[NSRCA-discussion] Rainout Contests...3 lines??

Thu Jun 15 01:27:39 AKDT 2006

Some years ago the AGS contest drew close to 70 contestants for about 5
or 6 years. Bob Noll and I decided to run 3 lines, and we did it for 3 or
4 years. As I recall, never had a problem. As line manager, my biggest
problem was keeping the judges rotated, but it really was not a problem.
I think we tried to keep the lower classes on the middle line, since they
are less likely to be flying at the "correct" distance and lines.
It worked for us! Our self imposed cut off for 3 lines was 50
contestants. Over 50 and we went to 3 lines!

Terry T.

On Wed, 14 Jun 2006 18:27:48 -0400 "Verne Koester" <verne at twmi.rr.com>
writes:
I don't EVER want 3 flight lines overlapping. I'm not real fond of 2.

Verne
----- Original Message ----- 
From: Archie Stafford 
To: 'NSRCA Mailing List' 
Sent: Wednesday, June 14, 2006 2:04 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rainout Contests...

Logistically this would be tough to do with a local contest
Honestly I
wouldn’t want 3 flight lines going anyway a month before the NATS
.All 3
would over-fly each other, and the middle flight line gets it from both
ends
running multiple sites means you are running guys back and forth
between the sites, and you’d have to do assigned frequencies, which for
guys going to the NATS, its not an issue, for guys that aren’t, then it
could be.  I like the idea of especially at that contest, starting Friday
afternoon..maybe even something to consider for ComAir as well.  Both
have HUGE turnouts and this would get in 6 rounds easily.  

Arch Stafford

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of george w.
kennie
Sent: Wednesday, June 14, 2006 1:54 PM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rainout Contests...

Why can't you use site 1 and 3 and run 4 flight lines?????????????? 
Hmmmmm, it shouldn't be all that difficult to put 3 flight lines just on
site 3,...... that runway is pretty long on the left- hand end.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Atwood, Mark 
To: NSRCA Mailing List 
Sent: Tuesday, June 13, 2006 9:57 PM
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rainout Contests...

I was actually thinking that exact same thing.  Back in the late 80’s,
early 90’s the Mint Julep got so big that they needed to make it a three
day event.  I’m not sure we’re there
but this is clearly the largest
regional contest in the area.  Assuming the normal D4 folks would have
driven over Saturday morn, we would have had 50+ contestants this year.  
Even with good weather
6 rounds would be a challenge.  I like the Friday
afternoon idea

Anyone else have thoughts?  

The other possibility is to maybe run more than 2 flight lines.  Clearly
the Muncie site can facilitate that
just not sure how to handle it
logistically

From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
[mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On Behalf Of mike
mueller
Sent: Tuesday, June 13, 2006 4:47 PM
To: NSRCA Mailing List
Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rainout Contests...

 I think that the shootout should consider a schedule change.
 I propose that we attempt to get in 2 rounds on Friday afternoon. Those
who don't want to spend an extra night can leave early enough in the
morning on Friday to make the event. Most of the D5 guys were there on
Friday anyways.
 This may be the 1 contest a year where this would work. If we have a
huge crowd again it works and it also allows for some bad weather.
 Mike

Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:
I have been following this thread with interest . . .
. . it demonstrates how difficult, if not impossible
it is to please the majority, let alone everybody. On
the flip side of this thread, I have been asked why we
need to hold two day events. Some have asked for
Saturday only, others Sunday only ala control line
aerobatics. Family/Church/Work commitments prevent
some from attending both days of a weekend event. 

--- mike mueller wrote:

> Mark, thanks for clarifying what I was actually
> attempting to say. After I made my comments
> yesterday I went flying. Somehow Frankie had heard
> that I was a little po'd. I told him that my anger
> was in no way directed at either him or Tommy. It's
> just a general comment on what I have observed. Oh
> ya your right about the peer pressure influencing
> many, Mike Mueller
> 
> "Atwood, Mark" wrote: 
> v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:*
> {behavior:url(#default#VML);} w\:*
> {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape
> {behavior:url(#default#VML);} 
> st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) } 
> Larry, I think the issue is less about Muncie than
> the general topic. Muncie at 8am appeared to be a
> complete washout. It was WAY more obvious than
> usual
Forecast was for up to an inch of rain over
> the next 12 hours and probably more on Sunday. 
> Calling it was horribly unfortunate as we had such a
> big crowd from so many areas, but probably the right
> thing given the information available.
> 
> I think Mike’s point has more to due with less
> obvious situations, and the general “let’s get home
> early” attitude that’s become the norm. Forget
> weather
we get the same issue at the district
> championship regarding flying a 6th round. With 40+
> contestants, and 2 flight lines, with an average of
> 9 minutes per pilot, it takes 3 hours per round. 
> With GREAT weather
 that’s 9 hours of flying both
> days with no breaks. We get the sun in the box at
> 4:30 – 5pm
so even with a militaristic 8:30am start,
> and rigid attention to flight lines (Everyone does a
> great job at this I must add) we’re pressed to
> finish anything more than 3 rounds on Saturday

> We could also fly 3 rounds on Sunday
but we’d likely
> not finish until 4pm or so. That seems to be
> unacceptable to most anymore. I realize that many
> come from a great distance for this event (we like
> to think it’s all about the steak roast and night
> fly! J ), but there are some who are scratching for
> that last round in hopes
> of pulling out a win, and maybe a district
> championship.
> 
> I know I’ve left before some contests have ended
> because of other commitments. That’s my choice, and
> if I have to sacrifice a round
then that’s my
> choice. Bob Kane often chooses to sacrifice the
> first round of Sunday flying to attend church
 I
> guess my point is maybe Mike’s right
and we have to
> weight the “Contest” as a whole more heavily
 and
> do our very best to complete them. The pilot
> “vote” has value, but let’s face it
there’s a lot of
> peer pressure from those who’s current standings
> won’t change, or maybe even those that will, but who
> are in the better position at present
to call it a
> day.
> 
> Let’s face it
MOST of the time, we’re able to
> finish up 6 rounds by 2pm or so
.so it’s not a big
> deal most contests. On the few that do run
> long
maybe we need to suck it up for the exception
> and lose a little sleep.
> 
> -Mark
> 
> 
> ---------------------------------
> 
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On
> Behalf Of Lisa & Larry
> Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 10:32 PM
> To: 'NSRCA Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Congratulations
> D5,proud holders of the Ryder trophy for 2006
> 
> 
> My initial take is that I agree with Verne if a
> mistake was made, we own it. I was there when the
> vote was made. If someone had thoughts to continue
> the contest it could have been brought up. Many
> people were there earlier and had left the field for
> one reason or another (not necessarily to go home,
> but to kill time). 
> 
> Looking back, I think that there is room for
> improvement. Perhaps the best thing to do was for
> the CD’s to be at the field at the correct time for
> starting the contest no matter what the conditions
> are, and not let anyone leave for any reason if
> there is a cancellation concern. This way they can
> work to keep all pilots in the area so a debate can
> be heard. A decision could then be made to allow
> folks to check out of there hotel room and meet back
> at the field to see if any flying could be done.
> This would allow everyone the flexibility to check
> back in a hotel if we hold the contest without the
> risk of any unnecessary loss of money by not
> checking out.
> 
> “People needing to leave early on Sunday”, is not
> a good argument to cancel a contest if the rain is
> bad on Saturday
 If you can get a contest in
> regardless of the time on Sunday’s end, provided the
> majority of folks want it, then that is what should
> be done. My point is that everybody knows their own
> situation. For those who took the time and made the
> commitment to stick it out, they deserve to have a
> full contest benefit even if it’s a couple of rounds
> to make a contest.
> 
> I’m on the fence with regards to the Muncie
> cancellation. I would have been ok with either call.
> If a cancellation is immanent, the sooner it’s
> called the better. It’s always easier to second
> guess the decision after the fact knowing how it
> turned out. I wonder how many people would be ticked
> if the Muncie contest wasn’t cancelled and we
> couldn’t get any rounds in due to rain on Sunday
> also? Lisa and I stayed in the area. There wouldn’t
> have been enough time to get a complete round in on
> Saturday for all classes. I don’t know about Sunday.
> 
> Larry
> 
> 
> ---------------------------------
> 
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On
> Behalf Of Verne Koester
> Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 7:55 PM
> To: NSRCA Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Congratulations
> D5,proud holders of the Ryder trophy for 2006
> 
> 
> For the record, Tom and Frank polled those who
> were there before they called it. If it was a
> mistake, everyone standing there owns it, including
> me.
> 
> 
> 
> Verne
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> 
> From: DoWayne Gould 
> 
> To: 'NSRCA Mailing List' 
> 
> Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 6:50 PM
> 
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Congratulations
> D5,proud holders of the Ryder trophy for 2006
> 
> 
> 
> As a CD that may have to make this call in the
> future I am watching this thread closely. I make it
> to all the contests that I can afford the time and
> money to attend. I was at Muncie when the rain
> started at around 2:30am. It was still raining
> steady at 10am with no clearing in sight. I would
> not want to stand around all day in the rain for the
> outside chance that the weather would clear long
> enough to get a round or two in. The forecast for
> Sunday was for a better chance of rain. I think Tom
> and Frank did the right thing calling the contest
> and let everyone salvage there weekend.
> As for staying late on Sunday to finish or start a
> contest, I work third shift and have to be at work
> at midnight Sunday. That means if I get started to a
> contest at 7am and awards are given around 7pm and I
> have a 2 to 3 hour drive, it doesn’t leave much
> family and rest time before work. Taking Monday’s
> off for may be OK for some but others like me get
> paid for being there, if I don’t work I lose a days
> pay. No pay equals upset family and no hobby funds.
> Dowayne
> 
> 
> ---------------------------------
> 
> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On
> Behalf Of george w. kennie
> Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 12:53 PM
> To: NSRCA Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Congratulations
> D5,proud holders of the Ryder trophy for 2006
> 
> 
> I have to somewhat concur. The most enjoyable
> contest that I ever competed in was a seven rounder.
> We flew 3 rounds on Sunday and I was in favor of one
> more, 
=== message truncated ===>
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Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com

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