[NSRCA-discussion] The real rason Pattern flyers are seen as Elitists...

[DaveL322 at comcast.net]

Fred,

Believe it or not, your enthusiasm is appreciated, and it is needed.  You are certainly welcome to call out anyone you want as an elitist snob - you'd undoubtedly be correct to some extent as this list does include some of the best (elite) flyers in the world but, that doesn't make them snobs.  A number of folks have made some suggestions in the interest of helping you out.......helping people is not generally consistent with the actions of an elitist snob.

I would suggest that you carefully review the information (either fact or opinion) you have put to the list, the accuracy of your facts, and the content and source of the dissenting replies.  You are darn right you will be called out when you incorrectly state a fact with no supporting reference - and that is all - you were not flamed or attacked personally.  Opinions clash on the list all the time....no one is exempt from that.

You recently posted to the effect "we" all missed your point that increasing demands on the performance needed for Sportsman was negative toward attracting new guys.  It is a very good point and one I agree with 100%.  However, your point was not missed, in fact, it was a point of discussion long before I recall you joining the list.  During the last rules cycles it was a topic of hot debate among the rules committee members - which included a very even balance of active flyers from all classes and all parts of the country.  As a matter of fact, a number of guys on that committee will attest to the fact that I (an FAI flyer) was one of the staunchest advocates for keeping Sportsman simple.  Mike Hester, John Pavlick and I butted heads quite a bit......and then had a blast hangin at the Tangerine this year.  The constant struggle/compromise with Sportsman and Intermediate is too have schedules appear interesting and remain achievable with the majority of planes at the field on a giv
en weekend.  It ain't easy to do, especially when all the classes need to link together to allow structured progressive development of flight skills and trimming through the classes.

Your opinion is that a vertical line represents a demand for increased performance.  Opinion noted.  Many dissenting opinions posted, most with ideas and discussion on how to remedy the "problem" you noted.  I, as many others on this list, firmly believe that any plane that is not horsepower challenged for 2 loops or a stall turn will not be horsepower challenged to do a simple short vertical line.  Perhaps we are all wrong, and you are the only one who is right.  Perhaps we have some clarification and ideas on how you can overcome the problem and we are right.  My bet is that the majority is right on this one, especially considering the breadth of flying skills and range of experience for this majority.

Dave





-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: "Fred Huber" <fhhuber at clearwire.net> 

When someone who actually does start trying to fly Sportsman tries to give input on how to attract more people to Sportsman... the Elitist snobs who are flying Maters would rather nitpick on technicalities than listen to the real issue the relative beginner to the sport is trying to address.

You ARE Elitists... 

"Your plane must not be good enough... get a better one" IS NOT the correct response to a beginner to Sportsman saying the new sequence requires more performance than the old sequence.

You want to attract people... you are certainly doing the EXACT wrong thing.  And when its pointed out... you attack the messenger for telling you about it.

I'm about ready to scrape the NSRCA logos off my model... 
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From: "Fred Huber" <fhhuber at clearwire.net>
Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] The real rason Pattern flyers are seen as
	Elitists...
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 21:30:13 +0000
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