> >>>> Thanks in advance> Anthony>>
> >>>>
> >> _______________________________________________>
> >> NSRCA-discussion mailing list>
> >> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> >> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion>
> >>
> >>> _______________________________________________>
> >>>
> >> NSRCA-discussion mailing list>
> >> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> >> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >> _________________________________________________________________
> >> Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows
> >> Live.
> >> http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com- 
> Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry? 
> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008_______________________________________ 
> ________
> >> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> >> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> >> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >>
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> See how Windows Mobile brings your life together?at home, work, or  
> on the go. See Now
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From vanputte at cox.net  Mon Sep  8 13:14:06 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 21:14:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
In-Reply-To: <3A009E72-7810-4120-96BC-59C70F9E11F9@cox.net>
References: <BLU137-W5167F5E80CF69820E3EC2583550@phx.gbl>
	<3A009E72-7810-4120-96BC-59C70F9E11F9@cox.net>
Message-ID: <B3F195F5-E47B-4A1B-ADA4-50E7BD7CEAE3@cox.net>


On Sep 8, 2008, at 4:00 PM, Ron Van Putte wrote:

> Chris - I submitted a description of my airplane, but I'm afraid  
> that you might have three different versions parked on the  
> website.  I kept finding changes I wanted to make after I submitted  
> a version.  Please delete all but the last one.  Thanks.
>
> Ron
>
> On Sep 8, 2008, at 1:06 PM, chris moon wrote:
>
>> Anthony.
>> Your question is exactly why I started the web site. There is no  
>> single
>> place to find the large amount of data that exists on battery and  
>> motor
>> longevity and performance. Everyone has their personal data and
>> experiences but unless you contact everyone flying electrics, you  
>> won't
>> be able to get a large enough sample of data to draw valid  
>> conclusions.
>> As far as batteries, I think you will find answers all over the  
>> board.
>> I know of some who have only had good performance from a set of
>> batteries for 20-30 cycles and others who have 200+ cycles on the  
>> same
>> type of batteries. What I am trying to do is see if the 20-30  
>> cycles is
>> the norm, or is the 200 correct, or is the average somewhere in the
>> middle. Only a large enough sample will tell, and hopefully that will
>> happen. I know that many/most/ of the really low cycle life packs  
>> were
>> caused by mfg defects and were subsequently replaced by the mfg.
>> As far as the Flight Power F3A packs, the consensus is that they are
>> really strong for maybe 50 flights, then degrade quickly and the  
>> average
>> cycle life is probably 100 or less. I consider a pack run out if it
>> can't provide adequate power for normal contest flight. Not  
>> completely
>> dead, just too weak for a contest flight. For example, my Flight  
>> Power
>> F3A pack has 110 cycles and I consider it too weak now for a contest
>> flight. On the other hand, I have 2 sets of TP 5300 ProLites with  
>> 150+
>> cycles each and fly them regularly with good performance still.
>> Remember that the user has ultimate control over how well things work
>> over time. We can all list people who could never get glow motor  
>> XYZ to
>> run well while others have stellar performance over a long period of
>> time. Same for electrics. Everyone will agree that there is a  
>> definite
>> learning curve to electrics and the best way to ensure success at  
>> first
>> is to copy a setup and charging regimen that has been used by others
>> with success over time.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>
>> Anthony Abdullah wrote:
>> > I was looking at the site and noticed how quickly / few cycles  
>> it takes for lipo performance to start to degrade (20-30 cycles in  
>> some cases). Is the "premature" degradation on the site just a  
>> function of a small sample or does performance on average start to  
>> decrease in as few cycles?
>> >
>> > What is the average number of cycles others are seeing with F3A  
>> lipo packs before they start to lose capacity?
>> >
>> >
>> > --- On Sun, 9/7/08, JEREMY CHINN wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >> From: JEREMY CHINN
>> >> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended  
>> equipment
>> >> To: "General pattern discussion"
>> >> Date: Sunday, September 7, 2008, 6:55 PM
>> >> Chris Moon took the time to put up the new site
>> >>
>> >> http://www.electric-f3a.com/
>> >>
>> >> Lots of great information to be had there.> Date: Sun,
>> >> 7 Sep 2008 17:30:52 -0500> From:
>> >> glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net;
>> >> nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> Subject: Re:
>> >> [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended
>> >> equipment>> Anthony,>> I've used the Axi
>> >> 5330 F3A and the Dualsky 11T with very good results from
>> >> both. I think the AXI is a little stronger, but both are
>> >> plenty powerful. I usually run them with a 20X15 APC prop.
>> >> The CC85 and Jeti 99 spin controllers are both very good and
>> >> reliable. I prefer the Spin's myself, but I've used
>> >> both.>> For batteries, I prefer the Flightpower 5350
>> >> F3A packs....these have more capacity for their weight than
>> >> the higher discharge capacity packs - You don't need the
>> >> "C" rating, you need the "mah" rating-
>> >> my perspective anyway. The True battery 5000 ma packs are OK
>> >> for practice, but their availablity is spotty and they seem
>> >> to have differing dimensions between different
>> >> "lots".>> There is a new website the has
>> >> been started to collate various electric combo's--
>> >> I'm sure someone here will give the url shortly.>
>> >>
>> >>> G> ---- Anthony Abdullah
>> >>>
>> >> wrote:>> =============> Hello everyone,> I
>> >> have decided that my next pattern plane / build will be
>> >> electric and I am doing my preliminary research before
>> >> starting to buy equipment (motor, ESC, batteries, prop,
>> >> E-motor mount) and could really use some help.>> My
>> >> goal for my first foray into electrics is to put together
>> >> proven reliable equipment that works and performs well as
>> >> complimentary components. I don't know as much about
>> >> electrics as I will need to, but I am sure that I will be
>> >> learning a lot as I go along. My expectations are that I
>> >> will be using a Lipo 10S pack of at least 5000 mah (will
>> >> this be enough?). I have often seen that people use the
>> >> Hacker C50 motors but also see a lot of other engines by
>> >> other manufacturers.>> Requirements:> 1. I do not
>> >> want to use a gear box so I will need a motor capable of
>> >> direct drive> 2. I want equipment where the components
>> >> will all work well together> 3. weight is always an
>> >> issue> 4. price is a consideration but third behind
>> >> reliability and performance>> I will be flying
>> >> advanced with the new airplane which will be purpose built
>> >> as an electric. If there is a website or other source of
>> >> useful information on electrics, I would like that as well.
>> >>
>> >>>> Thanks in advance> Anthony>>
>> >>>>
>> >> _______________________________________________>
>> >> NSRCA-discussion mailing list>
>> >> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> >> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion>
>> >>
>> >>> _______________________________________________>
>> >>>
>> >> NSRCA-discussion mailing list>
>> >> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> >> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> >> _________________________________________________________________
>> >> Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows
>> >> Live.
>> >> http://windowslive.com/connect/post/ 
>> jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry? 
>> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008______________________________________ 
>> _________
>> >> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> >> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> >> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> >>
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>> See how Windows Mobile brings your life together?at home, work, or  
>> on the go. See Now
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From cjm767driver at hotmail.com  Mon Sep  8 13:36:22 2008
From: cjm767driver at hotmail.com (chris moon)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 21:36:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
Message-ID: <BLU137-W36B1F0E88FCE724EFAB61483550@phx.gbl>


Thanks for submitting Ron.  I have several things to update tonight and 
I will make sure to post the last one.

Chris

Ron Van Putte wrote:
> Chris - I submitted a description of my airplane, but I'm afraid that 
> you might have three different versions parked on the website.  I kept 
> finding changes I wanted to make after I submitted a version.  Please 
> delete all but the last one.  Thanks.
>
> Ron
>
> On Sep 8, 2008, at 1:06 PM, chris moon wrote:
>
>> Anthony.
>> Your question is exactly why I started the web site. There is no single
>> place to find the large amount of data that exists on battery and motor
>> longevity and performance. Everyone has their personal data and
>> experiences but unless you contact everyone flying electrics, you won't
>> be able to get a large enough sample of data to draw valid conclusions.
>> As far as batteries, I think you will find answers all over the board.
>> I know of some who have only had good performance from a set of
>> batteries for 20-30 cycles and others who have 200+ cycles on the same
>> type of batteries. What I am trying to do is see if the 20-30 cycles is
>> the norm, or is the 200 correct, or is the average somewhere in the
>> middle. Only a large enough sample will tell, and hopefully that will
>> happen. I know that many/most/ of the really low cycle life packs were
>> caused by mfg defects and were subsequently replaced by the mfg.
>> As far as the Flight Power F3A packs, the consensus is that they are
>> really strong for maybe 50 flights, then degrade quickly and the average
>> cycle life is probably 100 or less. I consider a pack run out if it
>> can't provide adequate power for normal contest flight. Not completely
>> dead, just too weak for a contest flight. For example, my Flight Power
>> F3A pack has 110 cycles and I consider it too weak now for a contest
>> flight. On the other hand, I have 2 sets of TP 5300 ProLites with 150+
>> cycles each and fly them regularly with good performance still.
>> Remember that the user has ultimate control over how well things work
>> over time. We can all list people who could never get glow motor XYZ to
>> run well while others have stellar performance over a long period of
>> time. Same for electrics. Everyone will agree that there is a definite
>> learning curve to electrics and the best way to ensure success at first
>> is to copy a setup and charging regimen that has been used by others
>> with success over time.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>
>> Anthony Abdullah wrote:
>>> I was looking at the site and noticed how quickly / few cycles it 
>> takes for lipo performance to start to degrade (20-30 cycles in some 
>> cases). Is the "premature" degradation on the site just a function of 
>> a small sample or does performance on average start to decrease in as 
>> few cycles?
>>>
>>> What is the average number of cycles others are seeing with F3A 
>> lipo packs before they start to lose capacity?
>>>
>>>
>>> --- On Sun, 9/7/08, JEREMY CHINN wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> From: JEREMY CHINN
>>>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended 
>> equipment
>>>> To: "General pattern discussion"
>>>> Date: Sunday, September 7, 2008, 6:55 PM
>>>> Chris Moon took the time to put up the new site
>>>>
>>>> http://www.electric-f3a.com/
>>>>
>>>> Lots of great information to be had there.> Date: Sun,
>>>> 7 Sep 2008 17:30:52 -0500> From:
>>>> glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net;
>>>> nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> Subject: Re:
>>>> [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended
>>>> equipment>> Anthony,>> I've used the Axi
>>>> 5330 F3A and the Dualsky 11T with very good results from
>>>> both. I think the AXI is a little stronger, but both are
>>>> plenty powerful. I usually run them with a 20X15 APC prop.
>>>> The CC85 and Jeti 99 spin controllers are both very good and
>>>> reliable. I prefer the Spin's myself, but I've used
>>>> both.>> For batteries, I prefer the Flightpower 5350
>>>> F3A packs....these have more capacity for their weight than
>>>> the higher discharge capacity packs - You don't need the
>>>> "C" rating, you need the "mah" rating-
>>>> my perspective anyway. The True battery 5000 ma packs are OK
>>>> for practice, but their availablity is spotty and they seem
>>>> to have differing dimensions between different
>>>> "lots".>> There is a new website the has
>>>> been started to collate various electric combo's--
>>>> I'm sure someone here will give the url shortly.>
>>>>
>>>>> G> ---- Anthony Abdullah
>>>>>
>>>> wrote:>> =============> Hello everyone,> I
>>>> have decided that my next pattern plane / build will be
>>>> electric and I am doing my preliminary research before
>>>> starting to buy equipment (motor, ESC, batteries, prop,
>>>> E-motor mount) and could really use some help.>> My
>>>> goal for my first foray into electrics is to put together
>>>> proven reliable equipment that works and performs well as
>>>> complimentary components. I don't know as much about
>>>> electrics as I will need to, but I am sure that I will be
>>>> learning a lot as I go along. My expectations are that I
>>>> will be using a Lipo 10S pack of at least 5000 mah (will
>>>> this be enough?). I have often seen that people use the
>>>> Hacker C50 motors but also see a lot of other engines by
>>>> other manufacturers.>> Requirements:> 1. I do not
>>>> want to use a gear box so I will need a motor capable of
>>>> direct drive> 2. I want equipment where the components
>>>> will all work well together> 3. weight is always an
>>>> issue> 4. price is a consideration but third behind
>>>> reliability and performance>> I will be flying
>>>> advanced with the new airplane which will be purpose built
>>>> as an electric. If there is a website or other source of
>>>> useful information on electrics, I would like that as well.
>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks in advance> Anthony>>
>>>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________>
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list>
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion>
>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________>
>>>>>
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list>
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>> _________________________________________________________________
>>>> Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows
>>>> Live.
>>>> 
>> http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008_______________________________________________ 
>>
>>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> See how Windows Mobile brings your life together?at home, work, or on 
>> the go. See Now
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>


_________________________________________________________________
Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows Live.
http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008
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From js.smith at verizon.net  Mon Sep  8 14:02:05 2008
From: js.smith at verizon.net (Scott Smith)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 22:02:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends
In-Reply-To: <48C53EFC.3090602@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <0K6W009Y4D5LBIK8@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net>

 

I don't have a source but if you get a new cable, pot the wires with a
little JB-Weld at the connector.  This will keep the wires from breaking at
the crimp.  Also, if you break off the locking tab, it's easier to connect
and disconnect.  

 

 

 



 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Stuart Chale
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 11:04 AM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

 

Does anyone have a source for the 3 pin female data cable ends for the 

TP charger to balancer connection?

They have a habit of breaking usually right at the pin making it 

difficult to repair.  A prewired pigtail or double female extension that 

could be cut in half would allow easy repairs and hopefully cheaper than 

$10 to replace the cable each time it breaks.

 

Thanks,

Stuart C.

 

_______________________________________________

NSRCA-discussion mailing list

NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From natpenton at centurytel.net  Mon Sep  8 14:09:29 2008
From: natpenton at centurytel.net (Nat Penton)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 22:09:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
References: <BLU137-W5167F5E80CF69820E3EC2583550@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <9622746AB6CF437AAC97ABAED03E882D@GREENROOM>

Heat is public enemy number 1 as far as Lipo battery life is concerned. If you can keep cell temps below 150F you can expect 150 plus cycles.

I don't have all the answers as to how to handle the cooling in the widebodies.    Nat
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: chris moon 
  To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net ; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
  Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 1:06 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment


  Anthony.
  Your question is exactly why I started the web site. There is no single 
  place to find the large amount of data that exists on battery and motor 
  longevity and performance. Everyone has their personal data and 
  experiences but unless you contact everyone flying electrics, you won't 
  be able to get a large enough sample of data to draw valid conclusions. 
  As far as batteries, I think you will find answers all over the board. 
  I know of some who have only had good performance from a set of 
  batteries for 20-30 cycles and others who have 200+ cycles on the same 
  type of batteries. What I am trying to do is see if the 20-30 cycles is 
  the norm, or is the 200 correct, or is the average somewhere in the 
  middle. Only a large enough sample will tell, and hopefully that will 
  happen. I know that many/most/ of the really low cycle life packs were 
  caused by mfg defects and were subsequently replaced by the mfg. 
  As far as the Flight Power F3A packs, the consensus is that they are 
  really strong for maybe 50 flights, then degrade quickly and the average 
  cycle life is probably 100 or less. I consider a pack run out if it 
  can't provide adequate power for normal contest flight. Not completely 
  dead, just too weak for a contest flight. For example, my Flight Power 
  F3A pack has 110 cycles and I consider it too weak now for a contest 
  flight. On the other hand, I have 2 sets of TP 5300 ProLites with 150+ 
  cycles each and fly them regularly with good performance still.
  Remember that the user has ultimate control over how well things work 
  over time. We can all list people who could never get glow motor XYZ to 
  run well while others have stellar performance over a long period of 
  time. Same for electrics. Everyone will agree that there is a definite 
  learning curve to electrics and the best way to ensure success at first 
  is to copy a setup and charging regimen that has been used by others 
  with success over time. 

  Chris


  Anthony Abdullah wrote:
  > I was looking at the site and noticed how quickly / few cycles it takes for lipo performance to start to degrade (20-30 cycles in some cases). Is the "premature" degradation on the site just a function of a small sample or does performance on average start to decrease in as few cycles?
  >
  > What is the average number of cycles others are seeing with F3A lipo packs before they start to lose capacity? 
  >
  >
  > --- On Sun, 9/7/08, JEREMY CHINN wrote:
  >
  > 
  >> From: JEREMY CHINN 
  >> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
  >> To: "General pattern discussion" 
  >> Date: Sunday, September 7, 2008, 6:55 PM
  >> Chris Moon took the time to put up the new site 
  >> 
  >> http://www.electric-f3a.com/
  >> 
  >> Lots of great information to be had there.> Date: Sun,
  >> 7 Sep 2008 17:30:52 -0500> From:
  >> glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net;
  >> nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> Subject: Re:
  >> [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended
  >> equipment>> Anthony,>> I've used the Axi
  >> 5330 F3A and the Dualsky 11T with very good results from
  >> both. I think the AXI is a little stronger, but both are
  >> plenty powerful. I usually run them with a 20X15 APC prop.
  >> The CC85 and Jeti 99 spin controllers are both very good and
  >> reliable. I prefer the Spin's myself, but I've used
  >> both.>> For batteries, I prefer the Flightpower 5350
  >> F3A packs....these have more capacity for their weight than
  >> the higher discharge capacity packs - You don't need the
  >> "C" rating, you need the "mah" rating-
  >> my perspective anyway. The True battery 5000 ma packs are OK
  >> for practice, but their availablity is spotty and they seem
  >> to have differing dimensions between different
  >> "lots".>> There is a new website the has
  >> been started to collate various electric combo's--
  >> I'm sure someone here will give the url shortly.>
  >> 
  >>> G> ---- Anthony Abdullah 
  >>> 
  >> wrote:>> =============> Hello everyone,> I
  >> have decided that my next pattern plane / build will be
  >> electric and I am doing my preliminary research before
  >> starting to buy equipment (motor, ESC, batteries, prop,
  >> E-motor mount) and could really use some help.>> My
  >> goal for my first foray into electrics is to put together
  >> proven reliable equipment that works and performs well as
  >> complimentary components. I don't know as much about
  >> electrics as I will need to, but I am sure that I will be
  >> learning a lot as I go along. My expectations are that I
  >> will be using a Lipo 10S pack of at least 5000 mah (will
  >> this be enough?). I have often seen that people use the
  >> Hacker C50 motors but also see a lot of other engines by
  >> other manufacturers.>> Requirements:> 1. I do not
  >> want to use a gear box so I will need a motor capable of
  >> direct drive> 2. I want equipment where the components
  >> will all work well together> 3. weight is always an
  >> issue> 4. price is a consideration but third behind
  >> reliability and performance>> I will be flying
  >> advanced with the new airplane which will be purpose built
  >> as an electric. If there is a website or other source of
  >> useful information on electrics, I would like that as well.
  >> 
  >>>> Thanks in advance> Anthony>>
  >>>> 
  >> _______________________________________________>
  >> NSRCA-discussion mailing list>
  >> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  >> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion>
  >> 
  >>> _______________________________________________>
  >>> 
  >> NSRCA-discussion mailing list>
  >> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
  >> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  >> _________________________________________________________________
  >> Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows
  >> Live.
  >> http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008_______________________________________________
  >> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  >> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  >> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  >> 
  > _______________________________________________
  > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  >
  >
  > 



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From simestd at netexpress.com  Mon Sep  8 14:25:28 2008
From: simestd at netexpress.com (Tom Simes)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 22:25:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
In-Reply-To: <9622746AB6CF437AAC97ABAED03E882D@GREENROOM>
References: <BLU137-W5167F5E80CF69820E3EC2583550@phx.gbl>
	<9622746AB6CF437AAC97ABAED03E882D@GREENROOM>
Message-ID: <20080908142442.7a008ad3.simestd@netexpress.com>

On Mon, 8 Sep 2008 17:08:25 -0500
"Nat Penton" <natpenton at centurytel.net> wrote:

> Heat is public enemy number 1 as far as Lipo battery life is
> concerned. If you can keep cell temps below 150F you can expect 150
> plus cycles.
> 
> I don't have all the answers as to how to handle the cooling in the
> widebodies.    Nat

Conformal external batteries or heat sink plate?  The fins could serve
double duty as boundary layer control...  Ok, maybe I'm a little over
caffeinated today ;)  Still though, imagine a battery retention
mechanism where the cells intermeshed with heatsink fins to both
secure the pack and transfer the heat.  Sure would beat some of the odd
phase change potting compound schemes used in missles and other "one
way" aircraft.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conformal_fuel_tank

Tom
 
======================================================================
   "Z-80 system stack overflow.  Shut 'er down Scotty, the system's
         sucking mud" - Error message on TRS 80 Model-16B

Tom Simes                                       simestd at netexpress.com 
======================================================================

From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Mon Sep  8 14:33:19 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 22:33:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends
References: <48C53EFC.3090602@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV6A2AE4C644956EDA4DE60E8550@phx.gbl>

Stu:

Try Digikey.com

Ed

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Stuart Chale" <schale at optonline.net>
To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 10:04 AM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends


> Does anyone have a source for the 3 pin female data cable ends for the 
> TP charger to balancer connection?
> They have a habit of breaking usually right at the pin making it 
> difficult to repair.  A prewired pigtail or double female extension that 
> could be cut in half would allow easy repairs and hopefully cheaper than 
> $10 to replace the cable each time it breaks.
> 
> Thanks,
> Stuart C.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>

From natpenton at centurytel.net  Mon Sep  8 14:57:24 2008
From: natpenton at centurytel.net (Nat Penton)
Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 22:57:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
References: <BLU137-W5167F5E80CF69820E3EC2583550@phx.gbl><9622746AB6CF437AAC97ABAED03E882D@GREENROOM>
	<20080908142442.7a008ad3.simestd@netexpress.com>
Message-ID: <5F4F3792787D4E2A9668D74E296F21E0@GREENROOM>

Tom, the plastic sheaths on TP 5300s can be removed without any problems. 
This greatly increases heat transfer and saves some weight, but it is 
nowhere near a total solution.      Nat

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tom Simes" <simestd at netexpress.com>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 5:24 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment


> On Mon, 8 Sep 2008 17:08:25 -0500
> "Nat Penton" <natpenton at centurytel.net> wrote:
>
>> Heat is public enemy number 1 as far as Lipo battery life is
>> concerned. If you can keep cell temps below 150F you can expect 150
>> plus cycles.
>>
>> I don't have all the answers as to how to handle the cooling in the
>> widebodies.    Nat
>
> Conformal external batteries or heat sink plate?  The fins could serve
> double duty as boundary layer control...  Ok, maybe I'm a little over
> caffeinated today ;)  Still though, imagine a battery retention
> mechanism where the cells intermeshed with heatsink fins to both
> secure the pack and transfer the heat.  Sure would beat some of the odd
> phase change potting compound schemes used in missles and other "one
> way" aircraft.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conformal_fuel_tank
>
> Tom
>
> ======================================================================
>   "Z-80 system stack overflow.  Shut 'er down Scotty, the system's
>         sucking mud" - Error message on TRS 80 Model-16B
>
> Tom Simes                                       simestd at netexpress.com
> ======================================================================
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 


From anthonyr105 at hotmail.com  Mon Sep  8 16:32:27 2008
From: anthonyr105 at hotmail.com (Anthony Romano)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 00:32:27 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends
In-Reply-To: <0K6W009Y4D5LBIK8@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net>
References: <48C53EFC.3090602@optonline.net>
	<0K6W009Y4D5LBIK8@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net>
Message-ID: <BLU124-W43070602EBE8572E7D436E2540@phx.gbl>

Hi Scott,
 Good point. A little left over epoxy works well for that too!

Anthony



Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 18:00:52 -0400
From: js.smith at verizon.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends



















 

I don?t have a source but if you get a new cable, pot the wires
with a little JB-Weld at the connector.  This will keep the wires from
breaking at the crimp.  Also, if you break off the locking tab, it?s
easier to connect and disconnect.  

 

 

 



 

 

-----Original Message-----

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Stuart Chale

Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 11:04 AM

To: NSRCA Mailing List

Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

 

Does anyone have a source for the 3 pin female data cable ends for the 

TP charger to balancer connection?

They have a habit of breaking usually right at the pin making it 

difficult to repair.  A prewired pigtail or double female
extension that 

could be cut in half would allow easy repairs and hopefully cheaper
than 

$10 to replace the cable each time it breaks.

 

Thanks,

Stuart C.

 

_______________________________________________

NSRCA-discussion mailing list

NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion







_________________________________________________________________
See how Windows connects the people, information, and fun that are part of your life.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093175mrt/direct/01/
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From lagrue at hotmail.com  Mon Sep  8 17:06:56 2008
From: lagrue at hotmail.com (JEREMY CHINN)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 01:06:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
In-Reply-To: <9622746AB6CF437AAC97ABAED03E882D@GREENROOM>
References: <BLU137-W5167F5E80CF69820E3EC2583550@phx.gbl>
	<9622746AB6CF437AAC97ABAED03E882D@GREENROOM>
Message-ID: <BLU141-W32A94B1B3519AF69B3F11C7540@phx.gbl>


Interestingly enough, the batteries in my bird at the NATS never even got up to operating temperature....and the last flight was done with the throttle essentially as an on-off switch..... 
Of course it is an 'anti-widebody' design..... : )
 
 
 



From: natpenton at centurytel.netTo: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgDate: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 17:08:25 -0500Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment



Heat is public enemy number 1 as far as Lipo battery life is concerned. If you can keep cell temps below 150F you can expect 150 plus cycles.
 
I don't have all the answers as to how to handle the cooling in the widebodies.    Nat

----- Original Message ----- 
From: chris moon 
To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net ; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 1:06 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
Anthony.Your question is exactly why I started the web site. There is no single place to find the large amount of data that exists on battery and motor longevity and performance. Everyone has their personal data and experiences but unless you contact everyone flying electrics, you won't be able to get a large enough sample of data to draw valid conclusions. As far as batteries, I think you will find answers all over the board. I know of some who have only had good performance from a set of batteries for 20-30 cycles and others who have 200+ cycles on the same type of batteries. What I am trying to do is see if the 20-30 cycles is the norm, or is the 200 correct, or is the average somewhere in the middle. Only a large enough sample will tell, and hopefully that will happen. I know that many/most/ of the really low cycle life packs were caused by mfg defects and were subsequently replaced by the mfg. As far as the Flight Power F3A packs, the consensus is that they are really strong for maybe 50 flights, then degrade quickly and the average cycle life is probably 100 or less. I consider a pack run out if it can't provide adequate power for normal contest flight. Not completely dead, just too weak for a contest flight. For example, my Flight Power F3A pack has 110 cycles and I consider it too weak now for a contest flight. On the other hand, I have 2 sets of TP 5300 ProLites with 150+ cycles each and fly them regularly with good performance still.Remember that the user has ultimate control over how well things work over time. We can all list people who could never get glow motor XYZ to run well while others have stellar performance over a long period of time. Same for electrics. Everyone will agree that there is a definite learning curve to electrics and the best way to ensure success at first is to copy a setup and charging regimen that has been used by others with success over time. ChrisAnthony Abdullah wrote:> I was looking at the site and noticed how quickly / few cycles it takes for lipo performance to start to degrade (20-30 cycles in some cases). Is the "premature" degradation on the site just a function of a small sample or does performance on average start to decrease in as few cycles?>> What is the average number of cycles others are seeing with F3A lipo packs before they start to lose capacity? >>> --- On Sun, 9/7/08, JEREMY CHINN wrote:>> >> From: JEREMY CHINN >> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment>> To: "General pattern discussion" >> Date: Sunday, September 7, 2008, 6:55 PM>> Chris Moon took the time to put up the new site >> >> http://www.electric-f3a.com/>> >> Lots of great information to be had there.> Date: Sun,>> 7 Sep 2008 17:30:52 -0500> From:>> glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net;>> nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> Subject: Re:>> [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended>> equipment>> Anthony,>> I've used the Axi>> 5330 F3A and the Dualsky 11T with very good results from>> both. I think the AXI is a little stronger, but both are>> plenty powerful. I usually run them with a 20X15 APC prop.>> The CC85 and Jeti 99 spin controllers are both very good and>> reliable. I prefer the Spin's myself, but I've used>> both.>> For batteries, I prefer the Flightpower 5350>> F3A packs....these have more capacity for their weight than>> the higher discharge capacity packs - You don't need the>> "C" rating, you need the "mah" rating->> my perspective anyway. The True battery 5000 ma packs are OK>> for practice, but their availablity is spotty and they seem>> to have differing dimensions between different>> "lots".>> There is a new website the has>> been started to collate various electric combo's-->> I'm sure someone here will give the url shortly.>>> >>> G> ---- Anthony Abdullah >>> >> wrote:>> =============> Hello everyone,> I>> have decided that my next pattern plane / build will be>> electric and I am doing my preliminary research before>> starting to buy equipment (motor, ESC, batteries, prop,>> E-motor mount) and could really use some help.>> My>> goal for my first foray into electrics is to put together>> proven reliable equipment that works and performs well as>> complimentary components. I don't know as much about>> electrics as I will need to, but I am sure that I will be>> learning a lot as I go along. My expectations are that I>> will be using a Lipo 10S pack of at least 5000 mah (will>> this be enough?). I have often seen that people use the>> Hacker C50 motors but also see a lot of other engines by>> other manufacturers.>> Requirements:> 1. I do not>> want to use a gear box so I will need a motor capable of>> direct drive> 2. I want equipment where the components>> will all work well together> 3. weight is always an>> issue> 4. price is a consideration but third behind>> reliability and performance>> I will be flying>> advanced with the new airplane which will be purpose built>> as an electric. If there is a website or other source of>> useful information on electrics, I would like that as well.>> >>>> Thanks in advance> Anthony>>>>>> >> _______________________________________________>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion>>> >>> _______________________________________________>>>> >> NSRCA-discussion mailing list>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion>> _________________________________________________________________>> Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows>> Live.>> http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008_______________________________________________>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion>> > _______________________________________________> NSRCA-discussion mailing list> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion>>> 

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_______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Mon Sep  8 17:33:05 2008
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 01:33:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends
In-Reply-To: <BLU124-W43070602EBE8572E7D436E2540@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <FD11958A10B747B0942A2CEFD2358889@jaysdesktop>

Something that has a little flex, such as silicone sealer, works better. If
you have a hard, immovable joint the wire will tend to break there.

 

Jay Marshall 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony
Romano
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 8:32 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

 

Hi Scott,
 Good point. A little left over epoxy works well for that too!

Anthony





  _____  

Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 18:00:52 -0400
From: js.smith at verizon.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

 

I don't have a source but if you get a new cable, pot the wires with a
little JB-Weld at the connector.  This will keep the wires from breaking at
the crimp.  Also, if you break off the locking tab, it's easier to connect
and disconnect.  

 

 

 



 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Stuart Chale
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 11:04 AM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

 

Does anyone have a source for the 3 pin female data cable ends for the 

TP charger to balancer connection?

They have a habit of breaking usually right at the pin making it 

difficult to repair.  A prewired pigtail or double female extension that 

could be cut in half would allow easy repairs and hopefully cheaper than 

$10 to replace the cable each time it breaks.

 

Thanks,

Stuart C.

 

_______________________________________________

NSRCA-discussion mailing list

NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

  _____  

See how Windows connects the people, information, and fun that are part of
your life. See Now
<http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093175mrt/direct/01/> 

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From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Mon Sep  8 17:34:52 2008
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 01:34:52 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
In-Reply-To: <20080908142442.7a008ad3.simestd@netexpress.com>
Message-ID: <688BDF44FC714A39924A3DE612C4C3E6@jaysdesktop>

Would really be nice if the fins were part of the aircraft and protruded
into the slipstream.

Jay Marshall

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Tom Simes
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 6:25 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment

On Mon, 8 Sep 2008 17:08:25 -0500
"Nat Penton" <natpenton at centurytel.net> wrote:

> Heat is public enemy number 1 as far as Lipo battery life is
> concerned. If you can keep cell temps below 150F you can expect 150
> plus cycles.
> 
> I don't have all the answers as to how to handle the cooling in the
> widebodies.    Nat

Conformal external batteries or heat sink plate?  The fins could serve
double duty as boundary layer control...  Ok, maybe I'm a little over
caffeinated today ;)  Still though, imagine a battery retention
mechanism where the cells intermeshed with heatsink fins to both
secure the pack and transfer the heat.  Sure would beat some of the odd
phase change potting compound schemes used in missles and other "one
way" aircraft.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conformal_fuel_tank

Tom
 
======================================================================
   "Z-80 system stack overflow.  Shut 'er down Scotty, the system's
         sucking mud" - Error message on TRS 80 Model-16B

Tom Simes                                       simestd at netexpress.com 
======================================================================
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From astafford at swtexas.net  Mon Sep  8 17:53:21 2008
From: astafford at swtexas.net (Archie Stafford)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 01:53:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!
In-Reply-To: <C4EABC0C.2E12C%atwoodm@paragon-inc.com>
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNAENMCMAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
	<C4EABC0C.2E12C%atwoodm@paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <A0479B8F561743D3B6040653DD874657@astafford>

Mark,

Actually a few years ago at our pre Nats get together we actually discussed
kind of D1 v. D4 kind of contest.  The location would work out well for
that.  And I'm sure the weekend could be adjusted if needed.  The field is
so easy to get to and so pattern friendly with lots of hotels and
restaurants just a few miles from the field...

Arch

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Mark Atwood
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 6:25 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!

Just wanted to extend a thank you to Rick Cillas and Wes Stafford (yeah,
that's Archie's Dad) for putting on a great contest in St. Clairsville, OH
(on the WV border) this weekend.  The weather was a challenge, but the event
was excellent, highlighted by great food both days!

This event location is fairly new, and is now on a brand new field that was
excellent for pattern flying.  We only had 13 people, which speaks to the
location relative to our district (eastern edge of D4).

It seems to me that there must be some flyers in the Western PA region, WV,
Western NY that would be pretty close to this contest and I would encourage
you to consider it for your 2009 calendar.  It would be nice to get some
cross district participation on our Eastern shores that rivals the D4-D5
participation we get on the western side of the district.

Anyhow, great event, and a job well done by Rick and Wes.  Thanks for all
the effort!!

-Mark

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From verne at twmi.rr.com  Mon Sep  8 18:10:03 2008
From: verne at twmi.rr.com (Verne Koester)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 02:10:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNAENMCMAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com><C4EABC0C.2E12C%atwoodm@paragon-inc.com>
	<A0479B8F561743D3B6040653DD874657@astafford>
Message-ID: <C13B0EE330134517860D5EC447403492@Vinnie>

There wasn't a lot of chatter about the contest ahead of time. I think if we 
all talk it up a little beforehand, the attendance will rise quite a bit.

Verne


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Archie Stafford" <astafford at swtexas.net>
To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 9:53 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!


> Mark,
>
> Actually a few years ago at our pre Nats get together we actually 
> discussed
> kind of D1 v. D4 kind of contest.  The location would work out well for
> that.  And I'm sure the weekend could be adjusted if needed.  The field is
> so easy to get to and so pattern friendly with lots of hotels and
> restaurants just a few miles from the field...
>
> Arch
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Mark Atwood
> Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 6:25 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!
>
> Just wanted to extend a thank you to Rick Cillas and Wes Stafford (yeah,
> that's Archie's Dad) for putting on a great contest in St. Clairsville, OH
> (on the WV border) this weekend.  The weather was a challenge, but the 
> event
> was excellent, highlighted by great food both days!
>
> This event location is fairly new, and is now on a brand new field that 
> was
> excellent for pattern flying.  We only had 13 people, which speaks to the
> location relative to our district (eastern edge of D4).
>
> It seems to me that there must be some flyers in the Western PA region, 
> WV,
> Western NY that would be pretty close to this contest and I would 
> encourage
> you to consider it for your 2009 calendar.  It would be nice to get some
> cross district participation on our Eastern shores that rivals the D4-D5
> participation we get on the western side of the district.
>
> Anyhow, great event, and a job well done by Rick and Wes.  Thanks for all
> the effort!!
>
> -Mark
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 



From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Mon Sep  8 18:13:33 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 02:13:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNAENMCMAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com><C4EABC0C.2E12C%atwoodm@paragon-inc.com><A0479B8F561743D3B6040653DD874657@astafford>
	<C13B0EE330134517860D5EC447403492@Vinnie>
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV676AD7422EA611AE98F4AE8540@phx.gbl>

Schedule needs to be looekd at too.  This was the weeeknd for the D1 Oasis 
season finale.

Ed
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Verne Koester" <verne at twmi.rr.com>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 9:09 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!


> There wasn't a lot of chatter about the contest ahead of time. I think if 
> we all talk it up a little beforehand, the attendance will rise quite a 
> bit.
>
> Verne
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Archie Stafford" <astafford at swtexas.net>
> To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 9:53 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!
>
>
>> Mark,
>>
>> Actually a few years ago at our pre Nats get together we actually 
>> discussed
>> kind of D1 v. D4 kind of contest.  The location would work out well for
>> that.  And I'm sure the weekend could be adjusted if needed.  The field 
>> is
>> so easy to get to and so pattern friendly with lots of hotels and
>> restaurants just a few miles from the field...
>>
>> Arch
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Mark 
>> Atwood
>> Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 6:25 PM
>> To: General pattern discussion
>> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!
>>
>> Just wanted to extend a thank you to Rick Cillas and Wes Stafford (yeah,
>> that's Archie's Dad) for putting on a great contest in St. Clairsville, 
>> OH
>> (on the WV border) this weekend.  The weather was a challenge, but the 
>> event
>> was excellent, highlighted by great food both days!
>>
>> This event location is fairly new, and is now on a brand new field that 
>> was
>> excellent for pattern flying.  We only had 13 people, which speaks to the
>> location relative to our district (eastern edge of D4).
>>
>> It seems to me that there must be some flyers in the Western PA region, 
>> WV,
>> Western NY that would be pretty close to this contest and I would 
>> encourage
>> you to consider it for your 2009 calendar.  It would be nice to get some
>> cross district participation on our Eastern shores that rivals the D4-D5
>> participation we get on the western side of the district.
>>
>> Anyhow, great event, and a job well done by Rick and Wes.  Thanks for all
>> the effort!!
>>
>> -Mark
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 


From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Mon Sep  8 18:17:09 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 02:17:09 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends
References: <FD11958A10B747B0942A2CEFD2358889@jaysdesktop>
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV99739DBB23871C2FE1171E8540@phx.gbl>

Be careful about using silicon sealer.  It has a tendency to corrode metal over time.  Try Walthers Goo.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Jay Marshall 
  To: 'General pattern discussion' 
  Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 8:32 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends


  Something that has a little flex, such as silicone sealer, works better. If you have a hard, immovable joint the wire will tend to break there.



  Jay Marshall 

  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Romano
  Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 8:32 PM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends



  Hi Scott,
   Good point. A little left over epoxy works well for that too!

  Anthony






------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 18:00:52 -0400
  From: js.smith at verizon.net
  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends



  I don't have a source but if you get a new cable, pot the wires with a little JB-Weld at the connector.  This will keep the wires from breaking at the crimp.  Also, if you break off the locking tab, it's easier to connect and disconnect.  













  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Stuart Chale
  Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 11:04 AM
  To: NSRCA Mailing List
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends



  Does anyone have a source for the 3 pin female data cable ends for the 

  TP charger to balancer connection?

  They have a habit of breaking usually right at the pin making it 

  difficult to repair.  A prewired pigtail or double female extension that 

  could be cut in half would allow easy repairs and hopefully cheaper than 

  $10 to replace the cable each time it breaks.



  Thanks,

  Stuart C.



  _______________________________________________

  NSRCA-discussion mailing list

  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion




------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  See how Windows connects the people, information, and fun that are part of your life. See Now



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From DaveL322 at comcast.net  Mon Sep  8 18:55:51 2008
From: DaveL322 at comcast.net (Dave)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 02:55:51 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV676AD7422EA611AE98F4AE8540@phx.gbl>
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNAENMCMAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com><C4EABC0C.2E12C%atwoodm@paragon-inc.com><A0479B8F561743D3B6040653DD874657@astafford><C13B0EE330134517860D5EC447403492@Vinnie>
	<BAY135-DAV676AD7422EA611AE98F4AE8540@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <006701c91226$f5b16270$9300a8c0@davedesktop>

Yes, September is a busy month in the northeast/midatlantic - D1 wrapup, D2
Champs, NEAT, and several fall fly-ins, fun flies, pig roasts, etc.  Not
hard to be busy every weekend.

Dave



-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ed Alt
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 10:14 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!

Schedule needs to be looekd at too.  This was the weeeknd for the D1 Oasis 
season finale.

Ed
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Verne Koester" <verne at twmi.rr.com>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 9:09 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!


> There wasn't a lot of chatter about the contest ahead of time. I think if 
> we all talk it up a little beforehand, the attendance will rise quite a 
> bit.
>
> Verne
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Archie Stafford" <astafford at swtexas.net>
> To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 9:53 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!
>
>
>> Mark,
>>
>> Actually a few years ago at our pre Nats get together we actually 
>> discussed
>> kind of D1 v. D4 kind of contest.  The location would work out well for
>> that.  And I'm sure the weekend could be adjusted if needed.  The field 
>> is
>> so easy to get to and so pattern friendly with lots of hotels and
>> restaurants just a few miles from the field...
>>
>> Arch
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Mark 
>> Atwood
>> Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 6:25 PM
>> To: General pattern discussion
>> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!
>>
>> Just wanted to extend a thank you to Rick Cillas and Wes Stafford (yeah,
>> that's Archie's Dad) for putting on a great contest in St. Clairsville, 
>> OH
>> (on the WV border) this weekend.  The weather was a challenge, but the 
>> event
>> was excellent, highlighted by great food both days!
>>
>> This event location is fairly new, and is now on a brand new field that 
>> was
>> excellent for pattern flying.  We only had 13 people, which speaks to the
>> location relative to our district (eastern edge of D4).
>>
>> It seems to me that there must be some flyers in the Western PA region, 
>> WV,
>> Western NY that would be pretty close to this contest and I would 
>> encourage
>> you to consider it for your 2009 calendar.  It would be nice to get some
>> cross district participation on our Eastern shores that rivals the D4-D5
>> participation we get on the western side of the district.
>>
>> Anyhow, great event, and a job well done by Rick and Wes.  Thanks for all
>> the effort!!
>>
>> -Mark
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Mon Sep  8 19:17:00 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 03:17:00 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] YS-63
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNEEOECMAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

What's the high end needle setting for the 63? Prop is 13x6 and fuel is 30%CP

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com 
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.6.19/1659 - Release Date: 9/8/2008 7:01 AM



From dwaynenancy at suddenlink.net  Mon Sep  8 19:30:44 2008
From: dwaynenancy at suddenlink.net (Dwayne Brown)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 03:30:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV99739DBB23871C2FE1171E8540@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <43E39D2F666B47E0A1FFD99849A06D3C@YoursMine>

There are silicon sealers for electronics.  Most of the ones you see outgas
acetic acid which is why you get the corrosion over time.  The good ones
outgas an alcohol.  Dwayne

 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ed Alt
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 9:17 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

 

Be careful about using silicon sealer.  It has a tendency to corrode metal
over time.  Try Walthers Goo.

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Jay Marshall <mailto:lightfoot at sc.rr.com>  

To: 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 8:32 PM

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

 

Something that has a little flex, such as silicone sealer, works better. If
you have a hard, immovable joint the wire will tend to break there.

 

Jay Marshall 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony
Romano
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 8:32 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

 

Hi Scott,
 Good point. A little left over epoxy works well for that too!

Anthony

 


  _____  


Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 18:00:52 -0400
From: js.smith at verizon.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

 

I don't have a source but if you get a new cable, pot the wires with a
little JB-Weld at the connector.  This will keep the wires from breaking at
the crimp.  Also, if you break off the locking tab, it's easier to connect
and disconnect.  

 

 

 



 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Stuart Chale
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 11:04 AM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

 

Does anyone have a source for the 3 pin female data cable ends for the 

TP charger to balancer connection?

They have a habit of breaking usually right at the pin making it 

difficult to repair.  A prewired pigtail or double female extension that 

could be cut in half would allow easy repairs and hopefully cheaper than 

$10 to replace the cable each time it breaks.

 

Thanks,

Stuart C.

 

_______________________________________________

NSRCA-discussion mailing list

NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 


  _____  


See how Windows connects the people, information, and fun that are part of
your life. See Now
<http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093175mrt/direct/01/> 


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.6.19/1659 - Release Date: 9/8/2008
6:39 PM


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From Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au  Mon Sep  8 19:45:55 2008
From: Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au (Koenig, Tom)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 03:45:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] CDI for YS
References: <43E39D2F666B47E0A1FFD99849A06D3C@YoursMine>
Message-ID: <A80938E906BC3340B0E7C4731F4B355E024406F9@semailbox02>

Hi again all,
 
Just wondering if any of you know anymore/anything about the CDI release
date etc.
 
I'm sure some of you have even seen these perform? Down here I have seen
nothing ( but I am under a rock at the moment :-)!
 
Any comments, any news-I'd love to hear a bit about it all.
 
Tom

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From schale at optonline.net  Mon Sep  8 19:49:25 2008
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 03:49:25 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends
In-Reply-To: <0K6W009Y4D5LBIK8@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net>
References: <0K6W009Y4D5LBIK8@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net>
Message-ID: <48C5F231.7090003@optonline.net>

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From schale at optonline.net  Mon Sep  8 19:56:32 2008
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 03:56:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric pattern recommended equipment
In-Reply-To: <9622746AB6CF437AAC97ABAED03E882D@GREENROOM>
References: <BLU137-W5167F5E80CF69820E3EC2583550@phx.gbl>
	<9622746AB6CF437AAC97ABAED03E882D@GREENROOM>
Message-ID: <48C5F3E2.7090604@optonline.net>

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From schale at optonline.net  Mon Sep  8 19:58:42 2008
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 03:58:42 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV6A2AE4C644956EDA4DE60E8550@phx.gbl>
References: <48C53EFC.3090602@optonline.net>
	<BAY135-DAV6A2AE4C644956EDA4DE60E8550@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <48C5F467.4010308@optonline.net>

Thanks all.  Joe L. pointed out Atlanta Hobbies has the cables for a lot 
cheaper.  $4.99  Could also be used as 2 donor ends.
Stuart

Ed Alt wrote:
> Stu:
>
> Try Digikey.com
>
> Ed
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stuart Chale" <schale at optonline.net>
> To: "NSRCA Mailing List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 10:04 AM
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends
>
>
>> Does anyone have a source for the 3 pin female data cable ends for 
>> the TP charger to balancer connection?
>> They have a habit of breaking usually right at the pin making it 
>> difficult to repair.  A prewired pigtail or double female extension 
>> that could be cut in half would allow easy repairs and hopefully 
>> cheaper than $10 to replace the cable each time it breaks.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Stuart C.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>


From moleski at canisius.edu  Mon Sep  8 20:17:05 2008
From: moleski at canisius.edu (Martin X. Moleski, SJ)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 04:17:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] nsrca.us server update Tuesday morning
Message-ID: <48C5F8BE.2060108@canisius.edu>

nsrca.us is moving to a new server.

Better hardware and better software.

The site may be out of commission for a
couple of hours.

			Marty

From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Tue Sep  9 03:18:14 2008
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 11:18:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV99739DBB23871C2FE1171E8540@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <D90BAB2134DB4F298B5BCA112D557B01@jaysdesktop>

True, although I wasn't thinking of putting it on the metal. There is,
however, a type that is used for electronics that doesn't corrode.

 

Jay Marshall 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ed Alt
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 10:17 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

 

Be careful about using silicon sealer.  It has a tendency to corrode metal
over time.  Try Walthers Goo.

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Jay Marshall <mailto:lightfoot at sc.rr.com>  

To: 'General pattern discussion' <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>  

Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 8:32 PM

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

 

Something that has a little flex, such as silicone sealer, works better. If
you have a hard, immovable joint the wire will tend to break there.

 

Jay Marshall 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony
Romano
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 8:32 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

 

Hi Scott,
 Good point. A little left over epoxy works well for that too!

Anthony

 


  _____  


Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 18:00:52 -0400
From: js.smith at verizon.net
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

 

I don't have a source but if you get a new cable, pot the wires with a
little JB-Weld at the connector.  This will keep the wires from breaking at
the crimp.  Also, if you break off the locking tab, it's easier to connect
and disconnect.  

 

 

 



 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Stuart Chale
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 11:04 AM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

 

Does anyone have a source for the 3 pin female data cable ends for the 

TP charger to balancer connection?

They have a habit of breaking usually right at the pin making it 

difficult to repair.  A prewired pigtail or double female extension that 

could be cut in half would allow easy repairs and hopefully cheaper than 

$10 to replace the cable each time it breaks.

 

Thanks,

Stuart C.

 

_______________________________________________

NSRCA-discussion mailing list

NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 


  _____  


See how Windows connects the people, information, and fun that are part of
your life. See Now
<http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093175mrt/direct/01/> 


  _____  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From ejhaury at comcast.net  Tue Sep  9 03:46:54 2008
From: ejhaury at comcast.net (Earl Haury)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 11:46:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends
In-Reply-To: <D90BAB2134DB4F298B5BCA112D557B01@jaysdesktop>
References: <D90BAB2134DB4F298B5BCA112D557B01@jaysdesktop>
Message-ID: <CEA65D76C3C14E24AFC21C499801C051@EarlPC>

Aside from broken leads at the connectors, I've found that the connector sockets tend to loosen. This occurs not only on the data link sockets, but the balance lead connections. On the latter, the loose connection can produce erroneous imbalance readings resulting in the balancer actually creating imbalance rather than correcting it. Carefully removing each socket from the plastic housing and bending them so as to clamp tightly again works for awhile. I've removed the connectors from one balancer (balancer ends) and hard wired the extension / data leads to the pc board - tedious work. 

I've also found similar loose connections in the sockets between the two pc boards in the balancers. In one case a socket pin had "missed" the hole in the pc board during assembly, was only "tip" soldered and eventually broke. 

It's very easy for false information to sneak into a system that's measuring millivolts. 

Earl 

----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Jay Marshall 
  To: 'General pattern discussion' 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2008 6:17 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends


  True, although I wasn't thinking of putting it on the metal. There is, however, a type that is used for electronics that doesn't corrode.



  Jay Marshall 

  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Ed Alt
  Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 10:17 PM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends



  Be careful about using silicon sealer.  It has a tendency to corrode metal over time.  Try Walthers Goo.

    ----- Original Message ----- 

    From: Jay Marshall 

    To: 'General pattern discussion' 

    Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 8:32 PM

    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends



    Something that has a little flex, such as silicone sealer, works better. If you have a hard, immovable joint the wire will tend to break there.



    Jay Marshall 

    -----Original Message-----
    From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Romano
    Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 8:32 PM
    To: General pattern discussion
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends



    Hi Scott,
     Good point. A little left over epoxy works well for that too!

    Anthony




----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 18:00:52 -0400
    From: js.smith at verizon.net
    To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends



    I don't have a source but if you get a new cable, pot the wires with a little JB-Weld at the connector.  This will keep the wires from breaking at the crimp.  Also, if you break off the locking tab, it's easier to connect and disconnect.  













    -----Original Message-----
    From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Stuart Chale
    Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 11:04 AM
    To: NSRCA Mailing List
    Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends



    Does anyone have a source for the 3 pin female data cable ends for the 

    TP charger to balancer connection?

    They have a habit of breaking usually right at the pin making it 

    difficult to repair.  A prewired pigtail or double female extension that 

    could be cut in half would allow easy repairs and hopefully cheaper than 

    $10 to replace the cable each time it breaks.



    Thanks,

    Stuart C.



    _______________________________________________

    NSRCA-discussion mailing list

    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion




----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    See how Windows connects the people, information, and fun that are part of your life. See Now


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    _______________________________________________
    NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From brian_w_young at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  9 05:14:04 2008
From: brian_w_young at yahoo.com (brian young)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 13:14:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FS: TP 1010C, Balancer, data cable
Message-ID: <160293.71722.qm@web35207.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

http://www.rcuniverse.com/market/mymarket-selling.cfm


      
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From moleski at canisius.edu  Tue Sep  9 07:47:17 2008
From: moleski at canisius.edu (Martin X. Moleski, SJ)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 15:47:17 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Basic changeover finished
Message-ID: <48C69A7A.90007@canisius.edu>

nsrca.us is now up and running on the new server.

I can log in both as a user (front end) and as an
administrator (back end).

I have edited, saved, edited, saved the article
on the front page.

My impression is that we're in good shape.

Thyme needs the new username for the database;
then it should come alive (I hope).  All the
data has been transferred to the new site and
MySQL server.

I'll be available, on and off, between now
and 12:40 and then again after 2:30 PM.

Feedback appreciated.

			Marty

				Martin X. Moleski, SJ
				Loyola Hall
				Canisius College
				Buffalo, New York  14208

				Voice: (716) 888-2383
				  FAX: (716) 886-6506

				http://www.canisius.edu/~moleski/

				http://moleski.net


From brian_w_young at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  9 07:56:08 2008
From: brian_w_young at yahoo.com (brian young)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 15:56:08 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion]  FS: TP 1010C, Balancer, data cable
Message-ID: <905132.72717.qm@web35202.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

...This one works....

http://www.rcuniverse.com/market/item.cfm?itemID=431261 


      
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From simestd at netexpress.com  Tue Sep  9 08:21:15 2008
From: simestd at netexpress.com (Tom Simes)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 16:21:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Basic changeover finished
In-Reply-To: <48C69A7A.90007@canisius.edu>
References: <48C69A7A.90007@canisius.edu>
Message-ID: <20080909082113.632dc566.simestd@netexpress.com>

On Tue, 09 Sep 2008 11:47:06 -0400
"Martin X. Moleski, SJ" <moleski at canisius.edu> wrote:
 
> Feedback appreciated.

Thanks for the care and feeding of the site Marty :)

Tom
 
======================================================================
   "Z-80 system stack overflow.  Shut 'er down Scotty, the system's
         sucking mud" - Error message on TRS 80 Model-16B

Tom Simes                                       simestd at netexpress.com 
======================================================================

From moleski at canisius.edu  Tue Sep  9 08:33:01 2008
From: moleski at canisius.edu (Martin X. Moleski, SJ)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 16:33:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Basic changeover finished
In-Reply-To: <20080909082113.632dc566.simestd@netexpress.com>
References: <48C69A7A.90007@canisius.edu>
	<20080909082113.632dc566.simestd@netexpress.com>
Message-ID: <48C6A536.3010906@canisius.edu>

Tom Simes wrote:

>> Feedback appreciated.

> Thanks for the care and feeding of the site Marty :)

You're welcome.

It's a joy when it works!

				Marty

From rcmaster199 at aol.com  Tue Sep  9 09:51:43 2008
From: rcmaster199 at aol.com (rcmaster199 at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 17:51:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV99739DBB23871C2FE1171E8540@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY135-DAV99739DBB23871C2FE1171E8540@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <8CAE0BBCB2C2F45-16E8-861@WEBMAIL-DG03.sim.aol.com>

  Ed's correct in regard to RTV silicone sealing compounds. They produce 
acetic acid upon curing.

However, silicone rubber designed for insulation purposes (different 
curing method than RTV) has one of the highest di-electric strengths we 
can produce. RTV is not one of these chemicals so be forewarned

MattK

-----Original Message-----
From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 10:17 pm
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

Be careful about using silicon sealer.? It has
a tendency to corrode metal over time.? Try Walthers Goo.

  ----- Original Message -----
  From:
  Jay
  Marshall
  To: 'General pattern
  discussion'
  Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 8:32
  PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder
  Power data cable ends



  Something that has a
   little flex, such as silicone sealer, works better. If you have a 
hard,
  immovable joint the wire will tend to break there.
  ?


Jay
  Marshall
  -----Original
  Message-----
From:
  nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
  [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]
  On Behalf Of Anthony
  Romano
Sent: Monday,
  September 08, 2008 8:32 PM
To: General pattern
  discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder
  Power data cable ends
  ?
  Hi Scott,
?Good point.=2
0A
  little left over epoxy works well for that
  too!

Anthony






  Date:
  Mon, 8 Sep 2008 18:00:52 -0400
From: js.smith at verizon.net
To:
  nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder
  Power data cable ends

  ?
  I don?t have
   a source but if you get a new cable, pot the wires with a little 
JB-Weld at
  the connector.? This will keep the wires from breaking at the
   crimp.? Also, if you break off the locking tab, it?s easier to 
connect
  and disconnect. ?
  ?
  ?
  ?

  ?
  ?
  -----Original
  Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
  [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Stuart
  Chale
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 11:04 AM
To: NSRCA Mailing
  List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable
  ends
  ?
  Does anyone
  have a source for the 3 pin female data cable ends for the
  TP charger to
  balancer connection?
  They have a
  habit of breaking usually right at the pin making it
  difficult to
  repair.? A prewired pigtail or double female extension that

  could be cut
  in half would allow easy repairs and hopefully cheaper than
  $10 to
  replace the cable each time it breaks.
  ?
  Thanks,
  Stuart
  C.
  0
  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing
  list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  ?



  See how Windows connects the
  people, information, and fun that are part of your life. See Now





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion
  mailing
  list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



From brian_w_young at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  9 10:14:31 2008
From: brian_w_young at yahoo.com (brian young)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 18:14:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Corrosives - Electronics Burning
Message-ID: <737041.54204.qm@web35204.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

The silicone brought this to my mind. I had a speed control roast in my plane this spring, it smoked up pretty good and pretty well looked like a charcoal briquet;? but luckily nothing else burnt in the plane and the batteries didnt get damaged (apparently) as the leads desoldered and opened the circuit.
?
I noticed the next time out that every screw or bare metal part exposed inside the fuse had a rust coating on it. Im curious if the insulation on the PC board or wires burn producing a corrosive gas; anyone? 
?
Then that makes me wonder about the receiver and wire connections in the radio..although I have since replaced the receiver.


      
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From vanputte at cox.net  Tue Sep  9 10:29:25 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 18:29:25 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Basic changeover finished
In-Reply-To: <48C69A7A.90007@canisius.edu>
References: <48C69A7A.90007@canisius.edu>
Message-ID: <8BB43831-998C-4D60-8BDB-EC027D16B79E@cox.net>

Thanks Marty and anyone else who was involved with this.  I'm glad  
there are people with the knowhow, ambition and time to get jobs like  
this done.

Ron VP

On Sep 9, 2008, at 10:47 AM, Martin X. Moleski, SJ wrote:

> nsrca.us is now up and running on the new server.
>
> I can log in both as a user (front end) and as an
> administrator (back end).
>
> I have edited, saved, edited, saved the article
> on the front page.
>
> My impression is that we're in good shape.
>
> Thyme needs the new username for the database;
> then it should come alive (I hope).  All the
> data has been transferred to the new site and
> MySQL server.
>
> I'll be available, on and off, between now
> and 12:40 and then again after 2:30 PM.
>
> Feedback appreciated.
>
> 			Marty
>
> 				Martin X. Moleski, SJ
> 				Loyola Hall
> 				Canisius College
> 				Buffalo, New York  14208
>
> 				Voice: (716) 888-2383
> 				  FAX: (716) 886-6506
>
> 				http://www.canisius.edu/~moleski/
>
> 				http://moleski.net
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From moleski at canisius.edu  Tue Sep  9 10:50:39 2008
From: moleski at canisius.edu (Martin X. Moleski)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 18:50:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Basic changeover finished
In-Reply-To: <8BB43831-998C-4D60-8BDB-EC027D16B79E@cox.net>
References: <48C69A7A.90007@canisius.edu>
	<8BB43831-998C-4D60-8BDB-EC027D16B79E@cox.net>
Message-ID: <48C6C577.402@canisius.edu>

Ron Van Putte wrote:
> Thanks Marty and anyone else who was involved with this. 
You're welcome.
> I'm glad there are people with the knowhow, ambition and time to get 
> jobs like this done.
We've got a nice group of people on the webteam and acting as District 
webmasters.

When this upgrade seems to be working OK, there are some other Joomla 
software
upgrades we need to make (Community Builder, discussion forums). It 
should be
fun.

Marty

From getterflash at yahoo.com  Tue Sep  9 11:32:55 2008
From: getterflash at yahoo.com (Bob Kane)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 19:32:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Corrosives - Electronics Burning
Message-ID: <937950.65481.qm@web36706.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Once you add combustion to the equation I'm sure some of the resulting compounds are corrosive. 

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com



----- Original Message ----
From: brian young <brian_w_young at yahoo.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 9, 2008 2:14:29 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Corrosives - Electronics Burning


The silicone brought this to my mind. I had a speed control roast in my plane this spring, it smoked up pretty good and pretty well looked like a charcoal briquet;  but luckily nothing else burnt in the plane and the batteries didnt get damaged (apparently) as the leads desoldered and opened the circuit.
 
I noticed the next time out that every screw or bare metal part exposed inside the fuse had a rust coating on it. Im curious if the insulation on the PC board or wires burn producing a corrosive gas; anyone? 
 
Then that makes me wonder about the receiver and wire connections in the radio..although I have since replaced the receiver.



      
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From mjfrederick at cox.net  Tue Sep  9 14:15:28 2008
From: mjfrederick at cox.net (Matthew Frederick)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 22:15:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Finally!!!
Message-ID: <F888740B798748E1BD4D1C09510AD287@Mattmobile>

Well, over a week has passed since Hurricane Gustav graced us with his presence and I finally have cable and internet back!!! Now if they could just fix those pesky power lines!

Matt
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From dwaynenancy at suddenlink.net  Tue Sep  9 14:48:25 2008
From: dwaynenancy at suddenlink.net (Dwayne Brown)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 22:48:25 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends
In-Reply-To: <8CAE0BBCB2C2F45-16E8-861@WEBMAIL-DG03.sim.aol.com>
Message-ID: <B78D637205B14776809E4999AEE3FE04@YoursMine>

If you will get either Dow Corning 3140 or 3145 you may dip you electronics
in these w/o fear.  That is what they were made to do.  If is smells like
vinegar don't use it as that is acetic acid and will corrode.  Dwayne

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
rcmaster199 at aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2008 12:51 PM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

  Ed's correct in regard to RTV silicone sealing compounds. They produce 
acetic acid upon curing.

However, silicone rubber designed for insulation purposes (different 
curing method than RTV) has one of the highest di-electric strengths we 
can produce. RTV is not one of these chemicals so be forewarned

MattK

-----Original Message-----
From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 10:17 pm
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable ends

Be careful about using silicon sealer.? It has
a tendency to corrode metal over time.? Try Walthers Goo.

  ----- Original Message -----
  From:
  Jay
  Marshall
  To: 'General pattern
  discussion'
  Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 8:32
  PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder
  Power data cable ends



  Something that has a
   little flex, such as silicone sealer, works better. If you have a 
hard,
  immovable joint the wire will tend to break there.
  ?


Jay
  Marshall
  -----Original
  Message-----
From:
  nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
  [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]
  On Behalf Of Anthony
  Romano
Sent: Monday,
  September 08, 2008 8:32 PM
To: General pattern
  discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder
  Power data cable ends
  ?
  Hi Scott,
?Good point.=2
0A
  little left over epoxy works well for that
  too!

Anthony






  Date:
  Mon, 8 Sep 2008 18:00:52 -0400
From: js.smith at verizon.net
To:
  nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder
  Power data cable ends

  ?
  I don?t have
   a source but if you get a new cable, pot the wires with a little 
JB-Weld at
  the connector.? This will keep the wires from breaking at the
   crimp.? Also, if you break off the locking tab, it?s easier to 
connect
  and disconnect. ?
  ?
  ?
  ?

  ?
  ?
  -----Original
  Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
  [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Stuart
  Chale
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 11:04 AM
To: NSRCA Mailing
  List
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Thunder Power data cable
  ends
  ?
  Does anyone
  have a source for the 3 pin female data cable ends for the
  TP charger to
  balancer connection?
  They have a
  habit of breaking usually right at the pin making it
  difficult to
  repair.? A prewired pigtail or double female extension that

  could be cut
  in half would allow easy repairs and hopefully cheaper than
  $10 to
  replace the cable each time it breaks.
  ?
  Thanks,
  Stuart
  C.
  0
  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing
  list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  ?



  See how Windows connects the
  people, information, and fun that are part of your life. See Now





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion
  mailing
  list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion____________________
___________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com 
Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.6.19/1662 - Release Date: 9/9/2008
10:47 AM



From Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au  Tue Sep  9 15:05:11 2008
From: Tom.Koenig at actewagl.com.au (Koenig, Tom)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 23:05:11 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Finally!!!
References: <F888740B798748E1BD4D1C09510AD287@Mattmobile>
Message-ID: <A80938E906BC3340B0E7C4731F4B355E024406FC@semailbox02>

Just some Trivia...
 
My late fathers name was Gustav...and my sisters name is Hannah!!!
 
Plus I have family in Florida....so I'm sure my uncle had some chills up
his spine!!!
 
Tom ( forgotten what rain even feels like)

________________________________

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Matthew
Frederick
Sent: Wednesday, 10 September 2008 8:15 AM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Finally!!!


Well, over a week has passed since Hurricane Gustav graced us with his
presence and I finally have cable and internet back!!! Now if they could
just fix those pesky power lines!
 
Matt
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Tue Sep  9 15:05:18 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2008 23:05:18 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Futaba Flight Achievement Results?
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNCEONCMAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

Does anyone have them? I've never seen them posted... or shown anywhere.

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com 
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.6.19/1662 - Release Date: 9/9/2008 10:47 AM



From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Wed Sep 10 06:33:35 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 14:33:35 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] test
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGEPCCMAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

I seemed to have failed the last 2.... how about this one?

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com 
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.6.19/1664 - Release Date: 9/10/2008 6:00 AM



From patternrules at yahoo.com  Wed Sep 10 06:36:39 2008
From: patternrules at yahoo.com (Steven Maxwell)
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 14:36:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] test
In-Reply-To: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGEPCCMAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <920643.43408.qm@web58406.mail.re3.yahoo.com>

Your coming though loud and clear good buddy, LOL

--- On Wed, 9/10/08, JShulman <jshulman at cfl.rr.com> wrote:

From: JShulman <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] test
To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Wednesday, September 10, 2008, 10:31 AM

I seemed to have failed the last 2.... how about this one?

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com 
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.6.19/1664 - Release Date: 9/10/2008 6:00
AM


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



      
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From jlachow at hotmail.com  Wed Sep 10 07:09:47 2008
From: jlachow at hotmail.com (Joe Lachowski)
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 15:09:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OS 140 RX for sale
Message-ID: <BAY101-W304DEAA613791CC1CD8DEBB570@phx.gbl>


I have an OS 140 RX for sale. Rehabed about 40 flights ago. Comes with 4 headers(some used, some not),used ES 160 pipe, and an assortment of spare parts (piston, rings, needle valves etc). Asking $450 for everything.
 
Contact me off list if interested.
_________________________________________________________________
Get Windows Live and get whatever you need, wherever you are.  Start here.
http://www.windowslive.com/default.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Home_082008
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From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Wed Sep 10 07:44:58 2008
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 15:44:58 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Adjustable stab kit  - extra AL rod?
Message-ID: <738lm5$dbcan@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>

Hi All,

 

Does anyone have a handy source for, or an extra AL rod like that used
in the adjustable stab kit?  I need one.  Does HD or Lowes carry
something in this size?

 

Thanks,

Jim W.

 

 

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From mjfrederick at cox.net  Wed Sep 10 07:46:31 2008
From: mjfrederick at cox.net (mjfrederick at cox.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 15:46:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Adjustable stab kit  - extra AL rod?
In-Reply-To: <738lm5$dbcan@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <20080910114624.3FJR7.213013.imail@eastrmwml36>

I have 2 Gator adjustable stab kits with the aluminum rod. I'd be willing to part with one, if that suits your needs.

Matt
---- "Woodward wrote: 
> Hi All,
> 
>  
> 
> Does anyone have a handy source for, or an extra AL rod like that used
> in the adjustable stab kit?  I need one.  Does HD or Lowes carry
> something in this size?
> 
>  
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Jim W.
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 


From tony at radiosouthrc.com  Wed Sep 10 07:58:27 2008
From: tony at radiosouthrc.com (Tony)
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 15:58:27 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Adjustable stab kit  - extra AL rod?
In-Reply-To: <20080910114624.3FJR7.213013.imail@eastrmwml36>
References: <738lm5$dbcan@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>
	<20080910114624.3FJR7.213013.imail@eastrmwml36>
Message-ID: <9E81CF2A6E1645AD93E61260008B5D7E@Tony>

I still have about 10 sets of Gator adj. stab kits here, if anyone needs
them.  I also have the adjusters only as well.


Tony Stillman, President
Radio South, Inc.
139 Altama Connector, Box 322
Brunswick, GA  31525
1-800-962-7802
www.radiosouthrc.com

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
mjfrederick at cox.net
Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 11:46 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Adjustable stab kit - extra AL rod?

I have 2 Gator adjustable stab kits with the aluminum rod. I'd be willing to
part with one, if that suits your needs.

Matt
---- "Woodward wrote: 
> Hi All,
> 
>  
> 
> Does anyone have a handy source for, or an extra AL rod like that used
> in the adjustable stab kit?  I need one.  Does HD or Lowes carry
> something in this size?
> 
>  
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Jim W.
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Wed Sep 10 10:39:33 2008
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 18:39:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Adjustable stab kit  - extra AL rod?
In-Reply-To: <738lm5$dbcan@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <737og9$35lh5@dmzms99902.na.baesystems.com>

Thank you everyone  - rod round and on the way.

 

Thanks,

Jim

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Woodward,
Jim (US SSA)
Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 11:42 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Adjustable stab kit - extra AL rod?

 

Hi All,

 

Does anyone have a handy source for, or an extra AL rod like that used
in the adjustable stab kit?  I need one.  Does HD or Lowes carry
something in this size?

 

Thanks,

Jim W.

 

 

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From gene.maurice at sgmservice.com  Wed Sep 10 11:21:50 2008
From: gene.maurice at sgmservice.com (Gene Maurice)
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 19:21:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ceramic Bearings
Message-ID: <000001c9137a$78ef3410$6acd9c30$@maurice@sgmservice.com>

Does anyone have any experience with ceramic bearings, specifically, Si3N4
silicon nitride, in a glow application?? I have been using sealed Stainless
Steel in my OS160's with pretty good luck. The ceramics are a bit more
expensive but the stated properties are pretty attractive in our
environment; very high temperature, low mass, totally corrosion resistant,
reduced friction, etc.. Any input would be appreciated.

 

Gene Maurice

Plano, TX

AMA 3408 NSRCA 877

PACSS.sgmservice.com

gene.maurice at sgmservice.com

 

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From maureendunphy at bellsouth.net  Wed Sep 10 11:48:24 2008
From: maureendunphy at bellsouth.net (maureendunphy at bellsouth.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 19:48:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Adjustable stab kit  - extra AL rod?
In-Reply-To: <20080910114624.3FJR7.213013.imail@eastrmwml36>
References: <738lm5$dbcan@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>
	<20080910114624.3FJR7.213013.imail@eastrmwml36>
Message-ID: <091020081948.23579.48C824840004CABB00005C1B22243429029B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBFC7C89C0A070D0D01080C9D0C0E9F@att.net>

When Tony runs out, PAC also carries the Gator stab adjusters and wing adjusters.

Maureen
--
PAC R/C Hobbies 
215 South Lowry Street 
Smyrna, TN 37167 
615-220-0655 
www.pac-rc.com

-------------- Original message from <mjfrederick at cox.net>: -------------- 

I have 2 Gator adjustable stab kits with the aluminum rod. I'd be willing to 
> part with one, if that suits your needs. 
> 
> Matt 
> ---- "Woodward wrote: 
> > Hi All, 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Does anyone have a handy source for, or an extra AL rod like that used 
> > in the adjustable stab kit? I need one. Does HD or Lowes carry 
> > something in this size? 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Thanks, 
> > 
> > Jim W. 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From ronlock at comcast.net  Wed Sep 10 12:34:59 2008
From: ronlock at comcast.net (ronlock at comcast.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 20:34:59 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ceramic Bearings
Message-ID: <091020082034.13173.48C82F6E00054822000033752200758942050C010402019D@comcast.net>

I tried Ceramic bearings from Boca several years ago in an OS 1.40rx, running
in typical pattern set up, around 7,800.
As I recall, at only 30 flights or so they got rough.
Don't know how that may apply to current day ceramics.

Ron Lockhart
-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: "Gene Maurice" <gene.maurice at sgmservice.com> 

Does anyone have any experience with ceramic bearings, specifically, Si3N4 silicon nitride, in a glow application?? I have been using sealed Stainless Steel in my OS160?s with pretty good luck. The ceramics are a bit more expensive but the stated properties are pretty attractive in our environment; very high temperature, low mass, totally corrosion resistant, reduced friction, etc?? Any input would be appreciated.
 
Gene Maurice
Plano, TX
AMA 3408 NSRCA 877
PACSS.sgmservice.com
gene.maurice at sgmservice.com
 
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From: "Gene Maurice" <gene.maurice at sgmservice.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ceramic Bearings
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 19:22:43 +0000
Size: 721
URL: <http://lists.nsrca.org/pipermail/nsrca-discussion/attachments/20080910/6d651ee0/attachment.mht>

From ronlock at comcast.net  Wed Sep 10 12:34:59 2008
From: ronlock at comcast.net (ronlock at comcast.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 20:34:59 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ceramic Bearings
Message-ID: <091020082034.13173.48C82F6E00054822000033752200758942050C010402019D@comcast.net>

I tried Ceramic bearings from Boca several years ago in an OS 1.40rx, running
in typical pattern set up, around 7,800.
As I recall, at only 30 flights or so they got rough.
Don't know how that may apply to current day ceramics.

Ron Lockhart
-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: "Gene Maurice" <gene.maurice at sgmservice.com> 

Does anyone have any experience with ceramic bearings, specifically, Si3N4 silicon nitride, in a glow application?? I have been using sealed Stainless Steel in my OS160?s with pretty good luck. The ceramics are a bit more expensive but the stated properties are pretty attractive in our environment; very high temperature, low mass, totally corrosion resistant, reduced friction, etc?? Any input would be appreciated.
 
Gene Maurice
Plano, TX
AMA 3408 NSRCA 877
PACSS.sgmservice.com
gene.maurice at sgmservice.com
 
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From: "Gene Maurice" <gene.maurice at sgmservice.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ceramic Bearings
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 19:22:43 +0000
Size: 721
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From ojfrets at earthlink.net  Wed Sep 10 13:28:04 2008
From: ojfrets at earthlink.net (ORLANDO  FRETS)
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 21:28:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ceramic Bearings
In-Reply-To: <000001c9137a$78ef3410$6acd9c30$@maurice@sgmservice.com>
References: <000001c9137a$78ef3410$6acd9c30$@maurice@sgmservice.com>
Message-ID: <3FB81EFEECB64344B17BCC083B512004@OrlandoPC>

I know of several Pylon Racing guys using the ceramic bearings and swear by
them.
However, for pattern I do not know if they will take the prop loads
encountered. Pylon does not have the prop loads pattern does. 


Orlando Frets

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Gene Maurice
Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 3:22 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Ceramic Bearings

Does anyone have any experience with ceramic bearings, specifically, Si3N4
silicon nitride, in a glow application?? I have been using sealed Stainless
Steel in my OS160's with pretty good luck. The ceramics are a bit more
expensive but the stated properties are pretty attractive in our
environment; very high temperature, low mass, totally corrosion resistant,
reduced friction, etc.. Any input would be appreciated.

 

Gene Maurice

Plano, TX

AMA 3408 NSRCA 877

PACSS.sgmservice.com

gene.maurice at sgmservice.com

 



From mjfrederick at cox.net  Wed Sep 10 14:14:46 2008
From: mjfrederick at cox.net (Matthew Frederick)
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 22:14:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Adjustable stab kit  - extra AL rod?
References: <737og9$35lh5@dmzms99902.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <A5E5F9E62A924992A89E343B5F1DDD6C@Mattmobile>

Sorry I didn't get back to you quicker, Jim. So you don't need one from me?

Matt
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Woodward, Jim (US SSA) 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 1:36 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Adjustable stab kit - extra AL rod?


  Thank you everyone  - rod round and on the way.

   

  Thanks,

  Jim

   

  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Woodward, Jim (US SSA)
  Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 11:42 AM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Adjustable stab kit - extra AL rod?

   

  Hi All,

   

  Does anyone have a handy source for, or an extra AL rod like that used in the adjustable stab kit?  I need one.  Does HD or Lowes carry something in this size?

   

  Thanks,

  Jim W.

   

   



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From warrior523 at mchsi.com  Wed Sep 10 16:03:44 2008
From: warrior523 at mchsi.com (Dan)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 00:03:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield, MO Contest
Message-ID: <001501c913a1$d4704640$6500a8c0@warrior>

Guys,

This weekend is our contest here at Springfield.  The weather forecast has been pretty iffy the past few days and now it is getting down right ugly.  Keeping in mind what we went through last year with the rain all day Saturday I am very doubtfull that we will be able to get the contest in due to rains. Several inches (6 to 9) are possible from late Thursday until late Sunday evening.  I want to give us every chance possible to have the contest so I am holding off on a cancellation decision until I see a bit more about the weather during the day tomorrow.  I will post the final decision no later than 5 pm Thursday, but I will tell you all right now I really have my doubts about trying to have it this weekend.  Please pass this info on to anyone else that you might know of that was planning on coming.

Thanks and feel free to contact me with any thoughts.

Dan Curtis
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From jaqfly at prodigy.net  Wed Sep 10 19:35:27 2008
From: jaqfly at prodigy.net (Jim Quinn)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 03:35:27 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Adjustable stab kit  - extra AL rod?
Message-ID: <241733.59827.qm@web83301.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

JIm,

Try your local? hobby shop.

JIm Q.



----- Original Message ----
From: "Woodward, Jim (US SSA)" <jim.woodward at baesystems.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 11:41:32 AM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Adjustable stab kit - extra AL rod?


Hi All,
?
Does anyone have a handy source for, or an extra AL rod like that used in the adjustable stab kit?? I need one.? Does HD or Lowes carry something in this size?
?
Thanks,
Jim W.
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From getterflash at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 11 08:00:14 2008
From: getterflash at yahoo.com (Bob Kane)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 16:00:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District mailing lists down?
Message-ID: <703238.51910.qm@web36705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I sent a message to the D4 mailing list dist4 at nsrca.org and it did not go through. Anybody know who to contact?

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com



      
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From getterflash at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 11 08:05:17 2008
From: getterflash at yahoo.com (Bob Kane)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 16:05:17 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District mailing lists down?
Message-ID: <105932.57389.qm@web36708.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Nevermind, seems to be working now .  .

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com



----- Original Message ----
From: Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2008 12:00:10 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District mailing lists down?


I sent a message to the D4 mailing list dist4 at nsrca.org and it did not go through. Anybody know who to contact?

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com


      
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From moleski at canisius.edu  Thu Sep 11 08:35:18 2008
From: moleski at canisius.edu (Martin X. Moleski, SJ)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 16:35:18 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District mailing lists down?
In-Reply-To: <703238.51910.qm@web36705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <703238.51910.qm@web36705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <48C948C2.8020301@canisius.edu>

Bob Kane wrote:

> I sent a message to the D4 mailing list dist4 at nsrca.org and it did not
> go through. Anybody know who to contact?

I forwarded your question to Tom Simes.

He manages all of our mailing lists.

His mail server was not involved in the transition
on Tuesday.

So far as he can tell, all of the lists are up and
running.  We do have a new system of managing the
district mailing lists.  Tom may kill off the old
address in due time with appropriate notice.

I'm sure he will look into your question and reply
as soon as he is able.

				Marty

From simestd at netexpress.com  Thu Sep 11 09:01:56 2008
From: simestd at netexpress.com (Tom Simes)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 17:01:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District mailing lists down?
In-Reply-To: <703238.51910.qm@web36705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <703238.51910.qm@web36705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20080911090153.72b9b80d.simestd@netexpress.com>

On Thu, 11 Sep 2008 09:00:10 -0700 (PDT)
Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:

> I sent a message to the D4 mailing list dist4 at nsrca.org and it did not
> go through. Anybody know who to contact?

Hi Bob (and everyone),

If you have problems with any NSRCA mailing lists, please let me know -
I handle their care and feeding.

As far as I know, there have been no recent problems with the list
server.  If you ever feel a need to check whether a particular post
of yours made it to a given list, you can always check the archives
which are updated real time.  In the case of the D4 list, here are the
September archives:

http://lists.nsrca.org/pipermail/nsrca-dist4/2008-September/date.html

Back in May of this year we migrated the distX at nsrca.org lists
to the same Mailman server that the main discussion list uses
(lists.nsrca.org).  For the migration, I put forwards in place on the
old addresses to give folks time to update their address books.  Since
May, the correct addresses for the district lists have been of the form:

nsrca-distX at lists.nsrca.org

Here's the complete list:

http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo

Several people have been posting to both the new and old list addresses
which is causing duplicate posts because of the forwards.  Since
they are now causing more harm than good, I'll be removing the
distX at nsrca.org forwards shortly, please update your address books as
appropriate.

Thanks,

Tom
 
======================================================================
   "Z-80 system stack overflow.  Shut 'er down Scotty, the system's
         sucking mud" - Error message on TRS 80 Model-16B

Tom Simes                                       simestd at netexpress.com 
======================================================================

From khoard at gmail.com  Thu Sep 11 09:27:57 2008
From: khoard at gmail.com (Keith Hoard)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 17:27:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] NMP Header Frustration
Message-ID: <6792ef120809111027p577226b7sf9c09e38695d821f@mail.gmail.com>

Engine Problems?  Why - Yes!!!

OK, I'm running a YS 1.40L, Hyde Mount, NMP header, short Hatori pipe . . .
and the NMP header keeps loosening itself after every 10-20 flights.  I am
using the header strap, and have installed all of the copper washers and
even a couple extras (per Troy Newman).  The frustrating part is that when I
try to remove the little aluminum button to re-install the header, it strips
out because it is made from some very soft aluminum.  Right now, the button
is almost completely stripped out and I'm getting ready to ship the whole
mess back to Central.

Any good ideas out there, or should I just order the Hatori header?
Thanks!!

-- 

Keith Hoard
Collierville, TN
khoard at gmail.com
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From jbuchner at mclumber.com  Thu Sep 11 09:28:49 2008
From: jbuchner at mclumber.com (Jeff Buchner)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 17:28:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield, MO Contest
In-Reply-To: <001501c913a1$d4704640$6500a8c0@warrior>
Message-ID: <003d01c91433$8a71c810$2701a8c0@mclumber.com>

Hi Dan

I for one am willing to support your club and would come down and fly in
between rain showers like we did last year. No it's not going to be prime
weather but I still like seeing everybody, getting in a few rounds of
flying, and the bull sessions in between. Hope to see you and Springfield
crew this weekend.

Jeff Buchner

  -----Original Message-----
  From: Dan [mailto:warrior523 at mchsi.com]
  Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 7:03 PM
  To: NSRCA Mailing List
  Cc: vicenterc at comcast.net; Todd Schmidt; Rhodes, Russell G; Mike Howard;
Kaut, Ken; John DeLuca; John "Spanky" Clevenger; Joe Dunnaway; Jim Wilson;
Jerry Voth; Jeff Buchner; George Ashley; Forrest Wilhite; Doug Bennett; DOUG
ANDERSON; David Campbell; Claude Weimer; Chris White
  Subject: Springfield, MO Contest


  Guys,

  This weekend is our contest here at Springfield.  The weather forecast has
been pretty iffy the past few days and now it is getting down right ugly.
Keeping in mind what we went through last year with the rain all day
Saturday I am very doubtfull that we will be able to get the contest in due
to rains. Several inches (6 to 9) are possible from late Thursday until late
Sunday evening.  I want to give us every chance possible to have the contest
so I am holding off on a cancellation decision until I see a bit more about
the weather during the day tomorrow.  I will post the final decision no
later than 5 pm Thursday, but I will tell you all right now I really have my
doubts about trying to have it this weekend.  Please pass this info on to
anyone else that you might know of that was planning on coming.

  Thanks and feel free to contact me with any thoughts.

  Dan Curtis
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From ghwatson at comcast.net  Thu Sep 11 09:59:52 2008
From: ghwatson at comcast.net (Glen Watson)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 17:59:52 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] NMP Header Frustration
In-Reply-To: <6792ef120809111027p577226b7sf9c09e38695d821f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20080911175951.359DD114C3@bridi.netexpress.com>

Keith,

Two things that work for me with the NMP header...

1) I use Teflon (plumbers) tape on thread areas of the header...

2) I purchased a flex gear wrench (see attached pic if the list allowed it
to go thru) to use with the provide NMP fitting to tightening and loosing.
The wrench enables you to place uniform force close to the surface area to
help prevent boggiering up the soft aluminum.  Plus it has a ratchet action.
Works great, 3/8 is the size I use.

Regards,

Glen Watson
http://glenwatson.blogspot.com/


________________________________________
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Keith Hoard
Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2008 12:28 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] NMP Header Frustration

Engine Problems?? Why - Yes!!!

OK, I'm running a YS 1.40L, Hyde Mount, NMP header, short Hatori pipe . . .
and the NMP header keeps loosening itself after every 10-20 flights.? I am
using the header strap, and have installed all of the copper washers and
even a couple extras (per Troy Newman).? The frustrating part is that when I
try to remove the little aluminum button to re-install the header, it strips
out because it is made from some very soft aluminum.? Right now, the button
is almost completely stripped out and I'm getting ready to ship the whole
mess back to Central.

Any good ideas out there, or should I just order the Hatori header??
Thanks!!

-- 

Keith Hoard
Collierville, TN
khoard at gmail.com

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From warrior523 at mchsi.com  Thu Sep 11 13:29:50 2008
From: warrior523 at mchsi.com (Dan)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 21:29:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield Contest
Message-ID: <002e01c91455$80acbe30$6500a8c0@warrior>

Well, I need about another hour or so to check with more weather guessers.  I will have yes or no posted a little after 6 pm this evening.  It has started raining here now.  

Hang in there with me for a little longer, I would love to get this contest in if I think it is possible.

Dan
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From tschmidt at classicnet.net  Thu Sep 11 14:49:02 2008
From: tschmidt at classicnet.net (tschmidt at classicnet.net)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 22:49:02 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield Contest
References: <002e01c91455$80acbe30$6500a8c0@warrior>
Message-ID: <A57C1328E3A54EB5BD96EBE68096889D@gateway1ba02af>

Dan, I'm with Joe and Jeff!

Todd
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Dan 
  To: NSRCA Mailing List 
  Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2008 4:29 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield Contest


  Well, I need about another hour or so to check with more weather guessers.  I will have yes or no posted a little after 6 pm this evening.  It has started raining here now.  

  Hang in there with me for a little longer, I would love to get this contest in if I think it is possible.

  Dan


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From warrior523 at mchsi.com  Thu Sep 11 15:02:53 2008
From: warrior523 at mchsi.com (Dan)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2008 23:02:53 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield Contest.....IS ON
Message-ID: <001a01c91462$81f298c0$6500a8c0@warrior>

Okay guys here is what we have decided.  Weather is very iffy, could be some flying possible tomorrow and even some on Saturday, not sure how much or what time on Saturday the heavy stuff will begin coming in.  Sunday is probably a goner but who knows for sure...the weather guessers sure don't.  Anyhow, myself and the usual suspects will be at the field for the contest, including Friday for people arriving early. Those that want to come and join us, then by all means come on down.  We will do are darndest to be good host and see that it is as enjoyble as possible for all.  We will get in as many rounds as we can, maybe the clouds will let us get an earlier start on Saturday.

Looking forward to seeing all the make the trip and hope to see everyone at Ft. Scott.

Dan Curtis
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From dunnaway at hbcomm.net  Thu Sep 11 16:08:00 2008
From: dunnaway at hbcomm.net (Joe Dunnaway)
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 2008 00:08:00 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield Contest.....IS ON
In-Reply-To: <001a01c91462$81f298c0$6500a8c0@warrior>
References: <001a01c91462$81f298c0$6500a8c0@warrior>
Message-ID: <48C9B26A.5040304@hbcomm.net>

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From ggall at bellsouth.net  Thu Sep 11 17:47:19 2008
From: ggall at bellsouth.net (Gerald Gallagher)
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 2008 01:47:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield Contest.....IS ON
In-Reply-To: <48C9B26A.5040304@hbcomm.net>
Message-ID: <B48A53FFD20949249E59F8DDE2ACF322@geraldsdell>

Good luck Dan.
 
 

Jerry Gallagher

 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Joe Dunnaway
Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2008 8:06 PM
To: Dan
Cc: Forrest Wilhite; Doug Bennett; DOUG ANDERSON; David Campbell; George
Ashley; Kaut,Ken; Rhodes,Russell G; John "Spanky" Clevenger; NSRCA Mailing
List; Chris White; John DeLuca; Jim Wilson
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield Contest.....IS ON


GREAT DAN!!!!

It will be fun no matter what the weather does. :)

See ya tomorrow.

Joe


Dan wrote: 

Okay guys here is what we have decided.  Weather is very iffy, could be some
flying possible tomorrow and even some on Saturday, not sure how much or
what time on Saturday the heavy stuff will begin coming in.  Sunday is
probably a goner but who knows for sure...the weather guessers sure don't.
Anyhow, myself and the usual suspects will be at the field for the contest,
including Friday for people arriving early. Those that want to come and join
us, then by all means come on down.  We will do are darndest to be good host
and see that it is as enjoyble as possible for all.  We will get in as many
rounds as we can, maybe the clouds will let us get an earlier start on
Saturday.
 
Looking forward to seeing all the make the trip and hope to see everyone at
Ft. Scott.
 
Dan Curtis

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From warrior523 at mchsi.com  Thu Sep 11 19:20:20 2008
From: warrior523 at mchsi.com (Dan)
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 2008 03:20:20 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield Contest.....IS ON
References: <B48A53FFD20949249E59F8DDE2ACF322@geraldsdell>
Message-ID: <001d01c91486$78b6d130$6500a8c0@warrior>

MessageThanks Jerry,

Hope everything is going well with you.  Come up and see us sometime.

Dan
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Gerald Gallagher 
  To: 'General pattern discussion' 
  Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2008 8:47 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield Contest.....IS ON


  Good luck Dan.


  Jerry Gallagher

   

    -----Original Message-----
    From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Joe Dunnaway
    Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2008 8:06 PM
    To: Dan
    Cc: Forrest Wilhite; Doug Bennett; DOUG ANDERSON; David Campbell; George Ashley; Kaut,Ken; Rhodes,Russell G; John "Spanky" Clevenger; NSRCA Mailing List; Chris White; John DeLuca; Jim Wilson
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield Contest.....IS ON


    GREAT DAN!!!!

    It will be fun no matter what the weather does. :)

    See ya tomorrow.

    Joe


    Dan wrote: 
      Okay guys here is what we have decided.  Weather is very iffy, could be some flying possible tomorrow and even some on Saturday, not sure how much or what time on Saturday the heavy stuff will begin coming in.  Sunday is probably a goner but who knows for sure...the weather guessers sure don't.  Anyhow, myself and the usual suspects will be at the field for the contest, including Friday for people arriving early. Those that want to come and join us, then by all means come on down.  We will do are darndest to be good host and see that it is as enjoyble as possible for all.  We will get in as many rounds as we can, maybe the clouds will let us get an earlier start on Saturday.

      Looking forward to seeing all the make the trip and hope to see everyone at Ft. Scott.

      Dan Curtis


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From Autoford6 at aol.com  Sat Sep 13 03:58:12 2008
From: Autoford6 at aol.com (Autoford6 at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 11:58:12 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] test
Message-ID: <d20.396ce9f1.35fd04ca@aol.com>

test



**************Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, 
plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com.      
(http://www.stylelist.com/trends?ncid=aolsty00050000000014)
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From pamrich47 at hotmail.com  Sat Sep 13 07:11:20 2008
From: pamrich47 at hotmail.com (Richard Strickland)
Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 15:11:20 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] test
In-Reply-To: <d20.396ce9f1.35fd04ca@aol.com>
References: <d20.396ce9f1.35fd04ca@aol.com>
Message-ID: <BAY128-W25B59954CFBFDE9E4A0D04A0500@phx.gbl>


I see ya from Reno..
RS



From: Autoford6 at aol.comDate: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 07:58:02 -0400To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgSubject: [NSRCA-discussion] test

test


Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com.
_________________________________________________________________
Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows Live.
http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008
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From flyinbill1 at bellsouth.net  Sat Sep 13 17:23:15 2008
From: flyinbill1 at bellsouth.net (William C. Harden)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 01:23:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] RCRC contest today
Message-ID: <94AF04A276554D9598BDF32194D0935F@bill>

There are twenty one registered pilots in attendance today.  The weather was
partly sunny, around 90 degrees and the wind was from the south at 15 mph
gusting to 20.  

The classes were well and evenly supported except FAI, which had one pilot
(Raiko Potter).  From what I witnessed, the pilots handled the wind pretty
well.  At 1:30 PM the pilots had completed 2 rounds and the third round was
underway.  

Bill


From d_bodary at yahoo.com  Sat Sep 13 17:58:31 2008
From: d_bodary at yahoo.com (Dennis Bodary)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 01:58:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!
In-Reply-To: <A0479B8F561743D3B6040653DD874657@astafford>
Message-ID: <899843.74396.qm@web51705.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Don't forget the important thing. "The Chicken Guy"

--- On Mon, 9/8/08, Archie Stafford <astafford at swtexas.net> wrote:

From: Archie Stafford <astafford at swtexas.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!
To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Monday, September 8, 2008, 9:53 PM

Mark,

Actually a few years ago at our pre Nats get together we actually discussed
kind of D1 v. D4 kind of contest.  The location would work out well for
that.  And I'm sure the weekend could be adjusted if needed.  The field is
so easy to get to and so pattern friendly with lots of hotels and
restaurants just a few miles from the field...

Arch

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Mark Atwood
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 6:25 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 St. Clairsville Contest - D1 Invite!

Just wanted to extend a thank you to Rick Cillas and Wes Stafford (yeah,
that's Archie's Dad) for putting on a great contest in St. Clairsville,
OH
(on the WV border) this weekend.  The weather was a challenge, but the event
was excellent, highlighted by great food both days!

This event location is fairly new, and is now on a brand new field that was
excellent for pattern flying.  We only had 13 people, which speaks to the
location relative to our district (eastern edge of D4).

It seems to me that there must be some flyers in the Western PA region, WV,
Western NY that would be pretty close to this contest and I would encourage
you to consider it for your 2009 calendar.  It would be nice to get some
cross district participation on our Eastern shores that rivals the D4-D5
participation we get on the western side of the district.

Anyhow, great event, and a job well done by Rick and Wes.  Thanks for all
the effort!!

-Mark

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



      
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From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Sun Sep 14 06:37:34 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 14:37:34 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston, SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
Message-ID: <20080914093731.OJDXU.98615.root@Web02>

Hi all,

As I start cleaning up here in Lake Charles after IKE, I see on the news that the Houston and Beaumont areas were much harder hit than we were.  Since most of the contestant pool for our upcoming contest (Gulf Coast Pattern Championship) planned for October 4-5 would be coming from that area, I'm wondering how you guys feel about it?  

Were you:
1) far enough inland to avoid significant damage and want to proceed as planned 
2) Have too much going on now to worry about pattern and would rather cancel or postpone the contest?

I haven't been out to our field yet to assess the damage there ( Rita took off our canopy and club house roof, and destroyed most of our work tables), but I doubt that the runway was damaged, so if you want to have it, we can probably go ahead from a facilities standpoint.

My thoughts today are with Ron, Glen, Jim, Mark, Richard, Buddy, and the other "pattern guys" out there in SE TX.  

I realize that if you had significant damage, you probably won't get this message, but it's the thought that counts<G>.

G

From ejhaury at comcast.net  Sun Sep 14 08:01:31 2008
From: ejhaury at comcast.net (Earl Haury)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 16:01:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
	SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
In-Reply-To: <20080914093731.OJDXU.98615.root@Web02>
References: <20080914093731.OJDXU.98615.root@Web02>
Message-ID: <89DBC32D88FB44B581234E04CD8130FE@EarlPC>

George

I vote for "Proceed as planned", a number of us are going to N Dallas next 
weekend - can't let a hurricane impede pattern activities. Those of us on 
the west side came out pretty well, mostly yard debris and loss of power. I 
haven't heard from the north side folks - they may have been hit harder, 
especially Ron's area.

Earl
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net>
To: "NSRCA List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2008 9:37 AM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston, SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors


> Hi all,
>
> As I start cleaning up here in Lake Charles after IKE, I see on the news 
> that the Houston and Beaumont areas were much harder hit than we were. 
> Since most of the contestant pool for our upcoming contest (Gulf Coast 
> Pattern Championship) planned for October 4-5 would be coming from that 
> area, I'm wondering how you guys feel about it?
>
> Were you:
> 1) far enough inland to avoid significant damage and want to proceed as 
> planned
> 2) Have too much going on now to worry about pattern and would rather 
> cancel or postpone the contest?
>
> I haven't been out to our field yet to assess the damage there ( Rita took 
> off our canopy and club house roof, and destroyed most of our work 
> tables), but I doubt that the runway was damaged, so if you want to have 
> it, we can probably go ahead from a facilities standpoint.
>
> My thoughts today are with Ron, Glen, Jim, Mark, Richard, Buddy, and the 
> other "pattern guys" out there in SE TX.
>
> I realize that if you had significant damage, you probably won't get this 
> message, but it's the thought that counts<G>.
>
> G
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


From mwaustin54 at cox.net  Sun Sep 14 08:26:57 2008
From: mwaustin54 at cox.net (mwaustin54 at cox.net)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 16:26:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
 SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
In-Reply-To: <89DBC32D88FB44B581234E04CD8130FE@EarlPC>
Message-ID: <20080914122655.AD706.279554.imail@fed1rmwml35>

All, 
My duaghter's family spent the weekend in Kingwood with relatives and like Earl's story they area had min damage from her report(some trees blown down and no electricty) and no cell phone service but no flooding. Text messages could go out which is how I am communicating with them.

maustin
---- Earl Haury <ejhaury at comcast.net> wrote: 
> George
> 
> I vote for "Proceed as planned", a number of us are going to N Dallas next 
> weekend - can't let a hurricane impede pattern activities. Those of us on 
> the west side came out pretty well, mostly yard debris and loss of power. I 
> haven't heard from the north side folks - they may have been hit harder, 
> especially Ron's area.
> 
> Earl
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net>
> To: "NSRCA List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2008 9:37 AM
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston, SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
> 
> 
> > Hi all,
> >
> > As I start cleaning up here in Lake Charles after IKE, I see on the news 
> > that the Houston and Beaumont areas were much harder hit than we were. 
> > Since most of the contestant pool for our upcoming contest (Gulf Coast 
> > Pattern Championship) planned for October 4-5 would be coming from that 
> > area, I'm wondering how you guys feel about it?
> >
> > Were you:
> > 1) far enough inland to avoid significant damage and want to proceed as 
> > planned
> > 2) Have too much going on now to worry about pattern and would rather 
> > cancel or postpone the contest?
> >
> > I haven't been out to our field yet to assess the damage there ( Rita took 
> > off our canopy and club house roof, and destroyed most of our work 
> > tables), but I doubt that the runway was damaged, so if you want to have 
> > it, we can probably go ahead from a facilities standpoint.
> >
> > My thoughts today are with Ron, Glen, Jim, Mark, Richard, Buddy, and the 
> > other "pattern guys" out there in SE TX.
> >
> > I realize that if you had significant damage, you probably won't get this 
> > message, but it's the thought that counts<G>.
> >
> > G
> > _______________________________________________
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From geobet at gis.net  Sun Sep 14 09:07:19 2008
From: geobet at gis.net (george w. kennie)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 17:07:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] batteries
Message-ID: <007a01c9168c$55a4b560$6501a8c0@CYBERPOWER>

I ran into Dan of True RC this weekend at the Neat Fair and he advised that the 5000 Series paks were expected in this coming Friday.
He has 50 sets on order and also advised that he expects that they will sell out in about a week.

I remember seeing concerns on this list regarding availability, so I thought I would give a heads-up.

G.

-- 
I am using the free version of SPAMfighter for home users.
SPAMfighter has removed 16028 spam emails to date.
Paying users do not have this message in their emails.
Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len
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From derek_lieber at bellsouth.net  Sun Sep 14 10:07:27 2008
From: derek_lieber at bellsouth.net (derek_lieber at bellsouth.net)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 18:07:27 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FS Prestige Pattern Plane - New In Box
Message-ID: <091420081807.18055.48CD52DB000344D50000468722230682329B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9D0A0D0A0704A1050A9D0A0B@att.net>


I'm selling my new-in-box Prestige. This is the Prestige f3a pattern plane manufactured by Wistmodels in Poland. It is all composite construction, made from balsa/glass/carbon laminate with carbon gear and wing joiner. Control surfaces are live-hinged in the mold, with wipers. This is the electric version (lightweight layup) with the optional accessory pack that includes carbon battery tray, carbon spinner, aluminum wing/stab adjusters and misc. small hardware items needed to finish. I purchased this kit in early 2007 but subsequent life events have prevented me from assembling or flying it. The kit is immaculate. Everything is still in the original plastic bubble wrap. Color is all white with dark metallic blue canopy and wing bottoms. 

Asking $1900.

Note: cannot ship - local pickup, or, will deliver/meet you within reasonable radius of Knoxville, TN.

Derek Lieber
derek_lieber at bellsouth.net


From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Sun Sep 14 12:55:10 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 20:55:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
 SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
In-Reply-To: <89DBC32D88FB44B581234E04CD8130FE@EarlPC>
Message-ID: <20080914155505.LD7H3.104303.root@Web02>

Earl,

I'm glad to hear that you came through the storm undamaged!  I too am going to try to make it to Frisco, but I'm not sure I can manage it....Hope to see you there.

G
---- Earl Haury <ejhaury at comcast.net> wrote: 

=============
George

I vote for "Proceed as planned", a number of us are going to N Dallas next 
weekend - can't let a hurricane impede pattern activities. Those of us on 
the west side came out pretty well, mostly yard debris and loss of power. I 
haven't heard from the north side folks - they may have been hit harder, 
especially Ron's area.

Earl
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net>
To: "NSRCA List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2008 9:37 AM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston, SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors


> Hi all,
>
> As I start cleaning up here in Lake Charles after IKE, I see on the news 
> that the Houston and Beaumont areas were much harder hit than we were. 
> Since most of the contestant pool for our upcoming contest (Gulf Coast 
> Pattern Championship) planned for October 4-5 would be coming from that 
> area, I'm wondering how you guys feel about it?
>
> Were you:
> 1) far enough inland to avoid significant damage and want to proceed as 
> planned
> 2) Have too much going on now to worry about pattern and would rather 
> cancel or postpone the contest?
>
> I haven't been out to our field yet to assess the damage there ( Rita took 
> off our canopy and club house roof, and destroyed most of our work 
> tables), but I doubt that the runway was damaged, so if you want to have 
> it, we can probably go ahead from a facilities standpoint.
>
> My thoughts today are with Ron, Glen, Jim, Mark, Richard, Buddy, and the 
> other "pattern guys" out there in SE TX.
>
> I realize that if you had significant damage, you probably won't get this 
> message, but it's the thought that counts<G>.
>
> G
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From ghwatson at comcast.net  Sun Sep 14 13:23:44 2008
From: ghwatson at comcast.net (ghwatson at comcast.net)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 21:23:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
	SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
Message-ID: <091420082123.11522.48CD80DA000CBF1B00002D02221558639402019C9B0E990809@comcast.net>

George,

All is well here in NW Houston, specifically Cypress... power restored as of 10am Sat.  I am in the shop as I type working on projects.  

I vote to go forward with the contest as planned.
--
Regards,

Glen Watson

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> 

> Hi all, 
> 
> As I start cleaning up here in Lake Charles after IKE, I see on the news that 
> the Houston and Beaumont areas were much harder hit than we were. Since most of 
> the contestant pool for our upcoming contest (Gulf Coast Pattern Championship) 
> planned for October 4-5 would be coming from that area, I'm wondering how you 
> guys feel about it? 
> 
> Were you: 
> 1) far enough inland to avoid significant damage and want to proceed as planned 
> 2) Have too much going on now to worry about pattern and would rather cancel or 
> postpone the contest? 
> 
> I haven't been out to our field yet to assess the damage there ( Rita took off 
> our canopy and club house roof, and destroyed most of our work tables), but I 
> doubt that the runway was damaged, so if you want to have it, we can probably go 
> ahead from a facilities standpoint. 
> 
> My thoughts today are with Ron, Glen, Jim, Mark, Richard, Buddy, and the other 
> "pattern guys" out there in SE TX. 
> 
> I realize that if you had significant damage, you probably won't get this 
> message, but it's the thought that counts. 
> 
> G 
> _______________________________________________ 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From BUDDYonRC at aol.com  Sun Sep 14 14:45:23 2008
From: BUDDYonRC at aol.com (BUDDYonRC at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 22:45:23 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
	SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
Message-ID: <c61.3641d817.35feedfb@aol.com>

George 
I will not be there we will not have power restored for at least three  weeks 
and some say three month's Now Living in the area that will most likely be  
brought up later Houston is getting service first. we havent seen the first  
utility service truck or other service providers since the storm passed I  have 
my own generator running on natural gas and will survive.
Buddy
PS.The Sabine power station at Bridgecity is five feet  under water. 



**************Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, 
plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com.      
(http://www.stylelist.com/trends?ncid=aolsty00050000000014)
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From cahochhalter at yahoo.com  Sun Sep 14 14:53:41 2008
From: cahochhalter at yahoo.com (Charles Hochhalter)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 22:53:41 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
	SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
In-Reply-To: <c61.3641d817.35feedfb@aol.com>
Message-ID: <452679.91621.qm@web83205.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Buddy, glad to hear all is as can be and that you are taking care of yourself!
?
I have heard of no ill effects so far from anyone that can't be overcome with town.
?
Chuck Hochhalter

--- On Sun, 9/14/08, BUDDYonRC at aol.com <BUDDYonRC at aol.com> wrote:

From: BUDDYonRC at aol.com <BUDDYonRC at aol.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston, SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Sunday, September 14, 2008, 10:45 PM



George 
I will not be there we will not have power restored for at least three weeks and some say three month's Now Living in the area that will most likely be brought up later Houston is getting service first. we havent seen the first utility service truck or other service providers?since the storm passed I have my own generator running on natural gas and will survive.
Buddy
PS.The Sabine power station at Bridgecity is five feet ?under water. 





Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com._______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jlkonn at hotmail.com  Sun Sep 14 14:54:19 2008
From: jlkonn at hotmail.com (John Konneker)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 22:54:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
 SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
In-Reply-To: <c61.3641d817.35feedfb@aol.com>
References: <c61.3641d817.35feedfb@aol.com>
Message-ID: <BLU106-W58FC2F39F6950C2CE47B7ACD530@phx.gbl>


Hi Buddy,
I'm an ex-Beaumonter now living in Iowa.  What we have to deal with are ice storms and loss of power.
We don't have natural gas but we do have propane.  How did you go about making the conversion
so that you don't have to worry about gasoline supply for your generator?
JLK



From: BUDDYonRC at aol.comDate: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 18:45:15 -0400To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgSubject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston, SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors

George 
I will not be there we will not have power restored for at least three weeks and some say three month's Now Living in the area that will most likely be brought up later Houston is getting service first. we havent seen the first utility service truck or other service providers since the storm passed I have my own generator running on natural gas and will survive.
Buddy
PS.The Sabine power station at Bridgecity is five feet  under water. 


Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com.
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From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Sun Sep 14 14:55:35 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 22:55:35 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
 SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
In-Reply-To: <091420082123.11522.48CD80DA000CBF1B00002D02221558639402019C9B0E990809@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <20080914175530.R7KHA.106080.root@Web02>

Thanks, Glen.  I'm glad you made it through safely!  I can't get motivated to get out to the shop, yet.  Maybe next week.

I just heard from Randy Liprie who went out to the field this afternoon.  We have some damage to the metal canopy, but most is intact and there is no appreciable damage to the clubhouse or runway, so let's say the Contest is going as scheduled!  

G


---- ghwatson at comcast.net wrote: 

=============
George,

All is well here in NW Houston, specifically Cypress... power restored as of 10am Sat.  I am in the shop as I type working on projects.  

I vote to go forward with the contest as planned.
--
Regards,

Glen Watson

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> 

> Hi all, 
> 
> As I start cleaning up here in Lake Charles after IKE, I see on the news that 
> the Houston and Beaumont areas were much harder hit than we were. Since most of 
> the contestant pool for our upcoming contest (Gulf Coast Pattern Championship) 
> planned for October 4-5 would be coming from that area, I'm wondering how you 
> guys feel about it? 
> 
> Were you: 
> 1) far enough inland to avoid significant damage and want to proceed as planned 
> 2) Have too much going on now to worry about pattern and would rather cancel or 
> postpone the contest? 
> 
> I haven't been out to our field yet to assess the damage there ( Rita took off 
> our canopy and club house roof, and destroyed most of our work tables), but I 
> doubt that the runway was damaged, so if you want to have it, we can probably go 
> ahead from a facilities standpoint. 
> 
> My thoughts today are with Ron, Glen, Jim, Mark, Richard, Buddy, and the other 
> "pattern guys" out there in SE TX. 
> 
> I realize that if you had significant damage, you probably won't get this 
> message, but it's the thought that counts. 
> 
> G 
> _______________________________________________ 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 

From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Sun Sep 14 14:58:52 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 22:58:52 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
 SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
In-Reply-To: <c61.3641d817.35feedfb@aol.com>
Message-ID: <20080914175850.WPPNW.106128.root@Web02>

Hi Buddy,

I know that ya'll got hit VERY hard!  Let me know if there is anything that I can do to help you get through this.  We were without power here for 3 weeks after Rita....and I don't have a generator. 
 

G
---- BUDDYonRC at aol.com wrote: 

=============
George 
I will not be there we will not have power restored for at least three  weeks 
and some say three month's Now Living in the area that will most likely be  
brought up later Houston is getting service first. we havent seen the first  
utility service truck or other service providers since the storm passed I  have 
my own generator running on natural gas and will survive.
Buddy
PS.The Sabine power station at Bridgecity is five feet  under water. 



**************Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, 
plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com.      
(http://www.stylelist.com/trends?ncid=aolsty00050000000014)


From mjfrederick at cox.net  Sun Sep 14 17:18:17 2008
From: mjfrederick at cox.net (Matthew Frederick)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 01:18:17 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
	SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
References: <20080914093731.OJDXU.98615.root@Web02>
Message-ID: <D1551E1CD6104EB2A8ADF55BB3600BAC@Mattmobile>

I'd like to see it postponed because I still don't have anything to fly... 
:-)

Matt
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net>
To: "NSRCA List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2008 9:37 AM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston, SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors


> Hi all,
>
> As I start cleaning up here in Lake Charles after IKE, I see on the news 
> that the Houston and Beaumont areas were much harder hit than we were. 
> Since most of the contestant pool for our upcoming contest (Gulf Coast 
> Pattern Championship) planned for October 4-5 would be coming from that 
> area, I'm wondering how you guys feel about it?
>
> Were you:
> 1) far enough inland to avoid significant damage and want to proceed as 
> planned
> 2) Have too much going on now to worry about pattern and would rather 
> cancel or postpone the contest?
>
> I haven't been out to our field yet to assess the damage there ( Rita took 
> off our canopy and club house roof, and destroyed most of our work 
> tables), but I doubt that the runway was damaged, so if you want to have 
> it, we can probably go ahead from a facilities standpoint.
>
> My thoughts today are with Ron, Glen, Jim, Mark, Richard, Buddy, and the 
> other "pattern guys" out there in SE TX.
>
> I realize that if you had significant damage, you probably won't get this 
> message, but it's the thought that counts<G>.
>
> G
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


From bob at toprudder.com  Sun Sep 14 17:34:50 2008
From: bob at toprudder.com (Robert Richards)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 01:34:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
	SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
In-Reply-To: <BLU106-W58FC2F39F6950C2CE47B7ACD530@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <70078.30111.qm@web1106.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>

John,
   
  Try this link:
   
  http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/21337191.cfm
   
  Hope this helps.
   
  Bob R.
  

John Konneker <jlkonn at hotmail.com> wrote:
      .hmmessage P  {  margin:0px;  padding:0px  }  body.hmmessage  {  FONT-SIZE: 10pt;  FONT-FAMILY:Tahoma  }    Hi Buddy,
I'm an ex-Beaumonter now living in Iowa.  What we have to deal with are ice storms and loss of power.
We don't have natural gas but we do have propane.  How did you go about making the conversion
so that you don't have to worry about gasoline supply for your generator?
JLK


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From jlkonn at hotmail.com  Sun Sep 14 17:42:55 2008
From: jlkonn at hotmail.com (John Konneker)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 01:42:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
 SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
In-Reply-To: <70078.30111.qm@web1106.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
References: <BLU106-W58FC2F39F6950C2CE47B7ACD530@phx.gbl>
	<70078.30111.qm@web1106.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BLU106-W39F2ED040263832865E837CD520@phx.gbl>


Thanks Bob!
JLK



Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 18:34:46 -0700From: bob at toprudder.comTo: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgSubject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston, SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
John,
 
Try this link:
 
http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/21337191.cfm
 
Hope this helps.
 
Bob R.
John Konneker <jlkonn at hotmail.com> wrote:


Hi Buddy,I'm an ex-Beaumonter now living in Iowa.  What we have to deal with are ice storms and loss of power.We don't have natural gas but we do have propane.  How did you go about making the conversionso that you don't have to worry about gasoline supply for your generator?JLK
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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Sun Sep 14 19:58:41 2008
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (Mark Atwood)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 03:58:41 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships
Message-ID: <C4F355AD.2E56D%atwoodm@paragon-inc.com>

Hey All,

Just wanted to send out a formal invite to anyone in range (D5? D1? D2?...)
to attend the annual District 4 Championship Night Fly/ Fireworks
extravaganza and pattern contest!

THIS...is the contest of contests...at least in this region.  Great Pattern
event (usually better than 35 contestants), a tremendous Steak cookout, and
then a night fly contest that is....illuminating to say the least.

Directions to the event can be found on the Flying Cardinals club web site
http://www.flyingcardinals.org/directions.htm

Looks like we?re going to have some great weather for the weekend (ok, it?s
still 5 days away, but as of now it looks great).

Hope to see everyone there!!

-Mark
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From steveandlaurel at valornet.com  Sun Sep 14 20:51:04 2008
From: steveandlaurel at valornet.com (Steve Ford)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 04:51:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield Contest
Message-ID: <92027809432B4CC482849BB16A4D42C1@Home>

Big thanks to Dan and the Springfield crew for a great contest this weekend.  Perfect practice day on Friday, and great timing dodging the rain on Saturday with 4 fun rounds.  

Steve Ford
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From jbuchner at mclumber.com  Mon Sep 15 04:24:30 2008
From: jbuchner at mclumber.com (Jeff Buchner)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 12:24:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield Contest
In-Reply-To: <92027809432B4CC482849BB16A4D42C1@Home>
Message-ID: <00f101c9172d$f927ebc0$2701a8c0@mclumber.com>

I have to agree with Steve. The pattern gods were watching out for us. Good
Time, Good Contest, Good Friends!

Jeff Buchner
  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Steve Ford
  Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2008 11:51 PM
  To: NSRCS Board
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield Contest


  Big thanks to Dan and the Springfield crew for a great contest this
weekend.  Perfect practice day on Friday, and great timing dodging the rain
on Saturday with 4 fun rounds.

  Steve Ford
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From drmikedds at sbcglobal.net  Mon Sep 15 09:19:39 2008
From: drmikedds at sbcglobal.net (michael s harrison)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 17:19:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Jaicco regulators
Message-ID: <012501c91757$12d396e0$387ac4a0$@net>

Jim,

Could you send me instructions for ordering regulator and switchs.

Mike

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From kennedybryan at bellsouth.net  Mon Sep 15 13:15:02 2008
From: kennedybryan at bellsouth.net (Bryan Kennedy)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 21:15:02 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Quick update on the 40th Annual Rocket City
	Pattern Contest
Message-ID: <4F3CC91F171F47EB8D29741E2511AD2F@BryanKennedyPC>

Just a quick post to thank everyone for making it to the 40th annual
RCRC pattern contest.  We had a good turn out 21 registered pilots with
20 flying.
 
We completed 5 rounds total in Sportsman and Intermediate with 4 rounds
being flown in Advanced, Masters and FAI.
 
We did have one unfortunate mid-air. Raiko Potter (Pinnacle) and Larry
Odom (Black Magic) during the first round. 
 
Would like to start with thanking this years sponsor's.
 
*	Extreme Flight RC, donated a 58" Extra 300 kit and a Vanquish
combo kit with speed controller and motor
*	R/C Hobbies (Huntsville, AL) donated a 3D electric combo kit
with speed controller and Hacker motor
*	Don Peck donated $40.00 for our gas money drawing
 
I would like to thank RCRC club for allowing us to utilize this
fantastic facility. Thanks to Catherine Reuther for doing a fantastic
job with scoring (as usual) Tony Coberly assistant CD, Don Peck for
helping with concessions, and all the other RCRC club members that
helped out.
 
I will be submitting a formal report very soon, but here is the
standings information:
 
Sportsman
 
1.       Forrest Schaffer            4000
2.       Mike Williams               3866
3.       Louis Brown                 3760
4.       Mike Norton                  3690
5.       Larry Loucks                3334
6.       Ed Holliday                   3113
7.       Michael Prediger           1921
 
Intermediate
 
1.       Mikael Fedon                 4000
2.       Chris Odom                   3960
3.       Dean Funk                    3650
4.       Tony Coberly                 3625
5.       Kirk Sutherland              3607
6.       Bic Green                      3441
7.       Lawrence Odom 3112
 
Advanced
 
1.	Gary Courtney               4000
2.	Michael Wingo               2627
 
Masters
 
1.	John Fuqua                   3988
2.	Mike Hester                   3931
3.	Everette Carpenter         3713
 
FAI
 
1.	Raiko Potter                  3000
 
Thank you
Bryan Kennedy
CD
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From perkinsrx at centurytel.net  Mon Sep 15 14:23:49 2008
From: perkinsrx at centurytel.net (W. Eddie Batchelor)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 22:23:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
	SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
In-Reply-To: <20080914175850.WPPNW.106128.root@Web02>
Message-ID: <200809152223.m8FMNgMq005954@mail958c35.nsolutionszone.com>

George
Yes you do have a generator  BUT you should of got the 2K like I did. It
runs a 110 AC, 3 lights, and tv, and computer with no Prob.
OF course I've got a 6Kw for my frig & freezer :-)
All is well in DQ.

My sentiments and Prayers to SE TX also. Esp the Golden Triangle area.

Eddie 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
glmiller3 at suddenlink.net
Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2008 5:59 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Cc: BUDDYonRC at aol.com
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston, SE Texas and SW Louisiana
Competitors

Hi Buddy,

I know that ya'll got hit VERY hard!  Let me know if there is anything that
I can do to help you get through this.  We were without power here for 3
weeks after Rita....and I don't have a generator. 
 

G
---- BUDDYonRC at aol.com wrote: 

=============
George 
I will not be there we will not have power restored for at least three
weeks 
and some say three month's Now Living in the area that will most likely be  
brought up later Houston is getting service first. we havent seen the first

utility service truck or other service providers since the storm passed I
have 
my own generator running on natural gas and will survive.
Buddy
PS.The Sabine power station at Bridgecity is five feet  under water. 



**************Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, 
plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com.      
(http://www.stylelist.com/trends?ncid=aolsty00050000000014)

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From rob at koolsoft.com  Mon Sep 15 15:12:21 2008
From: rob at koolsoft.com (Robert L. Beaubien)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 23:12:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District mailing lists down?
In-Reply-To: <48C948C2.8020301@canisius.edu>
References: <703238.51910.qm@web36705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<48C948C2.8020301@canisius.edu>
Message-ID: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB2010ACFD3@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>

Hey Martin,

It appears the calendar stuff doesn't work on the new server.  Clicking
on the "New Calendar (under development)" link gives you a blank page
now.

- Robert Beaubien
- NSRCA, District 7 Webmaster
-
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Martin X.
Moleski, SJ
Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2008 9:35 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] District mailing lists down?

Bob Kane wrote:

> I sent a message to the D4 mailing list dist4 at nsrca.org and it did not
> go through. Anybody know who to contact?

I forwarded your question to Tom Simes.

He manages all of our mailing lists.

His mail server was not involved in the transition
on Tuesday.

So far as he can tell, all of the lists are up and
running.  We do have a new system of managing the
district mailing lists.  Tom may kill off the old
address in due time with appropriate notice.

I'm sure he will look into your question and reply
as soon as he is able.

				Marty
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From moleski at canisius.edu  Mon Sep 15 15:15:31 2008
From: moleski at canisius.edu (Martin X. Moleski, SJ)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 23:15:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District mailing lists down?
In-Reply-To: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB2010ACFD3@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>
References: <703238.51910.qm@web36705.mail.mud.yahoo.com>	<48C948C2.8020301@canisius.edu>
	<F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB2010ACFD3@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>
Message-ID: <48CEEC90.1030405@canisius.edu>

Robert,

> It appears the calendar stuff doesn't work on the new server.  Clicking
> on the "New Calendar (under development)" link gives you a blank page
> now.

Understood.

Thyme is a commercial product.  We couldn't install and
debug it on the new server because of licensing restrictions
UNTIL the new server became "nsrca.us" last Tuesday.

Buff is working on getting Thyme hooked up to its data
tables even as we speak.

The Thyme calendar should come back to life shortly
thereafter, all things being equal.

				Marty

From tschmidt at classicnet.net  Mon Sep 15 15:56:46 2008
From: tschmidt at classicnet.net (tschmidt at classicnet.net)
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2008 23:56:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield Contest
References: <92027809432B4CC482849BB16A4D42C1@Home>
Message-ID: <F5B75E0C72F245B1B16C38401E805A60@gateway1ba02af>

Yes, a big thanks to the Springfield gang for having the contest regardless of the weather forcast. Springfield is always a great place to visit and fly and was great fun Looking forward to next year!

Todd
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Steve Ford 
  To: NSRCS Board 
  Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2008 11:51 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Springfield Contest


  Big thanks to Dan and the Springfield crew for a great contest this weekend.  Perfect practice day on Friday, and great timing dodging the rain on Saturday with 4 fun rounds.  

  Steve Ford


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From flyintexan at att.net  Mon Sep 15 20:22:14 2008
From: flyintexan at att.net (Mark Hunt)
Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2008 04:22:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
	SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
References: <200809152223.m8FMNgMq005954@mail958c35.nsolutionszone.com>
Message-ID: <F6DD20A9A4E6424FA30FF6459444BDC7@MARK>

Just got power back on.....benn without since Fri. night......very minor 
damage in the yard...no problem with the house...some in my neighborhood 
were not so lucky.  Richard Lewis is same shape as I...he lives at the other 
end of the same subdivision.

No power still in alot of places around Houston.

Buddy, our thoughts are with you.  You sound much more prepared than most.

Don't know about going to Dallas...depends on how work goes...would love to 
make it though...


Mark



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "W. Eddie Batchelor" <perkinsrx at centurytel.net>
To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 15, 2008 5:23 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,SE Texas and SW Louisiana 
Competitors


> George
> Yes you do have a generator  BUT you should of got the 2K like I did. It
> runs a 110 AC, 3 lights, and tv, and computer with no Prob.
> OF course I've got a 6Kw for my frig & freezer :-)
> All is well in DQ.
>
> My sentiments and Prayers to SE TX also. Esp the Golden Triangle area.
>
> Eddie
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
> glmiller3 at suddenlink.net
> Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2008 5:59 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Cc: BUDDYonRC at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston, SE Texas and SW Louisiana
> Competitors
>
> Hi Buddy,
>
> I know that ya'll got hit VERY hard!  Let me know if there is anything 
> that
> I can do to help you get through this.  We were without power here for 3
> weeks after Rita....and I don't have a generator.
>
>
> G
> ---- BUDDYonRC at aol.com wrote:
>
> =============
> George
> I will not be there we will not have power restored for at least three
> weeks
> and some say three month's Now Living in the area that will most likely be
> brought up later Houston is getting service first. we havent seen the 
> first
>
> utility service truck or other service providers since the storm passed I
> have
> my own generator running on natural gas and will survive.
> Buddy
> PS.The Sabine power station at Bridgecity is five feet  under water.
>
>
>
> **************Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion 
> blog,
> plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com.
> (http://www.stylelist.com/trends?ncid=aolsty00050000000014)
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


From rob at koolsoft.com  Mon Sep 15 23:36:00 2008
From: rob at koolsoft.com (Robert L. Beaubien)
Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2008 07:36:00 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Mike Greear
In-Reply-To: <F6DD20A9A4E6424FA30FF6459444BDC7@MARK>
References: <200809152223.m8FMNgMq005954@mail958c35.nsolutionszone.com>
	<F6DD20A9A4E6424FA30FF6459444BDC7@MARK>
Message-ID: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB2010ACFE0@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>

Anyone have an email address for Mike Greear?

Thanx,

- Robert Beaubien
- NSRCA, District 7 Webmaster
-



From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Tue Sep 16 03:12:45 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2008 11:12:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
 SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
In-Reply-To: <F6DD20A9A4E6424FA30FF6459444BDC7@MARK>
Message-ID: <20080916061240.9DO1Z.143428.root@Web01>

Hey Mark,

Glad you and Richard made it OK!  

G
---- Mark Hunt <flyintexan at att.net> wrote: 

=============
Just got power back on.....benn without since Fri. night......very minor 
damage in the yard...no problem with the house...some in my neighborhood 
were not so lucky.  Richard Lewis is same shape as I...he lives at the other 
end of the same subdivision.

No power still in alot of places around Houston.

Buddy, our thoughts are with you.  You sound much more prepared than most.

Don't know about going to Dallas...depends on how work goes...would love to 
make it though...


Mark



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "W. Eddie Batchelor" <perkinsrx at centurytel.net>
To: "'General pattern discussion'" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 15, 2008 5:23 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,SE Texas and SW Louisiana 
Competitors


> George
> Yes you do have a generator  BUT you should of got the 2K like I did. It
> runs a 110 AC, 3 lights, and tv, and computer with no Prob.
> OF course I've got a 6Kw for my frig & freezer :-)
> All is well in DQ.
>
> My sentiments and Prayers to SE TX also. Esp the Golden Triangle area.
>
> Eddie
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
> glmiller3 at suddenlink.net
> Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2008 5:59 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Cc: BUDDYonRC at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston, SE Texas and SW Louisiana
> Competitors
>
> Hi Buddy,
>
> I know that ya'll got hit VERY hard!  Let me know if there is anything 
> that
> I can do to help you get through this.  We were without power here for 3
> weeks after Rita....and I don't have a generator.
>
>
> G
> ---- BUDDYonRC at aol.com wrote:
>
> =============
> George
> I will not be there we will not have power restored for at least three
> weeks
> and some say three month's Now Living in the area that will most likely be
> brought up later Houston is getting service first. we havent seen the 
> first
>
> utility service truck or other service providers since the storm passed I
> have
> my own generator running on natural gas and will survive.
> Buddy
> PS.The Sabine power station at Bridgecity is five feet  under water.
>
>
>
> **************Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion 
> blog,
> plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com.
> (http://www.stylelist.com/trends?ncid=aolsty00050000000014)
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Tue Sep 16 07:04:14 2008
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2008 15:04:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Mike Greear
In-Reply-To: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB2010ACFE0@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>
Message-ID: <857958.62940.qm@web33003.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

LuvtheRocs at aol.com

Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Tue, 9/16/08, Robert L. Beaubien <rob at koolsoft.com> wrote:
From: Robert L. Beaubien <rob at koolsoft.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Mike Greear
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 16, 2008, 12:35 AM

Anyone have an email address for Mike Greear?

Thanx,

- Robert Beaubien
- NSRCA, District 7 Webmaster
-


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



      
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From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Tue Sep 16 07:45:33 2008
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2008 15:45:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships
In-Reply-To: <C4F355AD.2E56D%atwoodm@paragon-inc.com>
Message-ID: <552133.55588.qm@web51010.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

http://www.weather.com/outlook/driving/interstate/weekend/USKY0801?from=36hr_topnav_driving
?
?Looking pretty nice! See you there on Friday with my Buds from Chitown. Mike

--- On Sun, 9/14/08, Mark Atwood <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com> wrote:

From: Mark Atwood <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships
To: "pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Sunday, September 14, 2008, 10:58 PM


Hey All,

Just wanted to send out a formal invite to anyone in range (D5? D1? D2?...) to attend the annual District 4 Championship Night Fly/ Fireworks extravaganza and pattern contest!

THIS...is the contest of contests...at least in this region. ?Great Pattern event (usually better than 35 contestants), a tremendous Steak cookout, and then a night fly contest that is....illuminating to say the least.

Directions to the event can be found on the Flying Cardinals club web site ?http://www.flyingcardinals.org/directions.htm

Looks like we?re going to have some great weather for the weekend (ok, it?s still 5 days away, but as of now it looks great).

Hope to see everyone there!!

-Mark _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From kerlock at comcast.net  Tue Sep 16 07:48:44 2008
From: kerlock at comcast.net (Mike Hester)
Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2008 15:48:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships
References: <552133.55588.qm@web51010.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <E7B7ADFB4ED740409A0B1F70FB2472F5@Sanity>

looks like the dragon horde will be there Friday! See ya there! 

-Mike

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: mike mueller 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2008 11:45 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships


        http://www.weather.com/outlook/driving/interstate/weekend/USKY0801?from=36hr_topnav_driving

         Looking pretty nice! See you there on Friday with my Buds from Chitown. Mike

        --- On Sun, 9/14/08, Mark Atwood <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com> wrote:

          From: Mark Atwood <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
          Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships
          To: "pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
          Date: Sunday, September 14, 2008, 10:58 PM


          Hey All,

          Just wanted to send out a formal invite to anyone in range (D5? D1? D2?...) to attend the annual District 4 Championship Night Fly/ Fireworks extravaganza and pattern contest!

          THIS...is the contest of contests...at least in this region.  Great Pattern event (usually better than 35 contestants), a tremendous Steak cookout, and then a night fly contest that is....illuminating to say the least.

          Directions to the event can be found on the Flying Cardinals club web site  http://www.flyingcardinals.org/directions.htm

          Looks like we?re going to have some great weather for the weekend (ok, it?s still 5 days away, but as of now it looks great).

          Hope to see everyone there!!

          -Mark 
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 





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  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



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From wilsorc at gmail.com  Tue Sep 16 09:10:53 2008
From: wilsorc at gmail.com (Bob Wilson)
Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2008 17:10:53 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships
In-Reply-To: <552133.55588.qm@web51010.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <C4F355AD.2E56D%atwoodm@paragon-inc.com>
	<552133.55588.qm@web51010.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <888fdd980809161010r35c3f9d9gb8e3f4e56b20ebb5@mail.gmail.com>

What are the dates of this contest?

2008/9/16 mike mueller <mups1953 at yahoo.com>

>
> http://www.weather.com/outlook/driving/interstate/weekend/USKY0801?from=36hr_topnav_driving
>
>  Looking pretty nice! See you there on Friday with my Buds from Chitown.
> Mike
>
> --- On *Sun, 9/14/08, Mark Atwood <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>* wrote:
>
> From: Mark Atwood <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships
> To: "pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Sunday, September 14, 2008, 10:58 PM
>
> Hey All,
>
> Just wanted to send out a formal invite to anyone in range (D5? D1? D2?...)
> to attend the annual District 4 Championship Night Fly/ Fireworks
> extravaganza and pattern contest!
>
> THIS...is the contest of contests...at least in this region.  Great Pattern
> event (usually better than 35 contestants), a tremendous Steak cookout, and
> then a night fly contest that is....illuminating to say the least.
>
> Directions to the event can be found on the Flying Cardinals club web site
>  *http://www.flyingcardinals.org/directions.htm
> **
> *Looks like we're going to have some great weather for the weekend (ok,
> it's still 5 days away, but as of now it looks great).
>
> Hope to see everyone there!!
>
> -Mark
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From donramsey at gmail.com  Tue Sep 16 09:17:01 2008
From: donramsey at gmail.com (Don Ramsey)
Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2008 17:17:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
	SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
In-Reply-To: <20080914093731.OJDXU.98615.root@Web02>
References: <20080914093731.OJDXU.98615.root@Web02>
Message-ID: <2c94dd7d0809161016y7f86f60cua3f37ada10269179@mail.gmail.com>

Conroe area was hit hard.  Power will probably not be for 2 weeks to a
month.  I do plan to go to North Dallas and would come to your contest.

Don

On Sun, Sep 14, 2008 at 9:37 AM, <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> As I start cleaning up here in Lake Charles after IKE, I see on the news
> that the Houston and Beaumont areas were much harder hit than we were.
>  Since most of the contestant pool for our upcoming contest (Gulf Coast
> Pattern Championship) planned for October 4-5 would be coming from that
> area, I'm wondering how you guys feel about it?
>
> Were you:
> 1) far enough inland to avoid significant damage and want to proceed as
> planned
> 2) Have too much going on now to worry about pattern and would rather
> cancel or postpone the contest?
>
> I haven't been out to our field yet to assess the damage there ( Rita took
> off our canopy and club house roof, and destroyed most of our work tables),
> but I doubt that the runway was damaged, so if you want to have it, we can
> probably go ahead from a facilities standpoint.
>
> My thoughts today are with Ron, Glen, Jim, Mark, Richard, Buddy, and the
> other "pattern guys" out there in SE TX.
>
> I realize that if you had significant damage, you probably won't get this
> message, but it's the thought that counts<G>.
>
> G
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From kerlock at comcast.net  Tue Sep 16 09:29:15 2008
From: kerlock at comcast.net (Mike Hester)
Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2008 17:29:15 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships
References: <C4F355AD.2E56D%atwoodm@paragon-inc.com><552133.55588.qm@web51010.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<888fdd980809161010r35c3f9d9gb8e3f4e56b20ebb5@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BFDB2E70311C4343826E78F96BE6065E@Sanity>

This weekend....
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Bob Wilson 
  To: mups1953 at yahoo.com ; General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2008 1:10 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships


  What are the dates of this contest?


  2008/9/16 mike mueller <mups1953 at yahoo.com>

          http://www.weather.com/outlook/driving/interstate/weekend/USKY0801?from=36hr_topnav_driving

           Looking pretty nice! See you there on Friday with my Buds from Chitown. Mike

          --- On Sun, 9/14/08, Mark Atwood <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com> wrote:

            From: Mark Atwood <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
            Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] District 4 Championships
            To: "pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
            Date: Sunday, September 14, 2008, 10:58 PM


            Hey All,

            Just wanted to send out a formal invite to anyone in range (D5? D1? D2?...) to attend the annual District 4 Championship Night Fly/ Fireworks extravaganza and pattern contest!

            THIS...is the contest of contests...at least in this region.  Great Pattern event (usually better than 35 contestants), a tremendous Steak cookout, and then a night fly contest that is....illuminating to say the least.

            Directions to the event can be found on the Flying Cardinals club web site  http://www.flyingcardinals.org/directions.htm

            Looks like we're going to have some great weather for the weekend (ok, it's still 5 days away, but as of now it looks great).

            Hope to see everyone there!!

            -Mark 
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


    _______________________________________________
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    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion







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From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Tue Sep 16 10:36:24 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2008 18:36:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
 SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
In-Reply-To: <2c94dd7d0809161016y7f86f60cua3f37ada10269179@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20080916133618.5Q0TH.155051.root@Web01>

Hi Don,

I'm glad to hear that you are still "in business", though cleanup is going to take a while for most of us.  I'm going to stay here this weekend and help clean up the field so that we can proceed with our contest as scheduled.

See ya then!

George
---- Don Ramsey <donramsey at gmail.com> wrote: 

=============
Conroe area was hit hard.  Power will probably not be for 2 weeks to a
month.  I do plan to go to North Dallas and would come to your contest.

Don

On Sun, Sep 14, 2008 at 9:37 AM, <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> As I start cleaning up here in Lake Charles after IKE, I see on the news
> that the Houston and Beaumont areas were much harder hit than we were.
>  Since most of the contestant pool for our upcoming contest (Gulf Coast
> Pattern Championship) planned for October 4-5 would be coming from that
> area, I'm wondering how you guys feel about it?
>
> Were you:
> 1) far enough inland to avoid significant damage and want to proceed as
> planned
> 2) Have too much going on now to worry about pattern and would rather
> cancel or postpone the contest?
>
> I haven't been out to our field yet to assess the damage there ( Rita took
> off our canopy and club house roof, and destroyed most of our work tables),
> but I doubt that the runway was damaged, so if you want to have it, we can
> probably go ahead from a facilities standpoint.
>
> My thoughts today are with Ron, Glen, Jim, Mark, Richard, Buddy, and the
> other "pattern guys" out there in SE TX.
>
> I realize that if you had significant damage, you probably won't get this
> message, but it's the thought that counts<G>.
>
> G
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>


From love2flypattern at yahoo.com  Tue Sep 16 13:43:22 2008
From: love2flypattern at yahoo.com (Jarvis Johnson)
Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2008 21:43:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Mike Greear
In-Reply-To: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB2010ACFE0@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>
Message-ID: <397593.76207.qm@web52707.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

LuvtheRocs at aol.com

--- On Tue, 9/16/08, Robert L. Beaubien <rob at koolsoft.com> wrote:

From: Robert L. Beaubien <rob at koolsoft.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Mike Greear
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 16, 2008, 12:35 AM

Anyone have an email address for Mike Greear?

Thanx,

- Robert Beaubien
- NSRCA, District 7 Webmaster
-


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From Lisandro.Zapata at rsandh.com  Wed Sep 17 06:36:56 2008
From: Lisandro.Zapata at rsandh.com (Zapata, Lisandro Arturo)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:36:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Jim Woodward's phone number
In-Reply-To: <737og9$35lh5@dmzms99902.na.baesystems.com>
References: <738lm5$dbcan@dmzms99801.na.baesystems.com>
	<737og9$35lh5@dmzms99902.na.baesystems.com>
Message-ID: <BF4A0C4C60DBFC4BACA96CD4557D7BD90A05029B@RSHJAXVEXCH01.rsandh.com>

I need Jim Woodward's phone number for some technical question. Can
somebody help me?

 

Arturo

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From jim.woodward at baesystems.com  Wed Sep 17 06:43:03 2008
From: jim.woodward at baesystems.com (Woodward, Jim (US SSA))
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:43:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Jim Woodward's phone number
In-Reply-To: <BF4A0C4C60DBFC4BACA96CD4557D7BD90A05029B@RSHJAXVEXCH01.rsandh.com>
Message-ID: <737og9$3tf4s@dmzms99902.na.baesystems.com>

Auturo,

 

Please use this email jim.wooodward at baesystems.com or call

Mobile: (954)319-0873

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Zapata,
Lisandro Arturo
Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2008 10:37 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Jim Woodward's phone number

 

I need Jim Woodward's phone number for some technical question. Can
somebody help me?

 

Arturo

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From gene.maurice at sgmservice.com  Wed Sep 17 09:13:09 2008
From: gene.maurice at sgmservice.com (Gene Maurice)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 17:13:09 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] North Dallas Contest
Message-ID: <001501c918e8$a6965880$f3c30980$@maurice@sgmservice.com>

All,

 

The 25th Annual North Dallas Pattern Classic will be held this weekend,
September 20 & 21 at the NDRCC field between Frisco and Denton Texas. Here's
a link to Yahoo Maps
http://maps.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTExNmIycG51BF9TAzI3MTYxNDkEc2VjA2ZwLWJ1dHRv
bgRzbGsDbGluaw--#mvt=m
<http://maps.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTExNmIycG51BF9TAzI3MTYxNDkEc2VjA2ZwLWJ1dHR
vbgRzbGsDbGluaw--#mvt=m&lat=33.238636&lon=-96.941815&zoom=15&q1=2066%20Brewe
r%20Rd%2C%20Aubrey%2C%20Texas>
&lat=33.238636&lon=-96.941815&zoom=15&q1=2066%20Brewer%20Rd%2C%20Aubrey%2C%2
0Texas

 

 The weather forecast is for two beautiful days, temperatures in the mid
80's and wind Southeast at 10 MPH. I hope our friends from the Gulf Coast /
Houston area can make it, you folks need the break!!

 

If you need any other information email me directly or call me at
972-365-8689.

 

Thanks, 

 

Gene Maurice

Plano, TX

AMA 3408 NSRCA 877

PACSS.sgmservice.com

gene.maurice at sgmservice.com

 

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From BUDDYonRC at aol.com  Wed Sep 17 15:46:12 2008
From: BUDDYonRC at aol.com (BUDDYonRC at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 23:46:12 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Houston,
	SE Texas and SW Louisiana Competitors
Message-ID: <d34.37b9e2d8.3602f0b8@aol.com>

John
Ihe unit comes with natural gas jets installed but also has LPG jets with  
instructions on how to converet to LPG my unit also has more output capacity  
with LPG.
Buddy



**************Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, 
plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com.      
(http://www.stylelist.com/trends?ncid=aolsty00050000000014)
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From getterflash at yahoo.com  Wed Sep 17 16:01:23 2008
From: getterflash at yahoo.com (Bob Kane)
Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2008 00:01:23 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Important question to D4 Finals attendees:
Message-ID: <232910.50203.qm@web36702.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

    Where is dinner Friday night?   I plan on getting there about 6PM or so, too late to fly (at least on Friday ;) )

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com



      
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From atwoodm at paragon-inc.com  Wed Sep 17 16:22:51 2008
From: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com (atwoodm at paragon-inc.com)
Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2008 00:22:51 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Important question to D4 Finals attendees:
In-Reply-To: <232910.50203.qm@web36702.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <232910.50203.qm@web36702.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1915029367-1221697368-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1026917940-@bxe025.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>

Let me guess ... You need a big ol' piece of cow!  


Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel

-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>

Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 17:01:21 
To: <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Important question to D4 Finals attendees:


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From verne at twmi.rr.com  Wed Sep 17 20:36:56 2008
From: verne at twmi.rr.com (Verne Koester)
Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2008 04:36:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Important question to D4 Finals attendees:
References: <232910.50203.qm@web36702.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<1915029367-1221697368-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1026917940-@bxe025.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>
Message-ID: <2BF4EE01CD404CBF91A7E1298FFDDAA0@Vinnie>

He IS a big ol' piece of cow.....

Verne


----- Original Message ----- 
From: <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2008 8:23 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Important question to D4 Finals attendees:


> Let me guess ... You need a big ol' piece of cow!  
> 
> 
> Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>
> 
> Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 17:01:21 
> To: <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Important question to D4 Finals attendees:
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>


From getterflash at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 18 02:37:22 2008
From: getterflash at yahoo.com (Bob Kane)
Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2008 10:37:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Important question to D4 Finals attendees:
Message-ID: <465976.97752.qm@web36702.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I'm moooooved . . . . .

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com



----- Original Message ----
From: Verne Koester <verne at twmi.rr.com>
To: atwoodm at paragon-inc.com; General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2008 12:36:56 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Important question to D4 Finals attendees:

He IS a big ol' piece of cow.....

Verne


----- Original Message ----- 
From: <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2008 8:23 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Important question to D4 Finals attendees:


> Let me guess ... You need a big ol' piece of cow!  
> 
> 
> Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>
> 
> Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 17:01:21 
> To: <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Important question to D4 Finals attendees:
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



      
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From ghwatson at comcast.net  Fri Sep 19 06:24:06 2008
From: ghwatson at comcast.net (Glen Watson)
Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2008 14:24:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Dist 6 -- Jetero RC Club Ike damage
Message-ID: <20080919142405.166FB114CF@bridi.netexpress.com>

All I can say is wow, see the pics in the below listed link of the Jetero RC
Club's pavilion as a result of Hurricane Ike.  Many outstanding pattern
meets have been hosted there.  I for one am hopeful the club will rebuilt
and carry on its pattern tradition.

 

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=7968512

 

 

Regards,

 

Glen Watson

http://glenwatson.blogspot.com/

http://www.geocities.com/rcprecision/pah.html

 

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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Fri Sep 19 14:39:14 2008
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2008 22:39:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bolly gear
Message-ID: <559360.10449.qm@web33005.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Does anyone know who has the F3A long gear in stock? Radio South is the last place I have thought of besides the usuals, but it's almost bedtime on that side of the country. lol


Chris   ?  ?  ?


      
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From vanputte at cox.net  Fri Sep 19 14:44:09 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2008 22:44:09 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bolly gear
In-Reply-To: <559360.10449.qm@web33005.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <559360.10449.qm@web33005.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <D80C2F1D-940A-455C-90F0-9B5B483ABD7C@cox.net>

Have you asked Maureen Dunphy at Precision Aero Composites?

Ron VP

On Sep 19, 2008, at 5:39 PM, krishlan fitzsimmons wrote:

> Does anyone know who has the F3A long gear in stock? Radio South is  
> the last place I have thought of besides the usuals, but it's  
> almost bedtime on that side of the country. lol
>
>
> Chris
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From trexlesh at msn.com  Fri Sep 19 14:57:04 2008
From: trexlesh at msn.com (Rex)
Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2008 22:57:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bolly gear
In-Reply-To: <D80C2F1D-940A-455C-90F0-9B5B483ABD7C@cox.net>
References: <559360.10449.qm@web33005.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<D80C2F1D-940A-455C-90F0-9B5B483ABD7C@cox.net>
Message-ID: <BAY119-W175E787857C576E3561011CC4E0@phx.gbl>

Last I heard, and that's recently....  Maureen has some on order.  They are sitting in a container to be shipped when the
hurricane weather allows transport!  A local guy has some on order from her.
 
Rex



> From: vanputte at cox.net> Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2008 17:44:04 -0500> To: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Bolly gear> > Have you asked Maureen Dunphy at Precision Aero Composites?> > Ron VP> > On Sep 19, 2008, at 5:39 PM, krishlan fitzsimmons wrote:> > > Does anyone know who has the F3A long gear in stock? Radio South is > > the last place I have thought of besides the usuals, but it's > > almost bedtime on that side of the country. lol> >> >> > Chris> >> >> >> >> > _______________________________________________> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion> > _______________________________________________> NSRCA-discussion mailing list> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From pcosky at comcast.net  Fri Sep 19 15:07:17 2008
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2008 23:07:17 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bolly gear
References: <559360.10449.qm@web33005.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <001e01c91aac$73e22f70$28440a0a@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>

Try here.

http://www.aeroproduct.net/
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: krishlan fitzsimmons 
  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
  Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 6:39 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bolly gear


        Does anyone know who has the F3A long gear in stock? Radio South is the last place I have thought of besides the usuals, but it's almost bedtime on that side of the country. lol



        Chris 


       




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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Fri Sep 19 16:10:32 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 00:10:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNKEFDCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

Anyone have an Excel file for the 09 Masters pattern?

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com 
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 8:25 AM



From pcosky at comcast.net  Fri Sep 19 16:20:21 2008
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 00:20:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNKEFDCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <000f01c91ab6$a93a9a90$28440a0a@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>

Here ya go

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "JShulman" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:11 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel


> Anyone have an Excel file for the 09 Masters pattern?
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 
> 8:25 AM
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
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From pcosky at comcast.net  Fri Sep 19 16:25:23 2008
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 00:25:23 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNKEFDCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <001b01c91ab7$5d4dd8d0$28440a0a@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>

Oops wrong file. That was the current sequence.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "JShulman" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:11 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel


> Anyone have an Excel file for the 09 Masters pattern?
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 
> 8:25 AM
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 



From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Fri Sep 19 16:26:22 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 00:26:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
In-Reply-To: <000f01c91ab6$a93a9a90$28440a0a@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNCEFECNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

Thanks Pete... but do you have the 09...lol.

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com 
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Pete Cosky
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:20 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel


Here ya go

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "JShulman" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:11 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel


> Anyone have an Excel file for the 09 Masters pattern?
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 
> 8:25 AM
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 8:25 AM

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 8:25 AM



From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Fri Sep 19 16:39:55 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 00:39:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNCEFECNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV28DFC92174EEA2EB4F9C0E8490@phx.gbl>

Try this Uncle JAS

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "JShulman" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 7:27 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel


> Thanks Pete... but do you have the 09...lol.
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Pete Cosky
> Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:20 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
>
>
> Here ya go
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "JShulman" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
> To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:11 PM
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
>
>
>> Anyone have an Excel file for the 09 Masters pattern?
>>
>> Regards,
>> Jason
>> www.jasonshulman.com
>> www.shulmanaviation.com
>> www.composite-arf.com
>>
>> No virus found in this outgoing message.
>> Checked by AVG.
>> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008
>> 8:25 AM
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 
> 8:25 AM
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 
> 8:25 AM
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 
-------------- next part --------------
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Fri Sep 19 16:49:07 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 00:49:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV28DFC92174EEA2EB4F9C0E8490@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGEFFCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

Awesome, thanks... and babysitting without having been "taught" is really tough.

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com 
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Ed Alt
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:40 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel


Try this Uncle JAS

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "JShulman" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 7:27 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel


> Thanks Pete... but do you have the 09...lol.
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Pete Cosky
> Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:20 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
>
>
> Here ya go
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "JShulman" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
> To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:11 PM
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
>
>
>> Anyone have an Excel file for the 09 Masters pattern?
>>
>> Regards,
>> Jason
>> www.jasonshulman.com
>> www.shulmanaviation.com
>> www.composite-arf.com
>>
>> No virus found in this outgoing message.
>> Checked by AVG.
>> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008
>> 8:25 AM
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 
> 8:25 AM
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 
> 8:25 AM
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 8:25 AM

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 8:25 AM



From KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com  Fri Sep 19 17:00:46 2008
From: KTHOMPSON56 at satx.rr.com (Ken Thompson)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 01:00:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGEFFCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <000401c91abd$14a68bd0$0200a8c0@kencopepere>

Shoot Jason, babysitting after being taught is tough!!
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "JShulman" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 7:50 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel


> Awesome, thanks... and babysitting without having been "taught" is really 
> tough.
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Ed Alt
> Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:40 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
>
>
> Try this Uncle JAS
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "JShulman" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 7:27 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
>
>
>> Thanks Pete... but do you have the 09...lol.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Jason
>> www.jasonshulman.com
>> www.shulmanaviation.com
>> www.composite-arf.com
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Pete Cosky
>> Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:20 PM
>> To: General pattern discussion
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
>>
>>
>> Here ya go
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "JShulman" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
>> To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:11 PM
>> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
>>
>>
>>> Anyone have an Excel file for the 09 Masters pattern?
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Jason
>>> www.jasonshulman.com
>>> www.shulmanaviation.com
>>> www.composite-arf.com
>>>
>>> No virus found in this outgoing message.
>>> Checked by AVG.
>>> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 
>>> 9/19/2008
>>> 8:25 AM
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG.
>> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008
>> 8:25 AM
>>
>> No virus found in this outgoing message.
>> Checked by AVG.
>> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008
>> 8:25 AM
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 
> 8:25 AM
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 
> 8:25 AM
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


From pcosky at comcast.net  Fri Sep 19 17:03:11 2008
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 01:03:11 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNCEFECNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <003f01c91abc$a40a92e0$28440a0a@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>

Sent it to you at cox.net

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "JShulman" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:27 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel


> Thanks Pete... but do you have the 09...lol.
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Pete Cosky
> Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:20 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
>
>
> Here ya go
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "JShulman" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
> To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:11 PM
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
>
>
>> Anyone have an Excel file for the 09 Masters pattern?
>>
>> Regards,
>> Jason
>> www.jasonshulman.com
>> www.shulmanaviation.com
>> www.composite-arf.com
>>
>> No virus found in this outgoing message.
>> Checked by AVG.
>> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008
>> 8:25 AM
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 
> 8:25 AM
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 
> 8:25 AM
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 



From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Fri Sep 19 17:14:46 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 01:14:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D3 Masters Pilots
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGEFGCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

Let me know who you are please (if you're not listed). I've got a few...

Dave Stodart
Joe Walker
Humberto Pomales
Steve Homenda
Mike Constantine
Mike Hester
Emory Schroeter
Erik Newsholme
John Fuqua
Ron Van Putte

Man... With all these pilots... I might have to join them. Looks like more fun than 3 or 4 of us in FAI  :(   When are some of you
sandbaggers coming to play in FAI?

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date: 9/19/2008 8:25 AM



From vanputte at cox.net  Fri Sep 19 19:14:29 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 03:14:29 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
In-Reply-To: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGEFFCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGEFFCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <F134F475-62A3-412F-AEA7-1767BCCCFA68@cox.net>

Jason - Talk to me at Jacksonville.  I'm a father of three and a  
grandfather of seven.  I'm babysitting two of them by myself tomorrow  
and tomorrow night.

Ron VP

On Sep 19, 2008, at 7:50 PM, JShulman wrote:

> Awesome, thanks... and babysitting without having been "taught" is  
> really tough.
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Ed Alt
> Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:40 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
>
>
> Try this Uncle JAS
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "JShulman" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 7:27 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
>
>
>> Thanks Pete... but do you have the 09...lol.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Jason
>> www.jasonshulman.com
>> www.shulmanaviation.com
>> www.composite-arf.com
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Pete  
>> Cosky
>> Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:20 PM
>> To: General pattern discussion
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
>>
>>
>> Here ya go
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "JShulman" <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
>> To: "NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:11 PM
>> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Masters call sheet in Excel
>>
>>
>>> Anyone have an Excel file for the 09 Masters pattern?
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Jason
>>> www.jasonshulman.com
>>> www.shulmanaviation.com
>>> www.composite-arf.com
>>>
>>> No virus found in this outgoing message.
>>> Checked by AVG.
>>> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date:  
>>> 9/19/2008
>>> 8:25 AM
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>>
>>
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG.
>> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date:  
>> 9/19/2008
>> 8:25 AM
>>
>> No virus found in this outgoing message.
>> Checked by AVG.
>> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date:  
>> 9/19/2008
>> 8:25 AM
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date:  
> 9/19/2008 8:25 AM
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date:  
> 9/19/2008 8:25 AM
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From vanputte at cox.net  Fri Sep 19 19:17:54 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 03:17:54 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D3 Masters Pilots
In-Reply-To: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGEFGCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGEFGCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <F1304904-F837-4E60-B366-E04C79918EB9@cox.net>

Everette Carpenter, and Ken Blackwell.

Ron VP

On Sep 19, 2008, at 8:15 PM, JShulman wrote:

> Let me know who you are please (if you're not listed). I've got a  
> few...
>
> Dave Stodart
> Joe Walker
> Humberto Pomales
> Steve Homenda
> Mike Constantine
> Mike Hester
> Emory Schroeter
> Erik Newsholme
> John Fuqua
> Ron Van Putte
>
> Man... With all these pilots... I might have to join them. Looks  
> like more fun than 3 or 4 of us in FAI  :(   When are some of you
> sandbaggers coming to play in FAI?
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1680 - Release Date:  
> 9/19/2008 8:25 AM
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Fri Sep 19 19:42:41 2008
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 03:42:41 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bolly gear
In-Reply-To: <559360.10449.qm@web33005.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <559360.10449.qm@web33005.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <D8C069ACBAD641849F02D857AC284FCD@BENICIA>

Try Maureen Dunphy at PAC.
 
http://www.pac-rc.com/

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of krishlan
fitzsimmons
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 3:39 PM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Bolly gear


Does anyone know who has the F3A long gear in stock? Radio South is the last
place I have thought of besides the usuals, but it's almost bedtime on that
side of the country. lol




Chris 
 
 
 

-------------- next part --------------
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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Fri Sep 19 19:44:27 2008
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 03:44:27 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D3 Masters Pilots
In-Reply-To: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGEFGCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGEFGCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <E28F3ECD2E7447A4A39CC0D88CD2AD14@BENICIA>

At the last D7 contest this past weekend there were 11 FAI pilots and 9 in
Masters - total of 35 overall. 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of JShulman
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 6:16 PM
To: NSRCA
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D3 Masters Pilots

Let me know who you are please (if you're not listed). I've got a few...

Dave Stodart
Joe Walker
Humberto Pomales
Steve Homenda
Mike Constantine
Mike Hester
Emory Schroeter
Erik Newsholme
John Fuqua
Ron Van Putte

Man... With all these pilots... I might have to join them. Looks like more
fun than 3 or 4 of us in FAI  :(   When are some of you
sandbaggers coming to play in FAI?

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

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From jonlowe at aol.com  Fri Sep 19 20:11:59 2008
From: jonlowe at aol.com (Jon Lowe)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 04:11:59 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D3 Masters Pilots
In-Reply-To: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGEFGCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGEFGCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <8CAE8EE1F6F28AF-EFC-159F@webmail-de03.sysops.aol.com>

Next year, unfortunately, me.


Jon Lowe


-----Original Message-----
From: JShulman <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
To: NSRCA <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Fri, 19 Sep 2008 8:15 pm
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D3 Masters Pilots



Let me know who you are please (if you're not listed). I've got a few...

Dave Stodart
Joe Walker
Humberto Pomales
Steve Homenda
Mike Constantine
Mike Hester
Emory Schroeter
Erik Newsholme
John Fuqua
Ron Van Putte

Man... With all these pilots... I might have to join them. Looks like more fun 
than 3 or 4 of us in FAI  :(   When are some of you
sandbaggers coming to play in FAI?

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

No virus found in this outgoing message.
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From grcourtney at tva.gov  Sat Sep 20 02:44:28 2008
From: grcourtney at tva.gov (Courtney, Gary Ray)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 10:44:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D3 Masters Pilots
In-Reply-To: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGEFGCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGEFGCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <E59A0A15B90F664B884CEDF5B9B60D99016FDAE1@TVACOCXVS2.main.tva.gov>


Jason

I'll come play just as soon as I figure out what the left stick is
for!!!! LOL

gary 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of JShulman
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 8:16 PM
To: NSRCA
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D3 Masters Pilots

Let me know who you are please (if you're not listed). I've got a few...

Dave Stodart
Joe Walker
Humberto Pomales
Steve Homenda
Mike Constantine
Mike Hester
Emory Schroeter
Erik Newsholme
John Fuqua
Ron Van Putte

Man... With all these pilots... I might have to join them. Looks like
more fun than 3 or 4 of us in FAI  :(   When are some of you
sandbaggers coming to play in FAI?

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

No virus found in this outgoing message.
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From tony at radiosouthrc.com  Sat Sep 20 06:11:22 2008
From: tony at radiosouthrc.com (Tony)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 14:11:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Dist 6 -- Jetero RC Club Ike damage
In-Reply-To: <E1Kgo0B-0000wA-Tk@orchid.host-care.com>
References: <E1Kgo0B-0000wA-Tk@orchid.host-care.com>
Message-ID: <BEEBDB373D184C6281D24A759227F1C3@Tony>

I hope the club contact AMA HQ for some funds to help get the field safe and
flyable again.  You sure can't be safe with all that debris!!!  $500 is not
a lot, but it is designed to get the club started.

 

 

Tony Stillman, President

Radio South, Inc.

139 Altama Connector, Box 322

Brunswick, GA  31525

1-800-962-7802

www.radiosouthrc.com

  _____  

From: Glen Watson [mailto:ghwatson at comcast.net] 
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2008 10:24 AM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Dist 6 -- Jetero RC Club Ike damage

 

All I can say is wow, see the pics in the below listed link of the Jetero RC
Club's pavilion as a result of Hurricane Ike.  Many outstanding pattern
meets have been hosted there.  I for one am hopeful the club will rebuilt
and carry on its pattern tradition.

 

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=7968512

 

 

Regards,

 

Glen Watson

http://glenwatson.blogspot.com/

http://www.geocities.com/rcprecision/pah.html

 

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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Sat Sep 20 07:38:34 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 15:38:34 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNKEFKCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

There was a quick discussion about this a couple weeks ago, but I wasn't paying attention. If I wanted to keep some wires separated
from one another, what would I use... clear silicone or RTV?

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1682 - Release Date: 9/20/2008 10:24 AM



From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Sat Sep 20 08:06:35 2008
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 16:06:35 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter
In-Reply-To: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNKEFKCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <6307632081764A35B9773723D3F67EFF@jaysdesktop>

If the wires are insulated then either would be OK. If there is ANY metal
contact then get an electrical silicone (no acid) from Radio Shack.

Jay Marshall

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of JShulman
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2008 11:40 AM
To: NSRCA
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter

There was a quick discussion about this a couple weeks ago, but I wasn't
paying attention. If I wanted to keep some wires separated
from one another, what would I use... clear silicone or RTV?

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
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10:24 AM


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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Sat Sep 20 08:12:57 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 16:12:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter
In-Reply-To: <6307632081764A35B9773723D3F67EFF@jaysdesktop>
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNCEFLCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

Jay,

Is there a difference between electrical silicone and regular silicone (Home Depot)? It will be on metal connectors.

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com 
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Jay Marshall
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2008 12:06 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter


If the wires are insulated then either would be OK. If there is ANY metal
contact then get an electrical silicone (no acid) from Radio Shack.

Jay Marshall

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of JShulman
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2008 11:40 AM
To: NSRCA
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter

There was a quick discussion about this a couple weeks ago, but I wasn't
paying attention. If I wanted to keep some wires separated
from one another, what would I use... clear silicone or RTV?

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1682 - Release Date: 9/20/2008
10:24 AM


_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1682 - Release Date: 9/20/2008 10:24 AM

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1682 - Release Date: 9/20/2008 10:24 AM



From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Sat Sep 20 09:35:16 2008
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 17:35:16 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter
In-Reply-To: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNCEFLCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <791DDA513DBA490B869AF3582260182E@jaysdesktop>

Yep. The type used for electrical (metal wires, etc.) has a different curing
agent which won't corrode the metal it comes in contact. HD may carry both -
I don't know. I used to use it extensively in electronics. We also had a big
expensive product recall before we found out the difference - a year later.

Jay Marshall

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of JShulman
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2008 12:14 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter

Jay,

Is there a difference between electrical silicone and regular silicone (Home
Depot)? It will be on metal connectors.

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com 
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Jay Marshall
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2008 12:06 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter


If the wires are insulated then either would be OK. If there is ANY metal
contact then get an electrical silicone (no acid) from Radio Shack.

Jay Marshall

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of JShulman
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2008 11:40 AM
To: NSRCA
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter

There was a quick discussion about this a couple weeks ago, but I wasn't
paying attention. If I wanted to keep some wires separated
from one another, what would I use... clear silicone or RTV?

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1682 - Release Date: 9/20/2008
10:24 AM


_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1682 - Release Date: 9/20/2008
10:24 AM

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG. 
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10:24 AM


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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Sat Sep 20 09:51:59 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 17:51:59 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter
In-Reply-To: <791DDA513DBA490B869AF3582260182E@jaysdesktop>
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNOEFLCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

Thanks Jay. I'll pick some up on my way back from the field.

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com 
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Jay Marshall
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2008 1:35 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter


Yep. The type used for electrical (metal wires, etc.) has a different curing
agent which won't corrode the metal it comes in contact. HD may carry both -
I don't know. I used to use it extensively in electronics. We also had a big
expensive product recall before we found out the difference - a year later.

Jay Marshall

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of JShulman
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2008 12:14 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter

Jay,

Is there a difference between electrical silicone and regular silicone (Home
Depot)? It will be on metal connectors.

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com 
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Jay Marshall
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2008 12:06 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion'
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter


If the wires are insulated then either would be OK. If there is ANY metal
contact then get an electrical silicone (no acid) from Radio Shack.

Jay Marshall

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of JShulman
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2008 11:40 AM
To: NSRCA
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter

There was a quick discussion about this a couple weeks ago, but I wasn't
paying attention. If I wanted to keep some wires separated
from one another, what would I use... clear silicone or RTV?

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1682 - Release Date: 9/20/2008
10:24 AM


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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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10:24 AM

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_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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No virus found in this outgoing message.
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Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1682 - Release Date: 9/20/2008 10:24 AM



From vanputte at cox.net  Sat Sep 20 11:17:26 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2008 19:17:26 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter
In-Reply-To: <791DDA513DBA490B869AF3582260182E@jaysdesktop>
References: <791DDA513DBA490B869AF3582260182E@jaysdesktop>
Message-ID: <BB274D38-CA21-44B5-89C5-B919F1B5AB95@cox.net>

Walmart, Home Depot, Lowe's and some of the other retailers sell  
different types of GOOP silicone in tubes for various uses, like  
running shoes, plumbing and electronics.

Ron VP

On Sep 20, 2008, at 12:34 PM, Jay Marshall wrote:

> Yep. The type used for electrical (metal wires, etc.) has a  
> different curing
> agent which won't corrode the metal it comes in contact. HD may  
> carry both -
> I don't know. I used to use it extensively in electronics. We also  
> had a big
> expensive product recall before we found out the difference - a  
> year later.
>
> Jay Marshall
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of  
> JShulman
> Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2008 12:14 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter
>
> Jay,
>
> Is there a difference between electrical silicone and regular  
> silicone (Home
> Depot)? It will be on metal connectors.
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Jay  
> Marshall
> Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2008 12:06 PM
> To: 'General pattern discussion'
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter
>
>
> If the wires are insulated then either would be OK. If there is ANY  
> metal
> contact then get an electrical silicone (no acid) from Radio Shack.
>
> Jay Marshall
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of  
> JShulman
> Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2008 11:40 AM
> To: NSRCA
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Silicone/RTV chatter
>
> There was a quick discussion about this a couple weeks ago, but I  
> wasn't
> paying attention. If I wanted to keep some wires separated
> from one another, what would I use... clear silicone or RTV?
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1682 - Release Date:  
> 9/20/2008
> 10:24 AM
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1682 - Release Date:  
> 9/20/2008
> 10:24 AM
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1682 - Release Date:  
> 9/20/2008
> 10:24 AM
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From gene.maurice at sgmservice.com  Sun Sep 21 16:20:16 2008
From: gene.maurice at sgmservice.com (Gene Maurice)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 00:20:16 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 24th North Dallas Patter Classic Results
Message-ID: <000301c91c48$fd119220$f734b660$@maurice@sgmservice.com>


Sportsman

		

Lindholm, Tom                                     

1

3990.243


Strachan, Brian                                   

2

3981.627


Knotts, Ken                                       

3

3662.566

			

Intermidiate

		

Tipton, Tim                                       

1

4000


Shepherd, Glen                                    

2

3902.125


Valls, Edward                                     

3

3682.859


Small, Russell                                    

4

3654.227


Bartolucci, Bill                                  

5

2121.799

			

Advanced

		

Lewis, Richard                                    

1

4000


Ford, Steve                                       

2

3946.313


Dolzine, Dave                                     

3

3877.093

			

Masters

		

Young, Brian                                      

1

3986.789


Hunt, Mark                                        

2

3948.881


Van Nostrand, Lance                               

3

3946.927


Ramsey, Donald                                    

4

3911.468


Black, Keith                                      

5

3888.243


Byrd, Stephen                                     

6

3826.51


Harmon, David                                     

7

3343.766

			

FAI

		

Cunningham, Bill                                  

1

3995


Haury, Earl                                       

2

3917.662


Harrison, Michael                                 

3

3874.846


Wagner, Art                                       

4

3777.722


Bouchard, Andre                                   

5

3764.234


Byrd, Rick                                        

6

3011.802

 

 

Gene Maurice

Plano, TX

AMA 3408 NSRCA 877

PACSS.sgmservice.com

gene.maurice at sgmservice.com

 

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From brian_w_young at yahoo.com  Sun Sep 21 17:26:06 2008
From: brian_w_young at yahoo.com (brian young)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 01:26:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 24th North Dallas Patter Classic Results
Message-ID: <558412.82670.qm@web35205.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Enjoyed the contest. Thanks for putting in the work. 

Brian


----- Original Message ----
From: Gene Maurice <gene.maurice at sgmservice.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2008 7:20:15 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 24th North Dallas Patter Classic Results


Sportsman   
Lindholm, Tom????????????????????????????????????  1 3990.243 
Strachan, Brian??????????????????????????????????  2 3981.627 
Knotts, Ken????? ????????????????????????????????? 3 3662.566    
Intermidiate   
Tipton, Tim??????????????????????????????????????  1 4000 
Shepherd, Glen???????????????????????????????????  2 3902.125 
Valls, Edward????????????????????????????? ??????? 3 3682.859 
Small, Russell???????????????????????????????????  4 3654.227 
Bartolucci, Bill?????????????????????????????????  5 2121.799    
Advanced   
Lewis, Richard???????????????????????????????????  1 4000 
Ford, Steve??????????????????????????????????????  2 3946.313 
Dolzine, Dave????????????????????????????????????  3 3877.093    
Masters   
Young, Brian?????????????????????????????????????  1 3986.789 
Hunt, Mark???????????????? ??????????????????????? 2 3948.881 
Van Nostrand, Lance??????????????????????????????  3 3946.927 
Ramsey, Donald???????????????????????????????????  4 3911.468 
Black, Keith?????????????????????????????????????  5 3888.243 
Byrd, Stephen????????????????????????????????????  6 3826.51 
Harmon, David????????????????????????????????????  7 3343.766    
FAI   
Cunningham, Bill?????????????????????????????????  1 3995 
Haury, Earl???????????????????????? ?????????????? 2 3917.662 
Harrison, Michael????????????????????????????????  3 3874.846 
Wagner, Art??????????????????????????????????????  4 3777.722 
Bouchard, Andre??????????????????????????????????  5 3764.234 
Byrd, Rick????? ?????????????????????????????????? 6 3011.802 
?
?
Gene Maurice
Plano, TX
AMA 3408 NSRCA 877
PACSS.sgmservice.com
gene.maurice at sgmservice.com


      
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From steveandlaurel at valornet.com  Sun Sep 21 18:13:33 2008
From: steveandlaurel at valornet.com (Steve Ford)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 02:13:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 24th North Dallas Patter Classic Results
References: <000301c91c48$fd119220$f734b660$@maurice@sgmservice.com>
Message-ID: <7E3251F8C25C499883423DBD977C8859@Home>

Thanks to Gene and the North Dallas club.  We had a great time and will be sure to make it again next year.

Steve Ford
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Gene Maurice 
  To: 'General pattern discussion' 
  Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2008 7:20 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 24th North Dallas Patter Classic Results


        Sportsman
         
        Lindholm, Tom                                     
       1
       3990.243
       
        Strachan, Brian                                   
       2
       3981.627
       
        Knotts, Ken                                       
       3
       3662.566
       
         
        Intermidiate
         
        Tipton, Tim                                       
       1
       4000
       
        Shepherd, Glen                                    
       2
       3902.125
       
        Valls, Edward                                     
       3
       3682.859
       
        Small, Russell                                    
       4
       3654.227
       
        Bartolucci, Bill                                  
       5
       2121.799
       
         
        Advanced
         
        Lewis, Richard                                    
       1
       4000
       
        Ford, Steve                                       
       2
       3946.313
       
        Dolzine, Dave                                     
       3
       3877.093
       
         
        Masters
         
        Young, Brian                                      
       1
       3986.789
       
        Hunt, Mark                                        
       2
       3948.881
       
        Van Nostrand, Lance                               
       3
       3946.927
       
        Ramsey, Donald                                    
       4
       3911.468
       
        Black, Keith                                      
       5
       3888.243
       
        Byrd, Stephen                                     
       6
       3826.51
       
        Harmon, David                                     
       7
       3343.766
       
         
        FAI
         
        Cunningham, Bill                                  
       1
       3995
       
        Haury, Earl                                       
       2
       3917.662
       
        Harrison, Michael                                 
       3
       3874.846
       
        Wagner, Art                                       
       4
       3777.722
       
        Bouchard, Andre                                   
       5
       3764.234
       
        Byrd, Rick                                        
       6
       3011.802
       

   

   

  Gene Maurice

  Plano, TX

  AMA 3408 NSRCA 877

  PACSS.sgmservice.com

  gene.maurice at sgmservice.com

   



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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From moleski at canisius.edu  Sun Sep 21 19:10:25 2008
From: moleski at canisius.edu (Martin X. Moleski, SJ)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 03:10:25 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Integral
Message-ID: <48D70C9E.7050905@canisius.edu>


-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-webteam] Integral
Resent-Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2008 20:00:43 -0500
Resent-From: webmaster at nsrca.org
Resent-To: nsrca-webteam at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2008 21:00:15 -0400
From: JShulman <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
Reply-To: Webteam mailing list <nsrca-webteam at lists.nsrca.org>
To: Matthew Liprie (MLiprie) @ NSRCA <webmaster at nsrca.org>

Hi Matthew,

Depending on the scheme...
http://www.composite-arf.com.hk/ar/Catalog?cat=27

But white one's aren't due in until early October.

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


-----Original Message-----
From: Matthew Liprie (MLiprie) @ NSRCA [mailto:webmaster at nsrca.org]
Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2008 8:42 PM
To: jshulman at cfl.rr.com
Subject: Integral


------ NOTE: ------

This is a message from Matthew Liprie (MLiprie) at NSRCA ( http://www.nsrca.us ).

This user did not see your email address. If you reply the recipient will have
your email address.

When replying, please check carefully that the email address of Matthew Liprie
(MLiprie) is webmaster at nsrca.org.

NSRCA owners cannot accept any responsibility for the contents of the email and
of user email addresses.


------ Message from Matthew Liprie (MLiprie) to you: ------

Jason, this is Matthew Liprie.  I believe you are a 2nd salesman for the
Integrals.  How much would you sale me one for?

Thanks,



Matthew Liprie

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1683 - Release Date: 9/21/2008 10:10 AM


No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1683 - Release Date: 9/21/2008 10:10 AM




_______________________________________________
NSRCA-webteam mailing list
NSRCA-webteam at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-webteam

From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 22 05:57:00 2008
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 13:57:00 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Championships and the 2008 season
Message-ID: <544946.43099.qm@web51006.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

?Thanks to all who hosted and participated the contest this weekend. It may very well have been the best weekend contest I've ever been to. 
?Weather, food, extremely tough competition, guys from long distances, 32 flyers?who came ready to compete hard,?great food, adult beverages with Bobby Satalino, casino night ( we won!!!!)?on Friday and more adult beverages with Bobby,?awesome night flying and pyro show. It all made for a truly?unforgettable?experience.
?Thanks Mark Atwood, Bob Pannell, Dave Johnstone, Ray Morton, Amy and all the others for having us.
?Funny thing happened on Saturday evening during the fireworks. I looked behind the?pits?and the parking area was full of cars. Seems that the locals know that the festivity's are a blast to watch and there coming in numbers.
?I was impressed with the way the flight lines flowed and we got in all 6 rounds without a hitch. It says a lot about how responsible and ready?the flyers were. 
?All in all a nice way to closeout the area's contests for this year. 
?When 2008 started off I suspected it to be a down year for pattern due to a myriad of reasons and it turned out to be one of the best years. Pattern is alive and well here in the Midwest. Mike Mueller
?


      
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From patternrules at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 22 06:04:46 2008
From: patternrules at yahoo.com (Steven Maxwell)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 14:04:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Championships and the 2008 season
Message-ID: <495005.53882.qm@web58404.mail.re3.yahoo.com>


?Mike It was great seeing everyone, and always a good time at Championships with the Chicago Mafia always makes a better contest.
Is final standing posted anywhere.
?Steve Maxwell

--- On Mon, 9/22/08, mike mueller <mups1953 at yahoo.com> wrote:

From: mike mueller <mups1953 at yahoo.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Championships and the 2008 season
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 9:56 AM







?Thanks to all who hosted and participated the contest this weekend. It may very well have been the best weekend contest I've ever been to. 
?Weather, food, extremely tough competition, guys from long distances, 32 flyers?who came ready to compete hard,?great food, adult beverages with Bobby Satalino, casino night ( we won!!!!)?on Friday and more adult beverages with Bobby,?awesome night flying and pyro show. It all made for a truly?unforgettable?experience.
?Thanks Mark Atwood, Bob Pannell, Dave Johnstone, Ray Morton, Amy and all the others for having us.
?Funny thing happened on Saturday evening during the fireworks. I looked behind the?pits?and the parking area was full of cars. Seems that the locals know that the festivity's are a blast to watch and there coming in numbers.
?I was impressed with the way the flight lines flowed and we got in all 6 rounds without a hitch. It says a lot about how responsible and ready?the flyers were. 
?All in all a nice way to closeout the area's contests for this year. 
?When 2008 started off I suspected it to be a down year for pattern due to a myriad of reasons and it turned out to be one of the best years. Pattern is alive and well here in the Midwest. Mike Mueller
?
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From getterflash at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 22 06:38:43 2008
From: getterflash at yahoo.com (Bob Kane)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 14:38:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 Masters sequence
Message-ID: <802228.1224.qm@web36706.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I have a calling card for the new 2009/2010 Masters sequence. This has probably already been answered, but is there a maneuver description out there somewhere?  Thanks.

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com



      
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From schale at optonline.net  Mon Sep 22 06:57:13 2008
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 14:57:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 Masters sequence
In-Reply-To: <802228.1224.qm@web36706.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <802228.1224.qm@web36706.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <48D7B238.9070702@optonline.net>

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From getterflash at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 22 07:09:01 2008
From: getterflash at yahoo.com (Bob Kane)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 15:09:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 Masters sequence
Message-ID: <357837.15230.qm@web36708.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Great, thanks.

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com



----- Original Message ----
From: Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 10:56:56 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] 2009 Masters sequence

try this.
http://www.modelaircraft.org/events/ruleproposals/rcaerobatics.aspx
Stuart C

Bob Kane wrote: 
I
have a calling card for the new 2009/2010 Masters sequence. This has
probably already been answered, but is there a maneuver description out
there somewhere?  Thanks.

 
Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com 



________________________________

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



      
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From mking46516 at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 22 07:24:20 2008
From: mking46516 at yahoo.com (Marty King)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 15:24:20 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 weekend contest scores and website
Message-ID: <149186.35222.qm@web53010.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Hey Guys,

Any idea when the D4 website will be back on line and
is anyone going to post the scores from the D4 contest this past
weekend? The suspense is almost to much to handle.......

I
really have missed seeing you guys this summer. The wife and I are
taking care of her 84 year old father who has Alzheimer's and just came
home from having hip surgery. I have flown twice this summer, I know
what a bummer..... But I have been depending on all the D4 news along
with the rest of the NSRCA districts post for my pattern fix.......

Marty King





AMA 9945 LM, CD

NSRCA 2551

Angels Shadows

http://www.fancyflying.150m.com


      
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Mon Sep 22 07:56:25 2008
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (vicenterc at comcast.net)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 15:56:25 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
Message-ID: <092220081556.17659.48D7C0250009766A000044FB22165279660C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>

Has anyone done the conversion?

Thanks,

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone
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From cahochhalter at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 22 09:14:20 2008
From: cahochhalter at yahoo.com (Charles Hochhalter)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 17:14:20 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
In-Reply-To: <092220081556.17659.48D7C0250009766A000044FB22165279660C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <919850.20028.qm@web83204.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Keith Black did this conversion and posted it on www.2dogrc.com website for their lipo transmitter offering.
?
Good Luck... let me know if you cant find it.
?
Chuck Hochhalter
Team 2DogRC

--- On Mon, 9/22/08, vicenterc at comcast.net <vicenterc at comcast.net> wrote:

From: vicenterc at comcast.net <vicenterc at comcast.net>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
To: "NSRCA NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 3:56 PM



Has anyone done the conversion?
?
Thanks,
?
--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From tkeithblack at gmail.com  Mon Sep 22 10:46:52 2008
From: tkeithblack at gmail.com (Keith Black)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 18:46:52 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
In-Reply-To: <919850.20028.qm@web83204.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <919850.20028.qm@web83204.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <8B0F505EC297422E8DF0131A942CABCA@OfficePC>

After further consideration I went back to NiCad batteries. JR recommends against this due to the higher voltage AND I had a synthesized RX module go bad while I was using the LiPo's. That being said, I used the standard non-synth modules for about two years with this setup.

Keith
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Charles Hochhalter 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 12:14 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo


        Keith Black did this conversion and posted it on www.2dogrc.com website for their lipo transmitter offering.

        Good Luck... let me know if you cant find it.

        Chuck Hochhalter
        Team 2DogRC

        --- On Mon, 9/22/08, vicenterc at comcast.net <vicenterc at comcast.net> wrote:

          From: vicenterc at comcast.net <vicenterc at comcast.net>
          Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
          To: "NSRCA NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
          Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 3:56 PM


          Has anyone done the conversion?

          Thanks,

          --
          Vicente "Vince" Bortone
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Mon Sep 22 11:04:37 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 19:04:37 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
In-Reply-To: <8B0F505EC297422E8DF0131A942CABCA@OfficePC>
References: <919850.20028.qm@web83204.mail.mud.yahoo.com><8B0F505EC297422E8DF0131A942CABCA@OfficePC>
Message-ID: <958755346-1222110273-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-899875861-@bxe245.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>

Flightpower makes a tx lipo pack with voltage step down incorporated.  I have one in my 9303 but have kept the stock nicads in my 12Xm

G
Sent from my BlackBerry? wireless device

-----Original Message-----
From: "Keith Black" <tkeithblack at gmail.com>

Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 13:20:34 
To: <cahochhalter at yahoo.com>; General pattern discussion<nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From ahrensw at charter.net  Mon Sep 22 13:19:35 2008
From: ahrensw at charter.net (Bill Ahrens)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 21:19:35 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Championships and the 2008 season
In-Reply-To: <544946.43099.qm@web51006.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <544946.43099.qm@web51006.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3C7E1AEA1AA4450C87BFCAFB995498E4@Basement>

I agree, It by far was the best contest I had attended,  Friday I had a
problem with my plane, Ray Morton did not hesitate and volunteered his
workshop to work on my plane, and we where competing against each other the
next day.  

 

I saw some of the best flying and yes Arch's last landing is one I will
remember, that was some flying and staying cool!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike mueller
Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 8:57 AM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D4 Championships and the 2008 season

 


 Thanks to all who hosted and participated the contest this weekend. It may
very well have been the best weekend contest I've ever been to. 

 Weather, food, extremely tough competition, guys from long distances, 32
flyers who came ready to compete hard, great food, adult beverages with
Bobby Satalino, casino night ( we won!!!!) on Friday and more adult
beverages with Bobby, awesome night flying and pyro show. It all made for a
truly unforgettable experience.

 Thanks Mark Atwood, Bob Pannell, Dave Johnstone, Ray Morton, Amy and all
the others for having us.

 Funny thing happened on Saturday evening during the fireworks. I looked
behind the pits and the parking area was full of cars. Seems that the locals
know that the festivity's are a blast to watch and there coming in numbers.

 I was impressed with the way the flight lines flowed and we got in all 6
rounds without a hitch. It says a lot about how responsible and ready the
flyers were. 

 All in all a nice way to closeout the area's contests for this year. 

 When 2008 started off I suspected it to be a down year for pattern due to a
myriad of reasons and it turned out to be one of the best years. Pattern is
alive and well here in the Midwest. Mike Mueller

 

 

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From jonlowe at aol.com  Mon Sep 22 15:01:07 2008
From: jonlowe at aol.com (Jon Lowe)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 23:01:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
In-Reply-To: <8B0F505EC297422E8DF0131A942CABCA@OfficePC>
References: <919850.20028.qm@web83204.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<8B0F505EC297422E8DF0131A942CABCA@OfficePC>
Message-ID: <8CAEB1E29D27F8C-F08-1510@FWM-D45.sysops.aol.com>

I use Sanyo 1650 MAH NiMh's in my two 10x's.? Last a long time (several days of practice), and I can fast charge them at the field?if I need to.? Got them from NoBS batteries.? They have instructions on their website on how to refill your existing cassette.

I'm not sure?I understand the fascination with LiPo's in a transmitter.? I sure as heck wouldn't charge them without removing them.


Jon Lowe


-----Original Message-----
From: Keith Black <tkeithblack at gmail.com>
To: cahochhalter at yahoo.com; General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 1:20 pm
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo



After further consideration I went back to NiCad batteries. JR recommends against this due to the higher voltage AND I had a synthesized RX module go bad while I was using the LiPo's. That being said, I used the standard non-synth modules for about two years with this setup.

?

Keith


----- Original Message ----- 

From: Charles Hochhalter 

To: General pattern discussion 

Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 12:14 PM

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo








Keith Black did this conversion and posted it on www.2dogrc.com website for their lipo transmitter offering.

?

Good Luck... let me know if you cant find it.

?

Chuck Hochhalter

Team 2DogRC

--- On Mon, 9/22/08, vicenterc at comcast.net <vicenterc at comcast.net> wrote:


From: vicenterc at comcast.net <vicenterc at comcast.net>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
To: "NSRCA NSRCA" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 3:56 PM



Has anyone done the conversion?

?

Thanks,

?

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone


_______________________________________________
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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion









_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 22 15:37:14 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 23:37:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
References: <919850.20028.qm@web83204.mail.mud.yahoo.com><8B0F505EC297422E8DF0131A942CABCA@OfficePC>
	<958755346-1222110273-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-899875861-@bxe245.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV929691BCFAE3CB11140B0E84B0@phx.gbl>

I thought about making a Tech Aero product to do this, but with a pair of 
packs for redundancy, and with dual regulators .  The main thing that 
stopped me is that once you go this route, you aren't going to ever see the 
real battery voltage on your Tx display again, only the regulated output 
voltage.  That leads to other issues about how to charge it, get status of 
both batteries out of the single charger inout.  It can be done, but 
probably not worth the price.

Ed
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 2:04 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo


Flightpower makes a tx lipo pack with voltage step down incorporated.  I 
have one in my 9303 but have kept the stock nicads in my 12Xm

G
Sent from my BlackBerry? wireless device

-----Original Message-----
From: "Keith Black" <tkeithblack at gmail.com>

Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 13:20:34
To: <cahochhalter at yahoo.com>; General pattern 
discussion<nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From TXF3A at entouch.net  Mon Sep 22 15:51:28 2008
From: TXF3A at entouch.net (Andre Bouchard)
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 23:51:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] New/Never Used ThunderPower Extreme V2's for Sale
Message-ID: <57.B1.05357.B7F28D84@mxo5.broadbandsupport.net>

I have the following for sale:

 

ThunderPower Extreme V2, Pair of 5S x 5000, New and fresh - no connectors
installed.  $500 including shipping in US.

 

Please contact me off-list if interested.

 

Thanks,

 

Andre Bouchard

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From jzeigenfus at comcast.net  Mon Sep 22 18:24:08 2008
From: jzeigenfus at comcast.net (jzeigenfus at comcast.net)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 02:24:08 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
Message-ID: <092320080224.13139.48D8534200012FA80000335322007348409C9A00020A09070A9606@comcast.net>

I did it for the 9303 and no problems. Make sure the pack you are using is for TX's. It's nice to turn on the TX and see a full charge all the time. JEZ

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: vicenterc at comcast.net 

Has anyone done the conversion?

Thanks,

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone
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From: vicenterc at comcast.net
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 15:56:38 +0000
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From jerry at buddengineering.com  Mon Sep 22 18:53:23 2008
From: jerry at buddengineering.com (Budd Engineering)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 02:53:23 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
In-Reply-To: <092220081556.17659.48D7C0250009766A000044FB22165279660C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
References: <092220081556.17659.48D7C0250009766A000044FB22165279660C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <87C71B11-E1E4-48C3-AB92-8E51AFA00E8D@buddengineering.com>

Yep, and I couldn't be happier.

True R/C 2500 mAh LiPo's, $30 each, fits inside the 10X battery holder  
with a minor amount of trimming with the Dremel tool.  I bought one  
set to try, liked it so well I bought another and converted the spare  
battery pack.  That way I can charge them out of the transmitter (not  
that it matters, the charge rate is so low that the risk of a mishap  
is about the same as with NiCads or NiMh).

I screwed around with a couple sets of NiMH's for the past several  
years, they were a total waste of time, the self discharge rate got to  
where I had to re-charge them if I didn't fly within a day or so of  
the previous charge

The LiPo's peak up at 12.5 V, essentially the same voltage as a good  
set of NiCads, and discharge almost linearly, so it's easy to assess  
their state of discharge.

http://home.comcast.net/~truerc/ready_pack/ready_packs.htm

Thx, Jerry

Budd Engineering
jerry at buddengineering.com
http://www.buddengineering.com

On Sep 22, 2008, at 8:56 AM, vicenterc at comcast.net wrote:

> Has anyone done the conversion?
>
> Thanks,
>
> --
> Vicente "Vince" Bortone
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From wilsorc at gmail.com  Mon Sep 22 20:24:25 2008
From: wilsorc at gmail.com (Bob Wilson)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 04:24:25 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
Message-ID: <888fdd980809222124x3b04e58ax9b0f16a02d7942e5@mail.gmail.com>

I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is the correct
technique for a snap?

For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same direction)
aileron and up elevator.
For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite aileron and
down elevator.

Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC videos and mine look so
raggedy-ass.
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Mon Sep 22 20:30:07 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 04:30:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <888fdd980809222124x3b04e58ax9b0f16a02d7942e5@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNMEHHCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

swap rudder with elevator

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob Wilson
  Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls


  I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is the
correct technique for a snap?

  For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same direction)
aileron and up elevator.
  For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite aileron and
down elevator.

  Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC videos and mine look
so raggedy-ass.
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1684 - Release Date: 9/22/2008
6:39 AM
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From jpavlick at idseng.com  Mon Sep 22 20:36:55 2008
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 04:36:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
References: <888fdd980809222124x3b04e58ax9b0f16a02d7942e5@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00c701c91d35$eaf35ea0$9501a8c0@GW7422>

Most guys will tell you that you should apply ALL of the controls at the same time. After all that's how a snap button works and some people swear by them. 
I tend to apply the elevator just slightly before everything else. Somebody gave me a 9.5 on my Avalanche at the NATs though so I must be doing something right. LOL

John Pavlick
http://www.idseng.com
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Bob Wilson 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls


  I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is the correct technique for a snap?

  For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same direction) aileron and up elevator.
  For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite aileron and down elevator.

  Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC videos and mine look so raggedy-ass.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 22 21:03:38 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 05:03:38 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNMEHHCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV7DDF01F000787717AF0ECE84A0@phx.gbl>

I just tried that. Something doesn't look exactly right and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.  What am I doing wrong?  

Ed
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: JShulman 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls


  swap rudder with elevator

  Regards,
  Jason
  www.jasonshulman.com
  www.shulmanaviation.com
  www.composite-arf.com

    -----Original Message-----
    From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob Wilson
    Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM
    To: General pattern discussion
    Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls


    I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is the correct technique for a snap?

    For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same direction) aileron and up elevator.
    For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite aileron and down elevator.

    Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC videos and mine look so raggedy-ass.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Mon Sep 22 21:13:11 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 05:13:11 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV7DDF01F000787717AF0ECE84A0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNEEHJCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

You need a taller stand, or move the tail off the end of the bench...lol

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Ed Alt
  Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 1:04 AM
  To: General pattern discussion
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls


  I just tried that. Something doesn't look exactly right and the elevator
is scraping the workbench now.  What am I doing wrong?

  Ed
    ----- Original Message -----
    From: JShulman
    To: General pattern discussion
    Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30 PM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls


    swap rudder with elevator

    Regards,
    Jason
    www.jasonshulman.com
    www.shulmanaviation.com
    www.composite-arf.com

      -----Original Message-----
      From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob Wilson
      Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM
      To: General pattern discussion
      Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls


      I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is the
correct technique for a snap?

      For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same direction)
aileron and up elevator.
      For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite aileron
and down elevator.

      Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC videos and mine
look so raggedy-ass.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------


    _______________________________________________
    NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.0/1684 - Release Date: 9/22/2008
6:39 AM
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From f3aflyer7 at gmail.com  Mon Sep 22 21:41:59 2008
From: f3aflyer7 at gmail.com (Scott Pavlock)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 05:41:59 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Some New Battery Technology Worth Keeping an Eye
	On
Message-ID: <72f9ee7c0809222241i45d8d86enc0dcbd7ad94ccb09@mail.gmail.com>

I found this article today and thought you guys might be interested. I
personally like the part that says "These batteries will typically perform
well in temperatures up to 400-Degrees F."

http://www.metaefficient.com/rechargeable-batteries/innovative-lifepo4-batteries-electric-vehicles.html

Scott Pavlock
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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 22 21:46:48 2008
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 05:46:48 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV7DDF01F000787717AF0ECE84A0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <703309.36868.qm@web33007.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Did you put the elevator upside down Ed? You have to make sure you put the non scraping side down.. 



Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Mon, 9/22/08, Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com> wrote:
From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 10:03 PM



 
 

I just tried that.?Something doesn't look 
exactly right and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.? What am I 
doing wrong?? 
?
Ed

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: 
  JShulman 
  
  To: General pattern discussion 
  
  Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap 
  rolls
  

  swap rudder 
  with elevator
  ?
  Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

  
    -----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
    [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob 
    Wilson
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM
To: 
    General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap 
    rolls


    
    I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is the 
    correct technique for a snap?
    ?
    For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same direction) 
    aileron?and up elevator.
    For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite aileron 
    and down elevator.
    ?
    Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC?videos and 
    mine look so raggedy-ass.
  
  

  _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion 
  mailing 
  list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep 23 02:35:02 2008
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (vicenterc at comcast.net)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 10:35:02 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
Message-ID: <092320081034.1050.48D8C651000D95EF0000041A22165514060C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>

Jerry,

Are you using regulator?  It looks like JR does not like the high voltage.  Probably, I am going to try to call or e-mail JR to ask.  I wonder if there is a difference between the 2.4 modules and the old modules in regard taking higher voltage.  New TX are designed to work with LiPo.  Just wondering.

JR sponsored pilits.  Can you find out?

Thanks for all responding.

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Budd Engineering <jerry at buddengineering.com> 

> Yep, and I couldn't be happier. 
> 
> True R/C 2500 mAh LiPo's, $30 each, fits inside the 10X battery holder 
> with a minor amount of trimming with the Dremel tool. I bought one 
> set to try, liked it so well I bought another and converted the spare 
> battery pack. That way I can charge them out of the transmitter (not 
> that it matters, the charge rate is so low that the risk of a mishap 
> is about the same as with NiCads or NiMh). 
> 
> I screwed around with a couple sets of NiMH's for the past several 
> years, they were a total waste of time, the self discharge rate got to 
> where I had to re-charge them if I didn't fly within a day or so of 
> the previous charge 
> 
> The LiPo's peak up at 12.5 V, essentially the same voltage as a good 
> set of NiCads, and discharge almost linearly, so it's easy to assess 
> their state of discharge. 
> 
> http://home.comcast.net/~truerc/ready_pack/ready_packs.htm 
> 
> Thx, Jerry 
> 
> Budd Engineering 
> jerry at buddengineering.com 
> http://www.buddengineering.com 
> 
> On Sep 22, 2008, at 8:56 AM, vicenterc at comcast.net wrote: 
> 
> > Has anyone done the conversion? 
> > 
> > Thanks, 
> > 
> > -- 
> > Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
> > _______________________________________________ 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep 23 02:35:02 2008
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (vicenterc at comcast.net)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 10:35:02 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
Message-ID: <092320081034.1050.48D8C651000D95EF0000041A22165514060C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>

Jerry,

Are you using regulator?  It looks like JR does not like the high voltage.  Probably, I am going to try to call or e-mail JR to ask.  I wonder if there is a difference between the 2.4 modules and the old modules in regard taking higher voltage.  New TX are designed to work with LiPo.  Just wondering.

JR sponsored pilits.  Can you find out?

Thanks for all responding.

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Budd Engineering <jerry at buddengineering.com> 

> Yep, and I couldn't be happier. 
> 
> True R/C 2500 mAh LiPo's, $30 each, fits inside the 10X battery holder 
> with a minor amount of trimming with the Dremel tool. I bought one 
> set to try, liked it so well I bought another and converted the spare 
> battery pack. That way I can charge them out of the transmitter (not 
> that it matters, the charge rate is so low that the risk of a mishap 
> is about the same as with NiCads or NiMh). 
> 
> I screwed around with a couple sets of NiMH's for the past several 
> years, they were a total waste of time, the self discharge rate got to 
> where I had to re-charge them if I didn't fly within a day or so of 
> the previous charge 
> 
> The LiPo's peak up at 12.5 V, essentially the same voltage as a good 
> set of NiCads, and discharge almost linearly, so it's easy to assess 
> their state of discharge. 
> 
> http://home.comcast.net/~truerc/ready_pack/ready_packs.htm 
> 
> Thx, Jerry 
> 
> Budd Engineering 
> jerry at buddengineering.com 
> http://www.buddengineering.com 
> 
> On Sep 22, 2008, at 8:56 AM, vicenterc at comcast.net wrote: 
> 
> > Has anyone done the conversion? 
> > 
> > Thanks, 
> > 
> > -- 
> > Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
> > _______________________________________________ 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep 23 02:41:24 2008
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (vicenterc at comcast.net)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 10:41:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
Message-ID: <092320081041.9712.48D8C7D00000364E000025F022165514060C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>

Please replace pilits with pilots.  I went too fast.

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: vicenterc at comcast.net 

Jerry,

Are you using regulator?  It looks like JR does not like the high voltage.  Probably, I am going to try to call or e-mail JR to ask.  I wonder if there is a difference between the 2.4 modules and the old modules in regard taking higher voltage.  New TX are designed to work with LiPo.  Just wondering.

JR sponsored pilits.  Can you find out?

Thanks for all responding.

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Budd Engineering <jerry at buddengineering.com> 

> Yep, and I couldn't be happier. 
> 
> True R/C 2500 mAh LiPo's, $30 each, fits inside the 10X battery holder 
> with a minor amount of trimming with the Dremel tool. I bought one 
> set to try, liked it so well I bought another and converted the spare 
> battery pack. That way I can charge them out of the transmitter (not 
> that it matters, the charge rate is so low that the risk of a mishap 
> is about the same as with NiCads or NiMh). 
> 
> I screwed around with a couple sets of NiMH's for the past several 
> years, they were a total waste of time, the self discharge rate got to 
> where I had to re-charge them if I didn't fly within a day or so of 
> the previous charge 
> 
> The LiPo 's pea k up at 12.5 V, essentially the same voltage as a good 
> set of NiCads, and discharge almost linearly, so it's easy to assess 
> their state of discharge. 
> 
> http://home.comcast.net/~truerc/ready_pack/ready_packs.htm 
> 
> Thx, Jerry 
> 
> Budd Engineering 
> jerry at buddengineering.com 
> http://www.buddengineering.com 
> 
> On Sep 22, 2008, at 8:56 AM, vicenterc at comcast.net wrote: 
> 
> > Has anyone done the conversion? 
> > 
> > Thanks, 
> > 
> > -- 
> > Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
> > _______________________________________________ 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
& gt; http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 10:37:01 +0000
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From schale at optonline.net  Tue Sep 23 04:46:47 2008
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 12:46:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Some New Battery Technology Worth Keeping an
 Eye	On
In-Reply-To: <72f9ee7c0809222241i45d8d86enc0dcbd7ad94ccb09@mail.gmail.com>
References: <72f9ee7c0809222241i45d8d86enc0dcbd7ad94ccb09@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48D8E51E.7000601@optonline.net>

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From khoard at gmail.com  Tue Sep 23 04:49:27 2008
From: khoard at gmail.com (Keith Hoard)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 12:49:27 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Some New Battery Technology Worth Keeping an
	Eye On
In-Reply-To: <48D8E51E.7000601@optonline.net>
References: <72f9ee7c0809222241i45d8d86enc0dcbd7ad94ccb09@mail.gmail.com>
	<48D8E51E.7000601@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <6792ef120809230549g2bc61418xa770dac78ab00cba@mail.gmail.com>

I've run both LiFe and A123's thru a West Systems Battery Analyzer. . . The
LiFe's have higher internal resistance.

On Tue, Sep 23, 2008 at 7:46 AM, Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net> wrote:

>  Isn't this the same technology as A123 cells?  Much better reliability and
> more cycles but at a weight penalty.  A pack to equal our 10S motor packs
> would weigh about 1 pound more.
>
> Stuart C
>
> Scott Pavlock wrote:
>
> I found this article today and thought you guys might be interested. I
> personally like the part that says "These batteries will typically perform
> well in temperatures up to 400-Degrees F."
>
>
> http://www.metaefficient.com/rechargeable-batteries/innovative-lifepo4-batteries-electric-vehicles.html
>
> Scott Pavlock
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>



-- 

Keith Hoard
Collierville, TN
khoard at gmail.com
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From jpavlick at idseng.com  Tue Sep 23 05:06:32 2008
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 13:06:32 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV7DDF01F000787717AF0ECE84A0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <169645.93720.qm@web80505.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Ed,
?You're almost there. Just extend the tailwheel gear. That's what?I did. You may have to use longer main gear too depending on what prop you're running or takeoff and landing may be a little difficult. Once you get these details worked out you should be fine. When you fly this for the first time, you may want to disable?all of your mixes (and also?the "double weedon" switch) because you're going to have to create some new ones anyway. Knife edge will be much improved by the way. VBG
?
John Pavlick

--- On Tue, 9/23/08, Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com> wrote:

From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 5:03 AM





I just tried that.?Something doesn't look exactly right and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.? What am I doing wrong?? 
?
Ed

----- Original Message ----- 
From: JShulman 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls


swap rudder with elevator
?
Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob Wilson
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls



I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is the correct technique for a snap?
?
For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same direction) aileron?and up elevator.
For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite aileron and down elevator.
?
Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC?videos and mine look so raggedy-ass.



_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Tue Sep 23 05:32:46 2008
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 13:32:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Some New Battery Technology Worth Keeping
	anEye On
In-Reply-To: <6792ef120809230549g2bc61418xa770dac78ab00cba@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <56D6BF21C1824DDEA1AA27AC8C6FDDEF@jaysdesktop>

Didn't the article say that these were produced by A123? "The biggest player
in the LiFePO4 marketplace for electric vehicles, however, is A123
Systems.."

 

Jay Marshall 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Keith Hoard
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 8:49 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Some New Battery Technology Worth Keeping
anEye On

 

I've run both LiFe and A123's thru a West Systems Battery Analyzer. . . The
LiFe's have higher internal resistance.

On Tue, Sep 23, 2008 at 7:46 AM, Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net> wrote:

Isn't this the same technology as A123 cells?  Much better reliability and
more cycles but at a weight penalty.  A pack to equal our 10S motor packs
would weigh about 1 pound more.

Stuart C

Scott Pavlock wrote: 

I found this article today and thought you guys might be interested. I
personally like the part that says "These batteries will typically perform
well in temperatures up to 400-Degrees F."

http://www.metaefficient.com/rechargeable-batteries/innovative-lifepo4-batte
ries-electric-vehicles.html

Scott Pavlock






  _____  



 
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion




-- 

Keith Hoard
Collierville, TN
khoard at gmail.com



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From rcmaster199 at aol.com  Tue Sep 23 07:30:49 2008
From: rcmaster199 at aol.com (rcmaster199 at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 15:30:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <703309.36868.qm@web33007.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <703309.36868.qm@web33007.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <8CAEBA864A89F34-D94-7A@WEBMAIL-MA12.sysops.aol.com>

Woa Ed....A one piece rudder wouldn't move much at all so how could it 
scrape the bench....who are you trying to chide??

That gives me an idea....maybe we should build elevators as 1 piece and 
rudders as 2 piece. Split rudders will eliminate any belly or canopy 
pitching. If each half was driven with a separate servo on separate 
channels, they might be programmed to move differentially and eliminate 
roll couple also. QED!!

Just in case you forgot to trim your triangle, this is a simpler 
shearing of the hair

Matt

-----Original Message-----
From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 1:46 am
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls

Did you put the elevator upside down Ed? You have to make sure you put 
the non scraping side down..



Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Mon, 9/22/08, Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; wrote:
From: Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt;
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: "General pattern discussion" 
&lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 10:03 PM






I just tried that.?Something doesn't look
exactly right and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.? What am 
I
doing wrong??
?
Ed

  ----- Original Message -----
  From:
  JShulman

  To: General pattern discussion

  Sent:
 Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30
  PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
  rolls


  swap rudder
  with elevator
  ?
  Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


    -----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
    [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob
    Wilson
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM
To:
    General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
    rolls



     I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is 
the
    correct technique for a snap?
    ?
     For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same 
direction)
    aileron?and up elevator.
     For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite 
aileron
    and down elevator.
    ?
    Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC?videos and
    mine look so raggedy-ass.





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion
  mailing
  list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
=0
Ahttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Tue Sep 23 07:42:12 2008
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 15:42:12 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <8CAEBA864A89F34-D94-7A@WEBMAIL-MA12.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <932752.70922.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I like that idea!! The rudder could even be mixed to low throttle so?each half moves in opposite directions for downline braking, or would that just cause the plane to spin, which could also be cool.

--- On Tue, 9/23/08, rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com> wrote:

From: rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com, nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 11:30 AM

Woa Ed....A one piece rudder wouldn't move much at all so how could it 
scrape the bench....who are you trying to chide??

That gives me an idea....maybe we should build elevators as 1 piece and 
rudders as 2 piece. Split rudders will eliminate any belly or canopy 
pitching. If each half was driven with a separate servo on separate 
channels, they might be programmed to move differentially and eliminate 
roll couple also. QED!!

Just in case you forgot to trim your triangle, this is a simpler 
shearing of the hair

Matt

-----Original Message-----
From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 1:46 am
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls

Did you put the elevator upside down Ed? You have to make sure you put 
the non scraping side down..



Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Mon, 9/22/08, Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; wrote:
From: Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt;
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: "General pattern discussion" 
&lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 10:03 PM






I just tried that.?Something doesn't look
exactly right and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.? What am 
I
doing wrong??
?
Ed

  ----- Original Message -----
  From:
  JShulman

  To: General pattern discussion

  Sent:
 Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30
  PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
  rolls


  swap rudder
  with elevator
  ?
  Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


    -----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
    [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob
    Wilson
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM
To:
    General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
    rolls



     I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is 
the
    correct technique for a snap?
    ?
     For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same 
direction)
    aileron?and up elevator.
     For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite 
aileron
    and down elevator.
    ?
    Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC?videos and
    mine look so raggedy-ass.





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion
  mailing
  list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
=0
Ahttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From joddino at socal.rr.com  Tue Sep 23 08:08:08 2008
From: joddino at socal.rr.com (James Oddino)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 16:08:08 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Jaicco regulators
In-Reply-To: <012501c91757$12d396e0$387ac4a0$@net>
References: <012501c91757$12d396e0$387ac4a0$@net>
Message-ID: <C5CDF28F-023F-4143-86B1-7D354601AB9D@socal.rr.com>

Hi Mike,

Been out of town.  You can order stuff from Central hobbies or I can  
make it up for you.  I need to know if you want the plain regulator or  
the Perfect Switch Harness configuration.  The latter is recommended  
in a one battery, one switch setup like a pattern plane where one is  
trying to minimize weight.  I also need to know the voltage.  You can  
select 5.1, 5.7, or 6.0 Volts.  I'll sell you the regulators for $20  
and the Switch Harness for $30 if you don't tell anyone.  I don't do  
much retail so I'm not setup for credit cards so you'd have to send a  
check.  I'm going out of town again later this week but will be back  
on the 2nd.

Jim


On Sep 15, 2008, at 10:18 AM, michael s harrison wrote:

> Jim,
> Could you send me instructions for ordering regulator and switchs.
> Mike
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From schale at optonline.net  Tue Sep 23 08:17:40 2008
From: schale at optonline.net (Stuart Chale)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 16:17:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Jaicco regulators
In-Reply-To: <C5CDF28F-023F-4143-86B1-7D354601AB9D@socal.rr.com>
References: <012501c91757$12d396e0$387ac4a0$@net>
	<C5CDF28F-023F-4143-86B1-7D354601AB9D@socal.rr.com>
Message-ID: <48D91698.4030309@optonline.net>

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From pamrich47 at hotmail.com  Tue Sep 23 08:19:09 2008
From: pamrich47 at hotmail.com (Richard Strickland)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 16:19:09 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <8CAEBA864A89F34-D94-7A@WEBMAIL-MA12.sysops.aol.com>
References: <703309.36868.qm@web33007.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<8CAEBA864A89F34-D94-7A@WEBMAIL-MA12.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <BAY128-W53B7E57960C80EA8A94243A04A0@phx.gbl>


Didn't Steve Rojecki(sp?) do a split rudder at the TOC like in '88?
RS> To: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 11:30:07 -0400> From: rcmaster199 at aol.com> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls> > Woa Ed....A one piece rudder wouldn't move much at all so how could it > scrape the bench....who are you trying to chide??> > That gives me an idea....maybe we should build elevators as 1 piece and > rudders as 2 piece. Split rudders will eliminate any belly or canopy > pitching. If each half was driven with a separate servo on separate > channels, they might be programmed to move differentially and eliminate > roll couple also. QED!!> > Just in case you forgot to trim your triangle, this is a simpler > shearing of the hair> > Matt> > -----Original Message-----> From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>> Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 1:46 am> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls> > Did you put the elevator upside down Ed? You have to make sure you put > the non scraping side down..> > > > Chris      > > --- On Mon, 9/22/08, Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; wrote:> From: Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt;> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls> To: "General pattern discussion" > &lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;> Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 10:03 PM> > > > > > > I just tried that. Something doesn't look> exactly right and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.  What am > I> doing wrong? >  > Ed> > ----- Original Message -----> From:> JShulman> > To: General pattern discussion> > Sent:> Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30> PM> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap> rolls> > > swap rudder> with elevator>  > Regards,> Jason> www.jasonshulman.com> www.shulmanaviation.com> www.composite-arf.com> > > -----Original Message-----> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob> Wilson> Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM> To:> General pattern discussion> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap> rolls> > > > I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is > the> correct technique for a snap?>  > For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same > direction)> aileron and up elevator.> For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite > aileron> and down elevator.>  > Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC videos and> mine look so raggedy-ass.> > > > > > _______________________________________________> NSRCA-discussion> mailing> list> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________> NSRCA-discussion mailing list> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion> > > _______________________________________________> NSRCA-discussion mailing list> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> =0> Ahttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion> > > _______________________________________________> NSRCA-discussion mailing list> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
_________________________________________________________________
See how Windows Mobile brings your life together?at home, work, or on the go.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093182mrt/direct/01/
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From kerlock at comcast.net  Tue Sep 23 08:19:10 2008
From: kerlock at comcast.net (Mike Hester)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 16:19:10 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Jaicco regulators
References: <012501c91757$12d396e0$387ac4a0$@net>
	<C5CDF28F-023F-4143-86B1-7D354601AB9D@socal.rr.com>
Message-ID: <B67C8A4B54724E34AA60A014E7D887F0@Sanity>

I think you just told everyone...LOL

=)

-Mike

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: James Oddino 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:08 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Jaicco regulators


  Hi Mike,


  Been out of town.  You can order stuff from Central hobbies or I can make it up for you.  I need to know if you want the plain regulator or the Perfect Switch Harness configuration.  The latter is recommended in a one battery, one switch setup like a pattern plane where one is trying to minimize weight.  I also need to know the voltage.  You can select 5.1, 5.7, or 6.0 Volts.  I'll sell you the regulators for $20 and the Switch Harness for $30 if you don't tell anyone.  I don't do much retail so I'm not setup for credit cards so you'd have to send a check.  I'm going out of town again later this week but will be back on the 2nd.


  Jim




  On Sep 15, 2008, at 10:18 AM, michael s harrison wrote:


    Jim,
    Could you send me instructions for ordering regulator and switchs.
    Mike
    _______________________________________________
    NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion






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From wilsorc at gmail.com  Tue Sep 23 08:23:55 2008
From: wilsorc at gmail.com (Bob Wilson)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 16:23:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <932752.70922.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <8CAEBA864A89F34-D94-7A@WEBMAIL-MA12.sysops.aol.com>
	<932752.70922.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <888fdd980809230923i7176fb99k6ce7c5235e068b06@mail.gmail.com>

Ah..ha, just as I suspected.  The conversation got out of hand, but sure is
enjoyable reading.
Obviously, my snap roll technique was flawed and I can't wait for flying
tonight so I can work on the improvements.

Thanks guys
bw

On Tue, Sep 23, 2008 at 10:42 AM, Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>wrote:

>   I like that idea!! The rudder could even be mixed to low throttle
> so each half moves in opposite directions for downline braking, or would
> that just cause the plane to spin, which could also be cool.
>
> --- On *Tue, 9/23/08, rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com>* wrote:
>
> From: rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
> To: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com, nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 11:30 AM
>
>
> Woa Ed....A one piece rudder wouldn't move much at all so how could it
> scrape the bench....who are you trying to chide??
>
> That gives me an idea....maybe we should build elevators as 1 piece and
> rudders as 2 piece. Split rudders will eliminate any belly or canopy
> pitching. If each half was driven with a separate servo on separate
> channels, they might be programmed to move differentially and eliminate
> roll couple also. QED!!
>
> Just in case you forgot to trim your triangle, this is a simpler
> shearing of the hair
>
> Matt
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
> To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 1:46 am
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
>
> Did you put the elevator upside down Ed? You have to make sure you put
> the non scraping side down..
>
>
>
> Chris
>
> --- On Mon, 9/22/08, Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com <lt%3Bed_alt at hotmail.com>&gt; wrote:
> From: Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com <lt%3Bed_alt at hotmail.com>&gt;
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
> To: "General pattern discussion"
> &lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org <lt%3Bnsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>&gt;
> Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 10:03 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I just tried that. Something doesn't look
> exactly right and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.  What am
> I
> doing wrong?
>
> Ed
>
>   ----- Original Message -----
>   From:
>   JShulman
>
>   To: General pattern discussion
>
>   Sent:
>  Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30
>   PM
>   Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
>   rolls
>
>
>   swap rudder
>   with elevator
>
>   Regards,
> Jasonwww.jasonshulman.comwww.shulmanaviation.comwww.composite-arf.com
>
>
>     -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>     [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob
>     Wilson
> Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM
> To:
>     General pattern discussion
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
>     rolls
>
>
>
>      I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is
> the
>     correct technique for a snap?
>
>      For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same
> direction)
>     aileron and up elevator.
>      For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite
> aileron
>     and down elevator.
>
>     Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC videos and
>     mine look so raggedy-ass.
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion
>   mailing
>   listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion <http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion> mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>       _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> =0
> Ahttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Tue Sep 23 08:37:19 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 16:37:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <888fdd980809230923i7176fb99k6ce7c5235e068b06@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNIEIFCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

Try leading with the elevator first for '9.5's', or like my '9' snaps, just
go to the corners at the same time.

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob Wilson
  Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 PM
  To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; General pattern discussion
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls


  Ah..ha, just as I suspected.  The conversation got out of hand, but sure
is enjoyable reading.
  Obviously, my snap roll technique was flawed and I can't wait for flying
tonight so I can work on the improvements.

  Thanks guys
  bw


  On Tue, Sep 23, 2008 at 10:42 AM, Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
wrote:

          I like that idea!! The rudder could even be mixed to low throttle
so each half moves in opposite directions for downline braking, or would
that just cause the plane to spin, which could also be cool.

          --- On Tue, 9/23/08, rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com>
wrote:

            From: rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com>

            Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls

            To: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com,
nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
            Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 11:30 AM



Woa Ed....A one piece rudder wouldn't move much at all so how could it
scrape the bench....who are you trying to chide??

That gives me an idea....maybe we should build elevators as 1 piece and
rudders as 2 piece. Split rudders will eliminate any belly or canopy
pitching. If each half was driven with a separate servo on separate
channels, they might be programmed to move differentially and eliminate
roll couple also. QED!!

Just in case you forgot to trim your triangle, this is a simpler
shearing of the hair

Matt

-----Original Message-----
From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 1:46 am
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls

Did you put the elevator upside down Ed? You have to make sure you put
the non scraping side down..



Chris

--- On Mon, 9/22/08, Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; wrote:
From: Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt;
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: "General pattern discussion"
&lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 10:03 PM






I just tried that. Something doesn't look
exactly right and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.  What am
I
doing wrong?

Ed

  ----- Original Message -----
  From:
  JShulman

  To: General pattern discussion

  Sent:
 Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30
  PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
  rolls


  swap rudder
  with elevator

  Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


    -----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
    [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob
    Wilson
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM
To:
    General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
    rolls



     I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is
the
    correct technique for a snap?

     For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same
direction)
    aileron and up elevator.
     For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite
aileron
    and down elevator.

    Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC videos and
    mine look so raggedy-ass.





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion
  mailing
  list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion____________________
___________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
=0
Ahttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

    _______________________________________________
    NSRCA-discussion mailing list
    NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



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From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Tue Sep 23 09:15:55 2008
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 17:15:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Jaicco regulators
In-Reply-To: <B67C8A4B54724E34AA60A014E7D887F0@Sanity>
Message-ID: <341362.36105.qm@web51008.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

?I love Jaccio regulators!!!!! Mike

--- On Tue, 9/23/08, Mike Hester <kerlock at comcast.net> wrote:

From: Mike Hester <kerlock at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Jaicco regulators
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 11:19 AM





I think you just told everyone...LOL
?
=)
?
-Mike
?

----- Original Message ----- 
From: James Oddino 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:08 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Jaicco regulators

Hi Mike, 


Been out of town. ?You can order stuff from Central hobbies or I can make it up for you. ?I need to know if you want the plain regulator or the Perfect Switch Harness configuration. ?The latter is recommended in a one battery, one switch setup like a pattern plane where one is trying to minimize weight. ?I also need to know the voltage. ?You can select 5.1, 5.7, or 6.0 Volts. ?I'll sell you the regulators for $20 and the Switch Harness for $30 if you don't tell anyone. ?I don't do much retail so I'm not setup for credit cards so you'd have to send a check. ?I'm going out of town again later this week but will be back on the 2nd.


Jim





On Sep 15, 2008, at 10:18 AM, michael s harrison wrote:




Jim,
Could you send me instructions for ordering regulator and switchs.
Mike_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion




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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



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From jpavlick at idseng.com  Tue Sep 23 09:16:48 2008
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 17:16:48 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNIEIFCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <526921.86060.qm@web80502.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Yeah but if you REALLY want to make sure you get a 9.5 (like?I did)?you have to be flying a Black Magic! LOL
?
John Pavlick

--- On Tue, 9/23/08, JShulman <jshulman at cfl.rr.com> wrote:

From: JShulman <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 4:38 PM



Try leading with the elevator first for '9.5's', or like my '9' snaps, just go to the corners at the same time.
?
Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob Wilson
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 PM
To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls



Ah..ha, just as I suspected.? The conversation got out of hand, but sure is enjoyable reading.
Obviously, my snap roll technique was flawed and I can't wait for flying tonight so I can work on the improvements.
?
Thanks guys
bw


On Tue, Sep 23, 2008 at 10:42 AM, Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net> wrote:





I like that idea!! The rudder could even be mixed to low throttle so?each half moves in opposite directions for downline braking, or would that just cause the plane to spin, which could also be cool.

--- On Tue, 9/23/08, rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com> wrote:

From: rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com> 

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com, nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 11:30 AM 




Woa Ed....A one piece rudder wouldn't move much at all so how could it 
scrape the bench....who are you trying to chide??

That gives me an idea....maybe we should build elevators as 1 piece and 
rudders as 2 piece. Split rudders will eliminate any belly or canopy 
pitching. If each half was driven with a separate servo on separate 
channels, they might be programmed to move differentially and eliminate 
roll couple also. QED!!

Just in case you forgot to trim your triangle, this is a simpler 
shearing of the hair

Matt

-----Original Message-----
From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 1:46 am
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls

Did you put the elevator upside down Ed? You have to make sure you put 
the non scraping side down..



Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Mon, 9/22/08, Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; wrote:
From: Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt;
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: "General pattern discussion" 
&lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 10:03 PM






I just tried that.?Something doesn't look
exactly right and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.? What am 
I
doing wrong??
?
Ed

  ----- Original Message -----
  From:
  JShulman

  To: General pattern discussion

  Sent:
 Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30
  PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
  rolls


  swap rudder
  with elevator
  ?
  Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


    -----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
    [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob
    Wilson
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM
To:
    General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
    rolls



     I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is 
the
    correct technique for a snap?
    ?
     For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same 
direction)
    aileron?and up elevator.
     For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite 
aileron
    and down elevator.
    ?
    Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC?videos and
    mine look so raggedy-ass.





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion
  mailing
  list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      _______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
=0
Ahttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From vanputte at cox.net  Tue Sep 23 09:40:27 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 17:40:27 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <526921.86060.qm@web80502.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <526921.86060.qm@web80502.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <B7FE059E-AD71-4278-925A-43D9B85879B2@cox.net>

I think Black Magic airplanes should be barred from competition.  It  
is too easy to get high scores on spins, because they stop spinning  
immediately after the rudder/elevator controls are neutralized.   
That's just not fair.

Ron VP

On Sep 23, 2008, at 12:16 PM, John Pavlick wrote:

> Yeah but if you REALLY want to make sure you get a 9.5 (like I did)  
> you have to be flying a Black Magic! LOL
>
> John Pavlick
>
> --- On Tue, 9/23/08, JShulman <jshulman at cfl.rr.com> wrote:
> From: JShulman <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 4:38 PM
>
> Try leading with the elevator first for '9.5's', or like my '9'  
> snaps, just go to the corners at the same time.
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob Wilson
> Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 PM
> To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
>
> Ah..ha, just as I suspected.  The conversation got out of hand, but  
> sure is enjoyable reading.
> Obviously, my snap roll technique was flawed and I can't wait for  
> flying tonight so I can work on the improvements.
>
> Thanks guys
> bw
>
> On Tue, Sep 23, 2008 at 10:42 AM, Anthony Abdullah  
> <aabdu at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> I like that idea!! The rudder could even be mixed to low throttle  
> so each half moves in opposite directions for downline braking, or  
> would that just cause the plane to spin, which could also be cool.
>
> --- On Tue, 9/23/08, rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com> wrote:
> From: rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com>
>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
> To: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com, nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 11:30 AM
>
>
> Woa Ed....A one piece rudder wouldn't move much at all so how could  
> it scrape the bench....who are you trying to chide?? That gives me  
> an idea....maybe we should build elevators as 1 piece and rudders  
> as 2 piece. Split rudders will eliminate any belly or canopy  
> pitching. If each half was driven with a separate servo on separate  
> channels, they might be programmed to move differentially and  
> eliminate roll couple also. QED!! Just in case you forgot to trim  
> your triangle, this is a simpler shearing of the hair  Matt ----- 
> Original Message----- From: krishlan fitzsimmons  
> <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com> To: General pattern discussion  
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 1:46 am  
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls Did you put the elevator  
> upside down Ed? You have to make sure you put the non scraping side  
> down.. Chris       --- On Mon, 9/22/08, Ed Alt  
> &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; wrote: From: Ed Alt  
> &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap  
> rolls To: "General pattern discussion" &lt;nsrca- 
> discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt; Date: Monday, September 22, 2008,  
> 10:03 PM I just tried that. Something doesn't look exactly right  
> and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.  What am I doing  
> wrong?    Ed ----- Original Message ----- From: JShulman To:  
> General pattern discussion Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30  
> PM Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls swap rudder with  
> elevator   Regards, Jason www.jasonshulman.com  
> www.shulmanaviation.com www.composite-arf.com -----Original  
> Message----- From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org  
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob  
> Wilson Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM To: General  
> pattern discussion Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls I'm  
> probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is the  
> correct technique for a snap?   For an inside snap, I apply rudder  
> a fraction before (same direction) aileron and up elevator. For an  
> outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite aileron and  
> down elevator.   Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my  
> TOC videos and mine look so raggedy-ass.  
> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca- 
> discussion_______________________________________________ NSRCA- 
> discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion  
> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org =0 Ahttp:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion  
> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Tue Sep 23 09:52:59 2008
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 17:52:59 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <B7FE059E-AD71-4278-925A-43D9B85879B2@cox.net>
Message-ID: <540178.23214.qm@web33006.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Somebody stop em!!? lol?? 

Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Tue, 9/23/08, Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net> wrote:
From: Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 10:40 AM

I think Black Magic airplanes should be barred from competition.  It  
is too easy to get high scores on spins, because they stop spinning  
immediately after the rudder/elevator controls are neutralized.   
That's just not fair.

Ron VP

On Sep 23, 2008, at 12:16 PM, John Pavlick wrote:

> Yeah but if you REALLY want to make sure you get a 9.5 (like I did)  
> you have to be flying a Black Magic! LOL
>
> John Pavlick
>
> --- On Tue, 9/23/08, JShulman <jshulman at cfl.rr.com> wrote:
> From: JShulman <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
> To: "General pattern discussion"
<nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 4:38 PM
>
> Try leading with the elevator first for '9.5's', or like my
'9'  
> snaps, just go to the corners at the same time.
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob Wilson
> Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 PM
> To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
>
> Ah..ha, just as I suspected.  The conversation got out of hand, but  
> sure is enjoyable reading.
> Obviously, my snap roll technique was flawed and I can't wait for  
> flying tonight so I can work on the improvements.
>
> Thanks guys
> bw
>
> On Tue, Sep 23, 2008 at 10:42 AM, Anthony Abdullah  
> <aabdu at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> I like that idea!! The rudder could even be mixed to low throttle  
> so each half moves in opposite directions for downline braking, or  
> would that just cause the plane to spin, which could also be cool.
>
> --- On Tue, 9/23/08, rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com>
wrote:
> From: rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com>
>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
> To: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com, nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 11:30 AM
>
>
> Woa Ed....A one piece rudder wouldn't move much at all so how could  
> it scrape the bench....who are you trying to chide?? That gives me  
> an idea....maybe we should build elevators as 1 piece and rudders  
> as 2 piece. Split rudders will eliminate any belly or canopy  
> pitching. If each half was driven with a separate servo on separate  
> channels, they might be programmed to move differentially and  
> eliminate roll couple also. QED!! Just in case you forgot to trim  
> your triangle, this is a simpler shearing of the hair  Matt ----- 
> Original Message----- From: krishlan fitzsimmons  
> <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com> To: General pattern discussion  
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 1:46 am  
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls Did you put the elevator  
> upside down Ed? You have to make sure you put the non scraping side  
> down.. Chris       --- On Mon, 9/22/08, Ed Alt  
> &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; wrote: From: Ed Alt  
> &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap  
> rolls To: "General pattern discussion" &lt;nsrca- 
> discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt; Date: Monday, September 22, 2008,  
> 10:03 PM I just tried that. Something doesn't look exactly right  
> and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.  What am I doing  
> wrong?    Ed ----- Original Message ----- From: JShulman To:  
> General pattern discussion Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30  
> PM Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls swap rudder with  
> elevator   Regards, Jason www.jasonshulman.com  
> www.shulmanaviation.com www.composite-arf.com -----Original  
> Message----- From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org  
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob  
> Wilson Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM To: General  
> pattern discussion Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls I'm  
> probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is the  
> correct technique for a snap?   For an inside snap, I apply rudder  
> a fraction before (same direction) aileron and up elevator. For an  
> outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite aileron and  
> down elevator.   Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my  
> TOC videos and mine look so raggedy-ass.  
> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca- 
> discussion_______________________________________________ NSRCA- 
> discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion  
> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org =0 Ahttp:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion  
> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



      
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From joddino at socal.rr.com  Tue Sep 23 10:11:34 2008
From: joddino at socal.rr.com (James Oddino)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 18:11:34 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Jaicco regulators
In-Reply-To: <48D91698.4030309@optonline.net>
References: <012501c91757$12d396e0$387ac4a0$@net>
	<C5CDF28F-023F-4143-86B1-7D354601AB9D@socal.rr.com>
	<48D91698.4030309@optonline.net>
Message-ID: <4FC7B4BE-D3C5-4C99-9B89-5EC5AB0073A0@socal.rr.com>

I better start looking at where my emails come from.

On Sep 23, 2008, at 9:17 AM, Stuart Chale wrote:

> He won't tell anyone :)
>
> James Oddino wrote:
>>
>> Hi Mike,
>>
>> Been out of town.  You can order stuff from Central hobbies or I  
>> can make it up for you.  I need to know if you want the plain  
>> regulator or the Perfect Switch Harness configuration.  The latter  
>> is recommended in a one battery, one switch setup like a pattern  
>> plane where one is trying to minimize weight.  I also need to know  
>> the voltage.  You can select 5.1, 5.7, or 6.0 Volts.  I'll sell you  
>> the regulators for $20 and the Switch Harness for $30 if you don't  
>> tell anyone.  I don't do much retail so I'm not setup for credit  
>> cards so you'd have to send a check.  I'm going out of town again  
>> later this week but will be back on the 2nd.
>>
>> Jim
>>
>>
>> On Sep 15, 2008, at 10:18 AM, michael s harrison wrote:
>>
>>> Jim,
>>> Could you send me instructions for ordering regulator and switchs.
>>> Mike
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

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From jpavlick at idseng.com  Tue Sep 23 10:41:45 2008
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 18:41:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <B7FE059E-AD71-4278-925A-43D9B85879B2@cox.net>
Message-ID: <37631.26369.qm@web80503.mail.mud.yahoo.com>


Shh. Now you gave away my other secret. And all this time?I thought it was because?I was becoming a better pilot. :(?Hey - nobody ever said this had to be fair! VBG
?
John Pavlick

--- On Tue, 9/23/08, Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net> wrote:

From: Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 5:40 PM

I think Black Magic airplanes should be barred from competition.  It  
is too easy to get high scores on spins, because they stop spinning  
immediately after the rudder/elevator controls are neutralized.   
That's just not fair.

Ron VP

On Sep 23, 2008, at 12:16 PM, John Pavlick wrote:

> Yeah but if you REALLY want to make sure you get a 9.5 (like I did)  
> you have to be flying a Black Magic! LOL
>
> John Pavlick
>
> --- On Tue, 9/23/08, JShulman <jshulman at cfl.rr.com> wrote:
> From: JShulman <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
> To: "General pattern discussion"
<nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 4:38 PM
>
> Try leading with the elevator first for '9.5's', or like my
'9'  
> snaps, just go to the corners at the same time.
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob Wilson
> Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 PM
> To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
>
> Ah..ha, just as I suspected.  The conversation got out of hand, but  
> sure is enjoyable reading.
> Obviously, my snap roll technique was flawed and I can't wait for  
> flying tonight so I can work on the improvements.
>
> Thanks guys
> bw
>
> On Tue, Sep 23, 2008 at 10:42 AM, Anthony Abdullah  
> <aabdu at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> I like that idea!! The rudder could even be mixed to low throttle  
> so each half moves in opposite directions for downline braking, or  
> would that just cause the plane to spin, which could also be cool.
>
> --- On Tue, 9/23/08, rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com>
wrote:
> From: rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com>
>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
> To: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com, nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 11:30 AM
>
>
> Woa Ed....A one piece rudder wouldn't move much at all so how could  
> it scrape the bench....who are you trying to chide?? That gives me  
> an idea....maybe we should build elevators as 1 piece and rudders  
> as 2 piece. Split rudders will eliminate any belly or canopy  
> pitching. If each half was driven with a separate servo on separate  
> channels, they might be programmed to move differentially and  
> eliminate roll couple also. QED!! Just in case you forgot to trim  
> your triangle, this is a simpler shearing of the hair  Matt ----- 
> Original Message----- From: krishlan fitzsimmons  
> <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com> To: General pattern discussion  
> <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 1:46 am  
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls Did you put the elevator  
> upside down Ed? You have to make sure you put the non scraping side  
> down.. Chris       --- On Mon, 9/22/08, Ed Alt  
> &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; wrote: From: Ed Alt  
> &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap  
> rolls To: "General pattern discussion" &lt;nsrca- 
> discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt; Date: Monday, September 22, 2008,  
> 10:03 PM I just tried that. Something doesn't look exactly right  
> and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.  What am I doing  
> wrong?    Ed ----- Original Message ----- From: JShulman To:  
> General pattern discussion Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30  
> PM Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls swap rudder with  
> elevator   Regards, Jason www.jasonshulman.com  
> www.shulmanaviation.com www.composite-arf.com -----Original  
> Message----- From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org  
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob  
> Wilson Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM To: General  
> pattern discussion Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls I'm  
> probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is the  
> correct technique for a snap?   For an inside snap, I apply rudder  
> a fraction before (same direction) aileron and up elevator. For an  
> outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite aileron and  
> down elevator.   Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my  
> TOC videos and mine look so raggedy-ass.  
> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca- 
> discussion_______________________________________________ NSRCA- 
> discussion mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion  
> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org =0 Ahttp:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion  
> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From drmikedds at sbcglobal.net  Tue Sep 23 12:17:58 2008
From: drmikedds at sbcglobal.net (michael s harrison)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 20:17:58 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Jaicco regulators
In-Reply-To: <4FC7B4BE-D3C5-4C99-9B89-5EC5AB0073A0@socal.rr.com>
References: <012501c91757$12d396e0$387ac4a0$@net>	<C5CDF28F-023F-4143-86B1-7D354601AB9D@socal.rr.com>	<48D91698.4030309@optonline.net>
	<4FC7B4BE-D3C5-4C99-9B89-5EC5AB0073A0@socal.rr.com>
Message-ID: <004501c91db9$4f7f7c40$ee7e74c0$@net>

That is ok, I will order from Central.  They are a very good company.

Mike

 

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of James Oddino
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 1:11 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Jaicco regulators

 

I better start looking at where my emails come from.

 

On Sep 23, 2008, at 9:17 AM, Stuart Chale wrote:





He won't tell anyone :)

James Oddino wrote: 

Hi Mike, 

 

Been out of town.  You can order stuff from Central hobbies or I can make it
up for you.  I need to know if you want the plain regulator or the Perfect
Switch Harness configuration.  The latter is recommended in a one battery,
one switch setup like a pattern plane where one is trying to minimize
weight.  I also need to know the voltage.  You can select 5.1, 5.7, or 6.0
Volts.  I'll sell you the regulators for $20 and the Switch Harness for $30
if you don't tell anyone.  I don't do much retail so I'm not setup for
credit cards so you'd have to send a check.  I'm going out of town again
later this week but will be back on the 2nd.

 

Jim

 

 

On Sep 15, 2008, at 10:18 AM, michael s harrison wrote:





Jim,

Could you send me instructions for ordering regulator and switchs.

Mike

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 




  _____  



 
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
  

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

Internal Virus Database is out of date.
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.5.2/1561 - Release Date: 7/18/2008
6:35 PM

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From troy at troynewman.net  Tue Sep 23 13:03:48 2008
From: troy at troynewman.net (Troy Newman)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 21:03:48 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
In-Reply-To: <092320081034.1050.48D8C651000D95EF0000041A22165514060C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
References: <092320081034.1050.48D8C651000D95EF0000041A22165514060C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB2010AD073@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>

Vince,
 
While its not recommended there are several people that have done it. I
will say that because you will hear of XXX people that have done it with
no problems.
 
JR does NOT recommend it and here is why:  The output of the system is
driven by a specific design voltage. In the 72mhz stuff the output
transistor would get hot if the system was run at the higher voltage. A
3S lipo pack comes off the charger at about 12.4-12.6V....A fully
charged stock battery pack comes off the charger at about 11.5 to 12V.
Here is what I think you should look at. The Lipo pack will maintain is
"over voltage" condition for a long time. It will stay above 11.5V most
of the time you spend flying it. Where as the Nimh or Nicd packs will
fall off to about a 10.5V range and slowly come down from there. The
high voltage condition is only for a few minutes maybe the first flight.
The lipo high Voltage condition is a long time maybe 5-8 flights.
 
The issue with the 72mhz equipment was the output transistor would get
hot and start to weaken causing loss of range and possible a failure.
This is the same problem as running your TX on 72mhz and leaving it on
for long periods of time with the antenna down. The module gets hot.
This is un-needed wear and tear on the output transistor. Continued
abuse like this will weaken the output transistor...In the lipo you are
running it in a "high" volt condition for a longer period of time every
time you charge the system up. So yes it will work on day #1 and Day
#2....but What happens on Day #50 or 9 months down the road. 1 yr later?
Its not a good idea as it will weaken the system and it could cost you a
model.
 
Fast forward to the DSM technology. Again we have a similar situation.
The output of the system was designed to be run at a given voltage. That
voltage is the 8cell (nicd or Nimh) packs. Not the extra 1V of head
voltage carried in the 3S lipo packs. I'm not in on the design of the
DSM output and can't tell you if it has a similar issue to the one in
the 72mhz. However in the 12X manual it states clearly....
 
"Q: Can I use a 3-cell LiPo pack in my transmitter?

A: No. All current JR and Spektrum transmitters are designed to operate
using a 9.6-volt transmitter pack. A fully charged 3-cell LiPo pack puts
out 12.6 volts. This higher voltage can overload the power-regulating
transistor, causing damage and or failure, possibly in flight. Many of
our customers have experienced failures using 3-cell LiPo packs and
their use in JR and Spektrum transmitters is highly advised against. The
12X system will operate for over 8 hours using the included 2000mAh NiMH
battery."

 

This being the case the 12X is the latest system from JR. SO if it is
not Lipo capable the others are not either. Will it work? Yes, are you
taking a chance and risking your model YES.

I don't understand the rave with the lipo TX packs. The 12X pack that
comes standard is a 2000mah pack. A replacement pack would be a
2000-2100mah pack also... So you are not going to get more flight time
per charge. The only thing is the lipo will not self discharge as fast
as the Nimh. However I find the Nimh packs last for a very long
time....Still flyable  (10.5V) after sitting for a month untouched. One
note I usually charge my TX packs with the wall C/10 charger overnight.
I sometimes will use a Sirius charger on them or a peak detection
charger for a quick field boost if its getting low. However This is a
rare thing. 90% of my charging is with the slow c/10 charge rate. At
this the Nimh packs provide extremely good service life and hold their
charge well. A guy that is always fast charging his nimh batts will have
trouble with the Nimh technology. It doesn't do as well with this type
of use.
 

By the way JR makes  a 2500mah nimh that I have placed in my 9303 and
also have installed in an old 10X battery case. It works great as well. 

 

Hope this helps you.

Troy Newman
Team JR

 

________________________________

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
vicenterc at comcast.net
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 3:35 AM
To: General pattern discussion; General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo


Jerry,
 
Are you using regulator?  It looks like JR does not like the high
voltage.  Probably, I am going to try to call or e-mail JR to ask.  I
wonder if there is a difference between the 2.4 modules and the old
modules in regard taking higher voltage.  New TX are designed to work
with LiPo.  Just wondering.
 
JR sponsored pilits.  Can you find out?
 
Thanks for all responding.
 
--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone
 

	-------------- Original message -------------- 
	From: Budd Engineering <jerry at buddengineering.com> 
	
	> Yep, and I couldn't be happier. 
	> 
	> True R/C 2500 mAh LiPo's, $30 each, fits inside the 10X
battery holder 
	> with a minor amount of trimming with the Dremel tool. I bought
one 
	> set to try, liked it so well I bought another and converted
the spare 
	> battery pack. That way I can charge them out of the
transmitter (not 
	> that it matters, the charge rate is so low that the risk of a
mishap 
	> is about the same as with NiCads or NiMh). 
	> 
	> I screwed around with a couple sets of NiMH's for the past
several 
	> years, they were a total waste of time, the self discharge
rate got to 
	> where I had to re-charge them if I didn't fly within a day or
so of 
	> the previous charge 
	> 
	> The LiPo 's pea k up at 12.5 V, essentially the same voltage
as a good 
	> set of NiCads, and discharge almost linearly, so it's easy to
assess 
	> their state of discharge. 
	> 
	> http://home.comcast.net/~truerc/ready_pack/ready_packs.htm 
	> 
	> Thx, Jerry 
	> 
	> Budd Engineering 
	> jerry at buddengineering.com 
	> http://www.buddengineering.com 
	> 
	> On Sep 22, 2008, at 8:56 AM, vicenterc at comcast.net wrote: 
	> 
	> > Has anyone done the conversion? 
	> > 
	> > Thanks, 
	> > 
	> > -- 
	> > Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
	> > _______________________________________________ 
	> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
	> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
	> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
	> 
	> _______________________________________________ 
	> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
	> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
	& gt; http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Tue Sep 23 13:58:57 2008
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 21:58:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
In-Reply-To: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB2010AD073@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>
Message-ID: <412389.18057.qm@web33002.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

The lipo pack is lighter.. Guess that's one good thing Troy. Probably the only real benefit except holding voltage over time. Although, even though in a transmitter, I would say the battery should be discharged for storage, and charged the day before anyway. So even holding the voltage over time may not be a real benefit. But the weight thing would be nice.. 

Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Tue, 9/23/08, Troy Newman <troy at troynewman.net> wrote:
From: Troy Newman <troy at troynewman.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 2:03 PM

Vince,
 
While its not recommended there are several people that have done it. I
will say that because you will hear of XXX people that have done it with
no problems.
 
JR does NOT recommend it and here is why:  The output of the system is
driven by a specific design voltage. In the 72mhz stuff the output
transistor would get hot if the system was run at the higher voltage. A
3S lipo pack comes off the charger at about 12.4-12.6V....A fully
charged stock battery pack comes off the charger at about 11.5 to 12V.
Here is what I think you should look at. The Lipo pack will maintain is
"over voltage" condition for a long time. It will stay above 11.5V
most
of the time you spend flying it. Where as the Nimh or Nicd packs will
fall off to about a 10.5V range and slowly come down from there. The
high voltage condition is only for a few minutes maybe the first flight.
The lipo high Voltage condition is a long time maybe 5-8 flights.
 
The issue with the 72mhz equipment was the output transistor would get
hot and start to weaken causing loss of range and possible a failure.
This is the same problem as running your TX on 72mhz and leaving it on
for long periods of time with the antenna down. The module gets hot.
This is un-needed wear and tear on the output transistor. Continued
abuse like this will weaken the output transistor...In the lipo you are
running it in a "high" volt condition for a longer period of time
every
time you charge the system up. So yes it will work on day #1 and Day
#2....but What happens on Day #50 or 9 months down the road. 1 yr later?
Its not a good idea as it will weaken the system and it could cost you a
model.
 
Fast forward to the DSM technology. Again we have a similar situation.
The output of the system was designed to be run at a given voltage. That
voltage is the 8cell (nicd or Nimh) packs. Not the extra 1V of head
voltage carried in the 3S lipo packs. I'm not in on the design of the
DSM output and can't tell you if it has a similar issue to the one in
the 72mhz. However in the 12X manual it states clearly....
 
"Q: Can I use a 3-cell LiPo pack in my transmitter?

A: No. All current JR and Spektrum transmitters are designed to operate
using a 9.6-volt transmitter pack. A fully charged 3-cell LiPo pack puts
out 12.6 volts. This higher voltage can overload the power-regulating
transistor, causing damage and or failure, possibly in flight. Many of
our customers have experienced failures using 3-cell LiPo packs and
their use in JR and Spektrum transmitters is highly advised against. The
12X system will operate for over 8 hours using the included 2000mAh NiMH
battery."

 

This being the case the 12X is the latest system from JR. SO if it is
not Lipo capable the others are not either. Will it work? Yes, are you
taking a chance and risking your model YES.

I don't understand the rave with the lipo TX packs. The 12X pack that
comes standard is a 2000mah pack. A replacement pack would be a
2000-2100mah pack also... So you are not going to get more flight time
per charge. The only thing is the lipo will not self discharge as fast
as the Nimh. However I find the Nimh packs last for a very long
time....Still flyable  (10.5V) after sitting for a month untouched. One
note I usually charge my TX packs with the wall C/10 charger overnight.
I sometimes will use a Sirius charger on them or a peak detection
charger for a quick field boost if its getting low. However This is a
rare thing. 90% of my charging is with the slow c/10 charge rate. At
this the Nimh packs provide extremely good service life and hold their
charge well. A guy that is always fast charging his nimh batts will have
trouble with the Nimh technology. It doesn't do as well with this type
of use.
 

By the way JR makes  a 2500mah nimh that I have placed in my 9303 and
also have installed in an old 10X battery case. It works great as well. 

 

Hope this helps you.

Troy Newman
Team JR

 

________________________________

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
vicenterc at comcast.net
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 3:35 AM
To: General pattern discussion; General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo


Jerry,
 
Are you using regulator?  It looks like JR does not like the high
voltage.  Probably, I am going to try to call or e-mail JR to ask.  I
wonder if there is a difference between the 2.4 modules and the old
modules in regard taking higher voltage.  New TX are designed to work
with LiPo.  Just wondering.
 
JR sponsored pilits.  Can you find out?
 
Thanks for all responding.
 
--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone
 

	-------------- Original message -------------- 
	From: Budd Engineering <jerry at buddengineering.com> 
	
	> Yep, and I couldn't be happier. 
	> 
	> True R/C 2500 mAh LiPo's, $30 each, fits inside the 10X
battery holder 
	> with a minor amount of trimming with the Dremel tool. I bought
one 
	> set to try, liked it so well I bought another and converted
the spare 
	> battery pack. That way I can charge them out of the
transmitter (not 
	> that it matters, the charge rate is so low that the risk of a
mishap 
	> is about the same as with NiCads or NiMh). 
	> 
	> I screwed around with a couple sets of NiMH's for the past
several 
	> years, they were a total waste of time, the self discharge
rate got to 
	> where I had to re-charge them if I didn't fly within a day or
so of 
	> the previous charge 
	> 
	> The LiPo 's pea k up at 12.5 V, essentially the same voltage
as a good 
	> set of NiCads, and discharge almost linearly, so it's easy to
assess 
	> their state of discharge. 
	> 
	> http://home.comcast.net/~truerc/ready_pack/ready_packs.htm 
	> 
	> Thx, Jerry 
	> 
	> Budd Engineering 
	> jerry at buddengineering.com 
	> http://www.buddengineering.com 
	> 
	> On Sep 22, 2008, at 8:56 AM, vicenterc at comcast.net wrote: 
	> 
	> > Has anyone done the conversion? 
	> > 
	> > Thanks, 
	> > 
	> > -- 
	> > Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
	> > _______________________________________________ 
	> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
	> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
	> > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
	> 
	> _______________________________________________ 
	> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
	> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
	& gt; http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



      
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Tue Sep 23 14:26:57 2008
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (vicenterc at comcast.net)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 22:26:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo
Message-ID: <092320082226.10173.48D96D2A000CC0A7000027BD22165258060C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>

Troy,

Well, that is clear like water.  Thanks for the feedback.  I was checking alternates since I need to replace the TX batteries for next season.  I will keep using the NiMh as you recommended.  

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: "Troy Newman" <troy at troynewman.net> 

> Vince, 
> 
> While its not recommended there are several people that have done it. I 
> will say that because you will hear of XXX people that have done it with 
> no problems. 
> 
> JR does NOT recommend it and here is why: The output of the system is 
> driven by a specific design voltage. In the 72mhz stuff the output 
> transistor would get hot if the system was run at the higher voltage. A 
> 3S lipo pack comes off the charger at about 12.4-12.6V....A fully 
> charged stock battery pack comes off the charger at about 11.5 to 12V. 
> Here is what I think you should look at. The Lipo pack will maintain is 
> "over voltage" condition for a long time. It will stay above 11.5V most 
> of the time you spend flying it. Where as the Nimh or Nicd packs will 
> fall off to about a 10.5V range and slowly come down from there. The 
> high voltage condition is only for a few minutes maybe the first flight. 
> The lipo high Voltage condition is a long time maybe 5-8 flights. 
> 
> The issue with the 72mhz equipment was the output transistor would get 
> hot and start to weaken causing loss of range and possible a failure. 
> This is the same problem as running your TX on 72mhz and leaving it on 
> for long periods of time with the antenna down. The module gets hot. 
> This is un-needed wear and tear on the output transistor. Continued 
> abuse like this will weaken the output transistor...In the lipo you are 
> running it in a "high" volt condition for a longer period of time every 
> time you charge the system up. So yes it will work on day #1 and Day 
> #2....but What happens on Day #50 or 9 months down the road. 1 yr later? 
> Its not a good idea as it will weaken the system and it could cost you a 
> model. 
> 
> Fast forward to the DSM technology. Again we have a similar situation. 
> The output of the system was designed to be run at a given voltage. That 
> voltage is the 8cell (nicd or Nimh) packs. Not the extra 1V of head 
> voltage carried in the 3S lipo packs. I'm not in on the design of the 
> DSM output and can't tell you if it has a similar issue to the one in 
> the 72mhz. However in the 12X manual it states clearly.... 
> 
> "Q: Can I use a 3-cell LiPo pack in my transmitter? 
> 
> A: No. All current JR and Spektrum transmitters are designed to operate 
> using a 9.6-volt transmitter pack. A fully charged 3-cell LiPo pack puts 
> out 12.6 volts. This higher voltage can overload the power-regulating 
> transistor, causing damage and or failure, possibly in flight. Many of 
> our customers have experienced failures using 3-cell LiPo packs and 
> their use in JR and Spektrum transmitters is highly advised against. The 
> 12X system will operate for over 8 hours using the included 2000mAh NiMH 
> battery." 
> 
> 
> 
> This being the case the 12X is the latest system from JR. SO if it is 
> not Lipo capable the others are not either. Will it work? Yes, are you 
> taking a chance and risking your model YES. 
> 
> I don't understand the rave with the lipo TX packs. The 12X pack that 
> comes standard is a 2000mah pack. A replacement pack would be a 
> 2000-2100mah pack also... So you are not going to get more flight time 
> per charge. The only thing is the lipo will not self discharge as fast 
> as the Nimh. However I find the Nimh packs last for a very long 
> time....Still flyable (10.5V) after sitting for a month untouched. One 
> note I usually charge my TX packs with the wall C/10 charger overnight. 
> I sometimes will use a Sirius charger on them or a peak detection 
> charger for a quick field boost if its getting low. However This is a 
> rare thing. 90% of my charging is with the slow c/10 charge rate. At 
> this the Nimh packs provide extremely good service life and hold their 
> charge well. A guy that is always fast charging his nimh batts will have 
> trouble with the Nimh technology. It doesn't do as well with this type 
> of use. 
> 
> 
> By the way JR makes a 2500mah nimh that I have placed in my 9303 and 
> also have installed in an old 10X battery case. It works great as well. 
> 
> 
> 
> Hope this helps you. 
> 
> Troy Newman 
> Team JR 
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________ 
> 
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of 
> vicenterc at comcast.net 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 3:35 AM 
> To: General pattern discussion; General pattern discussion 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] JR 10X conversion to LiPo 
> 
> 
> Jerry, 
> 
> Are you using regulator? It looks like JR does not like the high 
> voltage. Probably, I am going to try to call or e-mail JR to ask. I 
> wonder if there is a difference between the 2.4 modules and the old 
> modules in regard taking higher voltage. New TX are designed to work 
> with LiPo. Just wondering. 
> 
> JR sponsored pilits. Can you find out? 
> 
> Thanks for all responding. 
> 
> -- 
> Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
> 
> 
> -------------- Original message -------------- 
> From: Budd Engineering 
> 
> > Yep, and I couldn't be happier. 
> > 
> > True R/C 2500 mAh LiPo's, $30 each, fits inside the 10X 
> battery holder 
> > with a minor amount of trimming with the Dremel tool. I bought 
> one 
> > set to try, liked it so well I bought another and converted 
> the spare 
> > battery pack. That way I can charge them out of the 
> transmitter (not 
> > that it matters, the charge rate is so low that the risk of a 
> mishap 
> > is about the same as with NiCads or NiMh). 
> > 
> > I screwed around with a couple sets of NiMH's for the past 
> several 
> > years, they were a total waste of time, the self discharge 
> rate got to 
> > where I had to re-charge them if I didn't fly within a day or 
> so of 
> > the previous charge 
> > 
> > The LiPo 's pea k up at 12.5 V, essentially the same voltage 
> as a good 
> > set of NiCads, and discharge almost linearly, so it's easy to 
> assess 
> > their state of discharge. 
> > 
> > http://home.comcast.net/~truerc/ready_pack/ready_packs.htm 
> > 
> > Thx, Jerry 
> > 
> > Budd Engineering 
> > jerry at buddengineering.com 
> > http://www.buddengineering.com 
> > 
> > On Sep 22, 2008, at 8:56 AM, vicenterc at comcast.net wrote: 
> > 
> > > Has anyone done the conversion? 
> > > 
> > > Thanks, 
> > > 
> > > -- 
> > > Vicente "Vince" Bortone 
> > > _______________________________________________ 
> > > NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> > > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> > > http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________ 
> > NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> & gt; http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
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From f3aflyer7 at gmail.com  Tue Sep 23 15:34:11 2008
From: f3aflyer7 at gmail.com (Scott Pavlock)
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 23:34:11 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Some New Battery Technology Worth Keeping
	anEye On
In-Reply-To: <56D6BF21C1824DDEA1AA27AC8C6FDDEF@jaysdesktop>
References: <6792ef120809230549g2bc61418xa770dac78ab00cba@mail.gmail.com>
	<56D6BF21C1824DDEA1AA27AC8C6FDDEF@jaysdesktop>
Message-ID: <72f9ee7c0809231634y3e296aecp39fee1f2407f8071@mail.gmail.com>

I don't think that they were going to be produced by A123, but more or less
developed by them along with help from the auto industry.

Scott Pavlock

On Tue, Sep 23, 2008 at 9:32 AM, Jay Marshall <lightfoot at sc.rr.com> wrote:

>  Didn't the article say that these were produced by A123? "The biggest
> player in the LiFePO4 marketplace for electric vehicles, however, is A123
> Systems?."
>
>
>
> *Jay **Marshall*
>
> -----Original Message-----
> *From:* nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:
> nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] *On Behalf Of *Keith Hoard
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 23, 2008 8:49 AM
> *To:* General pattern discussion
> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Some New Battery Technology Worth
> Keeping anEye On
>
>
>
> I've run both LiFe and A123's thru a West Systems Battery Analyzer. . . The
> LiFe's have higher internal resistance.
>
> On Tue, Sep 23, 2008 at 7:46 AM, Stuart Chale <schale at optonline.net>
> wrote:
>
> Isn't this the same technology as A123 cells?  Much better reliability and
> more cycles but at a weight penalty.  A pack to equal our 10S motor packs
> would weigh about 1 pound more.
>
> Stuart C
>
> Scott Pavlock wrote:
>
> I found this article today and thought you guys might be interested. I
> personally like the part that says "These batteries will typically perform
> well in temperatures up to 400-Degrees F."
>
>
> http://www.metaefficient.com/rechargeable-batteries/innovative-lifepo4-batteries-electric-vehicles.html
>
> Scott Pavlock
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Keith Hoard
> Collierville, TN
> khoard at gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Tue Sep 23 16:20:48 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 00:20:48 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
References: <932752.70922.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV2DF1ED5DF14C5B814E238E8450@phx.gbl>

I've created a monster...
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Anthony Abdullah 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 10:42 AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls


        I like that idea!! The rudder could even be mixed to low throttle so each half moves in opposite directions for downline braking, or would that just cause the plane to spin, which could also be cool.

        --- On Tue, 9/23/08, rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com> wrote:

          From: rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com>
          Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
          To: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com, nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
          Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 11:30 AM


Woa Ed....A one piece rudder wouldn't move much at all so how could it 
scrape the bench....who are you trying to chide??

That gives me an idea....maybe we should build elevators as 1 piece and 
rudders as 2 piece. Split rudders will eliminate any belly or canopy 
pitching. If each half was driven with a separate servo on separate 
channels, they might be programmed to move differentially and eliminate 
roll couple also. QED!!

Just in case you forgot to trim your triangle, this is a simpler 
shearing of the hair

Matt

-----Original Message-----
From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 1:46 am
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls

Did you put the elevator upside down Ed? You have to make sure you put 
the non scraping side down..



Chris          

--- On Mon, 9/22/08, Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; wrote:
From: Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt;
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: "General pattern discussion" 
&lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 10:03 PM






I just tried that. Something doesn't look
exactly right and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.  What am 
I
doing wrong? 
 
Ed

  ----- Original Message -----
  From:
  JShulman

  To: General pattern discussion

  Sent:
 Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30
  PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
  rolls


  swap rudder
  with elevator
   
  Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


    -----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
    [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob
    Wilson
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM
To:
    General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
    rolls



     I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is 
the
    correct technique for a snap?
     
     For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same 
direction)
    aileron and up elevator.
     For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite 
aileron
    and down elevator.
     
    Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC videos and
    mine look so raggedy-ass.





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion
  mailing
  list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
=0
Ahttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 



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From mwaustin54 at cox.net  Tue Sep 23 17:53:43 2008
From: mwaustin54 at cox.net (mwaustin54 at cox.net)
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 01:53:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For Sale
Message-ID: <20080923215342.JSLV7.439524.imail@fed1rmwml35>

I'll post this for anyone interested before going to RCU with it.

Low time OS 140RX  w/ Mintor 2 plug head & standard head included $275.00
Mueller header for same motor - $25.00
Hyde "A" mount for same motor - $75.00
OS pipe- excellent condition - $ 85.00
Package deal for  450.00 !!

Be happy to provide pics and info if interested.

Email me anytime.

Mike Austin


From mwaustin54 at cox.net  Tue Sep 23 17:56:47 2008
From: mwaustin54 at cox.net (mwaustin54 at cox.net)
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 01:56:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For Sale
Message-ID: <20080923215647.35R0A.439574.imail@fed1rmwml35>

I'll post this for anyone interested before going to RCU with it.

Low time OS 140RX  w/ Mintor 2 plug head & standard head included $275.00
Mueller header for same motor - $25.00
Hyde "A" mount for same motor - $75.00
OS pipe- excellent condition - $ 85.00
Package deal for  450.00 !!

Be happy to provide pics and info if interested.

Email me anytime.

Mike Austin


From verne at twmi.rr.com  Tue Sep 23 19:41:56 2008
From: verne at twmi.rr.com (Verne Koester)
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 03:41:56 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
References: <932752.70922.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<BAY135-DAV2DF1ED5DF14C5B814E238E8450@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <8D4F53A51D8D4C30BD2DCD911DEE1853@Vinnie>

Monster's been there all along. You just let him out......

Verne


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Ed Alt 
  To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net ; General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 8:20 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls


  I've created a monster...
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Anthony Abdullah 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 10:42 AM
    Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls


          I like that idea!! The rudder could even be mixed to low throttle so each half moves in opposite directions for downline braking, or would that just cause the plane to spin, which could also be cool.

          --- On Tue, 9/23/08, rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com> wrote:

            From: rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com>
            Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
            To: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com, nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
            Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 11:30 AM


Woa Ed....A one piece rudder wouldn't move much at all so how could it 
scrape the bench....who are you trying to chide??

That gives me an idea....maybe we should build elevators as 1 piece and 
rudders as 2 piece. Split rudders will eliminate any belly or canopy 
pitching. If each half was driven with a separate servo on separate 
channels, they might be programmed to move differentially and eliminate 
roll couple also. QED!!

Just in case you forgot to trim your triangle, this is a simpler 
shearing of the hair

Matt

-----Original Message-----
From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 1:46 am
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls

Did you put the elevator upside down Ed? You have to make sure you put 
the non scraping side down..



Chris          

--- On Mon, 9/22/08, Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; wrote:
From: Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt;
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: "General pattern discussion" 
&lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 10:03 PM






I just tried that. Something doesn't look
exactly right and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.  What am 
I
doing wrong? 
 
Ed

  ----- Original Message -----
  From:
  JShulman

  To: General pattern discussion

  Sent:
 Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30
  PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
  rolls


  swap rudder
  with elevator
   
  Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


    -----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
    [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob
    Wilson
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM
To:
    General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
    rolls



     I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is 
the
    correct technique for a snap?
     
     For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same 
direction)
    aileron and up elevator.
     For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite 
aileron
    and down elevator.
     
    Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC videos and
    mine look so raggedy-ass.





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NSRCA-discussion
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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________
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=0
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From jnhiller at earthlink.net  Wed Sep 24 08:10:45 2008
From: jnhiller at earthlink.net (J N Hiller)
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 16:10:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <8D4F53A51D8D4C30BD2DCD911DEE1853@Vinnie>
Message-ID: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPGEPGEAAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>

How about another serious question? In moving to masters (2009) I wonder
about the 45 down 1 1/2 snap to inverted.
Is there a preferred direction?
Should the rudder be released after the 1 full snap to avoid pitching the
nose down?
This may be the least of my problems but I would like to hear your views on
this. Sometimes I feel like I need to re-learn straight and level flight but
I am committed to moving up.
Thanks in advance.
Jim Hiller

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Verne Koester
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 8:42 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls

Monster's been there all along. You just let him out......

Verne


----- Original Message -----
From: Ed Alt <mailto:ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net <mailto:aabdu at sbcglobal.net>  ; General pattern
discussion <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 8:20 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls

I've created a monster...
----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Abdullah <mailto:aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
To: General pattern discussion <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 10:42 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls

I like that idea!! The rudder could even be mixed to low throttle so each
half moves in opposite directions for downline braking, or would that just
cause the plane to spin, which could also be cool.

--- On Tue, 9/23/08, rcmaster199 at aol.com <mailto:rcmaster199 at aol.com>  <
rcmaster199 at aol.com <mailto:rcmaster199 at aol.com> > wrote:
From: rcmaster199 at aol.com <mailto:rcmaster199 at aol.com>  <
rcmaster199 at aol.com <mailto:rcmaster199 at aol.com> >
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com, nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 11:30 AM
Woa Ed....A one piece rudder wouldn't move much at all so how could it
scrape the bench....who are you trying to chide??

That gives me an idea....maybe we should build elevators as 1 piece and
rudders as 2 piece. Split rudders will eliminate any belly or canopy
pitching. If each half was driven with a separate servo on separate
channels, they might be programmed to move differentially and eliminate
roll couple also. QED!!

Just in case you forgot to trim your triangle, this is a simpler
shearing of the hair

Matt

-----Original Message-----
From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 1:46 am
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls

Did you put the elevator upside down Ed? You have to make sure you put
the non scraping side down..



Chris

--- On Mon, 9/22/08, Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; wrote:
From: Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt;
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: "General pattern discussion"
&lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 10:03 PM






I just tried that. Something doesn't look
exactly right and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.  What am
I
doing wrong?

Ed

  ----- Original Message -----
  From:
  JShulman

  To: General pattern discussion

  Sent:
 Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30
  PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
  rolls


  swap rudder
  with elevator

  Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


    -----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
    [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob
    Wilson
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM
To:
    General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
    rolls



     I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is
the
    correct technique for a snap?

     For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same
direction)
    aileron and up elevator.
     For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite
aileron
    and down elevator.

    Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC videos and
    mine look so raggedy-ass.





_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion
  mailing
  list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion____________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      _______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
=0
Ahttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Wed Sep 24 09:07:22 2008
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 17:07:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <HDEBJEADHEDJKKHHCEKPGEPGEAAA.jnhiller@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <417137.99314.qm@web51003.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

?Jim I think the snap looks better if you snap away from yourself. So from right to left snap to the right and from left to right the opposite.
?Verne K. did the best 45 degree down 1.5 positive snap I've seen this last weekend. He has an intersting way of programming his Futaba 14MZ so that he can lead with elevator but when he goes to bury the sticks in the corners it backs off on the elevator. Net results are some pretty impressive looking snaps.? Mike

--- On Wed, 9/24/08, J N Hiller <jnhiller at earthlink.net> wrote:

From: J N Hiller <jnhiller at earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Wednesday, September 24, 2008, 11:10 AM








How about another serious question? In moving to masters (2009) I wonder about the 45 down 1 1/2 snap to inverted.
Is there a preferred direction?
Should the rudder be released after the 1 full snap to avoid pitching the nose down?
This may be the least of my problems but I would like to hear your views on this. Sometimes I feel like I need to re-learn straight and level flight but I am committed to moving up.
Thanks in advance.
Jim Hiller
?
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Verne Koester
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 8:42 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
?
Monster's been there all along. You just let him out......
?
Verne
?
?

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Ed Alt 
To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net ; General pattern discussion 
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 8:20 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
?
I've created a monster...

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Anthony Abdullah 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 10:42 AM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
?




I like that idea!! The rudder could even be mixed to low throttle so?each half moves in opposite directions for downline braking, or would that just cause the plane to spin, which could also be cool.

--- On Tue, 9/23/08, rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com> wrote:

From: rcmaster199 at aol.com <rcmaster199 at aol.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com, nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008, 11:30 AMWoa Ed....A one piece rudder wouldn't move much at all so how could it scrape the bench....who are you trying to chide???That gives me an idea....maybe we should build elevators as 1 piece and rudders as 2 piece. Split rudders will eliminate any belly or canopy pitching. If each half was driven with a separate servo on separate channels, they might be programmed to move differentially and eliminate roll couple also. QED!!?Just in case you forgot to trim your triangle, this is a simpler shearing of the hair?Matt?-----Original Message-----From: krishlan fitzsimmons <homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com>To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 1:46 amSubject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls?Did you put the elevator upside down Ed? You have to make sure you put the non scraping side down..???Chris?? ?? ?? ??--- On Mon, 9/22/08, Ed Alt
 &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; wrote:From: Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt;Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rollsTo: "General pattern discussion" &lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 10:03 PM??????I just tried that.?Something doesn't lookexactly right and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.? What am Idoing wrong???Ed?? ----- Original Message -----? From:? JShulman?? To: General pattern discussion?? Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30? PM? Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap? rolls??? swap rudder? with elevator? ?? Regards,Jasonwww.jasonshulman.comwww.shulmanaviation.comwww.composite-arf.com????? -----Original Message-----From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org??? [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob??? WilsonSent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AMTo:??? General pattern discussionSubject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap???
 rolls??????? I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is the??? correct technique for a snap???? ????? For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same direction)??? aileron?and up elevator.???? For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite aileron??? and down elevator.??? ???? Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC?videos and??? mine look so raggedy-ass.?????_______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion? mailing? listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion??????? _______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion mailing
 listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org=0Ahttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion??_______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion




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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion




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From rcmaster199 at aol.com  Wed Sep 24 09:17:19 2008
From: rcmaster199 at aol.com (rcmaster199 at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 17:17:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV2DF1ED5DF14C5B814E238E8450@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY135-DAV2DF1ED5DF14C5B814E238E8450@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <8CAEC8072075642-6C0-D28@WEBMAIL-MA11.sysops.aol.com>

no no...the rudder isn't split like the likes of the Hyde passport. In 
the suggested version, the rudder has an upper half and a lower half 
and the two are separated and driven separately. BTW, I am only half 
serian

-----Original Message-----
From: Ed Alt <ed_alt at hotmail.com>
To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; General pattern discussion 
<nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 8:20 pm
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls

I've created a monster...

  ----- Original Message -----
  From:
  Anthony
  Abdullah
  To: General pattern discussion

  Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 10:42
  AM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
  rolls





      I like that idea!! The rudder could even be mixed to low
        throttle so?each half moves in opposite directions for downline
         braking, or would that just cause the plane to spin, which 
could also be
        cool.

--- On Tue, 9/23/08, rcmaster199 at aol.com &lt;rcmaster199 at aol.com&gt;
        wrote:

        From:
          rcmaster199 at aol.com &lt;rcmaster199 at aol.com&gt;
Subject:
          Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com,
          nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2008,
          11:30 AM

Woa Ed....A one piece rudder wouldn't move much at all so how could it
scrape 
the bench....who are you trying to chide??

That gives me an idea....maybe we should build elevators as 1 piece and
rudders as 2 piece. Split rudders will eliminate any belly or canopy
pitching. If each half was driven with a separate servo on separate
channels, they might be programmed to move differentially and eliminate
roll couple also. QED!!

Just in case you forgot to trim your triangle, this is a simpler
shearing of the hair

Matt

-----Original Message-----
From: krishlan fitzsimmons &lt;homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com&gt;
To: General pattern discussion &lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
Sent: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 1:46 am
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls

Did you put the elevator upside down Ed? You have to make sure you put
the non scraping side down..



Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Mon, 9/22/08, Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt; wrote:
From: Ed Alt &lt;ed_alt at hotmail.com&gt;
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap rolls
To: "General pattern discussion"
&lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 10:03 PM






I just tried that.?Something doesn't look
exactly right and the elevator is scraping the workbench now.? What am
I
doing wrong??
?
Ed

  ----- Original Message -----
  From:
  JShulman

  To: General pattern discussion

  Sent:
 Monday, September 22, 2008 11:30
  PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
  
rolls


  swap rudder
  with elevator
  ?
  Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


    -----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
    [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Bob
    Wilson
Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:24 AM
To:
    General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Snap
    rolls



     I'm probably opening this up for lots of discussion, but what is
the
    correct technique for a snap?
    ?
     For an inside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before (same
direction)
    aileron?and up elevator.
     For an outside snap, I apply rudder a fraction before opposite
aileron
    and down elevator.
    ?
    Problem is, I watch the big boys do snaps on my TOC?videos and
    mine look so raggedy-ass.





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NSRCA-discussion
  mailing
  list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion_______________________________________________
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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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=0
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_
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From pcosky at comcast.net  Wed Sep 24 16:57:00 2008
From: pcosky at comcast.net (Pete Cosky)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 00:57:00 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Sept Kfactor question
References: <003e01c91ea1$5e9cc4b0$6a440a0a@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>
	<7a5634980809241746r5b1320bdocfc413be1bc57a2d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <007d01c91ea9$99fd4b30$6a440a0a@usa.ccu.clearchannel.com>

Thanks. 

I converted it to an older XLS format as well for those without the latest office product.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Chris Fitzsimmons 
  To: Pete Cosky ; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 8:46 PM
  Subject: Re: Sept Kfactor question


  No problem Pete. I will add the list in on this also as others may want this also. Maybe Marty will put it on the website also. 

  Chris

   
  On 9/24/08, Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net> wrote: 
    Kris,

    You wouldn't happen to have the actual spreadsheet of equipment used at the nats from the first pages of the Sept. KF would you? It would make my life so much easier to just open an excel spread sheet and sort by columns.

    Pete
    NSRCA 3866

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From cjm767driver at hotmail.com  Wed Sep 24 17:16:12 2008
From: cjm767driver at hotmail.com (chris moon)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 01:16:12 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Sept Kfactor question
Message-ID: <BLU137-W51ADB80B6540DBCDAC350583440@phx.gbl>



Awesome.  Thanks Pete!

I was having a hard time aligning the pages in the KFactor to see the
right data.  Printer must have been slightly out of alignment on my
copy.



Chris



Pete Cosky wrote:

  
  
  
  Thanks. 
   
  I converted it to an older XLS
format as well for those without the latest office product.
  
    -----
Original Message ----- 
    From:
    Chris Fitzsimmons 
    To:
    Pete Cosky ; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
    
    Sent:
Wednesday, September 24, 2008 8:46 PM
    Subject:
Re: Sept Kfactor question
    

    
    No problem Pete. I will add the list in on this also as others
may want this also. Maybe Marty will put it on the website also. 
     
    Chris

    

    
    On 9/24/08, Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net>
wrote:
    
      
      Kris,
       
      You wouldn't happen to have the
actual spreadsheet of equipment used at the nats from the first pages
of the Sept. KF would you? It would make my life so much easier to just
open an excel spread sheet and sort by columns.
       
      Pete
      NSRCA 3866
      
    
    
    

  
  

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From derekkoopowitz at gmail.com  Wed Sep 24 17:46:20 2008
From: derekkoopowitz at gmail.com (Derek Koopowitz)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 01:46:20 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Sept Kfactor question
In-Reply-To: <BLU137-W51ADB80B6540DBCDAC350583440@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU137-W51ADB80B6540DBCDAC350583440@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <6A58C6E53AA046A2BB509755572944FD@BENICIA>

Here is the actual spreadie...
 
 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of chris moon
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 6:16 PM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Sept Kfactor question


Awesome.  Thanks Pete!
I was having a hard time aligning the pages in the KFactor to see the right
data.  Printer must have been slightly out of alignment on my copy.

Chris

Pete Cosky wrote: 

Thanks. 
I converted it to an older XLS format as well for those without the latest
office product.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Chris Fitzsimmons <mailto:kfactoreditor at gmail.com>  
To: Pete Cosky <mailto:pcosky at comcast.net>  ;
nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 8:46 PM
Subject: Re: Sept Kfactor question

No problem Pete. I will add the list in on this also as others may want this
also. Maybe Marty will put it on the website also. 
Chris


On 9/24/08, Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net> wrote: 

Kris,
You wouldn't happen to have the actual spreadsheet of equipment used at the
nats from the first pages of the Sept. KF would you? It would make my life
so much easier to just open an excel spread sheet and sort by columns.
Pete
NSRCA 3866




  _____  


_______________________________________________

NSRCA-discussion mailing list

NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org

http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


  _____  

Stay up to date on your PC, the Web, and your mobile phone with Windows
Live. See Now <http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093185mrt/direct/01/>

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From troy at troynewman.net  Wed Sep 24 17:52:08 2008
From: troy at troynewman.net (Troy Newman)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 01:52:08 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Sept Kfactor question
In-Reply-To: <BLU137-W51ADB80B6540DBCDAC350583440@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU137-W51ADB80B6540DBCDAC350583440@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB2010AD092@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>

They also missed a bunch of FAI guys that were on the list, but didn't
get printed.

________________________________

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of chris
moon
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 6:16 PM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Sept Kfactor question


Awesome.  Thanks Pete!
I was having a hard time aligning the pages in the KFactor to see the
right data.  Printer must have been slightly out of alignment on my
copy.

Chris

Pete Cosky wrote: 

	Thanks. 
	I converted it to an older XLS format as well for those without
the latest office product.

		----- Original Message ----- 
		From: Chris Fitzsimmons <mailto:kfactoreditor at gmail.com>

		To: Pete Cosky <mailto:pcosky at comcast.net>  ;
nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
		Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 8:46 PM
		Subject: Re: Sept Kfactor question

		No problem Pete. I will add the list in on this also as
others may want this also. Maybe Marty will put it on the website also. 
		Chris
		
		
		On 9/24/08, Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net> wrote: 

			Kris,
			You wouldn't happen to have the actual
spreadsheet of equipment used at the nats from the first pages of the
Sept. KF would you? It would make my life so much easier to just open an
excel spread sheet and sort by columns.
			Pete
			NSRCA 3866


	
________________________________


	_______________________________________________
	NSRCA-discussion mailing list
	NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
	http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


________________________________

Stay up to date on your PC, the Web, and your mobile phone with Windows
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<http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093185mrt/direct/01/>  
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Wed Sep 24 17:54:18 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 01:54:18 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Sept Kfactor question
In-Reply-To: <6A58C6E53AA046A2BB509755572944FD@BENICIA>
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNKEJJCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

Still no FFA results?

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Derek
Koopowitz
  Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 9:46 PM
  To: 'General pattern discussion'
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Sept Kfactor question


  Here is the actual spreadie...





----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of chris moon
  Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 6:16 PM
  To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Sept Kfactor question


  Awesome.  Thanks Pete!
  I was having a hard time aligning the pages in the KFactor to see the
right data.  Printer must have been slightly out of alignment on my copy.

  Chris

  Pete Cosky wrote:
    Thanks.
    I converted it to an older XLS format as well for those without the
latest office product.
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Chris Fitzsimmons
      To: Pete Cosky ; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
      Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 8:46 PM
      Subject: Re: Sept Kfactor question


      No problem Pete. I will add the list in on this also as others may
want this also. Maybe Marty will put it on the website also.
      Chris


      On 9/24/08, Pete Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net> wrote:
        Kris,
        You wouldn't happen to have the actual spreadsheet of equipment used
at the nats from the first pages of the Sept. KF would you? It would make my
life so much easier to just open an excel spread sheet and sort by columns.
        Pete
        NSRCA 3866


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
  Stay up to date on your PC, the Web, and your mobile phone with Windows
Live. See Now
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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Wed Sep 24 18:54:39 2008
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 02:54:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Sept Kfactor question
In-Reply-To: <F078987D4F08C3429D64F81264554EB2010AD092@mail2.koolsoftmail.com>
Message-ID: <386642.18073.qm@web33003.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Are you sure they were on the list? Some people didn't submit their info. 

Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Wed, 9/24/08, Troy Newman <troy at troynewman.net> wrote:
From: Troy Newman <troy at troynewman.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Sept Kfactor question
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Wednesday, September 24, 2008, 6:52 PM



 
#yiv1055234586 .hmmessage P {
PADDING-RIGHT:0px;PADDING-LEFT:0px;PADDING-BOTTOM:0px;MARGIN:0px;PADDING-TOP:0px;}
#yiv1055234586 {
FONT-SIZE:10pt;FONT-FAMILY:Tahoma;}


They also missed a bunch of FAI guys that were on the list, but 
didn't get printed.



From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org 
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of chris 
moon
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 6:16 PM
To: 
nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Sept 
Kfactor question


Awesome.? Thanks Pete!
I was having a hard time aligning the 
pages in the KFactor to see the right data.? Printer must have been 
slightly out of alignment on my copy.

Chris

Pete Cosky wrote: 

  
  

  Thanks. 
  
  I converted it to an older XLS format as well for those 
  without the latest office product.
  
    ----- 
    Original Message ----- 
    From: 
    Chris Fitzsimmons 
    To: 
    Pete Cosky ; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
    Sent: 
    Wednesday, September 24, 2008 8:46 PM
    Subject: 
    Re: Sept Kfactor question
    

    No problem Pete. I will add the list in on this also as others may want 
    this also. Maybe Marty will put it on the website also. 
    
    Chris


    On 9/24/08, Pete 
    Cosky <pcosky at comcast.net> wrote: 
    
      
      Kris,
      
      You wouldn't happen to have the actual spreadsheet 
      of equipment used at the nats from the first pages of the Sept. KF would 
      you? It would make my life so much easier to just open an excel spread 
      sheet and sort by columns.
      
      Pete
      NSRCA 
  3866

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


Stay up to date on your PC, the Web, and your mobile phone with Windows Live. See Now _______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From terryb at beachlers.com  Wed Sep 24 21:31:44 2008
From: terryb at beachlers.com (Terry Beachler)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 05:31:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint
Message-ID: <20080925053143.959D0114A5@bridi.netexpress.com>

Hi flyers

I am about to finish a Venus II and would like to paint the inside of 
the canopy black, gray, or other appropriate color.  Any paint 
recommendations? I do not want to turn the canopy into a ball of 
melted plastic.

Terry Beachler


From trexlesh at msn.com  Wed Sep 24 21:40:01 2008
From: trexlesh at msn.com (Rex)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 05:40:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint
In-Reply-To: <20080925053143.959D0114A5@bridi.netexpress.com>
References: <20080925053143.959D0114A5@bridi.netexpress.com>
Message-ID: <BAY119-W287BF46D69C36DAD449CC3CC440@phx.gbl>

Terry
 
If you want to do it the easy way and aren't set up to spray with a gun, just
go to the local hobby shop and get some of the little rattle cans of paint made to 
spray plastic car bodies.... Most of them are clear and painted on the inside.
I believe Pactra makes that sort of paint.
 
Rex Lesher



> Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 00:31:25 -0500> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> From: terryb at beachlers.com> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint> > Hi flyers> > I am about to finish a Venus II and would like to paint the inside of > the canopy black, gray, or other appropriate color. Any paint > recommendations? I do not want to turn the canopy into a ball of > melted plastic.> > Terry Beachler> > _______________________________________________> NSRCA-discussion mailing list> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From humptybump at sbcglobal.net  Thu Sep 25 03:33:24 2008
From: humptybump at sbcglobal.net (Richard Lewis)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 11:33:24 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint
In-Reply-To: <20080925053143.959D0114A5@bridi.netexpress.com>
References: <20080925053143.959D0114A5@bridi.netexpress.com>
Message-ID: <751A9AA0249845EF936A0DBAC326800D@LEWISHOME>

I painted the inside of one with Dupli-color auto touch up paint with no
problems.  You can get some really nice metallic colors with these paints.
Did not seem to affect the canopy plastic in any way.  Mask the insie edge
if you are going to glue it down later.

Richard

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Terry
Beachler
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:31 AM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint

Hi flyers

I am about to finish a Venus II and would like to paint the inside of 
the canopy black, gray, or other appropriate color.  Any paint 
recommendations? I do not want to turn the canopy into a ball of 
melted plastic.

Terry Beachler

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.6.17/1657 - Release Date: 9/6/2008
8:07 PM
 

Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.6.17/1657 - Release Date: 9/6/2008
8:07 PM
 


From jonlowe at aol.com  Thu Sep 25 04:16:36 2008
From: jonlowe at aol.com (Jon Lowe)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:16:36 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint
In-Reply-To: <20080925053143.959D0114A5@bridi.netexpress.com>
References: <20080925053143.959D0114A5@bridi.netexpress.com>
Message-ID: <8CAED1FA000D923-107C-59C@WEBMAIL-MC03.sysops.aol.com>


 I used Tamiya PS-31 Smoke on the inside of? my Venus II canopy.? It gives the appearance of a tinted window.? More coats, and it gets darker.? It is made for Lexan RC car bodies, and was recommended to me over the Pactra product by my hobbyshop as an easier to apply product.? Went on easy and looked great.

One guy in our club used black paint on the inside of his Venus canopy.? Got so hot, it distorted.? The tint I used doesn't seem to do that.


 


Jon Lowe

 


 

-----Original Message-----
From: Terry Beachler <terryb at beachlers.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:31 am
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint









Hi flyers?
?

I am about to finish a Venus II and would like to paint the inside of 
the canopy black, gray, or other appropriate color.  Any paint 
recommendations? I do not want to turn the canopy into a ball of 
melted plastic.?
?

Terry Beachler?
?

_______________________________________________?

NSRCA-discussion mailing list?

NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org?

http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion?



 

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From ronlock at comcast.net  Thu Sep 25 05:10:12 2008
From: ronlock at comcast.net (ronlock at comcast.net)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 13:10:12 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint Option
Message-ID: <092520081310.22111.48DB8DAD00085F3F0000565F2207001641050C010402019D@comcast.net>

I think all of the recent suggestions on inside the canopy painat are good.

An optional thought - before paint, put vinyl lettering with reverse sticky side
inside the canopy with Pilot name, AMA number, whatever.   Black vinyl, and
then siliver paint is my perference.

Ron Lockhart

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com> 

I used Tamiya PS-31 Smoke on the inside of  my Venus II canopy.  It gives the appearance of a tinted window.  More coats, and it gets darker.  It is made for Lexan RC car bodies, and was recommended to me over the Pactra product by my hobbyshop as an easier to apply product.  Went on easy and looked great.

One guy in our club used black paint on the inside of his Venus canopy.  Got so hot, it distorted.  The tint I used doesn't seem to do that.



Jon Lowe




-----Original Message-----
From: Terry Beachler <terryb at beachlers.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:31 am
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint


Hi flyers 
 
I am about to finish a Venus II and would like to paint the inside of the canopy black, gray, or other appropriate color. Any paint recommendations? I do not want to turn the canopy into a ball of melted plastic. 
 
Terry Beachler 
 
_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 



Find phone numbers fast with the New AOL Yellow Pages! 
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From: Jon Lowe <jonlowe at aol.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint
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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 25 06:27:03 2008
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 14:27:03 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint
In-Reply-To: <20080925053143.959D0114A5@bridi.netexpress.com>
Message-ID: <58203.20399.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

If you don't want it to melt, don't paint it black. I just painted mine Candy Blue on the Element. The pic is on the Element build thread under Electric on RCU. Painted with the car spray paint. Very easy. 

Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Wed, 9/24/08, Terry Beachler <terryb at beachlers.com> wrote:
From: Terry Beachler <terryb at beachlers.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Wednesday, September 24, 2008, 10:31 PM

Hi flyers

I am about to finish a Venus II and would like to paint the inside of 
the canopy black, gray, or other appropriate color.  Any paint 
recommendations? I do not want to turn the canopy into a ball of 
melted plastic.

Terry Beachler

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



      
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From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Thu Sep 25 07:14:05 2008
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 15:14:05 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint
In-Reply-To: <58203.20399.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <8F56691389154BE8B08A43A8BD338BFD@jaysdesktop>

If you want easy smoke, use Rit dyes.

 

Jay Marshall 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of krishlan
fitzsimmons
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 10:27 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint

 


If you don't want it to melt, don't paint it black. I just painted mine
Candy Blue on the Element. The pic is on the Element build thread under
Electric on RCU. Painted with the car spray paint. Very easy. 

Chris 

 

 

 



--- On Wed, 9/24/08, Terry Beachler <terryb at beachlers.com> wrote:

From: Terry Beachler <terryb at beachlers.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Wednesday, September 24, 2008, 10:31 PM

Hi flyers


  


I am about to finish a Venus II and would like to paint the inside of 


the canopy black,
 gray, or other appropriate color.  Any paint 


recommendations? I do not want to turn the canopy into a ball of 


melted plastic.


  


Terry Beachler


  


_______________________________________________


NSRCA-discussion mailing list


NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org


http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

 

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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Thu Sep 25 08:04:38 2008
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 16:04:38 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
In-Reply-To: <751A9AA0249845EF936A0DBAC326800D@LEWISHOME>
Message-ID: <388861.5822.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+)?with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info?I saw?it is even 12 grams lighter.
?
Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?
?
I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those who have used them or seen them run.
?
Thanks a bunch
Anthony
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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 25 08:08:40 2008
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 16:08:40 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
In-Reply-To: <388861.5822.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <796444.93363.qm@web33002.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I have a friend running these down in Southern California. He has gone through a couple fairly quickly. But the one he's on now, I think he has 50 or more flights on. 


Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Thu, 9/25/08, Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
From: Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 9:04 AM

As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+)?with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info?I saw?it is even 12 grams lighter.
?
Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?
?
I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those who have used them or seen them run.
?
Thanks a bunch
Anthony
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


      
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From homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 25 08:11:42 2008
From: homeremodeling2003 at yahoo.com (krishlan fitzsimmons)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 16:11:42 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
In-Reply-To: <388861.5822.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <639304.66396.qm@web33008.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Oh, forgot to add, he loves the power. He fly's intermediate, so don't know about power for the other classes. And not sure on the weight. I will tell you to not believe the weights that are advertised on some of the E stuff. Sometimes deceiving. 
I will see if I can get him to reply to me. 

Chris   ?  ?  ?

--- On Thu, 9/25/08, Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
From: Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 9:04 AM

As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+)?with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info?I saw?it is even 12 grams lighter.
?
Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?
?
I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those who have used them or seen them run.
?
Thanks a bunch
Anthony
_______________________________________________
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From cjm767driver at hotmail.com  Thu Sep 25 08:32:48 2008
From: cjm767driver at hotmail.com (chris moon)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 16:32:48 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
Message-ID: <BLU137-W2699FA453FC0A15FCFDCBB83440@phx.gbl>



Anthony:



What I tell people starting in electric pattern is to find someone with
a setup that works and is in your price range and copy it exactly.  It
could be Axi, Hacker, Pletty etc but don't try something new until you
get a handle on the whole electric thing.  Trying a new setup while
trying to learn the electric thing at the same time could be
disappointing.  



I did try one of those HXT motors a while ago on a test plane and it
had good power but higher power consumption than the Axi for example. 
Only flew it a few times so I don't have any longevity info for you.





Chris



Anthony Abdullah wrote:

  
    
      
        
        As I am doing my research into the world of electric
pattern I have come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears
that the HXT 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI
motor ($60 vs.$200+) with very similar performance numbers, physical
dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info I saw it is even 12
grams lighter.
         
        Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the
catch? Will it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively
hot, does it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap
Chinese knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to
know is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?
         
        I appreciate any information you guys can provide,
particularly from those who have used them or seen them run.
         
        Thanks a bunch
        Anthony

        
        
      
    
  
  

_______________________________________________
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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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From dwaynenancy at suddenlink.net  Thu Sep 25 08:37:11 2008
From: dwaynenancy at suddenlink.net (Dwayne Brown)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 16:37:11 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
In-Reply-To: <388861.5822.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <EE6CBA183F3647BC9EF3D09140CE9002@YoursMine>

I have a friend in 79109 who is trying one in comparison to an AXI motor.
Next week for the results.  Dwayne

 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Anthony
Abdullah
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 11:05 AM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors

 


As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come
across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230
is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+) with
very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact,
according to the info I saw it is even 12 grams lighter.

 

Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn
out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like
bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good
value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A
pattern?

 

I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those
who have used them or seen them run.

 

Thanks a bunch

Anthony

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.7.2/1690 - Release Date: 9/25/2008
7:05 AM

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From kerlock at comcast.net  Thu Sep 25 08:59:22 2008
From: kerlock at comcast.net (Mike Hester)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 16:59:22 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
References: <388861.5822.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <90442B0D99C14054AE264B777C8C6207@Sanity>

Ok, some in depth answers.

We did in fact test this motor last season on a Black Magic V2, flying masters. We used the HXT 63-64B 230kv motor. We used a CC HV85 controller, Tanic and vampower packs.

Power is certainly not a problem for this motor. It is fairly comparable to the AXI. 2700 watts, 82 amps, 6200 RPM on an APC 20x14. the motor never got over 110 degrees.

Longevity: we got well over 100 flights on it before the plane was lost, no problems whatsoever. This was using Esprit stand off mounts as well, o nose mounting.

No can issues, nothing, it just delivered. your results may vary of course. These are "cheap" chinese motors and you do not have the support structure in place like the name brands. but considering you can buy almost 4 of them for the price of one AXI, it's pretty interesting. 

I've run a lot of these chinese motors and maybe I'm just lucky, but I just don't have problems. I keep hearing about problems with darned near everything, including name brand stuff, and the only issue we've run into yet was a very early bearing failure with an AXI...that's all. Ever.

I have yet to install one of these on a VF3, and wonder about it because by it's very nature you will have to use more power to fly it. I realize 82 amps is a lot, but the packs never got warm, nor did the speed control or motor, so who knows.

in short, if this is your first forray into electrics of this size, you would probably be better off with the AXI just from the standpoint of support. But so far I can't find a thing wrong with this motor, or else I am just that lucky (and THAT is highly unlikely, trust me!)

-Mike

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Anthony Abdullah 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:04 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors


        As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+) with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info I saw it is even 12 grams lighter.

        Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?

        I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those who have used them or seen them run.

        Thanks a bunch
        Anthony
       




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  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



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From getterflash at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 25 09:20:57 2008
From: getterflash at yahoo.com (Bob Kane)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 17:20:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
Message-ID: <259498.56578.qm@web36708.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I'm going to use a Great Planes Rimfire 63-62-250 in my Integral.  I have tested it and it is in the same ballpark as the "designer" motors.  The only caution I would throw out there is unless you have a solid basic understanding of electric circuits and access to a wattmeter, you are better off copying a successful setup (including the prop). A fueled motor will tolerate a too-large prop by not delivering enough power and a too-small prop by spinning faster.  An electric setup will create a fuse somewhere in the circuit if the prop is too large, and you are wasting potential power if the prop is not large enough. 

The motor will be controlled with a Castle HV85 controller and power supplied by Thunderpower packs.

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com



----- Original Message ----
From: Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:04:36 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors


As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+) with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info I saw it is even 12 grams lighter.
 
Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?
 
I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those who have used them or seen them run.
 
Thanks a bunch
Anthony


      
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From anthonyr105 at hotmail.com  Thu Sep 25 09:30:43 2008
From: anthonyr105 at hotmail.com (Anthony Romano)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 17:30:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
In-Reply-To: <90442B0D99C14054AE264B777C8C6207@Sanity>
References: <388861.5822.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<90442B0D99C14054AE264B777C8C6207@Sanity>
Message-ID: <BLU124-W2046B84D883EB21FE1AEE9E2440@phx.gbl>

Hi Mike,
Are you sure on that prop size?

From: kerlock at comcast.netTo: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgDate: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:59:16 -0400Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors



Ok, some in depth answers.
 
We did in fact test this motor last season on a Black Magic V2, flying masters. We used the HXT 63-64B 230kv motor. We used a CC HV85 controller, Tanic and vampower packs.
 
Power is certainly not a problem for this motor. It is fairly comparable to the AXI. 2700 watts, 82 amps, 6200 RPM on an APC 20x14. the motor never got over 110 degrees.
 
Longevity: we got well over 100 flights on it before the plane was lost, no problems whatsoever. This was using Esprit stand off mounts as well, o nose mounting.
 
No can issues, nothing, it just delivered. your results may vary of course. These are "cheap" chinese motors and you do not have the support structure in place like the name brands. but considering you can buy almost 4 of them for the price of one AXI, it's pretty interesting. 
 
I've run a lot of these chinese motors and maybe I'm just lucky, but I just don't have problems. I keep hearing about problems with darned near everything, including name brand stuff, and the only issue we've run into yet was a very early bearing failure with an AXI...that's all. Ever.
 
I have yet to install one of these on a VF3, and wonder about it because by it's very nature you will have to use more power to fly it. I realize 82 amps is a lot, but the packs never got warm, nor did the speed control or motor, so who knows.
 
in short, if this is your first forray into electrics of this size, you would probably be better off with the AXI just from the standpoint of support. But so far I can't find a thing wrong with this motor, or else I am just that lucky (and THAT is highly unlikely, trust me!)
 
-Mike
 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Anthony Abdullah 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:04 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors





As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+) with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info I saw it is even 12 grams lighter.
 
Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?
 
I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those who have used them or seen them run.
 
Thanks a bunch
AnthonyE-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (5.5.1.322)Database version: 5.10780ehttp://www.pctools.com/spyware-doctor/



_______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussionE-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (5.5.1.322)Database version: 5.10780ehttp://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor/E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (5.5.1.322)Database version: 5.10780ehttp://www.pctools.com/spyware-doctor/
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From kerlock at comcast.net  Thu Sep 25 09:58:06 2008
From: kerlock at comcast.net (Mike Hester)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 17:58:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
References: <388861.5822.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com><90442B0D99C14054AE264B777C8C6207@Sanity>
	<BLU124-W2046B84D883EB21FE1AEE9E2440@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <8768B6DE36414CCA856690CCC064C7CA@Sanity>

20.5x14, my bad LOL

But yes.

-Mike

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Anthony Romano 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 1:30 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors


  Hi Mike,
  Are you sure on that prop size?




------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: kerlock at comcast.net
  To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:59:16 -0400
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors



  Ok, some in depth answers.

  We did in fact test this motor last season on a Black Magic V2, flying masters. We used the HXT 63-64B 230kv motor. We used a CC HV85 controller, Tanic and vampower packs.

  Power is certainly not a problem for this motor. It is fairly comparable to the AXI. 2700 watts, 82 amps, 6200 RPM on an APC 20x14. the motor never got over 110 degrees.

  Longevity: we got well over 100 flights on it before the plane was lost, no problems whatsoever. This was using Esprit stand off mounts as well, o nose mounting.

  No can issues, nothing, it just delivered. your results may vary of course. These are "cheap" chinese motors and you do not have the support structure in place like the name brands. but considering you can buy almost 4 of them for the price of one AXI, it's pretty interesting. 

  I've run a lot of these chinese motors and maybe I'm just lucky, but I just don't have problems. I keep hearing about problems with darned near everything, including name brand stuff, and the only issue we've run into yet was a very early bearing failure with an AXI...that's all. Ever.

  I have yet to install one of these on a VF3, and wonder about it because by it's very nature you will have to use more power to fly it. I realize 82 amps is a lot, but the packs never got warm, nor did the speed control or motor, so who knows.

  in short, if this is your first forray into electrics of this size, you would probably be better off with the AXI just from the standpoint of support. But so far I can't find a thing wrong with this motor, or else I am just that lucky (and THAT is highly unlikely, trust me!)

  -Mike

    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Anthony Abdullah 
    To: General pattern discussion 
    Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:04 PM
    Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors


          As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+) with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info I saw it is even 12 grams lighter.

          Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?

          I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those who have used them or seen them run.

          Thanks a bunch
          Anthony
         




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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Thu Sep 25 11:41:50 2008
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 19:41:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
In-Reply-To: <BLU124-W2046B84D883EB21FE1AEE9E2440@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <478263.23188.qm@web82102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

That is what I have seen, all the way up to a 20x15 in some reports on RCU. I did notice on the motor specs they recommend between a 14 and 18 inch prop, but that is on 8S power.

--- On Thu, 9/25/08, Anthony Romano <anthonyr105 at hotmail.com> wrote:

From: Anthony Romano <anthonyr105 at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 1:30 PM




#yiv1527209329 .hmmessage P
{
margin:0px;padding:0px;}
#yiv1527209329 {
FONT-SIZE:10pt;FONT-FAMILY:Tahoma;}

Hi Mike,
Are you sure on that prop size?





From: kerlock at comcast.net
To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:59:16 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors






Ok, some in depth answers.
?
We did in fact test this motor last season on a Black Magic V2, flying masters. We used the HXT 63-64B 230kv motor. We used a CC HV85 controller, Tanic and vampower packs.
?
Power is certainly not a problem for this motor. It is fairly comparable to the AXI. 2700 watts, 82 amps, 6200 RPM on an APC 20x14. the motor never got over 110 degrees.
?
Longevity: we got well over 100 flights on it before the plane was lost, no problems whatsoever. This was using Esprit stand off mounts as well, o nose mounting.
?
No can issues, nothing, it just delivered. your results may vary of course. These are "cheap" chinese motors and you do not have the support structure in place like the name brands. but considering you can buy almost 4 of them for the price of one AXI, it's pretty interesting. 
?
I've run a lot of these chinese motors and maybe I'm just lucky, but I just don't have problems. I keep hearing about problems with darned near everything, including name brand stuff, and the only issue we've run into yet was a very early bearing failure with an AXI...that's all. Ever.
?
I have yet to install one of these on a VF3, and wonder about it because by it's very nature you will have to use more power to fly it. I realize 82 amps is a lot, but the packs never got warm, nor did the speed control or motor, so who knows.
?
in short, if this is your first forray into electrics of this size, you would probably be better off with the AXI just from the standpoint of support. But so far I can't find a thing wrong with this motor, or else I am just that lucky (and THAT is highly unlikely, trust me!)
?
-Mike
?

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Anthony Abdullah 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:04 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors






As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+)?with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info?I saw?it is even 12 grams lighter.
?
Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?
?
I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those who have used them or seen them run.
?
Thanks a bunch
Anthony




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From tony at radiosouthrc.com  Thu Sep 25 12:05:06 2008
From: tony at radiosouthrc.com (Tony)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 20:05:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern Contest this weekend
Message-ID: <AFEC0CD374034115A73B089F597F1042@Tony>

Just wanted to remind everyone of the pattern contest this weekend in
Jacksonville, FL.  Looks like the weather will be warm but good and I look
forward to seeing everyone.  The field will be open for practice tomorrow.
I'll be at the site around noon.  

 

See everyone then!

 

Tony Stillman, President

Radio South, Inc.

139 Altama Connector, Box 322

Brunswick, GA  31525

1-800-962-7802

www.radiosouthrc.com

 

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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Thu Sep 25 12:12:30 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 20:12:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern Contest this
	weekend
In-Reply-To: <AFEC0CD374034115A73B089F597F1042@Tony>
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNKEKICNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

The Orlando group will be there just after noon... ish...lol. I know the
guys here have been practicing the new Masters routines, so if anyone wants
to go through them there, we'll be more that ready to help (or any class).

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


  -----Original Message-----
  From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Tony
  Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 4:05 PM
  To: 'General pattern discussion'
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern Contest this
weekend


  Just wanted to remind everyone of the pattern contest this weekend in
Jacksonville, FL.  Looks like the weather will be warm but good and I look
forward to seeing everyone.  The field will be open for practice tomorrow.
I?ll be at the site around noon.



  See everyone then!



  Tony Stillman, President

  Radio South, Inc.

  139 Altama Connector, Box 322

  Brunswick, GA  31525

  1-800-962-7802

  www.radiosouthrc.com



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From vanputte at cox.net  Thu Sep 25 12:24:52 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 20:24:52 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern Contest this
	weekend
In-Reply-To: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNKEKICNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNKEKICNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <B38730BA-1B20-47A6-9B5D-EB29C33CCF42@cox.net>

I need help.

Ron VP (15-year Master class pilot)

On Sep 25, 2008, at 3:13 PM, JShulman wrote:

> The Orlando group will be there just after noon... ish...lol. I  
> know the guys here have been practicing the new Masters routines,  
> so if anyone wants to go through them there, we'll be more that  
> ready to help (or any class).
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Tony
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 4:05 PM
> To: 'General pattern discussion'
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern Contest  
> this weekend
>
> Just wanted to remind everyone of the pattern contest this weekend  
> in Jacksonville, FL.  Looks like the weather will be warm but good  
> and I look forward to seeing everyone.  The field will be open for  
> practice tomorrow.  I?ll be at the site around noon.
>
>
>
> See everyone then!
>
>
>
> Tony Stillman, President
>
> Radio South, Inc.
>
> 139 Altama Connector, Box 322
>
> Brunswick, GA  31525
>
> 1-800-962-7802
>
> www.radiosouthrc.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From jpavlick at idseng.com  Thu Sep 25 13:29:43 2008
From: jpavlick at idseng.com (John Pavlick)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 21:29:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern Contest this
	weekend
In-Reply-To: <B38730BA-1B20-47A6-9B5D-EB29C33CCF42@cox.net>
Message-ID: <839387.93119.qm@web80501.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

We know THAT!? Oh, you mean you need help with the new sequences. That's different. LOL
?
John Pavlick

--- On Thu, 9/25/08, Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net> wrote:

From: Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern Contest this weekend
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 8:24 PM

I need help.

Ron VP (15-year Master class pilot)

On Sep 25, 2008, at 3:13 PM, JShulman wrote:

> The Orlando group will be there just after noon... ish...lol. I  
> know the guys here have been practicing the new Masters routines,  
> so if anyone wants to go through them there, we'll be more that  
> ready to help (or any class).
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca- 
> discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Tony
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 4:05 PM
> To: 'General pattern discussion'
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern Contest  
> this weekend
>
> Just wanted to remind everyone of the pattern contest this weekend  
> in Jacksonville, FL.  Looks like the weather will be warm but good  
> and I look forward to seeing everyone.  The field will be open for  
> practice tomorrow.  I?ll be at the site around noon.
>
>
>
> See everyone then!
>
>
>
> Tony Stillman, President
>
> Radio South, Inc.
>
> 139 Altama Connector, Box 322
>
> Brunswick, GA  31525
>
> 1-800-962-7802
>
> www.radiosouthrc.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jonlowe at aol.com  Thu Sep 25 14:32:23 2008
From: jonlowe at aol.com (Jon Lowe)
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 22:32:23 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern Contest this
 weekend
Message-ID: <bb8.3b3f7169.360d6b6e@aol.com>

Gary and I are on our way.  Just passed Tallahassee.  See you there.

Jon Lowe

-----Original Message-----
From: Tony <tony at radiosouthrc.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 4:05 PM
To: 'General pattern discussion' <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern Contest this weekend

Just wanted to remind everyone of the pattern contest this weekend in Jacksonville, FL.? Looks like the weather will be warm but good and I look forward to seeing everyone.? The field will be open for practice tomorrow.? I?ll be at the site around noon.? 
?
See everyone then!
?
Tony Stillman, President
Radio South, Inc.
139 Altama Connector, Box 322
Brunswick, GA? 31525
1-800-962-7802
www.radiosouthrc.com
?=
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From jcwilsonjr at comcast.net  Thu Sep 25 16:23:26 2008
From: jcwilsonjr at comcast.net (Jerry Wilson)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 00:23:26 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint
In-Reply-To: <8CAED1FA000D923-107C-59C@WEBMAIL-MC03.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <20080926002325.B63F0114A9@bridi.netexpress.com>

I used Tamiya PS-38 Translucent Blue.  Took about four coats to get the
opaqueness to suit me.  But came out looking like a darkly tinted window.

 

Jerry

 

  _____  

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Jon Lowe
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 7:16 AM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint

 

I used Tamiya PS-31 Smoke on the inside of  my Venus II canopy.  It gives
the appearance of a tinted window.  More coats, and it gets darker.  It is
made for Lexan RC car bodies, and was recommended to me over the Pactra
product by my hobbyshop as an easier to apply product.  Went on easy and
looked great.

One guy in our club used black paint on the inside of his Venus canopy.  Got
so hot, it distorted.  The tint I used doesn't seem to do that.

 

Jon Lowe

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Terry Beachler <terryb at beachlers.com>
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Sent: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:31 am
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Canopy paint

Hi flyers 
 
I am about to finish a Venus II and would like to paint the inside of the
canopy black, gray, or other appropriate color. Any paint recommendations? I
do not want to turn the canopy into a ball of melted plastic. 
 
Terry Beachler 
 
_______________________________________________ 
NSRCA-discussion mailing list 
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org 
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 

  _____  

Find phone numbers fast with the New AOL Yellow
<http://yellowpages.aol.com/?NCID=emlweusyelp00000001>  Pages! 

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From vanputte at cox.net  Thu Sep 25 16:28:39 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 00:28:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern Contest this
	weekend
In-Reply-To: <839387.93119.qm@web80501.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <839387.93119.qm@web80501.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <6016B690-B579-470C-BD8B-DCB2456FB234@cox.net>

No, I need help.  A good form of help would be if I was to pretend to  
fly the Master class sequence with my airplane, while Jason Shulman  
actually flew the airplane.  Now, that would be help.  Oh Geez!   Now  
everybody knows about it and we can't do it!

Ron VP

On Sep 25, 2008, at 4:29 PM, John Pavlick wrote:

> We know THAT!  Oh, you mean you need help with the new sequences.  
> That's different. LOL
>
> John Pavlick
>
> --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net> wrote:
> From: Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern  
> Contest this weekend
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 8:24 PM
>
> I need help. Ron VP (15-year Master class pilot) On Sep 25, 2008,  
> at 3:13 PM, JShulman wrote: > The Orlando group will be there just  
> after noon... ish...lol. I > know the guys here have been  
> practicing the new Masters routines, > so if anyone wants to go  
> through them there, we'll be more that > ready to help (or any  
> class). > > Regards, > Jason > www.jasonshulman.com >  
> www.shulmanaviation.com > www.composite-arf.com > > -----Original  
> Message----- > From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org  
> [mailto:nsrca- > discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of  
> Tony > Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 4:05 PM > To: 'General  
> pattern discussion' > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman  
> Memorial Pattern Contest > this weekend > > Just wanted to remind  
> everyone of the pattern contest this weekend > in Jacksonville, FL.  
> Looks like the weather will be warm but good > and I look forward  
> to seeing everyone. The field will be open for > practice tomorrow.  
> I?ll be at the site around noon. > > > > See everyone then! > > > >  
> Tony Stillman, President > > Radio South, Inc. > > 139 Altama  
> Connector, Box 322 > > Brunswick, GA 31525 > > 1-800-962-7802 > >  
> www.radiosouthrc.com > > > >  
> _______________________________________________ > NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org > http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion  
> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion  
> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http:// 
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Thu Sep 25 17:01:44 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 01:01:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern Contest this
	weekend
In-Reply-To: <6016B690-B579-470C-BD8B-DCB2456FB234@cox.net>
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNIEKNCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

Did that once Ron... years ago in Lakeland. It's was great, especially when the pilot turned and walked away on the last maneuver
and the airplane finished the flight and landed... priceless

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com


-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Ron Van
Putte
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 8:28 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern Contest
thisweekend


No, I need help.  A good form of help would be if I was to pretend to
fly the Master class sequence with my airplane, while Jason Shulman
actually flew the airplane.  Now, that would be help.  Oh Geez!   Now
everybody knows about it and we can't do it!

Ron VP

On Sep 25, 2008, at 4:29 PM, John Pavlick wrote:

> We know THAT!  Oh, you mean you need help with the new sequences.
> That's different. LOL
>
> John Pavlick
>
> --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net> wrote:
> From: Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern
> Contest this weekend
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 8:24 PM
>
> I need help. Ron VP (15-year Master class pilot) On Sep 25, 2008,
> at 3:13 PM, JShulman wrote: > The Orlando group will be there just
> after noon... ish...lol. I > know the guys here have been
> practicing the new Masters routines, > so if anyone wants to go
> through them there, we'll be more that > ready to help (or any
> class). > > Regards, > Jason > www.jasonshulman.com >
> www.shulmanaviation.com > www.composite-arf.com > > -----Original
> Message----- > From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca- > discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of
> Tony > Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 4:05 PM > To: 'General
> pattern discussion' > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman
> Memorial Pattern Contest > this weekend > > Just wanted to remind
> everyone of the pattern contest this weekend > in Jacksonville, FL.
> Looks like the weather will be warm but good > and I look forward
> to seeing everyone. The field will be open for > practice tomorrow.
> I?ll be at the site around noon. > > > > See everyone then! > > > >
> Tony Stillman, President > > Radio South, Inc. > > 139 Altama
> Connector, Box 322 > > Brunswick, GA 31525 > > 1-800-962-7802 > >
> www.radiosouthrc.com > > > >
> _______________________________________________ > NSRCA-discussion
> mailing list > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org > http://
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion
> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://
> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.2/1690 - Release Date: 9/25/2008 7:05 AM

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Checked by AVG.
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From vanputte at cox.net  Thu Sep 25 18:25:55 2008
From: vanputte at cox.net (Ron Van Putte)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 02:25:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern Contest this
	weekend
In-Reply-To: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNIEKNCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNIEKNCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <1106B7CD-0638-4D3A-8067-E52015562847@cox.net>

MANY years ago, it was pulled by Bill Johnston (Kraft Southeast) and  
Dave Brown on the judges at the Tangerine Contest.  Bill turned to  
the judges about 2/3 of the way through the maneuver schedule and  
said something like, I can't do this.  Here you fly it." and handed  
his transmitter to one of the judges.  What was really funny is that  
Dave was doing "Dave Brown quality" maneuvers with Bill Johnston's  
airplane, but the judges gave "Bill Johnston scores" to the  
maneuvers.  They didn't give "halo points" back in those days.  Yeah,  
right.

Ron VP

On Sep 25, 2008, at 8:02 PM, JShulman wrote:

> Did that once Ron... years ago in Lakeland. It's was great,  
> especially when the pilot turned and walked away on the last maneuver
> and the airplane finished the flight and landed... priceless
>
> Regards,
> Jason
> www.jasonshulman.com
> www.shulmanaviation.com
> www.composite-arf.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of Ron Van
> Putte
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 8:28 PM
> To: General pattern discussion
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern Contest
> thisweekend
>
>
> No, I need help.  A good form of help would be if I was to pretend to
> fly the Master class sequence with my airplane, while Jason Shulman
> actually flew the airplane.  Now, that would be help.  Oh Geez!   Now
> everybody knows about it and we can't do it!
>
> Ron VP
>
> On Sep 25, 2008, at 4:29 PM, John Pavlick wrote:
>
>> We know THAT!  Oh, you mean you need help with the new sequences.
>> That's different. LOL
>>
>> John Pavlick
>>
>> --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net> wrote:
>> From: Ron Van Putte <vanputte at cox.net>
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman Memorial Pattern
>> Contest this weekend
>> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>> Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 8:24 PM
>>
>> I need help. Ron VP (15-year Master class pilot) On Sep 25, 2008,
>> at 3:13 PM, JShulman wrote: > The Orlando group will be there just
>> after noon... ish...lol. I > know the guys here have been
>> practicing the new Masters routines, > so if anyone wants to go
>> through them there, we'll be more that > ready to help (or any
>> class). > > Regards, > Jason > www.jasonshulman.com >
>> www.shulmanaviation.com > www.composite-arf.com > > -----Original
>> Message----- > From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>> [mailto:nsrca- > discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org]On Behalf Of
>> Tony > Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 4:05 PM > To: 'General
>> pattern discussion' > Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Stillman
>> Memorial Pattern Contest > this weekend > > Just wanted to remind
>> everyone of the pattern contest this weekend > in Jacksonville, FL.
>> Looks like the weather will be warm but good > and I look forward
>> to seeing everyone. The field will be open for > practice tomorrow.
>> I?ll be at the site around noon. > > > > See everyone then! > > > >
>> Tony Stillman, President > > Radio South, Inc. > > 139 Altama
>> Connector, Box 322 > > Brunswick, GA 31525 > > 1-800-962-7802 > >
>> www.radiosouthrc.com > > > >
>> _______________________________________________ > NSRCA-discussion
>> mailing list > NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org > http://
>> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> _______________________________________________ NSRCA-discussion
>> mailing list NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org http://
>> lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.2/1690 - Release Date:  
> 9/25/2008 7:05 AM
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.2/1690 - Release Date:  
> 9/25/2008 7:05 AM
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From schroetere at bellsouth.net  Fri Sep 26 04:09:01 2008
From: schroetere at bellsouth.net (Emory Schroeter)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 12:09:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
In-Reply-To: <BLU124-W2046B84D883EB21FE1AEE9E2440@phx.gbl>
References: <388861.5822.qm@web82104.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<90442B0D99C14054AE264B777C8C6207@Sanity>
	<BLU124-W2046B84D883EB21FE1AEE9E2440@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <3C4B6532-C374-4003-8879-40B743782916@bellsouth.net>

Hey Anthony,

 From my experience, I was amazed at how well the HXT motor performed.  
I don't remember the stats exactly, but they were very close to the  
performance I was seeing with the AXI. I believe it was slightly less  
efficient (maybe 2 more amps drawn) and had about 200 less RPM than  
the AXI. Like someone mentioned, I kept waiting for it to fail, but it  
didn't. I had well over 100 flights on it when I decided to plant the  
airplane in the ground. Based on my experience with it, I wouldn't  
hesitate to try one again in the future. I mostly used the APC 20x15  
prop.

Emory Schroeter.


On Sep 25, 2008, at 1:30 PM, Anthony Romano wrote:

> Hi Mike,
> Are you sure on that prop size?
>
>
>
> From: kerlock at comcast.net
> To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:59:16 -0400
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
>
>
> Ok, some in depth answers.
>
> We did in fact test this motor last season on a Black Magic V2,  
> flying masters. We used the HXT 63-64B 230kv motor. We used a CC  
> HV85 controller, Tanic and vampower packs.
>
> Power is certainly not a problem for this motor. It is fairly  
> comparable to the AXI. 2700 watts, 82 amps, 6200 RPM on an APC  
> 20x14. the motor never got over 110 degrees.
>
> Longevity: we got well over 100 flights on it before the plane was  
> lost, no problems whatsoever. This was using Esprit stand off mounts  
> as well, o nose mounting.
>
> No can issues, nothing, it just delivered. your results may vary of  
> course. These are "cheap" chinese motors and you do not have the  
> support structure in place like the name brands. but considering you  
> can buy almost 4 of them for the price of one AXI, it's pretty  
> interesting.
>
> I've run a lot of these chinese motors and maybe I'm just lucky, but  
> I just don't have problems. I keep hearing about problems with  
> darned near everything, including name brand stuff, and the only  
> issue we've run into yet was a very early bearing failure with an  
> AXI...that's all. Ever.
>
> I have yet to install one of these on a VF3, and wonder about it  
> because by it's very nature you will have to use more power to fly  
> it. I realize 82 amps is a lot, but the packs never got warm, nor  
> did the speed control or motor, so who knows.
>
> in short, if this is your first forray into electrics of this size,  
> you would probably be better off with the AXI just from the  
> standpoint of support. But so far I can't find a thing wrong with  
> this motor, or else I am just that lucky (and THAT is highly  
> unlikely, trust me!)
>
> -Mike
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Anthony Abdullah
> To: General pattern discussion
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:04 PM
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
>
> As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have  
> come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT  
> 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor  
> ($60 vs.$200+) with very similar performance numbers, physical  
> dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info I saw it is even 12  
> grams lighter.
>
> Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will  
> it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does  
> it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese  
> knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to know  
> is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?
>
> I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from  
> those who have used them or seen them run.
>
> Thanks a bunch
> Anthony
>
>
>
>
> E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (5.5.1.322)
> Database version: 5.10780e
> http://www.pctools.com/spyware-doctor/
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
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>
>
>
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> Stay up to date on your PC, the Web, and your mobile phone with  
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From cjm767driver at hotmail.com  Fri Sep 26 06:27:01 2008
From: cjm767driver at hotmail.com (chris moon)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 14:27:01 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Electric-F3a web site
Message-ID: <BLU137-W4266B3077DD581F1724D0983470@phx.gbl>


For those who requested, I have added some discussion forums to the 
electric-f3a web site.  There is not a lot of content there right now as 
you would expect but please stop by and check it out.  I get lots of 
email questions directly and would rather have the information flow out 
in the public rather than via private emails. (no, I don't mind 
answering the emails) This way though we can all learn from each other.  
And to be honest, I don't know a lot (most) of the answers but I know 
some of you out there do! 
You need to register to post but not to read - this prevents spam posts 
from clogging up the site.  I will be moving some areas of the regular 
site to the forums so that the topics can be discussed there rather than 
just be read only.

Just to be clear, I am not trying to direct any info flow away from the 
NSRCA email list, just provide an area for electric pattern discussion 
especially for those who are not on the email list.  Please stop by and 
check them out.

There is a link on the home page of www.electric-f3a.com
or you can enter the forums directly from http://electric-f3a.com/smf

Chris


_________________________________________________________________
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From aabdu at sbcglobal.net  Fri Sep 26 06:56:55 2008
From: aabdu at sbcglobal.net (Anthony Abdullah)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 14:56:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
In-Reply-To: <3C4B6532-C374-4003-8879-40B743782916@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <273418.58542.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Emory,
What ESC and battery did you use with that. Is the Jeti spin 99 still the right choice for that motor?

Thanks for the info.
--- On Fri, 9/26/08, Emory Schroeter <schroetere at bellsouth.net> wrote:

From: Emory Schroeter <schroetere at bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Friday, September 26, 2008, 8:08 AM


Hey Anthony,


>From my experience, I was amazed at how well the HXT motor performed. I don't remember the stats exactly, but they were very close to the performance I was seeing with the AXI. I believe it was slightly less efficient (maybe 2 more amps drawn) and had about 200 less RPM than the AXI. Like someone mentioned, I kept waiting for it to fail, but it didn't. I had well over 100 flights on it when I decided to plant the airplane in the ground. Based on my experience with it, I wouldn't?hesitate?to try one again in the future. I mostly used the APC 20x15 prop.


Emory Schroeter.





On Sep 25, 2008, at 1:30 PM, Anthony Romano wrote:


Hi Mike,
Are you sure on that prop size?





From:?kerlock at comcast.net
To:?aabdu at sbcglobal.net;?nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:59:16 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors



Ok, some in depth answers.
?
We did in fact test this motor last season on a Black Magic V2, flying masters. We used the HXT 63-64B 230kv motor. We used a CC HV85 controller, Tanic and vampower packs.
?
Power is certainly not a problem for this motor. It is fairly comparable to the AXI. 2700 watts, 82 amps, 6200 RPM on an APC 20x14. the motor never got over 110 degrees.
?
Longevity: we got well over 100 flights on it before the plane was lost, no problems whatsoever. This was using Esprit stand off mounts as well, o nose mounting.
?
No can issues, nothing, it just delivered. your results may vary of course. These are "cheap" chinese motors and you do not have the support structure in place like the name brands. but considering you can buy almost 4 of them for the price of one AXI, it's pretty interesting.
?
I've run a lot of these chinese motors and maybe I'm just lucky, but I just don't have problems. I keep hearing about problems with darned near everything, including name brand stuff, and the only issue we've run into yet was a very early bearing failure with an AXI...that's all. Ever.
?
I have yet to install one of these on a VF3, and wonder about it because by it's very nature you will have to use more power to fly it. I realize 82 amps is a lot, but the packs never got warm, nor did the speed control or motor, so who knows.
?
in short, if this is your first forray into electrics of this size, you would probably be better off with the AXI just from the standpoint of support. But so far I can't find a thing wrong with this motor, or else I am just that lucky (and THAT is highly unlikely, trust me!)
?
-Mike
?

----- Original Message -----
From:?Anthony Abdullah
To:?General pattern discussion
Sent:?Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:04 PM
Subject:?[NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors






As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+)?with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info?I saw?it is even 12 grams lighter.
?
Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?
?
I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those who have used them or seen them run.
?
Thanks a bunch
Anthony




E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (5.5.1.322)
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_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



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Stay up to date on your PC, the Web, and your mobile phone with Windows Live.?See Now?_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From jlachow at hotmail.com  Fri Sep 26 08:19:20 2008
From: jlachow at hotmail.com (Joe Lachowski)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 16:19:20 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Stuff For Sale
Message-ID: <BAY101-W25BF38D3CB0B987891C1E9BB470@phx.gbl>

Here is a bunch of stuff I have for sale. It is mostly stuff for the OS 140 RX new in package. Anything under $25.00 single or in combination, you pay for shipping. If you take all OS parts as a package you can have them for $225.00. Total asking price for parts individually is $251.00
 
 
2 used NMP Li-Ion Chargers - $25.00 for both
 
OS parts
 
22681980  140RX Needle($9.49) - $7.00
29403200  140RX Piston($58.00) - $45.00
294034000 140RX Piston Ring($26.99) - $20.00
29431000/29430010 EFI Bearing Set($44.98) - $35.00
GPMQ4588 Great Planes Spinner Adapter f/140RX($4.49) - $3.00
71703009 In-flight control needle valve($31.99) (have 2) - $20.00 each
28282000 Remote Needle Valve Assembly($36.99) - $25.00
MACS 4745 2.25? rise Header f/140RX($37.99) - $25.00
2841400 RX Gasket Set($5.49) - $4.00
45508200 RX Woodruff Key($3.59)(have 2) - $2.50 each
27517000 Piston Pin Retainer($2.69)(have 2 sets) - $2.00 each
71531000 OS Non-Bubble Weight(Clunk)($15.99)(have 3) - $10.00 each
26711305 Ratchet Spring ($2.09) - $1.00
 
_________________________________________________________________
Want to do more with Windows Live? Learn ?10 hidden secrets? from Jamie.
http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008
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From schroetere at bellsouth.net  Fri Sep 26 09:17:26 2008
From: schroetere at bellsouth.net (schroetere at bellsouth.net)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 17:17:26 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
In-Reply-To: <273418.58542.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <3C4B6532-C374-4003-8879-40B743782916@bellsouth.net>
	<273418.58542.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <092620081717.26764.48DD1923000448330000688C22228869349B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF0A9D0A9B0A019D080C9C@att.net>

Hey Anthony,

I am using the Castle Creations HV85 and a mix of Tanic and Vampower batteries. I haven't used a Jeti, but I'm sure it would do well also. My packs are between 4500-5000 mah flying the masters pattern.

Emory.
-------------- Original message from Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>: -------------- 

Emory,
What ESC and battery did you use with that. Is the Jeti spin 99 still the right choice for that motor?

Thanks for the info.
--- On Fri, 9/26/08, Emory Schroeter <schroetere at bellsouth.net> wrote:

From: Emory Schroeter <schroetere at bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Friday, September 26, 2008, 8:08 AM


Hey Anthony, 


>From my experience, I was amazed at how well the HXT motor performed. I don't remember the stats exactly, but they were very close to the performance I was seeing with the AXI. I believe it was slightly less efficient (maybe 2 more amps drawn) and had about 200 less RPM than the AXI. Like someone mentioned, I kept waiting for it to fail, but it didn't. I had well over 100 flights on it when I decided to plant the airplane in the ground. Based on my experience with it, I wouldn't hesitate to try one again in the future. I mostly used the APC 20x15 prop.


Emory Schroeter.




On Sep 25, 2008, at 1:30 PM, Anthony Romano wrote:


Hi Mike,
Are you sure on that prop size?





From: kerlock at comcast.net
To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:59:16 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors



Ok, some in depth answers.

We did in fact test this motor last season on a Black Magic V2, flying masters. We used the HXT 63-64B 230kv motor. We used a CC HV85 controller, Tanic and vampower packs.

Power is certainly not a problem for this motor. It is fairly comparable to the AXI. 2700 watts, 82 amps, 6200 RPM on an APC 20x14. the motor never got over 110 degrees.

Longevity: we got well over 100 flights on it before the plane was lost, no problems whatsoever. This was using Esprit stand off mounts as well, o nose mounting.

No can issues, nothing, it just delivered. your results may vary of course. These are "cheap" chinese motors and you do not have the support structure in place like the name brands. but considering you can buy almost 4 of them for the price of one AXI, it's pretty interesting.

I've run a lot of these chinese motors and maybe I'm just lucky, but I just don't have problems. I keep hearing about problems with darned near everything, including name brand stuff, and the only issue we've run into yet was a very early bearing failure with an AXI...that's all. Ever.

I have yet to install one of these on a VF3, and wonder about it because by it's very nature you will have to use more power to fly it. I realize 82 amps is a lot, but the packs never got warm, nor did the speed control or motor, so who knows.

in short, if this is your first forray into electrics of this size, you would probably be better off with the AXI just from the standpoint of support. But so far I can't find a thing wrong with this motor, or else I am just that lucky (and THAT is highly unlikely, trust me!)

-Mike

----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Abdullah
To: General pattern discussion
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:04 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors


As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+) with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info I saw it is even 12 grams lighter.

Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?

I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those who have used them or seen them run.

Thanks a bunch
Anthony





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From donramsey at gmail.com  Fri Sep 26 10:14:04 2008
From: donramsey at gmail.com (Don Ramsey)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 18:14:04 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Contest Results
Message-ID: <2c94dd7d0809261114p16520199m813f552250a9100c@mail.gmail.com>

Results for the North Dallas Pattern Classic is available on
pages.suddenlink.net/donramsey

Sorry for the delay but I still don't have internet from effects of the
hurricane.
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From getterflash at yahoo.com  Fri Sep 26 10:35:43 2008
From: getterflash at yahoo.com (Bob Kane)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 18:35:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Castle Creations, was Re:  E-Question HXT motors
Message-ID: <829504.12793.qm@web36703.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Castle Creations was founded and is run by Patrick del Castillo . . . . . . .    not only do they have great products and support, they are located right here in the US.   I have been using their products for many years and have never been let down.

 Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com



----- Original Message ----
From: "schroetere at bellsouth.net" <schroetere at bellsouth.net>
To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, September 26, 2008 1:17:23 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors


Hey Anthony,
 
I am using the Castle Creations HV85 and a mix of Tanic and Vampower batteries. I haven't used a Jeti, but I'm sure it would do well also. My packs are between 4500-5000 mah flying the masters pattern.
 
Emory.
-------------- Original message from Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>: -------------- 


Emory,
What ESC and battery did you use with that. Is the Jeti spin 99 still the right choice for that motor?

Thanks for the info.
--- On Fri, 9/26/08, Emory Schroeter <schroetere at bellsouth.net> wrote:

From: Emory Schroeter <schroetere at bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Friday, September 26, 2008, 8:08 AM


Hey Anthony, 

>From my experience, I was amazed at how well the HXT motor performed. I don't remember the stats exactly, but they were very close to the performance I was seeing with the AXI. I believe it was slightly less efficient (maybe 2 more amps drawn) and had about 200 less RPM than the AXI. Like someone mentioned, I kept waiting for it to fail, but it didn't. I had well over 100 flights on it when I decided to plant the airplane in the ground. Based on my experience with it, I wouldn't hesitate to try one again in the future. I mostly used the APC 20x15 prop.

Emory Schroeter.



On Sep 25, 2008, at 1:30 PM, Anthony Romano wrote:

Hi Mike,
Are you sure on that prop size?



________________________________
 From: kerlock at comcast.net
To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:59:16 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors



Ok, some in depth answers.
 
We did in fact test this motor last season on a Black Magic V2, flying masters. We used the HXT 63-64B 230kv motor. We used a CC HV85 controller, Tanic and vampower packs.
 
Power is certainly not a problem for this motor. It is fairly comparable to the AXI. 2700 watts, 82 amps, 6200 RPM on an APC 20x14. the motor never got over 110 degrees.
 
Longevity: we got well over 100 flights on it before the plane was lost, no problems whatsoever. This was using Esprit stand off mounts as well, o nose mounting.
 
No can issues, nothing, it just delivered. your results may vary of course. These are "cheap" chinese motors and you do not have the support structure in place like the name brands. but considering you can buy almost 4 of them for the price of one AXI, it's pretty interesting.
 
I've run a lot of these chinese motors and maybe I'm just lucky, but I just don't have problems. I keep hearing about problems with darned near everything, including name brand stuff, and the only issue we've run into yet was a very early bearing failure with an AXI...that's all. Ever.
 
I have yet to install one of these on a VF3, and wonder about it because by it's very nature you will have to use more power to fly it. I realize 82 amps is a lot, but the packs never got warm, nor did the speed control or motor, so who knows.
 
in short, if this is your first forray into electrics of this size, you would probably be better off with the AXI just from the standpoint of support. But so far I can't find a thing wrong with this motor, or else I am just that lucky (and THAT is highly unlikely, trust me!)
 
-Mike
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Abdullah
To: General pattern discussion
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:04 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors

As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+) with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info I saw it is even 12 grams lighter.
 
Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?
 
I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those who have used them or seen them run.
 
Thanks a bunch
Anthony
 



E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (5.5.1.322)
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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



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 Stay up to date on your PC, the Web, and your mobile phone with Windows Live. See Now _______________________________________________
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From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Fri Sep 26 11:44:55 2008
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 19:44:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Castle Creations,
	was Re:  E-Question HXT motors
In-Reply-To: <829504.12793.qm@web36703.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <304962.17520.qm@web51008.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

?I second Bob's enthusiasm towards Castle. It's an American product that we should be proud of. They are bullet proof controllers. Mike

--- On Fri, 9/26/08, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Castle Creations, was Re: E-Question HXT motors
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Friday, September 26, 2008, 1:35 PM





Castle Creations was founded and is run by Patrick del Castillo . . . . . . .??? not only do they have great products and support, they are located right here in the US.?? I have been using their products for many years and have never been let down.

?Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com




----- Original Message ----
From: "schroetere at bellsouth.net" <schroetere at bellsouth.net>
To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, September 26, 2008 1:17:23 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors



Hey Anthony,
?
I am using the Castle Creations HV85 and a mix of Tanic and Vampower batteries. I haven't used a Jeti, but I'm sure it would do well also. My packs are between 4500-5000 mah flying the masters pattern.
?
Emory.
-------------- Original message from Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>: -------------- 






Emory,
What ESC and battery did you use with that. Is the Jeti spin 99 still the right choice for that motor?

Thanks for the info.
--- On Fri, 9/26/08, Emory Schroeter <schroetere at bellsouth.net> wrote:

From: Emory Schroeter <schroetere at bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Friday, September 26, 2008, 8:08 AM


Hey Anthony, 


>From my experience, I was amazed at how well the HXT motor performed. I don't remember the stats exactly, but they were very close to the performance I was seeing with the AXI. I believe it was slightly less efficient (maybe 2 more amps drawn) and had about 200 less RPM than the AXI. Like someone mentioned, I kept waiting for it to fail, but it didn't. I had well over 100 flights on it when I decided to plant the airplane in the ground. Based on my experience with it, I wouldn't?hesitate?to try one again in the future. I mostly used the APC 20x15 prop.


Emory Schroeter.





On Sep 25, 2008, at 1:30 PM, Anthony Romano wrote:


Hi Mike,
Are you sure on that prop size?





From:?kerlock at comcast.net
To:?aabdu at sbcglobal.net;?nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:59:16 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors



Ok, some in depth answers.
?
We did in fact test this motor last season on a Black Magic V2, flying masters. We used the HXT 63-64B 230kv motor. We used a CC HV85 controller, Tanic and vampower packs.
?
Power is certainly not a problem for this motor. It is fairly comparable to the AXI. 2700 watts, 82 amps, 6200 RPM on an APC 20x14. the motor never got over 110 degrees.
?
Longevity: we got well over 100 flights on it before the plane was lost, no problems whatsoever. This was using Esprit stand off mounts as well, o nose mounting.
?
No can issues, nothing, it just delivered. your results may vary of course. These are "cheap" chinese motors and you do not have the support structure in place like the name brands. but considering you can buy almost 4 of them for the price of one AXI, it's pretty interesting.
?
I've run a lot of these chinese motors and maybe I'm just lucky, but I just don't have problems. I keep hearing about problems with darned near everything, including name brand stuff, and the only issue we've run into yet was a very early bearing failure with an AXI...that's all. Ever.
?
I have yet to install one of these on a VF3, and wonder about it because by it's very nature you will have to use more power to fly it. I realize 82 amps is a lot, but the packs never got warm, nor did the speed control or motor, so who knows.
?
in short, if this is your first forray into electrics of this size, you would probably be better off with the AXI just from the standpoint of support. But so far I can't find a thing wrong with this motor, or else I am just that lucky (and THAT is highly unlikely, trust me!)
?
-Mike
?

----- Original Message -----
From:?Anthony Abdullah
To:?General pattern discussion
Sent:?Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:04 PM
Subject:?[NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors






As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+)?with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info?I saw?it is even 12 grams lighter.
?
Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?
?
I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those who have used them or seen them run.
?
Thanks a bunch
Anthony




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From pamrich47 at hotmail.com  Fri Sep 26 13:12:11 2008
From: pamrich47 at hotmail.com (Richard Strickland)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 21:12:11 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FW:  Castle Creations,
 was Re:  E-Question HXT motors
In-Reply-To: <304962.17520.qm@web51008.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <829504.12793.qm@web36703.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<304962.17520.qm@web51008.mail.re2.yahoo.com> 
Message-ID: <BAY128-W561F11A843D1EF159F3188A0470@phx.gbl>





And they don't charge an arm and a leg to fix 'em--unlike the Hacker with one tiny transitor/ic out of it and it "..can't be repaired.."  BTW, anyone know anyone who CAN repair them? RS

Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 12:44:52 -0700From: mups1953 at yahoo.comTo: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgSubject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Castle Creations, was Re: E-Question HXT motors



 I second Bob's enthusiasm towards Castle. It's an American product that we should be proud of. They are bullet proof controllers. Mike--- On Fri, 9/26/08, Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:
From: Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Castle Creations, was Re: E-Question HXT motorsTo: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>Date: Friday, September 26, 2008, 1:35 PM



Castle Creations was founded and is run by Patrick del Castillo . . . . . . .    not only do they have great products and support, they are located right here in the US.   I have been using their products for many years and have never been let down.
 Bob Kanegetterflash at yahoo.com 


----- Original Message ----From: "schroetere at bellsouth.net" <schroetere at bellsouth.net>To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>Sent: Friday, September 26, 2008 1:17:23 PMSubject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors

Hey Anthony,
 
I am using the Castle Creations HV85 and a mix of Tanic and Vampower batteries. I haven't used a Jeti, but I'm sure it would do well also. My packs are between 4500-5000 mah flying the masters pattern.
 
Emory.
-------------- Original message from Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>: -------------- 




Emory,
What ESC and battery did you use with that. Is the Jeti spin 99 still the right choice for that motor?
Thanks for the info.--- On Fri, 9/26/08, Emory Schroeter <schroetere at bellsouth.net> wrote:
From: Emory Schroeter <schroetere at bellsouth.net>Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motorsTo: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>Date: Friday, September 26, 2008, 8:08 AM
Hey Anthony, 

>From my experience, I was amazed at how well the HXT motor performed. I don't remember the stats exactly, but they were very close to the performance I was seeing with the AXI. I believe it was slightly less efficient (maybe 2 more amps drawn) and had about 200 less RPM than the AXI. Like someone mentioned, I kept waiting for it to fail, but it didn't. I had well over 100 flights on it when I decided to plant the airplane in the ground. Based on my experience with it, I wouldn't hesitate to try one again in the future. I mostly used the APC 20x15 prop.

Emory Schroeter.



On Sep 25, 2008, at 1:30 PM, Anthony Romano wrote:

Hi Mike,Are you sure on that prop size?

From: kerlock at comcast.netTo: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgDate: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:59:16 -0400Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
Ok, some in depth answers.
 
We did in fact test this motor last season on a Black Magic V2, flying masters. We used the HXT 63-64B 230kv motor. We used a CC HV85 controller, Tanic and vampower packs.
 
Power is certainly not a problem for this motor. It is fairly comparable to the AXI. 2700 watts, 82 amps, 6200 RPM on an APC 20x14. the motor never got over 110 degrees.
 
Longevity: we got well over 100 flights on it before the plane was lost, no problems whatsoever. This was using Esprit stand off mounts as well, o nose mounting.
 
No can issues, nothing, it just delivered. your results may vary of course. These are "cheap" chinese motors and you do not have the support structure in place like the name brands. but considering you can buy almost 4 of them for the price of one AXI, it's pretty interesting.
 
I've run a lot of these chinese motors and maybe I'm just lucky, but I just don't have problems. I keep hearing about problems with darned near everything, including name brand stuff, and the only issue we've run into yet was a very early bearing failure with an AXI...that's all. Ever.
 
I have yet to install one of these on a VF3, and wonder about it because by it's very nature you will have to use more power to fly it. I realize 82 amps is a lot, but the packs never got warm, nor did the speed control or motor, so who knows.
 
in short, if this is your first forray into electrics of this size, you would probably be better off with the AXI just from the standpoint of support. But so far I can't find a thing wrong with this motor, or else I am just that lucky (and THAT is highly unlikely, trust me!)
 
-Mike
 

----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Abdullah
To: General pattern discussion
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:04 PM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors





As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+) with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info I saw it is even 12 grams lighter.
 
Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?
 
I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those who have used them or seen them run.
 
Thanks a bunch
AnthonyE-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (5.5.1.322)Database version: 5.10780ehttp://www.pctools.com/spyware-doctor/


_______________________________________________NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussionE-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (5.5.1.322)Database version: 5.10780ehttp://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor/E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (5.5.1.322)Database version: 5.10780ehttp://www.pctools.com/spyware-doctor/

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From rcmaster199 at aol.com  Fri Sep 26 13:52:08 2008
From: rcmaster199 at aol.com (rcmaster199 at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 21:52:08 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FW:  Castle Creations,
 was Re:  E-Question HXT motors
In-Reply-To: <BAY128-W561F11A843D1EF159F3188A0470@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY128-W561F11A843D1EF159F3188A0470@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <8CAEE392F045F65-D10-46A3@WEBMAIL-MZ03.sysops.aol.com>

Hmmmm!! Castillo---Castle....It makes perfect sense to me. I now 
understand why Dave Lockhart and Dean Pappas have been so complimentary 
of these controllers. The man has his name on his product. That's old 
time quality

MattK

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Strickland <pamrich47 at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA DISCUSSION <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 5:12 pm
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FW:  Castle Creations, was Re:  E-Question 
HXT motors

And they don't charge an arm and a leg to fix 'em--unlike the Hacker 
with one tiny
transitor/ic out of it and it "..can't be repaired.."? BTW, anyone know 
anyone who
CAN repair them?
?
RS





Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 12:44:52 -0700
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Castle Creations, was Re: E-Question 
HXT motors






?I second Bob's enthusiasm towards Castle. It's an American product 
that we should be proud of. They are bullet proof controllers. Mike

--- On Fri, 9/26/08, Bob Kane &lt;getterflash at yahoo.com&gt; wrote:

From: Bob Kane &lt;getterflash at yahoo.com&gt;
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Castle Creations, was Re: E-Question HXT 
motors
To: "General pattern discussion" 
&lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
Date: Friday, September 26, 2008, 1:35 PM





Castle Creations was founded and is run by Patrick del Castillo . . . . 
. . .??? not 
only do they have great products and support, they are 
located right here in the US.?? I have been using their products for 
many years and have never been let down.

?Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com




----- Original Message ----
From: "schroetere at bellsouth.net" &lt;schroetere at bellsouth.net&gt;
To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; General pattern discussion 
&lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
Sent: Friday, September 26, 2008 1:17:23 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors



Hey Anthony,
?
I am using the Castle Creations HV85 and a mix of Tanic and Vampower 
batteries. I haven't used a Jeti, but I'm sure it would do well also. 
My packs are between 4500-5000 mah flying the masters pattern.
?
Emory.
-------------- Original message from Anthony Abdullah 
&lt;aabdu at sbcglobal.net&gt;: --------------






Emory,
What ESC and battery did you use with that. Is the Jeti spin 99 still 
the right choice for that motor?

Thanks for the info.
--- On Fri, 9/26/08, Emory Schroeter &lt;schroetere at bellsouth.net&gt; 
wrote:

From: Emory Schroeter &lt;schroetere at bellsouth.net&gt;
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
To: "General pattern discussion" 
&lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
Date: Friday, September 26, 2008, 8:08 AM


Hey Anthony,


 From my experience, I was amazed at how well the HXT motor performed. I 
don't remember the stats exactly, but they were very close t
o the 
performance I was seeing with the AXI. I believe it was slightly less 
efficient (maybe 2 more amps drawn) and had about 200 less RPM than the 
AXI. Like someone mentioned, I kept waiting for it to fail, but it 
didn't. I had well over 100 flights on it when I decided to plant the 
airplane in the ground. Based on my experience with it, I 
wouldn't?hesitate?to try one again in the future. I mostly used the APC 
20x15 prop.


Emory Schroeter.





On Sep 25, 2008, at 1:30 PM, Anthony Romano wrote:

Hi Mike,
Are you sure on that prop size?





From:?kerlock at comcast.net
To:?aabdu at sbcglobal.net;?nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:59:16 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors



Ok, some in depth answers.
?
We did in fact test this motor last season on a Black Magic V2, flying 
masters. We used the HXT 63-64B 230kv motor. We used a CC HV85 
controller, Tanic and vampower packs.
?
Power is certainly not a problem for this motor. It is fairly 
comparable to the AXI. 2700 watts, 82 amps, 6200 RPM on an APC 20x14. 
the motor never got over 110 degrees.
?
Longevity: we got well over 100 flights on it before the plane was 
lost, no problems whatsoever. This was using Esprit stand off mounts as 
well, o nose mounting.
?
No can issues, nothing, it just delivered. your results may va
ry of 
course. These are "cheap" chinese motors and you do not have the 
support structure in place like the name brands. but considering you 
can buy almost 4 of them for the price of one AXI, it's pretty 
interesting.
?
I've run a lot of these chinese motors and maybe I'm just lucky, but I 
just don't have problems. I keep hearing about problems with darned 
near everything, including name brand stuff, and the only issue we've 
run into yet was a very early bearing failure with an AXI...that's all. 
Ever.
?
I have yet to install one of these on a VF3, and wonder about it 
because by it's very nature you will have to use more power to fly it. 
I realize 82 amps is a lot, but the packs never got warm, nor did the 
speed control or motor, so who knows.
?
in short, if this is your first forray into electrics of this size, you 
would probably be better off with the AXI just from the standpoint of 
support. But so far I can't find a thing wrong with this motor, or else 
I am just that lucky (and THAT is highly unlikely, trust me!)
?
-Mike
?

----- Original Message -----
From:?Anthony Abdullah
To:?General pattern discussion
Sent:?Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:04 PM
Subject:?[NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors






As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have 
come across the HXT line of electric motors. It a
ppears that the HXT 
63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 
vs.$200+)?with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, 
etc. In fact, according to the info?I saw?it is even 12 grams lighter.
?
Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it 
burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it 
smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, 
a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor 
viable for F3A pattern?
?
I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from 
those who have used them or seen them run.
?
Thanks a bunch
Anthony




E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (5.5.1.322)
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Database version: 5.10780e
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=_______________________________________________
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From DaveL322 at comcast.net  Fri Sep 26 17:53:45 2008
From: DaveL322 at comcast.net (Dave)
Date: Sat, 27 Sep 2008 01:53:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FW:  Castle Creations,
	was Re:  E-Question HXT motors
In-Reply-To: <8CAEE392F045F65-D10-46A3@WEBMAIL-MZ03.sysops.aol.com>
References: <BAY128-W561F11A843D1EF159F3188A0470@phx.gbl>
	<8CAEE392F045F65-D10-46A3@WEBMAIL-MZ03.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <F82506999F544EBF87B49009669C031B@davedesktop>

Absolutely!!!  When I started with electric, Castle was one of the first
companies I purchased from, and was very happy to become sponsored with
Castle.  So far as Patrick del Castillo, he not only has his name on his
product, but actively contributes:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=813861

Posts 10, 15, and 26 are some good ones - and give quite a bit of insight
into "getting what you pay for".

Regards,

Dave Lockhart
Team Castle



-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of
rcmaster199 at aol.com
Sent: Friday, September 26, 2008 5:52 PM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] FW: Castle Creations, was Re: E-Question HXT
motors

Hmmmm!! Castillo---Castle....It makes perfect sense to me. I now 
understand why Dave Lockhart and Dean Pappas have been so complimentary 
of these controllers. The man has his name on his product. That's old 
time quality

MattK

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Strickland <pamrich47 at hotmail.com>
To: NSRCA DISCUSSION <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 5:12 pm
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] FW:  Castle Creations, was Re:  E-Question 
HXT motors

And they don't charge an arm and a leg to fix 'em--unlike the Hacker 
with one tiny
transitor/ic out of it and it "..can't be repaired.."? BTW, anyone know 
anyone who
CAN repair them?
?
RS





Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 12:44:52 -0700
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Castle Creations, was Re: E-Question 
HXT motors






?I second Bob's enthusiasm towards Castle. It's an American product 
that we should be proud of. They are bullet proof controllers. Mike

--- On Fri, 9/26/08, Bob Kane &lt;getterflash at yahoo.com&gt; wrote:

From: Bob Kane &lt;getterflash at yahoo.com&gt;
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Castle Creations, was Re: E-Question HXT 
motors
To: "General pattern discussion" 
&lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
Date: Friday, September 26, 2008, 1:35 PM





Castle Creations was founded and is run by Patrick del Castillo . . . . 
. . .??? not 
only do they have great products and support, they are 
located right here in the US.?? I have been using their products for 
many years and have never been let down.

?Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com




----- Original Message ----
From: "schroetere at bellsouth.net" &lt;schroetere at bellsouth.net&gt;
To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; General pattern discussion 
&lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
Sent: Friday, September 26, 2008 1:17:23 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors



Hey Anthony,
?
I am using the Castle Creations HV85 and a mix of Tanic and Vampower 
batteries. I haven't used a Jeti, but I'm sure it would do well also. 
My packs are between 4500-5000 mah flying the masters pattern.
?
Emory.
-------------- Original message from Anthony Abdullah 
&lt;aabdu at sbcglobal.net&gt;: --------------






Emory,
What ESC and battery did you use with that. Is the Jeti spin 99 still 
the right choice for that motor?

Thanks for the info.
--- On Fri, 9/26/08, Emory Schroeter &lt;schroetere at bellsouth.net&gt; 
wrote:

From: Emory Schroeter &lt;schroetere at bellsouth.net&gt;
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
To: "General pattern discussion" 
&lt;nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org&gt;
Date: Friday, September 26, 2008, 8:08 AM


Hey Anthony,


 From my experience, I was amazed at how well the HXT motor performed. I 
don't remember the stats exactly, but they were very close t
o the 
performance I was seeing with the AXI. I believe it was slightly less 
efficient (maybe 2 more amps drawn) and had about 200 less RPM than the 
AXI. Like someone mentioned, I kept waiting for it to fail, but it 
didn't. I had well over 100 flights on it when I decided to plant the 
airplane in the ground. Based on my experience with it, I 
wouldn't?hesitate?to try one again in the future. I mostly used the APC 
20x15 prop.


Emory Schroeter.





On Sep 25, 2008, at 1:30 PM, Anthony Romano wrote:

Hi Mike,
Are you sure on that prop size?





From:?kerlock at comcast.net
To:?aabdu at sbcglobal.net;?nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:59:16 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors



Ok, some in depth answers.
?
We did in fact test this motor last season on a Black Magic V2, flying 
masters. We used the HXT 63-64B 230kv motor. We used a CC HV85 
controller, Tanic and vampower packs.
?
Power is certainly not a problem for this motor. It is fairly 
comparable to the AXI. 2700 watts, 82 amps, 6200 RPM on an APC 20x14. 
the motor never got over 110 degrees.
?
Longevity: we got well over 100 flights on it before the plane was 
lost, no problems whatsoever. This was using Esprit stand off mounts as 
well, o nose mounting.
?
No can issues, nothing, it just delivered. your results may va
ry of 
course. These are "cheap" chinese motors and you do not have the 
support structure in place like the name brands. but considering you 
can buy almost 4 of them for the price of one AXI, it's pretty 
interesting.
?
I've run a lot of these chinese motors and maybe I'm just lucky, but I 
just don't have problems. I keep hearing about problems with darned 
near everything, including name brand stuff, and the only issue we've 
run into yet was a very early bearing failure with an AXI...that's all. 
Ever.
?
I have yet to install one of these on a VF3, and wonder about it 
because by it's very nature you will have to use more power to fly it. 
I realize 82 amps is a lot, but the packs never got warm, nor did the 
speed control or motor, so who knows.
?
in short, if this is your first forray into electrics of this size, you 
would probably be better off with the AXI just from the standpoint of 
support. But so far I can't find a thing wrong with this motor, or else 
I am just that lucky (and THAT is highly unlikely, trust me!)
?
-Mike
?

----- Original Message -----
From:?Anthony Abdullah
To:?General pattern discussion
Sent:?Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:04 PM
Subject:?[NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors






As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have 
come across the HXT line of electric motors. It a
ppears that the HXT 
63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 
vs.$200+)?with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, 
etc. In fact, according to the info?I saw?it is even 12 grams lighter.
?
Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it 
burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it 
smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, 
a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor 
viable for F3A pattern?
?
I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from 
those who have used them or seen them run.
?
Thanks a bunch
Anthony




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From f3aflyer7 at gmail.com  Fri Sep 26 19:30:30 2008
From: f3aflyer7 at gmail.com (Scott Pavlock)
Date: Sat, 27 Sep 2008 03:30:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
In-Reply-To: <092620081717.26764.48DD1923000448330000688C22228869349B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF0A9D0A9B0A019D080C9C@att.net>
References: <3C4B6532-C374-4003-8879-40B743782916@bellsouth.net>
	<273418.58542.qm@web82105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<092620081717.26764.48DD1923000448330000688C22228869349B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF0A9D0A9B0A019D080C9C@att.net>
Message-ID: <72f9ee7c0809262030x22dd14b2h35434e262533c001@mail.gmail.com>

Anthony,

My experience with generic brand, cheaper motors has shown a lot about how
different manufacturers use various techniques to cut costs, and how it
severely reduces the quality of the product. From an economic standpoint,
it's impossible for two manufacturers to sell two supposedly identical
products at such a large price difference. The only way this is possible is
to increase the quantity sold, and I'm sure AXI sells more motors than HXT.

In performance testing both in the air and on a dyno, the generic brand
almost always under performs fairly severely. This is usually a result of
poor workmanship and poorly selected or out of date materials. There is a
large difference in the metal that comes from China, and the metal that
comes from Japan. The material costs to make an electric motor are fairly
low because they can be bought in bulk and are readily accessable. Name
brand motors tend to use quality materials, but more importantly, use higher
quality labor where much of the costs to make the motor are incurred. This
not only produces a quality motor, but unit to unit reliability.

Many people use generic motors because they boast the same (in some cases
better) numbers, for a fraction of the cost. Some end up with an up to
standard motor and end up pretty happy with their purchase. But many also
end up with a motor that performs marginal at best, or maybe not at all,
without product replacement or product support. Motors can and will fail,
and is the one component that has the capability to destroy both the ESC and
the battery in one violent 500A burst. And one way to help prevent this it
is to use a high quality system.

In the long run, you will be much happier with a name brand motor,
regardless of wether you are just getting started or have been using
electrics for years. The same goes for the batteries and ESC.

Scott


On Fri, Sep 26, 2008 at 12:17 PM, <schroetere at bellsouth.net> wrote:

>  Hey Anthony,
>
> I am using the Castle Creations HV85 and a mix of Tanic and Vampower
> batteries. I haven't used a Jeti, but I'm sure it would do well also. My
> packs are between 4500-5000 mah flying the masters pattern.
>
> Emory.
>
> -------------- Original message from Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>:
> --------------
>
>   Emory,
> What ESC and battery did you use with that. Is the Jeti spin 99 still the
> right choice for that motor?
> Thanks for the info.
> --- On *Fri, 9/26/08, Emory Schroeter <schroetere at bellsouth.net>* wrote:
>
> From: Emory Schroeter <schroetere at bellsouth.net>
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Date: Friday, September 26, 2008, 8:08 AM
>
>
> Hey Anthony,
> From my experience, I was amazed at how well the HXT motor performed. I
> don't remember the stats exactly, but they were very close to the
> performance I was seeing with the AXI. I believe it was slightly less
> efficient (maybe 2 more amps drawn) and had about 200 less RPM than the AXI.
> Like someone mentioned, I kept waiting for it to fail, but it didn't. I had
> well over 100 flights on it when I decided to plant the airplane in the
> ground. Based on my experience with it, I wouldn't hesitate to try one again
> in the future. I mostly used the APC 20x15 prop.
>
> Emory Schroeter.
>
>
>  On Sep 25, 2008, at 1:30 PM, Anthony Romano wrote:
>
>  Hi Mike,
> Are you sure on that prop size?
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> From: kerlock at comcast.net
> To: aabdu at sbcglobal.net; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:59:16 -0400
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
>
>
> Ok, some in depth answers.
>
> We did in fact test this motor last season on a Black Magic V2, flying
> masters. We used the HXT 63-64B 230kv motor. We used a CC HV85 controller,
> Tanic and vampower packs.
>
> Power is certainly not a problem for this motor. It is fairly comparable to
> the AXI. 2700 watts, 82 amps, 6200 RPM on an APC 20x14. the motor never got
> over 110 degrees.
>
> Longevity: we got well over 100 flights on it before the plane was lost, no
> problems whatsoever. This was using Esprit stand off mounts as well, o nose
> mounting.
>
> No can issues, nothing, it just delivered. your results may vary of course.
> These are "cheap" chinese motors and you do not have the support structure
> in place like the name brands. but considering you can buy almost 4 of them
> for the price of one AXI, it's pretty interesting.
>
> I've run a lot of these chinese motors and maybe I'm just lucky, but I just
> don't have problems. I keep hearing about problems with darned near
> everything, including name brand stuff, and the only issue we've run into
> yet was a very early bearing failure with an AXI...that's all. Ever.
>
> I have yet to install one of these on a VF3, and wonder about it because by
> it's very nature you will have to use more power to fly it. I realize 82
> amps is a lot, but the packs never got warm, nor did the speed control or
> motor, so who knows.
>
> in short, if this is your first forray into electrics of this size, you
> would probably be better off with the AXI just from the standpoint of
> support. But so far I can't find a thing wrong with this motor, or else I am
> just that lucky (and THAT is highly unlikely, trust me!)
>
> -Mike
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>
> *To:* General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> *Sent:* Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:04 PM
> *Subject:* [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
>
>   As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come
> across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230
> is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+) with
> very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact,
> according to the info I saw it is even 12 grams lighter.
>
> Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn
> out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like
> bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good
> value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A
> pattern?
>
> I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those
> who have used them or seen them run.
>
> Thanks a bunch
> Anthony
>
>
> *
>
> E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (5.5.1.322)
> Database version: 5.10780e
> http://www.pctools.com/spyware-doctor/<http://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor/>
> *
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
>
> E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (5.5.1.322)
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>
>
>
> *
>
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> Database version: 5.10780e
> http://www.pctools.com/spyware-doctor/<http://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor/>
> *
> ------------------------------
> Stay up to date on your PC, the Web, and your mobile phone with Windows
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>  _______________________________________________
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> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing listNSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.orghttp://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
>
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From mjfrederick at cox.net  Fri Sep 26 23:01:31 2008
From: mjfrederick at cox.net (Matthew Frederick)
Date: Sat, 27 Sep 2008 07:01:31 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Contest Results
References: <2c94dd7d0809261114p16520199m813f552250a9100c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <123C71F69B614288A5B8E2CCDDAF59A3@Mattmobile>

Well... Shame on you for taking so long anyway...

Just playing, I know what it's like...

Matt
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Don Ramsey 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Friday, September 26, 2008 1:14 PM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Contest Results


  Results for the North Dallas Pattern Classic is available on pages.suddenlink.net/donramsey    

  Sorry for the delay but I still don't have internet from effects of the hurricane.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Sat Sep 27 05:02:49 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Sat, 27 Sep 2008 13:02:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Gulf Coast Pattern Championship !!!!
Message-ID: <20080927080245.7FQ6Q.410379.root@Web03>

HI All,

I just wanted to remind everyone in D6 that the GCPC will be held as scheduled in Sulphur LA next weekend.  The field will be open all week but "officially" open for practice on Friday - The weather here this weekend is FABULOUS!  I hope that it holds for next weekend.  

Link to flyer:

http://www.larksrc.org/GCPC.htm

Link to Map:

http://www.larksrc.org/MAP.htm

There are many more hotels in the area than are listed on the flyer, so please let me know if you are having trouble finding accomodations.  

I'm looking forward to seeing everyone again!

George

From mups1953 at yahoo.com  Sat Sep 27 05:42:21 2008
From: mups1953 at yahoo.com (mike mueller)
Date: Sat, 27 Sep 2008 13:42:21 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
In-Reply-To: <72f9ee7c0809262030x22dd14b2h35434e262533c001@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87424.81350.qm@web51011.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

?Anthony my experience is consistent with Scotts observations. I really think the AXI F3a is the best bang for the buck in E. pattern. Mine was so reliable this last season that I never had to one think to it in over 200 flights plus if you did have a problem with it Hobby Lobby would replace it. At $280 your well served and the power they deliver is impressive. Mike

--- On Fri, 9/26/08, Scott Pavlock <f3aflyer7 at gmail.com> wrote:

From: Scott Pavlock <f3aflyer7 at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Friday, September 26, 2008, 10:30 PM



Anthony,

My experience with generic brand, cheaper motors has shown a lot about how different manufacturers use various techniques to cut costs, and how it severely reduces the quality of the product. From an economic standpoint, it's impossible for two manufacturers to sell two supposedly identical products at such a large price difference. The only way this is possible is to increase the quantity sold, and I'm sure AXI sells more motors than HXT.

In performance testing both in the air and on a dyno, the generic brand almost always under performs fairly severely. This is usually a result of poor workmanship and poorly selected or out of date materials. There is a large difference in the metal that comes from China, and the metal that comes from Japan. The material costs to make an electric motor are fairly low because they can be bought in bulk and are readily accessable. Name brand motors tend to use quality materials, but more importantly, use higher quality labor where much of the costs to make the motor are incurred. This not only produces a quality motor, but unit to unit reliability.

Many people use generic motors because they boast the same (in some cases better) numbers, for a fraction of the cost. Some end up with an up to standard motor and end up pretty happy with their purchase. But many also end up with a motor that performs marginal at best, or maybe not at all, without product replacement or product support. Motors can and will fail, and is the one component that has the capability to destroy both the ESC and the battery in one violent 500A burst. And one way to help prevent this it is to use a high quality system.

In the long run, you will be much happier with a name brand motor, regardless of wether you are just getting started or have been using electrics for years. The same goes for the batteries and ESC.

Scott



On Fri, Sep 26, 2008 at 12:17 PM, <schroetere at bellsouth.net> wrote:




Hey Anthony,
?
I am using the Castle Creations HV85 and a mix of Tanic and Vampower batteries. I haven't used a Jeti, but I'm sure it would do well also. My packs are between 4500-5000 mah flying the masters pattern.
?
Emory.
-------------- Original message from Anthony Abdullah <aabdu at sbcglobal.net>: -------------- 






Emory,
What ESC and battery did you use with that. Is the Jeti spin 99 still the right choice for that motor?

Thanks for the info.
--- On Fri, 9/26/08, Emory Schroeter <schroetere at bellsouth.net> wrote:

From: Emory Schroeter <schroetere at bellsouth.net>

Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Date: Friday, September 26, 2008, 8:08 AM





Hey Anthony, 


>From my experience, I was amazed at how well the HXT motor performed. I don't remember the stats exactly, but they were very close to the performance I was seeing with the AXI. I believe it was slightly less efficient (maybe 2 more amps drawn) and had about 200 less RPM than the AXI. Like someone mentioned, I kept waiting for it to fail, but it didn't. I had well over 100 flights on it when I decided to plant the airplane in the ground. Based on my experience with it, I wouldn't?hesitate?to try one again in the future. I mostly used the APC 20x15 prop.


Emory Schroeter.





On Sep 25, 2008, at 1:30 PM, Anthony Romano wrote:


Hi Mike,
Are you sure on that prop size?





From:?kerlock at comcast.net
To:?aabdu at sbcglobal.net;?nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 12:59:16 -0400
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors



Ok, some in depth answers.
?
We did in fact test this motor last season on a Black Magic V2, flying masters. We used the HXT 63-64B 230kv motor. We used a CC HV85 controller, Tanic and vampower packs.
?
Power is certainly not a problem for this motor. It is fairly comparable to the AXI. 2700 watts, 82 amps, 6200 RPM on an APC 20x14. the motor never got over 110 degrees.
?
Longevity: we got well over 100 flights on it before the plane was lost, no problems whatsoever. This was using Esprit stand off mounts as well, o nose mounting.
?
No can issues, nothing, it just delivered. your results may vary of course. These are "cheap" chinese motors and you do not have the support structure in place like the name brands. but considering you can buy almost 4 of them for the price of one AXI, it's pretty interesting.
?
I've run a lot of these chinese motors and maybe I'm just lucky, but I just don't have problems. I keep hearing about problems with darned near everything, including name brand stuff, and the only issue we've run into yet was a very early bearing failure with an AXI...that's all. Ever.
?
I have yet to install one of these on a VF3, and wonder about it because by it's very nature you will have to use more power to fly it. I realize 82 amps is a lot, but the packs never got warm, nor did the speed control or motor, so who knows.
?
in short, if this is your first forray into electrics of this size, you would probably be better off with the AXI just from the standpoint of support. But so far I can't find a thing wrong with this motor, or else I am just that lucky (and THAT is highly unlikely, trust me!)
?
-Mike
?

----- Original Message -----
From:?Anthony Abdullah
To:?General pattern discussion
Sent:?Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:04 PM
Subject:?[NSRCA-discussion] E-Question HXT motors






As I am doing my research into the world of electric pattern I have come across the HXT line of electric motors. It appears that the HXT 63-64 B230 is a fraction of the cost of the comparable AXI motor ($60 vs.$200+)?with very similar performance numbers, physical dimensions, etc. In fact, according to the info?I saw?it is even 12 grams lighter.
?
Being a realist I have to ask the question; what's the catch? Will it burn out after three flights, does it run excessively hot, does it smell like bacon? I don't get it. Is it just a cheap Chinese knock off, a very good value, or both? What I really want to know is, is the motor viable for F3A pattern?
?
I appreciate any information you guys can provide, particularly from those who have used them or seen them run.
?
Thanks a bunch
Anthony




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From mwaustin54 at cox.net  Sat Sep 27 09:40:06 2008
From: mwaustin54 at cox.net (mwaustin54 at cox.net)
Date: Sat, 27 Sep 2008 17:40:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Fwd:  For Sale
Message-ID: <20080927134003.UWTR4.500386.imail@fed1rmwml35>

Engine and header or sold. Price reduced for the pipe and Hyde mount!!

OS Alum tuned pipe for OS 140RX excellent cond  - $ 75.00

Hyde "A" mount for OS 140  - 65.00

Mike Austin


> Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2008 21:53:42 -0400
> From: <mwaustin54 at cox.net>
> To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For Sale
> 
> I'll post this for anyone interested before going to RCU with it.
> 
> Low time OS 140RX  w/ Mintor 2 plug head & standard head included $275.00
> Mueller header for same motor - $25.00
> Hyde "A" mount for same motor - $75.00
> OS pipe- excellent condition - $ 85.00
> Package deal for  450.00 !!
> 
> Be happy to provide pics and info if interested.
> 
> Email me anytime.
> 
> Mike Austin
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From jeff at priusonline.com  Sat Sep 27 14:38:19 2008
From: jeff at priusonline.com (Jeff Hatton)
Date: Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:38:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Test
Message-ID: <F9332498-9C69-40CA-AD0A-3C1C8BE96BF2@priusonline.com>

Ignore

- Jeff Hatton

From iflyrc24 at gmail.com  Sat Sep 27 15:21:39 2008
From: iflyrc24 at gmail.com (iflyrc24 at gmail.com)
Date: Sat, 27 Sep 2008 23:21:39 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Test
Message-ID: <714841397-1222557693-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1422783371-@bxe259.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>

Works here.
Dowayne
------Original Message------
From: Jeff Hatton
Sender: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
To: NSRCA Mailing List
ReplyTo: General pattern discussion
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Test
Sent: Sep 27, 2008 6:38 PM

Ignore

- Jeff Hatton
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
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Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

From mjfrederick at cox.net  Sat Sep 27 20:03:30 2008
From: mjfrederick at cox.net (Matthew Frederick)
Date: Sun, 28 Sep 2008 04:03:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Gulf Coast Pattern Championship !!!!
References: <20080927080245.7FQ6Q.410379.root@Web03>
Message-ID: <7941E656651541DA98262C27D4559304@Mattmobile>

Wish I could make it, George, but unfortunately I've only got one flight on 
my Patriot so far. I'll be at Crowley, though!

Matt
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net>
To: "NSRCA List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Saturday, September 27, 2008 8:02 AM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Gulf Coast Pattern Championship !!!!


> HI All,
>
> I just wanted to remind everyone in D6 that the GCPC will be held as 
> scheduled in Sulphur LA next weekend.  The field will be open all week but 
> "officially" open for practice on Friday - The weather here this weekend 
> is FABULOUS!  I hope that it holds for next weekend.
>
> Link to flyer:
>
> http://www.larksrc.org/GCPC.htm
>
> Link to Map:
>
> http://www.larksrc.org/MAP.htm
>
> There are many more hotels in the area than are listed on the flyer, so 
> please let me know if you are having trouble finding accomodations.
>
> I'm looking forward to seeing everyone again!
>
> George
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Sun Sep 28 02:36:33 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Sun, 28 Sep 2008 10:36:33 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Fw: Wistmodel Prestige for sale
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV387506CE1FAB4CAB3AEFBE8410@phx.gbl>

Just posted to RCU

http://www.rcuniverse.com/market/item.cfm?itemid=437793&electric=0

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From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Sun Sep 28 04:49:41 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Sun, 28 Sep 2008 12:49:41 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Gulf Coast Pattern Championship !!!!
In-Reply-To: <7941E656651541DA98262C27D4559304@Mattmobile>
Message-ID: <20080928074937.274QP.430418.root@Web04>

Mathew, 

I'm sorry that you can't make it. I'll see you in Crowley for sure.

G
---- Matthew Frederick <mjfrederick at cox.net> wrote: 

=============
Wish I could make it, George, but unfortunately I've only got one flight on 
my Patriot so far. I'll be at Crowley, though!

Matt
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net>
To: "NSRCA List" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Saturday, September 27, 2008 8:02 AM
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Gulf Coast Pattern Championship !!!!


> HI All,
>
> I just wanted to remind everyone in D6 that the GCPC will be held as 
> scheduled in Sulphur LA next weekend.  The field will be open all week but 
> "officially" open for practice on Friday - The weather here this weekend 
> is FABULOUS!  I hope that it holds for next weekend.
>
> Link to flyer:
>
> http://www.larksrc.org/GCPC.htm
>
> Link to Map:
>
> http://www.larksrc.org/MAP.htm
>
> There are many more hotels in the area than are listed on the flyer, so 
> please let me know if you are having trouble finding accomodations.
>
> I'm looking forward to seeing everyone again!
>
> George
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 

_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


From jlachow at hotmail.com  Sun Sep 28 08:53:28 2008
From: jlachow at hotmail.com (Joe Lachowski)
Date: Sun, 28 Sep 2008 16:53:28 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Revised for Sale List
Message-ID: <BAY101-W21E4AB937AF85F4007F92BBB410@phx.gbl>

Here is a bunch of stuff I have for sale.  Anything under $25.00 single or in combination, you pay for shipping. 
 Contact me off list.
 
O.S. 140 RX, excellent running shape - $275.00
 
2 used NMP Li-Ion Chargers($32) - $25.00 for both
Tru-Turn Spinner 3? FAI 120 Slot, 2bl new - $25.00
TT-0825-A 8X1.25mm &  8mm bushing($8.95) - $4.50
Central Hobbies Nose Ring f/OS140($12.95) ? 6.50
Hobbico Exhaust Deflector 60-270size) - $1.00
OS #8 plug - $4.00
OS Type F plugs qty of 3 - $12.00
K&B 1L plugs qty of 6 - $20.00
Central Hobbies NMPTW2 tail wheel assembly($24.95) - $12.50
Tettra Crank Tank 580cc(20 oz)($12.95) - $6.50
Tettra Crank Tank 460cc(16 oz) ($11.95)- two available at $6.00
Hayes 16 oz fuel tank - $3.00
Dubro 20 oz fuel tank - $3.00
 
50 plus assorted wheels of various sizes - $25.00
 
 
 
OS  1.40 RX parts
 
72102100 140RX Header you get one NIP, 3 used and a life time supply of Viton O-Rings - $50.00
22681980  140RX Needle($9.49) - $7.00
29403200  140RX Piston($58.00) - $45.00
294034000 140RX Piston Ring($26.99) - $20.00
29431000/29430010 EFI Bearing Set($44.98) - $35.00
GPMQ4588 Great Planes Spinner Adapter f/140RX($4.49) - $3.00
71703009 In-flight control needle valve($31.99) (have 2) - $20.00 each
28282000 Remote Needle Valve Assembly($36.99) - $25.00
MACS 4745 2.25? rise Header f/140RX($37.99) - $25.00
2841400 RX Gasket Set($5.49) - $4.00
45508200 RX Woodruff Key($3.59)(have 2) - $2.50 each
27517000 Piston Pin Retainer($2.69)(have 2 sets) - $2.00 each
71531000 OS Non-Bubble Weight(Clunk)($15.99)(have 3) - $10.00 each
26711305 Ratchet Spring ($2.09) - $1.00
_________________________________________________________________
Want to do more with Windows Live? Learn ?10 hidden secrets? from Jamie.
http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008
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From ed_alt at hotmail.com  Sun Sep 28 14:05:02 2008
From: ed_alt at hotmail.com (Ed Alt)
Date: Sun, 28 Sep 2008 22:05:02 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Keystone Indoor Electric Fly and F3P contest
Message-ID: <BAY135-DAV1421A68F3DF4000CF6928E8410@phx.gbl>

All the details posted to RCU.  

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_7999314/anchors_7999314/mpage_1/key_/anchor/tm.htm#7999314

This is going to be fun!  Hope to see many of you there.

Ed
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From jlachow at hotmail.com  Sun Sep 28 14:40:48 2008
From: jlachow at hotmail.com (Joe Lachowski)
Date: Sun, 28 Sep 2008 22:40:48 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Revised for Sale List
In-Reply-To: <BAY101-W21E4AB937AF85F4007F92BBB410@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY101-W21E4AB937AF85F4007F92BBB410@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY101-W17C1BB6C4FD967123A758FBB410@phx.gbl>

Items marked below indicate those that have been sold

From: jlachow at hotmail.comTo: dist1 at nsrca.org; nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgDate: Sun, 28 Sep 2008 12:53:24 -0400Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Revised for Sale List



Here is a bunch of stuff I have for sale.  Anything under $25.00 single or in combination, you pay for shipping. 
 Contact me off list.
 
O.S. 140 RX, excellent running shape - $275.00
 
2 used NMP Li-Ion Chargers($32) - $25.00 for both
Tru-Turn Spinner 3? FAI 120 Slot, 2bl new - $25.00 SOLD
TT-0825-A 8X1.25mm &  8mm bushing($8.95) - $4.50
Central Hobbies Nose Ring f/OS140($12.95) ? 6.50 SOLD
Hobbico Exhaust Deflector 60-270size) - $1.00
OS #8 plug - $4.00 SOLD
OS Type F plugs qty of 3 - $12.00 SOLD
K&B 1L plugs qty of 6 - $20.00 SOLD
Central Hobbies NMPTW2 tail wheel assembly($24.95) - $12.50
Tettra Crank Tank 580cc(20 oz)($12.95) - $6.50 SOLD
Tettra Crank Tank 460cc(16 oz) ($11.95)- two available at $6.00 SOLD
Hayes 16 oz fuel tank - $3.00
Dubro 20 oz fuel tank - $3.00
 
50 plus assorted wheels of various sizes - $25.00
 
 
 
OS  1.40 RX parts
 
72102100 140RX Header you get one NIP, 3 used and a life time supply of Viton O-Rings - $50.00
22681980  140RX Needle($9.49) - $7.00
29403200  140RX Piston($58.00) - $45.00
294034000 140RX Piston Ring($26.99) - $20.00
29431000/29430010 EFI Bearing Set($44.98) - $35.00
GPMQ4588 Great Planes Spinner Adapter f/140RX($4.49) - $3.00
71703009 In-flight control needle valve($31.99) (have 2) - $20.00 each BOTH SOLD
28282000 Remote Needle Valve Assembly($36.99) - $25.00
MACS 4745 2.25? rise Header f/140RX($37.99) - $25.00
2841400 RX Gasket Set($5.49) - $4.00
45508200 RX Woodruff Key($3.59)(have 2) - $2.50 each
27517000 Piston Pin Retainer($2.69)(have 2 sets) - $2.00 each
71531000 OS Non-Bubble Weight(Clunk)($15.99)(have 3) - $10.00 each
26711305 Ratchet Spring ($2.09) - $1.00

Want to do more with Windows Live? Learn ?10 hidden secrets? from Jamie. Learn Now 
_________________________________________________________________
Stay up to date on your PC, the Web, and your mobile phone with Windows Live.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093185mrt/direct/01/
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Sun Sep 28 14:43:46 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Sun, 28 Sep 2008 22:43:46 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Memorial pics and results
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV1421A68F3DF4000CF6928E8410@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNMELOCNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

also on RCU

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_7966921/tm.htm

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com



No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
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1:30 PM
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From lagrue at hotmail.com  Sun Sep 28 15:24:16 2008
From: lagrue at hotmail.com (JEREMY CHINN)
Date: Sun, 28 Sep 2008 23:24:16 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Keystone Indoor Electric Fly and F3P contest
In-Reply-To: <BAY135-DAV1421A68F3DF4000CF6928E8410@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY135-DAV1421A68F3DF4000CF6928E8410@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BLU141-W4431F8979307C629367A6FC7410@phx.gbl>


Awesome to see some Indoor Pattern stuff on the list!!! Thanks for posting that Ed. 
 
 



From: ed_alt at hotmail.comTo: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.orgDate: Sun, 28 Sep 2008 17:05:08 -0500Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Keystone Indoor Electric Fly and F3P contest



All the details posted to RCU.  
 
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_7999314/anchors_7999314/mpage_1/key_/anchor/tm.htm#7999314
 
This is going to be fun!  Hope to see many of you there.
 
Ed
_________________________________________________________________
Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows Live.
http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008
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From jonlowe at aol.com  Sun Sep 28 15:52:06 2008
From: jonlowe at aol.com (Jon Lowe)
Date: Sun, 28 Sep 2008 23:52:06 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Memorial pics and results
Message-ID: <c22.480d42a2.3611729e@aol.com>

Damn you, we are still driving home!  Great contest though.

Jon Lowe

-----Original Message-----
From: JShulman <jshulman at cfl.rr.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 28, 2008 5:44 PM
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] OJ Memorial pics and results

also on RCU
?
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_7966921/tm.htm
?
Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com
?=
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From warrior523 at mchsi.com  Sun Sep 28 17:38:30 2008
From: warrior523 at mchsi.com (Dan)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 01:38:30 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] BCRC Contest
Message-ID: <000c01c921d4$10488020$6500a8c0@warrior>

Just a quick note to give a great big thank you to Todd Schmidt and the Bourbon County RC club for hosting another superb contest this weekend past.  Large attendance, huge hospitality and perfect weather.  Add in some stiff competition and you end up with a truly great weekend.

Thanks to Todd and all the club members.

All ready looking forward to next year.

Dan
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From vicenterc at comcast.net  Sun Sep 28 17:51:44 2008
From: vicenterc at comcast.net (vicenterc at comcast.net)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 01:51:44 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] BCRC Contest
Message-ID: <092920080151.15169.48E034AA00007EDF00003B4122155688840C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>

I agree 100%.  It was a great contest and we had a great weekend.  I am also planing to attend next year.  

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: "Dan" <warrior523 at mchsi.com> 

Just a quick note to give a great big thank you to Todd Schmidt and the Bourbon County RC club for hosting another superb contest this weekend past.  Large attendance, huge hospitality and perfect weather.  Add in some stiff competition and you end up with a truly great weekend.

Thanks to Todd and all the club members.

All ready looking forward to next year.

Dan
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From: "Dan" <warrior523 at mchsi.com>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] BCRC Contest
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 01:39:07 +0000
Size: 691
URL: <http://lists.nsrca.org/pipermail/nsrca-discussion/attachments/20080929/591eb323/attachment.mht>

From steveandlaurel at valornet.com  Sun Sep 28 18:02:07 2008
From: steveandlaurel at valornet.com (Steve Ford)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 02:02:07 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] BCRC Contest
References: <092920080151.15169.48E034AA00007EDF00003B4122155688840C9D0A9B020A0C0790@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <99C5BE47B2C7462384668A0EEBA837B9@Home>

The Bourbon Barrel was a great time, thanks to Todd and the club members.

Steve Ford
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: vicenterc at comcast.net 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Sunday, September 28, 2008 8:51 PM
  Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] BCRC Contest


  I agree 100%.  It was a great contest and we had a great weekend.  I am also planing to attend next year.  

  --
  Vicente "Vince" Bortone

    -------------- Original message -------------- 
    From: "Dan" <warrior523 at mchsi.com> 

    Just a quick note to give a great big thank you to Todd Schmidt and the Bourbon County RC club for hosting another superb contest this weekend past.  Large attendance, huge hospitality and perfect weather.  Add in some stiff competition and you end up with a truly great weekend.

    Thanks to Todd and all the club members.

    All ready looking forward to next year.

    Dan


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From 1shinden at att.net  Mon Sep 29 05:56:14 2008
From: 1shinden at att.net (Mike Howard)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 13:56:14 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] BCRC Contest
Message-ID: <739087.97919.qm@web81103.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Great contest, Great weather, Club members support was great,? I guess I just had a GREAT time, See ya there next year Todd.


Mike



----- Original Message ----
From: Steve Ford <steveandlaurel at valornet.com>
To: General pattern discussion <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 28, 2008 9:02:04 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] BCRC Contest


The Bourbon Barrel was a great time, thanks to Todd and the club members.
?
Steve Ford
----- Original Message ----- 
From: vicenterc at comcast.net 
To: General pattern discussion 
Sent: Sunday, September 28, 2008 8:51 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] BCRC Contest

I agree 100%.? It was a great contest and we had a great weekend.? I am also planing to attend next year.? 

--
Vicente "Vince" Bortone

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: "Dan" <warrior523 at mchsi.com> 

Just a quick note to give a great big thank you to Todd Schmidt and the Bourbon County RC club for hosting another superb contest this weekend past.? Large attendance, huge hospitality and perfect weather.? Add in some stiff competition and you end up with a truly great weekend.
?
Thanks to Todd and all the club members.
?
All ready looking forward to next year.
?
Dan
________________________________
_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 
________________________________
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From flyintexan at att.net  Mon Sep 29 06:06:41 2008
From: flyintexan at att.net (Mark Hunt)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 14:06:41 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] todd schmidt
Message-ID: <112053.24204.qm@web80707.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Looking for Todd.

Please email me privately:
flyintexan at att.net


-mark
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Mon Sep 29 08:01:26 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 16:01:26 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Arturo
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNKENACNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

Email me please

BTW: Final scores are posted on the Jax thread

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com 
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.5/1697 - Release Date: 9/29/2008 7:40 AM



From Lisandro.Zapata at rsandh.com  Mon Sep 29 08:58:02 2008
From: Lisandro.Zapata at rsandh.com (Zapata, Lisandro Arturo)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 16:58:02 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Arturo
In-Reply-To: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNKENACNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNKENACNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
Message-ID: <BF4A0C4C60DBFC4BACA96CD4557D7BD90A41C14C@RSHJAXVEXCH01.rsandh.com>

Hello,

Thanks for the email, I checked this morning and still I am in the last
place :(   LOL

Anyway, whenever you're are ready send me the files and I will work on
them

Arturo

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of JShulman
Sent: Monday, September 29, 2008 12:02 PM
To: NSRCA
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Arturo

Email me please

BTW: Final scores are posted on the Jax thread

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com 
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.5/1697 - Release Date:
9/29/2008 7:40 AM


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Mon Sep 29 09:17:11 2008
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 17:17:11 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D2 Championships
Message-ID: <FEED1AF81582435DA6BFD72B23BF8215@jaysdesktop>

When and where? One site says Lake City, the other Woodruff.

 

Jay Marshall 

 

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From Lisandro.Zapata at rsandh.com  Mon Sep 29 09:29:16 2008
From: Lisandro.Zapata at rsandh.com (Zapata, Lisandro Arturo)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 17:29:16 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Arturo
In-Reply-To: <BF4A0C4C60DBFC4BACA96CD4557D7BD90A41C14C@RSHJAXVEXCH01.rsandh.com>
References: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNKENACNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>
	<BF4A0C4C60DBFC4BACA96CD4557D7BD90A41C14C@RSHJAXVEXCH01.rsandh.com>
Message-ID: <BF4A0C4C60DBFC4BACA96CD4557D7BD90A41C1CA@RSHJAXVEXCH01.rsandh.com>

Sorry, this email was meant to be private, but if any of you have the
schedules in excel, that will help me a lot.

Arturo

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Zapata,
Lisandro Arturo
Sent: Monday, September 29, 2008 12:58 PM
To: General pattern discussion
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Arturo

Hello,

Thanks for the email, I checked this morning and still I am in the last
place :(   LOL

Anyway, whenever you're are ready send me the files and I will work on
them

Arturo

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of JShulman
Sent: Monday, September 29, 2008 12:02 PM
To: NSRCA
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Arturo

Email me please

BTW: Final scores are posted on the Jax thread

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com 
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.5/1697 - Release Date:
9/29/2008 7:40 AM


_______________________________________________
NSRCA-discussion mailing list
NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
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From jshulman at cfl.rr.com  Mon Sep 29 12:18:49 2008
From: jshulman at cfl.rr.com (JShulman)
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2008 20:18:49 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Interesting reading
Message-ID: <PKEJKIOCAGMLLNFJCJNNGENICNAA.jshulman@cfl.rr.com>

This was posted in one of our local clubs newsletters... never knew.


Most Futaba battery packs and individual Sanyo
battery cells (which most OEM radio manufacturers
use) have a two-letter date code stamped somewhere
on the pack or cell. The first letter of the code is the
year of manufacture and the second letter is the month
of manufacture. 1996=A, 1997=B, 1998=C, etc.
January=A, February=B, March=C, etc. If you have a
battery or pack with a date code of IB, it was
manufactured in February of 2004.

Regards,
Jason
www.jasonshulman.com 
www.shulmanaviation.com
www.composite-arf.com

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG. 
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.5/1697 - Release Date: 9/29/2008 7:40 AM



From cjm767driver at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 29 16:02:25 2008
From: cjm767driver at hotmail.com (chris moon)
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 00:02:25 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D2 Championships
Message-ID: <BLU137-W210EAAAB45DCDF3375538B83430@phx.gbl>


Jay,  Last email I got from Blaire and confirmed by Ryan is Oct 18-19 at 
Lake City

Chris

Jay Marshall wrote:
>
> When and where? One site says Lake City, the other Woodruff.
>
> */Jay Marshall/*
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


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From lightfoot at sc.rr.com  Mon Sep 29 16:53:50 2008
From: lightfoot at sc.rr.com (Jay Marshall)
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 00:53:50 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D2 Championships
In-Reply-To: <BLU137-W210EAAAB45DCDF3375538B83430@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <B977DB85C8974399ADE3B44C0FAF6166@jaysdesktop>

Thanks. The NSRCA calendar still had it at Woodruff but the D2 calendar said
Lake City. There are, however, two consecutive contests scheduled for Lake
City.

 

Jay Marshall 

-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of chris moon
Sent: Monday, September 29, 2008 8:02 PM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D2 Championships

 

Jay, Last email I got from Blaire and confirmed by Ryan is Oct 18-19 at 
Lake City

Chris

Jay Marshall wrote:
>
> When and where? One site says Lake City, the other Woodruff.
>
> */Jay Marshall/*
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion



  _____  

Stay up to date on your PC, the Web, and your mobile phone with Windows
Live. See Now <http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093185mrt/direct/01/>


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From patternrules at yahoo.com  Mon Sep 29 19:57:47 2008
From: patternrules at yahoo.com (Steven Maxwell)
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 03:57:47 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] For Sale Axi 5320/28
Message-ID: <982533.25252.qm@web58406.mail.re3.yahoo.com>

?Comes with 3 18X12? and one 19X12 props used last year great shape.? $185 shipped USPS priority mail.
?
Steve Maxwell


      
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From bob at toprudder.com  Tue Sep 30 03:21:13 2008
From: bob at toprudder.com (Robert Richards)
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 11:21:13 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D2 Championships
In-Reply-To: <B977DB85C8974399ADE3B44C0FAF6166@jaysdesktop>
Message-ID: <440242.78940.qm@web1104.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>

The last time I checked (a month ago??) there were conflicting dates depending on which website I checked.  The last I heard, the Oct 18-19 dates were going to be changed to either Oct 25-26 or Oct 11-12. I think Ryan was leaning towards Oct 25-26. Maybe they decided to stick to the original date.
   
  Bob R.
  

Jay Marshall <lightfoot at sc.rr.com> wrote:
                Thanks. The NSRCA calendar still had it at Woodruff but the D2 calendar said Lake City. There are, however, two consecutive contests scheduled for Lake City.
   
    Jay Marshall 

  -----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of chris moon
Sent: Monday, September 29, 2008 8:02 PM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D2 Championships
   
  Jay, Last email I got from Blaire and confirmed by Ryan is Oct 18-19 at 
Lake City

Chris

Jay Marshall wrote:
>
> When and where? One site says Lake City, the other Woodruff.
>
> */Jay Marshall/*
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion


    
---------------------------------
  
  Stay up to date on your PC, the Web, and your mobile phone with Windows Live. See Now

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From timsautopro at yahoo.com  Tue Sep 30 07:48:19 2008
From: timsautopro at yahoo.com (Tim Taylor)
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 15:48:19 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D2 Championships
In-Reply-To: <440242.78940.qm@web1104.biz.mail.sk1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <479260.28886.qm@web62304.mail.re1.yahoo.com>

I talked to Blaire and the Lake City club and the dates are Oct 18-19 at the Lake City field.

--- On Tue, 9/30/08, Robert Richards <bob at toprudder.com> wrote:

From: Robert Richards <bob at toprudder.com>
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D2 Championships
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>, nsrca-dist2 at lists.nsrca.org, "Ryan Smith" <smaragdz at bellsouth.net>
Date: Tuesday, September 30, 2008, 7:21 AM



The last time I checked (a month ago??) there were conflicting dates depending on which website I?checked.? The last I heard, the Oct 18-19 dates were going to be changed to either Oct 25-26 or Oct 11-12. I think Ryan was leaning towards Oct 25-26. Maybe they decided to stick to the original date.
?
Bob R.


Jay Marshall <lightfoot at sc.rr.com> wrote:




Thanks. The NSRCA calendar still had it at Woodruff but the D2 calendar said Lake City. There are, however, two consecutive contests scheduled for Lake City.
?

Jay Marshall 
-----Original Message-----
From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of chris moon
Sent: Monday, September 29, 2008 8:02 PM
To: nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] D2 Championships
?
Jay, Last email I got from Blaire and confirmed by Ryan is Oct 18-19 at 
Lake City

Chris

Jay Marshall wrote:
>
> When and where? One site says Lake City, the other Woodruff.
>
> */Jay Marshall/*
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion





Stay up to date on your PC, the Web, and your mobile phone with Windows Live. See Now_______________________________________________
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http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From humptybump at sbcglobal.net  Tue Sep 30 07:59:53 2008
From: humptybump at sbcglobal.net (Richard Lewis)
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 15:59:53 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited for this
	one...
Message-ID: <727007.63004.qm@web83107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Wow -?Should be?an incredible October weekend for flying.
?
Myself, Mark H, and my Dad plan on camping at the field Friday and Saturday.
?
I understand that their facilities were damaged by Ike, but there's plenty of shed left and the clubhouse was unscathed.
?
I hope the turnout is good for this one..I hope the Crowley/BR boys have the?stones to show up..:)
?
Richard Lewis
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From smaragdz at bellsouth.net  Tue Sep 30 08:09:43 2008
From: smaragdz at bellsouth.net (Ryan Smith)
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 16:09:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] D2 Championships
Message-ID: <093020081609.19047.48E24F430002B94A00004A6722230682229B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF960B090E9D0E039C@att.net>

Hey guys,

The date has been set for the 18th and 19th of October at the Lake City field. I truly apologize for the confusion that has come about from all of this, but after some discussion, this was chosen as the best date overall. Please mark your calendars as this is the final date. I look forward to seeing everyone there! If you have not been to the Lake City field before, it's a great venue and there are power hookups for campers. There is a shower and an indoor restroom on site as well.

Regards,

Ryan
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From mjfrederick at cox.net  Tue Sep 30 14:15:57 2008
From: mjfrederick at cox.net (Matthew Frederick)
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 22:15:57 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited for
	thisone...
References: <727007.63004.qm@web83107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <7269FB846C6B40618E66232D4F793847@Mattmobile>

I don't know if any of us BR boys are coming. Maybe Jim. I might come, but I doubt it. I just got my Patriot up and running, and only have one flight on it. Other than that, I haven't flown since March when my Genesis went in.

Matt
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Richard Lewis 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 10:59 AM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited for thisone...


  Wow - Should be an incredible October weekend for flying.



  Myself, Mark H, and my Dad plan on camping at the field Friday and Saturday.



  I understand that their facilities were damaged by Ike, but there's plenty of shed left and the clubhouse was unscathed.



  I hope the turnout is good for this one..I hope the Crowley/BR boys have the stones to show up..:)



  Richard Lewis



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
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From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Tue Sep 30 15:00:43 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 23:00:43 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited for
 thisone...
In-Reply-To: <7269FB846C6B40618E66232D4F793847@Mattmobile>
Message-ID: <20080930180040.KKRZ2.126521.root@Web01>

Come on over Matthew!  You can trim it out Saturday morning!

G
---- Matthew Frederick <mjfrederick at cox.net> wrote: 

=============
I don't know if any of us BR boys are coming. Maybe Jim. I might come, but I doubt it. I just got my Patriot up and running, and only have one flight on it. Other than that, I haven't flown since March when my Genesis went in.

Matt
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Richard Lewis 
  To: General pattern discussion 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 10:59 AM
  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited for thisone...


  Wow - Should be an incredible October weekend for flying.



  Myself, Mark H, and my Dad plan on camping at the field Friday and Saturday.



  I understand that their facilities were damaged by Ike, but there's plenty of shed left and the clubhouse was unscathed.



  I hope the turnout is good for this one..I hope the Crowley/BR boys have the stones to show up..:)



  Richard Lewis



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion

From flyintexan at att.net  Tue Sep 30 15:06:45 2008
From: flyintexan at att.net (Mark Hunt)
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 23:06:45 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited for
	thisone...
References: <20080930180040.KKRZ2.126521.root@Web01>
Message-ID: <4D69C54270DC48ACA3637D7F34639CD4@MARK>

Get there Friday afternoon and we'll all trim on it!

-Mark


----- Original Message ----- 
From: <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 6:00 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited for 
thisone...


> Come on over Matthew!  You can trim it out Saturday morning!
>
> G
> ---- Matthew Frederick <mjfrederick at cox.net> wrote:
>
> =============
> I don't know if any of us BR boys are coming. Maybe Jim. I might come, but 
> I doubt it. I just got my Patriot up and running, and only have one flight 
> on it. Other than that, I haven't flown since March when my Genesis went 
> in.
>
> Matt
>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>  From: Richard Lewis
>  To: General pattern discussion
>  Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 10:59 AM
>  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited for 
> thisone...
>
>
>  Wow - Should be an incredible October weekend for flying.
>
>
>
>  Myself, Mark H, and my Dad plan on camping at the field Friday and 
> Saturday.
>
>
>
>  I understand that their facilities were damaged by Ike, but there's 
> plenty of shed left and the clubhouse was unscathed.
>
>
>
>  I hope the turnout is good for this one..I hope the Crowley/BR boys have 
> the stones to show up..:)
>
>
>
>  Richard Lewis
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>  _______________________________________________
>  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion 


From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Tue Sep 30 15:08:00 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 23:08:00 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited for
 this one...
In-Reply-To: <727007.63004.qm@web83107.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20080930180757.POV5S.126739.root@Web01>

Hey Richard!

We have the hurricane damage cleared away (though not repaired)  All is go for the weekend.  The weather looks absolutely FABULOUS!   We have plenty of canopy left and the electricity is OK at the field....I'm glad to hear that your Dad is back in the air!  Did he ever find the missing plane?

See ya this weekend!

George
---- Richard Lewis <humptybump at sbcglobal.net> wrote: 

=============
Wow -?Should be?an incredible October weekend for flying.
?
Myself, Mark H, and my Dad plan on camping at the field Friday and Saturday.
?
I understand that their facilities were damaged by Ike, but there's plenty of shed left and the clubhouse was unscathed.
?
I hope the turnout is good for this one..I hope the Crowley/BR boys have the?stones to show up..:)
?
Richard Lewis

From mjfrederick at cox.net  Tue Sep 30 15:27:55 2008
From: mjfrederick at cox.net (Matthew Frederick)
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 23:27:55 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited
	forthisone...
References: <20080930180040.KKRZ2.126521.root@Web01>
	<4D69C54270DC48ACA3637D7F34639CD4@MARK>
Message-ID: <162A576156F0434593E639E2E9B68AF0@Mattmobile>

I dunno guys, it's very tempting. If I come, I'm gonna fly it the way it is. 
It's trimmed out good enough for intermediate already (heck, Jim was flying 
it the way it is in Masters). Unfortunately there are some minor issues that 
need to be taken care of structurally before real fine trimming can be done. 
OK, I'll make y'all a deal, if the engine parts I need get here by Thursday, 
I'll drive up Friday.

Matt
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mark Hunt" <flyintexan at att.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 6:12 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited 
forthisone...


> Get there Friday afternoon and we'll all trim on it!
>
> -Mark
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net>
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 6:00 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited 
> for thisone...
>
>
>> Come on over Matthew!  You can trim it out Saturday morning!
>>
>> G
>> ---- Matthew Frederick <mjfrederick at cox.net> wrote:
>>
>> =============
>> I don't know if any of us BR boys are coming. Maybe Jim. I might come, 
>> but I doubt it. I just got my Patriot up and running, and only have one 
>> flight on it. Other than that, I haven't flown since March when my 
>> Genesis went in.
>>
>> Matt
>>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>>  From: Richard Lewis
>>  To: General pattern discussion
>>  Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 10:59 AM
>>  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited for 
>> thisone...
>>
>>
>>  Wow - Should be an incredible October weekend for flying.
>>
>>
>>
>>  Myself, Mark H, and my Dad plan on camping at the field Friday and 
>> Saturday.
>>
>>
>>
>>  I understand that their facilities were damaged by Ike, but there's 
>> plenty of shed left and the clubhouse was unscathed.
>>
>>
>>
>>  I hope the turnout is good for this one..I hope the Crowley/BR boys have 
>> the stones to show up..:)
>>
>>
>>
>>  Richard Lewis
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 


From glmiller3 at suddenlink.net  Tue Sep 30 16:45:38 2008
From: glmiller3 at suddenlink.net (glmiller3 at suddenlink.net)
Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2008 00:45:38 -0000
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited
 forthisone...
In-Reply-To: <162A576156F0434593E639E2E9B68AF0@Mattmobile>
Message-ID: <20080930194536.P2089.495694.root@Web02>

We'll see ya then!
G
---- Matthew Frederick <mjfrederick at cox.net> wrote: 

=============
I dunno guys, it's very tempting. If I come, I'm gonna fly it the way it is. 
It's trimmed out good enough for intermediate already (heck, Jim was flying 
it the way it is in Masters). Unfortunately there are some minor issues that 
need to be taken care of structurally before real fine trimming can be done. 
OK, I'll make y'all a deal, if the engine parts I need get here by Thursday, 
I'll drive up Friday.

Matt
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mark Hunt" <flyintexan at att.net>
To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 6:12 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited 
forthisone...


> Get there Friday afternoon and we'll all trim on it!
>
> -Mark
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: <glmiller3 at suddenlink.net>
> To: "General pattern discussion" <nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 6:00 PM
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited 
> for thisone...
>
>
>> Come on over Matthew!  You can trim it out Saturday morning!
>>
>> G
>> ---- Matthew Frederick <mjfrederick at cox.net> wrote:
>>
>> =============
>> I don't know if any of us BR boys are coming. Maybe Jim. I might come, 
>> but I doubt it. I just got my Patriot up and running, and only have one 
>> flight on it. Other than that, I haven't flown since March when my 
>> Genesis went in.
>>
>> Matt
>>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>>  From: Richard Lewis
>>  To: General pattern discussion
>>  Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 10:59 AM
>>  Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] LARKS Contest Oct 4&5 - Getting excited for 
>> thisone...
>>
>>
>>  Wow - Should be an incredible October weekend for flying.
>>
>>
>>
>>  Myself, Mark H, and my Dad plan on camping at the field Friday and 
>> Saturday.
>>
>>
>>
>>  I understand that their facilities were damaged by Ike, but there's 
>> plenty of shed left and the clubhouse was unscathed.
>>
>>
>>
>>  I hope the turnout is good for this one..I hope the Crowley/BR boys have 
>> the stones to show up..:)
>>
>>
>>
>>  Richard Lewis
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>  NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>>  NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>>  http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>> _______________________________________________
>> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
>> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
>> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
>
> _______________________________________________
> NSRCA-discussion mailing list
> NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
> http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion
> 

_______________________________________________
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NSRCA-discussion at lists.nsrca.org
http://lists.nsrca.org/mailman/listinfo/nsrca-discussion