intermediate 402 rolling suggestions

Tue Jul 8 06:18:11 AKDT 2003

Hi Rodney,  the circular motion for rolls is why I switched to 'mode 3'
(though a standard for modes seems to be lacking... different places call
different things mode 3).  I have rudder and elevator on right stick,
aileron and throttle on left stick.  So rolls are: hold left stick over,
move right stick in a semi circle.

I made the switch over a winter.  I flew a few hours on realflight, and it
cost me one sport plane that I was flying before the more valuable pattern
plane, but I think it was worth it.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rodney Tanner" <rodney19821982 at yahoo.com>
To: <discussion at nsrca.org>
Sent: June 27, 2003 11:46 AM
Subject: Re: intermediate 402 rolling suggestions

> The pros would say pulsing elevator as the wing comes
> to the horizontal is just the first step.
> I attended a Quique Somenzini clinic last November and
> he had us working rudder and elevator stick in a
> coordinated circular motion, timed with a fairly slow
> roll rate.
> He did the two reverse rolls on my Viper and boy it
> looked good, very axial, very smooth. He then did most
> of the Intermediate schedule in constant rolls!! But,
> as they say, the Quiques, Chips, Jasons and CPLs are a
> different breed from the rest of us. His serious pre
> contest practice schedule is about 2 gallons a day for
> ten consecutive days!
> Six months later, here I am still pulsing away on the
> elevator. The 2 or 3 guys that have worked hard to
> master the more advanced circular method are flying
> better and scoring higher.
>
> Rodney
> NSRCA 2906
>
>
>
>
> --- Scott McNaught <scott.mcnaught at sympatico.ca>
> wrote:
> > Hello Jim,
> >
> > I am currently practicing the two rolls in the
> > intermidiate pattern. I am
> > using elevator through my rolls, my problem is the
> > timming of the elevator
> > and the amount which increases on the second roll as
> > your speed decreases.
> >
> > Scott McNaught
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "D Suding" <junk at velocitus.net>
> > To: <discussion at nsrca.org>
> > Cc: <jivey61 at msn.com>
> > Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2003 4:12 PM
> > Subject: Re: intermediate 402 rolling suggestions
> >
> >
> > > Jim-
> > >
> > > You are correct.  But even the guys with balanced
> > planes were ALL OVER the
> > > sky on those rolls. I was watching their elevator
> > input, and I thought
> > > that this was a universal problem with the
> > Intermediate guys.
> > >
> > > Even with a perfectly balanced plane, you're going
> > to have to add
> > > elevator, down-up-down-up.  But my point is to not
> > let that elevator input
> > > throw you off course. I like to call it a "blip"
> > of elevator.
> > >
> > > I would love to hear from an Intermediate pilot
> > that goes out to the field
> > > tonight and tries it. Make sure you are flying
> > high enough that a mistake
> > > isn't going to crash you.
> > >
> > > -Dennis
> > >
> > > > Dennis
> > > >  These guys are flying nose heavy airplanes. If
> > they would balance the
> > > > planes so that they are as neutral upright as
> > inverted, or very near
> > > > as. The majority of the would go away.
> > > >
> > > > Jim Ivey
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: D Suding
> > > > Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2003 1:54 PM
> > > > To: discussion at nsrca.org
> > > > Cc: randy10926 at comcast.net
> > > > Subject: Re: intermediate 402 rolling
> > suggestions
> > > >
> > > > I noticed something in the Intermediate class
> > while I was judging in
> > > > Albuquerque. The two horizontal rolls looked bad
> > even when performed by
> > > > the best pilots. I think I know why.
> > > >
> > > > First, you can't just throw the stick to the
> > right or left and wait for
> > > > plane to roll 720 degrees. It will lose too much
> > altitude.  You need
> > > > elevator.
> > > >
> > > > Second, you don't start feeding the elevator
> > when the plane gets past 90
> > > > degrees. This will make the plane cork-screw.  I
> > kept seeing this.  The
> > > > plane would roll 90 degrees, and the pilot would
> > feed some elevator,
> > > > increasing as it went to 180, then decreasing as
> > it followed through to
> > > > 270 and so on.
> > > >
> > > > Here's what you do:
> > > >
> > > > 1) Find a roll rate that takes about 1.5 seconds
> > to roll 360 degrees.
> > > >
> > > > 2) Here's the trick: DON'T ADD ANY ELEVATOR
> > EXCEPT AT 180 and 360
> > > > DEGREES!!!!! When the plane gets to 180, give it
> > a SHORT, SHARP down
> > > > elevator to pitch the nose up to level. Then at
> > 360 degrees, give it a
> > > > SHORT, SHARP up elevator to pitch the nose up
> > again.
> > > >
> > > > Of course, to get picky, you actually start
> > feeding elevator at ~175
> > > > degrees, but the key is to really limit the
> > duration of the elevator
> > > > input so that your purpose is to correct for the
> > effects of gravity
> > > > only.
> > > >
> > > > 3) Practice one thousand times.
> > > >
> > > > Hope this helps.
> > > >
> > > > -Dennis
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >> Yes you start with a half roll and end with a
> > half roll.  The inverted
> > > >> flight should be centered in the box and last
> > at least 4 seconds.
> > > >>
> > > >> Randy
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> ----- Original Message -----
> > > >> From: "kyle d." <baseballstar2 at cfl.rr.com>
> > > >> Date: Wednesday, June 25, 2003 11:02 am
> > > >> Subject: intermediate 402
> > > >>
> > > >>> Can anybody go through all the manevers. I
> > really dont get the
> > > >>> striet in verted flight do u do a half roll
> > then do another half
> > > >>> roll. because u are coming out of a split S.
> > Or can u fint the
> > > >>> drawings for these maneuvers
> > > >>>
> > > >>
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