Trimming Help

[Wayne Galligan]

I think you have to also consider that they are relative to the thrust line.

WG
  
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Bob Kane 
  To: discussion at nsrca.org 
  Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 7:55 AM
  Subject: RE: Trimming Help


  I have to ask . . . . .   what is the difference between adding positice incidence to the wing versus negative to the stab? Are they not relative? 

  Dean Pappas <d.pappas at kodeos.com> wrote: 
    Hi again Paul,
    Many planes trim nicely with a small amount of positive incidence in the wing, compared to the stab.
    The typical amount is about 1/4 to 1/3 degree, or a little over 1/16" over the wing chord. If you have full degree of incidence in the wing, you may have a belly-pitch in knife edge, unless terribly nose-heavy. Now we need to ask those of you out there with well trimmed Tai-Ji to tell us where your CG is. There's no sense in re-inventing the wheel. Put the CG there, and adjust/shim the incidence 'till the elevator trim goes away, and let's see where we are.

    Before doing that, are you sure that the ailerons aren't both trailed up or down, even a little?

    Don't let us forget you, until this problem is licked,
    Dean

    -----Original Message-----
    From: David Lockhart [mailto:DaveL322 at comcast.net]
    Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 11:06 AM
    To: discussion at nsrca.org
    Subject: Re: Trimming Help


    Paul,

    Most of the trim advice being given is based (rightly so) on some
    assumptions -
    - the plane is straight and true,
    - ail hinges are sealed,
    - servos are tracking evenly throughout the range of throw (as measured by a
    throw meter - Budd Laser, CRC, Ivans Gadget, etc),
    - all references to ail throw and ail differential refer to actual measured
    throw at the aileron (as opposed to an ATV/endpoint/differential setting in
    the radio).

    Another thing I would suggest - if possible, have another experienced
    pattern pilot fly the plane and see if they find the same problem - and it
    gives you an opportunity to very critcically watch the plane and evaluate
    without needing to concentrate on the actual flying.

    As Dean P said, negative ail differential is rarely needed, but not out of
    the question. Most of my planes end up with no differential, or a very
    slight amount of positive differential - but I did have one that required
    negative differential.

    Good luck,

    Dave Lockhart
    DaveL322 at comcast.net



    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Paul Lawrence" 
    To: 
    Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 8:19 AM
    Subject: RE: Trimming Help


    > The plane is a Tai Ji 60. I may have found an
    > incidence
    > problem too. I don't really know where the reference
    > line is for this model and I am also still learning
    > how to check incidence, but if I block up the plane
    > and get the wings at 0 degrees and then check the
    > stab, it is showing -1 degree of incidence. That seems
    > excessive.
    >
    > I'm flying Intermediate and the yaw really shows up on
    > the humpty bump and full roll up on stall turn. When I
    > perform the humpty bump, I pull to vertical, 1/2 roll
    > right and the plane heads off to the left(belly in).
    > On the full roll up, the plane heads off to the right
    > after rolling right.
    >
    > So far, I have received a lot of good advice and have
    > several things to try. Thanks.
    >
    >
    >
    > >
    > > -----Original Message-----
    > > From: Paul Lawrence [mailto:pwl45 at yahoo.com]
    > > Sent: Sun 3/28/2004 10:33 PM
    > > To: discussion at nsrca.org
    > > Cc:
    > > Subject: Trimming Help
    > >
    > >
    > > After getting soundly beat in Ocala last weekend, I
    > > realized that I have been getting proverse yaw as my
    > > plane rolls.
    > > It wasn't evident until I saw other well-trimmed
    > > planes flying.
    > > The plane yaws in the direction of roll input and I
    > > have been experimenting with a multitude of aileron
    > > differential settings and can't seem to remove the
    > > yaw.
    > > With zero differential, the plane still yaws in the
    > > direction of roll.
    > > The trimming chart says to reduce differential in
    > > this condition, but I have reduced it to zero.
    > > Should I program in negative differential(doesn't
    > > sound good) or should I program a litle bit of
    > > opposite rudder correction to offset the proverse
    > > yaw?
    > >
    > > Also, does CG and Incidence affect adverse or
    > > proverse yaw while rolling?
    > > The plane was a little nose heavy and I have also
    > > been adding tail weight to try and clean up the
    > > rolls, but still can't get that yaw out of the
    > > rolls.
    > >
    > >
    > >
    >
    > =====================================
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    > and follow the instructions.
    >

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  Bob Kane
  getterflash at yahoo.com


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