Scoring formula

[Cameron Smith]

 Where there any Judge ranking numbers produced from this years NATS?

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: discussion-request at nsrca.org [mailto:discussion-request at nsrca.org]
On Behalf Of Bob Pastorello
Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2005 6:10 AM
To: discussion at nsrca.org
Subject: Re: Scoring formula

I remember a Nats (a few years' back) when I *was* the toughest judge on
the 
FAI line, both Prelims and Finals.  I know because the CD came up and
told 
me "you're being too hard".  Okay.  After it was all done, my higher
scores 
tracked the overall placements of the standings pretty darn well.  I
felt 
pretty good about that, because there were some pretty high-falutin
judges 
on my panel with me!!

Then I learned - quite by accident - that my scores HAD been tossed.
EVERY 
round that I sat there, doing my damndest to be consistent, fair, and 
downgrade by the rulebook....in the heat and wind, only to learn that I
DID 
NOT NEED TO BE THERE !!!!!

Some stupid jerk actually had the gall to justify that by telling me
"since 
your scores got tossed, that makes the other judges' scores more
accurate". 
I didn't wring that guys' neck....but he also made it to my list of
"persons 
likely to be left out of my will".... :-)

Actually had someone ask me a couple years later, "Why don't you get 
certified, Bob?"

I'll put my judging consistency and skill up against anyone's..... but
not 
if it's gonna be thrown out later.  As difficult as it is to train, and
then 
*recruit* judges at big events, WHY would anyone want to toss their
efforts 
in the trash????   Why bother to play at all, if there is no more value 
placed on someone's best effort than that?

Bob Pastorello
www.rcaerobats.net
rcaerobob at cox.net
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Atwood, Mark" <atwoodm at paragon-inc.com>
To: <discussion at nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 10:16 PM
Subject: RE: Scoring formula


I have to agree with Derek on this one, 100%.

The conventional thought on "throwing out Highs and lows" is that you'll
get rid of the spurious ZERO from some Snap-roll nazi  along with the
gift "10" that the pilot's buddy awarded him.   That could be true.

But what really happens...the down side... Is that the toughest judge on
the panel...get's EVERY SCORE THROWN OUT...   He might as well pack up
and go home.   Same is true for the "easy" judge.  Forget about the fact
that they're consistent...  Tossing Highs and Low's doesn't really care.
In fact...the more consistently "tough" they are...the more likely that
they wasted their time.

TBL on the other hand looks at judges across the entire pool of flyers..
If a judge is consistently tough...fine.  But if he's tough on 8
pilots...and easy on 2...it's going to catch it.  Same goes for the easy
judge that's suddenly tough.



-----Original Message-----
From: discussion-request at nsrca.org [mailto:discussion-request at nsrca.org]
On Behalf Of Derek Koopowitz
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 10:30 PM
To: discussion at nsrca.org
Subject: RE: Scoring formula

There is a big difference between TBLP and TBL.  TBL does not change
individual maneuver scores at all - it may change the overall round
score
for a judge based on how that judge has scored other pilots and relative
to
that judges' scores compared to the other judges.

I have given explanations of what TBL is several times - certain people
are
set in their ways and will not open up their minds to understanding
statistical methods.  I can equate TBL vs high-low throw out to people's
understanding of the impact on turnaround in pattern.

The problem with high-low discard is that you are eliminating the work
of
40% of your judges scores if 5 judges are used.  Is that fair to the
judges
and pilots?  TBL changes that by keeping about 90% of all judges scores.



-----Original Message-----
From: discussion-request at nsrca.org [mailto:discussion-request at nsrca.org]
On
Behalf Of Grow Pattern
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 6:13 PM
To: discussion at nsrca.org
Subject: Re: Scoring formula

Check this out I was researching TBL formulae and I ran across this. The
parallelisms of the full-size aerobatic world to our world are pretty
scary.

_ Eric
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