[NSRCA-discussion] Rainout Contests...
dwaynenancy
dwaynenancy at cox.net
Wed Jun 14 20:01:28 AKDT 2006
At the Nats I've seen where 2 supposedly not overlapping have
contestants who mid-aired at the extreme edges of flight space. Bad scene.
Dwayne
Mike Darr wrote:
> Keep in mind, if you run three flight lines, (which I am dead set
> against anyway) you would have a hard time finding enough judges and
> scribes. I don't think we need to change a thing. On the rare
> occurrence that it rains at a contest then we just deal with it. We
> will never be able to predict Mother Nature, let alone win a battle
> with her. Really the only thing we can do, and I think we should, is
> change the date for the Shootout. I can't even remember flying at the
> Shootout, and there being good weather for both days.
> Mike Darr
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Verne Koester <mailto:verne at twmi.rr.com>
> *To:* NSRCA Mailing List <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, June 14, 2006 6:27 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rainout Contests...
>
> I don't EVER want 3 flight lines overlapping. I'm not real fond of 2.
> Verne
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Archie Stafford <mailto:rcpattern at comcast.net>
> *To:* 'NSRCA Mailing List'
> <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, June 14, 2006 2:04 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rainout Contests...
>
> Logistically this would be tough to do with a local
> contest…Honestly I wouldn’t want 3 flight lines going anyway a
> month before the NATS….All 3 would over-fly each other, and
> the middle flight line gets it from both ends…running multiple
> sites means you are running guys back and forth between the
> sites, and you’d have to do assigned frequencies, which for
> guys going to the NATS, its not an issue, for guys that
> aren’t, then it could be. I like the idea of especially at
> that contest, starting Friday afternoon..maybe even something
> to consider for ComAir as well. Both have HUGE turnouts and
> this would get in 6 rounds easily.
>
> Arch Stafford
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> *From:* nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] *On Behalf
> Of *george w. kennie
> *Sent:* Wednesday, June 14, 2006 1:54 PM
> *To:* NSRCA Mailing List
> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rainout Contests...
>
> Why can't you use site 1 and 3 and run 4 flight
> lines?????????????? Hmmmmm, it shouldn't be all that difficult
> to put 3 flight lines just on site 3,...... that runway is
> pretty long on the left- hand end.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> *From:* Atwood, Mark <mailto:atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
>
> *To:* NSRCA Mailing List
> <mailto:nsrca-discussion at lists.nsrca.org>
>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, June 13, 2006 9:57 PM
>
> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rainout Contests...
>
> I was actually thinking that exact same thing. Back in the
> late 80’s, early 90’s the Mint Julep got so big that they
> needed to make it a three day event. I’m not sure we’re
> there…but this is clearly the largest regional contest in
> the area. Assuming the normal D4 folks would have driven
> over Saturday morn, we would have had 50+ contestants this
> year. Even with good weather…6 rounds would be a
> challenge. I like the Friday afternoon idea…
>
> Anyone else have thoughts?
>
> The other possibility is to maybe run more than 2 flight
> lines. Clearly the Muncie site can facilitate that…just
> not sure how to handle it logistically…
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> *From:* nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] *On
> Behalf Of *mike mueller
> *Sent:* Tuesday, June 13, 2006 4:47 PM
> *To:* NSRCA Mailing List
> *Subject:* Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Rainout Contests...
>
> I think that the shootout should consider a schedule change.
>
> I propose that we attempt to get in 2 rounds on Friday
> afternoon. Those who don't want to spend an extra night
> can leave early enough in the morning on Friday to make
> the event. Most of the D5 guys were there on Friday anyways.
>
> This may be the 1 contest a year where this would work. If
> we have a huge crowd again it works and it also allows for
> some bad weather.
>
> Mike
>
> */Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com>/* wrote:
>
> I have been following this thread with interest . . .
> . . it demonstrates how difficult, if not impossible
> it is to please the majority, let alone everybody. On
> the flip side of this thread, I have been asked why we
> need to hold two day events. Some have asked for
> Saturday only, others Sunday only ala control line
> aerobatics. Family/Church/Work commitments prevent
> some from attending both days of a weekend event.
>
>
> --- mike mueller wrote:
>
>> Mark, thanks for clarifying what I was actually
>> attempting to say. After I made my comments
>> yesterday I went flying. Somehow Frankie had heard
>> that I was a little po'd. I told him that my anger
>> was in no way directed at either him or Tommy. It's
>> just a general comment on what I have observed. Oh
>> ya your right about the peer pressure influencing
>> many, Mike Mueller
>>
>> "Atwood, Mark" wrote:
>> v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:*
>> {behavior:url(#default#VML);} w\:*
>> {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape
>> {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
>> st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }
>> Larry, I think the issue is less about Muncie than
>> the general topic. Muncie at 8am appeared to be a
>> complete washout. It was WAY more obvious than
>> usual…Forecast was for up to an inch of rain over
>> the next 12 hours and probably more on Sunday.
>> Calling it was horribly unfortunate as we had such a
>> big crowd from so many areas, but probably the right
>> thing given the information available.
>>
>> I think Mike’s point has more to due with less
>> obvious situations, and the general “let’s get home
>> early” attitude that’s become the norm. Forget
>> weather…we get the same issue at the district
>> championship regarding flying a 6th round. With 40+
>> contestants, and 2 flight lines, with an average of
>> 9 minutes per pilot, it takes 3 hours per round.
>> With GREAT weather… that’s 9 hours of flying both
>> days with no breaks. We get the sun in the box at
>> 4:30 – 5pm…so even with a militaristic 8:30am start,
>> and rigid attention to flight lines (Everyone does a
>> great job at this I must add) we’re pressed to
>> finish anything more than 3 rounds on Saturday…
>> We could also fly 3 rounds on Sunday…but we’d likely
>> not finish until 4pm or so. That seems to be
>> unacceptable to most anymore. I realize that many
>> come from a great distance for this event (we like
>> to think it’s all about the steak roast and night
>> fly! J ), but there are some who are scratching for
>> that last round in hopes
>> of pulling out a win, and maybe a district
>> championship.
>>
>> I know I’ve left before some contests have ended
>> because of other commitments. That’s my choice, and
>> if I have to sacrifice a round…then that’s my
>> choice. Bob Kane often chooses to sacrifice the
>> first round of Sunday flying to attend church… I
>> guess my point is maybe Mike’s right…and we have to
>> weight the “Contest” as a whole more heavily… and
>> do our very best to complete them. The pilot
>> “vote” has value, but let’s face it…there’s a lot of
>> peer pressure from those who’s current standings
>> won’t change, or maybe even those that will, but who
>> are in the better position at present…to call it a
>> day.
>>
>> Let’s face it…MOST of the time, we’re able to
>> finish up 6 rounds by 2pm or so….so it’s not a big
>> deal most contests. On the few that do run
>> long…maybe we need to suck it up for the exception
>> and lose a little sleep.
>>
>> -Mark
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------
>>
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On
>> Behalf Of Lisa & Larry
>> Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 10:32 PM
>> To: 'NSRCA Mailing List'
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Congratulations
>> D5,proud holders of the Ryder trophy for 2006
>>
>>
>> My initial take is that I agree with Verne if a
>> mistake was made, we own it. I was there when the
>> vote was made. If someone had thoughts to continue
>> the contest it could have been brought up. Many
>> people were there earlier and had left the field for
>> one reason or another (not necessarily to go home,
>> but to kill time).
>>
>> Looking back, I think that there is room for
>> improvement. Perhaps the best thing to do was for
>> the CD’s to be at the field at the correct time for
>> starting the contest no matter what the conditions
>> are, and not let anyone leave for any reason if
>> there is a cancellation concern. This way they can
>> work to keep all pilots in the area so a debate can
>> be heard. A decision could then be made to allow
>> folks to check out of there hotel room and meet back
>> at the field to see if any flying could be done.
>> This would allow everyone the flexibility to check
>> back in a hotel if we hold the contest without the
>> risk of any unnecessary loss of money by not
>> checking out.
>>
>> “People needing to leave early on Sunday”, is not
>> a good argument to cancel a contest if the rain is
>> bad on Saturday… If you can get a contest in
>> regardless of the time on Sunday’s end, provided the
>> majority of folks want it, then that is what should
>> be done. My point is that everybody knows their own
>> situation. For those who took the time and made the
>> commitment to stick it out, they deserve to have a
>> full contest benefit even if it’s a couple of rounds
>> to make a contest.
>>
>> I’m on the fence with regards to the Muncie
>> cancellation. I would have been ok with either call.
>> If a cancellation is immanent, the sooner it’s
>> called the better. It’s always easier to second
>> guess the decision after the fact knowing how it
>> turned out. I wonder how many people would be ticked
>> if the Muncie contest wasn’t cancelled and we
>> couldn’t get any rounds in due to rain on Sunday
>> also? Lisa and I stayed in the area. There wouldn’t
>> have been enough time to get a complete round in on
>> Saturday for all classes. I don’t know about Sunday.
>>
>> Larry
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------
>>
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On
>> Behalf Of Verne Koester
>> Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 7:55 PM
>> To: NSRCA Mailing List
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Congratulations
>> D5,proud holders of the Ryder trophy for 2006
>>
>>
>> For the record, Tom and Frank polled those who
>> were there before they called it. If it was a
>> mistake, everyone standing there owns it, including
>> me.
>>
>>
>>
>> Verne
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>
>> From: DoWayne Gould
>>
>> To: 'NSRCA Mailing List'
>>
>> Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 6:50 PM
>>
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Congratulations
>> D5,proud holders of the Ryder trophy for 2006
>>
>>
>>
>> As a CD that may have to make this call in the
>> future I am watching this thread closely. I make it
>> to all the contests that I can afford the time and
>> money to attend. I was at Muncie when the rain
>> started at around 2:30am. It was still raining
>> steady at 10am with no clearing in sight. I would
>> not want to stand around all day in the rain for the
>> outside chance that the weather would clear long
>> enough to get a round or two in. The forecast for
>> Sunday was for a better chance of rain. I think Tom
>> and Frank did the right thing calling the contest
>> and let everyone salvage there weekend.
>> As for staying late on Sunday to finish or start a
>> contest, I work third shift and have to be at work
>> at midnight Sunday. That means if I get started to a
>> contest at 7am and awards are given around 7pm and I
>> have a 2 to 3 hour drive, it doesn’t leave much
>> family and rest time before work. Taking Monday’s
>> off for may be OK for some but others like me get
>> paid for being there, if I don’t work I lose a days
>> pay. No pay equals upset family and no hobby funds.
>> Dowayne
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------
>>
>> From: nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org
>> [mailto:nsrca-discussion-bounces at lists.nsrca.org] On
>> Behalf Of george w. kennie
>> Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 12:53 PM
>> To: NSRCA Mailing List
>> Subject: Re: [NSRCA-discussion] Congratulations
>> D5,proud holders of the Ryder trophy for 2006
>>
>>
>> I have to somewhat concur. The most enjoyable
>> contest that I ever competed in was a seven rounder.
>> We flew 3 rounds on Sunday and I was in favor of one
>> more,
> === message truncated ===>
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>
> Bob Kane
> getterflash at yahoo.com
>
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