"Cabinet Grade Particle Board"....where can I find it?

Ken Thompson III mrandmrst at comcast.net
Sat Nov 20 03:36:23 AKST 2004 

Terry,
I'm sure your tables work exceptionally well.  I have no doubt that your 
system is a very good for building pattern ships.
I have to agree about the ability to hit the center of a 3/4" board, but, 
you will notice that I said the "ease" of running in the screws not the 
ability to hit the center.
It seems that you are very happy with your table, and I might even build one 
like that, should I ever have the room to use one of my tables exclusively 
for building airplanes.  Those who know me, know that I never build anything 
except ARF's, all my true building is done by others.
My reason for posting on this subject was strictly how I build a flat table, 
which I would consider myself fairly proficient at. Flat tables are 
necessary to build accurate cabinets, which is what I do for a living.
I still like the concrete idea!
Ken
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Terry Terrenoire" <amad2terry at juno.com>
To: <discussion at nsrca.org>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 10:00 PM
Subject: Re: "Cabinet Grade Particle Board"....where can I find it?


> Ken: Yes, I add an additional leg in the middle of the 7 foot length.
> That makes a total of 10 30 inch long 1x2s. Then I made 3 "skirts" -,
> also of 1x2. These are positioned around the top for top support, 9
> inches down from the top to support the drawers, and 3 inches from the
> bottom to support the shelves. Whole thing takes less than 80 feet of
> 1x2.
> Yes, you do have to be more accurate in your screw positioning but,
> anyone expecting to build with the accuracy necessary for a pattern ship
> had better be able to hit the center of a 3/4 inch board! I also
> pre-drill the holes and counter sink the flat head screws.
> The "doubled" corners still just have the equivalent of a 2x2, certainly
> not more material than a 2x4.
>
> I don't know current wood prices, but when I built mine in 1984,, the
> total cost per workbench was about $30. Of course that did not include
> the concrete that was added some years later. And the concrete does not
> need much supprt to keep it from sagging! :)
>
> Terry T.
>
> On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 07:36:47 -0500 "Ken Thompson III"
> <mrandmrst at comcast.net> writes:
>> Terry,
>> The reason I use 2x4's is not for the extra strength, it's for the
>> ease of
>> running in the screws without the concern for being exactly in the
>> center of
>> the board.  If you are a little off center with a #6 screw in the
>> edge of a
>> 1x2, chances are you will split it.  In doubling up the material on
>> your
>> corners you use more 1x than 2x product.  Using 1x2's, to support
>> industrial
>> grade particle board, the weight of the particle board alone will
>> make it
>> sag in the middle, unless of course you add extra support to the
>> center of
>> the table, which in turn adds more material, thus more cost.
>> I use my style of table to build everything from counter tops to
>> cabinets.
>> Granted, these items do not have to be anywhere near as accurate as
>> an
>> airplane wing, but they are a whole lot heavier and my tables hold
>> their
>> flatness and level very well.
>> Concrete?  Now that's some heavy duty building surface!!
>> But, I'll bet that it's accurate as heck.
>>
>> Ken
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Terry Terrenoire" <amad2terry at juno.com>
>> To: <discussion at nsrca.org>
>> Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 7:01 AM
>> Subject: Re: "Cabinet Grade Particle Board"....where can I find it?
>>
>>
>> > THE 2X4S ARE OVERKILL!!!!!!!!!
>> > You do NOT need this extra"strength", expense and weight, as well
>> as
>> > space loss.
>> >
>> > Instead, use 1x2 for all framing and double them in an "L" shape
>> for the
>> > corners.
>> > I built my workbenches this way 20 years ago and they are in
>> perfect
>> > shape today.
>> > You might be interested to know that I build on concrete. there is
>> over
>> > 350# on one bench, and nearly 700# on the other.
>> > When sheeting a wing, another 200# is added.
>> >
>> > I started out my tops with hollow core doors that I got cheap from
>> a
>> > local lumber yard because they had some minor damage. These were
>> sheeted
>> > with Homosote. This is stiff but pins can be inserted. Now I use a
>> steel
>> > sheet for magnitic building on the concrete slabs.
>> >
>> > Terry T.
>> >
>> > On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 00:02:06 -0500 "John Pavlick"
>> <jpavlick at idseng.com>
>> > writes:
>> >> I've never tried any of this "high-tech" stuff. Sounds
>> interesting.
>> >> In case
>> >> you want to do things the "old-fashioned" way (like me), here's
>> how
>> >> I built
>> >> my bench:
>> >>
>> >> 1. Standard 2x4 (wood) frame. Build it straight and square, and
>> >> brace it
>> >> heavily (especially in the corners). I used the metal brackets
>> made
>> >> for deck
>> >> assembly to speed up assembly and help make everything square.
>> You
>> >> can find
>> >> these at Home Depot near the pressure treated lumber.
>> >>
>> >> 2. 3/4" plywood top. Glued and screwed to the frame.
>> >>
>> >> 3. A shelf made the same as the top (2x4's and 3/4" plywood)
>> about
>> >> 1' off
>> >> the floor. This strengthens the legs and makes the corner braces
>> >> effective.
>> >>
>> >> 4. Paint it everywhere.
>> >>
>> >> 5. Install in final resting place and level and square the top.
>> >>
>> >> 6. Get a piece of 1/4 glass for the top. This in itself is not
>> flat
>> >> - it
>> >> will conform to the surface it is laying on. Shim until it is as
>> >> close to
>> >> perfect as you can make it. You can use the little pads for
>> glass
>> >> table tops
>> >> available at a glass shop or Home Depot. Place them at 1'
>> intervals,
>> >> the
>> >> glass will not deflect over this short span.
>> >>
>> >> 7. To push pins in (they won't go through the glass) use a piece
>> of
>> >> "Homasote" - this a construction material used between siding
>> and
>> >> sheathing
>> >> (Home Depot again). It is gray, about 1/2" thick and fairly
>> light
>> >> but it
>> >> holds pins very well.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> This has worked nicely for me. I check the top surface before
>> >> building but
>> >> so far I haven't had to adjust it since I built the bench two
>> years
>> >> ago. The
>> >> bench is in my basement but it's fairly dry. The nice part is
>> that
>> >> even if
>> >> the wood warps a little bit, I can always correct the top. This
>> is
>> >> probably
>> >> overkill but at least I know the reason my maneuvers aren't
>> perfect
>> >> is NOT
>> >> because of a twisted wing or fuselage.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> John Pavlick
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> > >
>> >> > > --- Mark Grabowski <MGrabowski at fmtinv.com> wrote:
>> >> > >
>> >> > >> Gents, I've seen references to using cabinet grade
>> >> > >> particle board for making
>> >> > >> very flat building surfaces. I'm assuming this isn't
>> >> > >> something I'll find at
>> >> > >> my local home depot. Any suggestions? (I'm in the
>> >> > >> Chicago suburbs)
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >> This is a solicitation for business and to be
>> >> > >> removed from our list please
>> >> > >> email at:
>> >> > >> mgrabowski at fmtinv.com <mailto:mgrabowski at fmtinv.com>
>> >> > >> Mark Grabowski
>> >> > >> Account Executive
>> >> > >> Ph: 630-515-4747
>> >> > >> Fax: 877-316-7401
>> >> >
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