[NSRCA-discussion] Was Mini Brio, Now Pattern Longitevity

Sun Feb 26 02:07:07 AKST 2006

 Hey Bob good thoughts. I would add that more than anything we the faithfull can do more to attract new participants by setting a good example. In this day and age when you get all the super annoying 3Der's flying 2 inches from your nose pattern has got to be seen as a breath of fresh air. Being freindly, helpful and showing off the value of pattern goes farther to attract one to the sport than saving them money. Another thing that we can all do to help is to go out of our way to make the new guys that come to a contest feel welcome. How many out there have seen just the opposite?
   We could benefit from a campaign that portrays pattern as a "COOL THING" to participate in. Pattern planes are "COOL" typically they attract a lot of attention for their beauty. We have a somewhat poor public perception for a boat load of reasons. One problem is the average age of guys at a contest. It will take an effort to change it. Each of us has to try a little harder. Mike

Bob Kane <getterflash at yahoo.com> wrote:
  I belong to the IAC, the organization for full scale
aerobatics. The latest magazine has an article about
problems with shrinking full scale participation and
public indifference about the sport. Unlike most
popular sports, it is very difficult for the casual
observer to see who is "winning" an aerobatic contest,
the judging criteria is lost on them. 

The Winter Olympics is going on now, I'm sure many of
you have watched the figure skating competition. Yet
what we are watching is ice dancing, not figure
skating. The "figures" part of skating has long since
dissapeared since it was boring to watch on TV and not
understood by the general public, much like our
precision aerobatics.

I wish I could offer the magic answer to growing our
ranks, but I don't have it. Many will continue to be
attracted by the same thing that drew me in, the
chance to improve my flying beyond left-hand cirlces
in the sky. Others, looking for Monster Truck thrills
will have to go elsewhere. 

I will continue to share my enthusiasm, fly my plane
on training night so others can see what it can do,
and hope it draws interest. 

--- mike mueller wrote:

> Hey we are not alone. I have heard that IMAC is
> dwindling also. They suffer from too expensive, high
> tech, size restriction problems. THey are being
> driven away from many of the fields across America.
> At least we have a managable airframe size. With the
> new gas engines coming in we will attract some new
> people. If IMAC continues with it's problems we
> could get some of our buddy's back. IMAC and Pattern
> have more in common than most would admit.
> The idea that competition of any kind is
> appealing to a large group is naive. We have turned
> a corner and I see interest being on the rise. One
> indication is the popularity of the small F3A
> electric planes on the market. Mike
> 
> Mike Hester wrote:
> Real quickly, I don't think pattern is dying, I
> think it is evolving, 
> changing, shifting areas of activeness. While it's
> numbers are dwindling in 
> some places, the numbers are on the increase in
> others.
> 
> one thing I think would be a mistake would be to
> change the airframe rules 
> in pattern. they are stabilized, and I don't think
> changing them would have 
> any positive long lasting effect. if anything, it
> could worsen the 
> situation. Stability fosters enginuety, and some
> people are rising to the 
> challenge of both leading edge technology, and old
> school methods. When you 
> learn how to seamlessly blend both, you create more
> options.
> 
> Think about how wide open our airframe and power
> rules really are: power is 
> virtually unlimited, airframe is an empty 2 meter
> box with a maximum weight 
> of 5 k or 11 lbs, and the noise requirement...but if
> they can get a 40% 
> within the noise requirements, then that's no longer
> an issue.
> 
> What we have to do, all of us, is foster a fun but
> competetive atmosphere. 
> We need to reach out to people on a grass roots
> level and get them 
> motivated. We need to slay the perception that you
> must have a $3000 
> airframe and $2-3000 worth of electric power or
> you're wasting your time. I 
> hate that crap. And we need to ALL make sure that we
> don't even 
> subconsciously give the edge to a guy with the
> latest greatest electric set 
> up, because by doing so think what message we'll be
> sending to the guy that 
> really can't afford that kind of investment right
> now, today. in the future 
> who knows.
> 
> if you haven't heard, ZDZ is coming out with a new
> 40cc f3A engine this 
> summer. this thing will turn as large of a prop as
> the electrics. The weight 
> increase over glow isn't even half as bad as
> electric. This alone could do 
> great things for us in crossing certain invisible
> barriers.
> 
> Then again, maybe not =)
> 
> Sorry to ramble, must be the paint fumes.....
> 
> -Mike
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Ryan Smith" 
> To: 
> Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2006 12:51 PM
> Subject: [NSRCA-discussion] Was Mini Brio, Now
> Pattern Longitevity
> 
> 
> I honestly don't think that you have to spend out
> the butt to have a 
> competitive setup. The keeping up with the Joneses
> syndrome is the prevalent 
> factor that makes everyone think that pattern is so
> ungodly expensive. There 
> are plenty of options out there for people to create
> a cost-effective, 
> competitive two meter rig. But alas, people out
> there think they HAVE to 
> have the biggest best and fastest everything, when
> in reality, there is no 
> way in hell most newer fliers out there can discern
> between a slightly 
> inferior and cheaper product and a top of the line
> product (a big example 
> here would be digital servos as opposed to analog
> servos). There are 
> certainly MANY viable options out there for a cheap
> two meter setup that 
> will be competitive in the long run. The best
> example I can see of this is 
> Mark Hunt, down in the Houston area. His airplane,
> the Insight, is all wood 
> and foam, and can be built with maybe $150 worth of
> wood (I'm throwing a 
> generous estimate out there), not to mention the
> plans are like $25. He is 
> actually running an OS 1.60 on a standard muffler
> and is still making the 
> noise restrictions. Mark exemplifies what people
> just starting out in 
> pattern need to look into, not only because it's
> cheap, but the airplanes 
> are simple to maintain and I would venture to say
> bulletproof. I bought a 
> set from him a while back and haven't had the chance
> to build one, but I 
> really would like to. I would like to do what he's
> doing and and outfit it 
> with analog servos and make it otherwise plain jane
> and see just how it 
> stacks up to the rest of the field out there. There
> are also several other 
> wood airplanes out there that are a little more
> extravagant, such as the 
> Black Magic v2 by Mike Hester and the Quest and
> Shindin by Bryan Herbert 
> that are being drawn in CAD and being kitted. Look
> at the airplanes that the 
> Japanese team members fly- they're all wood. And
> look at where they place. 
> Most if not all are always in the top ten, and young
> Tetsuo Onda even placed 
> second this year. That's a heck of a feat for
> anyone, mu
> ch less an eighteen year old who is flying against
> people who have been 
> modeling twice as long as he's been living.
> 
> Another point, the theory of everyone flying the
> same thing has 
> never worked, not in fullscale and not in models.
> The One Design class never 
> caught on in full scale, however there are many
> examples of that airplane 
> flying. In IMAC, there are worries about everyone
> using consistent 
> batteries, motors, servos, and such, and if you have
> to be dictated that 
> much on what you can and cannot fly, it takes the
> fun out. Also, in IMAC, it 
> is commonplace to see high end airplanes in Basic
> and Sportsman just because 
> people want to get that advantage that they really
> get through burning fuel. 
> I know everyone hates to hear that, but it is the
> truth. Once you start to 
> see improvements in your own flying after having
> flown a lot, then you see 
> what everyone preaches about when they say fly a
> bunch. I really don't think 
> that pattern dying is really directly related to
> cost, but if you want to 
> make it such let's break down Jay's idea. How cost
> effective is it to make 
> someone buy something that they can't use in upper
> classes and would have to 
> buy a new setup every year. Shouldn't we be showing
> people that they can go 
> and get a nice setup that they can actually use and
> enjoy? Not to mention 
> the fact that you can reuse the equipment should you
> decide (or your thumbs 
> decide) to get a new airframe. I think the cost
> factor is implemented by 
> people who don't really have the desire to succeed
> and have to use that as a 
> scapegoat to cover what they see as their failures.
> 
> I honestly think pattern needs an overhaul. It's not
> the cost 
> that really drives people away, it's the ideology
> surrounding it that does. 
> People see pattern as being boring and too easy, and
> generally not exciting. 
> However, with the advent 3D flight, and people
> becoming attracted to model 
> airplanes because of it, they really want to hone
> their skills. I have seen 
> a lot of subtle hints dropped by some past pattern
> flyers who write for 
> magazines telling people to look into pattern if
> they really want to become 
> better at 3D. I also think that we need more
> promotion. 
=== message truncated ===>
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Bob Kane
getterflash at yahoo.com

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