Judging behaviour

Thu Jan 23 05:42:31 AKST 2003

I have no problems with post flight comments if the pilot asks,
especially if he is new to pattern and wants to improve his/her flying. 

Someone who may be struggling with a four point roll for example may ask
for some advice if the person who is judging is a more experienced
flyer.

I guess what I am trying to say is if a pilot is struggling with some
elements of his flight and concedes that he has, at the end of his
flight by asking for help then I have no problem with giving some
feedback.

I feel my situation was a little different. I didn't ask. I guess he
could have expressed his view to the other judges if I wasn't there but
I can't stop that.

The point I tried to make in my original post was judges and pilots need
to maintain some level of ethical behaviour at comps to say "keep the
peace"

I am the first to admit that criticism and comments are needed to make
you 
A better pilot, however there is a time and place for that and that
isn't on the flight line of a national championship.

The old saying that "Money is the root of all evil" it is similar to say
that "judging is the root of most arguments at pattern competitions"
unfortunately, I don't think I am on my own here when I say this. By
keeping opinions to ourselves certainly goes a long way to keep harmony.

Peter Pennisi
Pentagon Systems
P.O Box 4280
Eight Mile Plains
QLD 4113
Australia
Phone:    61+0738414234
Fax:        61+0733419203
Mobile:   0408007206
Email: pentagon.systems at bigpond.com

-----Original Message-----
From: discussion-request at nsrca.org [mailto:discussion-request at nsrca.org]
On Behalf Of Dave & Sue Funk
Sent: Thursday, 23 January 2003 22:28 PM
To: discussion at nsrca.org
Subject: Re: Judging behaviour

I agree with Rick completely. Comments from the judges is welcome. (POST
FLIGHT)

 Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rick Wallace" <rickwallace45 at hotmail.com>
To: <discussion at nsrca.org>
Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 5:41 AM
Subject: Re: Judging behaviour

> I'm a fairly new pattern pilot, and welcome the comments of more
experienced
> pilots anytime I can get 'em, especially since they're  pilots too,
and
are
> virtually always more experienced than I am.
>
> I look at immediate post-flight conversation w/ the judges as a way to
> improve my flying. I'll routinely turn to the judges after I land and
ask
> them for their comments.
> Sometimes they'll let me know that they'd rather not comment, and I
thank
> them and leave. Often, though, one or more will be willing to give his
> impressions and perceptions of the flight - this can be as valuable as
any
> other input.
>
> Of course, if the next guy already has his engine running, and is
waiting
to
> step into the box then there's no discussion- -it's his flight line.
> Otherwise, why not get the mini-critique?
>
> By the same token when I judge, when a competitor *asks* for feedback
(and
> only then) after his flight, I'll give it (usually deferring to the
more
> senior judge if there is one) when there's time before the next
pilot's
up.
> I trust the other judge not to be influenced (not to be swayed in his
> judgiung the rest of the round) by my comments, as I try not to be
swayed
by
> his comments.
>
> We pattern guys don't fly together enough as it is, and should take
max
> advantage of the chances to help each other and to be helped.
>
> My $.02 -
> Rick
>
> >
> >I recently attended a competition in which the conduct of a
particular
> >judge
> >left a bit of a sour taste in my mouth. As I turned towards the
judges
> >after
> >completing my flight this particular person (experienced F3A judge)
made
a
> >number of comments about my flight being flown too far out and that
he
> >docked several points per manoeuvre. These comments were made in the
> >presence of the other two judges.
> >
> >I am not going to argue that I was or wasn't. The concern I had with
this
> >behaviour was he could have influenced the other judges to think the
same
> >as
> >they had less experience. This type of conduct should not be allowed
to
> >happen. Judges should be able to judge a flight based on their own
> >perception and interpretation of rules etc. If this particular person
> >thought that I should be docked 2 points per manoeuvre then that
should
be
> >his opinion only.
> >
> >The issue here is that most of us on this list judge and fly
aerobatics.
> >Everyone deserves to be judged fairly and unbiased by people who have
their
> >own perception on how a flight should look and should be flown. Why
have
3
> >or 5 judges?
> >
> >If you looked at this incident from another angle some of my
competitors
> >may
> >say that I was being coached by a judge which could raise another set
of
> >problems.
> >
> >All in all, the fact he said anything was wrong.
> >
> >Just my thoughts
> >
> >Peter
> >
> >
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